Oscars Winners and Losers, and Universal’s Pivot to Keep Movies in Theaters Longer

Summary

The Town with Matthew Belloni

Episode Summary: “Oscars Winners and Losers, and Universal’s Pivot to Keep Movies in Theaters Longer”

Release Date: March 16, 2026
Host: Matthew Belloni (B)
Guests: Lucas Shaw, Bloomberg (C); Producer Craig Horlbeck (D)

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Overview

This lively episode tackles two core Hollywood topics: the immediate Oscars aftermath—who won, who lost, and the highlights within the Dolby Theatre—and Universal’s headline-grabbing shift back to longer theatrical windows for its movies. Matthew Belloni, joined by Lucas Shaw and Craig Horlbeck, offers sharp analysis of industry trends, inside-the-room color, and the business logic (and backstage politics) behind recent changes in how, when, and where audiences watch movies.

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Oscars 2026: Inside the Room

First-Time Attendance and Atmosphere (04:01–06:33)

• Lucas Shaw reflects on his first Oscars:
  • Despite a history of Oscar parties at home, he acknowledges, "As someone who loves movies and loves the Oscars, I found myself feeling at a certain point like... you take it all in and it’s something you grew up watching... it is very fun to sit there and see it and experience it in person." (04:13)
  • Belloni pushes back: The Oscars feel different in person and carry an aura of seriousness—“People care. Like Michael B. Jordan brought his dad, who never comes to anything, to the Oscars. Like, that's the difference with the Oscars.” (06:01)
• Colorful touches:
  • Both debate the oddity of a sushi bar at the Governor's Ball and detail other culinary highlights like the chicken pot pie and caviar cones—capturing the event’s unique “Hollywood gala” flavor. (04:49–05:29)
  • Belloni observes, “It’s way... people take it way more seriously... it’s full formal.” (05:41)

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Big Winners of the Night (06:40–09:48)

• Studios:
  • Mike and Pam (Warner Bros. co-CEOs):
    • Triumphed with two high-stakes films, Sinners (original, big-budget hit) and One Battle After Another (riskier, but critical darling)
    • Repeated on-stage thank-yous mark their leadership—"Four times. I counted four. Mike and Pam, thank yous. Amy Madigan, Ryan Coogler, MBJ, thank them. And Sarah Murphy, the producer." (07:39)
• Ryan Coogler:
  • Described as "man of the hour” in the room, with an outsized audience response—"Like Ryan Coogler, huge... maybe even bigger than PTA as a winner." (08:19)
• Theatrical Exhibition:
  • “If you look at these winners… all of the narrative features that won Oscars last night were movies that grossed over $100 million worldwide.” (09:26)
  • Even Netflix entries (Frankenstein, K-Pop) were widely watched, signaling mass-appeal as a badge of Oscar success.

Notable Quote

• “All of the narrative features that won Oscars last night were movies that grossed over $100 million worldwide.” – Belloni (09:26)

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Noted Winners & Losers (10:59–18:24)

Winners:

• Neil Mohan (YouTube): “Least famous studio head there…most powerful person at this show.” (10:15)
• Security: No mishaps despite heightened threats.
• International Reach: Norway’s first international film Oscar; international (and documentary) winners were the only ones making political statements.

Losers:

• Disney:
  • Excessive self-promotion during the broadcast and awkward product placement—"They lost the Oscars to YouTube." (10:59)
  • Awkward attempts to leverage the Oscars for franchise synergy called out: “Instead of introducing the category, they’re basically just talking about the Avengers.” (11:30)
• Producers of the Show:
  • Show ran “way, way, way long,” botched some sensitive moments (like an abrupt cut-off during the K-Pop category win), and missed comedic opportunities.
• A24 and ‘Marty Supreme’:
  • Timothée Chalamet’s major campaign fell flat, and the film was shut out in major categories.
  • “I think they’re gonna do a lot of soul-searching about where the Marty Supreme campaign went wrong… all of a sudden it wins nothing.” (13:24)

Notable Quotes

• “If you’re Chalamet... you seemed like a sure thing...and then you kind of blow it at the last minute...” – Lucas Shaw (14:19)
• “If you are him... you do a full autopsy on what happened and why. Did they do one too many things? Did they do ten too many things?” – Belloni (15:04)
• “The whole thing with the ballet stuff that happened so late that it didn't ... impact voting at all. ...I think he was losing this regardless.” – Belloni (15:29)
• “He did so much press that you’re bound to like slip up... I bet you he’ll be more subtle next time.” – Producer Craig (16:24)
• “First female cinematographer to ever win an Oscar, Autumn Arkhipa.” (18:20)

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Memorable and Awkward Moments (18:30–21:36)

• Conan O’Brien’s jokes—at both Amazon (few/no noms) and Ted Sarandos/Netflix—spark industry reflection on studio presence and public perception.
• “It’s a flex... he was the only studio chief to get a moment in the sun during the show.” – Lucas Shaw on Sarandos (19:13)
• “He’s just come off a campaign of two and a half months where he tried to change that opinion...now he’s going to go back to being the guy who’s trying to kill theaters...” – Belloni (19:45)

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Universal’s Pivot to Longer Theatrical Windows (21:36–29:18)

What Changed?

• Universal will shift to a minimum of five weekends of exclusive play for new movies (up from three); in 2027, it increases to seven weekends (about 45 days) before paid video-on-demand (PVOD).
  • “Universal announced...they are moving their windows back. Not quite to where they were pre-COVID...guarantee seven weekends starting in 2027.” (21:36)

The Industry Context

• “Windows” (release schedule: theaters → rental → streaming) had collapsed post-COVID as studios rushed to boost streaming services.
• Some studios (e.g., Sony) are publicly embracing longer gaps before films hit “free” streaming, reflecting renewed faith in theatrical revenue and pressure from star filmmakers.

Is it a Big Deal?

• Shaw’s View: It’s “about optics and PR more than anything,” suggesting it's at least partly a signal to filmmakers and talent, as well as a bid to retrain consumers. (22:16)
• Belloni’s Position: Disagrees—argues it’s an industry-wide effort to reverse a slide in box office and consumer expectation:
  • “It’s not...those later weekends that are suffering. It’s the first weekend. ...People are being trained to know that the movies are coming sooner rather than later.” (22:22)
• Distinction (PVOD vs. SVOD):
  • The change affects PVOD, not “free” streaming (SVOD).
  • “The streaming window for Universal remains one of the longest in the industry.” – Shaw (23:08)
  • Sony now promises at least 100-120 days before the Netflix streaming window (Pay 1 deal) per Tom Rothman’s op-ed.
  • Chris Nolan (Universal’s star director) reportedly requires a 120-day window in his deals.

What’s the Real Strategy?

• Balancing maximizing digital/rental revenue vs. restoring that “theaters first” imperative for a healthier future.
• Appealing to top talent: “If you have a project out there, you can have Tom Rothman, Mike Luke, whomever, saying, if you come to us, we’re going to leave it in theaters for six weeks...” (24:59)
• Universal responding to internal and external pressures—“Chris Nolan...thinks that theatrical window should be 60 days.” (25:09)

Notable Quotes

• “The movement now in the industry is to get that SVOD window to be longer...because that is what the consumer sees as free.” – Belloni (26:59)

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More Oscars Color: Room Energy and Memes (29:18–32:44)

• Craig Horlbeck’s Take: This Oscars felt more suspenseful and energetic than his other two experiences—especially the rivalry between Sinners and One Battle After Another for Best Picture. (29:32–29:51)
• On Oscar Parties:
  • Belloni describes behind-the-scenes: stars freely mingling, sneaking drinks, Timothée Chalamet and Kylie Jenner’s 45-minute break from the ceremony.
  • Kumail Nanjiani’s handling of a tie “impressively professional” (31:14)
  • “Everyone cares. ...That’s why it’s fun.” – Belloni (32:00)

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Oscars Betting and Prediction Markets (32:45–35:18)

• Both hosts recount their bets: Heavy favorites mostly paid out, but the heavy action was on tight races (e.g., Best Actor).
• Gambling is fun on the side, but both urge it not be incorporated into the actual broadcast—"Please never incorporate gambling into the broadcast." (35:11)
• Over $100M reportedly bet on the Oscars via prediction markets. (34:10)

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Additional Notable Quotes & Moments

• “I think Lucas is wrong. I think...that the thing that’s different about the Oscars is everybody cares. ...It is meaningful, these people getting up there.” – Belloni (32:00)
• On the politics of Oscar speeches: “I don’t love the politics stuff. ...It’s preaching to the choir and alienates the audience.” – Belloni (18:04)
• “We’re still team Timmy on the show, are we not?” – Belloni (16:53)

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Key Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment / Topic | |-----------|-------------------------------------------------------------------| | 04:01 | Oscar “on the ground” impressions | | 06:40 | Major Oscar winners (Warner Bros., Ryan Coogler, Theaters) | | 09:26 | Belloni on win for theatrical exhibition | | 10:59 | Disney’s excessive self-promotion | | 12:35 | Awkward moments (show production criticism, A24 miss) | | 14:19 | Chalamet’s failed Oscar campaign | | 18:20 | First female cinematographer wins Oscar | | 19:45 | Ted Sarandos jokes and Netflix “theater enemy” perception | | 21:36 | Universal’s new theater window policy discussed | | 24:59 | Attracting talent via promises of theatrical exclusivity | | 26:59 | SVOD window importance clarified | | 29:18 | Oscars afterparty antics, on-the-ground energy | | 32:45 | Oscars betting – does it belong? |

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Tone & Style

The episode is brisk, smart, and occasionally irreverent, with insidery humor and a distinct, plugged-in Hollywood voice. Matt, Lucas, and Craig move easily from party banter to business insight, painting the dual realities of glitzy award nights and the less glamorous, high-stakes chess game playing out between studios, streaming platforms, and creative talent.

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Bottom Line

This episode gives listeners a front-row seat—both to the jubilation and drama behind the Oscars and the critical, often invisible decisions shaping the industry's future. The universal truth: The Oscars still matter, the business of movies is in flux, and even top studios are retrenching to rebuild the audience’s belief in the magic of the theater.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

This episode of the Town is brought to you by the Madison, the new original series on Paramount, plus its Academy Award nominee Taylor Sheridan's most intimate story yet. A New York City family is uprooted to Montana after an unexpected tragedy. In the quiet majesty of the Madison Valley, they confront love and loss, discovering resilience and the transformative power of family and the land that grounds them. Led by a powerhouse cast, Academy Award nominee Michelle Pfeiffer and Golden Globe nominee Kurt Russell. Don't miss the Madison, the highly anticipated new series streaming now only on Paramount. Plus, it is Monday, March 16th. Often, the least sexy aspects of Hollywood are the most important to the business. In movies, I'm talking about Windows, the shorthand for how studios get the most value out of each title by releasing it first in theaters, then for rent on home video, then on subscription streaming services, and so on. As we know, the windowing system has been under attack since COVID Universal first blew up the traditional window of 75 days, or even 60 days, to institute a system that guaranteed a movie only 17 days in theaters. Most got more. But it varied by title, and the message to consumers was pretty clear this movie is likely going to be on streaming pretty soon. Other studios followed with variable windows, first to P VOD, then to SVODs like Netflix and Hulu, all to feed their streaming business. And meanwhile, moviegoers were getting the message and skipping theaters. The theater chains have all either gone bankrupt or been perpetually teetering, like my friend Adam Aaron at amc. But then last week, Universal announced a change says it's going to switch to a minimum of five weekends of exclusive play for new movies, up from three next year. It will go to seven weekends before P VOD. That's about 45 days similar to what Paramount recently committed to for its movies and Warner Brothers titles. If that deal happens. Donna Langley, the head of Universal, she told the New York Times, our windowing strategy has always been designed to evolve with the marketplace. We firmly believe in the primacy of theatrical exclusivity and working closely with our exhibition partners to support a healthy, sustainable theatrical ecosystem. Tom Rothman, the head of the Sony studio who came on this show a few weeks ago to argue for longer windows. He followed it up with a Times op ed piece last week where he revealed that in Sony's new Netflix deal, films won't go to subscription streaming till 100 to 120 days after theatrical release. The P VOD versus SVOD question is extremely important in this debate, but why the backtrack now? And what's the right window for movies to rent and watch on services many consider to be free? That's what we're talking about with Lucas Shaw, our Monday guy. Today we're going to do the Oscars. Of course, our winners and losers. What Craig and I ate important stuff like that. And we're going to do the new shift in Windows strategy. How long is long enough? From the ringer and puck, I'm Matt Bellany and this is the town. Okay. We are here with Lukas Shaw from Bloomberg. Welcome back. Lukas, how was your first Oscars? I cannot believe you haven't been ever. It's kind of insane.

[C]

Take it up with the Academy. Take it. I like having Oscar parties. I grew up with my parents having Oscar parties, making themed food. It's fun to watch at home with friends. And so that on a very like this is a very not town comment or not matte coded comment. It's a privilege to be there. As someone who loves movies and loves the Oscars, I found myself feeling at a certain point like there's this more skeptical, like cynical side of me that I'll get to in a second. But you take it all in and it's something that you grew up watching and so it is very fun to sit there and see it and experience it in person.

[B]

I agree. As cynical as we can be on this show about all aspects of Hollywood, there is something very cool that this, this thing exists and it's a 100 year old tradition and we get to go.

[C]

I did have the chicken pot pie at your recommendation. Is excellent.

[B]

Delicious, right? Unfortunately, they moved the sushi bar at the Governor's Ball. It was not where it normally is. They moved it to the opposite side of the party which caused me to have to search for it. And then by the time I got there, there was a little bit of a line, which was disappointing.

[C]

I still don't get why at a Wolfgang Puck catered event you're going out of your way for the sushi. That's the Globes. With Nobu, you don't need.

[B]

I don't know. I don't know why. I just love it so much. Maybe it's because I haven't eaten in five hours, but. And they added a little crispy rice station this year, which I found delicious.

[C]

So overall, a little caviar cone station. So this is.

[B]

Yes, the.

[C]

The. The. I will say, because I've been to all the other major award shows, it doesn't. Other than like the crazy security to get in, it doesn't feel any different. It's like the same thing.

[B]

Oh, it does. Are you kidding? I feel like it's way. People take it way more seriously. First of all, everyone except you is dressed up. You. For some reason we're not wearing a tux. But everyone is full formal. And people care. Like Michael B. Jordan brought his dad, who never comes to anything, to the Oscars. Like, that's the difference with the Oscars.

[C]

People care and it's taken more seriously, which is reflecting security. I just mean as an attendee, what my experience is, is not that different. You.

[B]

Yeah, okay.

[C]

The red carpet part, sure. But then the. Like you're. When you're in the show. Okay, I'm watching the show. I go out to the bar, I talk to some people. I go back to watch it. You're at the gov. You're at the Governor's Ball. Like it doesn't. The. Like the star wattage there isn't necessarily higher than it is at the Globes or the Gramm.

[B]

And Ed Begley Jr. Is there for some reason. I don't know why. Every year he's there. Before we move on, I want a couple winners and losers from the night.

[C]

Sure.

[B]

Just to get your sense, you can go with the first winner, which is obvious. I mean, the obvious winner.

[C]

I'm gonna do two in one because they're related. Mike and Pam, co CEOs of Warner Brothers. One battle after another is their movie. Sinners is their movie. They were seen as kind of these risky bets because they were. One was original. The other, the Coogler movie, was original and fairly expensive for an original movie. The PTA movie was an adaptation of a Thomas Pynchon novel, but also far and away the most expensive movie that PTA had ever Made the Sinners is not only a huge box office success, but goes on to be the second biggest winner at the Academy Awards. One battle after another loses money in theaters. Yeah, I was about to say that number isn't as great as people were hoping in box office, but it did pretty well. You throw in the big Oscar campaign, it's going to have a long life on streaming and rental. And so it'll end up being something that they're happy to have in the library. And so that is. And they get name checked on stage for believing an original work again and again and again.

[B]

Four times. I counted four. Mike and Pam, thank yous. Amy Madigan, Ryan Coogler, mbj, thank them. And Sarah Murphy, the producer. So did you hear a Zaslav? Thank you. Yes, someone. So someone did I forget which one of.

[C]

I forget which one of the ones you just said. I think it was maybe an early one. But someone did say thanks to David Zaslav.

[B]

Maybe I have a blocker on my radar.

[C]

The other one that I think, and I don't know if this counts as part of the same, but I just think it was so evident both from the crowd reaction, but also the way in which Michael B. Jordan spoke about him, the way the cinematographer spoke about him. Like Ryan Coogler, huge. Like I would say maybe even bigger than PTA as a winner of award season.

[B]

Well, certainly in the room the crowd was like three or four times bigger and more enthusiastic for sinners than one battle, which is. I was like, holy shit, is this. It's going to win. Didn't happen that way. I think a lot of the international voters fell for one battle. Yeah, but, but in the room, like he was the man of the hour and you know, you got to throw Zaslav in there as a winner. Did you hear what happened at the Warner's party on Friday about his speech? Yeah, he. He got up and at the Warner's party and in front of all the talent from all the movies and went on and on about one battle and sinners and didn't mention weapons. And Amy Madigan and Zack Kreger were standing right there. It's like, dude, I mean you have a whole team of handlers, like get a speech together. That's not going to. Mike and Pam, to their credit, Mike got up and like dutifully thanked them and made them feel special.

[C]

But man, as long as your studio chiefs do it.

[B]

Shout out to Amazing sub.

[C]

Yes, shout out to David Zaslav for dusting something off of my tuxedo. That you don't think was a tuxedo.

[B]

Oh, that was nice of him. Yeah, we had some nice chats this weekend. He's very happy.

[C]

Are you going to go with a winner or a loser?

[B]

Let's go. Losers. I mean. Well, I was going to say the other winner first is the theaters. If you look at these winners, take out the Netflix movies and take out the international winner. All of the narrative features that won Oscars last night were movies that grossed over $100 million worldwide. So these are movies that people saw well.

[C]

And even if you don't want to count it for the theater reasons, the two Netflix movies that won most of the awards, Frankenstein and K Pop, were also very popular movies. They were not small movies. So everything that won was something that a lot of people saw.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. And that I think is a huge win, both for moviegoing and theaters and Netflix and for the Oscars.

[C]

Now, whether it leads to ratings, we'll see.

[B]

Yeah, we do not have the ratings yet.

[C]

Well, I'll get there for one of my losers.

[B]

And then the quiet winner, we both saw him on the way in. It was Neil Mohan of YouTube, the least famous studio head there.

[C]

Despite your gratuitous jabs at him.

[B]

I. That was not gratuitous. I said, how does it feel that nobody knows who you are and you're the most powerful person at this entire show? That's not rude. His publicist didn't like that. I mean, that guy is just like stealth power. He knows that he is the most powerful guy there.

[C]

YouTube people and Disney people were both in the room and kind of circling each other and trying not to interact too much. And it was funny because they've also traded executives, where one of the top executives at Disney is this guy Adam Smith, who used to be at YouTube, and one of the top executives at YouTube is Justin Connelly, who used to be at Disney.

[B]

And that leads into one of my losers for the night. And we can go into that. Disney. I mean, come on. The amount of Spawn Con all the promo, it used to be that Disney recognized that, you know, they are a television network and a film studio. So they were very cognizant of not using the Oscars to promote their own wares. That has gone out the window now. They just do not care. They lost the Oscars to YouTube. So it was one after another. Grogu sitting next to Kate Hudson, The

[C]

Robert Downey Jr. Chris Evans thing, where instead of introducing the category, they're basically just talking about the Avengers.

[B]

It was pretty cringy like if I

[C]

knew it was going to happen once they walked out, it was unfortunate, I

[B]

know, but, but I don't think they got a big boost out of that. If I, if I'm a Marvel fan and I look at that, I'm like, wow, is Avengers not cool anymore? Like, I don't know man, that just wasn't. And then they, they, they got Anna Wintour to come to LA and promote Devil Wears Prada with an hathway.

[C]

See it, it, it reminds me, and we've talked about this in the past, like if they were just better about using the Oscars as a promotional campaign for the movie business and for the movies that are coming up. Like if you had it with, you know, you had trailer debuts, if you had other things, it would feel less.

[B]

I've talked about it.

[C]

I know you've talked about it. It would feel less spawn Connie and more natural if there was a way to do. Well, this feeds into my other. I think one of the losers is the producers of the show in general for a couple of reasons. One, it ran way, way, way long. And as a result.

[B]

And they also managed to cut people off.

[C]

And as a result of that, that K pop moment was dreadful. You have like this huge moment. There'd never been a K pop song that had won. The woman on stage, EJ who got it was like, she's been such a sweetheart throughout the whole awards process because she's sort of like a hidden person. She's not in the movie. And then she tried to hand it off.

[B]

They were not ever supposed to be a band that people watched live.

[C]

She tried to hand it off to someone. El cut it. And they, then they waited for like 45 seconds cuz they'd let other people pick it up and they didn't let it. It was just so awkward and I felt incredible.

[B]

I kept saying to Craig, I was like, oh, nope, he's trying, he's trying to come back. He's trying. And oh, they're going to let him, they're going to let him come back one.

[C]

Yeah, I mean there's a. I have a lot of thoughts, like why bring out the women from Bridesmaids if you're not going to have them do something funny? Why have them just like, oh, I

[B]

think they thought it was going to be funny. They thought that was funny. I, I just don't think it was. My loser, which is an obvious one, is obviously Marty supreme. And I think a 24 in general because they also lost in a couple other categories. You Know where I think they're going to do a lot of soul searching about where the Marty supreme campaign went wrong. Because you have the number one film marketer out there right now in Timmy Chalamet, who could seemingly do no wrong and was everywhere and won a lot of the precursor awards. And then the campaign just hit a wall and all of a sudden it wins nothing.

[C]

So I had that question, but not so much about 824, but about Chalamet, if you're him and you seemed like a sure thing. Right. And your marketing campaign, which, by the way, one of the stories I wanted to do this Oscar season that I didn't really get around to because was my understanding is a lot of what happened was actually him, not the studio,

[B]

meaning he was driving the campaign, but that's why you hire him. Yeah.

[C]

He had people he works with who are, who are setting up different partnerships and without even a 24 needing to facilitate in some cases. And then you kind of blow it at the last minute or it doesn't happen for you. Do you blame yourself? Does that make you change your strategy at all? Or do you say, look, what I did meant that this movie opened, it validated me as a major star. I almost won again and one of these days the academy is going to reward me because they know I'm great. Or does he pull a cruise where he changes his behavior or changes his entire outlook, what movies he's making, all that stuff.

[B]

Girlfriend, new, new strategy.

[C]

Does he believe in the Kardashian curse because of this or something like that?

[B]

I. I don't know. I mean, first of all, I think number one, the movie opened and the movie performed worldwide. The fact that this movie got above $200 million is still opening around the world. Like that is number one. You have to think of the money first. And he is not any less of a bankable star because of what happened at the Oscars. Now, having said that, I think you do. If you are him and you care very much about marketing and, and you know, the trajectory of your career, you do a full autopsy on what happened and why. They. Did they do one too many things? Did they do ten too many things is scarcity, the new, you know, ubiquity. All of that gets looked at. The whole thing with the ballet stuff that happened so late that it didn't, I don't believe impact voting at all. People in the real world think it did, but I don't think it did. I think he was losing this regardless.

[D]

But what that did the ballet and opera thing. Although I don't think it affected him losing the Oscar. But it was a product of, I think, like overexposure. And I bet you that is the takeaway is he probably was like, okay, I did so much. It worked to open the movie. But for the campaign, he did so much press that you're bound to like slip up every once in a while. So I bet you whatever thing he does next, I bet you he's going to disappear for a little while and whatever he does next is not going to be the same Marty supreme, full throttle, over the top marketing campaign. I bet you he will be a little bit more subtle next time.

[B]

Well, we've got Dune coming up end of the year. So does he pull back on that?

[D]

But that's not going to be an Oscar play for his. For acting.

[B]

Maybe. You never know. You never know. It's the end of the trilogy. And they talked about how the last one, Denis didn't get nominated because everyone's waiting for the third one like Lord of the Rings to go nuts on it. So maybe there will be another Oscar campaign.

[D]

Well, it's just hard to ride that hot for so long. I mean, he's basically been doing press for two straight years from Bob Dylan through this.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[C]

And he's got yet another end of the year movie. So I.

[B]

Right. And we're. We're still team Timmy on the show, are we not?

[D]

Yeah. He's like the most bankable movie star under look 35.

[C]

Yeah. I'm, I'm happy that Michael B. Jordan one. I personally would have voted for Chalamet. I thought that movie was. Was really good. And he was in every frame. Another loser was. Was Amazon. Just the Conan joke about how they had no nominations. I, you know, again, I would say other winners. I'm going to give a shout out to security didn't have any mishaps, despite all the threats.

[B]

Sure. No drone strikes.

[C]

No drone strikes. Norway won its first. I think they said it was, that it was its first international film Oscar. Someone can. Someone I believe that is fact check me on that. In Memoriam section was a highlight of the show.

[B]

Unfortunately, Craig and I watched that with drinks in our hands from the lobby because we got locked out. Yeah.

[C]

And I would just say in general, people might not like it or not, but the international film people for documentary for the winners, Javier Bardem were like the only people willing to say anything political, whether you agree with what they said or not. I think it is notable that basically other than Jimmy Kimmel, no American had any stones to go there.

[B]

So, yeah, I, I, I'm mixed on that. I don't love the politics stuff. I just think it's preaching to the choir and alienates the audience. But, you know, maybe I'm, maybe I'm just not progressive.

[C]

No, a lot of people feel the way you do. A lot of people.

[B]

And it was better than the Globes. Like, Globes had nothing. Yes.

[D]

Well, also the first female cinematographer to ever win an Oscar, Autumn Arkhipa.

[B]

Yeah, that was a nice moment. And I like that Conan, like, because people at home wouldn't know that. I like that they acknowledge that.

[C]

We're going to talk about another Conan joke as a segue into what else you want to talk about. Do you think Sarando, do you think that people at home understood the Ted Sarandos jokes?

[B]

Oh, yeah. He made it very clear that this is Netflix and it's the first, yeah, first time in a theater. And you got it. Now the thing is, Ted laughed very heartily, like, good sport, Ted. How furious on a scale of 1 to 10, do you think he secretly was?

[C]

I'm gonna go not that furious. Only because he was the only studio chief to get like a moment in the sun during the show. It was a flex and like it shows on, on abc. Unless I missed that Josh tomorrow, the new CEO, like, didn't have a, a moment for himself on camera.

[B]

They obviously, and I didn't watch the broadcast, but I don't even think they flashed to him. Usually they will flash to Iger.

[C]

Someone showed that they flashed there. At least the camera got Josh and Dana.

[B]

Oh, they did okay. All right. And he was at Governor's Ball for a little bit and then left. But I actually think Ted was probably, if he thinks about that joke a little bit, I think he's going to be a little mad about it. I put it like a six or seven because the whole, I mean, we know how much Ted loves awards and we know how much they covet the best picture and this kind of thing, it once again just doesn't put them up against a wall when trying to appeal to voters because they are now the enemy of theaters. And he's just come off a campaign of two and a half months where he tried to change that opinion and, you know, people. And now he's going to go back to being the guy who's trying to kill theaters, at least in the public perception. I know he doesn't say that and he says he loves personally going to movie theaters, but jokes like that don't help.

[C]

I saw one of his movies in theaters over the weekend. My mom and I were the only people in the theater.

[B]

Yes. That's really funny.

[A]

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[B]

So, speaking of theaters and nobody in them, let's move on to Windows because some developments this week. We had hot on the heels of Tom Rothman coming on this show talking about how the Windows issues needs to be addressed. We had Universal announce very publicly in the New York Times that they are moving their windows back. Not quite to where they were pre Covid, but they are going to guarantee seven weekends of theatrical exclusivity starting in 2027. Five weekends until then. And that is a change from where they were. Why is Universal doing this?

[C]

I think it's about optics and PR more than anything. I don't think you do. Yeah, I don't think that it's a huge business mover.

[B]

I totally disagree. I think this is part of the retrenchment that is going on and people are seeing that the numbers not like what Tom said on the show. It's not necessarily those later weekends that are suffering. It's the first weekend because people are being trained to know that the movies are coming sooner rather than later. And this is a, a, a parachute for the industry. They're pulling this to say, listen, we've got to slow down. We can't go towards our streaming services so much. We need to protect this window.

[C]

This doesn't actually affect the streaming window at all.

[B]

You mean the free streaming window? Yeah, we're going to talk about this. This is the, this is the window to pvod.

[C]

This is to buy and rent at home, which is not streaming.

[B]

I agree.

[C]

The streaming window for Universal remains one of the longest in the industry. The, the, the, the ability to transact at home is where they were more aggressive because they believed that there were some people who were just going to. Once you get to the third or fourth weekend, those people weren't going to come and were going to stay home. I think. I don't know that we totally disagree. I think that it is about reinforcing theatrical, seeing that even, you know, five years, depending on when you want to start the clock on co. On Covid. But over the, you know, the industry has not bounced back to where it was in 2019. And if you want to try to reinforce it, you're going to do some things to help prop up the numbers. This is the biggest year of releases that, that the industry has had since then. And they're hoping that they can sort of help retrain the consumer a little bit. But I think when we're talking financially for the studio, like, Universal was pretty clear that they were making good money from P vod. They didn't think it was cannibalizing the theatrical and that they, they have a longer window than some of their peers in streaming. And so I think this.

[B]

And now they're going back on that, like that whole thing where they.

[C]

Again, the streaming window didn't change. So.

[B]

No, no, that's what I'm saying. On pvod, they are going back on it like that experiment they did for Wicked. That won't happen where they release it on Thanksgiving and put it in PVOD for New Year's. That won't happen under this model.

[C]

I think part of it is trying to kind of signal to the consumer in the industry that we want to reinforce theaters. And I think part of it is also you're competing for. You're competing for filmmaking talent. You. If, if. Look, the argument that they would make is a nuanced one, which is actually like, our windows are some of the best in the industry when it comes to streaming, but not as good when it comes to P vod. But try to explain that to most people and they don't really get it and it opens, you up to potential attacks from Warner Brothers, from Sony, from whoever, saying.

[B]

Or from your talent. I mean, if I'm Chris Nolan, that's what I mean.

[C]

But in, in regards to talent, you, if you have a project out there, you can have Tom Rothman, Mike Luke, whomever, saying, you know, if you come to us, we're going to leave it in theaters for six weeks, don't worry about it.

[B]

Right. No. And, and Chris Nolan, who is arguably Universal's most important filmmaker, he's now the president of the Directors Guild and he thinks that theatrical window should be 60 days.

[C]

Is that even arguable at this point? Is that just because, like out of deference to Spielberg, what do you mean that Nolan is the most important?

[B]

I mean, I only say that because it's not, it's not like Nolan is under contract at Universal Fair. He could take next project. If he, if he wants to do another Superman or Batman movie, he's got to go to Warner Brothers for his next movie. But, but he is, he has now done two in a row and they would like to keep him. And I think it's a nice message to talent who obviously they want this. And I want to be clear here, because you have said it, the PVOD window is very different from the SVOD window. And the people that I have talked to in this space are saying exactly what you have said, which is the real issue is the SVAD window. And Tom Rothman at Sony, he put in this New York Times piece that he wrote this week that in the new Sony Pay One deal with Netflix, they have a 100 to 120 day window for their movies. I have, you know, that is not what a lot of these other studios are doing. They are having a variable SVOD window where sometimes on the movies that are not bigger hits, they go to SVOD much sooner. Sooner, especially if it's an owned and operated platform.

[C]

But for the biggest movies, for, for Disney's biggest movies, for Universal's biggest movies, they're that long, if not longer? I mean, I think, well, Zootopia 2,

[B]

I think it was the biggest movie of last year. It was 104 days. Yeah. So. And, and a lot of people in the industry think that it should be 120, that for those kinds of movies it should be at least 120. Chris Nolan has it in his deal that it's 120.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

So that means that for Universal with The Odyssey, it's 120. I think for a lot of the Universal movies for streaming, it's 120.

[B]

But my point is, is that I think the movement now in the industry is to get that SVOD window to be longer. Yeah, that. And it's less about the P VOD and, you know, Universal's statement is nice, but it's more about the SVOD window because that is what the consumer sees as free. If the consumer continues to see these movies hitting, quote, unquote, free streaming within a couple months, that is what is hurting the box office.

[C]

They've been slowly walking back a lot of the changes they made during the pandemic, basically where they compressed these windows. Universal had been a little bit of an outlier with. With P vod, which made it. It. Which drove a lot of. A lot of the theater owners crazy. I mean, not as much as Netflix drives them crazy, obviously.

[B]

Yeah, I know. And every time one of these movies flops, it's a chance for Ted Sarandos to be like, well, look what the consumer is telling us. The consumer doesn't want the theaters. The consumer wants it at home. But do you think this is an admission by Universal that maybe Peacock is not the priority that it once was?

[C]

Again, I don't know. Because it doesn't change the streaming component of it. I don't know that it's a commentary on Peacock. I do think it is more.

[B]

Well, but presumably that if the Peabod window is longer, then maybe the streaming window will be longer.

[C]

I think the streaming window for them is already quite long. So I think it is trying to buttress the theatrical business at a time where it really needs some help. And Universal is, most years, the number two studio.

[B]

And they'll have a nice announcement.

[C]

It's a nice announcement. And the money that they sacrifice from two weeks of P. OD Is worth it to them for what they're doing. It's kind of signaling to the industry, to talent.

[B]

Well, and they'll have a nice announcement at Cinemacon, and they'll get a big ovation from the theater owners. And guess who will be at Cinemacon this year? I imagine Chris Nolan in some capacity. So he will get to hear that. Spielberg will get to hear that. All those filmmakers will get to feel good about Universal, and that's. And that could be enough. All right, Lucas, thank you. I'm going to get you a tuxedo for you to wear in the future. The town budget is now going to accommodate a tuxedo for.

[C]

Because I don't like bow ties, you know.

[B]

All right, well, there you go. Thank you. We are back with the call sheet Craig, give me your take. I didn't ask you your take on the evening. Your third Oscars. How does this compare?

[D]

I thought this one was the most energetic in the room in terms of suspense. What was going to happen next? Not really knowing till the end who was going to win best picture. I think because the sinners contingency was so loud, even though it was expected one battle was going to win, there was still some suspense at the end that sinners could potentially steal it.

[B]

And they had kind of gone back and forth all night. Yeah. It's funny because I got some feedback from friends that said that it felt like there was not that much excitement or enthusiasm in the room yet in the room. I thought it was. Of the three that you and I have been to together, the most energetic of those three.

[D]

I agree. I also think the. There were just tight races that were more interesting to me. Like the best actor race was incredibly interesting. A winner we didn't get to of the night has to be Leo's mustache.

[B]

Oh, yeah. You're a big fan. I was a little confused by it. I know he's shooting the Scorsese movie in Prague, but I thought he looked great.

[D]

I think Leo has looked better than he has in years. I don't know if he's like working out or doing whatever for the role, but his. The mustache. Leo looks great. He's back.

[B]

He is back. And he had some nice memeable moments.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

What was your best moment? We, for the first time, we went down to the lower lobby level.

[D]

Yes.

[B]

Where you were excited to see a bunch of stars boozing it up.

[D]

Well, it's fun because there are. There are real stretches where we were down there for, I don't know, maybe a half an hour during the show. And like, Emma Stone's there with her husband having a glass of white wine. Stellan Skarsgard's there just during the show. Timmy and Kylie were gone for like 45 minutes during the broadcast, hanging out. It's very cool to see that they kind of just like us go in and out.

[B]

Yeah, just like us. They're like hankering for drinks during the show and then get accosted by the security when you try to bring your drink back to your seat, which is not allowed.

[D]

One other moment I want to shout out. I don't know what award we give this most professional moment, but I thought Kumail Nanjiani handled the tie very, very impressively.

[B]

They clearly prepped him in advance. They told him when he walked out, like, FYI, it's a tie. This is what we do. And he was good about that. My favorite moment was. Do you remember when they announced the shorts and the second movie was announced? That two people exchanging saliva. The guy in front of us immediately, clearly he was involved with the movie. I don't know what it was.

[D]

He.

[B]

We were on the second floor, so the mezzanine level. This guy got up and literally said to his buddy, I'm going for it. He got up and, like, ran out to go down the stairs and to try to get on stage with the rest of the winners.

[D]

He had no shot.

[B]

He had no shot. It was not happening. Did not make it on stage. But just these sheer balls. To think that he could go from the mezzanine all the way down to the orchestra and get on stage with that movie. Loved it. Yes. That's what's great about the Oscars. I think Lucas is wrong. I think that the thing that's different about the Oscars is everybody cares. They really care. And I know they care about any award, but they really care about the Oscars. It is meaningful, these people getting up there talking about how much it means for their country, how much it means for if they represent a particular ethnic or racial group. The first win for female cinematographer, and she asked all the women to stand up. That's why these awards matters, because they represent so much for these people. It's the culmination of a career, and that's why it's fun.

[C]

Totally agree.

[B]

All right, having said that, let's talk about gambling. Talk about what's really important, because this is. As you know, we have both been experimenting with gambling this season, and I want to go through it like I ended up. I only bet on two categories for the actual show, actually three. I bet my strategy, which is the heavy favorites, the ones that I know are going to win. So I bet golden to win best song. Did not win very much money. I bet, like 100 bucks, and I ended up winning, like, 19 or 20. And then I also.

[D]

No way. Not even that.

[C]

You.

[D]

If you bet 100 bucks, you probably won $3.

[B]

No, it. Because it was like 80 something percent to win.

[D]

Oh, okay.

[B]

When I bet. So then I bet on. I bet a while ago. Then I bet on one battle to win and. Which was a heavy favorite but not a guarantee. And I won there. I lost on Timmy. I bet on Chalamet, and I Did

[D]

I bet on him as well.

[B]

Yeah. So you lost. But how did you do otherwise?

[D]

I bet on Sean Penn a few weeks ago or a month ago at this point, which paid off. And then I, I went for the value. I, I, I bet on Sinners to steal best picture just because all these things were like five or six to one. I bet on Timmy. And then just to spite you, I bet on golden to lose, which I was wrong.

[B]

Oh, why would you do that?

[D]

Because it was like $5 to win 50. That's, that's how you're supposed to Never gonna happen.

[B]

What did you think was gonna win the Sinner Song?

[D]

Yeah, that's what I bet on. I lied to you by Center Song.

[B]

Wow. Okay, well, good. I got some stats from Kalshi and they had $105 million exchange hands for, for prediction markets for the Oscars. This year, best actor closed at 25.5 million. So more people bet on that than best picture, which I guess makes sense because it was this three way race that people were interested in.

[D]

Well, and the lines were rapidly changing. I think I saw a report that even during the broadcast, Leo started to surge as a potential sleeper pick to win best actor. The thing about KI that's different is the, the, the numbers you're seeing are all based on what the public sentiment is.

[B]

Not the Vegas guys.

[D]

Exactly. It is not Vegas setting these lines. So it's you, you trust it a little less.

[B]

What's going on? I had a positive experience. Listen, I'm not a gambler. I don't do this stuff normally. I'm not a sports gambler. And I thought it was kind of fun.

[D]

It is a little fun to do a little sprinkling. Although here's what I'll say. I hope to God that the Oscars never incorporates anything into their broadcast. What the Globes did that whole thing when the oscars goes to YouTube or anything like that. Please never incorporate gambling into the broadcast.

[B]

No, it's just fun to do on the side. And it was fun to go up to Kate Hudson at the nominees brunch and say I won money on you, which she appreciated. All right, that's the show for today. I want to thank my guest Lucas Shaw, producer Craig Horlbeck, artist Jon Jones and Jesse Lopez. And I want to thank you. We'll see you a couple more times this week.

[E]

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