“Seed by seed”

Summary

The Tony Kornheiser Show – Episode: “Seed by Seed”
Release Date: June 9, 2025
Host: Tony Kornheiser
Guests: Michael Wilbon, Pat40
Produced by: This Show Stinks Productions, LLC

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Introduction to the Episode

In the "Seed by Seed" episode of The Tony Kornheiser Show, host Tony Kornheiser engages in lively discussions with his regular guests, Michael Wilbon and Pat40. The episode delves into recent sports events, including the NBA Finals, the French Open, and the Belmont Stakes, while also weaving in personal anecdotes and humorous banter about everyday activities like gardening and golfing.

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NBA Finals and Basketball Insights

Timestamp: [01:09]

Tony kicks off the discussion by referencing Aaron Rodgers, drawing parallels to a past Steelers commentator Terry Bradshaw’s opinion. This segues into a light-hearted debate about Rodgers' demeanor:

Tony Kornheiser [01:09]: “Now, it is fashionable to look at Aaron Rodgers right now and say he has become a jerk. Like Terry Bradshaw basically said, he has become a jerk and we, the Steelers, shouldn't be involved with him.”

Pat40 Interjects:

Pat40 [01:26]: “Didn't Bradshaw say something like stay.”

This exchange sets the tone for the episode's blend of sports commentary and humorous takes on athletes' personalities.

Gardening and Planting Potatoes

Timestamp: [02:07]

Tony shifts the conversation to a more personal topic—planting potatoes. He discusses his plans with Chris to plant sprouted potatoes, highlighting the familial and down-to-earth aspects of the show:

Tony Kornheiser [02:48]: “On Wednesday, the potatoes that we put in the closet have sprouted eyes. You are going to plant the potatoes in an area in the front of the yard that we think gets a little bit of sun…”

Pat40 shares his excitement and playful concerns about the gardening project, emphasizing the show's family-friendly approach.

Golfing Stories and Anecdotes

Timestamp: [04:42]

The conversation naturally transitions to golf, with Tony recounting a particularly frustrating playoff event:

Tony Kornheiser [04:43]: “Canadian Open, one of the dullest. They missed putt after putt after putt three different times… Ryan Fox wins. He has two putts to win from five feet and barely does, but he does. It was terrible.”

Pat40 reminisces about past golf moments, drawing connections to legendary players like Grant Wade and Tiger Woods:

Pat40 [05:44]: “…you miss them. Then the fourth time they played it, here’s to Ryan Fox, because he said, you know what? I'm not laying up, I'm going for it.”

This segment highlights the camaraderie and shared frustrations among golf enthusiasts.

The French Open and Michael Wilbon’s Enthusiasm

Timestamp: [30:50]

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to analyzing an epic tennis match between Sinner and Alcaraz, considered one of the greatest matches ever:

Michael Wilbon [25:16]: “For me, it was that because there was stuff involving Rod Laver and Arthur Ashe and Stan Smith… this was insane. Part of its drama is the unbelievable shot making and talent.”

Tony agrees, underscoring the rarity and excitement of witnessing such high-caliber sport:

Tony Kornheiser [30:40]: “I believe that Sinner probably has that same amount of confidence in himself… there’s nobody in their league right now.”

The discussion delves into the dynamics of modern tennis, player confidence, and the future of the sport, providing deep insights for both casual listeners and avid sports fans.

Belmont Stakes and Horse Racing Controversy

Timestamp: [42:31]

Transitioning to horse racing, Tony and Pat40 discuss Sovereignty's victory at the Belmont Stakes, raising concerns about the trainer Bill Mott's decision to skip the Preakness:

Tony Kornheiser [43:48]: “…I think Bill Mott cheated the sport, and I think he cheated the fans. And I think there should be a rule against this.”

Pat40 echoes the sentiment, critiquing the decision and advocating for structural changes in the Triple Crown races:

Pat40 [49:22]: “…the horse racing business needs to do something to make sure this doesn't happen.”

This segment delves into the integrity of horse racing, the importance of the Triple Crown, and the impact of decisions made by trainers and owners on the sport's legacy.

Personal Anecdotes and Light-Hearted Banter

Throughout the episode, Tony shares personal stories about golfing, experiences with friends, and humorous takes on everyday scenarios. For instance, recounting a golf game where heavy rain interrupted play:

Tony Kornheiser [13:03]: “We go out at like 12, 15. Now I'm going out. You gotta sign up on Sundays.”

Conversely, Pat40 discusses humorous mishaps and the camaraderie among friends during their recreational activities.

Advocacy and Listener Engagement

Towards the end, Tony passionately advocates for changes in horse racing rules to preserve the integrity of the Triple Crown:

Tony Kornheiser [48:06]: “…I think there should be some rules here. Because these horses, they're not bred to pull a plow. They're bred to run fast, to race.”

Pat40 encourages Tony to share his viewpoints through a column, highlighting the episode's blend of personal passion and sports analysis.

Closing Remarks and Musical Interlude

The episode concludes with musical segments from the band "22 in Jersey," interspersed with humorous commentary and creative pizza recipe suggestions inspired by listener emails. Tony’s playful idea for the “Kornheiser pizza” adds a unique and entertaining finish to the episode.

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Notable Quotes

1. Tony Kornheiser [01:09]:

   “Now, it is fashionable to look at Aaron Rodgers right now and say he has become a jerk.”

2. Michael Wilbon [25:16]:

   “…this was insane. Part of its drama is the unbelievable shot making and talent.”

3. Tony Kornheiser [30:40]:

   “I believe that Sinner probably has that same amount of confidence in himself… there’s nobody in their league right now.”

4. Tony Kornheiser [43:48]:

   “I think Bill Mott cheated the sport, and I think he cheated the fans. And I think there should be a rule against this.”

5. Pat40 [49:22]:

   “…the horse racing business needs to do something to make sure this doesn't happen.”

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Conclusion

In "Seed by Seed," Tony Kornheiser masterfully balances in-depth sports analysis with personal stories and humor. From dissecting monumental tennis matches to passionately advocating for fair horse racing practices, the episode offers a comprehensive and engaging listening experience. Regular guests Michael Wilbon and Pat40 contribute their expertise and camaraderie, making the show both informative and entertaining for listeners who seek insightful commentary on current sports events and beyond.

Transcript

[Tony Kornheiser]

Hey, it's Tony. On today's show, we'll talk to Wilbon about the NBA Finals. Also about the French Open, which he loved. And we'll talk about Sovereignty winning the Belmont with Pat 40. But first, how about a little commerce?

[Michael Wilbon]

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[Chris]

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[Michael Wilbon]

Previously on the Tony Kornheiser Show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Now, it is fashionable to look at Aaron Rodgers right now and say he has become a jerk. Like Terry Bradshaw basically said, he has become a jerk and we, the Steelers, shouldn't be involved with him. Okay. It's a Wilbon position. It's a position of preponderance. It is.

[Pat 40]

Didn't Bradshaw say something like stay.

[Tony Kornheiser]

In California and eat bark? Which is why I said yesterday, I wonder at the first training table who's going to give him a plate of bark? Because that would be funny.

[Michael Wilbon]

The Tony Kornheiser show is on now.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Not everybody knows that we have an Internet. Not everybody knows that Chris is here because we had Harrison for a couple of weeks as he was doing his project for Marais and Harrison did something that was useful. It took him a while because he only got half the flowers and half the zucchini seed.

[Unknown]

By seed.

Right.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But he was able to plant things like his mark on the. The food that we're going to eat down the road, the harvest. The harvest. If we have a harvest, his mark will be appreciated. We haven't asked Chris to do anything. Chris does stand up comedy. We're not having him do stand up comedy at 7:30 in the morning. Don't have cursing or anything like that.

[Unknown]

It's a family show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Thank you so. And Chris is the 37th and last grandchild. And whenever I say that to people, I go, you're kidding. 37. I go, yeah. 37. He's 37. But I have thought of something for Chris to do.

[Pat 40]

Oh.

[Tony Kornheiser]

On Wednesday, the potatoes that we put in the closet have sprouted eyes. You on Wednesday, are going to plant the potatoes in an area in the front of the yard that we think gets a little bit of sun, although hasn't been any sun for a few days. But. But. So you have to be psyched up for that. There'll be at least three different potato strains of potatoes that you will plant, and we will supervise, but you will plant.

[Chris]

Tony, we've been talking about these potatoes for. Since I got here. Yes.

[Unknown]

I'm very excited.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I showed them to Michael. Right. They have eyes.

[Unknown]

Oh, yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You know, they're ready to go now. It's a little late.

[Unknown]

The eyes are open.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It's a little bit late for potatoes to plant them. Let's say June 15th.

[Pat 40]

Well, it just means we'll have a later harvesting.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But it's not like we're going to get snow in Sephora or October, so don't worry about it.

[Pat 40]

Probably not.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So we'll cut the potatoes. Goes in such a way that the eyes are up, looking up under the ground, looking into dirt, but looking up. And that's supposedly. What do we plan them about six inches deep.

[Unknown]

Yeah. Then you got to create a little mound.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Well, this is Chris's job. We can supervise.

[Pat 40]

We're going to need you to watch the Martian, you know, between now and then.

[Tony Kornheiser]

All right. So that's. At least there's something that he can do. A lot of sports happened over the weekend. Wilbourne's going to want to talk about a bunch of it. He's going to want to talk about the French Open, which he thinks the greatest thing he's ever seen. Last night, he told me how great the soccer was. I said, I'm not interested in the soccer. It's not my history. I'm not. I don't care about soccer. This upsets him very much. Although the things he doesn't care about, he thinks no one should care about.

[Unknown]

He takes one trip to the UK Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

And he loves soccer. And he's talking about Ronaldo, so he's going to talk about that. So we'll talk about these things. I'll talk about the Nats briefly, but I do want to say, played golf twice. I will talk about that. And I will also talk about one of the worst playoffs I've ever seen.

[Pat 40]

With The Canadian Open.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Canadian Open, one of the dullest. They missed putt after putt after putt three different times. They played 18 and missed putts inside of 10ft that are going to win the tour. And they missed them. Then the fourth time they played it, here's to Ryan Fox, because he said, you know what? I'm not laying up, I'm going for it. He took out a three wood and hit it 260, hit it to like eight feet. Of course, missed the putt because he's missed every putt. But the other guy, Sam Burns, was forced to do the same thing. Got on the green in a less advantageous position, put his first putt sufficiently past the hole to six feet and missed that. Just so, like, Ryan Fox wins. He has to two putt the win from five feet and barely does, but he does. It was terrible.

[Unknown]

Got a miss on the pro side.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Terrible playoff, you know, the Canadian Open, it was terrible. I'm happy you bring this up because of Nick Taylor, because he had an 80 footer.

[Unknown]

Sure. And you think back to what happened 25 years ago. Different course, different time of year, but.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Where you have the toys. Different course.

[Unknown]

Iron from the fairway, bunker over the water to beat Grant Wade. And to hear there's a. There's a video that's going around where Ted Scott, who's Sheffler's caddy, who was on the bag for weight back then.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Oh, is that right? Talks about Grant Wade is our friend.

[Pat 40]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

After he. After Grant Wade hits it on the green on 18, he goes, I think we beat Tiger woods here. And then you can hear it in the announcer's voice as they go. He's aiming awfully right. Do you think he pushed it? Is that going to be able to carry it? It goes five, you know, five yards beyond the pin, just off the green. That's what you miss.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Yeah. Until we didn't have any of that six iron, 216.

[Unknown]

I think it was as.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Fabulous. Well, it's Tiger Woods. Come on. Now, the other thing I watched. So Wilbon got upset with me because instead of watching the basketball game, I was watching the Tony Awards. Okay. Reasonable person would do.

[Unknown]

Did you stay up for the Hamilton reunion?

[Tony Kornheiser]

No, I did not. I missed that.

[Pat 40]

They got back 10 years.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, the commercials very well. When the commercials happen. I went over to the other thing and at one point, Oklahoma City scores a basket to make it, I don't know, 52, 27. And I go, this is back to the Tonys. This is over. I'M not watching.

[Unknown]

Did you recognize the voice playing the role of the announcer?

[Tony Kornheiser]

No.

[Unknown]

Brian Stokes Mitchell.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Oh, he's very famous.

[Unknown]

Oh, the voice.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yes. He's.

[Unknown]

It's Wheels of a Dream.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, it's great. Oh, no, I did. I didn't know that. I didn't know that. So I watched a lot of. Why didn't watch a lot of Tony Awards. I watched enough to satisfy me that I was being current. And Wilbond was upset because he was.

[Unknown]

Watching the band Never Be Satisfied.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Well, that's the way it goes.

[Unknown]

But just doing Hamilton reference.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Speaking of theater, on Saturday night, I watched 2/3 to 3/4 of the live broadcast on CNN of Good Night and Good luck with George Clooney. My friend Lowell Singer said, are you on this? I didn't know about it. I said, I'm on it now. And it was great. It was the closest thing to being there that you can have on television because it was live. They're not fooling around. Did you see that, Chris? I did not. I wasn't home Saturday night, but I recorded it for later. Good. Did you see it?

[Unknown]

I did not. But the camera work. Were they going tight in on the face? Were they trying to give you the experience of being in the theater?

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yes, yes. For a lot of close ups. And they was. It was brilliant. It's brilliantly written and George Clooney is a wonderful actor and everybody in the ensemble is wonderful. Did you see? You didn't.

[Pat 40]

I was unaware it was on. I was watching Mr. 3000.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay. Again.

[Unknown]

Yeah. Got to catch those checks.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, yeah. $2, 9.

[Unknown]

But I wish.

[Pat 40]

I mean, I remember the mo. Movie. The movie was terrific.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Right. But he didn't play Edward R. Murrow in the movie.

[Pat 40]

No, that's right, he didn't. So he's Edward R. Murrow in this.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He's Edward R. Morrow in this. It's. It's just, it was really. I was thrilled by it and I had one. And during the day. I had planned my whole day around watching the Belmont. The Belmont did not disappoint and Wilbon says he watches. So we're going to talk to Wilbon about it. But I will just say this and we're going to talk to Pat40 about it at great length. The race did not disappoint. Sovereignty went out there and for the second time, the only two times they run against each other, Sovereignty ran down journalism and went by and it was great. Yeah, really was great. All of that stuff was great. There was a lot of things to do And I play, I played Saturday. I played with Neville on Saturday. We love Neville. Love Neville. Neville and I played Falls Road. Now the Falls Road Golf Course, you wouldn't want to play it every day because it's very open. It's pretty short from the front tees, always has great greens, pretty accessible. The greens were wonderful and the fairways were wonderful. You know, they were, they were thick fairways. They were really quite good. You can't shave them down because too many people hack around and they're not good enough. People like me would ruin the fair.

[Unknown]

They have a full T sheet every day and you have to protect the.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Court every single day. And we end up with another couple. We end up with Scott and Alexis, who are married. Scott, I think he said at one point to Neville, he works in biotechnology. I heard biotechnology. And I said, well, what am I going to say? So that was the end of that. I was not going to talk to him about biotechnology. Alexis, a tennis player and a golfer, good athlete. He played from the tips. Michael Scott played from the tips.

[Unknown]

He try and drive number one.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He got close. He got close. He's good. I, I, I had him for like 74 to 76.

[Unknown]

That front right corner.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, he missed. He, he like had three or four birdies and didn't, didn't have any doubles. And he was a really good player. And they were, we got lucky. They were very pleasant. She had no idea who I was like at 4 or 5. She, because everybody tries to make a little bit of conversation. She says, do you, Scott says, you do something in sports? And I said, yeah, I do. That's, you know, okay. I, you know, I do something in sports.

[Unknown]

Pitching coach.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Should have said that. Should have said. I should have said I work Freddie Longos on the, on the nets.

[Pat 40]

You could tell them you're, you're a sea captain. You could tell him you're a gardener.

[Tony Kornheiser]

No, no, I just said, yeah. And then around 7 or so, she says, Scott says, you were for ESPN. Are you on ESPN? I said, yeah. When I sent her 5:30 Monday through Friday, she goes, oh, that was it. Like there was like, there's no more. There's no more. But very pleasant. I love that.

[Unknown]

The follow up was finding out the time slot.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, we, we enjoyed their company. We hope they enjoyed our company. And it was great. And then, and we, it rained on us. It rained on us. Not hard rain, but on Saturday it rained on us for, I would say the first five or six holes, maybe a little bit more than that. Then it Turned beautiful.

[Pat 40]

Oh, yeah, it did.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It turned beautiful for the last eight holes. Probably just turned beautiful. That was nice yesterday. Rain constant.

[Pat 40]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

We go out at like 12, 15. Now I'm going out. You gotta sign up on Sundays.

[Unknown]

Sunday's a T sheet day.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. T sheet day. So I call up Scott, what do you got, starter? And I said, got anything for me? He says, well, at 12:12, I got a threesome. I said, do I know any of them? And he goes, it's Bobby Lane. It's Peter Farrell. It's Chris Duke. I know them all. Chris Duke's my doctor. I like them all. Bobby Lane's kid, Young Lane, was our intern.

[Unknown]

I'm getting news from Dr. Duke's office.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Really?

[Unknown]

Oh, yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Oh, okay.

[Unknown]

They're doing an info session.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay. So I'm really happy to play, but they're strong players. Michael will appreciate this. Chris hit to the bunker on the right on two.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

And took an iron and landed at seven feet.

[Unknown]

He was practicing all winter. Five o' clock.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He said the sim room. He said the sim room. What made him. He's. He's a really good player.

[Unknown]

He was a Bay 2 guy.

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay. These guys are strong, so they're. And I like them very much. Why? I enjoy their company. I do. But I can't play when I play with three people that good. I'm shankopotamus all over the place. I stink.

[Unknown]

So do you get. Do you get extra anxious because they are smooth club players?

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yes, yes. And I like them too. And I don't want to hold them up. I don't want to make their experience bad because I'm a hack, or a chop, as I've been called by pros. A chop.

[Unknown]

Called you a chop.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Lee Jansen said there's this chop.

[Unknown]

Oh, is it 18?

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, chop next to me, it's like a 16. I went, Whoa, that's good. I was an 18. Anyway. Anyway, so we play and it rains and it rains and it rains. It's never. There's no thunder. There's no lightning. It's never hard enough to stop. I would have stopped. It's never hard enough to stop, except we finished 13 and it starts coming down. We are very lucky because there's a shelter at 13. And we go to the shelter and stand in the shelter for maybe 30 minutes.

[Unknown]

And you have a doctor with you.

[Tony Kornheiser]

We have a doctor in case anything goes wrong. And for maybe 30 minutes, we have a nice chat. We talk about everything under the sun, although there's no sun. And then it abates a little bit. And. And the decision is, well, let's play 14. Let's play 15. If it's awful, go in. But it went back to the original status of light enough rain that you could play all the way through. And I played all the way through. I probably shot 110. I didn't even put in score.

[Pat 40]

But then in 99.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But then Chris did this really nice thing I like. So we go in to have something to eat afterwards. Except I don't know that we're going to have something to eat. I get there either early or late or whatever and I sit at the table and Peter had to leave. So it's Bobby and it's Chris and food comes to them. And I hadn't ordered any food. And I knew that if I ordered food, it would take too long. At that point, everybody would be done. And Chris gave me half his sandwich.

[Unknown]

How about that?

[Tony Kornheiser]

A grilled bacon, cheese and tomato sandwich gave me half of it. And I figured if he gave it to me, although it didn't appear to look healthy. But he's a doctor. He said he probably figured the guy was out playing for five hours in the rain. Let him eat something substantial. It's really nice. And Chris, of course, his daughter Lean, was our intern, Lance.

[Pat 40]

Intern Lean. Yes.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So it's this spider web of stuff. But I had a really good time. Like, every one of those guys either birdie to party or part of. You know what I mean? There would be a birdie on almost every hole. They were that good. And pars all over the place. You know, not doubles. Not like me. What did you get? Eight. Give me a six. Six. But it was. I was. I played twice. I hate the rain. I played twice in the rain and was so happy.

[Unknown]

So yesterday, was somebody in your group keeping everyone else up to date with the tennis or is that just something.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You was over when we went out? The tennis was over, wasn't it?

[Unknown]

No, no, no. It still went on two hours.

[Pat 40]

Yeah, it went on till about two or three.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I watched the first three sets, maybe. Okay. No, nobody kept us. Kept us up on.

[Pat 40]

Because I was about to go out in a hike in the rain. Well, let me see what happens here.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Did it start at 12?

[Unknown]

No, no, no, no.

[Pat 40]

It started at 9. 9:30, something like that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay, so the first.

[Unknown]

Dust in the eye.

[Pat 40]

It's the second longest final.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, I watched three sets before I went to play, before I drove over there, so I assumed it would have been over, but it was. I guess it wasn't over. No, we didn't know. I mean, then I watched a lot of it after. I mean, you watch what you watch. Yeah, look, I mean, we ended up.

[Unknown]

Listening to the last set on the radio because we were driving back.

[Pat 40]

It was as thrilling a match.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Here's the thing. There's nobody in men's tennis in the same league as Sinner and Alcaraz at the moment. There's nobody. Djokovic, as you saw, couldn't stay with Sinner. And all of the men in the top 10, 12, something like that, almost all of them are actually older than Sinner and Alcaraz. And the ones that are their age or younger aren't as good. Yeah, these two are great. That. These two are great. There's, you know, they should win them all.

[Pat 40]

This appears to be a rebirth of Nadal and Federer. Yeah, we'll get this.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Well, then Djokovic will come along.

[Pat 40]

Yeah, you get somebody else along.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, but. Yeah, but these guys are really strong players.

[Unknown]

Players.

[Pat 40]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

It's amazing at the final tally, which is 193 to 192 and.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. In points. Yeah.

[Pat 40]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

How is tennis on the radio?

[Unknown]

It was hard to listen to A time is impossible, you know, but there's different voices. If you know the voices and you know the course, there's enough time. It's hard when you're going center, forehead, down the line. Alcaraz returned with, you know, gets the angle.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

But when he got to high stakes, when, when Alcaraz had the chance to win on serve, it started to make a lot more sense. But, you know, it was tennis.

[Tony Kornheiser]

There are, it's, there's no other sport that does what I'm going to say now, like auto racing, if it's on an oval, the ovals are the same. They got to be the same. They can't have grass. Horse racing. The dirt is the dirt. Sometimes it gets wet, but the dirt is the dirt. Basketball, the floor is the floor.

[Pat 40]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Baseball, the dimensions change a little bit, but the surface doesn't really change. Tennis has three different surfaces. They have grass, they have hard court, and they have clay. And clay is. The play is slower. You can get to the ball in clay. There's no match on grass that takes five hours and 20 minutes. Points don't take that long.

[Pat 40]

Points of bang, bang.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So you have to.

[Unknown]

I don't know.

I think Federer, Nadal might have something to say about that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You have to be in great shape. Shape. That's very true. To play tennis on clay. Yeah. Because you're out there a long time. You're out there a long time and age. I mean, I'm, I, I assume that Djokovic was done in at some point by being 38 and playing a 23 year old.

[Pat 40]

Yeah. And I think he's just not as good as center right now.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He's not.

[Pat 40]

Yeah. Center will make the shot. Every time center needed to make a shot in that match, he did.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Pat 40]

And just that much better than my friend David said.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I was saying how good that match was with Djokovic and how I thought that Djokovic brought honor to himself in the way that he played. And David said he never had a chance to win that. Never, not once. Never. And I just said, why you write all the time hard to be your friend. We'll take a break Wilbon when we return. I'm Tony Kornheiser.

[Michael Wilbon]

This is the Tony Kornheiser show. Tony Kornheiser show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

This is the Liquid iv. Read its peak hydration season and Liquid IV is the perfect companion for your hottest summer plants. They've just launched an exhilarating new flavor. Arctic raspberry. Have you had that?

[Unknown]

No.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Have you had that?

[Pat 40]

I have not tried that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Arctic raspberry.

[Unknown]

Stuck with strawberry lemonade, I could have Arctic Raspberry Plus.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Liquid IV has sugar free solutions powered by Liv Hydra Science. For smart hydration, just visit Liquid IV.com and use the code Tony K at checkout for 20% off your first order.

[Unknown]

Like how the kids make my Liquid IV drink vanish.

[Tony Kornheiser]

They just drink it themselves.

[Unknown]

Oh, I go to the playground to pick them up and I just slowly see each of the three boys circle over to my, you know, my station and just take furtive sips.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay. Did you know that just one stick of liquid IV along with 16 ounces of water hydrates better than water alone? Now, Michael would have used that and then the kids would. Yes, and sip that. Yeah. Powered by LIV Hydro Science, an optimized ratio of electrolytes, essential vitamins, and clinically tested nutrients that turn ordinary water into extraordinary hydration, no matter what your summer brings. Tear, pour, live more. Go to liquidiv.com, get 20% off your first order with the code Tonyk at checkout. That's 20% off your first order with code tonykidiv.com Use the code, people.

[Michael Wilbon]

You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You've heard me talk about collars and company. Makers of the amazing dress collar polo. Well, now they've taken things to the next level with their brand new Maverick performance blazer. And you have to check this out. These blazers are sharp, perfect for travel. Why? Because they're wrinkle resistant. Just throw it in your bag. When you get to your destination, slip it back on. No wrinkles, no stress. Finally, no more figuring out how to travel with a blazer. And it's not just about convenience. The Mavic performance blazer is made with stretch fabric so you can move comfortably all day long. Plus it's packed with smart features, inside security zip pockets, a built in optional pocket square and even a sunglasses loop. While you're at it, pair the blazer with The Collars & Co. Famous Dress Collar polos. They've already sold over a million of these comfortable polos with the signature dress collar on top. So visit collars and co.com use the promo code Tony for 20% off today. Use the code people. That should send me one of these. Yeah, I'd like to see this. A non wrinkle blazer. Yeah, because then I don't have to carry a steamer around with me all the time.

[Michael Wilbon]

This is the Tony Kornheiser show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

This is a band called 22 in Jersey. Sean Cunningham sends us in. He says, my name is Sean a little since the days of band from the Tony Korneiser show. The following are from my son Reagan's band. I swear Reagan was not a girl's name 22 years ago. He plays bass in 22 in Jersey. I may be boxing, but this is good. The first time they played live, they won the battle of the bands at the University of Central Florida, the largest university in the nation. Says they could use some love on Spotify, YouTube, Instagram would appreciate if you could feature them. Thanks for supporting unsigned music and playing whole songs after your show. Happy to do it. Yeah. 22 in Jersey playing a song called Daydreams that plays in Michael Wilbon. We're going to start with this. I called Wilbon last week and I said so we. This fantastic thing happened. There's a place in la. It's not LA sortas it's sorted and they have a Wilbon pizza and Wilbond says I know. How did you know? How did you know about this?

[Unknown]

Well, because there's a new thing called a telephone. Amazing what happens when you answer it. Yeah, you know, people could tell you all kinds of things and so people call and tell me they're ordering it or give me a pic. I got. There's two things kind of like that. The other thing is more absurd. The pizza is an Honor to have that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, sure.

[Unknown]

But there's a. When you check into a hotel, I won't mention the name of the hotel, but you check into a hotel. I'm talking about a big business hotel in Evanston, Illinois. You check in and a lot of people are going to business at Northwestern or visiting their children at Northwestern or, you know, whatever the purpose may be. Or you're in Evanston, you. You're there because you're at the lake in the summer. You want to just be there. Football game, whatever the case may be. You go check in. And the key card, the key card you receive to open your door for your entire visit. It may be Charlton Heston's face. It could be Cindy Crawford's face. It could be Michael Wilbourne's face.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Wow.

[Unknown]

And I got.

The first time. The first time I got this, I don't even know who it was, like 10 years ago. And then, of course, every time, every friend I have who has a child at Northwestern at some point stays at this hotel and is issued this may check in his key card. And I've gotten it from my Torico. It happens, you know, all the time. And I need to. I should stop by and say, listen, in the day of nil. Damn it. There's some money that is owed me. You didn't. People. I didn't sign off any rights on the use of my name, image and likeness. Give me some, Give me some, some, some Doski.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's great. That's wonderful. But you can't eat the key card. You can eat the pizza. Have you. No, you haven't had the pizza?

[Unknown]

No, I don't. I don't. You know, look, I'm a Chicago pizza guy.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And I don't just eat anybody's pizza. And I'm sure it's terrific. And I don't go in and eat things on p. I don't. I'm not gonna have pineapple on pizza. I'm not gonna have mushrooms on it. So it doesn't matter what you have on your sausage. I'm getting sausage pizza. That's it. That's the deal. Thin crust sausage. That's what's up.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay.

[Unknown]

Doesn't matter what's on it, who made it, how good it might be to others. You know what bonus mileage you get if you have it multiple times in a week. I'm honored. Knock yourself out. Glad to hear it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

All right, let's talk about some of the things that happened over the weekend. Let's start with alcaraz and Sinner because you are a tennis person, and I believe that you believe that's one of the greatest matches ever.

[Unknown]

I have been watching tennis my whole life, and it is up there in the group of matches. I mean, I've got favorite matches in my life, which, you know, when these things happen when you're a kid, they involve a person that you consider, you know, your idol, your favorite player. For me, it was that because there was stuff involving Rod Laver and Arthur Ashe and Stan Smith and, you know, it's fine, but then those have faded because I don't know that there are matches. There might be a few, but the favorite matches for me came the next sort of generation, if you will, and that was dealing with guys my age, and that was dealing specifically with Jimmy Connors and Bjorn borg and John McEnroe, who was probably my favorite player ever. And it involves those guys, and it's hard for me to put something with them. And then I started covering matches, you know, in some tennis and going to the US Open, going to Davis cup and being able to see the great players of whatever day, you know, play the greatest tennis in the world. And so I got some stuff to choose from. But, you know, this was insane. Part of it's drama for me. Has to have drama, obviously. It has to have an incredible level just of shot making, of talent. And this had that. And it has not just drama, but either improbability or impossibility. This had that. Because you don't. Because it's not going to happen. Because if five, three down, all 40, it's not going to. The match is over.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Right.

[Unknown]

And I'm not a person who goes to bed because stuff is over. I don't. There's somebody I know in this conversation on a daily basis. Yeah. I'm not one of them. For me to. For me to tune out is like, okay, so I didn't do that yesterday. Different sort of situation, but it's not possible. Something that was impossible happened and something that makes me. The stuff that is like that for me, makes me examine the nature of sport itself. And so I have Tony and I have dozens, a couple of dozen friends in sport who can articulate what it's like to do the most difficult things in the world because they've done it. And so there are guys that I am friends with and women who are eloquent in talking about what belief in self is like at a level that when you're going to work every day and driving your car and having a valet parked, you don't you don't know what it is? Don't you not know what it is?

[Tony Kornheiser]

You.

[Unknown]

You don't necessarily recognize it. You can't understand what happened. Like, if people say, well, I. He says, Alcaraz says, I just believed in myself. What. What do you mean you believed in yourself? This guy has. He has knocked you around for two and a half sets. You're going down, son. As great as you are, he's kicking your ass. And he believed himself, and he did. It's not just a sentence. And I have a friend, Tony, who, you know, I won't mention his name because I'm not supposed to maybe attribute this to him, but he's just smart. I should mention his name. I'm going to mention his name. It's John Barry. John Barry played in the NBA, like, 13 years. John Barry's dad was even greater than John. John Barry's dad's in the hall of Fame, one of the seven great shooters of all time, no matter how long ago it was. And I asked John about stuff like this when he's playing and he does things himself or he's on the court and he does it, and it's done to him by Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan, both of which happened to him. Or he's part of a game that doesn't make any sense because that is not possible. And John says, you have to understand the people who do this. There's a level of belief in self that is completely irrational. There is confidence, there's great confidence, there's irrational confidence, and then there's delusional confidence. And it's one of the greatest breakdowns of this thing that I've ever had or heard. And I sit there and I listen to John when we watch something like this, and. And he has enough experience with it to be able to use that. When he said it, I was like, you know what? That's it. And so whenever you have something like yesterday with that tennis match and it's over and a guy does something on a stage that is just one of the grandest stages ever, I don't care what the sport is. I don't care who you're rooting for. I don't care what the guy is. I don't care if he's your boy. And they don't care what was done. Yesterday is one of the impossible things you're ever gonna see a sport because it's, like, never been done. That's how, you know, not, oh, it's 14, 5, 5, 5, 5 and 5. No, it's never been done. And so, you know. Yeah, I'm sorry that that happens occasionally. And when you see it, you just have to say, you know what? I'm glad. I love sport at the level. I can occasionally witness this.

[Tony Kornheiser]

This is lovely. I agree with every word you say. And I would come back by saying I believe that Sinner probably has that same amount of confidence in himself.

[Unknown]

Yes.

[Tony Kornheiser]

The same amount of talent as Alcaraz. And I believe that of the next 16 majors, four years, I don't think somebody other than them will win more than three of them because they're young and they're great and there's nobody in their league right now. Right. Nobody.

[Unknown]

But you can join the fray late. Djokovic.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Djokovic did. Yeah. But we're waiting for that guy. We don't know who that guy is.

[Unknown]

We don't. We don't know who that guy is.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Not yet.

[Unknown]

And sometimes there's not a guy. Often these things are rivalries of two. And we saw that with Agassi and samples to a great, great, great degree. But I, I, you know, I don't know. I, I kind of. I keep hoping because of the way he plays, the way, the manner which he plays. I keep hoping. Brian Shelton. I'm sorry, Ben. His father was Brian. Of course, Ben Shelton. Don't know if he will ever join it. He may never get there. He could join it. Could join it late to the party.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It's possible. But American men have, you know, they.

[Unknown]

Have, you know, I mean, that's, that was then, I mean, been a long time when, when things are done for the first time, that's what they are. They're done for the first time. You don't need history. You don't need the comfort of history. Like John Barry says, there's. There's irrational confidence and there's delusional confidence. That's what there is.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, I agree.

[Unknown]

It doesn't matter what, it doesn't matter what other people think of it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Which doesn't mean that the next time this happens, Sinner won't win. Doesn't mean that. I mean, Sinners that good.

[Unknown]

He could.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He's that good.

[Unknown]

Center appears to be that good.

[Tony Kornheiser]

They're both that good.

[Unknown]

Although, Although he is, you know, sort of losing right now. Alcaraz is building a little edge on him. Yeah, but that happened with Nadal, who built an edge even on Federer. This, that's the great thing about this, is we're catching it at the ground floor.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. You get 10, 12 more years of it. You do.

[Unknown]

I just ride with this.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

You know, I am. I'm the ride with this because I love tennis and I want to see this. And sometimes you're robbed of rivalries because of injury or freak stuff. Monica Sellers, Steffi Groff. And you're robbed of it and you can't do anything about it. Not even the people involved can really necessarily do anything about it. So I'm just. I'm enjoying whatever. This is good.

[Tony Kornheiser]

The basketball last night, not surprising at all. Not surprising. They would build a lead and hold the lead. Right? Not surprising.

[Unknown]

Yeah. And no matter how much Indiana struggled and fought and they fought, they fought hard. But, you know, Oklahoma City had its first kind of championship moment last night.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

In terms of being in the finals, like, okay, here's what this is about. Look, I think that there are two finals of relatively recent vintage, if you're not, you know, 24 years old, that you can call on and see the blueprint for what is happening with game one and what is to perhaps happened beyond. And that's in 19. Well, maybe it was 1999 when Allen Iverson.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's right, for Philadelphia, one against the Lakers. And then they got swept and Shaq.

[Unknown]

And Kobe came back and said, okay, enough of this.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, that's right.

[Unknown]

And also when. When Magic Johnson beat Michael Jordan in game one in Chicago and. And Jordan missed the. Jordan didn't hit one of the shots that he's hit, the signature shots. He missed it. And the Lakers win game one and Jordan comes back to lead a five game, you know, four game, you know, sweep from then, five games to win that final. It's when I was watching game one in live time, I thought of those two.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I thought of the Shaq and Kobe one. And I will say this, that had had Indiana won last night. The series is over. It's over. And that's why, you know, I never thought that was going to happen. I mean, and I do. I think it is more reasonable to believe that Oklahoma City will win four in a row than that Indiana will win the series in my mind. But I don't know if I'm right.

[Unknown]

Yeah, you know, me too. I think I believe that. But I was also, you know, I was watching with my brother Don, who's out here with me in Arizona. And Don reminds me that, you know, he's like, remember a team that everybody thought was a great team, who I know you remember, and the people on it, you knew quite well. And that was the 76ers of Julius Irving. Yeah, George McGinnis. And.

[Tony Kornheiser]

And they lost to Portland.

[Unknown]

They lost to Portland.

[Tony Kornheiser]

They lost to Walton. They lost to.

[Unknown]

Oh. In that series. And they lost.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's right.

[Unknown]

They won the first two at home.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's right.

[Unknown]

And then. And then Watt got just blitzed.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. And that's probably the most underappreciated, underrated team of all time.

[Unknown]

The Portland Collins and George McGinnis and Julius Irving and who I missed. And I'm missing somebody. Right.

[Tony Kornheiser]

All great. All great.

[Unknown]

Great.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Caldwell Jones. Caldwell Jones on that team.

[Unknown]

It was just, you know, just a great series with Bill Walton and towards you and Gross and Maurice Lucas.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Fabulous.

[Unknown]

Great. Anyway, there's stuff you can choose from if, you know, as a, you know, template for what you think may happen. And now we get to watch it. But, you know, for me, you know, yesterday watching. And I watched the women's tennis the day before. I watched the soccer game, a couple of soccer games yesterday. But, you know, I mean, the great one, the championship game in Europe was just stunning. And then to watch. I watched everything. I watched.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Did you watch. Did you and Don watch the Clooney show after?

[Unknown]

We watched a lot of it last night.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Great, right? It's great things doing here.

[Unknown]

It's great in that the subject matter is great. The treatment of. It's great. The handling of it is great. It didn't move me like I thought it would.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Ooh, it did for me.

[Unknown]

Yeah, it didn't move me. Like I said, I like it. Obviously I didn't live it. I lived the very end of it and I wasn't conscious for it. We're talking about the 50s.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, it's a long time ago.

[Unknown]

Because you're dealing with Wisconsin, the neighboring state, and that lunatic. And I enjoyed. Look, don't get me wrong now, I enjoyed it and I would have enjoyed. I love stage plays more than musicals. So in general terms. So if I had seen it in person, which I did not last week in New York, I saw Gypsy instead. And that was apparently the performance last night out of Audrey McDonald was one of the all time television. She's great performances. And I know you watched the Tonys. I did not.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I went back and forth until it was 52 to 20. You know, I said, okay. You know, I said, that's enough. It's enough for me.

[Unknown]

Yeah, but it was. But it was. I'm gonna watch the rest. I still have about 15, 20 minutes to watch it. Look, it's fascinating and maybe there was. There's nothing uplifting about it in a way. And I thought there might be because here is something that I believe in, which is media, modern media as the great watchdog for America and democracy. And we're in need of it now as much. And I never thought I'd feel this way as we were then. But there's nothing uplifting about it to me. It made me angry in its brilliance in conveying what needed to be done, what had to be done. It did not uplift me.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay?

[Unknown]

And so, you know, I'm a child of I became what I became because of the news world life cycle business junkie. And I don't watch news now. I don't watch it. I don't consume anything. I don't watch any. Don't consume any of it. And so this was a departure for me for the last year, was not close to a year, eight months, whatever it is, since November. But I'm going to watch the end of it. Tony, maybe I have a different, maybe the climax of Differently out there.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It's a wonderful ending, very understated. And it comes back. It comes back to individual responsibility. It's really quite good. It's quite good. All right. I'll talk to you later. All right, Tom Michael Wilbon, boys and girls, fabulous performance by Wilbon.

[Unknown]

Today.

[Tony Kornheiser]

We're going to come back with Pat 40. We're going to talk about the horses. I'm Tony Kornheiser. You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show. Now let's talk about that car you own but don't use, the one you're paying to keep registered and insured. That's taking up space out front and it's just sitting there doing no one any good. Let me tell you what you should do about that car. You should give Cars for Kids a call and have them take care of it for you. That's right. Just give them the info. They will come to you as soon as the next day. Take that car off your hands at no cost to you. Even better, they will turn that car into funds to help kids. So visit carsforkids.org Tony that's cars with a K and the number 4. To donate or call cars for kids directly at 1-877-cars-FOR KIDS.

[Pat 40]

You don't want to sing it?

[Tony Kornheiser]

I'm not singing it.

[Unknown]

Donate your car today.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Now. I will never get that out of my head for the rest of the day. And they will get that car picked up in a jiffy.

[Unknown]

Join the band.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Plus, you can get a tax deduction, vacation voucher, and life will be Just great. They've been around for 30 years and have done this over a million times. Call now or head over to cars4kids.org Tony right now and get this done. That's carsforkids.org Tony remember, that's cars with.

[H]

A K. You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. How can you find amazing candidates fast? Easy. Just use Indeed. Stop struggling to get your job posts seen on other job sites. Indeed's Sponsored Jobs help you stand out and hire fast. With Sponsored Jobs, your post jumps to the top of the page for your relevant candidates so you can reach the people you want faster and it makes a huge difference. According to INDEED data, Sponsored Jobs posted directly on Indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Plus with Indeed sponsored Jobs, there are no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. And listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more [e-mail] listen just go to indeed.com listen right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com listen. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need. You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Once again, this is a rock and roll band, 22 in Jersey. This is a song called her and Michael. If people like 22 in Jersey want to send in their original music to get it played, how do they do it?

[Unknown]

Send us your music by emailing it to jingles Tony koenizershow.com We are always.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Happy to play your songs because your songs don't cost us anything. And the good songs too. Like if I just sat here and played don't worry baby 19 times. I don't, I don't. Brian Wilson, $4,000. I'm not gonna do it. 22 in Jersey plays in Pat 40. We always talk to Pat about college football and college basketball and there's stuff we could. I mean, we could talk about how colleges are going to pay athletes now in this new ruling, but I don't care about it. Today we're going to talk to Pat because of where he lives and where he's worked. We're going to talk about the horses and the last race in the Triple Crown and the fact that for the second time and just two out of two, not two out of three, two out of two. Sovereignty ran down journalism from the top of the stretch on. And if that had been the normal Belmont mile and a half, Sovereignty would have won by 15 to 20 lengths instead of three or four. What did you think of the race when you watched it?

[Unknown]

I thought I was watching the Kentucky Derby all over again. Very similar the way it all shook out with Journalism, you know, perfectly positioned and heading into the stretch and like, here he goes. And then Sovereignty just being better and having greater stamina and greater closing speed going past him. Very impressive race. A fast time at Saratoga, too. You know, this wasn't run at Belmont Park. It was run at Saratoga Upstate because they're renovating Belmont park, but so they only ran a mile and a quarter, as opposed to the usual mile and a half. But it was a very impressive effort by Sovereignty. And when he hit the line, I thought, man, I wish you would have run the Preakness.

[Tony Kornheiser]

We're going to get to that. It was 1, 2, 3, the same 1, 2, 3 as in the Derby. Sovereignty, Journalism and Baeza. I don't know, I don't know how many times if that's ever happened, that you get two races down the line and you have the same three horses in the same order. Right. I mean, I'm sure if this was basketball or baseball, we'd have 87 statistics, you know, about how often this has happened and why it happens. But doesn't that strike you as tremendously odd?

[Unknown]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it strikes me as a tremendously stratified three year old season. We've got three that are better than the rest.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And I'll think all three are great horses. Terrific. You know, but, yeah, actually, if I were. If I were a good podcast guest, I would have looked up that information for you by now, but I haven't. But it is unusual, for sure. I mean, it really honestly was a replay of the Kentucky Derby and even at the same distance. So, yeah, everything looked very similar.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Except for the weather. Except it wasn't total slop. The trainer of Sovereignty is Bill Mott. I'm going to assume since the last time we saw you, you were chasing him and wearing a Mizzou journalism hat, I'm going to assume that you know him a little bit, right?

[Unknown]

Yes.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Would you say you like him? Would you say you're pals in any level?

[Unknown]

I wouldn't say we're pals, but I like him. You know, I mean, he's. He's been an interesting person to cover. He's been an extremely good horseman and has been around a long, long time. I mean, I've probably talked to him sometime for the first time in the early 1990s, maybe even the late 80s. And, you know, he's won a lot of races. He has always done things his own way. And this, I think, was very much an example of that. He was not going to run in the Triple Crown just to run in the Triple Crown. He was going to do what he thought was the best thing to do with Sovereignty.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay, so it. You are not as is. Neither is Andy Beyer. You are not at all surprised that he skipped the Preakness? Not at all. Right.

[Unknown]

No. No. When that horse won, I thought, oh, man, he may. We may not see him in Baltimore because that's the way Mott has always operated. You know, he. In 2019, Tony won the Derby by disqualification with Country House.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Right.

[Unknown]

And almost immediately said they were unlikely to run in the Preakness. And, you know, the horse ended up, I guess, being injured. There were some people that thought that was just something to say so that he didn't have to have to go or I think he was sick first and then turned up injured. But anyway, running a horseback in two weeks is something Belmont never, ever wants to do. And clearly not even with a chance for the Triple Crown was he gonna do it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

And he doesn't have to do it because he is a trainer of stature and because the owners here are not from the United States, where the Triple Crown means anything. Right. They are from foreign lands. They don't care. Right. Yeah.

[Unknown]

I think those are key points there, both of those, is that Belmont doesn't have to do what, you know, the sport may want him to do. You know, he's been around a long time. He's. I think he's 70. And, you know, he's like, I'm not gonna run this horse in Baltimore just because people think I should. And then. Absolutely, yes, Godolphin, which is the Arab ownership group. Yeah. You know, one of the richest ownership, maybe the richest in the world, is more interested in winning Breeders cup races. The by World cup, they wanted to win a Kentucky Derby badly, and they did that. I'm not sure they gave a damn about winning the Preakness. So Godolphin was. Was perfectly fine. I think, to see things the way Bill Mott did, which is not the way American horse racing fans wanted to see it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I don't care who wins European soccer leagues. I didn't grow up with it. It doesn't mean anything to me. I'll never understand. I'll never. I can appreciate. I'll never understand the passion that people have for soccer. It's just not mine. It's not mine. Godolphin likes Horse racing wants to win specific races, wants to breed horses, doesn't care about the Triple Crown. I get it. But I'm sitting here as somebody who was born and raised on Long island and went to Aqueduct and went to Belmont and did that as a kid all the time and have been to all the Triple Crown races. And I think Pat. And this is the advocacy part of the show, I think Bill Mott cheated the sport, and I think he cheated the fans. And I think there should be a rule against this. I do. Yeah.

[Unknown]

Well, you know what? Why don't you write this. Write all of everything you're saying as a column for the Washington Post. Because it all. It's a great column. You know, it is. To me, it's profoundly disappointing to not to have a horse that good that doesn't even try to win a Triple Crown. Like, I get that the schedule of the Triple Crown no longer fits the way modern thoroughbreds are raised, raced, conditioned, any of that. But, man, I mean, when you see a horse that good that doesn't contest it, yes, it does feel. It feels empty. It really does. It feels like we missed out on something that could have been great. And, you know, I've written several times that I would love to see the spacing changed of the Triple Crown races. Keep the Derby where it is. Move the Preakness to either Memorial Weekend or the first Saturday in June, move the Belmont to 4th of July, and then at least there would be far less excuse for an owner or trainer to skip the middle leg. As it is. You know, I think Bill Mott can certainly sit there and say, we did what was right for the horse. And it is hard to argue that. But he didn't do what was right for the sport.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's right. That's right. He didn't do what was right for the sport. And in this particular case, I mean, I don't know Bill Mott, but, I mean, I think he's wrong and even somewhat villainous. How many Triple Crown winners are there? There's less than 20. Is it like less than 15? Right. How many?

[Unknown]

12 or 13.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's all there are. That's all there are. They run a Belmont every single year. So there's 100 winners of the Belmont. Right. There's 100 winners of the Derby, but there's no. There's hardly any that won the Derby, the Preakness and the Belmont. And I mean, you know, so I'm not. I think the horse racing business needs to do something to make sure this doesn't Happen. Unless I. Unless you think my advocacy is terrible because you know the guy and you like the guy. Andy Beyer likes the guy. Likes him.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But doesn't like this. Done like this.

[Unknown]

No, I don't. I don't like this. And so, yeah, you know, like, again, I, I get it, but I don't. It's not what we, as racing fans in a sport that really, really needs the attention every year that it can have a Triple Crown chase.

That'S.

It needed this. And to not have it and to have that, you know, deprived is really disappointing. And I give a lot of credit to journalism and journalism's people for running all three races and running really well in all three. Second. First. Second is pretty darn good.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Yeah. No, I'm. This. It bothers me more than I think it should, but it really, it really does bother me for everybody to say, you know, well, he's the trainer and he gets to do what he wants. I understand that. I think there ought to be some. I think there ought to be some rules here. You know why? Because these horses, they're not bred to pull a plow. They're bred to run fast, to race. That's. That's what they do. This horse, this horse wants to race. The horse wants to race every day like that. They're horses they wanted. Dogs want to run every single day. That's what they want to do. And now they're going to. I think they're going to go in the Traverse and I'm going to bang my head against the wall that they go in the Travers and that they didn't go in the Preakness. Right?

[Unknown]

Yeah. Yeah. Travis, you know, that'll be like August, so that the horse will have plenty of rest by then. And that's kind of the normal schedule for Triple Crown horses is then to point for the Travis Travers at the end of the summer. But, yeah, you know, by then, guess what people are thinking and talking about football.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

They don't care about horse racing. You know, they're the.

[Tony Kornheiser]

This is the window fraction. Yeah, this is the window to find.

[Unknown]

Out whether your horse, how good your horse is, how many people can you can draw to the sport, and whether you can be part of a select group in history and they chose not to be.

[Tony Kornheiser]

No bothers me. Would you, Would you go to the Traverse if they ran again? If the two of the three of them ran again, would you go?

[Unknown]

I would like to. But again, you know, what if. Yeah. If somebody says, go watch Ohio State practice instead of Going to the Traverse. I'll go to Ohio State, watch the practice.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Understand.

[Unknown]

That's what'll matter more.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Understand. Plug your podcast for us.

[Unknown]

Podcast. Still on hiatus, but. But lingering. Looming.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Good.

[Unknown]

Stay tuned.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, I know we don't usually do this, but I know that you know horses and. And then I figured you had a strong opinion about it. I hoped you did anyway. I did.

[Unknown]

I did. So do you.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Got me nuts.

[Unknown]

Good stuff.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Got me nuts. Thank you, pat.

[Unknown]

Thank you, Pat.

[Tony Kornheiser]

40. Boys and girls, we'll take a break, come back email and jingle. I'm Tony Kornheiser.

[Chris]

Instacart is on a mission to have you not leave the couch this basketball season because between the pre game rituals and the post game interviews, it can be difficult to find time for everything else. So let Instacart take care of your game day snacks or weekly restocks and get delivery in as fast as 30 minutes because we hear it's bad luck to be hungry on game day. So download the Instacart app today and enjoy. $0 delivery fees on your first 3 orders. Service fees apply for 3 orders in 14 days. Excludes restaurants.

[Michael Wilbon]

You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser show.

[I]

Here comes Tony Mailbag.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I've got your emails, your faxes and your notes. Here comes Mr. Tony's mail back. Gonna reach some for all of you folks. Have mercy. A great thanks to Bruce Griffin for that. It's fabulous. Love that. Do you want to do the Bethesda.

[Pat 40]

Bagel Bagel sandwich today? Very happy about that. Yes, he did. Yes. Bethesda Bagels.

[Unknown]

We came to plant the potatoes.

[Pat 40]

Well, yeah, maybe we hold off.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Rewarding arguments.

[Pat 40]

Bethesda Bagels. We love a mule as well. Just go to BethesdaBaggles.com for the location in the DC area nearest you. Then pop on in and you'll be thrilled.

[Tony Kornheiser]

All right, that's gonna do it for us today. Before we get to the mailbag, let me just say. Seems like the other day my baby went away he went away across the sea it's been two years or so since I saw my baby go and then this letter came from me it said that we were through he found somebody new Let me think, let me think. What can I do? These are the Shangri La. This is written and produced by Shadow Morton. Yes, this is. Remember Walking in the Sand. Fabulous tune. Thanks to our guests today, Michael Wilbon and Pat40. Thanks as well to today's sponsors. Remember, you can listen to us on Apple podcasts, Spotify and Odyssey. Get the show through Apple Podcasts. Please leave us a review and David Epstein in New York I'll leave it to others to decide upon the appropriate toppings for the soon to be invented Kornheiser pizza, but I know this. The only way to pay for it will be exact change with personal check. Clay Kennedy Louisville, Kentucky what's on the Kornheiser pizza? Scoops of coffee, ice cream, handful of my dad's chips, eye of potato. Asking for a little with exotic pizza tastes from Greg in Kingston in Ontario and Canada. Would the Cornheiser be a New York style pizza? There is no such thing in New York style. Bill Matfeld, Fort Mill, South Carolina can he have Scotch and ice cream on a picture? Pizza sounds like the perfect combination for watching a late innings Nats game. You need one to calm the nerves when Davey goes to the bullpen and the other to comfort you when the inevitable happens. Why not put both on a pie? Chris in Pittsburgh after the email about the Wilbon pizza and Nigel suggesting there should be a Cornheiser pizza, I have to imagine you're being inundated with suggestions. So here's mine. The Kornheiser is a New York style pizza covered in a red wine sauce and topped with bitter greens, bacon and a Swiss cheese with as many holes as we can find. It will cost 5 to 5 11. Not as much as some pizzas, but better than others, which I guess is a good thing. It's also best eaten while standing over the sink and telling nobody in particular that Josh Bell stinks. He stinks. He stinks. He's batting.180. Come on. He's out there every day.

[Unknown]

Don't look at the numbers from the right side.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He's bat what?

[Unknown]

The right side. At least he's hitting from the left. Have you solved your Swiss cheese problem?

[Tony Kornheiser]

No, there were no holes in the Swiss cheese. I sensed someone close to me out and said, as I always say, make sure there's a lot of holes. There's no holes. None.

[Pat 40]

As we know, more holes, more flavor tastes better. Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Chris Ely Dayton, Ohio Dear Mr. Potato Head, the Cornhydra is a chicken Parmesan pizza in which half of it comes to your table in a to go box. Here's my idea for a promotion for the Steelers home opener. Terry Bradshaw passing out chocolate bark to the first 10,000 fans in attendance. Tyler Etching, Lincoln, Nebraska Chris the Intern says he can lift things. Oh really? What does he think he's better than you? How about Uncle Benny's table? Kornheiser Cornheim Nathan Ackerhelm, Charlotte, N.C. Mr. Tony to Chris on Wednesday's Pot Is there something that you do that you're good at? Just another example of Mr. Tony inspiring.

[Unknown]

The youth of America.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You're actually good at it. Dennis White, Woburn, Massachusetts. You know where? Woburn, Woburn, Woburn. Okay, I didn't know that. Perhaps you've received hundreds of emails regarding your love of the Beach Boys. Don't Worry Baby but here goes anyway. The story goes Brian Wilson was blown away by Be My Baby by the Ronettes. It inspired him to compose Don't Worry Baby. Further, he wanted the Ronettes to record the song. Unfortunately, Phil Spector, being the control freak that he was, wouldn't allow the group to record anything he didn't have some hand in composing. Just think of what might have been the Ronette singing Don't Worry About Baby. Music Heaven Another Phil Spector story. It's told that Bill Medley got his nose out of joint when Phil informed him that Bobby Hadfield would solo Unchained melody back in 1965. Prior to the recording, Bobby asked Phil what he was supposed to do, to which Phil said, go to the bank. It's one of the great musical things of all time.

[Pat 40]

It absolutely is.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. Bobby Hatfield Gordon cast in Bluffton, South Carolina Michael, we know that well, I was so excited when I heard you had received some Leopold's Ice Cream. Bluffton is a stone's throw from Savannah, and a visit to Leopold's is a must anytime we head down that way. Some history Leopold's Ice Cream was founded in 1919 by three brothers from Greece. Famed lyricist Johnny Mercer grew up a block away from Leopold's and worked at the shop as a boy. I bet you know the words to Moon River. Of course I do. Fast forward to today. The business is operated by Stratton Leopold, youngest son, one of the organization founders. Does the name ring a bell? Stratton is an active member of the Hollywood motion picture community, serving as producer on such films as Mission Impossible 3, the sum of All Fears, the General's Daughter, Paycheck and Parker. He has worked on many other hits during his nearly 50 years in the film industry, including the Big Chill and John Carpenter as they Live. Props and posters from these films can be found in the shop today. It's a fun place to visit. Side note I grew up in Floral Park, New York, a flu block a few blocks from Sawanaka High School, which I know well. There was a Howard Johnson's not far away on Jericho Turnpike. My mom loved the Coffee ice cream at Hojos. Always makes me smile to hear you talk about Hojo's. Coffee ice cream is the best sort of large chain restaurant ice cream ever. It's the best. Howard Johnson.

[Pat 40]

But not around anymore, right?

[Tony Kornheiser]

No, not anymore. Carrie Costin. Casablanca, Godfather One, Godfather Two. That's it. That's the list. Okay.

[Pat 40]

Pretty good list.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Ryan Grove. In falling waters when what to my wondering eyes should appear. But my dad's chips, ever so near. Was in line for crabby fries at a Hagerstown Flying Boxcars game, a team in the Atlantic League and professional baseball. And saw my dad's chips for the first time in my life. So I had to try them. They were worth it. They were located ever so close to the Swedish fish. Nice try, but I will. Having no teeth problems today, picture included, for News Channel 8. Yeah, he's got the. There you go. It's great. I've never been to that ballpark.

[Pat 40]

Hagerstown.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Hagerstown. They do very nice ads on tv. Yeah, they want you to go.

[Pat 40]

Well, you're huge, Meredith.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Is that what it's called? Meredith Park? I'm not certain. Not sure. Doug Edwards, while driving on I15, often referred to the as the I95 of the West. The other morning, I was passed by a yellow Subaru with the custom license plate that read Corny. I was so stunned that I couldn't get my phone to take a picture. That and the fact that I'm old and would have taken pictures of anything but the plate. I can also assume, only assume, that you and PK Subban were driving to Edmonton to see the Cup Final. We're passing through Salt Lake City on your route. Next time you're driving by, look me up. I'll treat both of you to hot dogs at Costco right off the freeway. So it didn't take much of your time. I've never had that. People talk about the hot dogs at Costco as if they're very good.

[Pat 40]

Oh, yeah.

[Unknown]

It keeps you with your membership card.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Is that right?

[Unknown]

Yeah.

They lose money on them. That's what gets you in.

[Pat 40]

They've never changed the price on it.

[Unknown]

And they never will.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. What did it cost?

[Unknown]

$1.50.

[Tony Kornheiser]

What does a hot dog normally cost?

[Unknown]

I mean, five to seven dollars somewhere.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, really.

[Pat 40]

But whoever the head guy was, like, we could do anything, but we're not changing the price.

[Unknown]

I think the pizza recipe might have changed. And some people are still upset about the chicken.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Okay.

[Unknown]

Every day.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Here's a haiku from Shad for cheap spices. Beware the nutmeg industrial complex is always listening. Michael Benedetti in San Tan Valley in Arizona. Can't wait to hear about your neighbor's new electric powered big rig on next week's show. Ben in port. Whiny me. Port. It's whiny me. I used to live with a lingering shame of having given up on Moby Dick. I used to this pod provides a mysterious if you're out on you, nobody read it. Nobody read it if you're out on your bike. Tight, everyone, as always, do wear wide.

[J]

Good evening. Thank you for filling these seats tonight.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Sam. Hey.

[I]

I like to daydream get lost inside my head it's a puzzle I can figure out Circles round that roundabout Constant pandemonium bleached with the ammonia now ain't what I'm thinking about lucid you passing out the square Roly poly's graffiti on my tongue I got some fairies dancing around me won't tell me why I'm numb and maybe they don't like me but I don't give up Cause baby ties are moving slowly and me I'm falling up cuz I'm all I really got I don't get much attention I be fading, drifting off I'm in my own dimension lost Neverland get fly will be the pan I don't think not my head rolling from Camelot just in here is real subjects to my appeals Stupid little dots and happy little lovey knots Never much for basic prefer my girls like limes I'm a star, I'm gonna shine Keep staring you might go.

[J]

Blind boy whoa Tell me what you wanna be I know you dream shadow do your blood stain fingers flick these clothes Little Red Riding hood be a duck keep your pretty head down pillow don't you dare look up.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Just so.

[I]

You can be cutting copy paste this easy who you want to be Tell me, tell me now Tell me are you proud? They said life is too short, too late to make a sound Was never too late Set love upon your enemy Just drop into my eyes and baby I can set you free Tell me.

[J]

What you want to be I know you will never let me pre cold trying to find a place to go.

[Unknown]

Home.

[J]

Oh tell me what you want to be I know you will never let me free go Trying to find a place called home.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Sa over you.

[J]

I could be dumb, I could be kind I could be anything that you like what am I to do? They say to love another you love yourself but recently it seems that I just need some help but darling when you're here? All my problems fade away? But somehow I just know? That it can't be that way? You want some space? I want away? But if you choose to let me stay? I could be honest? I guess I know it won't work out? But I feel compelled? All my doubts? They say the love? You must love yourself? But recently it seems that I just need some help?

[Tony Kornheiser]

The?

[J]

Darling, when you're here? All my problems fade away? But somehow I just know that it can't be that way? They say to love another? You must love yourself? But recently it seems that I just need some help? Darling, when you're here? All my problems fade away? But somehow I just know that it can't be that way?

[Tony Kornheiser]

Sam.