← The Thyroid (and Hormone) Fixer Podcast: Thyropause, Menopause, Metabolism and How to Fix It
The Thyroid (and Hormone) Fixer Podcast: Thyropause, Menopause, Metabolism and How to Fix It
574. The TRUTH About Your Labs: What Your Doctor Isn't Telling You with Dr. Ken Berry
00:59:56
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The patient's symptoms are just as important, if not in many cases, more important than the lab results.
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Welcome to the Thyroid Fixer podcast, where.
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We dive deep into the world of.
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Thyroid and hormones, especially for you ladies navigating perimenopause and menopause, and really for.
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Anyone struggling with hypothyroidism. I'm your host, Dr. Amy, thyroid and hormone specialist and CEO of a global telemedicine practice where we prescribe the right.
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Thyroid treatment and bioidentical identical hormones to.
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All 50 states and most of Canada, helping you become that badass human that.
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You'Re meant to be. So if you're battling weight gain and hair loss, you can't lose weight no matter what you do. Your energy levels are plummeting and your libido left town. Then you're in the right place and you have found your tribe.
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Remember, I want you to embrace every inch of that badass woman that you truly are. So if you're ready to dive in and fix things, let's get started. So I've been using a tool that's supporting my body in powerful ways. It's called the Wave Watch. Unlike trackers, it doesn't measure or log anything. Instead, it plays carefully designed sound frequencies that help the body rebalance, rest, and heal naturally. With over 140 frequency sets rooted in holistic health, it's helping people move from stress into a calm, restorative energy. You can try Wave Watch risk free and get a hundred dollars off with code Dr. Amy@wavewatch.com that's spelled W A V W A T C H dot com, forward slash D R A M I, E. And use the code Dr. Amy at checkout. I've been using Wave Watch for sleep, for mood, for motivation, digestion, hair support, hormone balance, you name it. The frequency is in there. And yes, it actually works. I completely and totally hear you and I see you and I understand you. And I know exactly where you're at. You're gaining weight. You can't lose. You have all the symptoms that no one's listening to. The fatigue, the hair loss, the brain fog. You can't remember why you walked into a room. You don't want to get dressed and go out because you know if you have that glass of wine with your friend, if you have that dessert with your husband or even order an appetizer, you're going to be five pounds heavier the next day. And your clothes are already tight. Every single doctor is telling you that you're normal and everything is fine. You've been to multiple conventional medicine doctors trying to use your insurance, hoping to God that somebody has an answer. Then you've dropped thousands of dollars on functional medicine or integrative medicine because you keep hearing how functional medicine gets to the root cause of the problem. But not every functional medicine practitioner knows the thyroid and knows the hormones and can treat you as a nuanced, personalized individual, a unique person. That is exactly what my team and I do. We specialize in thyroid problems. We specialize in hormones. You can't do one without the other. You cannot just see someone for your thyroid and have them ignore your hormones or have them half ass your hormones. They better be a hormone and thyroid expert. If you are going to spend your time, your energy and your money if you are going to invest in functional medicine, they need to be a thyroid and hormone expert and treat you as an individual.
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They can't have a cap on how.
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Much T3 that they're going to give you. They have to personalize your treatment plan to get you feeling your best, no.
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Matter what that looks like, so that.
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Every system in your body functions at the very top, at the very best. And that is exactly what we do. I made it my mission because I went through this. I was dismissed, I was gaslit, I.
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Was misdiagnosed, and I dropped thousands of.
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Dollars before I found an answer. That is why I made it my mission to be able to treat people in all 50 states so we can prescribe via telehealth. Thyroid and hormones and peptides. Yeah, the GLPs to all 50 states, most of Canada and now Puerto Rico. That is my mission to be able to help you wherever you are because I want you living your best life.
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I want you to join me in.
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Optimization land where you can go out and love life and go out with your friends and go out with your partner and not gain weight looking sideways at a brownie. Yes, we do have financing options available. I'm talking like 0% or 12 months, the whole thing.
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Based on your credit score.
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We got you. And our programs are affordable. They're completely and totally affordable and they.
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Will get you from point A to point B.
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They will bring you into optimization land. So please don't waste another moment struggling, please. I want you living here with me a great happy life in optimization land. So go to my website@dramy.com, click the Become a patient button so we can have a chat. Let's talk it out. Let's hear what you've done, what you haven't done, what's worked what hasn't worked. And let's get you on the right path to feeling your absolute best. If you can imagine the best life ever that is absolutely possible for you. I'm not BSing you.
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I am not BSing you.
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I was in your shoes.
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Many of my patients have been in your shoes.
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We will get you there, and that is my promise to you.
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Dr. Ken Berry. Honestly, if people don't know you, they've been living under a rock, but everyone that knows you loves you. The way that you deliver health information, it's just so just laid back, straightforward, to the point, blunt, which I obviously, as my audience knows, am totally in line with that. I love just delivering people the information they need to up level their health. And if they take it and run with it, good. If they don't and they discourage it, well, that's on them, too. So today we are talking about your new book, Common Sense Labs, which just. First of all, thank you. Thank you so much for writing this because we speak the same language. I've been talking about normal versus optimal and how to interpret your labs and what they mean forever. But you are giving people something in their hands that they can reference when they get their lab. So we're going to unpack this and more. I really want to pick your brain about different labs and just everything about labs. But first of all, thank you for your time and for coming on the Thyroid Fixer podcast.
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My pleasure. My pleasure.
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So, okay, first big question before we get nitty gritty. What made you write this book? What were you seeing go on in our health space that you said, you know what, we got to break this down for people and simplify what labs mean?
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Well, a long list of things over the course of two decades, three decades, really, if you count my training, ranging all the way from the arrogant ignorance and male chauvinism of old white men with gray hair and long white coats, judging their perception of the motivations of female patients. It goes from that all the way to the young doctor of whatever gender, whatever nationality, who's trying to be very impressive and sound very knowledgeable. And they wind up saying a bunch of words strung into sentences that when they walk out of the patient's exam room, very, very often, as soon as the nurse comes in to discharge the patient, the patient looks at the nurse and says, now, what the hell did he say? Because I didn't understand a word of that. So the entire purpose of having conversation, doctor to patient, is to relay an understandable and applicable and usable message. Right? That's the entire. Otherwise, doctors wouldn't talk to patients. We're not. I'm not there to impress the patient. I'm there to explain this to them in language that they can understand with a strategy that they can go home and immediately implement that into their life with very low friction. That's kind of been my goal from day one. And there's so many doctors, they have goals, very goal oriented, but their goal ain't that goal, evidently.
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Yes, exactly. And I hear that from the patients that come into our practice all the time. People are having very similar experiences in conventional medicine, and it's unfortunate. And I know that you have been a huge advocate of changing this paradigm in the conventional 6 system for, like you said, decades now. Moving into labs. Okay? When we talk about labs, you know, people want to go in, they want to see what's going on in their body, because it should. Right. It should help the doctor and the nurse to come up with a plan or to be able to put the pieces of the puzzle together with what the patient is saying. Like, hey, doc, I had this symptom. I have that symptom. I'm gaining weight, I'm losing my hair, I'm constipated, I'm tired all the time. What gives? Because I wasn't like this six months ago. Right. So the labs are there to give us a direction and so we can pair it up with what this person is saying they're experiencing. But that doesn't always happen in that five to seven minute visit in conventional medicine, does it?
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No, not at all. It very seldom happens. And, well, I want to preface everything we're about to talk about with this very important message that each and every one of your listeners needs to hear and take to heart. And hopefully there's some doctors listening to. The patient's symptoms are just as important, if not in many cases more important than the lab results. This is especially when it comes to thyroid health. Most doctors will let you talk, but they're thinking about something else. They're clicking buttons on their electronic medical record. They're not listening to you. Like I had an old doctor once tell me, if you will just shut up and listen, the patient will tell you what's wrong with it. And that's true about 90% of the time. And so do not let a doctor discount your symptoms because your doctor may have a medical degree, but your doctor has not lived in your body for the last month, the last three months, the last six months, what you've been experiencing in those last few months and how that's different from how you used to feel, that is, that's a gold mine for an intelligent, wise doctor. And it takes both intelligence and wisdom to be able to sit still and shut up and truly listen to the patient explain. This is how I feel. This is how I used to feel. What changed? How can I get back to feeling like I used to feel? Do not let a doctor discount your symptoms, what you've been experiencing. If they, if they even imply that this is all in your head, fire their ass immediately and find a new doctor. Okay? Because it, it may be in your head, but guess what else is in your head? Your brain. And guess what? Your brain's attached to the rest of your body. It's all one body. It has the same blood supply. Okay? So if it all is all in your head, that doesn't mean you're crazy. That just means that your thyroid is probably really out of whack.
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Ken, I think you're a brother from another mother. Honestly, I love you. I say this all the time. What I tell people is whether you're working in the insurance based system and you're going into your PCP or OBGYN for your 5 to 7 minute visit, or whether you are forking over cash to sit with somebody for an hour in the functional space, if they don't ask you the four most important words they can ask, how do you feel?
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You leave, you're done, you're gone.
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That's it. Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And so many doctors, especially in the kind of the wellness influencer space, will check a huge panel of labs and which gives you a ton of information. But if you don't pair that with the patient's symptoms and the change in their symptoms, that's only half the battle. And so many of those doctors, just like the old gray haired doctors, traditional medicine will think, well, I don't really need to hear your symptoms. I've got 500 lab results here we need to be discussing. And actually heard a young doctor one time, telepathian in the emergency department. Please be quiet. I am trying to figure out what is wrong with you. That's an absolute quote. And I was like, because I had this, my old mentor's advice, shut up and listen. And I was like, what is going on? Did he just say that out loud? And so don't let either a traditional doctor or an allopathic practitioner or one of the newfangled executive lab panel people, your symptoms, regardless of what labs they're going to check or not going to check your symptoms. Are just as important as any lab results on the sheep.
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Amen. Amen to that. I love it. Okay, now let's get to the meat. When we're talking about labs, like you're looking at your lab lab panel, can you explain to people how all of these different labs, Quest LabCorp, a hospital lab, how did they get that standard lab value range off to the side? And then we're going to really break down like where you fall in the range and all that. But, but how did they get that range?
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Yeah, so your listeners are going to be very underwhelmed at my answer, telling the truth about this. So in most cases, they took anywhere from 100 to 500 random, healthy appearing people off the street and they would check their, whatever lab tests that they're trying to kind of quantify, what's the normal range? And then they would check up for 100 to 500. In some cases, it's literally like 120 people. And then they would put that, they would plot that on a normal distribution curve and they would typically go two standard deviations from the mean and say, okay, that's the normal range. Now, you know this, but many people who are doctors or healthcare practitioners would be like, well, I mean, that sounds like kind of around the average. Yeah. And that's what that is. And that's going to give you average results. But I think what more and more people are wanting and in fact demanding is they don't want to be normal, they don't want to be average. They want to have their optimal health. And also keep in mind that most of these lab normal ranges were quantified back in the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s in some cases. And these were all performed on people eating a standard American diet full of bread, full of potatoes, full of dessert, full of pie, cake, cake, cookies, donuts, and so many of the normal ranges, if you had checked that in somebody eating a proper human diet, if you check that lab value on 200 of those people, then it would be fine if you fell within that standard deviation. But when you're checking on a, you know, 200 inflamed, hyperinsulinemic, probably hyperglycemic people, those aren't healthy people to start with. And so many of the normal ranges that'll appear on your lab sheet or on your phone, that is normal for a sick population, but it is not normal and indeed very not ideal if you're trying to achieve optimal health.
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Yes, I totally agree. I always simplify it and say in functional medicine, we took all the badasses we took the 75 year olds that are skiing down the side of Mountain, the 65 year old that's throwing weights around the gym and looks, looks fantastic. We tested them to get a much more narrow optimal range versus that standard lab value range that is that it's huge. Like, even though they went two standard deviations, it's still oftentimes depending on the marker you're talking about, way too wide and vast. And you show perfect examples in your book of, okay, your doctor calls you and says, you know, your lab is normal. Well, okay, does. And you use the perfect example of ggt, because this really stands out for me as a liver marker. You know, what, if you come in at a 43 for the GGT, is that as good as being a 15? Well, I mean, those numbers are pretty far apart. So where do you actually want to fall? And I love that you get down into the nitty gritty of where optimal is in the book as well.
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And I think that's very important for anybody who has basically stepped outside of the mainstream medical paradigm. And they're like, I don't want to just be average. I've got kids, I've got grandkids, I've got this spouse I love. I want to be kicking ass, right? I want to be optimal. What do my labs need to be? And so when I wrote this book with my good friend Kim Howerton, when we decided to include kind of optimal ranges, I was well aware that my book would at that point never, ever be adopted or used by the American Diabetes association or the American Heart association or the American Thyroid association, because they will only go by the normal range. They will never, ever even imply that there is such a thing as an optimal range for a lab result. And so I kind of niched myself down by putting that in the book. But I think that's, that's the information people really want.
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Oh, gosh. That's what they need. That's absolutely what they need. Now, your opinion, do you believe. I know it's a little controversial, but do you believe that those standard lab value ranges are also kind of tied to the pharmaceutical industry? So I'll give you an example of what I'm thinking. I remember a time where total cholesterol, you weren't getting flagged until you were over 300. Now you're getting flagged with a 205, which you and I know is not a problem. Like, we're not gonna freak out over total cholesterol 205 or a 250 or 275. But with that flag comes that conversation by your doctor. You know, Ken, you really should be on a statin because your cholesterol is high. Is there a correlation there?
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Probably. We know that the American Heart association recently updated their blood pressure cutoff guidelines. And Even if you're 85 years old, they want your blood pressure to be 80 under 120 on systolic and under 80 on diastolic. Now, any doctor that practices medicine with regular real humans will know that if you take somebody who's over the age of 60 and you give them enough blood pressure lowering medicine to get their blood pressure in that low, they're going to have lightheadedness and dizziness. They're probably going to pass out, probably going to fall, probably going to break a hip, break a wrist, break an ankle, crack their skull. That's not good. But now what it was great for was selling another few billion dollars worth of blood pressure medication. You can also see this in total testosterone levels for men. Yeah, just a few years ago, any total testosterone under 350 was flagged by LabCorp as being low. And now with the new guidelines, it has to be under 25049 before they will even entertain the idea that you might have low testosterone. And you gave the cholesterol example for forever. When they first came up with the test, any total cholesterol under 300 was completely normal. Doctor didn't, his pulse didn't go up. He didn't get those veins bulging. He didn't have. You didn't get emotional. You've got to have zilcore. None of that happened. And then they revised it down to 250 and now it's revised it again and it's got to be under 200. And many, many cardiologists now are saying it's got to be under 150 or you're at risk. And so is that selling billions more in cholesterol lowering medications. Of course. And then we can really go down the rabbit hole with why they want every male to have low testosterone and not do anything about that. I can't imagine, you know, what kind of conspiracies that would lead to.
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I've already gone down that rabbit hole on, on this podcast and I, I truly, it's worth mentioning. Why not? Because we're talking about it. I firmly believe, and it sounds like you do too, that if we can take away the testosterone, because I'm sure the listeners are going, well, wait a minute, you just said that now they're flagging it. You have to be lower. So that means they don't want to prescribe testosterone.
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Right.
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Because if we prescribe testosterone and get men's levels up to the optimal range, they're not going to need the Viagra and the statin and the BP and the depression med and the sleeping pill. That's my take on it.
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And then if you start looking at societal and governmental goals and aspirations, then you really go down the rabbit hole. If the average man's got a total testosterone of 280, just imagine society.
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Oh, yeah, yeah. Which we are seeing more and more estrogenic looking men. I always say, like, go to Walmart, go to the mall and just sit there and watch the dudes that walk by you. They have hips, they have man boobs, they're becoming more and more estrogenic from a variety of different sources. Yeah, yeah. So I love that we're touching on that as well. Okay, so you are hugely passionate about patients advocating for themselves and really knowing the right tests to ask for when they go to their doctor. So why are doctors falling short when it comes to ordering the correct labs? And what is lab literacy? You say lab literacy. Why is that important for the patient on their healthcare journey to know what their labs mean when they're having this conversation with their doc?
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A
Yeah. I'm gonna reveal something to your listeners that most doctors would rather your listener did not know. Doctors are just dudes and chicks, okay? They're just people, just like you and me. They have bills, they have spouses, they have problems, they have drama, they have trauma, they have stress, they are busy, they are behind, they're in danger of bankruptcy at any minute or not making the Mercedes payment, whatever. But they have all that list of worries and concerns. And so, yeah, they took an oath, and yeah, they try to do a good job, but the volume of medical literature is expanding at an exponential rate. Now, it's absolutely true. And any doctor who argues this is suspect immediately. There's no way one human being can keep up with all the reading of all the new literature coming out. It's literally impossible. So your doctor does not know it all. And your doctor needs to be able to readily admit that. I do not know it all. I have not read many of the latest studies. There's only 24 hours in the day, and I got a wife and three kids and two dogs and a cat and a peacock, whatever. There's no way I can read all that stuff. And so that's why, first of all, a doctor should Appreciate a patient who comes in with some stuff that they printed off on the Internet and said, I've been reading about this test and I've been reading about this stuff. They've actually done some of the doctor's work for them. Now maybe the patient's completely wrong, but does that not show a degree of motivation in that patient? They want to get healthy, they want to work with their doctor. Any doctor should applaud that and appreciate it. But many doctors get irritated if you bring anything in or even mention that you may have done an Internet search. That's part of the problem. Another big part is that doctors receive inadequate training when it comes to what labs to order and how to interpret those labs. The vast majority of doctors are not trained to really, truly take a good history from their patient and pay attention to that history, which I still agree with my mentor 90% of the time. The patient will literally quote out of the textbook. If you'll just let them talk and listen to them, you're like, oh well, it's obvious what they have. And then we come with big pharma having much too much impact and reach into what's considered normal and what's considered abnormal. Anytime they can get a lab normal range lowered or raised so that they make more money, guess what? They're going to do that of course. Right? And so when you realize your doctor's not some demigod, they're not some freak of nature with 180 IQ, they're just somebody who used to be a great student who really wants to help people, but they're stuck in the modern just muck sewer of modern, the practice of modern medicine trying to keep their head above water. And in many cases it's almost impossible for them to do that. Well, they can half ass do it and they can do the best they can. But what does the patient deserve, Dr. Amy? Do they just deserve the best that doctor can muster that day? I mean they paid their full copay, right? They paid their full deductible. So it seems like they should be able to expect a full measure from their healthcare provider.
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B
Yes, 100%. So when, when the patient goes in, just like you, you train them to do in the book, they go in with the list of labs that they want to have and they get a no. And I'll tie this back specifically because I hear it all the time in the practice, specifically with thyroid antibodies, reverse T3 and sometimes free T3. It's like a hard no. Now I'll focus on reverse T3. The biggest thing that my patients will hear from their conventional practitioner is, no, you don't need that. We only test it in a clinical setting. To which I say, well, of course, if you're lying in the ER, the ICU, and we test your reverse T3, it's going to be high. But I want to know what it's like when you're walking around trying to live life outside of laying in a hospital bed fighting for your life. So why is it, why do doctors say no to testing? If that would give them. Even if they're going by the standard lab value ranges, if it's going to give them a more accurate picture of what's going on inside their patient's body, why do they say no?
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A
Well, I have no idea. Because even back when in the first few years of my early medical practice, I practiced the standard allopathic medicine pathway, I was the guy that would show you the. To join the gym and join Weight Watchers. I was literally the guy that just, I said it by the book. But I can remember even back then when I was a young physician, if somebody came in and they had printed off an article and they're like, I really want you to check this. I was always just innately curious, like, huh, I haven't heard of that test. I wonder if that's a big deal. I don't know, you know, if your insurance will pay for it, I'm fine to order it. If your insurance doesn't pay for it, you understand you'll have to pay for it. And they're like, yeah, that's fine. I don't mind. I would order the test from day one, but there are many doctors. Like you said, it's just a hard no. And there's no discussion, there's no compromise. It's a hard no. And I want to save this to the very end, Dr. Amy. But I've got a nuclear option that your listeners can use with their doctor. If they ask for a reverse T3, or they ask for TPO antibodies or TG antibodies, or they ask for a fasting insulin and their doctor says, no, no discussion. I'm not ordering that. Just remind me at the very end, I'm going to tell your listeners the nuclear option that will get your doctor to order whatever the hell you want ordered with a yes, ma' am or yes, sir at the end.
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B
Oh, my gosh. Nothing like dangling a carrot. Okay? No, we cannot forget that piece. We're going to absolutely circle back to that. So if a patient's going in, let's say they're dealing with a closed minded dog, but man, they just, they just want to get some information so that they can use your book to better understand what their labs mean. What are the most important labs that they can ask for? Like basic ones that you know they're not going to get a no on, but that will give them a lot of information.
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A
Probably the most important lab that I get, the most useful metabolic health information from outside of the thyroid testing is a fasting insulin or a serum insulin level. If, and this is another one that's just beyond me. It's like, why wouldn't a doctor want this information? Right? Because we, we all know, even as just people walking the street, that insulin is intimately involved with diabetes. Some people's pancreas doesn't make insulin, Therefore they're type 1 diabetic. They have to inject insulin. Right? So it's obviously tied in very tightly. But if the average doctor knew, if they'd been taught I can actually predict someone developing type 2 diabetes 10 years before they develop it, why wouldn't I want that information? I could start to counsel them right now. Hey, you're, you're on the road to type 2 diabetes. You need to make the following changes. Now. There's no prescription medication for elevated insulin, right? And so basically, if you're eating too many carbohydrates, too much sugar, you're going to have a chronically elevated insulin level. And so if you keep that chronically elevated insulin level, you're going to be storing fat in your liver, fat in your pancreas. It's pushing you towards developing first prediabetes insulin resistance and ultimately type 2 diabetes. That's literally where it's pushing you. If your doctor would check a fasting insulin and find out, oh, it's 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, immediately they go, dude, you've got hyperinsulinemia, unless you've got an insulin secreting tumor, which only about one person out of 10 million has. So it's probably not that. Then we know that by definition you are eating too many total carbohydrates, especially the ultra processed simple carbohydrates. You're eating too many of those, you're overstressing your pancreas. And so just with that one test alone, you could take any, any mediocre doctor who's just literally middle of the road, C equals MD and make them a much, much, much better doctor just by checking a fasting insulin. But this is one of the many tests that especially my followers that want to be very metabolically healthy. They ask for a fasting insulin, and the doctors look at them like they've got two hits or like they're from Mars. Like, why would. What would you even do with that? And once the my followers have read my book and actually thought about this for, I don't know, 10 seconds, they look back at the doctor like, he's got two hits. Like, why would you not want to know what my insulin level is, dummy. And so there's been many a doctor fired over refusing to check a fasting insulin level, and I would say rightfully so.
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B
Yes, Yes, I love that. Okay, so take fasting insulin. Let's break it down for the listeners. That's a perfect example. So give the range, the standard lab value range that is wide and vast, and tell people where you like to see them for their fasting insulin.
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A
So a LabCorp for sure says that any fasting insulin under 25. So if it's 24, that's completely normal, completely healthy, maybe even optimal. According to LabCorp. You don't know. It's just in the normal range. And they also say that a fasting insulin of zero, at least they used to on their website, anywhere from 0 to 24 was. Was. That's the normal range. Now, you know as well as I do, if your fasting insulin is zero, you have type 1 diabetes. So I'm not. Hopefully they've corrected that on their website. The last time I checked, maybe a month ago, it was still said 0 to 24. No, that is not true at all. So it's my opinion, and we, we also reflect this in the book, that if your fasting insulin is above 10, you're mildly hyperinsulinemic. You're eating too many total carbohydrates, definitely simple carbs. You're just eating too much sugar. And you need to decrease the amount of sugar, AKA simple carbs that you're eating to get your fasting insulin under 10. In my opinion, that's. That's normal. But optimal is you really want to eat low carb enough that you can get it down to about 5.
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C
Yep.
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A
For most people, that's optimal right there. And so do you see, this doesn't promote any pharmaceutical. You notice that we haven't mentioned a drug. And so for many doctors, that's a very uncomfortable place because the only tool that they have in their toolbox is the prescription pad. Whether that's virtual or literal, that's all they have. That's all they got. Right. They don't know how to even tell somebody, oh, you're fasting insulin is high, okay? You need to change your diet and follow the ways, and then your fasting insulin level will just fall right back down to normal and eventually optimal. They don't know how to have that discussion. Plus, a discussion takes time. Whereas writing a prescription, clickety click, there's your prescription. It's already at the pharmacy. Go pick it up and AKA get out of here. I got more patients waiting, right? And people, People recognize that. They're like, yeah, no, I've been shuffled out like that. That's not helpful. But to have that diet discussion, that's going to take two, three, four, five, six more minutes. Now the doctor's even further behind. So I completely understand and empathize with the doctors, but I didn't take an oath to take care of, protect, and defend doctors. That's not what my oath said.
- [34:44]
C
The struggle is real when it comes to losing weight. Listen, I know because I've been there. You're trying all the things. You're doing the diet, you're tracking your macros, you're getting to the gym, you're going to the Pilates, you're doing all the things, but it's not working. It's not working. And this is independent of a thyroid problem. Maybe you have a thyroid problem. Maybe you have low hormones, or maybe you don't, and you're just like, I just have a really crappy metabolism that I am putting on weight or I can't lose weight no matter what I do. Then you need some help. But what you don't need is a stimulant fat burner of the old days where you literally thought you were having a heart attack. You need something that is actually going to work to increase your metabolism without jacking up your heart rate. Enter Thyroid Fixer.
- [35:38]
B
Yes, I know it's called Thyroid Fixer.
- [35:40]
C
But I named it after myself and the brand, because it's my baby. It's my child. It's a product that I have been studying for 15 years and using it on patients for 15 years before I brought it to you. Thyroid fixer contains T2.
- [35:56]
B
And what this does, I call it.
- [35:58]
C
The forgotten thyroid hormone. No, there's no tests for T2, but your body does produce T2 in small amounts. T2 will increase your basal metabolic rate, literally the amount of fat that you're burning at rest. It's also browning white adipose tissue. So this is why you jump into cold plunges. Or maybe you're like, I don't want to jump in a cold plunge to brown your white adipose tissue. That helps with insulin resistance, it helps with metabolism, it helps with inflammation, helps with overall health. So that's a good thing as well. And here's the other thing with T2, it's not going to affect your thyroid. So many of you know if you.
- [36:32]
B
Take T3, if we give you T3, or if you abuse T3 when you're.
- [36:36]
C
Not supposed to, it will have a feedback loop, a negative feedback loop on your thyroid and you're going to either look like you're hyperthyroid or you're going to shut down your own Thyroid Production. T2 doesn't do that. It's working at the cell level to just simply increase your metabolism. That's a win all the way around because now you're going to burn fat, now you're going to lose those extra LBs. And that's ultimately what we want. It also bonus, helps with ATP production at the mitochondrial level. This means steady energy through the day. No highs, no lows, no caffeinated red bull spikes, just really nice steady energy through the day to keep you going. So you want to add in thyroid fixer and just literally watch your body change over the next couple months. Cuz listen, I mean it's, it's time. Well, it's time all year long.
- [37:33]
B
I mean, there's no good time of.
- [37:35]
C
Year to lose body fat. We want to be in shape, we want to look, feel and perform our best. Add in thyroid fixer and your body will absolutely thank you and then you'll come back and you'll thank me.
- [37:47]
A
My oath is to the patients. And so if I have to take all day, I'm sorry, I'll have to reschedule everybody but the patient in front of me right now is the patient that's going to get my time and get 100% of my attention until this visit is over. And so I just think that's the way it ought to be. But in the current medical atmosphere is super hard for doctors to practice that way.
- [38:09]
B
Well, and that kind of, that ties back to that question I asked earlier about why don't they order certain tests, like let's take reverse T3. I've always thought that, that it's like, well, there's not a pill for an elevated reverse T3. I mean, yeah, you can adjust someone's thyroid medication based on it or, or look into their insulin resistance because that's a driver of reverse T3, but there's not a pill, there's not a reverse T3 lowering pharmaceutical that we can write on the prescription pad. So I think you're, you're nailing it right there as to why they just.
- [38:41]
A
Let's take reverse T3. So when I was in medical school and in early residency, when the endocrinology residents would come around, I was just in awe. Okay? Because endocrinology doctors are nerds, but endocrinologists are nerds. Nerds. Like they're nerds squared. And they should be the most inquisitive, the most curious, the most well educated when it comes to human hormones. But as any woman who's went down the Hashimoto's pathway or the reverse T3 pathway or even just the hypothyroidism pathway knows, very often endocrinologists are the most close minded, uninquisitive, uncurious, that, that you could pretty much be face to face with. And I do not. That's not how they were the ones I interacted with in residency. They were super just like wonder. Let's go and check this weird esoteric test and let's do this weird neurological test that you only read about in the physical exam manual. They were all over that kind of stuff. But it's like when they get in practice, it's either pharmaceuticals or my mind is shut down. And it's, it's super sad. But, and I think really in reality, they know this, they have to. Because if you check a reverse teeth through and it's elevated 100% of the time, what that means is a, for a good doctor is back to the drawing board. It means I gotta check a bunch more stuff, I gotta ask a bunch more questions, I gotta take a bunch more time with this patient. I gotta dig into their diet, I gotta dig into their, their environment, their surroundings, their stress level. I got to dig into a whole bunch of stuff. And refer back to my previous comment about how busy and behind doctors are if there's this test that's going to reveal true disease in their patient, that's useful, that's meaningful, but it's also going to 10x your workload with that one patient. Yeah, most doctors aren't interested in that. They want to click the prescribe button and get you out of the exam room so they can see the next person because the RD now are behind. And that's not my fault. That's not the patient's fault. That's the fault of the system, maybe even not the fault of that doctor. But it's 100% not the patient's Fault, but the patient is the one who bears the brunt of that because they're low man on the totem pole, basically. But reverse T3, that's an excellent example of how. I'm not checking that, because if I do, I'll have to do a lot more thinking and a lot more questions, question asking and a lot more listening. That takes a lot more time. Therefore, no, I'm not checking that.
- [41:15]
B
Maybe, maybe, maybe eventually. Well, okay. On the subject of thyroid, and I love the fact that you, you give love and you shine a light on, like you said earlier, thoroughly testing the thyroid, because that tells us so much. So based on your recent research, which common and not so common thyroid test markers should be evaluated in patients? I mean, obviously I talk about this all the time, but I want to hear from you, I want to unpack your brain on this as well.
- [41:44]
A
So, as you know, there's over a hundred different tests you can do on a human thyroid. If you look at the LabCorp book, if you checked every single thyroid test listed in the LabCorp manual, that'd be about $287,000 worth of labs. Right. And some of them you'd have to wait four weeks for until they got back from Mayo or ucla. Nobody's going to do that. And so I don't think that's necessary either. So first and foremost, does the patient have three or more real low thyroid or overactive thyroid symptoms? That's the first question. If the patient has no symptoms of thyroid disease but literally feel amazing, then check a TSH and a free T4. Sure. Whatever, it's fine. Doesn't matter because they had no symptoms anyway. But if we have three or more symptoms of thyroid disease, whether hyper hypo or hashish, you need to check a full thyroid panel. And different healthcare providers have different definitions of what the full thyroid panel is. I'll tell you what mine is and what we talk about in the book. And obviously, I'm having to balance two things. First of all, we gotta check enough labs so that we catch at least 99% of people with thyroid disease. But we also can't check $287,000 worth of labs because nobody would be able to afford that. Right. So there's has to be a happy medium. So every doctor checks a TSH or a thyroid stimulating hormone. And that's absolutely vital. Even though it's not a thyroid hormone, it comes from the anterior pituitary gland. It is intimately tied to thyroid function, either hyper or hypo. Absolutely. Next is a free T4, which most doctors don't have a big problem checking that. Now, free T3. A lot of doctors start to back up a little bit when you say check a free T3, but I think it's absolutely vital. The free T3 is the actual active thyroid hormone in the circulation. So wouldn't you want to know the actual business end? That's literally where the thyroid rubber meets the road. So that sounds like a good thing to check. And then the reverse T3, which I think is super important, not just for thyroid health, but as also you implied, metabolic, stress, sleep, literally anything going wrong. If you have a chronic disease process that's undiagnosed, that can make you reverse T3 high. If you have undiagnosed cancer, that can make you reverse T3 high. Why wouldn't I want to know this big red, flashing red sign? The reverse T3 is high because it tells me it's like the dummy light on your car. It doesn't tell you exactly what's wrong, but it tells you something is wrong. And what good doctor wouldn't want to know that? Very important sign. And then the two antibodies, the TPO antibody and the TG antibody, looking for signs of Hashimoto's. Now, there are other antibody tests for the thyroid, but those are going to catch 95, 99% of people with autoimmune thyroiditis. And a lot of doctors don't know what I'm about to say. Thyroiditis typically presents initially as hyperthyroid symptoms. And then it can go, and then it can kind of go quiet and just, they can feel fairly normal while it's cooking in the background. But ultimately what it's going to lead to is permanent hypothyroidism. When your body's immune system has attacked your thyroid for long enough, you're not going to have enough thyroid active thyroid tissue left. So to make thyroid hormone. And so there's this kind of curve that it follows. And most doctors don't know that. And obviously we can't expect patients to know that unless they're super motivated. But if a doctor doesn't know, there's going to be that. Usually an initial hyperphase followed by a lag and then ultimately the hypophase, they don't understand. And I've, I've, I can't tell you how many thousands of people have showed me their thyroid lab results. They would say, I got the doctor to check my antibodies and my TPO antibody was, I don't know, 22. They're like, he said that did not have hashish. That wasn't high enough. So he said that your immune system's just attacking your thyroid gland just a little bit and that's okay, right? You see my, it's like, what? And I think, I think that stems from the average doctor not knowing enough about Hashimoto's that they're just not comfortable. They're not, they're like, well, I mean, it's a little high, but it's not bad. It's kind of like the doctor who checks your fasting blood sugar and it's 105. And he's like, well, yeah, it's a little high, but let's not make a big stink about it because that's going to take me more time to order more, you know, back to the time thing. So, yeah, your antibodies are a little high, but I don't think it's high enough to qualify for Hashimoto's. I've heard that so many times. It's just like, oh my God, what in the world are we dealing with here? So for me, that's going to catch 99% of thyroid disease, from thyroid cancer to hyper to hypo to Hashis and all the other autoimmune thyroiditis variants that are out there. You're going to catch 99% of it with that little panel of labs. But you would not believe the kickback that when somebody reads the book, goes to their doctor and asked for that full, full thyroid panel. Right? Not happening. Not happening. And that's why I came up with, and I now teach people how to use the nuclear option that we're going to talk about in a few minutes.
- [47:10]
B
Yep. Yeah, hold on to that. We're still dangling that carrot. First of all, if anybody's listening, you got to go to YouTube and watch this on camera to just to see my shit eating grin as our camera's talking p. Because literally, like, we didn't even plan this. You don't know that I say this, but I say this all the time. I use that exact example. Okay? LabCorp TPO cut off is 34. You roll in with 20 antibodies. Oh, so we're just going to let your immune system continue to attack your thyroid as you get worse and worse. Maybe when you're 20 pounds heavier and can't get off the couch and that marker goes to 35 and you actually get flagged and it turns red, then we'll pay attention to you. I love that you said that.
- [47:56]
A
Yeah. And it's absolutely true. And the other thing That I think your listeners need to know about, because I love to pull back the curtain and let people understand that, first of all, your doctor is just a dude or a chick. And secondly, they have certain paradigms of thought. So a very common thought, and this was actually told to me by another old doctor when I was training in med school. He said, boy, you gotta watch out for women in thyroid medicine. Because women know that if they take a high enough dose of thyroid medicine, they'll lose weight. And so a lot of them will effectively lie to you so that you'll keep increasing their thyroid medicine so that they can lose weight. And at the time, I was just a young punk. I didn't know. I'm like, okay, middle note. Remember that? But then the more I learned about thyroid and the more I learned about actual humans, and after I'd had a patient or three who actually had hyperthyroidism, and after seeing how miserable they were, it wasn't like they were on a happy cocaine high. It wasn't like they were just losing weight and their life was wonderful. If you have hyperthyroidism, which is what you'll get. Iatrogenic hypothyroidism, Hyperthyroidism if you take too much thyroid hormone, you feel yucky, you're antsy, you're jittery, you're anxious, you can't sleep. Nobody wants that. Even to lose weight, nobody wants that. And so I. I had to go back and retrain my brain. It's like, no, nobody wants to be hyper thigh. That's not fun. That's not comfortable. Nobody wants that. Nobody's gonna lie about that. To lose weight. I mean, maybe 1% will smoke meth or snort coke to lose weight, but that's not the average patient in a doctor's office. So I think it's important that people understand. And so a lot of docs are very hesitant to raise even, you know, us. And, like, the TSH is a great example. And I tell people this all the time. If their TSH is 3.5, but they still have significant low thyroid symptoms, why would you not go up on the armor or nature? Yeah, why would you not? And. And they're like, well, we don't want to give you too low. We don't want to cause you to have hyper thigh. And so I tell them, ask your doctor, what would you have said if my TSH had come back at 1.0? Would you have said, oh, my God, or would you have said, okay, that's normal. I'll see you in Three months. And invariably the doctor's got to say, well, I would have said that's normal. No problem. I'll see you in three months. And then I say, tell the patient. Then you say, okay, I'm currently at 3.5. Let's just increase my armor or nature just enough to get me down to 1.0. Because you just said that's normal. Why can't we just do that and see if my symptoms improve? And with arguments like that, knowing that the doctors are human, they're like, I mean, God, they kind of got me there. I can't really argue with that. And it's important to tell your doctor, I don't want to take too much thyroid medicine. I'm sorry, that was. I misspoke. Thyroid replacement hormone. This is not a pharmacy. I love it. This is not a medicine. This is related hormone replacement. Nobody wants to take too much. And you need to tell your doctor that. Of course I don't want to take too much. I'm not an idiot. But I do want to take enough that, number one, my labs are normal, so you're happy. But number two, that I have no symptoms, therefore I'm happy. Let's see if we can't do both at the same time. Most doctors are very amenable to an argument like that.
- [51:15]
B
Yes. See, I'm telling you we're related somehow.
- [51:18]
C
I'm telling you.
- [51:18]
B
Okay, I love this. Okay, thank you for that. Amen to all of it. All right, I'm going to pick your brain on something that totally was not planned. You give such great information and detail as to how someone should prepare for their labs, which I think is vital. Like, you can't just go willy nilly.
- [51:39]
C
And all of that.
- [51:39]
B
You know, you want to go at a certain time of day, fasted, all of that. I want to get your opinion on this topic that I've been seeing come up on IG a lot and I've been speaking to it. But I want to pick your brain at the end. If you're like, I'm not really quite sure, we'll cut this part out. But people testing their thyroid after taking their medication. Now, the way that I tell patients to do it is I want to see you 18 to 24 hours after your med, and especially if you are taking something with T3 in it. Armor, nature, whatever. I don't want your medication circulating in your blood and for that result to pick up on that thyroid hormone that.
- [52:19]
C
Is in your blood.
- [52:20]
B
But there's some people that are saying, test at the Peak. What is your opinion when it does come to taking thyroid hormone and then testing? Because my concern is, and especially people reading your book and dealing with conventional medicine, if they test at the peak, their doctor's gonna lose their mind. That free T3 is gonna be flagged high and off the chart.
- [52:41]
A
Yep. I'm not a. I'm not a big fan of testing at the peak, and I'm not sure where that, where that comes from really. That doesn't even make good physiological sense. But you're spot on with as far as the human nature part of the question goes. If the average allopathically trained doctor, if they check somebody taking armor or nature or just, you know, a standalone T3, if they check them at their peak, that doctor's going to lose their shit. They're going to be like, oh, my God, I'm going to give you thyroid cancer. Stop taking all of it immediately. I don't even understand the logic behind that, really. We're very blatant in the book. And I say it at least 20 times a week, always fast at least 12 to 14 hours before any lab result. You know as well as I do there are doctors out there that say, oh, you don't have to fast anymore for any lab test. That's just the old way. And so I guess, screw your triglycerides, screw your hdl, screw your blood sugar. I mean, literally screw your ferritin, screw your homocysteine, screw. You're literally 20 test results are not going to be accurate if you don't fast for at least 12 to 14 hours. And then for all of my keto and fasting people that are, you know, they're like, well, I've been fasting for three days. I might as well just go ahead and get my labs drawn again. No, that's. You fasted for too long. Not, not that it's dangerous, but it's going to affect your lab results, including the reverse T3, because you've been. You haven't eaten for. For three days. And although it's perfectly healthy, in many cases it's very therapeutic to do longer fasts. You need to fast for a known set amount of time before your labs. And it 12 to 14 hours is the sweet spot between people can actually do it and actually will do it. And number two, that it's been long enough that most things have washed out and kind of returned back to baseline. But I think it's also perfectly acceptable because a doctor needs to always test their patients at the same point, whether that's the peak or the trough. You need to have your own routine as a doctor. And so if your routine is, I need you to not have had your thyroid medicine for at least 18 hours, then that needs to happen that way. Exactly that way, every single time. Otherwise you're comparing apples to oranges or Cadillacs to Volkswagens. You're not going to be able to tell what's what because they didn't fast the same length of time and they didn't not take their medicine for the same length of time. That's hugely important when it comes to lab results. But if any doctor tells you you don't have to fast for a lab, that should be a huge red flag that something's fishy with that because. Yeah, yeah. Whether it's a medication fast or a food fast or both, you probably need to fast before your labs. There's only very few tests that you can have checked in the blood that you're not going to affect the result. If you just ate a big pizza right. An hour before you had the labs tested, that's going to affect virtually every lab result that you can have checked.
- [55:37]
B
Yes. And I love how you lay that.
- [55:39]
C
Out in the book because it just.
- [55:40]
B
Gives people that, that time strategy. Just follow the directions in the book and you will get accurate lab results, which is ultimately what you want to have to be able to have the conversation with your doctor. So now we're going to move into the nuclear carrot that you promised us that you would teach. So, yes.
- [56:00]
A
So there's three things that doctors are scared of getting behind going broke or getting sued. That's the three biggest fears of any doctor. Okay? Now the biggest fear of all is getting sued. 100%. This will keep a doctor up at night. So I do not encourage you to use this tactic right out of the gate. We going to call this the nuclear I want my test and I want now option. Okay. You, if you're, if you like your doctor, don't use this. If you, if your doctor will at least listen to you and have a conversation and say, okay, I'll, I'll read the damn study you brought me and I'll see you in a month and we'll talk about it. That's a sign of a good doctor. Be nice to that doctor. Train that doctor. Yes. Patients can train their doctor 100%. I've seen it hundreds of times now. And when you train your doctor, this is super important. If your doctor currently doesn't know about a fasting insulin or reverse T3 and you go to your doctor diplomatically with a laid out, rational, nice argument and you convince your doctor and they're like, oh, I see what you're talking about. I haven't thought of that. They're going to go home that night, they're going to look it up, they're going to read about it, watch some of Dr. Amy's videos, some of my videos. And now here's the power of what you just did. And a lot of patients don't think they have this power. You have just changed the way that person practices medicine for the rest of their career. You have affected the health of every patient that doctor will see for the next 20 years. Think about that. How powerful is that? Gives me goosebumps to think about it. Okay, now but let's say you've got the typical running behind, about to go broke, asshole doctor. And they're like, no, I'm not ordering reverse T3. Here's what you say. You say, Doctor, I'm a rational, competent, use that word, competent patient. I have researched this. I believe that I have a serious medical condition. I don't think I'm going to die tomorrow, but I think I have an undiagnosed medical condition. I have spent hours researching this. Okay, you may think that's funny, but I don't think it's funny. I have asked you for these tests because I think that these tests will reveal my undiagnosed medical condition. You have refused to order the test that I believe from my study will reveal my disease. I need for you to document. That's an important word. I need for you to document in my. Now here's the really important word. I need for you to document in my permanent medical record that I have these concerns. I voiced these concerns to you. I ask you to order these tests and that you refused to order these tests. I need you to document that in my permanent medical record. And then I'll need a copy of that when I leave the office today. How nervous did that just make you, Dr. Amy?
- [58:53]
B
That's some pressure right there.
- [58:55]
A
Now what you effectively said, what you effectively said to this doctor is if I've got this condition and you refuse to order these labs and then I die from this. My daughter in law, who you've never met, don't know and she don't know you and how sweet you are and how you've got pictures of your dog on the wall, she's going to sue your ass for malpractice. You understand? Now that's what the doctor is going to Hear now, if one or two things is going to happen, I told you, this is a nuclear option. Sometimes nuclear explosions cause bad things. Either that doctor is going to get out the order pad and say, okay, what do you want? And then you get the labs ordered that you need order, or the doctor is going to proceed to kick you out of the office, in which case that's good that that happened because you need to find a new doctor anyway because they wouldn't order the test that you needed ordered. That's the nuclear option. And I can tell you, people have reported back like, yep, he ordered every test I've asked for, no questions asked. And I did that three years ago. I can literally walk in and ask him to order any test. Now. There's not any. There's no debate. There's no no. It's just, what do you want to order? So, and one lady said, he just hands me the lab order sheet and I check what I. What I will order. Now, keep in mind, if your doctor orders a test and your insurance doesn't cover it, you will be responsible for paying the difference. As long as you understand that. And you're like, yeah, I'll pay for it. I don't care. Then feel free, especially if your doctor's an asshole, to use the nuclear option in limited situations where there's just no other option.
- [60:28]
B
I love it. I love it. Yeah, just put that in your pocket. You can pull it out at any point in time and just create an explosion. Because like you said, it's going to be your way to discern whether or not you should stay with this person.
- [60:39]
A
Exactly. This is a partnership. Your doctor is your learned health partner. That's how you have to look at this. The doctor is not your daddy. The doctor's not your boss. The doctor's not your prison warden. They are a learned health partner. If you went to the local garage, your car's making a funny noise, and they said, oh, yeah, your motor and transmission are shot. We got to replace them both right now, that'll be 2,000 bucks. I don't know. That may be underestimating. Would you just be like, oh, yes, sir, mechanic. Yeah, well, that's what we'll do. No, nobody would do that. You'd be like, what the hell? I'm going to take it up the street to that other garage and see what he says, Get a second opinion. It's your right as a patient. You're not in custody. They are not your warden. You have the right to say no to any medical intervention. You Also have the right to request any medical intervention, treatment, or diagnostic test. That is your right as a patient. And then the last thing that I want to leave you with, Dr. Amy, is informed, Informed consent. This is huge. Doctors are not trained on this. If they're about to do surgery on you, they're very good at getting informed consent. The following things is what we're expecting the outcome to be. The following long list is the possible bad things that could happen, but they're very rare. But I need you to sign this piece of paper saying that you understand the proposed benefit and the possible risks, and then we shall proceed. Doctors don't do. Do that when it comes to prescribing pharmaceuticals. They don't do that. And currently, the American Medical association doesn't require or even imply that a doctor should do that. But that's super important. If you're about to start an antidepressant or a psychiatric medication or levothyroxine, you need to know, you need to be informed, what are the possible side effects? What are the possible bad outcomes? And ask what percentage of people have that bad outcome? What percentage of people have a good outcome from this intervention, this medication, this pharmaceutical, whatever? You have an absolute right to be informed before you give your consent for any procedure, any pharmaceutical, or anything, literally. Because you're not under arrest. You're a free human who walked into the doctor's office.
- [63:01]
B
Right. And we saw a lot of that in 2020, 2021, where, you know, if a doctor can't answer the pros and cons of a certain drug vaccine, xyz, then that's a problem in and of itself.
- [63:15]
A
Why are you recommending if you can't explain it?
- [63:18]
B
Right, Right, Exactly.
- [63:20]
A
That sounds like a valid question to me.
- [63:23]
B
It does. I love it. You have empowered people. I mean, just top to bottom, this, for me, this is like a bible. This is something that everyone should have in their home and reference and refer to every time you get labs before you walk into your doctor's office or just for your own basic knowledge of what's going on inside your body and what your labs actually mean, as opposed to the doctor that's just scanning down the side, looking for the higher, the lower flow and stopping on that particular marker. You need to know how your body works and what all this means for you with your labs. So, Dr. Canberry, thank you so much for writing this. So, I mean, just, I. I love you to death. I could talk to you for hours. But thank you so much for writing this because this is something that should be in the hands of every single person.
- [64:15]
A
Thank you so much and thanks for the, the pleasure and the honor of hanging out with you this afternoon. It's been a pleasure.
- [64:22]
B
It's been so much fun. And of course we'll put everything down in the show. Notes for where people can grab the book and follow you. But go ahead and give a shout out just so people know they can easily find you wherever you're to be found. Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, all the good stuff.
- [64:36]
A
So I actually have three books. My first book was Lies My Doctor Told Me and then Common Sense Labs. And I also wrote a book called kicking ass after 50 because I'm 56. And so I think that you should not be in the recliner. You should be kicking ass. I've got a little YouTube channel and I've got over 1900 videos. So the best way to use my YouTube channel is to go to the YouTube search function and type in Dr. Berry hypothyroidism, Dr. Barry Hashimoto's Dr. Barry insulin. And that way you don't have to watch all 1900 to get to what you're looking for. It'll take you straight to them. If I'm feeling especially snarky, you'll find me on Twitter. Twitter X if you're if I'm feeling loving and helpful, I'll be on Facebook or Instagram. I'm even on TikTok. If I'm feeling goofy, I go where the people are because that's who needs help, right? So that's where I'm at.
- [65:26]
B
And the people are everywhere. So I love it. So we'll put all of that down in the show Notes. Once again, thank you for jumping on this. The title of this is going to include something like the most important or the number one podcast. I'm already thinking about it in my mind because is it is the podcast that people need to listen to my audience needs to listen to. So thank you so much for your time.
- [65:49]
A
Thank you very much.
- [65:57]
C
The information shared on the Thyroid Fixer podcast is intended solely for informational and educational purposes. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or or treatment. Always consult with your physician or other qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition, treatment or before making changes to your healthc care regimen, including medications, supplements or other therapies. Use of the information provided in this podcast does not establish a doctor, patient or client provider relationship between you and the host or between you and any other healthcare professionals featured on the show. Any medical opinions or statements made by guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of the host or affiliated parties. Statements regarding dietary supplements or health related products mentioned in this podcast have not been evaluated by the fda. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. Some episodes of the Thyroid Fixer podcast may include sponsorships or affiliate links. The host may receive compensation for discussing or promoting certain products or services. Any such sponsorships or affiliations will be be clearly disclosed during the episode. All opinions expressed are those of the hosts or guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of any sponsors. The inclusion of a product or service does not imply endorsement by any healthcare professional featured on this podcast.