Jeff Probst on What It Takes to Produce ‘Survivor’

Summary

The Town with Matthew Belloni

Episode: Jeff Probst on What It Takes to Produce ‘Survivor’

Date: February 11, 2026
Host: Matt Belloni (The Ringer)
Guest: Jeff Probst (Host, Executive Producer, and Showrunner of Survivor)

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Episode Overview

In this landmark episode, Matt Belloni sits down with Jeff Probst ahead of Survivor’s 50th season to explore the legacy, evolution, and behind-the-scenes realities of this iconic reality show. The conversation delves into how Probst’s approach as host and showrunner has shaped the series, the unique production challenges of Survivor, the cultural impact of reality television, and why the show continues to thrive where others have faltered. The tone is thoughtful and lively, blending industry insight with humor and some nostalgia.

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1. Defining the Survivor Phenomenon

Timestamps: 01:06 – 06:23

• Cultural Milestone:
  Belloni recalls Survivor’s premiere and explosive finale that drew 52 million live viewers, reflecting on how it created the reality competition genre.
  “Very few people would have guessed that the show would still be a hit for CBS heading into its 50th season.” (02:05, Matt Belloni)

• Unexpected Longevity:
  Probst underscores how the show’s initial experimental spirit led to its evolution:
  “You keep your head down and you go one season at a time and you look up and suddenly it’s 25 years.” (04:52, Jeff Probst)

• The Show’s Vernacular & Rituals:
  Jeff describes efforts to create Survivor’s unique world, citing phrases like “the tribe has spoken” and explaining the first season’s rituals and props—some hits, some misses (such as the conch shell and the gong).
  “Mark was really generous in saying, just try things and let’s see what’s working.” (05:38, Jeff Probst)

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2. The Rise of Reality TV Stardom

Timestamps: 06:23 – 08:26

• Unprecedented Fame:
  Belloni references how first-season contestants like Colleen and Richard Hatch were suddenly celebrities.
  “It was the first real time that regular people had been thrust into this kind of stardom via a competition show.” (06:42, Matt Belloni)

• Probst as Observer:
  Jeff reflects on being in the background:
  “I had a really interesting vantage point because I was not talked about. Nobody knew who I was. No stories were done about me. It was about the players.” (07:12, Jeff Probst)

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3. Behind the Scenes: Probst as Showrunner

Timestamps: 08:26 – 11:25

• Creative Vision:
  Since assuming showrunner duties, Probst shifted Survivor to focus more on family appeal and the “Hero’s Journey,” making Survivor both cinematic and transformational for contestants.
  “I wanted to make Survivor a family show… I also wanted to make it even more cinematic… and I wanted to take on the Joseph Campbell idea of this hero’s journey.” (09:09, Jeff Probst)

• Casting Philosophy:
  The goal shifted to casting people you want to root for, emphasizing likability and inspirational qualities.

• Game vs. Experience:
  Probst sees the game as the “MacGuffin,” suggesting the psychological experience is the true reward.
  “The trick, I think, is the game is the MacGuffin… The experience you get is what changes you.” (09:52, Jeff Probst)

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4. Tribal Council and Authenticity

Timestamps: 11:25 – 13:15

• Preparation & Improv:
  Probst insists on natural conversations at Tribal Council; he never preps players on questions.
  “There’s no big science. I don’t have cue cards or cheat sheets or anybody in my ear. It’s an improv for sure.” (12:35, Jeff Probst)

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5. Production Logistics and Fiji as Home Base

Timestamps: 13:11 – 16:24

• Why Fiji?
  Challenges like climate change, population growth, and currency instability made Fiji the optimal permanent home. The nation supports the show with rebates, and Survivor reciprocates with tourism promotion.
  “If you pay the rebate, we will make Survivor synonymous with Fiji and we’ll work with your tourism board and we’ll make this a win win.” (13:48, Jeff Probst)

• Cost-Saving Changes:
  The pandemic forced Survivor to shorten seasons from 39 to 26 days, a move fans grumbled about, but which Probst described as necessary and surprisingly successful.
  “We’ve actually cut one third of our shooting and deliver one third more product.” (15:21, Jeff Probst)

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6. CBS Relations and Survivor’s Evolution

Timestamps: 16:24 – 18:23

• Network Dynamics:
  Probst laments past isolation from marketing but now enjoys close, creative collaboration with CBS executives.
  “If you talk about, like, some triggers, it would be in the past where I felt like they just wanted us to make the show and go away, and it felt weird to me to not be partners.” (17:03, Jeff Probst)

• Addressing Sensitive Topics:
  Survivor’s open approach to difficult moments—such as the outing of a trans contestant—intentionally fosters family conversations about sensitive topics.
  “We try to do it in a way where families can talk about it… you can talk to your kids and say, how would you handle that if somebody did that to you?” (17:36, Jeff Probst)

• Authenticity in Casting:
  Probst insists players are never pressured into sharing personal stories:
  “Your story is yours to tell… We never would have brought it up.” (18:41, Jeff Probst)

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7. Why Survivor Remains Unmatched

Timestamps: 19:20 – 22:19

• No Real Imitators:
  Despite imitators, no show has matched Survivor’s unique combination of adventure, isolation, and social experiment.

  “There is no show adventure like Survivor where you take a group of strangers and you literally leave them alone in a jungle and you say, no supplies. Good luck. By the way, every few days you’re going to have to vote somebody out… There’s nowhere to hide…” (20:23, Jeff Probst)

• Challenge of Longevity:
  Probst believes it’s Survivor’s ability to innovate every season that keeps it alive, while copycats quickly lose steam.

• Environmental Consistency:
  The show never attempted a cold-weather season because the island environment is integral to gameplay and contestant activity.
  “When you’re cold, you’re not out climbing a tree to get a coconut… We realized quickly the show will crumble.” (21:49, Jeff Probst)

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8. Diversity, Casting, and Cultural Change

Timestamps: 22:22 – 23:40

• Casting Evolution:
  Survivor intentionally moved away from a “hot body” focus to center more diverse, relatable contestants, spurring broader fan interest. “If you study our casting… we’ve gotten more interesting, more diversity and more stories that really remind me that representation matters.” (22:40, Jeff Probst)

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9. Inside Production and Life on Set

Timestamps: 25:56 – 30:23

• Daily Routine:
  Probst’s day off camera is packed with testing challenges, rehearsals (using the so-called Dream Team, not contestants), and approvals for all facets of production. “It’s pretty much nonstop. I’m either with the players… or we have a process. We test first, we test ideas… then we do rehearsals, full cameras and we shoot everything. Then we look at tape and then we tweak a little bit more.” (26:06, Jeff Probst)

• No Pickups:
  Survivor prides itself on not reshooting scenes or asking contestants to redo anything, preserving authenticity.

• Building a “City” in Fiji:
  The operation includes a crew of up to 800, including international and local workers, building a self-sustained community—kitchen, medical, security, even accounting is onsite.
  “It is like you’re a community.” (28:40, Jeff Probst)

• Family Culture:
  Survivor’s unique crew culture allows families to visit and even work on the show:
  “We have 73 babies born to people who met while working on our show.” (30:02, Jeff Probst)

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10. Survivor’s Future and Franchise Philosophy

Timestamps: 31:11 – 33:09

• Network Priority:
  CBS treats Survivor as a major priority, especially for this milestone season, offering unprecedented promotion and support.

• No Franchising Plans:
  Probst resists spin-offs or franchise dilution, choosing instead to funnel all creative energy directly into the main show.

  “I just decided I want to put all my ideas into Survivor because the format can handle any idea.” (32:30, Jeff Probst)

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11. Toughness, Fairness, and the Survivor Experience

Timestamps: 33:46 – 35:28

• Resource Scarcity:
  Since COVID, the production team has leaned into the “dangerous fun” element, proposing ideas like “no food, no supplies, dangerous advantages,” making the experience harder but more authentic. “I don’t think we should be giving them food very often and supplies because I think that struggle is part of what gets you down and breaks you down and then opens you up.” (34:30, Jeff Probst)

• Jeff Walking the Walk?:
  Probst admits he hasn’t lived a “Survivor week” himself, joking he’s “an imposter” in that regard. “I know I’m an imposter, Craig. I’m fully aware that I talk smack that I have never walked.” (35:18, Jeff Probst)

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12. Notable Quotes

• “The only problem is the host.” (04:27, Jeff Probst, recalling a review from Season 1)
• “Our budget has not gone down. But where you have to be adaptable is your costs still go up…” (14:33, Jeff Probst)
• “[On CBS trust] There is so much trust. And I’ve really learned that if you can make the show for the money they give you and deliver, they will let you keep delivering.” (24:30, Jeff Probst)

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13. Memorable Moments

• Survivor Babies: 73 children have been born to crew members who met on the show. (30:02)
• Dream Team Internship: Probst calls it “the greatest paid internship you will ever have in your life.” (27:07)
• Mike White’s Casting: The only question when casting Mike White was, “Do you need him?” to which Probst replied, “He will be the single greatest storyteller in the history of our show.” (23:40)

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14. Audience & Industry Takeaways

• Survivor’s durable format is rooted in authenticity, bold creative risks, and a refusal to franchise for franchise’s sake.
• The show’s embrace of diversity and social challenges keeps it culturally relevant and connected to viewers of all ages.
• Survivor continues to set the standard in reality TV production and is likely to influence competitors for years to come.

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For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In

This episode provides rich insight into the genius and grit behind Survivor’s enduring legacy. Probst’s candor about the show’s evolution, his creative process, and the real-world challenges faced by contestants and producers is both educational and entertaining—whether you’re a die-hard fan or just curious about the business of television.

Transcript

[Matt Bellany]

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[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

It is Wednesday, February 11th. I'm old enough to remember where I was on August 23rd in the year 2000, the season finale of a new show called Survivor was watched live by 52 million people in the US alone. Pretty amazing number these days. Survivor was a summer experiment for cbs. All the other networks had passed on the show, but a young producer named Mark Burnett got sponsors to essentially pay for it. Celeste Munres, the head of CBS finally said yes, became an absolute sensation, of course, and essentially created a genre of television the reality competition show, complete with the weekly eliminations, the real people dropped into extraordinary situations, the the mind games, physical challenges, the I'm not here to make friends and other tropes that we see all over TV these days. Many of them go back to Survivor, but even then I think very few people would have guessed that the show would still be a hit for CBS heading into its 50th season, which begins on February 25th. We're doing a series of preview specials beginning this week. They're doing a bunch of new things for the milestone season, bringing back players and doing twists and designs voted on by the audience. But I wanted to go behind the scenes on the show so there's really only one guy to do that with. Jeff Probst. He's been there since the beginnings, the host, and since 2010 he's been host and executive producer and showrunner, meaning he's involved in every aspect of the show from casting to twists to random emergencies on set. Of course, the tribal councils. Probst is an Interesting guy. Always super smart about the business and savvy in addition to being a five time Emmy winner. So in the run up to the 50th season, I asked him to come on the town, take us behind the scenes, hopefully take a look at producer Craig's audition tape. Finally. So today It's Survivor at 50 seasons and the business of one of the most iconic shows in the history of tv. From the ringer and Puck, I'm Matt Bellany and this is the town.

[Matt Bellany]

Okay. We are here with Jeff Probst, who is the host, executive producer, showrunner, face of the Survivor franchise. Franchise. Welcome, Jeff.

[Jeff Probst]

Nice to be here with you, Matt. Big fan of your show.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, that's very nice of you. I gotta say, I'm a little intimidated. You are pretty well known as one of the greatest interviewers in the history of television. I would say.

[Jeff Probst]

Wait a second, I just have to take this in. The guy with the most attitude in Hollywood is intimidated at all?

[Matt Bellany]

I am a little bit. I mean, you like. I mean, I guess you're underrated. It's hard to say you're underrated because you've been on television doing the top rated show for 25 years, but you are extremely good at asking questions and teasing out what you need out of your interviews on Survivor. And I think that's one of the many reasons why that show has endured because I gotta be honest with you, I was among the first group of viewers of the show. I remember it very clearly. My law school buddies and I were like, what is this? And we started watching in the summer of 2000. And if you had told me then that this show would first of all justify two cycles a year. I know it was very controversial when CBS decided to do that because American Idol was not doing that at the time. And if you had said that this was going to last 50 seasons, I would have said absolutely no way. People will get tired of it.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, I remember the first review I read which said, really interesting concept. The only problem is the host.

[Matt Bellany]

The rock and roll Jeopardy. Guy.

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah. And I was like, oh, my God. I'm the only problem with the show. Everything else is interesting.

[Matt Bellany]

They could have Dunkelman view.

[Jeff Probst]

Oh, don't even say that. Don't say it. My life would be so different.

[Matt Bellany]

I know they could have Brian Dunkleman view, but yeah, this was the best.

[Jeff Probst]

Thing that ever happened to me. So. Yeah, I hear you. I don't think anybody could have ever predicted this kind of run. There's just no way. You keep your head down and you go one season at a time and you look up and suddenly it's 25 years.

[Matt Bellany]

I know, it's amazing. If you had to give advice to your season one self after having done 50 seasons of this, what would it be?

[Jeff Probst]

Do the same thing. Because there's a lot of stuff from, like that first season, for instance, that I. I could cringe at if I were going to be critical.

[Matt Bellany]

What makes you cringe when you look back?

[Jeff Probst]

I'll tell you. The big idea we talked about a lot was let's create our own world, our own vernacular. Things like the tribe has spoken and Tribal Council castaways, tribemates, not players in competitions. And so with that came a lot of mythology. Like when players walked into Tribal Council, Mark really wanted to have a barrel, a treasure chest full of money. And we didn't like. Most of us didn't like it. We thought it was corny. But Mark said, I never want them to forget you were actually playing for $1 million. So he had a really strong point of view. We also had a gong. When you walked in, you had to hit the gong. It seemed corny at the time, but it was part of a ritual. We wanted you to feel like you were the last to the party. We've been here for a thousand years, and we did a conch shell that season where you had to have the shell before you could talk. A lot of those ideas didn't work. But the reason I would say do the same thing is Mark was really generous in saying, just try things and let's see what's working.

[Matt Bellany]

It's really hard to explain to people now who, you know, like Craig or others who maybe weren't watching or even alive at the time, that how famous these castaways became. Because a friend of mine, I was living in LA at the time, a friend of mine was actually dating Colleen from that first season. Wow. And it was crazy because we would go out and just over that summer, it became like she couldn't even go anywhere because people would come up and say, oh, my God. And it was the first real time that regular people had been thrust into this kind of stardom via a competition show. Now, it's obvious everybody knows these people, you know, your favorite reality star. But it's not the same as when 50 million people are watching the finale of a show and there's nothing else like it on television.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, I had a really interesting vantage point because I was not talked about. Nobody knew who I was. No stories were done about me. It was about the players But I was often around because we'd be at an event or a press situation so I could watch what you're talking about. I went to the super bowl with Richard Hatch after the first season ended, and it was to promote our second season. And every two steps we walked, it was Richard. Hey, Richard Hatch. Hey. Everybody in the stadium knew Richard Hatch and then Matt. For season two, everybody was aware of Survivor, and it premiered to, like, 45 million people after the Super Bowl. And now you got Colby and Elizabeth Hasselbeck and all of these people that were instantly thrust into the spotlight. Not a slow burn like the first season.

[Matt Bellany]

At least they knew what they were getting into. I think for some of these first season people, it was quite a rude awakening.

[Jeff Probst]

Absolutely. I mean, that is whiplash, especially with Survivor, because, as you said, 50 million. I have a Hollywood Reporter cover that says 72 million people watched part of that finale.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, my God.

[Jeff Probst]

That's a lot of awareness for somebody who was a truck driver from Wisconsin six weeks ago.

[Matt Bellany]

All right, so I want to talk a little bit about your role as showrunner. I mean, everyone knows you're the host. Everyone knows what you do on camera. But since, what was it, the 2010 season, what was the season that you took over from Burnett?

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, I think that's right.

[Matt Bellany]

You are. You are the showrunner, meaning you are involved in every aspect, from the casting to the twists that they do on the show to everything that we see. So how is the show different under you as showrunner than it maybe was under Mark Burnett?

[Jeff Probst]

That's a really interesting way to ask that question, because so much as Survivor is based on the point of view of the person who's leading the creative and leading the team. And so I did have a different angle I wanted to take, and that was number one. I wanted to make Survivor a family show. And I knew what that meant. To me, it meant the type of people we put on, the type of stories we focus on. I also wanted to make it even more cinematic. It was already cinematic, but we've taken it to another level, and we spent a lot of time on lenses and time of day and how we're going to shoot things. And then the other was that I wanted to really take on the Joseph Campbell idea of this hero's journey and design a game that is the lure. The game of Survivor is deliciously fun to lie, deceit, you know, all that stuff. But the trick, I think, is the game is the MacGuffin. You play the game because it's fun, but the experience you get is what changes you. And so I'm very much about that. Everybody on our show knows we think of our show in stages and they relate to Joseph Campbell and it's very nerdy and deep, but that's what's keeping our engine fueling.

[Matt Bellany]

And how did you make it more family? Because it's funny you say that. I remember back at the beginning there was a lot of debate about whether this was a show you should watch with your children because of the lying and deceit. Now it seems kind of quaint within the culture. I mean, you've got like the president openly lying. But how did you change that?

[Jeff Probst]

Well, I think you hit on something with the game because I think in the beginning the players were sort of teaching us what this format was going to be and a lot of things became personal once we started adding more game design. It freed the people up to play. It is a game. So lying is one of the tenets of the game, so you're okay to do that. The other thing is, you look at our casting now, the type of people we put on the show tend to be people you want to root for. Not always, but we're not putting people on that you just don't like at all. And then I think the other is the type of stories you tell. I have a much more playful sense now. I love Survivor. I love having fun. I love making dumb comments. I think of kids, Matt, constantly. And again, our crew knows it's 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 year olds. That's who I'm trying to get to, to say, you could do this. You get that imagination going. And when I meet them on the street and I meet them all the time, I ask them, do you think you could make fire? Yes. Do you think you could sleep in the jungle? Yes. They're already thinking about it.

[Matt Bellany]

Craig really wants to be on the show. We'll talk about that after. But he's. It's been a. It's been a lifelong dream. I'm sure you get that all the time.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, we'll find out if Craig has even applied.

[Matt Bellany]

That's true. Okay. How do you prepare yourself for these tribal council discussions? Like, do you consult with the contestants and say, I'm going to go here, here, here. Do you prefer to surprise them?

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Do you psych yourself up?

[Matt Bellany]

You sort of have to be a quasi psychologist on this show. And like, how do you prepare?

[Jeff Probst]

Well, there's no interaction with the players, like what you just suggested. There would never be me saying, hey, here's what we're going to talk about tonight. That's part of it. This sounds crazy, but I really. Here's what I know going into tribal. I know who we think is going home. It doesn't mean they are going to go home because we have these live tribals where sometimes things change. But I have a basic idea and I also know all the critical information. Who has any kind of an advantage or a twist that might come into the game. So I'm prepared for which direction it might go. But the truth, Matt, this is the absolute truth. I just walk in and I start asking questions and they're not that complicated. It's just trying to read the group and see where, like, you can feel tension. Sometimes they walk in and I can tell, oh, man, they are in a mood. Other times they're walking in laughing. So you go in that direction. But there's no big science. I don't have cue cards or cheat sheets or anybody in my ear. It is an improv for sure.

[Matt Bellany]

And it's probably a lot easier as a production now that you have a home base in Fiji. Yeah, like, you know, jumping around the world like you did in those early seasons had to be a huge pain in the ass. Now you know the environment you're dealing with, you know how to shoot it, you've got your people, you know the angles. Like, it must just be a lot easier that way.

[Craig]

Were you in support of that, Jeff, or is that something you didn't want to do, permanently move to Fiji?

[Jeff Probst]

Well, no, it. Actually, Craig, it. It. It was a lifesaver. Here's what happened is as the years went on, it used to be we could go all over the world and find small islands and then places where we could stay. Either build tent, a tent city where we all live in tents or some temporary housing. But as the years went on, a few factors happened. Population growth. A lot of the places that we shot in the past now have hotels on them. The second was the weather. It is changing. And places we used to be able to shoot now have such tremendous storms. In fact, even in Fiji, we've evacuated twice because of high cyclones and the other was political unrest. There are now countries we simply can't and wouldn't go to. And the last one is the dollar, the falling dollar, the value overseas. So when we went to Fiji like 10 years ago, I met with the AG and said, here's the deal. If you will pay the rebate because they give us a rebate, but you never know if they're going to pay it. They're an island nation. I mean, what are you going to do? I said if you pay the rebate, we will make Survivor synonymous with Fiji and we'll work with your tourism board and we'll make this a win win. And it has been an unbelievable partnership.

[Matt Bellany]

What does the season of Survivor cost to produce now?

[Jeff Probst]

Well, I can't give you the numbers.

[Matt Bellany]

But you can give me a, you can give me a ballpark.

[Jeff Probst]

I'll tell you this. Here's how I'll answer it. Our budget has not gone down. But where you have to be adaptable is your costs still go up, crew members get raises, format fees go up.

[Matt Bellany]

And so, well, the probes fee better be going up or I'm going to talk to your reps. I'm doing. Got a little leverage there. Being a face of the show.

[Jeff Probst]

You know, it's funny you say that. That was the hiccup with when Mark wanted to make me showrunner and he went to cbs, they said, you're going to give that much leverage, you're going to let the guy be the face and let the guy be behind the camera. And Mark said, I trust Probst and I have never used it as leverage. I'm grateful for it. But it's funny you say that. Anyway, about the budget, here's what I was going to tell you. The budget stays the same but your costs go up. So you have to adapt. So one thing we did is when Covid hit, we couldn't do our reg 39 day season and then do another 39 day season because with the quarantines we would have been out there like 150 days and it was untenable. So we sat down and said, how many days do we really need to do this show? We came up with 26 days. That's one third left. And I had a few people tell me you were going to destroy the format because you can't steal a third of the production days and still deliver the same 13 episodes, 16 hours to CBS. But we thought we had a handle on it and we did. And we have done that. And then Matt, we went from 60 minutes to 90 minute episodes. So we've actually cut one third of our shooting and deliver one third more product.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, I saw some grumbling online from fans about the shortened seasons, but you know what, they still watch.

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah. And fans, the hard thing with Survivor fans is they're so passionate, but they don't always have all the information.

[Matt Bellany]

Right.

[Jeff Probst]

There's a lot of factors that go into making this show and ultimately, I hope they trust us, but I don't think we're ever going back to 39 days.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. What's the most difficult conversation you've ever had with a CBS executive about the show?

[Jeff Probst]

Wow. Really? That's such a. That's a good question. I'll tell you. Years ago, I was not allowed to talk to marketing at all, and I did not understand it. I'm the showrunner. I just shot the show. I know what the show's about. Why don't we dovetail your ideas with what really happened? And I was told church and state. Mother. Thank you. Stay away. Very frustrating for me. It made no sense. Now with Amy Reisenbach and Mike Benson, I mean, it's a whole new thing. And I'm a collaborator. We're collaborators. We text with ideas all the time. And that's feels great. I can't believe the relationship I have. But, yeah, if you talk about, like, some triggers, it would be in the past where I felt like they just wanted us to make the show and go away, and it felt weird to me to not be partners.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, and you've had some situations that have come up where, you know, contestants being creepy or you have to have standards intervene or there's, you know, weather or things that like that just come from doing a show like this. Yeah.

[Jeff Probst]

Oh, yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

We.

[Jeff Probst]

I mean, really, if you look at the 750 or whatever episodes we've done, we've had very few situations. But what I like about our show and our commitment is we show it. We show it exactly as it happened. We put it right out there, and we try to do it in a way where families can talk about it. And this is something I hear from parents all the time. They will say, what you just said, Matt, and they'll say, you know, every so often a topic comes up. It could be about race, it could be about gender. It could be whatever. We talk about it, and then you can talk to your kids and say, how would you handle that if somebody did that to you? We had a guy out, this guy Zeke, as being transgender. It was a horrible thing to do. But the guy Zeke, who had happened to handled it so beautifully, he was so composed that he turned it into this incredible teaching moment.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, don't you cast people like that knowing that it could come up? I mean, I used to talk to John Murray on the Real World, where they would cast people knowing that it would become part of their storyline, the coming out or the revelation of some dark secret or something.

[Jeff Probst]

No, here's what we tell every player. You can ask any player, and we said it was Zeke, your story is yours to tell. If you want to talk about it, if you want to come out, if this is the time you want to let your family know that you're gay, that's all for you. We never would have brought it up to Zeke and Matt. We didn't. This was his second season playing and it was near the end of the and this other player was desperate and made a really unfortunate decision, but we would have never brought it up. That's one of the things that's fun about this show is it's not scripted. It's not loosely scripted. It's not loosely suggested. We just watch. The format does the work. We stay out of the way. You go write the show and then we'll deliver it to the audience.

[Matt Bellany]

So you must watch a lot of the knockoffs, the shows that try to take elements of Survivor or blatantly copy Survivor. Why don't those shows watch work? Why has survived? I know, I know you're going to say it's better produced and, you know you're going to say that it's, you know, there's something about the. The rigor that you guys bring to it. But at this point, 25 years into this, you think that one of these shows would hit, you know, Idol walked so that the Voice could run. Where is the voice of the Survivor format?

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, it's a really good question. I don't know that I have a good answer.

[Matt Bellany]

I mean, maybe stuff like the Traders. I mean, all these shows owe Survivor a debt for the entire elimination concept and the, you know, I'm not here to make friends and, you know, the kind of modern, modern weekly elimination that we know owes a lot to Survivor, but there's never been something like Survivor that has hit the same way.

[Jeff Probst]

I don't know. I can tell you what I think. I think the format. You might. You may think this is corny. I think one of the things that's unique about Survivor is the format speaks to us. It speaks to something. There are lots of fun shows. There is no show adventure like Survivor where you take a group of strangers and you literally leave them alone in a jungle and you say, no supplies. Good luck. By the way, every few days you're going to have to vote somebody out and in the end, all those people you voted out, they'll decide who wins. Good luck. See you later. There's no show like that. There's nowhere to hide. You are stripped of everything and I think at its core, that's why I was leaning into Joseph Campbell so much. I do think there's something a little bit spiritual about Survivor when you get into it. But I think to the other part of your question, I think a show could break. What's hard right now for a new show is you have to be great every week and you have to be great every season, which means your creative cannot falter, you cannot have a bad season. So you gotta dump all your best ideas into season two and then what you got left in three, and then by four. So I think the longevity, that's what's gonna be a test for a show like Traders, which is really well done. Can it reinvent itself over year after year after year?

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, I know. I remember doing a Hollywood Reporter roundtable with you early on in the success of the show, and I remember asking why Survivor hasn't done a cold weather season. And if I remember correctly, it came back to that. Something about that format and the stranding people on an island. That is what works. And you guys didn't want to screw around with that. Is that the case?

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah. And the real, deeper answer is when you're cold, you're not out climbing a tree to get a coconut or spearfishing. You are bundled up trying to stay warm. So we talked about one location. I can't even remember where it was now. And we just kind of imagined what would happen. And we realized quickly the show will crumble because what makes it good is you can run off in the jungle and you can sleep in the dirt, you can go spearfishing. You know, all of these things you can do in nature when it's 80 degrees that you would never do if it was 15 below.

[Craig]

You guys should do a season set in downtown la. That would be a real test.

[Matt Bellany]

Yes, Survivor, la, exactly. I know. But also when you cast extremely hot people, you want them to be wearing very little clothing.

[Jeff Probst]

I think that was true for a period of time. If you look at our casting now, we don't. We really don't pay attention to that. We really don't. If you study our casting, what's happened is we've gotten more interesting, more diversity and more stories that really remind me that representation matters. Because since COVID we've been much more diverse and every single ethnic group that applies is up. And when we meet them, they almost always say, well, I finally saw somebody on your show that looked like me or talked like me or was where I was from.

[Craig]

Was there a conversation as to if Mike White was too famous to be on the show.

[Jeff Probst]

Not for me. Mike texted me months ago and said, okay, I just want to tell you, if you're doing something special for 50 and you would like me to be a part of it, I'm in. But I will need to know at some point so I can set up my White Lotus schedule around it.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, trust me, trust me. They were annoyed at hbo. I know this for a fact. They're like, yeah, we gotta. We gotta work around Mike's Survivor schedule.

[Craig]

But even when he first came on, so happy, was there a conversation of should we cast Ned Schneebly from School of Rock on the show or will that disrupt things?

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, there was actually a conversation and you're hitting it. Which was. It was a different team of leaders over there. Kelly Call was there, but what Kelly said was, do you need him? Because he's a big celebrity, he's a big name. Do you need him? And I said, he will be the single greatest storyteller in the history of our show, and I'd like to have him. And Kelly was like, okay, great. So that was the only question was. And that is how CBS deals with me all the time. There is so much trust. And I've really learned that if you can make the show for the money they give you and deliver, they will let you keep delivering. And so, yeah, they let us have money.

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[Matt Bellany]

What is your day like as a producer on the show? When you're off camera, like when you are during the middle of the shoot, what are you doing on a daily basis?

[Jeff Probst]

It's pretty much nonstop. I'm either with the players, that's when we're shooting. I mean we're shooting the players all the time but involving me. Or you're either. We have a process. We test first, we test ideas, and that's with no cameras. That's just a small crew, whoever's intimate to the project and we really try to work out the kinks. Then we do rehearsals, full cameras and we shoot everything. Then we look at tape and then we tweak a little bit more. Those are two big areas. And then you have various approvals all day. Anything from art department related to, you know, a new risk, reward, journey that we're doing or even sometimes how we're going to cover something that's brand new. I'll meet with Scott Duncan, our DP, one of our DPs and say, let's shoot this this way, to make sure that when we cut back to the beaches, it differentiates itself, you know, and it separates. So it's. And if you have tribal council, then you're finishing at 10:00 clock or 10:30.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. And when you say rehearsals, are you rehearsing with the contestants?

[Jeff Probst]

No.

[Matt Bellany]

No. That's why I was like, why? Why would you give them that opportunity?

[Jeff Probst]

No, what we do is we have. They're called the dream team. It is the greatest paid internship you will ever have in your life. It's very competitive. But we have like 20, 21, 22, 23 year olds and their job is to basically to practice these challenges, to find the problems, to find a loophole. And they got to go hard and they do and they get beat up and bloody and bruised. But they are the spirit of our show every season because it's always a new group. And so we run a full. If we have a challenge that's 100 yards long, we've got 30 cameras working and moving and jumping and tripods going over here to reset for a repo, we Run everything. And then Dave Dryden, our director will look at all the footage and go, okay, on this close up, let's make sure we rack down to the hand to get the knots. So because we only get one shot with the players, we don't have never done a pickup. We never ask them to do anything again.

[Matt Bellany]

You don't really. I think that's a staple of most shows.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, we don't.

[Matt Bellany]

You don't do that. Interesting.

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah.

[Matt Bellany]

Why does it take a thousand people to do a season of survive? You said that recently on another interview.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, we have 400 of our primary crew, our international crew from say 20 different countries. And then we have about 400 sometimes more local Fijians which are day workers that come in from their islands. The reason is we build a city. So if you imagine a normal shoot in Atlanta, everybody's in a hotel. You go to dinner, you meet your friends, somebody comes to visit. We're on an island a mile long island, this kind of older resort that we're lucky to get every season. And that's it. There is no restaurant. We have catering. Our kitchen staff makes 100,000 meals every year. We have our own medical department. We have our own safety department. We have our own accounting department. We have everything. It is like you're a community.

[Matt Bellany]

And the survivor accountant comes to Fiji.

[Jeff Probst]

We have Matt, we're paying bills the whole time we're there.

[Matt Bellany]

That's true. I guess that's probably the plum assignment in the CBS accounting department.

[Jeff Probst]

Well, here's the cool part of our world. If you ever come visit and you're welcome. Is our culture one of the. It used to be that we were, we had a lot of confidentiality. We didn't want anybody to know anything so nobody could visit location. And it was very isolated. But that was when we were all young and nobody was married or had kids. People started having families. And I quickly realized this is not tenable to have these people leave their kids. So the really the first big thing I got at CBS was to have them let go of the confidentiality. And I just said we won't survive. I won't keep coming. Nobody's going to keep coming if we can't bring our family. So now check this fact. We have 73 babies born to people who met while working on our show.

[Matt Bellany]

Wow, that's crazy.

[Jeff Probst]

Met and have 73 babies. So Matt, if you come to location like season 50, we were shot there. We have 15 kids, little kids running all over the place. So there's all this joy and happiness because dad's right over there working. Mom's right over there working. Maybe their kid is old enough now to work on the show. We have a lot of parent child relationships. It's really unique.

[Matt Bellany]

How much do you follow the drama at the corporate level of your company? I mean, you're one of the longest tenured CBS talents. You're obviously a big priority for them at the company. Like, do you have any relationship with David Ellison? Like, what is that not David?

[Jeff Probst]

No. All I've heard from George was George.

[Matt Bellany]

Cheeks who runs cbs. Yeah.

[Jeff Probst]

George just said, hey, just want you to know, David wants you to know that Survivor continues to remain a massive priority. So just keep doing what you're doing. Yeah. And you know, Matt, this, you know, Survivor 50 is obviously a big season for us, but CBS promised me, they made a point of saying, go out there and kill it and we will support you like you've never seen before. And, man, they are. We have so many things happening for 50.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. You're doing this whole run up to the 50th. You're getting plugged up the wazoo on football. Like you're getting, it seems like you're getting a priority.

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, they really are. And that's what I, that's what I meant. Earlier I talked to some of my other friends in the industry and they say, well, do you ever get notes? And I said, not really. Mitch Graham, my day to day, he might say, hey, clarity issue here. Can you remind me who that is? But for the most part, they continue to let us flourish. And here's the analogy I always use with our team is we were given this glass ball. It's this beautiful glass ball. I don't want to drop it and break it. But we do have to be willing to throw that glass ball very high up in the air and then we just gotta catch it. Because you do have to reinvent. We reinvent Survivor all the time to keep fans happy and to keep players off balance.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, I think David Ellison should be kissing your ass way more. You are, you're, you're, you're the face of that show. So there's nowhere else you want to take this franchise? Is there a place that you guys haven't been able to go or do or something that you want to do with it? Maybe a, a digital offshoot, maybe a follow up show, you know, Survivor alums doing some different game. Is there anything you'd want to do with this that you haven't done?

[Jeff Probst]

No. And all those ideas are ideas that get talked about and then you just think about the dilution of the franchise. And it's the same reason I was never driven to have a production company and have 10 shows, because I. I'm more. I want to put all my energy into something. And so I just decided I want to put all my ideas into Survivor because the format can handle any idea. There's not a situation you could suppose that you couldn't try on Survivor because the format is very simple. A group of strangers must work together while conspiring against each other. You can do whatever else you want in there. So there's no limit. And even for 51, we've got an idea of where we want to take the show. So I don't think it's a physical location. I think it's a. It's a creative approach to where the game goes.

[Matt Bellany]

And it's been smart, too. They tried to do all sorts of weird things with the challenge, which I enjoy the MTV show, and it never really worked. And then they did a CBS season with international people, and I don't know. You're right about the franchise dilution and being smart about keeping the show what people love. And I think a lot of times in town, people, they can't resist. They try to exploit what they've got, and then ultimately they end up killing the baby. All right, Craig has some questions. Craig, please restrain yourself. If you have a contestant video, please, you can send that to Jeff separately.

[Craig]

Look, it's a conversation I need to have with my wife. That's going to be the hardest challenge, is to get my wife to agree to even allow me to submit. But I could ask you a million questions, Jeff. I love Survivor. Are there conversations in production meetings about what. How ruthless you are in terms of the resources and the food that you're providing? Contestants, do you have some people who are a little bit more strict and want to kind of remove some of the accommodations that you give people? And are there other producers who are more lenient?

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, well, we talk about it as a group, and right now we're.

[Craig]

Because it's changed kind of what you provided.

[Jeff Probst]

Yeah, it has. It has. When we stopped for Covid, that was really the first chance we had had to sit down and look at the show. And Matt Van Wagen and I, kind of my partner on the show, we just sat back and started thinking about what the show could be and where else you could take it. And Dangerous Fun was something that we really landed on. And then that became, okay, what about no food? What about no supplies? What about really dangerous advantages that if you pick them up they may explode on you. And I think that's kind of what you're talking about. And we're really happy with that in terms of I don't think we should be giving them food very often and supplies because I think that struggle is part of what gets you down and breaks you down and then opens you up.

[Craig]

Have you ever tried to live the Survivor way, the way the contestants do to get a sense of what it's like? Have you done a week?

[Jeff Probst]

I have not done a week. And it's funny. We have.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, that's B.S. you gotta walk the walk.

[Jeff Probst]

We had some influencers come out for Survivor 49 and we gave them, I think it was a 36 hour test and oh my God, they were destroyed. And it did. I know I'm an imposter, Craig. I'm fully aware that I talk smack that I have never walked.

[Matt Bellany]

That's funny. Thank you, Jeff Probst for coming on the show.

[Jeff Probst]

Matt, thanks for having me on.

[Matt Bellany]

We are back with a call sheet. Craig, let me have it.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

You probably want to know why I'm wearing a suit.

[Craig]

I know why you're wearing a suit. I saw your Instagram.

[Matt Bellany]

Yes.

[Craig]

You were at the Oscars luncheon and I have to say, quite a flex out of you sitting in the very front row next to pta.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Okay, can I explain that first of.

[Matt Bellany]

All the Oscar nominees lunch. If you don't know, it's like all the nominees get invited to this lunch the academy does every year. It's very nice and it's really like it's the quintessential Hollywood is just high school with money.

[Craig]

What is the point of it? Literally, what's the point of the lunch?

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

The point of the lunch is to take a photo where everybody gets their name called. They literally get a certificate for being.

[Matt Bellany]

An Oscar nominee and they are given.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

A speech by the head of the academy that tells them when they win, if they win, to not thank their agents.

[Matt Bellany]

You know, be emotional. Like it's basically just a prep pep talk for it. But what it really is, it is.

[Craig]

Like a yearbook photo where you get up on the bleachers and take a photo of the whole. The senior class.

[Matt Bellany]

Absolutely. And it's like everyone gets their senior superlative and gets up on stage. What it really is is a chance to campaign.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Everybody is there shaking hands, charming people, making themselves known. You know, it's a big faux pas.

[Matt Bellany]

To miss it because it shows that you don't have respect for the Academy. So you got to go.

[Craig]

And tons of media there.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Tons of media. And what they do is they put a journalist at most of the tables.

[Matt Bellany]

So what they do, it was not.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

That I was deemed cool enough to be in the front row. And the, you know, the head table, you literally put your hand in a.

[Matt Bellany]

Fishbowl of table numbers and pull one out.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

When you check in as media, it's a lottery. It is a literal lottery to see where you sit.

[Matt Bellany]

And I happened to get table number.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Two, so I happened to end up sitting next to Paul Thomas Anderson and across from Jesse Buckley. It was a pretty sweet seat for me.

[Craig]

Do you think it was a frozen envelope situation and they wanted you up there?

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

I seriously doubt that. Knowing how the Academy thinks of my coverage, I seriously doubt that.

[Matt Bellany]

But I will say it's rigged because there are some tables that do not have journalists at them.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

And guess who sits at those tables? Leo DiCaprio, Timmy Chalamet, Emma Stone. Like, no media at those tables. But Timmy was very nice. He says continue to be nice to him, which is funny. But PTA was great.

[Matt Bellany]

So honestly, it was great experience.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Like, I don't.

[Matt Bellany]

I don't.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

I don't really care about celebrities much, but it was a fun environment because it was kind of.

[Matt Bellany]

Everybody was kind of unguarded and, like, actually having a good time.

[Craig]

Did you have any takeaway coming out of this that. That you want to make a prediction on?

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

My prediction today is based on some of the interactions I saw. I'm going to predict that Paul Thomas.

[Matt Bellany]

Anderson will work with Timothee Chalamet on an upcoming project.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

They had some kind of vibe going, like, almost like a little sign language thing where they were, like, making gestures at each other, and they. They were sort of on a wavelength. It was almost like PTA was kind of courting him, and Timmy was courting him back. I know actors and directors do that kind of, like, mutual love affairs stuff a lot, but this seemed like something was up. So I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Chalamet will be in an upcoming PTA project.

[Craig]

I mean, sure, right? He's like, the hottest director. He, you know, Timmy's the hottest actor also, you know, you follow in the Leon Caprio playbook. You work with all. With all the best directors. It would make sense that Timmy would want to work with a guy like Peter.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

No superheroes and no drugs.

[Matt Bellany]

No hard drugs.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

All right, that's the show for today.

[Matt Bellany]

I want to thank my guest, Jeff.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

Probst, producer Greg Horback. Artist Jesse lopez and Jon Jones.

[Matt Bellany]

And I want to thank you.

[Unidentified Male Host/Co-host]

We'll see you one more time this week.