The Times Tech Podcast – “Who holds the power in the age of AI?”

Date: November 7, 2025
Hosts: Danny Fortson (Silicon Valley) & Katie Prescott (London)
Guests: Jensen Huang (Nvidia CEO), Liz Kendall (UK Secretary of State for Science & Tech), Yann LeCun (Meta Chief AI Scientist)
Main Theme:
Examining the current power dynamics in artificial intelligence, from chipmakers and cloud giants to the people, companies, and countries grappling with the consequences of AI's explosive growth. Key interviews probe whether the market boom is a bubble, who really holds the reins, and what the future holds as computing needs and investment skyrocket.

Overview

Danny Fortson and Katie Prescott co-host a globe-spanning episode exploring who truly has the power in the AI revolution. They dissect massive recent deals (OpenAI/AWS), interview Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang outside 10 Downing Street after his landmark UK visit, and probe Meta's Yann LeCun for a researcher's take on AI’s real progress toward AGI. The podcast concludes with analysis of the high-stakes, sometimes uneasy alliances among tech giants and fears of an “AI bubble.”

Key Segments & Insights

1. Opening Conversation: Setting the Scene

[03:15]–[05:11]

The co-hosts reflect on the relentless pace of AI deals and who is shaping business, culture, and the tech industry.
Major story: OpenAI’s jaw-dropping $38 billion deal with AWS, following massive investment from Microsoft (totaling $13 billion) fueling a “race for computing power.”
The hosts set up the core question: With AI’s resource intensive demands, do we have enough chips, electricity, and data centers? Are we also running into an AI investment bubble?

2. On the Ground at 10 Downing Street: The Power Players Assembled

[05:11]–[08:42]

Katie details her experience attending the Queen Elizabeth Prize event with key “godfathers/godmothers of AI” (Huang, LeCun, Hinton, Bengio, Fei-Fei Li).
“It was very exciting... We went and got a selfie outside [10 Downing Street]. So I should say, did all of the prize winners, when they came out, saw Yann LeCun holding up his mobile phone, taking a selfie as well, outside the famous door.” (Katie, [06:50])
Light banter about Jensen Huang’s trademark black leather jacket and how even he was in a suit for the state event.

3. Exclusive: Jensen Huang Interview

[08:42]–[15:54]

Reinventing Computing

“If you take a step back...we have reinvented the single most important instrument of humanity, computers... For the first time in probably about 60 years, maybe 100 years.” (Jensen Huang, [08:56])
AI doesn’t “change your job, it changes the work of your job.” Companies, economies grow; AI requires and creates high-skill infrastructure jobs.

The UK’s AI Potential & Infrastructure Challenges

UK has “the world’s biggest AI ecosystem without its own infrastructure.” ([10:44])
Nvidia has helped launch infrastructure companies like N Scale and NVS in the UK, signaling a push for local compute power.

Funding, Bubble Talk, and Valuations

Huang is optimistic about sustainability, dismissing bubble talk:
- “We’re all in a bubble. The question is, where are you in that phase? ...we’re in the beginning of the build out.” ([13:28])
On Nvidia’s $5 trillion valuation:
- “AI is the first technology in history that has the opportunity to directly benefit the total $100 trillion of the world’s economy... we’re in the beginning of that.” ([14:45])
Feels “a great, great honor” leading a company at the core of this upheaval ([15:26]):
- “This is probably the most impactful technology of all time. And the ability to manufacture intelligence is quite an extraordinary thing.”

4. Researcher’s View: Yann LeCun on AGI & AI Progress

[17:35]–[24:27]

Disputing the Hype: No “AGI Moment”

LeCun: “First of all, it’s not going to be a moment, it’s not going to be an event.” ([18:36])
Criticizes AGI terminology (“calling it AGI is complete nonsense”) and “San Francisco Consensus” of imminent human-level AI.
Forecast: No AGI in the next 2, 5, “probably more than 10 years”; current LLMs will not get us there.
- “Where is our domestic robot? Where is our Level 5 autonomous car?... That’s the next revolution in AI, which may happen in the next three to five years.” ([19:32])

Anatomy of AI’s Limitation

Real intelligence needs “world models,” not just ever larger LLMs or data scaling.
- “I just don’t believe this at all. So I think we need a number of breakthroughs in that respect.” ([22:07])

Recruitment, Competition, and Research

Meta is offering “enormous salaries” for engineers and scientists, but LeCun emphasizes the need for deeper, non-commercial progress.
On hiring: “Ask me again in six months.” ([22:49])

5. Market Analysis and OpenAI’s Mind-Boggling Math

[27:13]–[38:56]

OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS: Stakes, Power, and “Warm Sheds”

The new deal gives Microsoft 27% of OpenAI (valued at $120B) and exclusive access to models for five more years—or until a “third party” determines AGI arrives ([29:09]–[30:08]).
Physical compute constraints are now greater than chip scarcity—Satya Nadella laments “not enough power, not enough data center space... my problem isn’t chips anymore. It’s finding what he called warm shelves to plug them into.” ([30:31])
- “More sheds, more sheds, please.” (Katie, [30:49])

Sam Altman’s Trillion-Dollar Gambit

Altman expects to spend over a trillion dollars on compute (with Nvidia, AMD/Oracle, Microsoft). ([31:00])
“If we don’t have the compute, we can’t make the models.” (as paraphrased, [31:16])

The Bubble Question & OpenAI’s Financial Tightrope

Investors and journalists question OpenAI’s ability to finance promised spending (“how can a company with 13 billion in revenues make 1.4 trillion of spend commitments?”). ([32:42])
Altman brushes off concerns:
- “I think there’s a lot of people who would love to buy OpenAI shares. … We do plan for revenue to grow steeply.” ([33:02])
Danny draws direct parallels with the dotcom boom and the “collective delusion” that ended in a crash, warning that “all the whole edifice is built on some very large IOUs from a couple startups.” ([37:08])

Notable Quotes & Moments

Jensen Huang:
- “AI is the first technology in history that has the opportunity to directly benefit the total $100 trillion of the world’s economy.” ([14:45])
- “The ability to manufacture intelligence is quite an extraordinary thing.” ([15:26])
Yann LeCun:
- “It’s not going to be a moment, it’s not going to be an event… calling it AGI is complete nonsense.” ([18:36])
- “Where is our domestic robot? Where is our Level 5 autonomous car? We don’t have any system that understand the physical world.” ([19:32])
- On LLMs: “I just don’t believe this at all. So I think we need a number of breakthroughs in that respect.” ([22:07])
Sam Altman:
- “If you want to sell your shares, I’ll find you a buyer… I think a lot of people would love to buy OpenAI shares.” ([33:02])
- On OpenAI’s risk: “We are taking a forward bet that it’s going to continue to grow … AI that can automate science will create huge value.” ([33:36])
Danny Fortson:
- “All the whole edifice is built on some very large IOUs from a couple startups. Basically, it’s what it is. It’s Anthropic, it’s OpenAI…” ([37:08])
- “That vibe [of the dotcom bubble] is so real now again.” ([34:30])

Other Memorable Bits

Discussion on language:
- “Clanker”—a derogatory Star Wars-inspired word for computer or robot ([02:43])
- “Collins Dictionary word of the year is Vibe coding… the use of AI prompted by natural language to assist with the writing of computer code” ([40:01])
- “Danny vibe coded an amazing video game called Meatball Mania, which is going to make him rich when he loses his job to AI that does his job for him.” ([40:10])
The co-hosts’ good-humored skepticism and chemistry keeps the discussion human-scaled, even amid trillion-dollar tech shocks.
Candid takes on the closed-door, high-stakes negotiations between OpenAI and Microsoft, AWS, and the specter of “too big to fail” as Nvidia becomes the world’s most valuable company.

Takeaways

Power in AI is shifting and rising fast: Nvidia, Microsoft, AWS, and OpenAI are at the epicenter, wielding economic and infrastructural might that rivals nations.
There’s tension between hubris and reality: Insiders believe the AI boom “is just beginning,” but major voices (notably LeCun) warn current tech is far from human-level intelligence.
Everyone’s betting trillions on the future—often on the promise, not the profit. The hosts note the parallels with past bubbles but highlight both the greater scale and deeper integration of AI in today’s tech economy.
Unanswered questions about sustainability, regulation, and the real social impact loom large—even as “AI agents,” power shortages, and trillion-dollar “warm sheds” dominate the news.

Timestamps for Key Segments

[03:15] Opening theme, OpenAI/AWS deal, the race for compute power
[05:11] On the ground at 10 Downing Street, the AI ‘royalty’ assembled
[08:42] Jensen Huang interview: AI’s impact, UK infrastructure, “AI bubble” debate
[17:35] Yann LeCun interview: AGI skepticism, LLM limitations, AI research’s next revolution
[27:13] OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS relationships, market structure, power/grid supply issues
[32:42] Sam Altman/BG2 interview: OpenAI’s financials, speculative investment, risk vs. hype
[37:08] Parallels to dotcom bubble, “too big to fail” warnings
[39:34] “Vibe coding” as the word of the year; closing reflections

This episode is essential listening (or reading) for anyone tracking who wields power in the new age of AI—whether market makers, researchers, regulators, or those just trying to make sense of it all.

The Times Tech Podcast – “Who holds the power in the age of AI?”

Overview

Key Segments & Insights

1. Opening Conversation: Setting the Scene

[03:15]–[05:11]

The co-hosts reflect on the relentless pace of AI deals and who is shaping business, culture, and the tech industry.
Major story: OpenAI’s jaw-dropping $38 billion deal with AWS, following massive investment from Microsoft (totaling $13 billion) fueling a “race for computing power.”
The hosts set up the core question: With AI’s resource intensive demands, do we have enough chips, electricity, and data centers? Are we also running into an AI investment bubble?

2. On the Ground at 10 Downing Street: The Power Players Assembled

[05:11]–[08:42]

Katie details her experience attending the Queen Elizabeth Prize event with key “godfathers/godmothers of AI” (Huang, LeCun, Hinton, Bengio, Fei-Fei Li).
“It was very exciting... We went and got a selfie outside [10 Downing Street]. So I should say, did all of the prize winners, when they came out, saw Yann LeCun holding up his mobile phone, taking a selfie as well, outside the famous door.” (Katie, [06:50])
Light banter about Jensen Huang’s trademark black leather jacket and how even he was in a suit for the state event.

3. Exclusive: Jensen Huang Interview

[08:42]–[15:54]

Reinventing Computing

“If you take a step back...we have reinvented the single most important instrument of humanity, computers... For the first time in probably about 60 years, maybe 100 years.” (Jensen Huang, [08:56])
AI doesn’t “change your job, it changes the work of your job.” Companies, economies grow; AI requires and creates high-skill infrastructure jobs.

The UK’s AI Potential & Infrastructure Challenges

UK has “the world’s biggest AI ecosystem without its own infrastructure.” ([10:44])
Nvidia has helped launch infrastructure companies like N Scale and NVS in the UK, signaling a push for local compute power.

Funding, Bubble Talk, and Valuations

Huang is optimistic about sustainability, dismissing bubble talk:
- “We’re all in a bubble. The question is, where are you in that phase? ...we’re in the beginning of the build out.” ([13:28])
On Nvidia’s $5 trillion valuation:
- “AI is the first technology in history that has the opportunity to directly benefit the total $100 trillion of the world’s economy... we’re in the beginning of that.” ([14:45])
Feels “a great, great honor” leading a company at the core of this upheaval ([15:26]):
- “This is probably the most impactful technology of all time. And the ability to manufacture intelligence is quite an extraordinary thing.”

4. Researcher’s View: Yann LeCun on AGI & AI Progress

[17:35]–[24:27]

Disputing the Hype: No “AGI Moment”

LeCun: “First of all, it’s not going to be a moment, it’s not going to be an event.” ([18:36])
Criticizes AGI terminology (“calling it AGI is complete nonsense”) and “San Francisco Consensus” of imminent human-level AI.
Forecast: No AGI in the next 2, 5, “probably more than 10 years”; current LLMs will not get us there.
- “Where is our domestic robot? Where is our Level 5 autonomous car?... That’s the next revolution in AI, which may happen in the next three to five years.” ([19:32])

Anatomy of AI’s Limitation

Real intelligence needs “world models,” not just ever larger LLMs or data scaling.
- “I just don’t believe this at all. So I think we need a number of breakthroughs in that respect.” ([22:07])

Recruitment, Competition, and Research

Meta is offering “enormous salaries” for engineers and scientists, but LeCun emphasizes the need for deeper, non-commercial progress.
On hiring: “Ask me again in six months.” ([22:49])

5. Market Analysis and OpenAI’s Mind-Boggling Math

[27:13]–[38:56]

OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS: Stakes, Power, and “Warm Sheds”

The new deal gives Microsoft 27% of OpenAI (valued at $120B) and exclusive access to models for five more years—or until a “third party” determines AGI arrives ([29:09]–[30:08]).
Physical compute constraints are now greater than chip scarcity—Satya Nadella laments “not enough power, not enough data center space... my problem isn’t chips anymore. It’s finding what he called warm shelves to plug them into.” ([30:31])
- “More sheds, more sheds, please.” (Katie, [30:49])

Sam Altman’s Trillion-Dollar Gambit

Altman expects to spend over a trillion dollars on compute (with Nvidia, AMD/Oracle, Microsoft). ([31:00])
“If we don’t have the compute, we can’t make the models.” (as paraphrased, [31:16])

The Bubble Question & OpenAI’s Financial Tightrope

Investors and journalists question OpenAI’s ability to finance promised spending (“how can a company with 13 billion in revenues make 1.4 trillion of spend commitments?”). ([32:42])
Altman brushes off concerns:
- “I think there’s a lot of people who would love to buy OpenAI shares. … We do plan for revenue to grow steeply.” ([33:02])
Danny draws direct parallels with the dotcom boom and the “collective delusion” that ended in a crash, warning that “all the whole edifice is built on some very large IOUs from a couple startups.” ([37:08])

Notable Quotes & Moments

Jensen Huang:
- “AI is the first technology in history that has the opportunity to directly benefit the total $100 trillion of the world’s economy.” ([14:45])
- “The ability to manufacture intelligence is quite an extraordinary thing.” ([15:26])
Yann LeCun:
- “It’s not going to be a moment, it’s not going to be an event… calling it AGI is complete nonsense.” ([18:36])
- “Where is our domestic robot? Where is our Level 5 autonomous car? We don’t have any system that understand the physical world.” ([19:32])
- On LLMs: “I just don’t believe this at all. So I think we need a number of breakthroughs in that respect.” ([22:07])
Sam Altman:
- “If you want to sell your shares, I’ll find you a buyer… I think a lot of people would love to buy OpenAI shares.” ([33:02])
- On OpenAI’s risk: “We are taking a forward bet that it’s going to continue to grow … AI that can automate science will create huge value.” ([33:36])
Danny Fortson:
- “All the whole edifice is built on some very large IOUs from a couple startups. Basically, it’s what it is. It’s Anthropic, it’s OpenAI…” ([37:08])
- “That vibe [of the dotcom bubble] is so real now again.” ([34:30])

Other Memorable Bits

Discussion on language:
- “Clanker”—a derogatory Star Wars-inspired word for computer or robot ([02:43])
- “Collins Dictionary word of the year is Vibe coding… the use of AI prompted by natural language to assist with the writing of computer code” ([40:01])
- “Danny vibe coded an amazing video game called Meatball Mania, which is going to make him rich when he loses his job to AI that does his job for him.” ([40:10])
The co-hosts’ good-humored skepticism and chemistry keeps the discussion human-scaled, even amid trillion-dollar tech shocks.
Candid takes on the closed-door, high-stakes negotiations between OpenAI and Microsoft, AWS, and the specter of “too big to fail” as Nvidia becomes the world’s most valuable company.

Takeaways

Power in AI is shifting and rising fast: Nvidia, Microsoft, AWS, and OpenAI are at the epicenter, wielding economic and infrastructural might that rivals nations.
There’s tension between hubris and reality: Insiders believe the AI boom “is just beginning,” but major voices (notably LeCun) warn current tech is far from human-level intelligence.
Everyone’s betting trillions on the future—often on the promise, not the profit. The hosts note the parallels with past bubbles but highlight both the greater scale and deeper integration of AI in today’s tech economy.
Unanswered questions about sustainability, regulation, and the real social impact loom large—even as “AI agents,” power shortages, and trillion-dollar “warm sheds” dominate the news.

Timestamps for Key Segments

[03:15] Opening theme, OpenAI/AWS deal, the race for compute power
[05:11] On the ground at 10 Downing Street, the AI ‘royalty’ assembled
[08:42] Jensen Huang interview: AI’s impact, UK infrastructure, “AI bubble” debate
[17:35] Yann LeCun interview: AGI skepticism, LLM limitations, AI research’s next revolution
[27:13] OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS relationships, market structure, power/grid supply issues
[32:42] Sam Altman/BG2 interview: OpenAI’s financials, speculative investment, risk vs. hype
[37:08] Parallels to dotcom bubble, “too big to fail” warnings
[39:34] “Vibe coding” as the word of the year; closing reflections

Who holds the power in the age of AI?

Summary

The Times Tech Podcast – “Who holds the power in the age of AI?”

Overview

Key Segments & Insights

1. Opening Conversation: Setting the Scene

2. On the Ground at 10 Downing Street: The Power Players Assembled

3. Exclusive: Jensen Huang Interview

Reinventing Computing

The UK’s AI Potential & Infrastructure Challenges

Funding, Bubble Talk, and Valuations

4. Researcher’s View: Yann LeCun on AGI & AI Progress

Disputing the Hype: No “AGI Moment”

Anatomy of AI’s Limitation

Recruitment, Competition, and Research

5. Market Analysis and OpenAI’s Mind-Boggling Math

OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS: Stakes, Power, and “Warm Sheds”

Sam Altman’s Trillion-Dollar Gambit

The Bubble Question & OpenAI’s Financial Tightrope

Notable Quotes & Moments

Other Memorable Bits

Takeaways

Timestamps for Key Segments

Transcript

Summary

The Times Tech Podcast – “Who holds the power in the age of AI?”

Overview

Key Segments & Insights

1. Opening Conversation: Setting the Scene

2. On the Ground at 10 Downing Street: The Power Players Assembled

3. Exclusive: Jensen Huang Interview

Reinventing Computing

The UK’s AI Potential & Infrastructure Challenges

Funding, Bubble Talk, and Valuations

4. Researcher’s View: Yann LeCun on AGI & AI Progress

Disputing the Hype: No “AGI Moment”

Anatomy of AI’s Limitation

Recruitment, Competition, and Research

5. Market Analysis and OpenAI’s Mind-Boggling Math

OpenAI/Microsoft/AWS: Stakes, Power, and “Warm Sheds”

Sam Altman’s Trillion-Dollar Gambit

The Bubble Question & OpenAI’s Financial Tightrope

Notable Quotes & Moments

Other Memorable Bits

Takeaways

Timestamps for Key Segments