B (6:32)

It's so needed. And it is not talked about. We don't talk about the psychology of overeating. We talk about food plans, we talk about tracking. We talk about restricting. We talk about these. Making these long lists of what you're not supposed to do and what you shouldn't have. And if people just want to listen for five seconds, I hope you won't and leave that. The takeaway is this, that I hope everybody has. There is a reason that we eat. There is a reason that we have cravings. There's a reason that we put food in our mouth. And it's not straightforward. It's. It has layers to it. It's complicated. But if you just try to bypass that reason and squash your urges and your cravings, you end up in this ongoing hamster wheel of doing just that. You know, having a nurge, having a desire, being hungry, telling yourself there's something wrong or broken with you, that you have it, and trying to be strong enough, which we always fail at, to restrain yourself and to never do it again. It's what yo, yo, weight gain is built on.

A (7:38)

I love the fact that you said. And we, you're right, we could just mic Drop that moment alone and then end the podcast.

B (7:44)

We're done. We can go.

A (7:45)

That's it. Thank you for listening. But, but what you said about we don't talk about it. We talk about food plan, we talk about meal plans, we talk about tracking. Oh my gosh. If that didn't hit home and just like slap us in the face, I don't know what will. And that is so true. Do you think it's because of the embarrassment around overeating?

B (8:05)

I think that there is a billion dollar industry built up around telling us it's easy, telling us it's a one shot deal and their deal is the deal. If you purchase their deal, we'll fix everything. And that's not true. There's a lot less money to be made in psychology and understanding your motivations for things than there is in here. Follow this plan for thin thighs in 30 days or whatever. I think it's sexier to think we can get instant magical results.

A (8:36)

Well, that's it. It's the instant gratification. I mean, if you dig into the psychology behind it, that's going to take time. And we are in such a fast paced, immediate gratification society that I mean, people won't even stop for more than five seconds on an Instagram reel if it's not grabbing their attention immediately. So it's all about instant gratification.

B (8:55)

Yeah. However. But I think there's, I think there's a myth there too, because the myth is if I'm going to get it, if I'm going to dig into this, it's going to be complicated, it's going to be miserable. I'm going to have to face things I don't want to face. There's this, all these stories that we tell ourselves, but also this idea that it is a long road. Right. I hear that all the time from people. And yeah, you can see a really clear path. If I starve myself, if I go on. Let's just take a really caricature example. You know, if I choose some starvation food plan, and I am completely, perfectly strict with that, for a certain amount of time, I will maybe see drastic temporary results. Maybe. However, what people forget is you're only measuring one result. Right? You're measuring how your pants fit or a number on the scale or how much water you've been able to remove from your body. When you start to look at the reasons that you have cravings, the reasons that you're hungry, the reasons that you are wandering mindlessly to the pantry and every afternoon at you know, when you get home from work, you start to address, you start to get clear on what the reasons are which have nothing to do with food. And when you start to address the reasons, whether it is that, you know you've got a hunger for stress relief or you are exhausted or you have a hormonal imbalance or you have a thyroid issue or what. When you start to address those reasons, your whole life gets better. It's not about one number, it's not about a size. And when you start to address the reasons that food has the power in your life, people forget this. Food loses the power. So what people talk about in my program is that moment when they realize not when I worked really hard and I'm happy to report I didn't binge all week. It's that moment when they realized I haven't binged in a month. That's so weird. I used to do that every day and I haven't done that anymore. Right. And it's not because I've been sitting on my hands and like telling myself I will be good in the mirror every morning. It's because I've lost the craving because I took care of the reason.

A (10:54)

Okay, so you had mentioned you brought in like hormones and, and other, we'll say biological, not necessarily psychological things that are going on. So you unpack everything you're looking at. What's driving women to, I'll say people. I can't say women. Okay, we got to have the dudes in there too. What's driving people to overeat? Whether it is, let's say, a, like a deprivation thing. So I can say for myself, my story way back in the day when I was competing was obviously I was so restricted and on such a planned out, detailed, restrictive diet that, I mean, you can ask any competitor, as soon as you come off of that and you're done with the show, you are over consuming like crazy. I mean, that's why competitors will gain £20 in a week. And that's not healthy whatsoever. But you almost go on this super restrictive, almost depleted state to overeating to, I don't even know what, I guess it was to satisfy that deprivation. You know, in your mind, you're going, it's not fair that I couldn't eat a brownie. Now I'm going to eat 10 brownies. So I can understand that from that point of view. And then obviously I can understand it from the biological point of view with hormones, insulin, hunger cues, all of that. How do you dig deep enough to find out what that root cause of the overeating behavior is?

B (12:18)

Well, that's a big question.

A (12:20)

Yeah, sorry, just leading off of the big ones.

B (12:22)

No, it's the per. But it is the perfect question. So what I work with primarily, the easy entry point is what I call hidden hungers. Those are reasons. There are five primary reasons that I see. And I work with women. So smart, busy women tending to overeat. And I don't. If. Whether you have a hormone imbalance, whether you are sleep deprived, whether you have something else going on, whether you are perimenopausal, if you're not in touch with these hidden hungers, everything else is going to be worse. So there's that layer, like, what am I using food for that I don't need food for? Am I using it for comfort? Am I using it for stress relief? Am I using it because I'm trying to function on four and a half hours of sleep a night? So getting in touch with your hidden hungers is important. And I get women all the time who come to me and say, okay, but I know I also have some insulin resistance, right? Or I'm also perimenopausal. How is this going to work for me?

A (13:18)

Right.

B (13:19)

Thing is, you can't deal with whatever is going on inside your body effectively if you don't know how to listen to yourself. That's the first thing. If you don't know how to listen to yourself and check in with yourself, you're not going to know what's going on. And it's so funny because we separate physical and psychological. I wanna remind everybody, your brain lives inside your body. It's all physical. So if you're not connected to yourself, you're not gonna be able to take care of yourself effectively, no matter what is going on. And if you. Here's another layer of psychology here. We gotta start paying attention to what we believe and how we talk to ourselves. Because if you've got stories in your head that minimize all this stuff and just. I just have on repeat, which most women do, honestly, a loop about how you're not trying hard enough, how you don't have enough willpower, how you're lazy, how you don't care enough, if that is the primary loop that is running through your brain, you aren't going to be effective with anything because there's no room for it. Your brain has already decided it's all your fault. And your job is to get in there one more time and work harder. It's. It's like banging your Head against a wall. You know that poster with the X that says bang head here? That's what we've been taught to do. If this plan didn't work for you, it's because you didn't try hard enough. And what you need to do is you need to, like, wait till Monday and summon up your willpower and get all ready, you know, get a clean new chart for yourself or whatever, and dive in there again and do it better this time. It's always your fault. Always your fault. Yeah.

A (14:52)

Oh, that's so true. I mean, even I think about just growing up in the 80s and 90s, it's all about willpower. You need more willpower. How to strengthen your willpower.

B (15:01)

Right? Yeah. Who wants to live that way? First of all, even if it works, which it doesn't, because if you think about anybody who struggles with overeating or emotional eating, think about when it's the worst. Think about when you blow it. You know, however you define that, it's when it's when it is hardest to have willpower, or it's when your willpower is all being used up somewhere else. It's when you are so distracted by other things, you don't even remember to have willpower. It is the most faulty system, and the wellness industry loves it. They love willpower. Yeah.

A (15:33)

Yeah. No, you're right. And, and just this is a great time to bring what we're kind of laughing about off air and talking about. But it's so true. I talk about this all the time, especially with my patients. I, I, you know, we'll first meet with somebody. I'll say, you're in screw it mode, aren't you? I called screw it syndrome. I'm like, you have screw it syndrome, Meaning that they have literally done everything they possibly can, whether it's a program or a meal plan or they hired a nutritionist, they're tracking their food, all that, and nothing is working to change their body composition to lose that excess weight that they put on. So they go, well, screw it. I just might as well eat everything and anything I want to, because what I'm doing over here isn't working. And that's almost a form of throwing willpower out the window, even by choice, because you're saying, you know what? Why am I putting all this pressure on myself to eat a certain way when it's not even producing the result in my body that I want it to? And so we just tend to go off. And if you do that enough, you know, it's almost like we, we go into screw it syndrome. We eat what we want, and then we beat ourselves up with guilt afterwards, and then we feel so bad, and it's like this, this personal flogging that we're doing to ourselves, which. That's not healthy either.

B (16:52)

It's such an all or nothing mentality. It's perfectionism.

A (16:56)

Right.

B (16:57)

And you know, I always say to my clients, don't you wish we had. If we had some kind of monitor. This is a question I often ask people, like, if we could, if there was some kind of gauge that we could put on you that would measure how much of your overeating happens after that point that you've decided it's all ruined. Right. Or I blew it. Like, I was good all day and now I blew it. How much of the eating happens after that moment? And I can't think of anybody who hasn't said 75%, 80%. Perfectionism just keeps us stuck in this cycle. And I'm just going to keep sending the same message. Think about how many of these weight loss plans work and how many of them are literally built on perfectionism. Right. It's. You know, there are actually plans out there that if you, if you have one bad day, you have to start over.

A (17:46)

Right, right.

B (17:47)

That's so true. Yeah.

A (17:49)

Yeah.

B (17:49)

And how much time do you take in between that bad day and starting over? How much negative momentum do you build up in that time? Right. Perfectionism is. It's another huge piece that we gotta look at. If you really want to create freedom from overeating. It's, it's being gentler with ourselves and realizing, A, you're never going to get it perfect and B, you don't have to and who wants to.

A (18:12)

Yeah, right. Well, no, I mean, tying in what you just said there to the screw at piece, and I've, I've been there. So I am speaking from a place of total understanding that even when I was competing, I mean, Was I perfect 100% of the time? Absolutely not. So if I did slip up and let's say, had, you know, four scoops of that peanut butter with a piece of chocolate, oh, well, that's it. The whole day is blown. I might as well just. I'm just. You know what? I'm going to start tomorrow, so I'm going to go the rest of today. I'm just going to get in everything that I want, what I'm craving, and I'll start tomorrow. And so it goes back to that perfectionist piece that, that is so detrimental because it will literally throw you off. Whereas I could have just stopped with the peanut butter and the chocolate, went about the rest of my day like my normal plan was on a piece of paper that my coach gave me for the. For the show, and things would have been fine, but instead I just added in more garbage. More garbage. More garbage that my body had to then overcome.

B (19:09)

Yeah. Every moment. Every moment is this place where we can stop and reevaluate. But again, we spend so much time not being connected to ourselves that we don't even stop to think. I was telling you before we hit a record on this thing that I had, you were talking about the screw up moments, and I said, oh, my gosh, I just recorded a podcast episode about this. So I'm. I'm thinking about all these things, but we don't know what is going on inside our body so much of the time. You get up in the morning, maybe you have a morning routine and you do some morning thing that is good for yourself. Maybe you don't have time for that. And then you go and you go, and you go and you go and you go and you go. And then whatever you've been doing all day, you kind of get spit out of that. You get it home, you do your second. Whatever you do. And then you wonder why at the end of the day, you are sitting there either with the bowl of ice cream in your chair, watching Netflix, wanting to just zone out, or fighting, going to get the bowl of ice cream. Right.

A (20:05)

Right. We don't.

B (20:06)

We don't have a process of staying connected to ourselves and knowing what am I doing and what am I feeling? And so much of that screw it moment happens because stuff builds up and we're so busy taking care of life and taking care of everybody else, and we're not paying attention to ourselves. And by the time it hits. I was going to say, it feels like it's too late. It often is too late. We're out of resources to do all the things that our brain is saying, well, you should do that. And, you know, if you were really disciplined enough, you would do X, Y and z. Well, it's not a discipline problem, it's a bandwidth problem. You're done.

A (20:42)

Yes. Oh, gosh. I resonate with that too, because just think of anything. Whenever, like, even my house, right. If. If it gets too messy, I don't want to do anything because it's just too. I'm like, I don't even know where to start. So I'm just gonna be as it is. And it's a disaster, right? Yeah, that resonates. Okay, so we're talking about the drivers, but now let's talk about what we can do. So as you were talking about the, the Netflix and the ice cream and that battle, in my mind I thought, well, okay, what about a replacement? What if, what if they, that woman or myself, because I love my Netflix snack too. What if they go for some Greek yogurt with berries or a protein shake instead? Or is that not going to get to the root of the problem? Like, it might work that night, but then what about the other 29 days out of the month?

B (21:37)

Yeah, I think it's, I think what you are talking about is really important because yes, addressing low hanging fruit and figuring out, okay, how can I make some trade offs, that's always helpful. And if what you really want to do is have a relationship with food that you like and that you're not fighting with, it is going to pay off. To start to get clear on what your hidden hungers are, people end up on the couch with the ice cream and the Netflix for a variety of different reasons. It's not always the same. I mean, even people will say, I am stress eating, right? I'm a stress eater, right? And that can be a really useful thing to know. Or it can be not helpful at all. I have so many clients who say, well, duh, of course I'm a stress eater, but there's nothing I can do about the stress, right? Or I have clients who are stress eating. But actually it's not that it's the stress that's throwing them over the edge. It's the fact that they're also sleep deprived and they have a hidden hunger for rest and they have a hidden hunger for. There's another hidden hunger for self care and me time, right? They're not getting any of that. And so the stress rings much louder for them. So one of the things that can be really helpful is what I did. Because here's the other thing. We start talking about hidden hungers and it gets really overwhelming really quickly. So people are like, well, I have all of them. I'm sleep deprived, I'm stressed. I have emotionally charged situations going on. Of course I'm not getting enough me time. I mean, it can be this big huge snowball and so then it becomes one more thing that's like, okay, I don't even want to deal with that either. I understand why. I just, I just, I'll just stop eating carbs. That's why. So what I did is I created a quiz that you can take. It's free, it's on my website. But what it does is it helps you start to unravel. You don't need to deal with everything at once. And so it starts to help you unravel your personal situation and identify what your primary hidden hunger is. And then gives you some very easy resources for how to start doing something that will help you be more effective. A doable, simple set of steps that you can take. So that's something that people can do.

A (23:38)

So this is something crazy that I learned about electrolytes that I did not know before. Low sodium diets, you know, when you cut back on your salt, can actually contribute to insulin resistance. So number one, we don't want that. We know that is going to definitely increase our weight. Low potassium status suppresses your growth hormone, your anti aging hormone, and that even just having low thyroid function disrupts your electrolyte excretion. So I mean, if your magnesium is low, we know that that's going to interfere with thyroid T4 to T3 conversion. Now you have this whole electrolyte excretion issues that you're pushing out more electrolytes, but you need to keep them in for that conversion. I'm telling you, the data is crazy on the importance of electrolytes. So I use the OG of electrolyte powders. Element number one because they taste absolutely freaking amazing. I want to use probably too many packets in a day, quite honestly, because I keep putting them in my water because they taste that good. But of course I also know that I'm getting my balance of electrolytes. And in the summer I need more. Even in the winter when I'm skiing and snowboarding, I'm sweating that all out. You need more. So if you want to try some of these amazing, just amazing electrolytes and actually feel the difference, I mean, you will feel the difference. You'll feel more energized, you won't cramp up and you will get better sleep with this as well. I'm telling you. Definitely better sleep. Go to drink lmnt.com so spell out drinK-R-I n k l m n t.com/thyroid. And this is gonna save you some money. You can get the sample box, you can try all the different flavors. My absolute favorite. Just side note, grapefruit and orange. Drink elementi.com thyroid.

B (25:40)

It's really helpful. And the thing about dealing with this stuff from a non traditional perspective is that it tends to create what I call an eye roll effect. I am going to describe these things. And I don't be surprised if you're listening to this episode if you catch yourself rolling your eyes and thinking, well, that's not gonna help, right? What about a pill? What about.

A (26:01)

Right. Okay, let's get into it.

B (26:02)

I like it because these things sound so simple, but they make a huge difference. One of the most powerful things that women can start doing right away, and I'm talking to you women, is practicing taking pauses. And by pauses, I don't mean you take an afternoon off or you take a vacation. I mean picking some strategic times of day where you stop for 30 seconds and you take a deep breath. If you want to put your hand over your. Over your heart or feel your pulse, that's fantastic. There is actually research that when you feel your heartbeat, it starts to engage a relaxation response in your body. Take a breath, ask yourself three questions. What do I know about what I'm feeling? What do I know about what I'm needing? And what do I know about what I'm wanting? And do not get hung up. Here's what your brain will do. Your brain is a sneaky, sneaky thing. Do not get hung up about what you don't know, because there's all sorts of stuff you don't know. And if you are like most women, you haven't paused in a very long time. And it sounds so simple. What am I feeling? And then here's the thing that happens for high achievers. If you ask a high achiever a question they don't know the answer to, they get mad. I know because I am.

A (27:13)

What's the answer to how.

B (27:15)

Right? We get frustrated, we feel stupid, we feel like we shift, should know the answer. And then we avoid that question as long as forevermore because we don't like to feel that way. But just you want to practice starting to ask what is going on inside me? And the way you get to that is, okay, so what do I know? I know I have a headache. I know that meeting was really tense. Right? I don't know what the name of that feeling is, but I know my stomach is just in knots right now. I know I'm tired. What do you know? You start collecting what you know. Because if you don't know what's going on inside you, you cannot even begin to start to figure out how do I deal with the root cause.

A (27:53)

Okay, so now you don't just do this when you're being driven to overeat or, or go to the fridge. You're just pausing anytime through the day just to get in this habit.

B (28:04)

That's the hardest time. And that's. You see, that's part of the problem. We tell ourselves, okay, I need to. So during that time in the evening, I always eat all the M and M's. So instead, I'm going to do yoga. Okay, sounds really Zen like, but okay. But if you're doing this because you're exhausted, or if you're doing it because you haven't had a minute to sit down and do nothing all day, you are not going to want to do yoga or clean up the garage. I hear that one, too. I should just clean out a drawer.

A (28:31)

Oh, yeah. Or go for a walk. Right? That's a big one. Just for a while.

B (28:34)

Or go for a walk. It can be the best strategy in the world. But if it doesn't match what you're needing, it isn't going to feed you, it isn't going to take care of you. That's why this approach really has to be individualized, too, because you know yourself better than anybody. You're the only one who's lived inside your body your whole life. And I think this is true for a lot of health problems, too. You can find the best experts in the world and you can get amazing advice, but you also need to filter it through what you know about yourself. And. And that's another piece. I don't want to go in too many directions, but I think it's important to say that diet culture and the wellness industry has really done a number on so many women's trust in themselves and confidence in themselves. And I think that's another cause of screw it moments. We just believe nothing. We believe we're ineffective. Just somebody, please tell me what to do. Right?

A (29:24)

Definitely. Definitely. And, well, I think it even goes beyond, Yes, I totally agree, losing confidence in yourself, but then also losing confidence in those people who are supposed to help you. You know, I'm sure you've had a multitude of women say, well, I took this program, this program, and this program went to Weight Watchers, did Jenny Craig, did some online emotional overeating thing, and nothing worked. Just like I hear. I've been to five different doctors, two functional practitioners, and one health coach, and nobody can figure this out for me. And it's like they have a hard time trusting in you, in me, in themselves, and in anybody for that matter, because they've been bamboozled now for years, if not decades.

B (30:03)

Absolutely, absolutely. And I. And. And it's. It's such a catch 22, because one of the pieces of advice I always get for somebody looking to work with somebody is, is trust your gut. Right? You know, trust your gut. But if you're in a place where you feel so wary about trusting yourself, it becomes really hard to do that. And I think that's another reason why magical cures have so, so much allure. Right? It's not complicated. I don't have to trust myself. I just follow this protocol and yeah, definitely.

A (30:32)

Okay, so you're working with someone, you're kind of uncovering those hidden hungers are there. You know, we talked earlier about, I'm kind of going back to like the tracking or replacing Those M&Ms. With a healthier version or the ice cream with a healthier version. Does any of that actually come into play almost like as. As little tools to get people back on some kind of track so that they're not going off the rails every couple of weeks and then really backfiring what their ultimate goal is? Like, let's say their ultimate goal is to lose those 20 pounds that just came on in midlife. I guess that is my question. Are any of those tools like tracking or replacing foods or any. Does that come into your protocol?

B (31:16)

I don't have a protocol around food specific specifically because it's so different for every single person. What I think the best way to answer your question is to say, for instance, my group coaching program, what it starts with is let us. Let's deconstruct all the stuff that's not working. Okay? Let's do a detox of all the diet mentality stuff. Let's start to build some new neural pathways in your brain. Let's get your confidence back. Let's teach you how to make promises to yourself that you can keep. Let's help you feel empowered again because so many women feel just defeated in this area. Right? Let's create a place where you can start making decisions about food with confidence. Meaning. Well, it's the difference between, I have to do this, I can't eat this, I'm going to have to eliminate this. You know, I want to experiment with whether I would feel better if I do X, Y and Z. Right. I really actually like big, green, wonderful salads. I've been making myself eat them for years. I really want to start to find, you know, how can I eat in a way that is food I enjoy and where I, you know, I don't feel. I don't feel good when I get too full. I would like to find the way to eat in a way that I feel Good when I get up from the table. So starting to play with food. And that's actually a phrase we use in the program a lot, like, how do I play with this in a way that works for me? So it's coming at it from a very different direction. It's not, here are the five rules to follow, or here are the. Here are the ways to get more protein. But when you start to listen to yourself, some people are going to start to realize, I feel much better if I eat more protein. I actually like who I am when I have more protein at lunch or. You know, the joke that comes up sometimes in our coaching calls is I, I don't eat pancakes. And I don't eat pancakes because pancakes, I'll eat them for dinner, but I don't eat pancakes because pancakes are bad for me. I feel like crap when I eat pancakes, right? And I know that about myself. And it's the same reason I don't have two bottles of wine every night. It's not because someone said I can't have them. I don't have any desire for them because I would feel awful if I had two bottles of wine. So I don't eat pancakes. That's the difference. It's like figuring out, how can I get myself to a place where I can actually love food, enjoy my eating, and make choices that work for me and help me feel great. Does that answer your question?

A (33:42)

Oh, yes, A hundred percent. And you even went beyond which I love paying attention to your body. And instead of labeling a food as bad. Oh, that's bad. You say, how does that affect me? Because that food might not be bad in your neighbor Susie Q down the road, and she was like, yeah, I love pancakes, and I drink two bottles of wine every night. I'm good. Whereas when you tune in into exactly what that specific food does to your body, how it makes you feel like. And I think that that's another issue with society is we have become so out of touch with our own body that we want the. The Instagram plan. We want somebody to tell us what to do instead of sitting back and saying, just like you said earlier, taking that pause not only for yourself, how am I feeling? How does this food make me feel? How does this food make me feel? Did it give me energy? Did I feel better? Or did I feel sluggish and depressed and heavy and I got a headache and brain fog? I mean, there's your answer right there.

B (34:44)

And it's really interesting because. And again, this is where psychology comes in. A lot of Us have stories about what food is for us or what certain foods do for us that don't match the reality. Right. So. And I'm sure you have too. I've had, I've had so many clients who come in and they're like, they're ready to use their willpower and they're, okay, I'm ready. And I know I'm going to have to give up all the things that I love. Right? I know. Like, what do you love? Well, you know, I love eating as much as I want. That is my freedom. That is my freedom. Just the ability to just go hog wild and eat whatever I want. That is my freedom. Does it feel free? Right? And then when we play, like, why are you here then? But we have our brain again is very interesting. And so we can tell ourself one thing on repeat and reinforce it all the time. Right. I want to get results, but to do that, I'm going to have to be miserable. I want to lose weight, but to do that I'm going to have to give up all the foods that I love. I want to feel more energy, but to do that. But the reality so often doesn't match the story. And that's something that can be really hard to tease out on your own. That's one of the places that working with a coach or working in a. In my program we do group coaching or I do group coaching. It's really important because if you are working with you again, you could be working with the best expert in the world who somehow was able to divine the exact thing that you need. But if the whole time you're trying to do it, you've got this soundtrack in your head that is telling you how miserable it's going to make you. It will make you miserable.

A (36:13)

It'll make you miserable. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

B (36:16)

Good question. You did fitness training, Is that what, fitness competitions?

A (36:20)

Yeah, I did fitness and figure competitions. You know, just the same. I mean, it kind of falls into the bodybuilding category, but same strict, strict, strict diet exercise regimen for like 12 weeks.

B (36:30)

Well, the example I always use is it's been a while, but I used to run marathons. And you can say all sorts of things to yourself at mile 25 of a 26.2 race. Many of them are true, but you gotta be really clear if you wanna finish that last 1.2 miles. You gotta be really clear on whether it is helpful to be having this conversation in your head or not. And people get that, right? Like at mile 25, you can be saying I can't do this. This is awful. Why am I here? I need to stop. I'm gonna sit on the curb. You can say all this stuff, or you can say something that moves you toward your goal. We don't look at the stories we tell ourselves around food. It's not just food, but food and what food means to us. But also, we don't look at the stories we tell ourselves around what we're capable of or change. Does it have to be hard? Does it have to be agonizing? Does it have to be miserable? I don't, I don't think so. I think I would have, and I, you would probably agree with me. I would have the most miserable job in the world if what I was doing was signing people up for a awful process that was going to take forever where they were not going to see results till the very end and have to dig through all this painful stuff. We got to look at that stuff.

A (37:43)

Yeah, no, I totally agree. I love that, and it's so true. Okay, I have to ask you, I brought it up in the beginning. I have to ask you your take on GLPs, because, and here's my question around it. So on the one hand, we have these, I call it the Beverly Hills soccer mom drug of choice for weight loss. So we have these women that are taking these GLPs so that they can shut down their appetite, eat two pieces of pizza and glass of wine a day, lose the weight, and I mean, they look horrible, they're losing facial fat, they're losing their butt, all the whole thing, but they want to lose the weight. But the problem is, whenever they stop that, they're going to go back to their same way of eating, which might be five pieces of pizza and two bottles of wine a day instead of two pieces of one, right? So they haven't learned anything. They haven't changed anything. But then we have over here, the people that maybe they take a little bit of a lower dose, not necessarily a microdose, because that's not necessarily for weight loss, but they're taking a little bit of a lower dose where they, they still have appetite and they are, are consciously focused on, okay, I want to make better choices now that I have more food, noise control, and I'm going to have a steak. I'm going to plan this out. But wow, I, I, I, I have so much more power because I'm not reaching for the Cheetos and the brownies in between the steak and the protein shake. Where do you fall with your opinion Having worked with so many people with overeating tendencies, what's your opinion on the GLPs?

B (39:13)

So I think they have amazing potential. I think it's impossible for us to have longitudinal, long term research on what this is going to look like 30 years from now. And I think that's important for people to make an informed decision. I did a lot of work years ago with gastric bypass surgery patients and various different kinds of weight loss surgery, and there's some similarities there. And part of what you talk about is we're not providing a holistic approach with these medications. I think sometimes there's lip service being given. And this is exactly what happened in the bariatric surgery world. Like, you would have to meet with a psychologist, you'd have to get a note signed by a psychologist, but nobody really wanted to talk to the psychologist. They wanted to get the weight loss going. Right, Right. But we're not teaching people how to come off the medications. We're not teaching people how to have a relationship with food. And your relationship with food is not more than physiology. It is so much more than physiology. We live in a world that teaches us to use food for everything. And food is a full sensory experience. Right. There's a reason that food is so attractive. And I have seen people with very different experiences with the GLP1s. I just talked to a physician who was on them for a while and she said she went off of them, just didn't like the side effects. But also. And she's not the only person. I've said it, but she said it so beautifully. She said, melissa, the thing is, my hunger went away, but my hunger didn't go away. Like, I wasn't hungry, but I wanted to eat. Right. Like, there are different reasons that food has a pull for us. And so everyone's gonna have their own experience. I'm not saying that's true for everybody, but I have heard that from a number of people and I've heard from people who've gone off of them. And just like you described, okay, we're right back where we were. And now what do I do? Because now I feel guilty because. Or ashamed or weak because I created all these results physically and I won't be able to sustain them. And now I'm scared. I mean, there's that whole psychological bag of stuff. So I really, I. I think we can't minimize taking your power back in your relationship with food on other levels besides medication.

A (41:25)

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And I think there is that subset. A friend of mine, she now that you're talking, I don't even know what that underlying driver, what her hidden hunger is or was, whether it was just, you know, being an entrepreneur, being so busy and you only have time to stop at the gas station and grab a bag of something. That was her. That was her downfall. And incorporating in a GLP did help her change her eating habits. So it was almost an assistant to her overall goal as opposed to a crutch. But I just wonder how many people actually take that time to change their eating behavior and at the same time to look at what was driving them to overeat before. Like, you know, working with someone like yourself, or do they just use it and go, well, you know what? It's helping me lose weight, so whatever.

B (42:22)

Staying on it forever.

A (42:24)

Exactly.

B (42:26)

Yeah. I. I have a biased perspective because these are the people I see, but the people that I have talked to are people who have either decided, they've either done my program and as a part of it, decided, okay, I'm ready to try them now, or they came in and they're on the. For various reasons. I mean, people are. Are you, as you said, using them for different.

A (42:45)

For.

B (42:45)

For a variety of reasons, or they've come into the program and they want this other piece. Right. I. And I also know I'm using food for this and I'm using food for this, and I'm not hungry, but there's this huge empty feeling. I don't know what's going to happen. Is that going to come back? The cravings or the binges or. I want to figure this out. There's hunger, and there is also thinking about food and getting it right and how much brain space that takes up. And honestly, I think the people that I work with, many come in with the primary goal of I want to lose the weight. And many come in and they say, you know, I would love to lose some weight, or I don't even care about losing weight anymore. I am just so tired of this being the first thing I think about every morning and the last thing I judge myself for when I go to bed. And, you know, I'm. I'm so tired of having it rule my life. And that that is absolutely something we can untangle and unravel. And it is not something you always have to struggle with that.

A (43:41)

And that is so true as well, because it will start affecting other areas of your life when you are fully consumed. And I remember this again, just having this conversation with you just works up so many memories that it was like, oh, my Gosh, that was such a destructive phase in my life because I was so restricted that my whole life, just like you said, you wake up and you go, all right, did I pack my meals for the day? Okay, the first thing I need to do is do this. And then, you know, I'm going to eat this way. And it just. It literally consumes you to where you start canceling plans with friends because you know that going to that restaurant, you're going to eat the bread, and then you're going to feel guilty, and then you're going to have to deal with that guilt, beat yourself up. And it does. It starts having these fingers that go into every area of your life, and.

B (44:25)

Then you get so tired of it, you run out of willpower. And you have the screw it thing. And everybody's, you know, people have a screw thing that is a couple days, and people have screw it episodes that go on for years. Right?

A (44:38)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And then you're far, so far down the rabbit hole with your health. Now you. Now we are talking about those detrimental effects of, like, type 2 diabetes and cardiovascular disease and everything that comes with. With gaining excess body fat. I mean, listen, I'm all for body positivity, but the bottom line is when we have excess body fat, when we over consume processed garbage, it's going to have an effect on our health, period. End of story. It just is. Yeah.

B (45:05)

And I think then it gets even more complicated because people will come to me and they'll say, okay, I get it. Like, I don't want to go into deprivation mode and I don't want to choose a strict diet. And I know I have to cut back on X, Y and Z because of this health problem I have? And so how do I do that? How do I walk this line between taking care of my health and eating in whey, but not feeling like I am constantly, you know, living in a way that my rebel just wants to come out every minute and.

A (45:34)

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Well, I love that you unpack this for women. You. Have you mentioned the quiz already, the hidden hungers quiz, which I think is beautiful. So we're going to put that in the show notes, and then you also have a download that people can go to, which is free. The freedom to overeating roadmap for smart, busy women. So we're going to put that link in the show notes as well. And this is a great place for people to just start to uncover the lies and then they can obviously learn more about you and jumping into your group program as well. So Melissa, can you please tell people where they can find you in addition to what we'll put down there in the show notes?

B (46:14)

Yeah. And thank you for providing those. Very easy to find me. It's if you remember Too much on her plate. T o o toomuchonherplate.com is my website. Too much on her plate is my Instagram. Too much on her plate is the podcast and if this resonates with you, I really would encourage people to check that out because we get so many messages that take you in the other direction. Having stuff that you can put into your brain that reinforces non deprivation, non perfectionism, reasonable doable steps. I we there's a short supply of that in this world.

A (46:48)

Yes, yes, yes. Oh my goodness. It's been amazing. It's been so fun to talk to you even though it's we're talking about hard stuff. I get it. But phenomenal information. I mean even what you gave on this podcast is going to help people and then of course your download. So thank you so much for coming on. I greatly appreciated. My audience appreciates as well.

B (47:07)

This was great. Thank you for having me.

A (47:09)

Absolutely. And thank everyone for listening. More great information to come and definitely check the show notes and take the hidden hungers quiz for sure that'll help you. The information shared on the Thyroid Fixer Podcast is intended solely for informational and educational purposes. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always consult with your physician or other qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition treatment or before making changes to your healthcare regimen, including medications, supplements or other therapies. Use of the information provided in this podcast does not establish a doctor, patient or client, provide a relationship between you and the host, or between you and any other healthcare professionals featured on the show. Any medical opinions or statements made by guests are are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of the host or affiliated parties. Statements regarding dietary supplements or health related products mentioned in this podcast have not been evaluated by the fda. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Some episodes of the Thyroid Fixer Podcast may include sponsorships or affiliate links. The host may receive compensation for discussing or promoting certain products or services. Any such sponsorships or affiliations will be clearly disclosed during the episode. All opinions expressed are those of the hosts or guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of any sponsors. The inclusion of a product or service does not imply endorsement by any healthcare professional featured on this podcast.