“Welcome to 2025 Tony”

Summary

The Tony Kornheiser Show: “Welcome to 2025 Tony” – July 30, 2025

Hosted by This Show Stinks Productions, LLC

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1. Introduction and Upcoming Segments [00:00 - 01:07]

Tony Kornheiser kicks off the episode by outlining the day's topics:

• Baseball Trade Deadline: Insights from sportswriter Jeff Passan.
• Swimming Excellence: Discussion with Dave Shinen about Katie Ledecky’s stellar performance.
• Golf Banter: A light-hearted segment with Michael Wilbon and a silent guest, George.

Notable Quote:

• Tony Kornheiser: “On today's show, we'll talk with Jeff Passon about what moves we might see in baseball as the trade deadline approaches.” [00:00]

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2. Golf Discussions with Michael Wilbon [03:00 - 12:00]

Tony engages Michael Wilbon in a conversation about their busy golf season at Rehoboth Club. They delve into the challenges of slow play and how the club manages high traffic:

• Golf Course Traffic: Post-COVID surge with 150-175 rounds on weekdays.
• Slow Play Solutions: Emphasizing member awareness and courteous reminders to maintain pace.

Notable Quotes:

• Tony Kornheiser: “The worst thing at a golf course is slow play.” [03:39]
• Michael Wilbon: “We're 150 to 175 on a weekday.” [03:27]

They also discuss teaching golf to young children, highlighting programs like “Eagle Tots” aimed at developing motor skills and fostering early interest in the sport.

Notable Quote:

• Michael Wilbon: “We have something what we call eagle tots and that's three to five-year-olds that come out for one hour on the back range.” [08:04]

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3. Katie Ledecky and the World Swimming Championships with Dave Shinen [12:00 - 25:04]

Dave Shinen joins the show to provide an in-depth analysis of Katie Ledecky’s performance at the World Championships in Singapore:

• Ledecky's Dominance: Despite being 28, Ledecky continues to excel in the 1500m freestyle, breaking her own records and maintaining her status as the premier female distance swimmer.
• Rising Competition: Introduction of Summer McIntosh from Canada, who is challenging Ledecky’s records in the 400m and potentially the 800m freestyle.

Notable Quotes:

• Dave Shinen: “Her times are right there with some of her best times of her youth.” [16:00]
• Tony Kornheiser: “She never loses [the 1500m].” [15:54]

They also discuss the financial aspects of professional swimming, particularly how athletes like Ledecky earn substantial incomes through sponsorships and endorsements, contrasting with the limited prize money typically associated with the sport.

Notable Quote:

• Dave Shinen: “She makes seven figures.” [22:23]

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4. MLB and Gambling Concerns [25:04 - 40:00]

Jeff Passan returns to discuss significant issues facing Major League Baseball:

• Gambling Scandals: Examination of the cases involving pitchers Emmanuel Clase and Luis Ortiz, who were placed on non-disciplinary paid leave due to suspicious betting activities.
• Impact on Integrity: Concerns about the pervasive nature of legalized gambling and its potential to undermine the sport’s integrity, especially among younger audiences.

Notable Quotes:

• Jeff Passan: “It's terrifying the way that this has been as pervasive as it has become.” [32:47]
• Tony Kornheiser: “The Luis Ortiz thing is based on two pitches... there's the presumption... suspicious.” [35:04]

Passan emphasizes MLB’s partnership with betting integrity firms like iC360 to monitor and flag suspicious activities, highlighting the ongoing challenges the league faces in maintaining fair play.

Notable Quote:

• Jeff Passan: “MLB and the MLBPA agreed on non-disciplinary paid leave.” [32:47]

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5. Legacy of Bud Selig [37:13 - 40:19]

The conversation shifts to Bud Selig’s legacy as MLB Commissioner on his 81st birthday:

• Era of Change: Selig’s tenure marked significant shifts, including the sabermetric revolution and the push for revenue-generation through stadiums and regional sports networks.
• Labor Relations: Improvement in labor relations and the establishment of a relatively peaceful period in MLB under his leadership.

Notable Quotes:

• Jeff Passan: “Bud Selig... shepherded baseball into the era that it's in now.” [37:23]
• Tony Kornheiser: “There was mostly labor peace under Bud Selig? Mostly.” [39:44]

Passan also acknowledges MLB’s evolving challenges under current Commissioner Rob Manfred, noting both advancements like the pitch clock and ongoing labor disputes.

Notable Quote:

• Jeff Passan: “Is Bud Selig's legacy for all the things he did... retirement of number 42, Jackie Robinson's jersey.” [40:00]

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6. Listener Mailbag [41:30 - 42:10]

Tony and his co-host Sean engage in a humorous mailbag segment, addressing various listener emails ranging from debates on actors' hairstyles to congratulatory messages for local achievements. The segment adds a light-hearted conclusion to the episode, showcasing the show's interactive and personable nature.

Notable Quote:

• Tony Kornheiser: “If independent bands and independent artists want to send us their music to play on the podcast, how do they do it?” [26:27]

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Conclusion

In this episode of "The Tony Kornheiser Show," listeners are treated to a blend of in-depth sports analysis, light-hearted banter, and engaging discussions on contemporary issues in baseball and swimming. Tony Kornheiser masterfully navigates diverse topics, providing insights from expert guests while maintaining an entertaining and relatable tone.

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Notable Quotes Recap:

• “On today's show, we'll talk with Jeff Passon about what moves we might see in baseball as the trade deadline approaches.” – Tony Kornheiser [00:00]
• “The worst thing at a golf course is slow play.” – Tony Kornheiser [03:39]
• “We have something what we call eagle tots and that's three to five-year-olds that come out for one hour on the back range.” – Michael Wilbon [08:04]
• “She never loses [the 1500m].” – Tony Kornheiser [15:54]
• “She makes seven figures.” – Dave Shinen [22:23]
• “It's terrifying the way that this has been as pervasive as it has become.” – Jeff Passan [32:47]
• “Bud Selig... shepherded baseball into the era that it's in now.” – Jeff Passan [37:23]

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For more detailed discussions and insights, listen to the full episode available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and other major platforms.

Transcript

[Tony Kornheiser]

Hey, it's Tony. On today's show, we'll talk with Jeff Passon about what moves we might see in baseball as the trade deadline approaches. We'll also talk to Dave Shinen about another brilliant performance from Katie Ledecky. Plus, George, who does not speak, is sitting in with us today, we think. But first, let's keep the sales weasels happy. The Jack Welch Management Institute at Strayer University helps you go from I know the way to I've arrived with our top 10 ranked online MBA. Gain skills you can learn today and apply tomorrow. Get ready to go from make it.

[Michael Wilbon]

Happen to made it happen and keep striving.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Visit Strayer Edu Jack Welchmba to learn more. Strayer University is certified to operate in Virginia by chevin as many campuses, including at 2121 15th Street north in Arlington, Virginia. After Zoomie's @ the dog park, it's time for drive up at Target. In goes a big bag of kibble and one squeaky chicken toy for the good boy. Drive up. That's ready when you are. Only in the Target app. Just tap Target. Previously on the Tony Kornheiser Show.

[Jeff Passan]

It was the great final day of summer vacation.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's lovely. I won't even mention that Wilbon and I were not invited to this thing and that Wilbon should have been because he went to Northwestern. Greenberg went to Northwest. Hey.

[Jeff Passan]

Wilbon would be probably the most annoyed of anyone for not being there, I would think.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I'm going to bring it up on the air today. Oh, no. Now. So great. No, I gotta get invited back.

[Jeff Passan]

I gotta play better.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You will. I'll just say that Chef told me.

[Jeff Passan]

Yeah, I won't put it on you. All right.

[Dave Shinen]

Perfect. Perfect.

[Tony Kornheiser]

The Tony Corer show is on now. We have an update on this. We have an update on this. I brought this up to Wilbon yesterday before we were taping. Wilbaugh said he was invited. He said, well, no, I'm the only one. I'm the only one who wasn't invited. How am I supposed to feel about that, Greenberg? How am I supposed to feel about that?

[Michael Wilbon]

To be fair, it would have been hard to arrange this. You know, the. The cards. Because you're playing from a different set of tees.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Well, I'm way up. Yeah. Baltus Roll probably doesn't have those man tees. Right? They probably don't have.

[Michael Wilbon]

He'd be playing the family tees in.

[Tony Kornheiser]

The fairway, but I wasn't. Yeah, the. Yeah, the plaques in the middle of the fairway from 150 out. Take out driver. See if I can reach. Yeah, that's what happens when you get old. You all laugh, but it happens when you get old. So that's an update on that and also an update on our vacation schedule. Remember when we used to take the entire summer off? Yes. And then I realized that without the show, I have nothing to do. And I, and I sit around thinking, well, why don't I do a show? We are going to take a couple of weeks or we're going to take next week off. That's right. For certain. And then we'll be back the week after that. And then maybe we'll take another week off in August, you know, because. So you got to. I don't really know why, but I'm trying to be benevolent and allowing Nigel and Michael to have lives and Sean to have lives. So, you know, even though I'll be miserable, I'll be totally miserable.

[Michael Wilbon]

You need to get your smoked salmon.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I have to get that. Which lasts longer than. There's a debate about that. Yeah. Anyway, anyway, so George is here. George, who says nothing, is here. We're very happy about that. Nodding his head. This is, this is like the busiest, I mean, golf pros, this is the big busiest time. Right?

[Michael Wilbon]

This is our Super Bowl. Yeah, we're right in the heat of it right now.

[Tony Kornheiser]

How many, how many rounds a day at Rehoboth, would you say? On a busy day?

[Michael Wilbon]

Since post Covid, we're, we're 150 to 175 on a weekday.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's a lot.

[Michael Wilbon]

Yeah, that's, you know, anywhere could be 200, maybe 210 on the weekends, just depending. But I feel like this summer, as opposed to previous summers, this has been the busiest the season we've had, plus it being the centennial year right. At the club. So, you know, it's great, everyone's using it, but it is, it is busy, as you know.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I mean, no, it's, it's crowded all the time. I mean, we, you expect it to be crowded. I mean, that. The worst. Okay, this is my personal prejudice. The worst thing at a golf course is slow play. That's the worst. The worst because then somebody backs up, I don't know, 10, 12 groups, you know, and you get three groups on a hole and you can't go anywhere. And I hate slow play. And then I call the shop and I say, look, I know this is annoying for you to listen to, but these people, three groups ahead of us, they have to be black flagged, they have to be taken off the course, they just return their money, return their initiation fees, get them off the course. What do you do about, I mean, look, you guys know who the slow people are, you know who the fast people are. What, what do you do? Do you say anything?

[Michael Wilbon]

Oh, absolutely. I mean, well, we, we know when looking at the T sheet that what problem groups we're going to have for the day. So you know, even before they start, we're, we're kind of aware. So, you know, I think it's just about being present out on the course and making sure they see you. One to know that, hey look, you know, if they see you, they, they realize, you know, you're, you're watching them. So. And just, you know, if they do fall behind, you know, jumping on it right at the start and saying, hey look guys, you know, you're a little bit behind and we need you to pick it up. And not being afraid to do it and doing it in a, in a courteous manner to where, you know, they still feel comfortable. And then I think a lot of it too is just, you know, member awareness. Them being aware of where they're at and saying, hey look, taking the responsibility, not putting it on us as a staff. Just play fast, play fast.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Don't grind over, over a two foot pot, just pick it up. Michael, tell Bobby Abbo's solution to slow play.

[Michael Wilbon]

I just drive around the group. There's one time we were playing down in Florida and I'd never played the course. You know, it's hard to get your bearings and he just points, you know, points in a direction. I crank a pretty good drive at the time. We are driving through the fairway and all of a sudden we just pass a cart. He had me hit over a group in the first hole. Didn't even let him get out of position.

[Tony Kornheiser]

True. It's true. Just hit drive.

[Michael Wilbon]

Could you imagine if, if Tony hit a driver over a group in front of him?

[Tony Kornheiser]

They'd have to be 30 yards in front of me.

[Michael Wilbon]

I think, I think the tough thing to dad's point is, you know what, there's a difference in a bad time and what feels like slow play. And that's where you guys have to be. So, you know, careful as to when someone is beginning to get out of play. But they are actually not on a bad time for the, you know, the what? Whatever is perceived as par for the round. You might say it's four hours and 10 minutes. Four hours. Four hours. So yeah, if it's, you can play slow at 3, 45 for 18. It just depends on time of day and who else is out there.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Well, if I'm playing alone, I can play 18 in an hour and a half.

[Michael Wilbon]

I've, I've seen balls.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. So I don't, I'm just walk up and hit it. Just hit it again and again and again. It doesn't really matter. Are you playing? It's hard for you to play, isn't it? Yeah.

[Michael Wilbon]

Right now, I mean it, it's definitely kind of the final stretch for us here at the club. About another four weeks and then really quiets down. So we'll, we'll start to play more in the fall. A couple good rounds this this season, but nothing, nothing too crazy. So. But I'm looking forward to, to spending some more time and playing and practicing.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Have you taught Michael's children or did.

[Michael Wilbon]

You point of contention right now. I owe Michael an apology just with the coming off a member. Guess you showed up today. I know I knew this was coming. So I wasn't able to get out with walk this past week. I know we were, we were trying to so I missed him this past time. But I have been able to get out with Walker earlier in the season so Improve swing. I know I, I, I owe you one there, Michael.

[Tony Kornheiser]

What is, what's the number? What is the age or is there no age below which you say there's really no point in trying to teach. They don't have attention span. They don't really know what they're doing.

[Michael Wilbon]

So every Sunday this through the season, we have something what we call eagle tots and that's three to five year olds that come out for one hour on the back range. And really at that point we're just trying to develop motor skills like balancing, throwing, catching, that type of stuff which then, you know, can kind of correlate to a golf swing down the road. But and then just getting them around the game like, you know, this is a golf ball, this is a golf tee, this is a golf ball.

[Tony Kornheiser]

They're probably very happy. Happy. Oh yeah. And then they wander off and look at these.

[Michael Wilbon]

Their attention span is.

[Tony Kornheiser]

No, they have none. They have my attention span.

[Michael Wilbon]

All about the snacks. Yeah. I mean we're just trying to get them be surprised how many, you know, people who pick up golf later in life that come to us and say, man, I wish I had the opportunity to play as a kid because really it is if you learn early on, it definitely makes, makes the game easier on. And I learned, I learned golf later. But now they do. You know, you have various companies like us, Kids Golf started this, but you now have. Every main OEM is doing some form of a kids club, but they have. They're weighted so that kids pretty young can get it. So even the Captain, who is 3, has something that's called a yard club, which just has a larger face. And, you know, I'll put him outside with a pickleball and he just. He figures out how to swing. It's got the Scotty Scheffler grip trainer on it, and he can use real clubs as well. But this is a super light set. It feels more like a hockey stick. So it's a. It's a much larger face and you can hit it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Maybe that would help me. I don't hit the ball.

[Michael Wilbon]

Doesn't go very far.

[Tony Kornheiser]

My high school friends are coming soon. We're going to play golf for three or four days. It's going to cost me a fortune, as you know, their guest face, but I hope it works out.

[Michael Wilbon]

Did you go. Did you go on the online T sheet to secure times, or is that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

That's why I have George here. That's why I have George here.

[Michael Wilbon]

The text messages.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yes. So my favorite hole on the course is 10, and it's because it's the only hole you can get killed from behind and from in front because 10 is next to the driving range. Oh. So the people behind you, there's this. There's this thing where if you hit it into the driving range, and it's the greatest thing that Rehoboth does. The practice balls are all yellow. So if you hit a white ball, you know, you can find that ball in the range very quickly. The people who were dumb enough to hit yellow balls off the tee at 10, you need to. You need to say to them, here is a check. Take this, cash this. Never come back here. It's the dumbest thing I've ever seen. But anyway, so.

[Michael Wilbon]

And I never get hit from behind.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But as. As you get closer to the green, there's a secondary range. And on the secondary range, they're bombing drivers. They're bombing them. And if they. And if they fade it, you could get killed. And it's the most fun of all to see yellow. The yellow balls all over the, you know, all over the fairway at 10 and you. And. And the. The move is to, of course, stare at the people on the range. What are you doing? What are you. Yeah, like, come on. Or hit it. Hook it, Hook it. You know? You know, but it's. It's. It's wonderful. It is. I mean, golf at Rehoboth is wonderful. It's flat. You can walk it. Not at my age, but you can, you know, other people can walk it. And in the main, in the main, people play pretty quickly. I do that. Yeah, I do. My friends, the only hole they want to play is 19, which is a par three in the wind, which is not on the regular course. And they want to play it. That's all they care about. They want to get through 18 so they can go and play.

[Michael Wilbon]

Great hole.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, it's beautiful. It's windy. The green itself is the slowest green there because they allow the grass to grow a little bit because there's no shelter from.

[Michael Wilbon]

It's right on the bay.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, it's right there. And if you just, if you cut it really short, you know you're going to put it into the water. But it's really fun. You like working there, don't you?

[Michael Wilbon]

Love it.

[Tony Kornheiser]

We don't have to worry about you moving.

[Michael Wilbon]

13 seasons I've been.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Is that right? Yeah. That's great. It's lovely. It's lovely. It's great fun. All right, we will take a break. When we come back, Dave Shinen will join us and he will talk about Katie Ledecky and the World Championships of swimming in Singapore. I'm Tony Kornheiser. Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. Now I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of.

[Michael Wilbon]

Unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So I thought it would be fun if we made $15 bills but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a [e-mail] Switch upfront payment of $45 for a three month plan equivalent to $15 per month required new customer offer for first three months only. Speed slow. After 35 gigabytes of network's busy taxes and fees extra. See mintmobile.com Gatorade is the number one proven electrolyte blend designed to hydrate better than water so you can lose more sweat and raise your gain. Gatorade is it in you? You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser show. This is a band called Bats out of Hell. I'm gonna get to that in a second. This is sent to us by Christopher Davenport who writes attached to some songs from a former players band which is named Bats out of Hell. All the members are current Purdue students. Hope you can play these. And he is the. He's from Calumet College of St. Joseph sprint football. Okay, so that's probably what we're talking about. Former players. It's a lovely song. It's called Luna, but it's by a group named Bats out of Hell. My high school classmate Jimmy Steinman became famous by writing a song called Bat out of Hell. It also was the title of a show. Yeah, Bat out of Hell. So Bats out of Hell. I. I don't know if I'm the right guy on this because I think of Jimmy and I wonder what Jimmy would do with this. And the word lawsuit comes to mind. So anyway, it's very nice music. Bats out of Hell. And they play in Dave Shine. And Dave Shinen is writing about the World Swimming Championships because he knows a lot about swimming and covers swimming, often in the Olympics. But the World Swimming champions or championships are in Singapore. And in the old days, you know, the Washington Post might have covered them, but to be fair, the Washington Post would have sent somebody from the China bureau, you know, or the Tokyo bureau. They would not honestly have taken a sports guy. Do you think, Dave, do you think they would have sent. I don't think they would have sent a sports guy to the World Swimming Championships. It's not the Olympics. What do you think?

[Dave Shinen]

I mean, it's the first year after the Olympics, you know, that's a year when nobody's paying attention to summer Olympians. And so I think that we would probably have always skipped. Skip this one. I think that maybe one year prior to an Olympics, so like 2027 might be one that we go to, because now we're ramping up towards 2028 is the last year of the Olympic quad. So I don't know. I think. I think I'm okay with missing this one.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. I mean, I just really think they would get somebody from an agent bureau and say, you're a sports writer. Go do it. And you know, you got a 12 hour lead time, so you got lots of time to worry about a thing. Anyway, I want to talk about Katie Ledecky because everybody where we live cares about Katie Ledecky. And she's the greatest female swimmer of all time, and that's indisputed. But where is she? She continues to win the 1500. It's like a signature event. She never loses. But in your opinion, where is she compared to the height of her career? How close is she to that standard that she set?

[Dave Shinen]

I mean, she's right there. I mean, she. She broke a world record in the 800 earlier this year, which I didn't think was possible for her anymore. And. And deep down, I have to wonder if she ever thought, you know, she could do something like that again. I mean, a swimmer's body, you know, peaks around, you know, 19, 20, something like that. That's when she was at the height of her power. She was breaking world records all the time. You know, she's had. She said over the years how, you know, I can't hold myself to the standard when I was that young anymore. And. And so, like, deep down, I wonder if she ever thought she could do this again. But, but, but her times are right there with some of her best times of her youth. And so what's changed, though, is that the rest of the world is caught up. You know, when she got into this discipline, distance swimming, there were very few, really elite people doing it because nobody wants to do what she does. Nobody wants to put in the work. You know, swimmers don't get. Show up at the pool as a kid hoping to be a distance swimmer. You know, you're putting in 10,000 meters of practice every day and staring at that black line at the bottom of the pool. So. But what happened was, in part, she made it cool. You know, she made young swimmers want to be distant swimmers because she was the greatest swimmer and she's a distance swimmer. And so now all these kids who worshiped her, who had posters of her on their walls, are now competing against her and in some cases, taking her down.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Is she still preeminent or has that shifted? Is this young girl from Canada, Summer McIntosh, is she the preeminent swimmer now, or is it still Katie Ledecky, depending on the distance?

[Dave Shinen]

Yeah, there's a little bit of apples and oranges here because Summer McIntosh is. Is a. Is a. Is a generalist, I guess. She's not a specialist. She swims the IMs, she swims the butterfly freestyles, and she has recently expanded out her program to. To the 400 and the 800 freestyles, which is Katie Ledecky terr territory. She's already taken down Katie in the 400. She's close to getting her in the 800. That's the race to watch on Saturday, what everybody at this meet is calling, you know, the race of the year, the one that everybody's waiting to see. Summer McIntosh is now like in. In the same territory as Katie in the 800. It might take a world record to win that race between the two of them. It's going to be pretty epic, I think. But yeah, I mean, in terms of the 1500. That's the one that Katie won yester. She is still by far, you know, the best in the world at that. I'm not sure that anybody's going to catch her in that one. Certainly not by 20, 28. She, she, she won it by over five seconds yesterday, which is, is a tiny margin of victory in her record. She's won it by as many as 27 seconds in an international competition.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I mean, that's a lap of the pool, right? I mean, she's been on a lap that they're not on, right?

[Dave Shinen]

Yeah, yeah. I mean if you ever watch that race, you know, during the Olympics, I mean the, the camera has to pan out, way out to catch the second place finisher in the same frame. And she's constantly crisscrossing people and lapping them and it looks like, looks like she's going the wrong way on an eight lane highway. But yeah, she, she's still the dominant, by far the dominant swimmer in the world in the 1500s.

[Tony Kornheiser]

How old is she now?

[Dave Shinen]

She's 28. She'd be 31 in LA.

[Tony Kornheiser]

She wants, she is quoted as saying she wants to compete in L. A. The way it works in the United States is you have to go through trials at 31. Now, Territory's won a gold medal, like close to 50, but that's a sprint. That's a different deal. What are her chances of qualifying? Everybody would love to see it, but what are her chances of qualifying in Los Angeles?

[Dave Shinen]

Oh, I think, I think it's almost a slam dunk. I mean, unless something happens, she's going to be there. To me, she, you know, yes, she's going to be three years older than she is now, but you know, the way she's training, the way she's competing, I mean, and the way she's winning races, you know, certainly domestically by, by huge margins still. I mean, there's nobody in the US who's within like maybe 10 seconds of her in the 1500 and maybe 5 seconds of her in the 800. I mean that's a large gap to make up. Somebody could do it. But there's also two spots. And even if she's edged out at US Trials by, by one swimmer, she still makes the team. So I think it's a slam dun, makes the team. And I think at this point she'd still have to be the overwhelming favorite in the 1500 in L. A at this point. Three years out the 800, a little bit iffier.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So when I was younger and beginning a career as A sports writer. You saw swimmers in the Olympics and they left. They quit. Everybody quit before they were 23 years old. Nobody was swimmer after, and that's because you don't make any money. Mark Spitz was at that time, the greatest swimmer of all time, and he went to dental school. Because you don't make any money swimming. Now, they stick around in terms of physiology. Maybe we're learning something as to how long you can swim. Maybe it's much longer than we used to think. But they make money. How does she make money? I mean, I, you know, I understand there are contracts for baseball players, but swimming, how do you make money?

[Dave Shinen]

Well, I mean, think about it this way. I mean, swimming is a little bit like golf in that the viewers, the people, the fans also participate in the sport. So you can make a lot of money with equipment and uniform or swimsuit sponsorships. Right. Because those companies, Speedo and Tyr, they're selling tons of swimsuits to kids, to young swimmers, to youth swimmers. And, you know, somebody like Katie Ledecky is going to move a lot of merchandise. So she makes a lot of money. Money through sponsorships and there's, you know, a few other things she does, you know, personal appearances and. And whatnot.

[Tony Kornheiser]

But.

[Dave Shinen]

But she makes the majority of her money through sponsorships. And she makes a lot.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, because there. Are there prizes yet in swimming? Is. Is there yet a cash award for winning a race?

[Dave Shinen]

Well, yeah, there's that, too. I mean, she gets stipends from the US opc. There are prizes for winning the pro events she swims at. You know, so. Yes.

[Tony Kornheiser]

What do you get, 50 bucks? I mean, how much can it be?

[Jeff Passan]

Well, I mean, she makes.

[Dave Shinen]

She makes seven figures. I know that.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Oh, great. Okay, good. Yeah, that's good. Because somebody should swimming and should be her. Yeah. Let me get to the thing that I found.

[Dave Shinen]

Very few who do that. Very few can make that much money.

[Tony Kornheiser]

So I'm interested in this. I read in one of the stories that there was a virus going around. Papa caught it and he died last spring. There was a virus going around, and the Americans were getting this virus, and it may have affected their stuff in the pool. I'll ask you about that if you felt it affected their races. But what occurred to me is you're not in the United States of America. I can't imagine they didn't bring their own food. I can't imagine they didn't bring their own chefs. I can't imagine somebody didn't think, well, what if someone wants to poison Us. That's reasonable things to think. Can you explain all of that to me?

[Dave Shinen]

Well, I mean, you know, I don't know that it was food poisoning. I mean, you know, it could have been. It could have also just been a virus that went around really quickly and got many people before they figured it out that that's what was going on and started isolating people. I don't really know the particulars. You know, I'm not over there able to report on this and stuff. So, you know, I don't know what it was. I don't know what the origin of it was, but, yeah, it affected a lot of swimmers. There were a lot of very bad times in the first couple of days of the meet. They were least three Olympians who had to scratch from races, including finals where they were gold medal favorites. They had to scratch because they were physically unable. So had a major impact. But I don't know how it happened.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I will say this. If it. If it was. Let's just say. And it may not have been food poisoning. You know, it may not. But you agree with me, right, that everybody brings their own food and their own cooks. Nobody leaves this to chance. Nobody.

[Dave Shinen]

Yeah, that's correct. I mean. I mean, especially the U.S. you know, Team USA has got the money. They've got the, you know, the wherewithal. They've got chefs and stuff like that. So I don't know.

[Michael Wilbon]

I don't.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He's going out in the backyard and picking lettuce. That's not how it works. That is too much money on training. And you do. You try to leave nothing to chance, right? You try.

[Dave Shinen]

Yeah, you try. You certainly try. And I mean, you know, that doesn't mean you bring all your meats and everything. You know, maybe you still have to rely on a grocery store over there or something. I don't know. I don't know how that works, but it is very. It was very strange and kind of, you know, disappointing, but it happens.

[Tony Kornheiser]

All right, thank you for all of this. Thank you. Because you're the only person I would talk to about swimming, because I don't know anything about swimming. All right, thanks. I'll talk to you soon. Thank you.

[Dave Shinen]

All right, thanks, guys.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Dave Shinen, boys and girls. Love Dave. We love Dave Shinen. It's a great sports writer and has been for 30 years. Great sports writer. We will take a break. A great singer, too. Oh, yeah, he was. He went to Vanderbilt. Yeah. As a. An opera major. He can sing. Yes. He like. He can do the national anthem. Yes. And has better than you. He can do the national anthem and he's a great sportswriter. We will have Jeff Passon when we return. I'm Tony Kornheiser this Friday, starring Taron Edgerton. Holly, dangerous men are coming for us. I want you to get the race. Can you do that for me? All a father needs is a fighting chance. Everybody is looking for you. What do you do? I'll keep you safe.

[Sean]

Promise?

[Tony Kornheiser]

She rides shotgun. Rated R under 17. Not admitted without parent. In theaters Friday.

[Jeff Passan]

You say you'll never join the Navy.

[Sean]

Never climb Mount Fuji on a port visit or break the sound barrier.

[Jeff Passan]

Joining the Navy sounds crazy.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Saying never actually is.

[Michael Wilbon]

Learn [e-mail], america's Navy forged by the sea.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser Show.

[Dave Shinen]

The Tony Kornheiser Show.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Once again, this is the band Bats out of Hell. If Jimmy was with us, Jimmy might raise an eyebrow and go, what? Isn't that mine? I don't know. This is called Rhubarb Michael. If independent bands and independent artists want to send us their music to play on the podcast, how do they do it?

[Michael Wilbon]

Send us your music by emailing it to [e-mail] and that's how the hell.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Plays in Jeff Passon. And Jeff was on the PTI show yesterday and we talked about a story that he had reported and it's his story about how Rob Manford, who I'm going to assume is making a tour of clubhouses to talk to players at one point or another was with the Phillies and Bryce Harper confronted him and basically said get the bleep out of here if you're going to talk about anything like, you know, putting a salary cap here. And Manfred came back at him and, and we asked Jeff about it. And Jeff, yesterday you talked about the sort of lingering animosity with the labor struggles on both sides baseball. But I wanted to ask you and I, I couldn't do it in the format yesterday because it's too tightly scripted and this is not. I was sort of stunned with that language to the commissioner of a sport. I mean, I don't, I remember Bryce Harper from, from the Nats. Obviously I've always thought he was a great player and I, I didn't know whether he was popular or unpopular with his teammates though Papelbahn tried to choke him one time. But be that as it may, he's a veteran player now. He's a multiple time mvp. He's a big deal. Didn't that Language. Didn't people look in that room and say, what?

[Jeff Passan]

No, people looked in that room and said, thank you.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Wow. He's. He.

[Jeff Passan]

He is extraordinarily popular among players, Tony, and very well respected, contrary to what.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Everything that Wilbond says. Okay, of course, but go ahead, go ahead.

[Jeff Passan]

And I think, look, I think some of the perception of Bryce Harper lingers from the fact that, you know, he. He permeated the national consciousness at 15 years old on the COVID of Sports Illustrated as the next chosen one, and that he was up in the big leagues, you know, just past his 18th birthday, and he's been around for. For 14 years now, like, this is a guy who has. Has fulfilled expectations that were unreasonable from the beginning, and that's a really, really hard thing to do. And I think because of that, because of how he conducts himself, because he is a good husband and father, people look up to him and look to him in moments of leadership to provide. It now is getting in the face of the commissioner of baseball and dropping an F bomb. Leadership. You can certainly. You can certainly make the argument that it was too much, but I think you can also make the argument that. But for a long time, nobody at the Major League Baseball Players association, among the players, has stood up to Rob Manford quite like this. And look, there are contentious moments in bargaining, and inside of the bargaining room, particularly Max Scherzer, he's dropped a couple of F bombs along the way. You know, Jack Flaherty, another guy who's been outspoken in that room. Bryce Harper has never taken on a leadership role like an active one where he's on the executive subcommittee or as a player rep. But I think he knows the weight that his voice carries. And Rob Hanford for three years, has been going around doing these sessions now with players, all in an effort after the last collective bargaining agreement where he acknowledged, my relationship with players is not good. That's something I need to try and get better. And. And what over the last year, that has turned into is more of a discussion of the economics of the game, which is a hotly contested issue, Tony. You know, the players, they like the system for the most part, and certainly the leadership at the MLBPA likes the system. It's good money, but.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Jeff Passan]

Well, there's still issues there, though. You know, there's. There's a big divide between the guys at the top, like Juan Soto making $765 million and the guys who are making the minimum of around 800,000. And I think that Rob Manfred. Look, I don't know that he is actively going in there trying to bifurcate the player population. But there's no question that some of the things he's saying, he's hoping gets into the minds of some of the younger players who might want to make more money, whose careers might not be as fruitful or last as long as Bryce Harper's. And that solidarity is the only thing that keeps together unions. And if you can chip away at that solidarity in any way, then as management, you are doing a good job.

[Tony Kornheiser]

I just was stunned at the actual word to the commissioner of baseball. I mean, this to me is like an elected representative of the house using that word to the President of the United States. Just.

[Jeff Passan]

It was a stunning 2025, Tony.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Well, okay, but I was born in, you know, 1900, you know, I just, I don't know. Okay, all right. Okay, let's move on. The Emanuel class A thing, I don't know what it is now, but worst case scenario, it's awful. It's really bad. And I know that Wilburn was screaming yesterday. If you don't have proof, shut up. Well, that's not how it works. You go and you investigate something and, and you put a guy on this paid leave, but you're investigating whether or not there's any particular tie in to a series of bets. These weird. I think they're called micro bets. How. Yep, it strikes me this is a very significant problem in all sports. Once you let gambling in like that, this is significant. What are your thoughts on it?

[Jeff Passan]

Agree wholeheartedly. Let me address the first part because I think in a very notable part of the release from Major League Baseball about this subject was that MLB and the MLBPA agreed on non disciplinary paid leave. You know, if there is no evidence, Tony, that there's absolutely no way that players are the mlba. Yeah, they're not. They're not going to sideline a player unless there is compelling evidence to suggest that there was involvement here. I'm not saying either Emmanuel Clase or Luis Ortiz, the other guardians pitcher on non disciplinary paid leave, were guilty. What I'm saying is Major League Baseball believes it has enough evidence to put them on it. And the MLBPA agreed with that. So let's start there. But, but like I just want to tell you a story of my own personal life. I don't, I don't gamble because I always lose when I do. But I have sons who are 17 and 13 years old and they have friends who do. And they have kids in their class who do. These are Teenage boys who have access to easy access via apps to frankly going straight into a gambling addiction before they hit their 18th birthday. It's terrifying the way that this has been as pervasive as it has become. And I, you know, I was pro legal gambling now after seeing the effects, I didn't realize what the upshot would be. And I think it is horrifying to think that we're already taking a generation that is as dopamine addled as children are these days and just giving them something new to give them those quick fixes and those quick hits. And look, it's one thing to place a bet on who's going to win or lose a Super Bowl. It's another thing to be able to place 100 bet parlay. Well, no, no one's doing 100 bet parlay. But, but a five bet parlay on. Is this pitch going to be a baller strike?

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, this is, these are serious things. I mean, the Luis Ortiz thing, again, Wilbond screaming if you don't have evidence, shut up. But the Luis Ortiz thing is based on two pitches, two pitches that were first pitches in an inning. And, and what you need, what everybody needs to realize is as a result of legalized gambling, the database on who you are when you bet, what you bet on, it's, it's enormous. Now they can track things that are suspicious so quickly. The Ortiz things based on two pitches. And the presumption, clearly, Jeff, is that Ortiz cooperated with somebody and that somebody made a bunch of money. And by the way, it doesn't hurt the at bat. It's one pitch. It doesn't hurt the at bat. So you can justify it. But I think there's no way they're not suspicious of these two specific pitchers. Right? There's no way.

[Jeff Passan]

With Ortiz, I can tell you, yes, there is suspicion based on a June 15 pitch against the Mariners and a June 27 pitch against the Cardinals. Both of those were flagged by iC360, which is a betting integrity firm. And after the second one, they reached out to me to sportsbooks and others, and Major League Baseball is partnering with them. And so that absolutely is the case. David Perdem are very intrepid and talented. Gambling reporter at ESPN said that there were no flags placed on any Emmanuel Class A pitches. So one would have to think that perhaps there was some intelligence gleaned either from a conversation with Ortiz or with others who are in that orbit.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It's an amazing, it's an amazing problem. I mean, I can't, I Can't take the position that gambling should be illegal. I won't take that position, even though I don't gamble myself. But some of these bets. Some of these bets are scary, and I think they should probably be illegal. On a lighter note.

[Jeff Passan]

Yeah.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Bud Selig is 81 years old today. It is his birthday. How is he viewed now?

[Jeff Passan]

Bud Celix, only 81.

[Tony Kornheiser]

81. Oh, maybe he's older. Whatever. It's his birthday.

[Jeff Passan]

Hey, happy birthday, Bud.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah, I think Alan H. Selig.

[Jeff Passan]

How is Bud Ceelig? Dude, that's really. That's an interesting question. I. I look at Bud Selig as the person who brought baseball, or maybe not brought, but shepherded baseball into the era that it's in now. And by that, I mean he was around when the sabermetric revolution happened. He was the guy who was pushing for stadiums to be revenue generators and for regional sports networks to be revenue generators. And the economic model that no longer works for Major League Baseball, it was. It was a bounty during Bud Selig's tenure. Beyond that, I think one of the underrated things that Bud Selig did was get Major league for Major League Baseball and its owners was get their act together in terms of labor relations and ultimately, Tony, that's what I think Bud Selig's legacy is. He was the commissioner who, as much as he loved baseball and he absolutely adores.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Sure. He was an owner. He owned the Brewers.

[Jeff Passan]

Yep.

[Dave Shinen]

He.

[Jeff Passan]

He took the commissionership from the person who is in charge of the best interest of baseball to the person who is in charge of the best interest of owners. And Rob Manfred has taken that mantle and absolutely run with it and has done some wonderful things. I think the pitch clock. I'm not going to say it saves baseball because baseball wasn't dying, but I think the pitch clock invigorated baseball and gave it some real new life. But there have been elements of it, too, that. That baseball's resonance throughout society ever since the strike in 1994 has just not been the same. And ultimately, I do wonder is. Is Bud Selig's legacy for all the things he did, the fact that he was still the commissioner back when they lost the World Series.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah. But one of the things I wrote to say on the show today is that there was mostly labor peace under Bud Selig? Mostly.

[Jeff Passan]

There's been labor. There's been labor peace since Bud Selig, let's put it that way.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Yeah.

[Jeff Passan]

That mostly has got a big asterisk.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It does. There's no question about that. But I would also say one of the things that was accomplished with one stroke of the pen was one of the greatest things that ever happened in baseball and that was the retirement of number 42, Jackie Robinson's jersey. Don't you think that's a big deal? That's an underrated big deal. Big deal. All right. Thank you, Jeff.

[Jeff Passan]

Thank you, Tony.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Jeff Pass. And boys and girls will take a break. We will have email and jingle when we return. I'm Tony Kornhouse. Pro Savings days are back at Lowe's right now. Get a four piece GE kitchen suite for under $2,000. Plus get a free DeWalt 20 volt max XR8amp hour battery when you buy a select DeWalt tool. Save big with deals that work as hard as you do. Shop Pro Savings days in store or online. Today Lowes we help you Save valid through 8. One selection varies by location while supplies last. Discount taking the time of purchase. See sales associate for details.

[Michael Wilbon]

This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Sports are all about teamwork and so is insurance.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Whether you need an in person or digital assist, State Farm is there to.

[Michael Wilbon]

Help you choose the right coverage for.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Your home, car and more.

[Dave Shinen]

Get a game plan that helps fit.

[Michael Wilbon]

Your life and talk to State Farm today.

[Tony Kornheiser]

State Farm with the assist.

[Michael Wilbon]

Coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability and eligibility vary by state.

[Tony Kornheiser]

You're listening to the Tony Kornheiser show.

[Sean]

He's got your emails and your notes.

[Tony Kornheiser]

He'll read them for all you folks. Cause it's a mailbag.

[Sean]

Yeah, it's a mailbag.

[Tony Kornheiser]

If you drive a car.

[Sean]

No Subaru.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Try to fax. No, that won't do. If you went to camp, he might pick you. If you send free stuff, you'll get right through.

[Sean]

Mailbag.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Sean is great doing that. Did that live today? No, I'm kidding you. That live. But do you sing along, Sean? Do you sing along when you hear it? Occasionally, yes. The. The high notes are a little tricky to hit, but. No Subaru. You want to do the Bethesda Bagel ad? Yes, Bethesda Bagels. We love them. You will as well. Just go to Bethesda Bagels.com for the location in the DC area nearest you. Then pop on in and you'll be thrilled. And before we get to the mailbag, let me just say John and Mitchie were getting kind of itchy just to leave the folk music behind. Zal and Denny working for a penny, trying to get a fish on the line in a coffee house Sebastian sat and after every number they'd pass the hat. McGuinn and McGuire just are getting higher in LA. You know where that's at and no one's getting fat except Mama Chaos. That is Creek Alley. That's the Mamas and the Papas from a thousand years ago. Thanks to our guests today, Dave Shinen and Jeff Passon. Thanks to have George here as well. Yes thanks as well to today's sponsors. Remember you can listen to us on Apple podcast Spotify and ought to see if you get show through Apple. Please leave us a review so I got this from JS from Wichita, formerly in Buffalo and said I was made aware that your alma mama won the national debate tournament, making them the NCAA champions in debate for 2025. First time in New York school has ever won the national debate championship. How much do we think these kids are getting in nil money. I'm sure they'd appreciate some of your yellow legal pads and says please tell Joe Klein to eat it. Yeah, they won that. Binghamton won that a couple of months ago. That's right. Yeah, it's wonderful. I just think it's first needle. That's great. Well that means. That means Cornell and Columbia never did it. Exactly. Ha. Eat it. Or Stony Brook. Yeah, we always call ourselves the Cornella. Broom county county, you know, because Cornell's not in Broome County. I think it's in Tioga County. I'm not sure. Patrick Sitter, Sioux Falls, South Dakota thanks for letting us know we didn't have to send you emails pointing out it was Billy Bob. Yeah, I got that wrong. I said I got that from Brandon Borzelli, Lebanon, New Jersey. Joe Pantoliano was in quite a few notable works over several decades. The Matrix and of course, the three seasons spent on the Sopranos, to name a couple of popular works. The actor was born in 1951, very similar to your age. As you noted, he's usually seen wearing other people's hair. Perhaps his best bald role was when he played bail bondsman Eddie Moscone in the 1988 film Midnight Run with Robert De Niro, Charles Grodin, Yafat Kodo and other big names of the 80s. Full bald, in effect, at the young age of 37. In the film, he resembles a certain sportswriter at the same time period, using a full beard, Joe is going for the distinguished look, all the while screaming at De Niro to bring in Grodin by the midnight deadline. One can't help but wonder if the certain sports writer took to wearing other People's hair. If that individual would look like Ralph, Ralph Chiefaretto in the Sopranos, looking far younger. I hope I pronounce that right than the 50 plus years old he actually is playing a debonair mobster from Florida. Then again, Ralph's head, hands and other people's hair are buried in a bowling bag. After Christopher dismembers him in a bathtub with a meat cleaver. After Tony strangles him to death over two hundred thousand dollar horse insurance policy. So maybe sticking to the natural look is the way to go. Yeah, I. Oh my. Right, that was the horse. Is that right? I don't think so. That. That movie, by the way, Midnight Run is a great movie. It's fantastic. A great movie. Yes. From Dave Arnold in Broomall, Pennsylvania. Watching PTI Tuesday, couldn't help but thinking the jacket fits you like the big suit on David Byrne. And stop making sense. Yes, mauv. I went back to the mob second time ever on the show. Paired with the tie looked very. Yeah, no, I mean I thought everything worked pretty well. And Wilbon loves it. Yeah. Yeah, Wilbon loves it. Bill Garner, North Potomac, Maryland what is this? T shirts. I. Oh, a T shirt. I believe I had that. Yeah, this is $12 each. $12 each. T shirts in medium. Oh, medium, yeah. That's where you wear a shirt that's smaller than it should be so you can show your muscles off. That's a Salism move, isn't it? That's 100. It's laughable. You just look at him and go, what are you doing? What are you doing? Josh Cromwell, Moselle, Mississippi. I really enjoyed the fact that while reading an email that was all about the summer Littles, neither you nor Nigel could figure out what SOL stood for. Oh, I don't know. Maybe it's just an acronym for the very thing the email was about. I mean, I understand that you're unburdened by memory, but what's Nigel's excuse? Is he unburdened by sobriety? In my defense, there's something else that SOL stands for and that's the only thing that was coming into my brain. Okay. Which I cannot say on the app. Okay. Steve Sigourney, our friend in Big Sky, Montana, Chuck and Roxy, number 288. I'm having an epic trip to Ireland and Scotland for two and a half weeks. I gave Sansi a hearty lecheserie on Sunday at Port Rush. Wow. And had an awesome round at Trune. Please inform. Please inform dg. How about that? Wow, that's a great trip. Yes. And from Tom Targonski in Sioux City, Iowa. I couldn't tell if Dan Graziano was driving a city bus. Bus and applying the air brakes or if he was working behind the counter as a barrister while he appeared on your show. It was really weirdly loud and. And I think it was from when he went outside to inside, we got the weird echo and I think it was the sliding door that was making all that noise. But again, I mean, you know, he was wearing a Baltus roll shirt on TV the other day. Yeah, because he got invited. Wilbon got invited and didn't go. And Schefter got invited and Wind Horse got invited. Yeah. And what was Taylor Twelveman doing there? Exactly. What was he doing there? And Orlovsky, you know, I mean, okay, Orlovsky is on the get up Show a lot. Yeah, 12 is not on the get up show all that much. But he is a great, great player. Great player. And I'm happy for him. But I'm plotting revenge. If you're out on your bike tonight everyone is always do wear white. But I still need a bit of milk full fat which I've warmed in the micro huave.

[Sean]

Some may say she's a prisoner the concrete guides her home But I think that Luna's free and she's a hunting for your soul Luna's man's got a preacher's hand but he waves it in the dark and when she can she marks a landmark pissing in the park her shelter's just a paycheck away but ask her and she's already safe saved what you want with your trouble Taking back into other people what they like only rhythm in a glance of you but if not y now then I'll find out who your generation if that was me that I'd decip free Making your walls down with new till the crack streak open we shut off through don't care she just feels the ride Sometimes it's slow and sometimes it's high Life's tough l when you're out on the road but it ain't a big one you just don't know I say let's go. Come on, Luna, let's go. Let's go, Luna. Let's go, Luna, Come on. The battle still Sam want something put on show when it's messed up it's up you know it's only twice just to go on home I'm planning by mistake and still here to grow ride Are going to sit at the race you take a Chance now you still lose your place. Cuz life ain't living when you're not in the fight. It's a sail out the wrong and st in the right. Don't care she just feels the bright. Sometimes it's slow, sometimes it's high. Life's tough living when you're out on the road. But it ain't hard to think when you just don't know. Let's go, Luna. Come on, Luna.

[Tony Kornheiser]

Let's go.

[Sean]

Let's go Luna. Let's go Luna. Let's go Luna. Let's go Luna. Come on. Come on, Luna. Still work to be done. And so dark she leads the way so hard on herself. Just one of those days she leads so dark she leads the way so hard on herself it ain't so dark she leads away so hard.

[Tony Kornheiser]

It's.

[Sean]

Another day gone. It's just my luck that I'm staring down a highway out in the C. Thinking I must not be that far out from something. Had a road to the jagging like a broken knife. Found an old heat patch that had sent me a ride. My ears would not make noise from bits of silence. Hear it say, hear it say. Hey hey. Why don't you wait on it mug feels fine when it sets you free. When I'm all around. You won't hear a sound. You won't hear a sound. Take me to the wheel by patch Any sweet stories gotta catch. Pull my strings and eat me whole. But there ain't much left when it's all told. Red so green leaves, sour taste, bitter seeds poison breath through the vines. Can you hear it? Well so can I. Hey. Why don't you wait on it? The mud feels fine when it's deep. Your skin set you three cups of mallow. You won't hear a sound. You won't hear a sound. Bury me, bury me Ruby pat Any sweet stories got to catch? Pull my strings and eat me whole. But there ain't much left when it's all told. Hey hey hey hey hey hey. Hear it say, hear it say hey. Here I why don't you wait on it? The mind feels fine when it's deeper skin set you free. Cuz I'm all around. You can't hear a sound. You can't hear a sound. Bury me, bury me Robot patch Any sweet stories got to catch? Pull my strings and eat me whole. But there ain't much left when it's on Sama.