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- [00:00]
Tony Kornheiser
Hey, it's Tony. On today's show, we will talk to Chuck Todd about the shooting at the White House correspondents dinner where he was. And we'll also talk to Michael Wilbon about the NFL draft and the NBA playoffs. And Tim Kirkjian calls in to talk about the Red Sox cleaning house over the weekend. But first, commerce.
- [00:15]
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- [01:03]
Tony Kornheiser
Previously on the Toni Kornheiser Show. I can't talk to her. I don't understand what she's feeling. I feel terrible about this and I'm losing sleep.
- [01:15]
Jingles/Producer
She's not sneaking snacks when you're going to bed, right?
- [01:17]
Tony Kornheiser
No, I don't think so.
- [01:18]
Eric DeLong
The refrigerator is prosciutto, maybe.
- [01:20]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, you know, No, I don't know
- [01:21]
Michael Wilbon
what she's doing now.
- [01:22]
Eric DeLong
Is this going to impact her status in the draft? You think she'll slide for this?
- [01:25]
Tony Kornheiser
They'll fix her up and she'll be the best safety in the league. The Tony Kornheiser show is on now from Gary Lupton in Fredericksburg, Virginia. The amount of sleep I get is determined by my dog's biological functions. Yeah.
- [01:42]
Chuck Todd
Accurate.
- [01:43]
Tony Kornheiser
Jeremy. In Ohio, I have two 13 year old dogs who are in excellent health. But one to two times per year they do get diarrhea. One thing Yvette recommended a few years ago was to sprinkle on their food each morning. Proviable dc a probiotic prebiotic digestive health supplement for dogs and cats. It's done wonders. Dr. Pearl has given us some powder to spread on top of her food. She is better now than she was for the last five days. She is trending upward. We are very happy about this.
- [02:12]
Eric DeLong
That's good.
- [02:13]
Tony Kornheiser
Very happy about this. I don't want to stop medication.
- [02:17]
Chuck Todd
No.
- [02:17]
Tony Kornheiser
I'm still a nervous wreck that she's going to wake me up no matter what happens. All right. So normally in this spot I would talk about The Nats going two and oh, over the weekend in Chicago, beating the White Sox, going extras, beating them late both times and beating them well both times and getting good relief work. I would talk about that and I would talk about all the golf I played. But we're not going to do that today because we are guest loaded today because of what happened at the White House Correspondents Dinner. People who are long listeners to this show or whatever I did on radio know that I've been to the White House Correspondents Dinner four or five, six times. I don't really remember I went in the days when it was, you know, a showcase for stars. Yeah. You know, you go because you want to look at all these people you've seen on television and in the movies and they're getting invited all the time. That stopped at some point. I don't, I don't know when I stopped going before that. I did get a couple of texts from my relatives and friends who said, were you there? And I was not there. I had been invited and never wanted to go and did not go. But it was a big enough deal that when you're sitting there, as I was watching actually the entire thing on C Span, just because I wanted to see if I knew anybody there in the crowd and I wanted to hear what Trump had to say. I did, cuz I sort of thought he might harangue everybody cuz he, he's not best pals with the press, the organized press, the White House coverage press. So I had it on, but I turned off because we were gonna wait a while for a speech. It was gonna. I didn't wanna keep watching. And I went to a ball game and then Carol comes running in from the other room and she says, there's shooting. And I say, oh, okay. So I went back and so I wanted to talk to anybody I knew who was there. And Chuck Todd is graciously going to talk with us. You were there, why were you there and where were you physically? And can you explain to people so they understand how far away the ballroom is from the lobby?
- [04:18]
Chuck Todd
Okay. Yes. On all of those things. So I was invited by National Journal. They're a former employer of mine. I hadn't been probably five or six years myself.
- [04:29]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [04:31]
Chuck Todd
Probably Since. Honestly, since pre Covid now.
- [04:34]
Tony Kornheiser
Me too. I'm sure it's 10 years for me. I'm sure.
- [04:36]
Michael Wilbon
Yeah.
- [04:37]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [04:38]
Chuck Todd
You know, there was a time I had work on Sunday mornings. So the last thing I wanted to do was go out on a Saturday night.
- [04:44]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [04:45]
Chuck Todd
But I, for a Variety of reasons, thought I should go. And I'll be honest, I had a little trepidation. I knew it was gonna be a ton of protesters. I knew Trump, I assumed Trump was gonna take a blowtorch to the press. Just, you know, eviscerate and, you know, and I'm not gonna lie, you think, great. Am I gonna get mentioned in that, in that or not? You know, wasn't, wasn't something I was looking forward to on that front. So I, you know, being somebody's been there enough. The number one thing I decided I want to do was avoid protesters. And I thought, all right, I used to live behind that hotel. Yeah, Knowledge. Yeah. So I made sure that Uber dropped me at 19th and T. And I thought, I'm going to walk. Unfortunately, it was raining. I was like, I'm going to walk just so I can avoid the Connecticut Avenue mess.
- [05:41]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [05:42]
Chuck Todd
For those that are local, that's sort of where all the protesters gather, where all the drop, most of the drop offs happen if you don't, if you don't know where you're going. So I was really proud of myself. I avoided all that mess. I got into the lobby basically behind, you know, going Florida was dropped off at 19th and T, just to give you some bearings and get in with no problems. Now, the way they set it up, the ballroom is basically like two floors below.
- [06:13]
Tony Kornheiser
It's way down the lobby. It's way down, way down.
- [06:16]
Michael Wilbon
Right. And
- [06:19]
Chuck Todd
the first perimeter of defense. I mean, the reason that hotel is used for this event and for a lot of big events, it's because they have a way to essentially cordon off all of that. They can have their regular hotel, they can have their hotel bar and the lobby and people that are staying there. And then there really is a way they can essentially just lock off, lock people from going, you know, if you don't have a ticket, and that's what people were checking, making sure you had a ticket.
- [06:48]
Tony Kornheiser
You have to go down two full flights stairs, and there are guards everywhere.
- [06:55]
Chuck Todd
And that's right.
- [06:55]
Tony Kornheiser
So. So somebody's not just walking. You can walk into a lobby, but you can't walk into this event. Can't, can't.
- [07:03]
Chuck Todd
No, you cannot do it. You cannot do it. And you, you go through mag. So anyway, you, the usual thing is you go down two flights, you go through the mags and you know, you go through the mags and you get wanded after you go through if they decide. So it's sort of a double, a double security check. And then you go down another two flights, Tony. Actually, right, you go. You go down, and then you go down. You sort of walk down these two staircases into the ballroom itself. I happen to be in the bowl, but towards. Essentially towards the entrance where all this happened. And it was. So, I would say it was about 8 o', clock, and all of we had. We had gotten. Everybody had finished their salad, the first remarks were over, and they basically said, we're going to bring dinner. And I think we were probably about 10 minutes away from Trump starting to do his speech, and the waitstaff came out all. All at once.
- [08:11]
Tony Kornheiser
That's how they do it.
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Chuck Todd
Yeah, that's right. Almost like a ballet.
- [08:14]
Tony Kornheiser
There's hundreds of people doing it. They're plating at the same time all the time.
- [08:19]
Chuck Todd
Yes, that's right. So they basically do the swap from appetizer from the salad to the entree, and it's a minute after that. And the reason, you know, you just sort of remembered being flooded because it's already a tight space. And then you throw in all the wait staff there for a second, and it's super tight. And people are still trying to mingle a little bit from table to table.
- [08:41]
Tony Kornheiser
Not as much, but they're at the table. I want to make this clear. They're at the tables now. They're not milling around. There's not.
- [08:47]
Tim Kirkjian
We're all at tables.
- [08:48]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay.
- [08:49]
Chuck Todd
Yeah. We're not really milling. You know, there's a couple people doing that, but we're not really at that point. And then all of a sudden, I hear pop, pop, pop.
- [08:58]
Tony Kornheiser
Oh, you do?
- [09:00]
Chuck Todd
Oh, yeah, I heard the pop, pop, pop. And you're like. But it was. It was. Are we sure that was. Was that gunshots? You know, it was like one of those. Yeah, gunshots. That couldn't have been gunshots. And for like a split second, it's not. You don't think it is. And then somebody says, shots. And then, you know, everybody gets down, including the waitstaff.
- [09:23]
Tony Kornheiser
On. Under the table. On the floor.
- [09:25]
Chuck Todd
Everybody goes down onto the floor.
- [09:27]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [09:28]
Chuck Todd
I will confess, I was one of the last people to go down on the floor. It was like. I just kept like, where is this happening? Is this. Anyway, so you get down. There's poor one waitstaff that was next to me was hysterical. She was like, I knew I shouldn't have taken this. I shouldn't have done this. She was just scre. You just. I just fell for it is she was so scared. Right. And you didn't know. All of a sudden, you sort of look up you can see. And the place is teeming with law enforcement, because if you think about it, right, you have, obviously, at Secret Service there, you have Capitol Police, because there's members of Congress that have capital. Their protection is Capitol Police, not Secret Service. You have some marshals there, because you have some Cabinet secretaries there. And in some cases, it's U.S. marshals, not just Secret Service. That's their security detail. So the places. I mean, you look up and there's already 100 people essentially, walking between the tables, all with guns pulled, essentially.
- [10:32]
Michael Wilbon
Just.
- [10:32]
Chuck Todd
You could tell they're just making sure there's nothing in there. And, you know, I'm looking up, just wondering, is there anybody hurt? Did somebody get shot in the ballroom? And then you start to realize, hey, there's no ambulance, there's no paramedics. There's nothing here. And so, you know, without anybody saying anything, you sort of like, okay, this isn't happening in here, right?
- [10:56]
Tony Kornheiser
That's right.
- [10:57]
Chuck Todd
And then all of a sudden, you start to see, I'd say almost like about every 20 seconds, a security detail grabbed their principal. So I saw Pete Hegseth get escorted out. Then you see Scott Besant, the Treasury Secretary, get escorted out. Then I see Steve Scalise get escorted out. You just start to see anybody that had a security detail was taken out of there. Then we're all sitting there. Anything. And I'll be honest, I'm like, great, we're gonna get locked down on here. We're all not 100% sure. All we have is TMZ's reporting. Okay? You know that there is that shots were fired in the lobby. So this is all we know in the room at the moment. I'll share this little part. We. We sort of look at each other at the table we're all sitting at. None of us really knew each other that well there. I mean, I knew the. The person and a couple people from National Journal. So I'll be honest. We all look at each other, we pick up a glass, and we're like, well, we're never going to forget this, you know. You know, it's just one of those things where, like, we're never going to forget who we were sitting next to this woman. Nicole and I had this. This guy, Eduardo. And it's like. It's one of those moments. You're like, you know, so, you know, I'm glad we're all safe and all this stuff at about 10 minutes after that. And, you know, at this point, you know, where everybody there is a reporter, right? So we're all trying to find out more information. We're all going up to different people. We're all, you know, sort of comparing notes. And then I see that they've got a far door open, and I'm like, maybe they're gonna let us go. And then they start to say, you have to go. So I say, all right, I'm. I take off, and you start to see this choke point, because they say, you can't go that way. That's a crime scene. And that's what they called it. Like, that's a crime scene. And that it's the. Now. Now I know where all this was happening.
- [13:09]
Michael Wilbon
Right.
- [13:10]
Chuck Todd
So the reason it sounded like a muffle pop, pop, pop is because it happened to essentially two floors above.
- [13:17]
Tony Kornheiser
Two floors above. Yes.
- [13:19]
Chuck Todd
Yes. We could hear it, but it happened two floors above us. And so, you know, this is something that I've been going on and off to this dinner since the mid-90s. That is the first perimeter. And it held. All right, whatever anybody wants to talk about security. It helped.
- [13:37]
Tony Kornheiser
Yes.
- [13:37]
Michael Wilbon
Right.
- [13:38]
Tim Kirkjian
There was.
- [13:38]
Chuck Todd
There was. I mean, you know, it. He didn't get through the first ring of security, and there were, like, three or four more other rings before they would even gotten remotely close to the president. Now, you know, I was sitting close enough to that door that maybe I'm. Maybe I don't make it past the second ring of security. I will. I will confess to that when you start to look at that. But we were.
- [14:00]
Tim Kirkjian
It worked.
- [14:01]
Chuck Todd
That part of the security worked. So, anyway, we're evacuating. There's this choke point, and I'm looking around going, I'll just be honest with you, Tony. I was like, I don't want to be in this herd of sheep here.
- [14:14]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah. Yeah.
- [14:15]
Chuck Todd
So I start, like. Well, for evacuating, I'm following exit signs. So I start going down another hallway, and then I'm like, kind of a pied Piper. All of a sudden, a whole bunch of people start following me. We go through the kitchen.
- [14:30]
Tony Kornheiser
Through the kitchen. Wow.
- [14:32]
Chuck Todd
A hotel staffer recognizes me, and he. And he says, come through here.
- [14:36]
Michael Wilbon
Come through here.
- [14:37]
Tony Kornheiser
Wow.
- [14:37]
Chuck Todd
People. People are going out here. And all of a sudden, I'm on Wyoming.
- [14:43]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [14:43]
Michael Wilbon
You know.
- [14:44]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [14:44]
Chuck Todd
Right behind it.
- [14:45]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [14:46]
Chuck Todd
And so at that point, I'm like, all right, I'm gonna walk as far away from this area and get an Uber. So I start walking on my. I get up to the corner of Columbia and Wyoming, and they're the Fettermans.
- [15:01]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [15:01]
Chuck Todd
You don't miss John Fetterman.
- [15:02]
Tony Kornheiser
No, because he's wearing something out of the 1400s.
- [15:06]
Eric DeLong
He's like six, a big cloak and
- [15:08]
Tony Kornheiser
he's eight feet tall.
- [15:09]
Chuck Todd
Yeah, well, that's right, that's right. He had his dragon with him and his sword, right?
- [15:14]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [15:16]
Chuck Todd
And so I'm friendly. He's fairly friendly with him. He's always, he was actually my first guest on my, this version of the podcast. So he's always been very, he's very nice to me for, for a variety of reasons. Anyway, so he's offering. He's like, yeah, we're looking for our, our drivers. Looking for, seeing he can get through. And then he gets a ride. He and his wife offered me a ride. I was like, no, no, no, I'm gonna go up. So I walk up to Columbia and we're sort of 18th and Columbia all come together there.
- [15:51]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [15:51]
Chuck Todd
And Adams Mill. I start essentially walking towards Woodley. Get an Uber and get home. And originally my wife. I will give you this one little. Not making this little anecdote up. So as I'm walking out the door, I, you know, my wife was going to meet me. We were going to go to one of the after parties and she was going to meet me at a certain time. We, trust me, we had napped and everything. Right. To try to. And as I'm walking out the door at 6pm I said, I hope I'm not making a mistake. And she goes, why are you saying that? I'm like, I don't know. I just, you know, whether it was what, what? You know, whether it was what he was going to say, whatever it was, it was just a ton of trepidation. Well, let's just say I've, I've thought about that statement. Considering what actually happened.
- [16:38]
Tony Kornheiser
Were there quite a bit in the old days, not that long ago, 10, 12, 15 years ago, when it was star studded, Was there anybody like that that you saw like that? Nobody this time.
- [16:50]
Michael Wilbon
Right.
- [16:50]
Chuck Todd
It was all, was all very political.
- [16:53]
Tony Kornheiser
Right.
- [16:55]
Chuck Todd
A few influencers, I think, on the, you know, in the, in the influencer space.
- [17:00]
Michael Wilbon
But did you see like there wasn't
- [17:03]
Chuck Todd
the cast of Modern Family.
- [17:05]
Tony Kornheiser
Right. Okay.
- [17:06]
Chuck Todd
I remember the first time I met Tommy Lasorda was at a White House correspondence there.
- [17:10]
Tony Kornheiser
Did you see the people taking the President out?
- [17:15]
Chuck Todd
I did not.
- [17:15]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay.
- [17:16]
Chuck Todd
Because we, you know, as we all went down, all of that happened and then by the time we looked up, they were gone.
- [17:21]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah. And good, good that it works. You don't want it tested, but good that it works. You Mentioned after parties. One of the things about the White House Correspondents Dinner is that when it's over at a relatively early time, everybody fans out usually to go to the Vanity Fair or something like that. I imagine they were all stopped canceled though. I don't know this. I imagine they went on.
- [17:44]
Chuck Todd
Apparently there were two big ones. One was hosted by NBC and one was hosted by Ms. Now because they're now separate.
- [17:53]
Tony Kornheiser
Right.
- [17:54]
Chuck Todd
So they had competing after parties, but they both went on. They apparently. I didn't look, I was, I look, I wasn't gonna go into any closed in spaces.
- [18:04]
Tony Kornheiser
No, that's, that's understandable. Is it, is it rescheduled? Are they going to have it again?
- [18:09]
Chuck Todd
They're talking about it. I can't imagine. You know, that's not the easiest thing to reschedule in Washington DC.
- [18:17]
Tony Kornheiser
Right.
- [18:17]
Chuck Todd
Especially when you've got over the next six weeks a slew of America 250 events.
- [18:24]
Tony Kornheiser
That's right, that's.
- [18:25]
Chuck Todd
And freedom and all this stuff that's coming. And you know, it is, you know, so I don't, I just can't imagine how they do it on that front. But there's two security, if you're, if you're wondering because there's a lot of chatter about the security loopholes. It is true that I just had to show proof of a ticket in order to get into the hotel that night before I got to the magnetometer.
- [18:50]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, I understand the shooter was a guest in the hotel and had been there.
- [18:54]
Chuck Todd
That's right. See, there are two loopholes from the shooter. Loophole one is he took the train. Yeah. You ever, you ever been X rayed? You ever had any of your stuff X rayed on a train?
- [19:04]
Tony Kornheiser
No.
- [19:05]
Chuck Todd
Exactly. And loophole two was checking into the hotel and it's right out, it's right out of the movie in the Line of Fire. I mean, it's the John Malkovich character. I think he checks into the hotel, right?
- [19:14]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So. Well, well thought out, well planned on his part.
- [19:19]
Tim Kirkjian
He.
- [19:20]
Tony Kornheiser
This was not random, Tony.
- [19:23]
Tim Kirkjian
He got a degree from Caltech.
- [19:25]
Chuck Todd
Basically the west coast mit.
- [19:27]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [19:28]
Chuck Todd
This is a super smart person, as the president might say. A high IQ person.
- [19:35]
Tony Kornheiser
No, scary.
- [19:37]
Chuck Todd
Scarily so.
- [19:38]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah. Well, I'm glad you're safe and that everybody was safe. Nobody was hurt, right?
- [19:44]
Chuck Todd
Nobody was hurt. I mean if people got, might have like ding themselves like you know, crouching down under tables. But you know, look, I tell you something, I was worried. I was like, well, I hope nobody's trigger happy or anything. Like that. But look, man, the security did its job good. Secret Service did its job. I know. You know, there's always this if. If something happens and you have to. Basically, if you're not 100%, you're not. You're not doing your job. But I know how we in Washington, we always want to. Want to beat this up. As the security system was planned, it worked. Now, you can have a debate about whether that should change, whether TSA should start screening people that check into the hotel who happen to be staying there during the.
- [20:31]
Tim Kirkjian
Right.
- [20:31]
Chuck Todd
But if you think about it, that isn't something you would expect the Hilton to do.
- [20:36]
Tony Kornheiser
No, no.
- [20:37]
Chuck Todd
Yeah.
- [20:37]
Tony Kornheiser
No.
- [20:38]
Chuck Todd
In fairness, but that might. That might change or they try to move this somewhere else.
- [20:45]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, it's the biggest hotel in the city. It accommodates this better than any place else. You do it, trust me. Unless you build a ballroom.
- [20:54]
Chuck Todd
If you try to move it, though, there is no other hotel can do it. You have to go to the convention center and the car. Honestly, the cost of that is prohibitive for the. For the White House. Remember, this is not a dinner. This is not a presidential dinner. This is the white.
- [21:09]
Tony Kornheiser
This is a private organization of reporters.
- [21:12]
Chuck Todd
This is the trade association.
- [21:14]
Tony Kornheiser
Yes, yes, yes.
- [21:15]
Michael Wilbon
Okay.
- [21:16]
Chuck Todd
No different than when the realtors get together. No different than when the, you know, U.S. chamber gets together. It's the. You know, it just happens that we invited a lot of celebrities for 30 years and made. Made it a tad more interesting than your average trade association dinner.
- [21:29]
Tony Kornheiser
Glad you're safe. Glad everybody's safe.
- [21:31]
Eric DeLong
I just want to clarify one thing. There was. One of the Secret Service agents was shot, but he was wearing a chest.
- [21:36]
Michael Wilbon
Yes,
- [21:39]
Chuck Todd
you're absolutely right. Yes, there was one, but, yeah, he's okay.
- [21:42]
Tony Kornheiser
And this fellow who everyone thinks did it is alive. And, you know, we're gonna find stuff out. Yeah, this is.
- [21:52]
Chuck Todd
Yeah, we are.
- [21:53]
Tony Kornheiser
We're gonna find out. Thank you, Chuck. Glad you're safe.
- [21:55]
Chuck Todd
Okay, Chuck Todd.
- [21:56]
Tony Kornheiser
Boys and girls, that was not just so we know that doesn't break the code. That was not political. That was something that happened, and we know somebody who was there. And. And I hope that makes us all better for knowing these things, particularly that people were safe and security worked. We will come back with Michael Wilbon. I'm Tony Kornheiser. This is the Tony Kornheiser Show. Let's be honest, Mother's Day gifts can get a little predictable. They're nice, but they aren't home runs. And the older you get, the more you realize how much Moms actually do the stuff you didn't fully appreciate growing up, so it feels like they deserve something a little more lasting. And that's where Aura Frames comes in. Instead of something that fades after a few days, it's a gift that keeps evolving. You can keep adding photos and videos over time so it never feels static. It's also super easy to set up and it comes packaged beautifully so you don't have to overthink the presentation. It's just a more meaningful way to say thank you for everything past and present. Make Mother's Day special with Aura Frames. Name number one by wirecutter. You can save on the gift Mom's love by visiting auraframes.com for a limited time. Listeners can get $25 off their best selling Carver Mat frame with code Tony K. That's A u r auraframes.com promo code Tony K. And when you check out, let them know you heard about Aura Frames from us. Terms and conditions apply.
- [23:21]
Michael Wilbon
You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show.
- [23:25]
Tony Kornheiser
Mother's Day is coming up. And you know when you're a kid, you don't really notice everything moms did for you, like helping you buy socks and making sure they were the right size or helping to plant potatoes every spring all the time. You may not have appreciated it, but now you get it. She's always in your corner. She always will be. So yeah, Mother's Day matters. You got to get it right. And honestly, the easiest way? Books. That's short for bouquets. And how about this? You can get 25% off your order just for listening to this show. These aren't just flowers that cut fresh from the best farms. They're bigger, brighter, they last way longer. Some even grow on the side of a volcano. You can send a vibrant bouquet or even go big with a monthly subscription. So mom gets a little moment of joy again and again. And when she smiles, you'll know you nailed it. Plus, There are over 55,000 five star reviews, so you know it's legit. It'll take you like two minutes to get it all done. Pick the bouquet, set the delivery date and you're set. And with 25% off, you can grab something for your wife, your aunt, your grandma. Cover all your bases. Mother's Day's May 10th. Don't wait. Go to boogs.com use code Tony for 25% off. That's B O U Q S.com promo code Tony boost.com we've had these things. They're good.
- [24:35]
Michael Wilbon
This is The Tony Kornheiser Show. Tony Kornheiser show
- [24:42]
Tony Kornheiser
this is Dan Mangan. This is a song called Melody. It's sent to us by John back. He says I've got Dan Mangan on the job sending you some permission in a couple of songs. But I'm just a 20 plus year fan of the show that's had a couple of meetings with this great singer songwriter who can always benefit from more exposure. Yeah, he's really good. Dan Mangan and it is called Melody and it plays in Michael Wilbon and we'll get to the NBA because you have to get to the NBA. But we got to start with the draft because Wilbon the last couple of years has been involved with the Chicago Bears draft after as never before. How much attention did you pay to it and over how many days and what are your thoughts?
- [25:25]
Michael Wilbon
100%. Over all three days? Yeah, 100%. So you know, I started obsessing over it when the Bears made the trade that would also wind up bringing Caleb Williams to Chicago. So that trade is finally finished and it's like half their starting lineup came from that trade. But that is what got me into it as I had never, literally never been into it before. So you know, I mean the last month like waking up at 3:30 in the morning reading scouting reports and stuff, you know, I was lost by mind so.
- [26:02]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, I told you on the phone, I believe you are doing this because you honestly believe in your heart that the Bears are good, getting better and can be a championship contender and that's why you're interested.
- [26:14]
Michael Wilbon
Well, but I'm, I'm, you know they've been championship contenders before. I mean they've been in Super Bowls, they've been in NFC title games. Not many, not the, not recently, you
- [26:24]
Tony Kornheiser
know, not the last 10 years.
- [26:27]
Michael Wilbon
Well, yeah, yeah, the last 10 years.
- [26:28]
Tony Kornheiser
10.
- [26:29]
Michael Wilbon
Yeah, 2000. Well, 20, 18 was double doink. I mean when you get, when you have those games, you know you're, you, you're, you're pretty good. Team's pretty good. When you win a division you get a buy. You, you, you can win. And so, but yeah, this is, this is, I don't know, I've lost my mind here.
- [26:47]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, you have, you called me up and you were attacking Ben Johnson and
- [26:51]
Michael Wilbon
this is, yeah, because we chose because we need an edge rusher. And so the single obsessive thing in Chicago this week now that the Cubs 10 game winning streak ended in LA, is that the Bears didn't choose an edge rusher. They didn't Choose a pass rusher. We had like the 3 30th most effective pass rush in the league last year and didn't just pass rusher. And so this is a thing. This is a thing for everyone. Everyone, not just me and Ben Johnson chose another tight end and a receiver who runs a four two eight. So what can he run four two eight to the quarterback. So it's a thing. And there are people who believe that. Interesting. I mean, if you're going to. Coaches get obsessed. You and I have known coaches in every sport who are great, who are brilliant, and they get obsessed and they have to be talked off stuff just like the rest of us. And sometimes the GM can do that. Sometimes the owner has to step in or president, if there's a president of operations and mediate disputes on draft days. These things are broken. Jerry Jones and Jimmie Johnson, control of the board. The draft board is not a small thing. It's an enormous thing. And I, like. The Bears chose. The Bears had six players chosen, I guess seven in the three days. I like five of them a lot. I may even like six of them. But the one that we didn't take could be the one that keeps us out of, you know, from getting to, you know, Dak Prescott, you know, in January, on a Saturday or Sunday. So, yeah, the obsession, it lives. And now I thought, okay, I'm going to go to sleep Sunday night. This is over. I'm going to, like, be a normal person. No, because now you have to grade the draft and you have to read everybody out there who's graded the draft, and you're on just your draft. So it's, you know, I've joined a sick legion of people.
- [29:02]
Tony Kornheiser
Yes, you have. I am so happy to not have anything to do with that legion of people because I maintain that you will not know about the draft. With certain exceptions, positions like wide receiver, running back and offensive line, you can tell quickly. You can tell. Particularly running back, you can tell really quickly. But other positions that are more nuanced, it's, you know, it takes a while. It takes a while to figure it out. Right? Takes a while.
- [29:30]
Michael Wilbon
But last year's Bears draft class was spectacular. I mean, Colson Loveland, for one, you know, it took five weeks until they put in the starting lineup. And so it didn't take very long. And so. And you know, that spoiled us because you get seven. We had a rookie running back who turned out to be fabulous. Running back, yeah. But we also had a guy who was taken in the middle rounds and wound up being Starting left tackle. So, yeah, it can, but. And plus, Tony, nobody sits anymore. They have to play them right away because of the salary structure. I mean, the economic structure of the NFL demands it. So quarterbacks, the last seven quarterbacks. Baker Mayfield is the last quarterback taken high in the draft who did not play day one. So if Fernando.
- [30:18]
Tony Kornheiser
He's not playing day one. They got Kirk Cousins for that. He's not going to play day one.
- [30:22]
Michael Wilbon
He shouldn't. You can't imagine if Kirk Cousins is healthy, that kid will play game one. No, but Caleb Williams did. All those guys.
- [30:32]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, but you didn't have, you didn't have a guy who, who steps in and can be a competent, if not quite good, starting quarterback.
- [30:43]
Michael Wilbon
They purposely did not do that without paying a veteran quarterback. That.
- [30:46]
Tony Kornheiser
That's right. They didn't do that.
- [30:47]
Michael Wilbon
So again, the economic structure made demand something else. So that is, you know, at some point, you know, I will have to let go of the draft this week. I don't know when.
- [30:58]
Tony Kornheiser
At some point. Are you happy with the Cubs?
- [31:00]
Michael Wilbon
Right?
- [31:00]
Tony Kornheiser
You're very happy with the Cubs. They have no pictures in their winnings.
- [31:04]
Michael Wilbon
We went to LA and we're lucky to get game one after being down four nothing and then lost the next two badly. And now we go to San Diego, which is no better. So it's a tough, short road trip.
- [31:19]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, but they're. They're doing well.
- [31:21]
Michael Wilbon
They're doing well and they. And we have no pictures. We have like, nine pitchers on a disabled list.
- [31:26]
Tony Kornheiser
All right, let me get. Let me get to the NBA. What is in your mind, the most surprising series at the moment?
- [31:36]
Michael Wilbon
I don't, I don't think there's a surprise. Well, la. Houston. Yes, L.A. houston, three one, Lakers. Houston is a dog outfit. They are just. They're awful. It was great to hear Perk. On what night was it? Friday or Saturday night? They run together now on late SportsCenter. Just come on and say Houston's the dumbest team in the playoffs in years. It was just because I think everybody felt that way, who watched them. They played dumb. They are dumb. And that they didn't go out and get a point guard, even though Fred Van Vliet got hurt in June and they couldn't figure out that he needed a point guard. And so it's like, okay, just ask Kevin Durant to bring up the ball, you know, really? Because he's got a bad knee and nine turnovers in the game. How does that look? How's that going for you? And so for the Houston Rockets, a team with real aspirations and some terrific young players to be that stupid in the postseason. It's a real disappointment in addition to a surprise that the lakers without got
- [32:44]
Tony Kornheiser
two guys without 57 points. 57 points.
- [32:48]
Michael Wilbon
They're up three one now. Houston blew the Lakers out last night for the second game in Houston. They did, but you know, it goes back to LA now. Could. Is Houston good enough to get a game? Yeah, of course. But I don't know. I don't. I don't know that they can. And it looks like now Luca and Reeves are going to wind up back in the lineup for the next series if the lake or late in this series if it gets late.
- [33:17]
Tony Kornheiser
So that's your biggest surprise. Detroit. Orlando is not.
- [33:22]
Michael Wilbon
Not, not. Yeah, they are. It's 2:1. Yes, it is.
- [33:26]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [33:27]
Michael Wilbon
But you know, there's an asterisk because Orlando was. This is what we thought they were. What they're doing now.
- [33:35]
Tony Kornheiser
Right.
- [33:35]
Michael Wilbon
Is what we thought they were, not what they did all season. So here they are with Bankero and Franz Wagner. When you have those two players and they're young vets, they've been around three, four years now. When you have those two players and Suggs and point guard, you. You need to be a top four team in the East. They didn't play like it. They had to play their way in. But yeah, Tony, so that would be the second. If there's. If you want to call it a surprise in the east, that would be it.
- [34:06]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah. I mean, I'm one of those people who has said repeatedly I can't believe the Lakers won any games at all without Doncic and Reeves.
- [34:14]
Michael Wilbon
Right.
- [34:14]
Tony Kornheiser
And now I'll ask you this. What happens to Minnesota? Whoa, that's a 3:1. That means that Denver has to win three in a row.
- [34:23]
Michael Wilbon
Yes.
- [34:24]
Tony Kornheiser
Minnesota was on the verge of knocking them out. They defended Jokic with Gobert and amazingly it worked. It did. It worked.
- [34:33]
Michael Wilbon
And they did it like they did it two years ago when Denver was defending champ.
- [34:36]
Tony Kornheiser
So now what?
- [34:37]
Michael Wilbon
And Minnesota got rid of them.
- [34:38]
Tony Kornheiser
Now what?
- [34:40]
Michael Wilbon
So they're without their starting backcourt. Divincenzo with the torn Achilles is obviously done for a year, be done next season. 2. And. And Ant Man Anthony Edwards, it said weeks. Said to be out two weeks.
- [34:54]
Tony Kornheiser
Weeks.
- [34:55]
Michael Wilbon
So he's not going to play the rest of this series. So the question is, can Minnesota get either a game in Denver? That game might be tonight. Can they get a game in Denver tonight? Games game five. And if they don't, can they get game six back In Minneapolis without those guys. In the meantime, there's a secondary story going on there which affects me and this has angered Chicago even more than not taking an edge rusher.
- [35:33]
Tony Kornheiser
What?
- [35:34]
Michael Wilbon
So when the Bulls dismantled their team because the general manager didn't know what to do and they didn't know how to tank and they couldn't get any of it right, in February at the trade deadline, they trade a second round draft pick. IO de Sumo grew up on the south side of Chicago. Morgan Park High School, the University of Illinois, known quantity only in Chicago. Bulls took him in the second round, much like another Chicago point guard was taken in the second round named Jalen Brunson a few years ago. IO Decimo is chosen and he's a really consistent player off the bench for the Bulls. He would have been not in the top three for six, man, but you know, like fifth or six. But he was consistent and professional and smart. And you looked at him and you said, okay, whatever you do, you're not going to say a guy was chosen in the second round is untouchable, just like Brunson wasn't untouchable.
- [36:30]
Tony Kornheiser
That's right.
- [36:31]
Michael Wilbon
When Dallas stupidly let him go to New York. But you say IO Decimo, this is a guy you want. He represents you. He lives there. He knows this team. This is what he grew up dying to do. They trade him for a bag of beans. A second round pick. He scored 43 points.
- [36:53]
Tony Kornheiser
I thought I'd never heard his name.
- [36:54]
Michael Wilbon
Place of Anthony Edwards.
- [36:55]
Tony Kornheiser
I never heard his name.
- [36:58]
Michael Wilbon
I've heard it.
- [36:59]
Tony Kornheiser
43. Well, you heard it because he's local for you. I'd never heard of him.
- [37:03]
Michael Wilbon
Yes.
- [37:03]
Tony Kornheiser
46.
- [37:04]
Michael Wilbon
Yeah, this is like. This is like. I don't know who's the lady? Who's the last great player to grow up here in D.C. and he goes away and you, you. He doesn't go away. You trade him away.
- [37:19]
Tony Kornheiser
It's not Markel Fultz and you.
- [37:22]
Michael Wilbon
It could be. It could be Markel, folks. And you trade him away, you got nothing. Your team's an embarrassment. Your team is more irrelevant than the franchise has ever been in its 60 year history. And that kid shows up three months later in the NBA playoffs and he's a diamond.
- [37:42]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, well, all right. All right, I'll see you later. We can talk about all of this on the PTI program. I'll see you later.
- [37:50]
Michael Wilbon
Sounds good.
- [37:50]
Tony Kornheiser
Michael Wilbon, boys and girls. We will take a break. We will come back with Tim Kirchen and we will talk about the firing. Not just of Alex Cora, but of Alex Cora's many lieutenants. I'm Tony Kornheiser.
- [38:03]
Michael Wilbon
You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show. The Tony Kornheiser Show.
- [38:11]
Tony Kornheiser
Once again, this is Dan Mangan. This is a song called Peaks and Valleys. And, Michael, if people who have original music like Dan Mangan want to send us their music to get a place played on the show, how do they go about it?
- [38:25]
Jingles/Producer
Send us your music by emailing it to jinglesonyconnizershow.com Quite good?
- [38:29]
Eric DeLong
Oh, yes, quite good.
- [38:30]
Tony Kornheiser
Lovely plays in Tim Kirchen. There's, you know, baseball is overshadowed this week by the draft. Baseball is overshadowed this week by the playoffs in both the NBA and hockey, and I understand that. I sit and watch the gnats. That's me. I don't think that I represent a tremendous amount of people, but I am concerned with baseball. But even. Even if you're not. Alex Cora got fired from the Boston Red Sox. I think, like, hours after they had beaten the Orioles 19 to 1 or something like that. 17.
- [39:05]
Chuck Todd
1.
- [39:05]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, 17 to 1. And it wasn't just Alex Cora. Five of his top guys got fired, too. They just said, get out of here. Don't come back in the morning. Get out of here. Now, Tim Kirchhoin has seen this a lot in his life, but this is early in the year. This is a team with a large payroll. This is a team that has had success in recent years, if not last year, if not right now. What are your thoughts about the broom that's sweeping out the. You know, the architects of the team in Boston?
- [39:40]
Tim Kirkjian
Well, Tony, I haven't seen this that much. That's the point. The manager and five coaches in one sweep. I don't. I got asked about five different times by five different people yesterday. Have you ever seen this many guys go in? Tony, as we know, when I first started covering and when you were covering a long time ago, we only had five coaches.
- [40:04]
Tony Kornheiser
That's it. That's all you had?
- [40:05]
Tim Kirkjian
Now we have 18, which is absolutely absurd.
- [40:07]
Tony Kornheiser
That's just like basketball. Three rows of coaches. Get out of here. Red Holtzman had no assistant coaches. Get out of here. All right, go ahead.
- [40:16]
Tim Kirkjian
Now we have three assistant hitting coaches. Not the point. The point is I did not see this coming. I don't know anyone in baseball that did see this coming. I left spring training after a long chat with Alex Cora thinking the Red Sox are going to be better than they were last year when they made the playoffs. And they are a dangerous team. In the American League East. And instead, they have played poorly on every level, especially offensively. Tony, on the day he got fired, they were tied for the fewest home runs in baseball with 18, and they had the fewest stolen bases with eight. And offensively, they were just inept and they didn't pitch particularly well, especially since, you know, their best pitcher has. Garrett Crochet hasn't been very good this year. So to blame the manager for this is. Is. I just don't understand. And I have seen that many, many times, Tony, where they fire the manager just to get a new voice. The difference here is Alex Cora's voice was very deeply respected in that clubhouse, and that's what made this such a surprise to so many people.
- [41:32]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay, so here are the logical questions that one asks. And we can all agree it seems early. It may not be the right head that has to be chopped off, but who does this? How high does it go? Where is the agreement?
- [41:46]
Dan Mangan
Who.
- [41:46]
Tony Kornheiser
Who is behind this?
- [41:48]
Tim Kirkjian
Well, Craig Breslow is the general manager of the team now. He's Ivy League educated, Tony. He's a really smart guy, and he pitched in the major leagues, so he's got a lot of boxes already checked. But now this is all on him. And in his defense, if that is the correct term, he did not hire Alex Cora to be his manager. And every general manager has the right to say, I need my own guy in there. And clearly these two were not their own guys. So I see what Craig Breslow was doing, but this is now entirely on him. This is his team. He essentially built this team. He was one that traded Raphael Devers to the Giants when they couldn't get him to play first base. He was the guy that didn't get Alex Bregman to resign and play third base for the Red Sox. And that's not to say these were terrible moves, but his fingerprints are all over this team. And now he's got his own manager, at least in an interim basis, to run the team. So ownership is, as has a lot to do with it.
- [42:56]
Tony Kornheiser
That's what I want to ask you. What about the. They've got to sign off. They got to say good.
- [43:01]
Tim Kirkjian
Yes. And ownership there is hard to read. John Henry has been the owner there for quite some time, but, you know, when he doesn't even speak at the press conference, when the manager is fired, to me, is not a particularly good sign of a. Of a beautifully run organization. So I think the owner has to take a little bit more of. Have a little bit more input. And importance in, you know, in this final decision, even though it was clear from the Red Sox owners this was the general manager's decision.
- [43:37]
Tony Kornheiser
So I want to stress something here for people that aren't used to firings and how this works. Coaches get fired all the time. General managers get fired all the time. They don't have palace coups where coaches go. They don't have this where five or six guys are told and you get out of here too. I, I am not familiar with that, are you?
- [43:59]
Tim Kirkjian
No, Tony, that was my point is that they took all of Alex Cora's guys and said, you're one of Alex's guys, you have to go get out.
- [44:07]
Chuck Todd
And.
- [44:07]
Tim Kirkjian
Yeah, and that just doesn't make any sense. And Jason Veratech.
- [44:11]
Tony Kornheiser
Yes. The red side guy.
- [44:13]
Tim Kirkjian
Yeah. Now he's being reassigned, so he'll have another job in the organization if he wants one. But I mean, this is one of the, this is a championship caliber switch hitting catcher on some really good teams and one of the most respected guys in the organization. And he went too.
- [44:33]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah.
- [44:33]
Tim Kirkjian
So again, this is what separated. This is a complete house cleaning there. And I was, I just did not see this coming.
- [44:43]
Tony Kornheiser
And the new manager is who and from where?
- [44:46]
Tim Kirkjian
He's Chad Tracy. He's the son of Jim Tracy who's managing the major league. So he's got, you know, a good resume. And this is the most important thing, Tony. He has managed in the minor league system for the Red Sox and the Red Sox are built with a lot of young players. He has dealt with most of those young players along the way. And part of the thinking, I was told, is that he can relate to them really well because he's had them somewhere along the way. I understand what that's all about. But to suggest that Alex Cora is too much of a. He's only a veterans manager guy, that's just not true. His touch with people, especially with players, even with young players, is exceptionally good. He's one of the best managers that, that I've known over the last few years and I. But they brought in somebody who has, you know, more experience with these guys on the minor league level.
- [45:46]
Tony Kornheiser
When was the last time the Red Sox fired a guy in the middle? How long ago is that?
- [45:52]
Tim Kirkjian
Well, that's a good question. I mean, they fired Tito Francona after they lost Baltimore and they fired Grady Little after they at Yankee Stadium on Aaron Boone's walk off homer. So I wish I knew, Tony. I'm supposed to know these.
- [46:08]
Tony Kornheiser
Well, it's okay, because the point is it's a long time. That's not how they do it. That's not how that team does it. And my next note was. And the Mets guy still has his job. That guy has his job.
- [46:21]
Tim Kirkjian
Yeah, it's. And the Mets, by the way, have, have been swept four times already this year. They just scored three runs in a three game series against the Rockies. They just got swept at home by the Rockies. Now look, I'm not blaming Carlos Mendoza for that either. However, if Alex Cora wants another job, he's going to get another job because the Mets are failing at the moment and the Phillies are in a complete free fall. So there will be other jobs available. He will not be the only one to go during a season.
- [46:59]
Tony Kornheiser
I had written that down to Is Rob Thompson in trouble in Philadelphia? This is someone who they turn to when they did fire someone in the middle. And then Rob Thompson worked wonders immediately. And the Philadelphia Phillies over the last five years have been a solid playoff team and a World Series contender. And they look like, they look like they need something to happen. Is he somebody who would get fired?
- [47:25]
Tim Kirkjian
I don't think he's going to get fired. I don't think. Think he, I know he shouldn't be fired. He's done an excellent job with that team. But never forget that. Dave Domrowski is the general manager for the Phillies and one of his guys along the way has been Alex Cora, especially when they were together in Boston. But Tony, this is, this is how baseball works. The game is so difficult to play that good players are not good for long stretches of time and it affects your team. The Phillies are supposed to be good. The Mets should be way better than this. Red Sox way better. But only in baseball can supposedly good teams be this bad in the first month of the season, which opens up all sorts of jobs and situations.
- [48:10]
Tony Kornheiser
Are there any other managers you know of or can point to that you feel may be on shaky grounds?
- [48:17]
Tim Kirkjian
Well, those, those certainly would be the two top guys now, Matt's and Phillies. Matt Qutraro, who's like your. I love him. He loves you, Tony. The Royals are supposed to make the playoffs this year. They recently lost eight games in a row. It's like half of baseball has already lost eight games in a row already. So maybe, maybe he's in a little trouble. He and Salvador Perez, their star future hall of Fame catcher, had a little back and forth. They cleaned it up. It's going to be okay. But yeah, they, they need to do better than this. Even though they played better lately in the game they won yesterday.
- [48:53]
Tony Kornheiser
Yeah, they beat the Angels a couple of times. I've been following that. Yes. All right, I'm handed a note. The last time the Red Sox fired a manager in mid season was Jimmy Williams in 2001. It's a long time ago. 2001.
- [49:06]
Tim Kirkjian
That is a long time ago. And Jimmy Williams, by the way, Tony, completely off the topic. I walked in the clubhouse one day and saw him in the manager's office and he looks at me and he goes, you never make two batches of peel off in one, in one pan. And I went, what? Pilaf is an Armenian delicacy, which I actually know how to make because my father's side was Armenian. And he. I said, how could you possibly know that? And he goes, I live with an Armenian guy in Fresno, California. So that's how he said hello to me on a certain day. Never make two loads of pilav in one pot.
- [49:46]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay, I got just one other thing. Because I did want to talk about this. I got one other thing. How are you so far? We're a month in. How are you on the automatic ball strike challenges?
- [49:59]
Tim Kirkjian
I'm still willing to give it a chance. I think it's been better than people thought. The fans seem to get a big kick out of it when their team wins. And we just had a bases loaded walk turn into a strikeout that ended an inning. That's the first time this year. So overall, I think it's. It's worth a try to examine to see if this is going to work for a full year. But Aaron Boone told me in spring training, he said, I'm. I kind of like it, but enough people have told me we should either do the entire ball strike system, you know, robotically like this, or not do it at all. This in between might not be the best idea. So I'm going to give it the whole year. I find it interesting. But I want to make this clear, Tony. Being an umpire, the major leagues is way harder than people think. You, nor Nigel, nor any son. No one else in there would last five.
- [51:00]
Tony Kornheiser
No, no.
- [51:02]
Tim Kirkjian
Get me out of here. This is too scary. This is too dangerous.
- [51:06]
Michael Wilbon
I agree with that.
- [51:07]
Tim Kirkjian
And Tony, they're missing a pitch by one inch. A pitch that is thrown 102 miles an hour with violent movement. So I'm all in favor of it. But if we're going to start embarrassing umpires for missing a call by a half an inch, that that's a bit much for me.
- [51:24]
Tony Kornheiser
Do you worry, as some of our mutual friends worry, that it is Boosting the time of game and that we're getting back into that problematic area.
- [51:34]
Tim Kirkjian
Yeah, this is. Yes, I am worried about that. Even though it does happen very quickly.
- [51:40]
Tony Kornheiser
But there's a bunch of them.
- [51:42]
Tim Kirkjian
Yeah. If you have 20 challenges in a game, it's gonna extend. And the thing that baseball has done exceptionally well is cut the time of the game by half an hour. It makes it better for everyone involved, including the players. And we have to make sure that we don't slow the game down when we need to keep it swift.
- [52:01]
Tony Kornheiser
I agree with that. Plug your podcast for us.
- [52:03]
Tim Kirkjian
Oh, it's doing great. We're gonna have Joe Buck on tomorrow. We have a podcast running right now. Joe Buck is our guest tomorrow, and he and I were on a Brockmire episode years ago. Yes. And I. I was the worst actor in the history of acting. Although I got a check the other day for $6.37 from SAG residuals.
- [52:27]
Tony Kornheiser
Yep.
- [52:28]
Tim Kirkjian
Yes. So Jeffrey Kirkjin and I are doing great. We love it doing this. We taped yesterday at my house. We have Joe Buck running tomorrow. We do three episodes a week. And we actually made some money the other day. So good for you.
- [52:42]
Tony Kornheiser
Good for you. Thank you, Tim.
- [52:44]
Tim Kirkjian
All right, Tony. See you guys.
- [52:45]
Tony Kornheiser
Tim Kirchen, boys and girls, we will take a break. We will come back with email and jingle. I am Tony Kornheiser.
- [52:53]
Michael Wilbon
You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show. Here comes Tony's mailbag.
- [53:00]
Tony Kornheiser
I need. Eric DeLong and the Slappy boy.
- [53:13]
Chuck Todd
It's just great.
- [53:14]
Tony Kornheiser
You want to do the Bethesda bagel ad for us, please?
- [53:16]
Eric DeLong
Yeah, Bagel sandwiches on Mondays. We love it. You will as well. Just go to Bethesda Bagels.com for the location in the DC area nearest you. Then pop on in and you'll be thrilled.
- [53:25]
Tony Kornheiser
Before we get to the mailbag, let me just say ask the girl what she wants wanted to be she said, baby, can't you see I want to be famous a star of the screen but you can do something in between. Baby, you can drive my car yeah, I'm going to be a star Baby, you can drive my car and maybe I'll love you four guys who knows what happened today? Thanks to our guest today, Chuck Todd. Glad he's safe, that everybody's safe there. Michael Wilbon, Tim Kirkjian, thanks as well to today's sponsors. Remember, you can listen to us on Apple podcasts, Spotify and Audacy. If you get the show through Apple Podcast, please leave us a review from our Survivor update Rick Devins. They still can't get rid of me, but they did take out my closest ally, Christian. He is the Mike Wilbon to my Mr. Tony. I wanted to let you know I'm throwing out the first pitch for the Atlanta Braves this Friday. But it was last Friday, April 24th. Okay, so he did it already. Any Littles at the game should come yell the cheesery around section 131 so we can meet up and discuss Dom Smith as the Bravos take it to the Phillies. I'm sorry we got this late. Yeah, sorry, we just got it late. Also wanted to let you know they finished the repairs to Tucker Bridge Road in Macon, so commuters no longer have to take the detour. By Stratford Academy, proud alma mater of Russell Henley. Thanks as always for the incredible support. In fact, I've never felt so much support from someone who doesn't watch and will never watch Survivor. I'll take what I can get.
- [54:40]
Jingles/Producer
I'm watching the pitch right now. Slow walk to the mound.
- [54:43]
Tony Kornheiser
Oh, you're going to tell us what it looks like. Is he. Is he happy?
- [54:45]
Jingles/Producer
Yeah, a little outside.
- [54:47]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay. But he gets it. No bounces.
- [54:49]
Jingles/Producer
It bounces near the plate, but it's there.
- [54:51]
Tony Kornheiser
Okay, that's good. From Joe Rizzo. For years, the Lillehammer jacket has been a load bearing wall of this show's mythology. Cold snap in D.C. lilly Hammer jacket. Chessy needs a walk at 4am Lilly Hammer jacket. We pictured you in a Norwegian market. The Post's expense account in your pocket, pointing at the rack and saying, that one we should. We have spent decades treating the Lillehammer jacket the way archaeologists treat the Shroud of Turin as a relic with a specific and sacred origin story. And now it's been revealed it was purchased locally to take to Lillehammer. The lore has been destroyed heretofore. The adapter plug I bought from my trip to Cuba will be known as a Cuban adapter. And the sunscreen I bought for the Jersey shore will be known as Jersey sunscreen. P.S. please tell Justin Janis, head baseball coach at Oakton High School, to eat it. Let me just for the record say this is sort of stunning to me. It's a fabulous email. I never said I bought that jacket in Lillehammer.
- [55:44]
Eric DeLong
When it's referred to as the Lillehammer jacket.
- [55:46]
Tony Kornheiser
It is. I bought it for Lillehammer.
- [55:50]
Jingles/Producer
That's the difference. Jacket for versus the.
- [55:53]
Tony Kornheiser
I have bought other stuff in Lillehammer that I have talked about, but it's not like I didn't. I didn't take. I didn't delude anyone. I didn't go down the wrong path deliberately. I bought the jacket to take to Lilleham.
- [56:06]
Eric DeLong
Yes. You didn't weave intricate stories about shopping for it and finding it in. You know.
- [56:10]
Tony Kornheiser
I did not. No, I did not.
- [56:12]
Eric DeLong
The Lillehammer jacket.
- [56:13]
Tony Kornheiser
Kendrick from Knoxville. The Lillehammer jacket isn't from Lillehammer. Was the coffee creamer not smashed against the wall? Enraged by the great orange one? Maybe Junior did really wear a size 34 pant or. You've been joining the conversation this whole time. We just didn't know. Like Michael, I came to a screeching when I heard the Lilly Hammer jacket was simply domestic. Okay. Jesse Benton, Dade City, Florida, Formerly of Hagerstown, Maryland. Come on, man. What are we doing out here? What has gotten into Michael and Nigel? We all remember that you got the Lillehammer jacket at the old outlets in Martin Birds, West Virginia when you were in Shepherdstown for pre Jordan Wizards training camp. Or is it just me that remembers that story? What am I doing with my life? Can I be the official blah, blah, blah?
- [56:56]
Eric DeLong
Is that accurate?
- [56:57]
Tony Kornheiser
I believe that's accurate. I believe I bought it there. I believe that. Shepherdstown, West Virginia.
- [57:02]
Jingles/Producer
I don't know what to believe.
- [57:04]
Tony Kornheiser
I know I didn't buy it in Lillehammer. In Norway. I did not.
- [57:08]
Jingles/Producer
Next you're gonna tell me there's no brick on the trash can with Maggie.
- [57:11]
Tony Kornheiser
No, there was a brick on the trash.
- [57:12]
Jingles/Producer
Covered in foil.
- [57:13]
Tony Kornheiser
There was a brick Mo Conforti in Las Vegas. We as littles have been duped. What? I guarantee I'm not the only one riding in the show to say I don't know what to believe anymore. Did you really go to the Nike store? Do you really not have a Pulitzer? Will you really buy 1% of a horse named Lecheeserie? Is there really a cheese counter at Calvert Woodley? I can go on and on, but I'm going to leave it to Dan Byrne to write a song about this that will live in infamy from Mark Elliott in Prospect, Kentucky. I'm no probability expert, but what is more unlikely that Ken Griffey Jr. And Stan Musial were both born in Donora, Pennsylvania and share a birthday? Or that there are two Max Muncies, a somewhat unusual name in Major League Baseball, both drafted by the Oakland A's, and that they share a birthday? Mark's Rule. Tim's Drool. Mark Elliott, Prospect, Kentucky. I think the second one is more unbelievable.
- [58:03]
Eric DeLong
Two Max muncies in baseball with the same birthday.
- [58:06]
Tony Kornheiser
That's yes.
- [58:06]
Eric DeLong
Yeah, it's good.
- [58:07]
Tony Kornheiser
Unless they're the same person.
- [58:08]
Eric DeLong
No, they are not.
- [58:09]
Tony Kornheiser
And they've just been split in two. Ethan Rudderman in Toronto. In Canada. I'm a millennial. Loyal little. Hasn't missed an episode in over a decade. You think maybe the show has become too ingrained in my daily life? Case in point, my interaction with the barista. Barista? Is that how it's pronounced? Yeah, in Starbucks this morning. Barista. Good morning. What can I get for you? Me? Yeah, that's a great question. That's hysterical. It's brilliant.
- [58:32]
Michael Wilbon
Brilliant.
- [58:33]
Tony Kornheiser
I'm pleased to announce the birth of our second kiddo, a non masculine child named Ariel, born April 4, 2026. How's four? Four for a birthday?
- [58:41]
Eric DeLong
Oh, it's a great one. Share a birthday with myself and Greg Garcia.
- [58:44]
Tony Kornheiser
That's right. From Mark Corriere in Ellicott City, Maryland. Sometimes I wonder if my wife and kids pay attention to the show. When I played in the car, to my delight, the woman to whom I'm related by marriage apparently hears more than she lets on. We were listening to the John Orient interview and discussion on Amazon Prime. Freezing at the end of the interview, my wife quietly said to no one, he's probably ready for Ingleside. Okay. Galway in Ireland. This is Simon. Who won? Simon Cawley. Was that our winner? Okay.
- [59:16]
Eric DeLong
No different.
- [59:16]
Tony Kornheiser
Oh, captain, my captain. I'm a Nike socks aficionado. High durability, snug fit and the added left foot and right foot indicator on each sock. Of course, you may prefer starboard and port indicators on each sock. Love the show. Keep up the good work. Don't die soon. I don't know that my socks have that. They have the lnnr. I don't know that they do. David Epstein in New York. Listen to Stevie Ray. Near miss with the great Arnold Palmer. Brought back the memory of a chance I will also never get again. Back in the 90s, I played in a regular pickup football game on Saturdays in Central Park. We would gather sometime after 9am, do our stretching and warm ups and begin play by 10. We'd go at it for a good three hours, then hit the nearest bar for recuperative post game wings and beer. On one particular warm Saturday, we just finished with our game and were straggling out of the park along the pass when two guys approached two of our players who were a few feet behind me. I kept walking, but then sensed they had stopped. So I turned around to see my buddies politely shaking their heads. As the two guys approached them walked away. I asked what that was about and one friend said they wanted to get a pickup game of football, but we told him we had just finished playing. My other friend then commented quite casually that he thought he knew who one of them was. I turned to look and even from a side view would be Playmates was unmistakable John Kennedy Jr. Wow. To this day I have to resist the urge to smack myself in the head when I think about this moment. To say the least. Touch football with a Kennedy would have been a nice item to have on life's resume. From Tim in Tokyo Dear Mr. Tony, on a recent podcast, the lyrics you recited were from a Johnny Mathis song entitled Misty, and you correctly recall the scene from Diner where the characters played by Paul Reiser and Steve Guttenberg argue over Mathis versus Sinatra. When confronted with the makeout question, Gutenberg's character reluctantly admits that for makeout music he would choose Mathis. The real punchline comes a few minutes later in the scene when Mickey Rourke's character Boogie comes into the diner and they pose the question him, Sinatra, Mathis. He pauses and then answers definitively Presley. One more I put on Johnny Mathis. Chances are after dinner with PG last night didn't work. Regards, DG Tremendous if you're out on your bike tonight everyone is always do wear white.
- [61:21]
Chuck Todd
You know they all get involved and they all got their gear already and so they're going to be all colored up in in the maroon and black oh what.
- [61:34]
Dan Mangan
Melody chose me and Melody changed her mind I should be over it now but I ain't over it now that's pie rather be no only somebody's wasted time I should be over now but I ain't over it now they all got to go when you want them to stay so it's better not to love in case he's taken away it's all right it's fine you are fine in time this is what they say to the ones that stay behind. Me chose me Mela changed her mind I should be over now
- [62:46]
Michael Wilbon
but I
- [62:47]
Dan Mangan
over now this fight rather lonely somebody's wasting time I should be over now but I ain't over now they all gotta go when you want on the stage so it's better not to love in case it's taken away Just when you think you got a foot in the door is a moment see that she's not there anymore so why Melody choose me if I'm not the choosing kind I'll mess it with mine My I felt what it feels like to be chosen and then unchosen they always kind of go when you Want them to stay so it's better not to love and kiss us Taking away Just when you think you got some skin in the game Just when you think the tides are turning your way Just when you think you got a bird in a hand It's a shakedown broken to a shell man so W. Ch. Melody Ch I'm not choosing kind I'm messing with my mind. Love is simple when it's broken it's the softest words ever spoken I said I was kidding I was joking Now I'm twisted up and lost in thought But I remember I was thinking all that feeling Always sinking All that waiting Take that stage the feeling we're waiting a step How Sally all the keeps all the valley I've been down Song I'll rally Every foundation Some plan De Keep it even Keep her happy don't be afraid to love her madly and she will steer you and keep you afloat as you row that boat until you both let go someday. So is it simple being older we got all these kids upon our shoulders See I just get softer the world gets colder Now I'm twisted up and lost and thought but do you remember Night got late Equations were recalculated in my veins and we saved my life in the final round Some kind of paper cup tea Some hell Bath festival ground and hasty How Sally and how the peaks and how the valleys and up and down this farm But I'll rally and have you found something to sink deep into? So keep it even Keep her happy and don't be afraid to love her madly we should recap Lay it on me the good, the bad in between Hasty Bad Are you happy? And how the kids man how's that family? They cannot spare you from the valleys but they will give you something lean into so keep it even Keep her happy don't be afraid to love her madly she will steer you Keep you afloat as you roll that boat until you both let.
- [68:19]
Chuck Todd
Sam.