The Tom Woods Show – Ep. 2751

Guest: Darryl Cooper
Date: April 11, 2026
Main Theme: The Destructive Power of Immigration—History, Policy, and Cultural Impacts

Episode Overview

In this episode, Tom Woods is joined by Darryl Cooper, host of the Martyr Made podcast and co-host of Provoked, for an in-depth discussion on the history and consequences of mass immigration in the United States. The conversation critically examines American immigration policy—from its unique historical roots to its modern-day effects—emphasizing the interplay between demographics, culture, social cohesion, and political identity. The dialogue is candid, controversial at times, and focused on fostering a serious adult conversation often missing in mainstream discourse.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. America’s Unique Immigration History

[04:15–10:27] Darryl’s elevator pitch and historical context

• America is historically distinct from Europe/Asia:
  • Early America needed to fill a continent, leading to a radically inclusive approach (at least by 18th/19th-century standards) to immigration, focused on bringing in Europeans (“free white persons” was viewed as inclusive then).
  • Rapid “demographic churn” characterized much of America’s history, with major cities losing English majorities within a generation.
• Uniqueness of American Identity:
  • Unlike European “seed cultures” (e.g., Poland, Hungary), America’s sense of nationhood has always been dynamic and periodically renegotiated.
  • Importing labor for frontier settlement and industrialization defines much of America’s immigrant experience.
• Modern irrelevance of past rationale:
  • “We don’t have a giant continent to fill anymore. The country is built.”
  • There’s no longer a historic need for open doors; applying 19th-century policies today is an “illogical, dogmatic appeal to tradition.”
• Quote:
  • "We don’t have a giant continent to fill anymore… Those historical circumstances were extremely unique and they're never gonna come back again." —Darryl Cooper [09:10]

2. Evolving Notions of Identity and Assimilation

[10:27–19:32] How demographics, culture, and assimilation operate

• Waves of newcomers have always had to find a place:
  • Irish, Germans, Jews, and Italians each caused prior Americans—often themselves immigrants—to rethink American-ness, sometimes facing nativist backlash (e.g., the 1924 Immigration Act).
  • Assimilation isn’t inevitable or consistent; it’s sometimes uneasy and incomplete.
• Regional and racial dynamics:
  • The South: two groups, Black and white, with the Great Migration introducing new complexities to Northern cities.
  • Immigration pauses (1924–1965) still saw internal demographic shifts; “churn” is nearly continuous.
• Cultural negotiation is a core American tradition:
  • “Our identity as a people has been renegotiated sort of every generation.” —Darryl Cooper [10:40]

3. Scale, Composition, and the Limits of Cultural Integration

[19:32–29:37] Universalism, enclaves, and loss of shared culture

• Differences between manageable assimilation and overwhelming change:
  • Small numbers of distinct newcomers tend to assimilate into established culture, but large waves allow for enclave formation, hindering assimilation.
  • Recent patterns (e.g., visible Muslim/Saudi enclaves in Los Angeles) illustrate cultural “autarky.”
• Assimilation as mass-market culture:
  • Immigrants become “Americans” in terms of generic mass culture, not regional/local identity:
    “They are Americans, but they'll never really be Minnesotans…” —Darryl Cooper [21:48]
  • The loss of regional and local cultures is lamented, seen as vital to national dynamism.
• Political implications:
  • Immigration policy affects not merely “a policy among many,” but the very structure of how politics is conducted.

4. The Irony of Homogenization and Diversity

[29:37–34:25] Homogenization through forced diversity

• 20th-century trend:
  • Even “fascist” populist regimes strove for homogenization—erasing regional difference.
• American common culture erodes:
  • With ongoing demographic churn, icons like Martin Luther King Jr. may become mere footnotes as collective memory fragments: “If things just keep going like this… nobody's going to care about Martin Luther King Jr. anymore.” —Darryl Cooper [31:25]
  • Collective culture becomes nothing but a mantra—“diversity is our strength”—masking a “permanent state of forgetting.”

5. Role of the State and Policy-makers’ Disconnect

[34:25–37:54] How state intervention and elite abstraction inflame tensions

• State aggravation:
  • State-mandated privileges/entitlements for newcomers stoke mutual resentment, shifting attitudes from “neutral to negative to angry and resentful.”
  • Conflict intensifies at the neighborhood/factory-working class level, not at the Ivy League class that designs policy.

6. Is America an Idea or a People?

[38:02–45:17] The metaphysics of American nationhood

• “Nation of immigrants” is partly true:
  • Historically supported by facts, but less applicable as American society matured and “frontier” closed.
  • The brief post-WWII period saw Americas’ diverse groups start to coalesce into something like a “people,” a process derailed by the 1960s cultural revolution.
• Ethnogenesis and identity-building:
  • “You really do have to…go through these periods of crisis…to prove themselves to each other.”* —Darryl Cooper [43:35]
  • Attempts to define “American-ness” along purely racial or ideological lines break down in the face of actual lived communities.

7. Contestation of “Nation of Immigrants” as a Modern Mantra

[45:17–54:31] Debating slogans and changing realities

• Historical myth versus ideology:
  • “Immigration” used to mean individuals arriving, now it’s an ideology—“the essence of America.”
• Historical context matters:
  • 19th-century openness wouldn’t have survived a tidal wave of culturally-unassimilable newcomers.
• *“It is one of our virtues that we're such an open people…But when you make it a religion…the essence of America…well, I disagree.” —Darryl Cooper [53:44]

8. Policy Implications and Political Realities

[54:31–61:14] The question of reversibility and political strategy

• On reversibility:
  • Is there any coming back if mass immigration resumes?
    • “No.” Floods can’t be undone by mere policy; only large-scale political/cultural consensus can slow/reverse course.
    • “Donald Trump…locked down the border…But Joe Biden can make up for that times 10 in four years.” —Darryl Cooper [54:48]
• Winning the argument, not just winning elections:
  • Focus on making pro-mass-immigration policies a political liability for any party.
  • Arguments focused on issues like the creation of permanent underclasses, the outsourcing of laborers, and practical economic logic have more cross-ideological appeal than moralistic condemnation.
  • “You have to give people permission to think certain things…to think those things without feeling like they're one of the terrible people they were told about…their whole childhood.” —Darryl Cooper [60:36]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On why past immigration policy doesn’t fit today:
  • “To transpose those policies onto our modern, mature economy and mature political system…is illogical. It's a dogmatic appeal to tradition.” —Darryl Cooper [09:10]
• On assimilation and local identity:
  • "They're Americans, but they'll never really be Minnesotans, because that's a separate thing. Like they're Americanized by the mass culture, you know." —Darryl Cooper [21:48]
• On political culture and homogenization:
  • “The common culture is that you don't have one. Like, that's basically what it comes down to, because every generation…there's this permanent state of forgetting.” —Darryl Cooper [31:25]
• On the difficulty of immigration restriction for Christian Americans:
  • “…the only thing, especially Christian people…that really pushes you over the edge…is when you realize there's a line of 150 million people who are going to come in after that guy, and at some point you're going to have to say no.” —Darryl Cooper [50:42]
• On providing rhetorical “permission” for dissent:
  • “You have to give people…ways to think about things that are not going to make them feel like they're a terrible person for thinking it…you have to give them permission to think certain things.” —Darryl Cooper [60:36]
• On irreversibility:
  • "I don't think so. Like, I think you have to win the argument…It's not deporting 15 million people. And if the next guy wants to bring in another 15…" —Darryl Cooper [55:12]

Important Timestamps

• [04:15] – Darryl’s “elevator pitch”: American immigration’s historic uniqueness
• [10:27] – Transition to the present: why today is different and more complex
• [19:32] – Assimilation and the limits of multicultural coexistence/enclave formation
• [29:37] – Homogenization, loss of cultures, and the irony of “diversity”
• [34:25] – How state intervention breeds resentment and political instability
• [38:02] – Is America a nation of immigrants or an idea?
• [54:48] – Can mass immigration waves be “undone”?
• [56:56–61:14] – Political strategy: shifting the Overton Window and giving dissenters rhetorical cover

Tone & Language

The conversation is unsparing, analytical, and often iconoclastic—punctuated by historical references and a clear concern for the big-picture ramifications of social engineering and failing assimilation. Tom Woods and Darryl Cooper speak in clear, direct, sometimes provocative terms, pushing boundaries but intent on a serious, thoughtful critique rather than mere polemics.

Final Thoughts

Darryl Cooper and Tom Woods present a nuanced but firmly restrictionist case about the limits and dangers of mass immigration in the current era. They argue that while America’s past was shaped by immigration, the unique historical conditions behind that reality are gone. Today’s mass, state-facilitated, ideologically promoted immigration threatens not only practical assimilation but the very possibility of shared political life and social trust. The remedy, they say, is less in electoral flip-flops and more in moving the broader culture and Overton Window—giving ordinary Americans the rhetorical tools and moral confidence to speak honestly about the costs of perpetual demographic and cultural churn.

For further reading and resources, including Darryl Cooper’s work, visit tomwoods.com/2751.