← The Thyroid (and Hormone) Fixer Podcast: Thyropause, Menopause, Metabolism and How to Fix It
The Thyroid (and Hormone) Fixer Podcast: Thyropause, Menopause, Metabolism and How to Fix It
558. How HBOT Affects Weight, Sleep, Inflammation and Cancer with Dr. Deep Sea
00:57:06
Loading summary
Transcript85 lines
- [00:02]
A
Welcome to the Thyroid Fixer podcast where we dive deep into the world of thyroid and hormones. Especially for you ladies navigating perimenopause and menopause. And really for anyone struggling with hypothyroidism. I'm your host, Dr. Amy, thyroid and hormone specialist and CEO of a global telemedicine practice where we prescribe the right thyroid treatment and bioidentical hormones to all 50 states and most of Canada, helping you become that badass human that you're meant to be. So if you're battling weight gain and hair loss, you can't lose weight. No matter what you do, your energy levels are plummeting and your libido left town. Then you're in the right place and you have found your tribe. Remember, I want you to embrace every inch of that badass woman that you truly are. So if you're ready to dive in and fix things, let's get started. Did you know there's a reason why boosting NAD can actually make us feel years younger? This vital NAD molecule powers cellular energy, it supports our DNA health, it aids in detoxification, and it helps your body remain youthful. But by the age of 50, which I'm there now, NAD levels dropped to half of what they were at 20. So yeah, we need to replace them cuz I want to feel and look like I'm 20. All right, maybe 30. So luckily there is Qualia NAD Plus, a clinically proven cutting edge supplement that can boost your nad levels by 67%. So no shots, just a pill. Works amazingly. Contains powerful precursors like niacin, niacinamide and niagen. And the top NAD boosters known to science along with 11 other key ingredients to support the body's entire NAD production process. It's vegan, non GMO, gluten free, so no worries there. And. And it's a clinically proven formula that has become my go to for maximizing my NAD levels because I want to anti age. So if you want to age well too high NAD levels are a must. So you're going to visit qualia life.com I'm going to spell that for you. Q-U a l I a l I f e.com Thyroid to try Qualia NAD backed by a 100 day money back guarantee.
- [02:31]
B
What?
- [02:32]
A
Yeah, they back their products. It's going to work people. So you're going to use the promo code thyroid for 15% off. So that's qualife.com forward/thyroid with the promo code thyroid for 15% off. You have Questions about your thyroid, about your labs, what they mean. What about your hormones? What about insulin? Why are you gaining weight? Why are you so tired? Why are you losing your hair? Why won't my doctor listen to me? Why won't my doctor test these things? All of these questions that you have running around in your brain and you know that if you just had the answers that that could push you over the edge into optimal health, that you could be that badass human that you are meant to be. Well, I got you covered there because I am going live every single week in the just fix your thyroid Facebook group. That is my Facebook group. A beautiful community just filled with amazing people where I am in there, my nurse practitioners are in there, my health coaches are in there. There are patients in there that have been with me for so long, they're experts in their own right, and they answered just the way that I would. So we have you completely covered in this group. So not only can you post your question every single day, every single hour, if you want, you can mark your calendars for our weekly live Q and A sessions where you get to ask your question to me, and I'm going to answer it live on air. And not only that, we are doing product giveaways. We're doing working with our team giveaways. You're going to want to be in there and actually be live on that call. If you're at work going in the closet, just shut the door. Take minutes for yourself. Take a half an hour for yourself. Take an hour for yourself so that you can get the information that you need to bring yourself into optimization land where you're not looking sideways at a brownie and gaining weight at the same time, where you can feel amazing every single day. Because that's my goal for you. You know that I love, love, love to answer your questions and this is the place where you can get them answered live. You'll hear me say this in the beginning about how I really wanted to learn more about hbot, especially during my cancer healing journey post hysterectomy and really even for cancer prevention. But y' all know that I'm really big into body composition and anti aging, I. E. Wrinkles and prevention of. So I wanted to talk to Dr. Joe Deter, who is also called Dr. Deepsea. I love this. And he's going to explain why, because he spent 100 days underwater. By the way, he is a retired naval officer and a PhD who went deep. Oh, gosh, no pun intended, went deep into the research of hyperbaric oxygen and its effect on the body. Now he has 28 years of active duty naval service. He has had awards out the wazoo. We are talking about just an absolute brilliant, brilliant man. He's also, by the way, set a Guinness Book of World records by living underwater for a hundred days. So he's going to tell you about that, about his project Neptune 100 Research. And we're going to unpack the benefits of hyperbaric oxygen and go into yes, the different chambers involved as well. You've heard about soft sided, hard sided. We're going to talk about it all. So go ahead, deep dive. Haha. Into this episode with Dr. Deepsea. You know, I've had this question on my mind since going through my own cancer journey with uterine cancer about recovery and about prevention because my goal is to never hear the C word again. So I started diving into hbot, which is hyperbaric oxygen therapy. And there's a lot of information out there and it can get confusing in the world of HBOT because you have different people talking about the benefits and you have to kind of look like, well, are they selling something? Are they selling an age blood chamber and that's why they're touting the benefits or is there real science behind it? And then really beyond cancer, what about healing wounds? Healing from surgery, getting better sleep, getting that deep sleep which then has a trickle effect into hormone balance, into thyroid production, into weight loss, into balancing your glucose and your insulin. The research is even confusing for me. So I reached out to an expert. Now you already heard a little bit about Dr. Joe, but I wanted to bring Dr. Joe Detouri on my show so he can talk to you because he's been there and done that. He's got the nickname of Dr. Deepsea. And now we'll get into the why. What why? Why are you called that, Dr. Joe? But thank you so much for jumping on the show and sharing your research, your wisdom, your experience on all things hyperbaric and how people can use this therapy in their life to target whatever they're looking to target, be it cancer or recovery or better sleep.
- [07:51]
B
Sure. No, first of all, thank you for having me. I'm really enjoying being able to bring this stuff to light to people. I'm a clinical researcher, as you know, and this is the type of research that I want to do. I want to do more of this kind of research and open up the field. So there's a lot to what you've already said, but let's go ahead and just get these one at a Time.
- [08:12]
A
Okay. The first one then is, how'd you get the nickname of Dr. Deep Sea?
- [08:18]
B
The nickname Dr. Deep Sea came from Dr. Brian O'. Connell. I helped him with his doctoral program. And when I was pursuing mine, at the end of it, he said, now, you got to have a nickname. Now, in the military, when you're a deep sea diver, they call you deep sea. Like, I would walk up to you if you were a deep sea diver. And I go, hey, deep sea, how are you? I'm good. Deep sea, how are you? Right? So he's like, you're a deep sea, I'm a deep sea. And then it was Doctor. Oh, Dr. Deep Sea. Da, da. Brian O'. Connor.
- [08:50]
A
I like.
- [08:50]
B
Thank you very much, Doctor.
- [08:52]
A
I like it. I like it. But for you, the name kind of goes deeper, no pun intended, because you actually decided to spend a hundred days underwater just for a random experiment. Why did you do that? And kind of what led you up to that? Why'd you decide to do it? And then, obviously, tell us about that experience.
- [09:16]
B
Random experiment. Not really. Long story short, I went down there for four reasons, basically, the first of which is I have a PhD in biomedical engineering, as you know. So I wanted to do blood, urine, saliva, electrocardiograms, electroencephalograms, pulmonary function tests, test all, whole host of tests, see what happens to a human when you leave them in an isolated, confined, extreme environment. The second thing was science is getting a bad rap lately, and kids are looking to shy away from science, technology, engineering, and math. And I want to show them that you can do research. It can be sciency and it can still be cool. It's not about beakers and microscopes and lab coats and boring. Right? It can be fun and cool, and it can be encouraging. So that was the second reason. Third reason is I wanted to reach out and talk to everybody in the undersea environment, talk to them about preserving, protecting, and now rejuvenating our marine environment, where arguably 70% of our oxygen comes from. And guess what? I'm kind of partial to oxygen. So we need that. So let's take care of our oceans. And the fourth and final reason, and probably the most important one, is to steal in the mind of every person on the planet the mechanisms of action of hyperbaric medicine. Because while I was diving underwater, I was at the same pressure at which I treat traumatic brain injury. So I was trying to make sure that everybody gets it. Here I am. I'm going to do all these biomedical tests so that everybody can see. Yes. Not only Are there known mechanisms of action? There's some other stuff that can be a effect from the hyperbaric medicine as well. So that's the overall.
- [11:01]
A
So essentially, when you are underwater, you're in a 24,7 hyperbaric oxygen chamber, right?
- [11:09]
B
100% correct.
- [11:11]
A
Okay, so that's really where you get the, the juicy numbers and, and can do the research because it's not like you're popping in and out of the chamber. And then people can say, well, you know, maybe it was that walk that you took in the sunshine that improved your sleep. So, okay, you gotta tell us what, what did you find? Since you were testing all of these different biomarkers, what was the outcome?
- [11:32]
B
Everything known to biomedical engineering about hyperbaric medicine, I've just relayed it, basically. So I had a decrease in every single inflammatory marker in my body. 50% decrease. I had a decrease in cortisol. I had an increase in testosterone. I had an increase in my telomere length. That is those things on the end of the chromosome that is reversing transcriptase. So reverse transcriptase, I got longer telomeres. Therefore, when I did my testing, I was 10 years younger than when I went in the water, having spent 100 days underwater. Known mechanism of action of hyperbaric medicine. However, comma, I just displayed it. So things like that, all that stuff. I doubled my deep and REM sleep. I sleep generally well. On good days, I sleep between 30 and 33% in deep in REM. On this occasion, while underwater, 60 to 66% in deep in REM.
- [12:32]
A
Okay, that's insane. Okay, wait, let's back up. Okay, I was excited because I got like two hours of deep sleep the other night. But that only happens like once a month when I increase my progesterone. But let's, let's break that down for the listeners because those who maybe haven't worn an aura ring or any kind of tracking device, they don't know what we're talking about with the deep and the rem. So what are the benefits first of going into REM sleep, getting deep sleep, and there is a difference between the two. And then what should a normal human being be getting percentage wise? Like you just said, you went up to 66%. What should we be getting and what do most people get?
- [13:13]
B
Oh, yeah, you should be in the 30 to 33 percentile. That's a pretty good range. Most people that I speak with, I mean, I. Look, I am telling you the average of what I do. Often I get 20% deep in REM. That's just the way that it is. Now. What do you do when you're in deep in REM sleep? You relearn, you recategorize, you remember, you recycle, you push things back where they're supposed to be in the brain. Right. You take it from short term memory and you put it back in the medulla oblongata, the long term storage. Right. All that stuff is so crucial, so important, and if you want to listen to a guy, that's great. Kirk Parsley on sleep. Dr. Parsley, talk to him about sleep. He's forgotten more about it than I know for sure. And I've learned everything from him and others like Michelle Yagielski, for instance. I've learned a ton from her about sleep. So that kind of thing. But 30 to 33% is where we should be. And that deep. And REM balance is important in our life. However, when you can double that, it's simply unheard of. 70 million Americans alone suffer from sleep problems. So we got a real fix to a real problem.
- [14:24]
A
Yeah. And if you're not getting that deeper sleep for rest and repair, you can gain weight from that. You can move into type 2 diabetes and insulin resistance just from that lack of sleep alone. I always reference, there's a really interesting study done years ago. I can't even find it now, but I remember reading it and it just, it got burned into my brain. They took twins and they put each twin in a sleep lab. You know, DNA, everything is identical. They were identical twins. So in the sleep lab, they controlled for food, nutrition, movement, everything, lifestyle. All their environment was controlled. The only change they did was in the one twin. They kept him out of REM and deep sleep. They basically like, yeah, he was allowed to sleep, but they stimulated his brain enough. It's not like they came over, was like, joe, wake up. They just, they stimulated his brain enough to come out of that deep in REM sleep in five days. He was basically type 2 diabetic. Five days. Yeah, that's how important it is.
- [15:24]
B
You see that your sleep couples with your cortisol, right? Peak levels of cortisol are in the morning. Right. We did cortisol testing throughout the day via saliva and urine as well. But you see that if you can decrease that cortisol, you can have a spike in the other things that are more important. Like for guys, testosterone, you know? Right. So you can balance hormones by getting sleep, you know, it's so important. And like, Kirk and other people do great job at talking about how you know, if you get a couple of hours less sleep, you're like a couple of drinks in, right? It's like, oh, I'm a little like, so you definitely want your sleep.
- [16:02]
A
Okay, so you found that hyperbaric oxygen absolutely improved your sleep, which has that trickle down effect of healing the body on many different levels. So let's talk about the benefits of hyperbaric overarching. And then I really want to kind of break down. There's the soft sided ones that we can have at home. There's the hard side that you know in the media now recently there's been a lot of fear around the hard side because we've heard about a couple of unfortunate deaths that have occurred at different clinics. So we're also going to talk to people about, talk to the audience about what they can look for if they are interested in doing a medical grade hard sided chamber and what they can be asking the clinic. But let's back up. Let's just start with the overarching benefits of hyperbaric oxygen.
- [16:49]
B
Okay. There are 13 known mechanisms of action of hyperbaric medicine. Hyperoxygenation, reverse transcriptase, toxin inhibition. I mean they are many. Leukocyte adhesion, fibroblast proliferation secondary to collagen synthesis. It's crazy the amount of things that you can get. Anti inflammatory effect, right? But all those tie into your next question, which is hard sided or soft sided. And what I want your audience to do is picture it on the number bar. Here is 100% oxygen. On the surface. Here is the effect of breathing 300% oxygen. Because 3.0 is human tolerance. Somewhere here is where you're going to find the magic sweet spot, right? And whatever mechanism of action you want to affect, this is where you have to go and take a course in hyperbaric medicine. It's way too detailed to get into it. But like for instance, if you want toxin inhibition, if you measure the millimeters of mercury of oxygen pressure at your finger, what you're going to find is you have about 35 millimeters of mercury. As you probably well know, right? If you're breathing air, you have about 35 millimeters of mercury. You're in 760 millimeters of mercury pressure right now. But the combination of air and the step downs, everything that when you reduce it finally gets down to the finger. It's 35 millimeters of oxygen only. Okay, great. I find that if you have 450 millimeters of mercury of oxygen here, toxin production stops, C Alpha protein stops, gaseous Gangrene stops, we stop that flesh eating necrotizing fasciitis, we stop it, it cannot spread. Wait a minute, does that work for any other toxins like mold? Oh yeah. It's not like it works just a little, right. It's not like if being a little pregnant. Right? There's nothing like that. So when you're at about 2.5 or better, you can get 450 millimeters of mercury here. Right. So the best mechanism of action is higher pressure of oxygen gives you that mechanism of action. Now you want to talk about anti inflammatory. Down in the 1.3, 1.4 range. That is the best marker for anti inflammatory. Interleukin 6 drops precipitously. Interleukin 23 goes up. HSCRP, you know, all of those inflammatory markers that are in your body will change very well all towards the positive side when you're at about the 1.3, 1.4. While I was underwater, I was at 1.7. So 1.7, it worked really well for. But it works better in the shallows in the lower ranges down here as opposed to going way up high. Does that mean that toxin inhibition doesn't happen down here? No, it does, it does, just not as well. Does that mean that anti inflammatory doesn't happen up here? It does, just not as well.
- [19:54]
A
Okay, all right, that makes sense. So for the people listening, I just want to back up a little bit and kind of break it down, unpack. So when you're talking about one point, you're talking about atmospheric pressure. So when we look at a soft sided chamber that, that nowadays are very, I mean relatively affordable. They're not like scary like in the hundreds of thousands anymore. You can really get. I have a fantastic one by summit to see. I got it for 15k. I mean it's not horrible, right? So you can have a soft sided that goes up to about like a 1.3, 1.4 if I'm remembering correctly, right? Maybe it goes a little. Does it go higher than that or is that about the cat?
- [20:35]
B
1.4? Yep.
- [20:37]
A
Okay, so for that and lower people can experience what the anti inflammatory. What about the anti Aging, the wound healing, any kind of toxin, would that help with mold exposure, heavy metals at that level?
- [20:52]
B
The answer is nobody really knows. Because what I think you're thinking about and talking about is something that we call minimum therapeutic dose. So we're not there on the knowledge yet because we just, we simply don't know.
- [21:05]
A
So there's benefits, but we don't even know all the benefits.
- [21:07]
B
There are benefits. We just don't know all of them at this point.
- [21:10]
A
Okay, okay. So at the 2.0 ATA and above, like, you find those pressures in the hard side chambers.
- [21:20]
B
Yes, generally speaking, yes. But remember, any chamber can have any pressure. I've seen soft sided chambers that go to 2.0. Not my favorite kind of chamber, but I have seen them. You know, they're wrapped with Kevlar. I've seen them that go to 3.0 wrapped with Kevlar. But, you know, we'll get into that when you start asking questions about chambers and what people should be looking for when they go into a facility.
- [21:45]
A
Okay, yeah, yeah, we'll get to that for sure. Okay. So I've even heard, and I want to say it was you that talked about this, that hyperbaric oxygen therapy can actually help with weight loss. And that's a huge concern with many of my listeners, whether they're dealing with thyroid issues or hormones, hormone dysfunction, menopause. How does that occur? First of all, am I right that I. Did I hear that correctly? And then what mechanism does that have on the body to actually assist with weight loss?
- [22:16]
B
So I'm a researcher. When I went down there and stayed 100 days in a 1.7 ATA environment, or 1.7 times the pressure that we're at on the surface, my metabolism increased. I ate the exact same. Same food. I'm gonna say that again. I'm a creature of habit. Every day I wake up, four eggs, some cheese, some meat, cups of coffee, that kind of thing. And then lunch, I have a salad with a lot of protein on it. And then dinner, I have protein and something green. It's just the way I eat. I'm really lame. I'll eat the same thing over and over and over and over and over, right? But I lost £23 in 25 days.
- [23:00]
A
20.
- [23:00]
B
So much so. Eating the exact same diet. Exact same diet. So much so that, you know, there were 10 medical doctors, two psychiatrists and one psychologist along with me on this endeavor, Right? So they were helping me. And the medical doctor that was the lead, Sarah, was like, all right, that's not gonna work. You're gonna have to 1.5 to 1.75 your protein. I want you eating like. And. And I was eating about one gram per kilogram body weight. So I'm about 100 kilos. I was about 100 kilos at that time. So basically I was eating about 100 grams of protein. That's a pretty good amount of protein for a dude. Okay, so now I gotta eat 150 grams. You ever try and eat 150 grams of protein? That's a lot of protein, man.
- [23:49]
A
I hope you had a blender and like some protein shakes down there with you.
- [23:53]
B
No, it was all food based protein. So I wound up eating less and less of the green stuff and more and more of the meat.
- [24:00]
A
And that was body fat that you lost. You weren't losing muscle in addition, Right.
- [24:05]
B
Body fat. Because I was doing muscle measurements the entire time I was down there as well.
- [24:13]
A
Wow, that is wild. Okay, so why, what's happening?
- [24:17]
B
So if I give you more oxygen, I increase that adenosine diphosphate to adenosine triphosphate Krebs cycle thing that we have. So I increase your metabolism. If I increase your metabolism, I speed up the amount of energy product. So I'm giving you more and you're speeding up. You're revving up every cycle in your body. I don't know is the answer. This is something I did not expect. I know that people claim it all the time now. Is this the best thing for weight loss? No. Hell no. There's a lot of really better ways for weight loss. But is this something that you can use to help you with something like for instance, toxin inhibition and then it's a second order consequence of losing weight as well? Yeah, sure, I think that's probably a good way. But do I think that people should flock to hyperbaric chambers to lose weight? Probably not the most healthy thing to do, but teach their own, right?
- [25:16]
A
Yeah, but it's a, it's a nice little add on that you could do. Like you said, like I'm just thinking for the insulin resistant type 2 diabetic, if we can get that ATP production working better, get their cells working better, get them sleeping, I. E like referencing back to that study I talked about with the twins, get them sleeping better, which is going to help improve glucose and insulin and shift them from being a sugar burner to being a fat burner. Yeah, I can totally see where that would help. Even if people don't want to live underwater, if they did hyperbarics even a couple times a week, I would think that that would significantly improve their fat burning.
- [25:54]
B
Yeah. One of the PhD students that I have who was brilliant in his own right, Jason Sonners, he basically did some of that experimentation. So yeah, we find that people with type 2 diabetes, we can turn that around a little bit. Has to do a lot with diet and exercise and movement and water and da da da. But hyperbarics can help. Right? So there's some good things that go along with it, and it makes scientific sense. Now, is that double blind, randomized placebo controlled trial done? No, but I don't need that to convince me.
- [26:28]
A
No, you really don't. No, you don't need that. You have. You have a great anecdotal evidence with the 23 pounds, I'm going to say that. Now, what about cancer? Like, kind of going from, okay, the aesthetics and weight and maybe your sleep better and your inflammation's down and the toxin inhibition and all that is amazing. And then over here we have the big C. And I have heard for years about the benefits of HBOT at. I don't know, can we say preventing, can we say curing, or do we have to just say helping? I don't know.
- [26:59]
B
Yeah, I mean, I think the jury's still out on it. And it kind of sort of depends a little bit. Now, I'll give you a hint. Like, I'm in pre clinic clinical discussions right now for preclinical trials to follow on glioblast glioblastoma shrinking through hyperbaric oxygen therapy combined with beta hydroxylbutyrate. Right? So if you can stem somebody into ketosis, you can then activate it by the catabolic nature of hyperbaric oxygen, and then it speeds up that cycle. So basically, there's a possibility, and we do find shrinkage of tumors, but once again, preclinical. Not there yet. But the initial evidence suggests some great things. Right? And glioblastoma is a real killer. I mean, and it's a killer, right? So we need to do something differently. Traditional medicine has had its turn at it and they have failed dismally. So I think that this is a good shot. Now, let me just take all the doctors and put them back for a little bit and relax. Let me relax the doctors in your audience and be like, look, I understand that one of the known mechanisms of action of hyperbaric oxygen is it increases vegf, and VEGF increases angiogenesis. So vascular endothelial growth factor is increased in hyperbaric oxygen, which increases angiogenesis, which would.
- [28:25]
A
Okay, wait, what does that mean, Doc? What does that mean? Back it up and break it down in layman's terms.
- [28:29]
B
No, no, no. Great. So angiogenesis is basically the growing of neuroscience, new blood vessels. So it's important. But that's exactly what a tumor does as well. A tumor will increase the amount of blood flow to itself by producing vegf, vascular endothelial growth factor so that it can get more blood vessels to it so they can get more of a blood supply. That is a bad thing for that kind of cancer. So this is one of these, like you really have to know what you're talking about when it comes to this, when you're playing this game of Russian roulette with a patient. Right? It's called practicing medicine for a reason. Now I am not a medical doctor, but I'm a human physiology guy and you know, I teach med school, but I am absolutely not a medical doctor. So I do research on this kind of stuff. That's all I do. But I have seen some great cases of pushing down cancer. I've seen hyperbaric oxygen therapy combined with 35 to 50 grams. That is grams of vitamin C and prostate cancer gone. And I'm just telling you what I've seen in combination with other doctors that I've worked. Does that mean it's going to work for you? Nope, that means that I have seen it. That's as you know, very anecdotal. But I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater because that's some really good bath.
- [29:54]
A
I feel so much stronger in my workouts and I legit feel like I recover quicker from my workouts because I am now using every single day mito pure. So when I dive into what does mitopure do? How is this actually helping me? And sometimes I won't even look at what a supplement does. I'll just use it because I want to actually experience the results and then go back and say, okay, here's when I feel, here's what I notice. How is it doing it? So after feeling stronger, noticing that I'm recovering so much faster and especially with Hashimoto's hypothyroidism, you know, your recovery is much lower than everyone else's. With regular use. I started to see and feel the difference in my energy levels and in my workout. So I was stronger, I had more endurance where I would normally, let's say, poop out at burpee number 10, I was actually able to do burpee number 20 and not feel like I was dying. So the endurance is up. And the other thing I noticed when I dove into the literature on might appear is that it really does deliver double digit increases in muscle strength and guess what? Endurance without actually changing your exercise. So total win, complete and total win. It's working at cellular renewal, it's working on your mitochondrial health. But most of all for me, what I noticed Immediately better energy, steady through the day. Strength, power, resiliency, better workouts, better recovery. Absolutely amazing. So if you want the most out of your workout because it's hard enough to get to the gym. So if you actually want the most out of your workout and you want your muscles to get the most out of your workout, then you gotta go and grab some. It appear so timeline that makes might appear they're offering a 10 off your order. So you're gonna go to timeline.com forward/doctor Amy D R A M I E and you're going to use the code Dr. Amy and that's it. 10 off. You gotta try it. So again, timeline T I M E l I n e.com forward slash dash r a m I e. That's going to get you 10 off your order. Write me after, let me know how your workouts are. You are going to thank me. Water. That is some good bathwater. Now I've wait. I've always heard that cancer cannot like a cancer cell cannot exist in the presence of oxygen in that hyper oxygenated environment. Wouldn't that apply to pretty much all cancers then?
- [32:50]
B
Well, you know, cancer is like a spectrum, like all kids with autism. Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on. There's low level spectrum disorder and there's those people that are high level that are really non functioning or whatever, so to say everything. Joe's personal opinion, I don't believe it works. Well on melanoma for instance. Melanoma is a very aggressive external cancer that's in your skin, you know, and can metastasize everywhere. God forbid. Metastasized melanoma is a death sentence. Right. So some of those cancers, I don't think that it works very well for or let me just say that I have seen no proof that it works at all. Right. Because we're scientists and science wins over bs, right? That's just the way it goes.
- [33:33]
A
Right.
- [33:34]
B
But you can make the case for certain kinds of cancer does not thrive in oxygen and better off it needs a little bit more of a hypoxic environment. But that cancer that we were talking about, that is a tumor that increases vascular endothelial growth factor, will get more blood and it will exist better in that high oxygen environment. So yeah, again this is not an easy thing. We don't know is the answer. But yeah, so it could help in some way, shape or form. But most of that is prevention. We're talking about, in my opinion, preventing yourself from getting cancer. And how do you do that? Well, you put your body in the Right place to do what it always does, which is heal itself. And what you got to do is feed it the right fuel to heal itself. You want to use Cheetos? That's not going to work. I'm just saying. Right, not going to work. Sorry. You need water, right? I realize I'm being crazy, but you need a lot of water. You know, you need protein in some way, shape or form, and by God, you know, stay away from the junk food, stay away from everything processed. Get to the gym, spell gym with a G, you know, instead of a J, you know?
- [34:50]
A
Exactly. I love it and I do. I, I appreciate the fact that you are touching on that because those are important points. You know, we certainly don't want people walking around thinking they can pop into an H bond chamber and eat Cheetos and, and miss the gym. So. No. All of the lifestyle components tied together. Absolutely. Now, what about before we move on to again, the breakdown of the two different types? What about healing? So I'll just, I'll share with you my anecdotal experience after my hysterectomy for the uterine cancer. You know, obviously they say, oh, six weeks, no lifting anything over ten pounds. I'm like, yeah, I'm, I'm Amy and I'm type A. It's like an AA meeting. Hi, my name is Amy. I cannot wait six weeks to work out. So I wanted to do everything I possibly could to speed up my healing. And going in my HBOT every single day was part of that. And I gotta tell you, Joe, I mean, in 10 days I was back at the gym. Now, I started very light, started very light. But really by the two week mark, by the 14 day mark, I was lifting my normal 20, 30 pounds. I wasn't doing like 150 pound squats or deadlifts, but I was, I was working out, I was doing the machines, I was doing some free weights and I felt fine. And honestly, I truly believe I speed healed. So, you know, were there other factors? The protein, like you talked about. One gram per pound of lean body mass, taking extra minerals, supplements, keeping my inflammation down. But I really believe that HBOT helped super speed my healing. Am I wrong there? What mechanism does it have to heal the body?
- [36:22]
B
You're 100% correct. So every single cell in your body. No. Okay, not every single cell, but most cells in your body are made up of collagen, right? So if you can synthesize collagen, which hyperbaric oxygen does, you can heal faster. It also hyperbaric oxygen, one of the mechanism of action is it boosts stem cell proliferation. So I can give you eight times the number of stem cells and boost your collagen such that you can make more cells, heal more cells, and fix yourself again. Hyperbaric oxygen doesn't cure anything, but it helps the body to heal itself, which it does grandly if you only let it. Right.
- [37:05]
A
And stem cell treatments can be pricey. I mean, I know we have a lot of biohackers like Aspirin Greenfield going out and going to the stem cell clinics and whatnot, and that's great, but there's a huge barrier called dollar signs to the average person going to a stem cell treatment. Now, I get it, that hyperbaric oxygen would also be an investment. But if this is something that a person could do ongoing, let's say they invest in a soft sided chamber and they're doing this ongoing, then it's much, much less than going to a stem cell treatment center. And you're producing your. You're hyper producing your own stem cells. Which equates to what? Anti aging. You mentioned the collagen, so I'm assuming it's affecting your skin and your wrinkles too.
- [37:48]
B
Yeah, it does in fact affect your skin and your wrinkles. There's some aberrant hair growth that comes with that. That I get the complaint all the time from people that are in the chamber going, all right, I'm growing hair in places that I really didn't think I should be growing hair anymore. And I stopped. So that's weird, huh? I'm like, yeah, I understand that, you.
- [38:06]
A
Know, well, that can happen with testosterone too. So, you know, just get a good laser.
- [38:11]
B
I don't know. Remember, this is hyperbaric. Oxygen therapy is on label approved for selected enhancement of problem wounds as well as compromised grafts and flaps. So that's two separate indications that are in the healing modality that, that come with approval from the fda. Right. So does that mean that it doesn't work when you only have lesser problem wounds, not severe problem wounds? Of course, if you have any wound in your body, it's going to help you. Now do you need it? Maybe not. But hey, if you want that. So here's what I do with, for instance, plastic surgery people, people with plastic surgery. I work with the physician and the physician prescribes for me. But I'll bring people in for five times before they do plastic surgery and then five to 10 times afterwards. And they will come in and come out because why I prep their skin with collagen. Synthesis prior to. So I'm basically prepping the canvas for the master to come in and do his work, or her work, whoever the surgeon is to do their work. And then on the backside, we're healing them like selected enhancement of problem healing wounds. Right. So all that stuff is working, increasing stem cell. That stuff just doesn't stop working. And to make sure that you guys understand the lower pressures, right. Even in 1.3 ata in the soft sided chambers, 1.38. We found that you double the number of circulating stem cells breathing air in a 1.3 chamber in five treatments. Five air treatments, you double the number of stem cells. Now Remember, those are CD34+ progenitor stem cells. Those are the wild card. It's not like the injectable stuff because I think a ballpark, If I inject 10,000 stem cells into you, about 3,000 of them are really going to take. Some of them are going to get discarded. Some of them, your body's just going to start combating. They're not going to work well. Right. So. So, you know, you gotta kind of understand that exogenous stem cells are way worse than endogenous. Anything that your body makes is always more readily uptakeable.
- [40:32]
A
Sure. Yeah. No, that totally makes sense. You always want it. I guess it'd be more natural, right, to, to produce your own than from getting them exogenously.
- [40:40]
B
Exactly.
- [40:41]
A
Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Okay, so we got all kinds of benefits that we're just stacking, stacking, stacking. So now, now let's break down soft sided versus hard sided. Where do we start? Pros, cons, which way do we go?
- [40:57]
B
Sure. It depends on what mechanism you are trying to get to work. Right. If you're looking to cure decompression sickness, which is decrease bubble size. Well, if you're looking to do that, you need a deeper chamber, you need a probably a hard sided chamber. Something that goes to three or more atmospheres. So basically the difference between hard sided and soft sided chambers are, are the mechanism of action that you want to take effect. Right? So when you are pressurizing and trying to decrease bubble size, another mechanism of action of hyperbaric medicine, and increase hyperoxygenation, yet another mechanism of action of hyperbaric medicine. Those two things are best done at higher pressures. So you need something that's a higher pressure machine. So this is where the training of your document needs to take place. Hyperbaric oxygen is coded as a drug by the U.S. u.S. Pharmacopoeia. So it has to be prescribed by a physician or a DO or MD or PA has to write the prescription. Doesn't matter if it's only 1.1, it has to be written by a doctor, right? I cannot write a prescription for hyperbaric medicine, right. I'm not allowed to. Now I can teach the doctor and they can write it. So I teach them and they write it, right? So this is the kind of thing that I want to make sure that the audience knows this is a no kidding drug, right? So when they're doing this and they've taken a course, like maybe a course from the International Board of Undersea Medicine or some other corporation that teaches physicians this. Because it's not taught in medical school, by God. It is absolutely not taught in medical school. But they need to know the mechanism of action of the drug so that they can prescribe it properly, right? 3.0, that's what you want to do. The crush bubbles and increase hyper oxygenation. You want anti inflammatory better at 1.3, 1.4, 1.5 maybe. You know, post Covid treatments seem to be a 1.7, but it varies, right? You got to find whatever mechanism that you want to work and then pick the chamber. Don't just walk into a hyperbaric chamber facility and go, hey, what do you got? And they're like, we got soft sided chambers. That's it. Yeah, but I need the mechanism of action, of toxin inhibition, right? Oh, sorry, we don't have that. So just take it here, it'll be good enough. That's not the way we write prescriptions, right? Not the way physicians should be writing prescriptions. At least physician should be writing the prescription per what you need as opposed to what they happen to have on hand. That's like saying I'm going to give you antibiotics, but I only have three, three here. So I'll just give you these three antibiotics and then maybe later on you can go and find some more somewhere else. No, that's not the way you write prescriptions. You're like, okay, you need this pack. You need to take all the antibiotics. It needs to be all 12 of them in sequence for a day, whatever, whatever, whatever. Otherwise we build up, you know, antibiotic resistance. I mean, things like that. I'm trying to, I'm making light of something that's clearly not that light.
- [44:09]
A
But, but it's true. But okay, there are some locations where a person can just go in and like buy a package of five sessions in a hard sided chamber, no prescription required. How, how are these places doing that?
- [44:25]
B
Let me just turn on My video camera for this one. All I want to do is go. I just want to cover my face and go, not my treatment center. Not my treatment center. Because, no, it's illegal, right? Not only is it illegal, it's immoral. It's unethical, right? You should be trained to operate a hyperbaric chamber because there are some bad things that could happen. You could have a pulmonary overinflation syndrome if you don't know what that is. You goddamn sure shouldn't be operating a hyperbaric chamber if you don't know what a POIS is. But these are things that can happen. As shallow as 0.5 psi, which is about 3ft of sea water. That's not a lot of pressure difference. So it's not even as deep as 1.3 that the shallow chambers go to. So if somebody holds their breath, the shallowest recorded depth of an arterial gas embolism is 3ft, which can be a catastrophic event and you could die. So this is why, when you walk into a hyperbaric facility, you look for a couple of things. You look for a binder. You ask them for their red binder, and they'll know exactly what you're talking about. Because you should have a red binder in every hyperbaric facility that talks about the emergency procedures and the operational procedures. And, oh, by the way, it has the training and qualification for the safety director and the intermediate or advanced hyperbaric technician. Right? They need to have their certifications in there. You want to make sure the doctor was trained and his functional medicine practitioner or. Or something like that, A diving medical practitioner, something like that. Right? Everybody needs to be trained to do this. Now, if you just want to go to the flyby, regenerate places that don't require prescriptions, you're probably not getting it from an ASME approved chamber. You're probably getting something that. Look, when you build things in the United States and you build things to code for the fda, they have to carry certain warranties with them. There are plenty of chambers that do not come from this country that are being imported right now that the FDA's put a moratorium on. The FDA is closing places down. And those places are going to get closed down. God forbid some of them have an explosion. We've just come through two recent explosions, One earlier this year and one just a couple of, like, a month ago. And these are either a doing something wrong inside the chamber. You know, look, I love stacking modalities. However, comma, please don't stack the modalities inside the chamber. I have seen people working out in a hyperbaric chamber. Increasing or working out, Increasing your metabolism inside a hyperbaric chamber increases the risk of central nervous system oxygen toxicity. So where is that line? Nobody knows. Oh, by the way, oh, you want to be on a rowing machine or a bicycle and those things heat up and heat. And a hyperbaric oxygen is a bit. Oh, I wonder why explosions are happening. Right, so like don't bring anything that generates heat inside the thing that has oxygen in it because heat and oxygen do not go well together. Well, they do if you want a forest fire.
- [47:40]
A
Now wait, does that apply to the soft sided too? Like if I brought in my computer or phone.
- [47:45]
B
Oh, okay, so let's talk about that.
- [47:48]
A
Let's talk about that.
- [47:49]
B
It's not the electronic device that's the problem. It's the battery in your laptop. When you sit it on your lap, what happens to your lap? It gets hot. Heat generating devices, those batteries that we have, we want them to last long in the engineering world. We call it energy density. Lithium ion batteries especially have a tremendous amount of energy density. And then when I increase the pressure around them, if that battery wasn't made on a Wednesday, because like things that are made on Wednesday are generally better than the things that are made on Fridays. Right? As I'm trying to get out the door, or maybe a Monday as I'm hungover. I know that's being facetious, but you know what I'm saying. If the battery isn't made exactly perfectly and there's a small gap and a small airspace, the laws of physics will apply and you will condense that airspace and then you will make contact with the other anode and cathode will make contact and it will ignite. I have seen it time and time again cause fires. The battery in an Apple watch has caused a fire in a hyperbaric chamber that was filled with air. Okay, no batteries in chambers. Please, I beg you, please be the big proponent of this. Don't let people do it. Because we're going to get more attention from the FDA or God forbid, another governmental organization than we want if we start blowing up more chambers than have already blown up. Right. So I urge people to do this cautiously and err on the side of caution. You might get away with it for the first 34 times you do it in a software chamber at 1.3, but the 35th time you do it, you may be trapped in a ziploc bag with something that's on fire. Oh no. Good lord. I don't want that for you.
- [49:43]
A
Okay? I don't either, or anyone else. Right.
- [49:46]
B
Those modalities inside the chamber. If you want to stack modalities, do breathing exercises in the chamber. That's perfectly acceptable. Do the eye rotation exercises in the chamber perfectly. Accept, meditate in the chamber. Perfectly acceptable for you to put a rowing machine in your chamber or to work out or to put a red light in your chamber. You could just imagine, right? Like, oh, red light therapy. I just have to lay here. Except it's a heated device. Please, please don't, please. I don't want to read about you in the newspaper. I'm starting to like you. Not just you, your listeners. Right? Like I'm starting to like these people that are really going after, really trying to improve their health. But please don't do things that are bad just to get something that might be good.
- [50:35]
A
Okay? I promise.
- [50:36]
B
Thank you. Thank you.
- [50:37]
A
I will not take my phone into the. Okay. All right. That's helpful. No, that's how. That's great information too. Now, what about EWAT exercise with oxygen therapy? Have you gone down that rabbit hole at all? Okay, talk to me about that.
- [50:52]
B
EWAT is terrific for what it's used for. However, it cannot and should not be used in a hyperbaric chamber.
- [51:00]
A
Right. No, this is kind of like another modality. Like if people don't want to go in a chamber, they can do. And let me back up and explain because people are listening on what the hell she's talking about. It's exercise with oxygen therapy. It's basically a big oxygen containing bag. You got your oxygen condenser, same as you would with an HBOT soft side. @ least I bought the extra oxygen condenser so I can have extra oxygen. So the bag fills up, you wear a mask and you exercise with the mask on, breathing extra oxygen with the whole concept of as you're exercising, your heart rate gets up, that oxygen just comes in at a rapid pace and super saturates your cells. Did I say that right?
- [51:44]
B
Basically that's. That's basically it. Now it's good for what it's used for. Again, there's also those oxygen deprivation machines, right? You wrap around. It's the exact opposite. It treats you like you're at altitude. Yes. That increases HIF1 Alpha hypoxic inducing factor. It also upregulates brain derived neurotropic factor. That's all good stuff as well. Right. But not for use in combination with hyperbaric oxygen as a supplement afterwards adjunct therapy. Absolutely, let's do that.
- [52:16]
A
Okay. Because sometimes that might even be. Now, what about that over the HBOT chamber? If somebody, let's say, okay, doesn't have an hour and a half or an hour to spend in an HBOT chamber, is that a good alternative or just not? We're comparing, like, apples.
- [52:32]
B
Apples and peanuts, to be honest with you. But if you're looking at this, I want to challenge everybody to, if you can take time, if you can't make an hour or two to go to the gym, can't make an hour or two to go to do a hyperbaric treatment, people like, I can't be without my phone for an hour and a half.
- [52:52]
A
Half.
- [52:52]
B
I'm like, really? You are that important that you don't sleep? Oh, my goodness, that must be horrible. I know physicians on call at hospitals that are literally saving people's lives through surgery that also have to sleep. So you need to make sure that you are planning your day around the important things. So if one of those important things is a little bit of hyperbaric oxygen therapy, you'll get the benefits from that. If one of those is going to the gym, you know, you want to increase what we talked about, vegf, right? We want to increase vascular endothelial growth factor and angiogenesis, growing new blood vessels. Do that at the gym. That's the best way to go. Get that. That's an hour of hard working out gives you that. But, you know, what do you want to be at the end of the day? You have so many breaths to take. Where do you want to take them?
- [53:41]
A
I love that. That's a mic drop moment right there. That's beautiful. So now with all of your research and, you know, going underwater for 100 days and looking at all the different markers that you measured, you come up with five longevity cures. So what are those? Does it include hbot? What else is in that list?
- [53:59]
B
Five longevity cures. So basically, what I want people to do. You heard my tagline earlier. Spell gym with a G. So go to the gym, get your workout on. You need muscle. You need lean muscle mass to help you as you age. With stability, with walking, with balancing, all that. If you strength train, that will help you with everything. You get a little sick, you got some strength training, you got some room to eat into, if you will. When somebody gets sick, what's the first thing that happens? They lose muscle mass, right? As you get older, sarcopenia takes over, right? You lose muscle mass. Get muscle so that you have muscle when you need muscle. Right. It's good on so many different levels. Anti aging. Water, water, water, water, water, water, Right? Like, I keep pushing this. A gallon of water a day. They're like, oh, you could get high, hyper. You know, I'm like, well, okay, listen, yes, you can get hyper bulimia. You absolutely could drink too much water and wash away electrolytes. However, comma, if you're doing it smart, correctly, the right amount, you're going to be okay. But about a gallon of water a day is important to you. That three o' clock lull that you feel, that tired, that misery that, you know, all that is probably your dehydrated, what I call faith. You need to believe in something. You need to believe that there is a future, that there is something more than what we have right now. It keeps you going, it stimulates you, it drives you. It gets you to do the things that you maybe don't want to do. Like, I'll give you a perfect for instance. If you do something that you don't necessarily want to do, you increase something called your anterior mid cingulate cortex. It's a part of your brain. And it's one of these, like, I talked about it with Misha Tate when I was on her podcast. It's one of these, like, I don't want to go to the gym today. Well, I want to go to the gym because I want to grow my brain. And no matter what happens, that will always be with you. Right? So that's another thing. Things that will make you anti age, and there are many of them. So you're looking at things like hyperbaric oxygen therapy, like increasing circulation, things that will not decrease your age, like staying in the sun for the appropriate period of time, not being overexposed to ionizing radiation, certainly not eating products like plastic products, drinking out of metal containers. You know, so it's all in one basic thing is a lot of things in there, but it's all, do yourself no harm. You know, we have this Hippocratic oath that says, do no harm, but I think they're missing it because it's like, do no harm. Drink this bottle of plastic water. Wait, what right do no harm, Drink water. Okay, drink water out of the right container. But what kind of water? It needs to be the right kind of water, not filled with all these things that are going to pull everything out of you that you have in your body. So basically, those are my five general principles. You need to hydrate, you need to do things that will lengthen your telomeres, not Decrease your telomeres. You need to use the gym, you need to get out, work out, walk, increase your circulation. And look, take care of yourself. This is the one ride you got. And you need that faith to get you there, is my opinion.
- [57:28]
A
I love that. I love that. Boom again. You keep giving me these mic drop moments. I love it. I do. I mean, we can't say it enough honestly. And I love when my guests say the things that other guests say that I say over and over again. Because it's that whole repetition thing. When people hear something seven times, you know that you need to drink water. You need to have faith. You need to believe in something. You need to sleep. Like, the basics in our world world are not so basic in the average everyday person's world. And we need to drive these points home, right?
- [58:02]
B
You know, like, look, man, I could sit back and have a cocktail every night. Moderation is much better than that, right? And the other thing that, that I have found, and this is just an overall thought process that I've come on, your body is equipped with a great immune system. Now, this immune system used to have you running from saber tooth tiger. We do not run from saber toothed tigers anymore. The biggest problem I have is that somebody didn't like my Instagram reel or, you know, I'm at work and my boss needs some piece of paper that I haven't finished, right? That's the big stressors in our life. These are not real stresses. So what you need to do is from time to time, stress yourself physiologically. Get in an ice bath, get in a sauna, get in, stress yourself physiologically. Because we know that when your body does that, those longevity genes kick in, you stop replication or, you know, fornication between the cells and they stop reproducing, if you will, and they slow down and they go into sustainment mode. You need to do that every once in a while. You need to fast every once in a while. You see what I'm saying? Like what I call balance. Your life needs to be in balance plus good times. You need to have good times. Need to have bad times too, because the bad times help you remind yourself that you had good times and that there are good times. You know, the Buddhists say, walk the middle path. And I'm like, I'm not sure that I feel that right. I feel like you need the highs and the lows to realize and recognize and appreciate and be grateful for the fact that you have those good times in your life and look back and go, boy, I had a lot of good things in my life and then turn up that gratitude. Gratitude is one of those secret sauces that I remember it and then I forget it. And then I go, oh, yeah, that's right, I'm supposed to be grateful, damn it. Yeah, I got to remember to be grateful. Oh yeah, I am. I'm grateful. And then I get happy again and then I forget it. Right? It's true.
- [60:05]
A
It's so true. Oh, Dr. Joe, you've been amazing. Thank you so much. Thanks for the research that you've done and putting yourself underwater water for 100 days and just, I mean, you've done so much research, it's. It's mind blowing. I mean, we can't even list all of the, all of the papers that you've produced, but we're going to list where people can find you. So I'm going to let you tell the audience that and then of course, we'll put that in the show.
- [60:29]
B
I usually can be found at DrDeepc, www.doctordc.com or my handle on most of these, you know, Instagram and so forth is Dr. Deep Sea. So you can follow that stuff. But generally speaking, if you look up Joe Dettorro or Google Joe Dettori, you'll get a good insight to me. Once again, science wins over bullshit. And we definitely want to get people to start thinking scientifically and not just, oh yeah, I got some newfangled cool thing, right?
- [60:56]
A
Yep, exactly. And for the record, I love your Instagram. You do really good reels. They're very entertaining. I highly recommend you follow it. So thanks, Dr. Joe. Thank you so much for your time and your research and your knowledge today. I greatly.
- [61:09]
B
We appreciate you as well.
- [61:10]
A
All right, everyone, till next time, thanks for listening. The information shared on the Thyroid Fixer podcast is intended solely for informational and educational purposes. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always consult with your physician or other qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition, treatment, or before making changes to your healthcare regimen, including medications, supplements or other therapies. Use of the information provided in this podcast does not establish a doctor, patient or client, provide a relationship between you and the host, or between you and any other healthcare professionals featured on the show. Any medical opinions or statements made by guests are their own and do not not necessarily reflect those of the host or affiliated parties. Statements regarding dietary supplements or health related products mentioned in this podcast have not been evaluated by the fda. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Some episodes of the Thyroid Fixer podcast may include sponsorships or affiliate links. The host may receive compensation for discussing or promoting certain products or services. Any such sponsorships or affiliations will be clearly disclosed during the episode. All opinions expressed are those of the hosts or guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of any sponsors. The inclusion of a product or service does not imply endorsement by any healthcare professional featured on this podcast.