Why the Paramount-Skydance Merger is "F*cking Up ‘South Park’"

Summary

Summary of "Why the Paramount-Skydance Merger is 'F*cking Up ‘South Park’"

Episode Release Date: July 7, 2025
Podcast: The Town with Matthew Belloni
Host: Matthew Belloni, The Ringer

---

1. Introduction: The Paramount-Skydance Merger and Its Fallout

In this episode, Matthew Belloni delves into the complexities surrounding the recent merger between Paramount and Skydance and its detrimental impact on the beloved animated series South Park. Amidst widespread attention on the merger’s regulatory hurdles involving the FCC and the U.S. President, Belloni shifts focus to a less publicized but equally significant fallout: the delayed renewal of South Park’s streaming rights, which directly affects the show’s production schedule.

[00:00] Matt Belloni: "If you care about Hollywood... you should really be getting the whole story about Hollywood."

2. Background: South Park’s Digital Rights Agreement

The crux of the issue lies in a groundbreaking 2007 contract between Comedy Central's parent company and South Park creators Matt Stone and Trey Parker. This agreement granted Stone and Parker 50% of all future digital deals for the show—a visionary move made just as the television industry was transitioning to digital platforms.

[03:51] Lucas Shaw: "They did a nice job because that was literally right before the entire television business went digital."

Despite this lucrative arrangement, by 2019, Paramount licensed South Park’s streaming rights to HBO Max in a five-year deal worth over $500 million. However, this deal did not significantly bolster Paramount Plus, leading the studio’s leadership to seek more favorable terms.

3. The Merger’s Complication: Conflicting Streaming Strategies

With the merger complete, Paramount’s new management, led by David Ellison and Jeff Shell of Skydance, proposes splitting South Park’s streaming rights between Paramount Plus and HBO Max. The anticipated revenue from this split could exceed $2 billion over a decade, with Stone and Parker receiving half of this sum. However, Skydance’s leadership favors shorter-term deals and is contemplating licensing the show to Netflix on a global scale.

[01:34] Matt Belloni: "Matt Stone and Trey Parker... state... this merger is a shit show and it's fucking up South Park."

This disagreement stems from Skydance’s desire for more flexible and potentially lucrative arrangements, clashing with Paramount’s initial long-term vision. Consequently, this impasse has delayed the premiere of new South Park episodes, now pushed to at least July 23rd.

4. Stakeholder Tensions: Creators vs. New Management

Creators Matt Stone and Trey Parker are vocal about their dissatisfaction with the merger’s impact. They argue that Skydance is overreaching by attempting to influence material deals before the merger's finalization, thereby disrupting the established relationship and contract terms.

[07:20] Lucas Shaw: "They feel like they're already trying to run the company."

Belloni and guest Lucas Shaw explore whether Skydance’s intervention is justified, considering the substantial financial implications of the streaming agreements. Shaw emphasizes the difference between simply approving or denying a deal and actively negotiating terms, which he believes is the core of the conflict.

[10:43] Lucas Shaw: "The south park guys are trying to get the best deal possible. Skydance is trying to intervene on a deal that it's a little bit nervous about."

5. Broader Implications for Paramount and Other Productions

The turmoil surrounding South Park is symptomatic of larger issues within Paramount post-merger. Belloni draws parallels to other high-profile collaborations, such as the strained relationship with Taylor Sheridan, creator of Yellowstone. Under Skydance’s new leadership, there is speculation about budget cuts and tighter control over high-cost productions, which may not bode well for longstanding creator partnerships.

[12:51] Lucas Shaw: "Taylor Sheridan and Matt and Trey are both gone in a couple years, that does not look like good for him."

Additionally, the merger’s instability is mirrored in ongoing settlements, such as the one involving Donald Trump and Paramount. While officially, Paramount is paying $16 million without an apology, conflicting reports suggest possible side deals, potentially involving Public Service Announcements (PSAs) to secure FCC approval.

[19:29] Matt Belloni: "Donald Trump... said... $16 million plus $16 million... in advertising, it's like 32, maybe 35 million."

6. The Future of South Park and Paramount’s Strategic Moves

The uncertainty over streaming rights has tangible effects on South Park’s production timeline. With the new premiere date pending a finalized streaming deal, there is concern over how long the delay might last and what compromises might be made. Skydance may opt for a five-year licensing deal, aligning with their preference for shorter-term agreements, potentially at the expense of the creators’ longer-term interests.

[22:03] Matt Belloni: "They might have to negotiate some other streaming deal."

Belloni humorously speculates on creative resolutions, such as integrating South Park shorts into 60 Minutes segments, highlighting the show’s cultural significance and enduring popularity despite production challenges.

7. Additional Discussions: The Social Network Sequel

Towards the episode’s conclusion, Belloni and his co-host discuss the upcoming sequel to The Social Network. Aaron Sorkin returns as director and writer, with Jesse Eisenberg reprising his role as Mark Zuckerberg. While there is cautious optimism about the sequel’s potential, concerns linger about recapturing the original’s magic without legendary director David Fincher at the helm.

[28:05] Matt Belloni: "I think Jesse Eisenberg will come back and play Mark Zuckerberg in this movie."

8. Conclusion: Navigating Hollywood’s Shifting Landscape

The Paramount-Skydance merger exemplifies the volatile nature of Hollywood’s business landscape, where strategic shifts can have profound impacts on creative ventures. South Park stands at the intersection of these changes, symbolizing both the potential for lucrative deals and the fragility of creator-studio relationships in the face of corporate transformations.

[26:20] Lucas Shaw: "It's still one of the most watched shows on television."

As Paramount navigates its new identity under Skydance, the industry watches closely to see how longstanding partnerships like that of South Park will adapt or falter amidst evolving corporate strategies and market demands.

---

Notable Quotes:

• Matt Belloni
  "[00:00] If you care about Hollywood... you should really be getting the whole story about Hollywood."
  "[19:29] Donald Trump... said... $16 million plus $16 million... in advertising, it's like 32, maybe 35 million."

• Lucas Shaw
  "[03:51] They did a nice job because that was literally right before the entire television business went digital."
  "[10:43] The south park guys are trying to get the best deal possible. Skydance is trying to intervene on a deal that it's a little bit nervous about."
  "[16:02] Well, one, you reduce the exposure of south park on Paramount Plus."

---

This comprehensive overview encapsulates the key discussions and insights from the episode, providing listeners and non-listeners alike with a clear understanding of how the Paramount-Skydance merger is adversely affecting South Park, the broader implications for Hollywood, and the intricate dance between creative freedom and corporate strategy.

Transcript

[Matt Bellany]

If you care about Hollywood, and I assume you do, if you're listening to the Town, you should really be getting the whole story about Hollywood. That's what you get with Puck. I'm a founding partner Puck and I write a newsletter called what I'm Hearing. It's got exclusive news for insiders and analysis of the biggest stories. Puck has a bunch of great journalists. We just hired Kim Masters who also covers Hollywood from the inside, plus media, sports, fashion, politics and finance. It's a must have for plugged in people. Fans of the Town get a discount on the description page of this episode or at Puck News thetown Go further into Hollywood by becoming a Puck member Today it is Monday, July 7. Amid all the hoopla and the hand wringing over the Paramount sale to Skydance, most of it involving the FCC and the President and CBS News, the settlement we talked about last week, there is another fight playing out behind the scenes of this merger, with billions of dollars implicated. It involves South park, the 28 year old comedy Central show that was supposed to premiere new episodes this week. But that premiere has been pushed to at least July 23rd. And we can blame the Paramount sale, which has complicated the renewal of streaming rights to the show. South park streams on HBO Max, but that deal ended recently and the parties haven't been able to finalize a new deal because the current management of Paramount doesn't agree with the incoming Skydance leadership. Or in the words of a statement last week from creators Matt Stone and Trey Parker, this merger is a shit show and it's fucking up South Park. We are at the studio working on new episodes and we hope the fans get to see them somehow.

[Lucas Shaw]

End quote.

[Matt Bellany]

Okay, so what's going on here? It's complicated, of course, but this all goes back to a deal in 2007 that Comedy Central's owner did with Matt and Trey that gave them 50% of all future digital deals for the show. A truly amazing contract considering this was right before all of television started migrating to Digital. But by 2019, Paramount was able to license those south park streaming rights to HBO max in a five year deal that valued them at more than $500 million. It's a big number, but it did nothing to boost Paramount plus, which the Paramount leadership wanted to fix in the next deal. So now the current Paramount management wants to split the South park rights between Paramount plus and Max, and they think they can get more than $1 billion over 10 years from each of them, Bloomberg reported. That's potentially $2 billion sitting there, half of which would go to Matt and Trey. But as I mentioned, the leadership of Paramount is likely changing very soon. And these Skydance people don't love the prospect of a 10 year deal. They want a shorter arrangement for less money. And maybe they'll license south park to Netflix globally. Skydance feels so strongly that Jeff Shell, who will be the number two under David Ellison, he allegedly contacted Max's own not to do the deal improperly. So according to Matt and Trey's lawyers, Skydance counters that it has the right to intervene in material deals before the sale closes. And a $2 billion license of one of the company's biggest assets probably qualifies there. Or does it? Matt and Trey are understandably pissed here. But who's right? And how will this all play out? So we got Lucas Shaw here to discuss. He's back today. And it's the future of south park and a standoff over billions of dollars from the ringer and Puck. I'm Matt Bellany and this is the Town.

[Lucas Shaw]

All right.

[Matt Bellany]

We are here with Lucas Shaw, our Monday guy. How are you, Lucas?

[Lucas Shaw]

Welcome back from South Carolina.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, again with the revealing of my secret location. Yes, I am back. I guess it's fine now I'm back.

[Lucas Shaw]

You're in Los Angeles. What do you mean? What are you worried about? You don't want people sending you gift baskets.

[Craig Horbaugh]

Oh, you're also posting all over Instagram. Where are you at?

[Matt Bellany]

I am. You're right. But I want to keep my summer location secret so it's not inundated with Hollywood people. Not that anyone would follow my lead on anything.

[Lucas Shaw]

I'm not really worried about Hollywood people coming out to orient New York. So I'm happy to disclose my location.

[Matt Bellany]

That's true. But we saw in South Carolina, we saw a very prominent Hollywood executive that I will not name. And it sort of alarmed. Me and my wife were like, oh, my God, we cannot have this place become the Hollywood destination.

[Craig Horbaugh]

Who was it? Give us a hint.

[Matt Bellany]

This person used to run. No, I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it.

[Lucas Shaw]

Do you know this person well?

[Matt Bellany]

I do know this person well.

[Lucas Shaw]

So you talked to this person?

[Matt Bellany]

Yes, we did talk to this person.

[Lucas Shaw]

Did you get drinks with this person?

[Matt Bellany]

No, no, We. We said a very cordial hello. This person stopped by our table and then my wife saw him the next day at Pilates and that was enough. All right, no one cares. Let's move on. Paramount, everyone's talking about the Trump settlement, and rightfully so. We did a whole show on it last week with Brian Stelter. But there is this other scandal. Standoff. Whatever you want to call it, let's go.

[Lucas Shaw]

Standoff. I don't know that it's. I don't know that it's a scandal.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, not a scandal, but I mean, I'm sure Matt and Trey would say it's a scandal, but we're going to call it a standoff. And it concerns South Park. And the history of south park is a history of very interesting and unique deals in Hollywood. I still to this day, the fact that Matt and Trey's lawyers got Viacom then to give them 50% of the show's digital rights back in 2007. Still one of the all time great deals for talent. Can't believe Viacom was dumb enough to do that.

[Lucas Shaw]

Shout out to Kevin Morris.

[Matt Bellany]

Kevin Morris, Kevin Yorn. Yes, that firm. They did a nice job because that was literally right before the entire television business went digital.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah. In Viacom's defense, they did not know what was coming. On the other hand, the Internet had been around for a long time and this was perfectly symbolic of how backwards that company was and how shortsighted it was when it came to the Internet for a very long time. And remember at the time what the creators of south park were doing, where they were just putting episodes online for free, so they were just getting a share of ad revenue. Where this really became valuable was when you started licensing the rights to streaming services. And the value of that show on streaming went from, you know, tens of millions a year to hundreds of millions a year or more than 100 million a year. I mean, it's crazy.

[Matt Bellany]

All right, so with that as the backdrop, we've got this standoff between Matt and Trey and the difference of opinion between the current management of Paramount Global and specifically Chris McCarthy who runs the cable and digital stuff that south park falls under. And the new regime, David Ellison and his number two that are potentially looks a little more likely now gonna come in and run this company. Jeff Shell. So my question for you here is like, why is this a big deal? This is pretty clearly a material deal. This is a potential 10 year deal, $2 billion that this company would be doing a deal for and 10 years and locking up its, you know, one of its biggest assets for 10 years.

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, each deal would be worth more than a billion, but yes, Collectively more.

[Matt Bellany]

Than 2 billion total if they do the deal with both Paramount plus and HBO Max. Why shouldn't Ellison and Jeff Shell have the right to have an opinion here and to intervene if they don't think this is the right deal. What's the big problem here? Why don't, why shouldn't they be able to do that?

[Lucas Shaw]

I think the issue from the perspective of the creators of South Park, Trey Parker and Matt Stone, their feeling is that Skydance has a right to approve or deny these deals, but that Skydance has been getting involved in the negotiations and trying to influence the deals before even just getting a, a hey or nay. They feel like they're already trying to run the company.

[Matt Bellany]

But isn't that just a, a mechanism to push back here? It's sort of semantics like, okay, Jeff Shell is calling Warner Discovery and telling them not to do the deal. Allegedly.

[Lucas Shaw]

There is a difference between saying, we don't think this deal is a good deal and having Jeff Shell or David Ellison Call HBO, Max, whatever and say you're negotiating a 10 year deal. We want it to be a five year deal for them to call Bella Bajaria at Netflix and say, hey, Bella, we really, we really like the idea of you doing it. How about you step up your offer to X, Y or Z? You know, I think there is a difference between just saying yes or no and getting involved in negotiations. Now Skydance, Redbird's interpretation of this would be that they're still within their rights. And I think they're of the, they're of the position. One of the real issues in this is not just the licensing, but that Paramount was going to preemptively renew its overall deal with Trey and Matt, which is also worth a lot of money for more episodes of South Park.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, that's a separate deal.

[Lucas Shaw]

They have a deal to make the original episodes of south park, not the licensing, the streaming. And that is up at the end of 2027. And Trey and Matt came to them earlier this year and said, we want to do more. Let's add 5, 6, 7 years onto that. And that would also enable these 10 year streaming deals because you know you're getting enough south park to merit to pay a bunch for 10 more years. And there's a very interesting back kind of you use cat and mouse game happening here where I think they look at it and say, hey, Chris McCarthy and the current leadership at Paramount has been willing to, you know, they've been good to us. They're paying us what we want to do.

[Matt Bellany]

One foot out the door, right?

[Lucas Shaw]

No, I know, but. And they're saying, let's get our, let's get this new deal locked in now so that we don't have to worry about it. Once David Ellison comes in and we have the, we have essentially eight to 10 years of massive paydays for us. And by the end of that, maybe we'll be good, we'll be done. And Skydance and Redbird are looking at this and saying, we don't want to do that yet. Like do a shorter term streaming deal, don't renew the overall deal. Like, we'll negotiate when we get in because we're going to be the owners.

[Matt Bellany]

They want to test the market, they want to do their own diligence, they want to figure out what the best market is for south park, which they are a partner in. Even though they have a 50% joint venture with these guys, they feel like they need to be in the chair and doing this with them and not have some Last minute, Chris McCarthy, one foot out the door, sweet deal with these guys that he has a relationship with. And to me, that seems kind of reasonable. It just feels like they could let this go and let them have a, you know, make their deal with hbo, with Paramount plus and then veto it. Right. They could just veto and say, no, we don't like that deal and we're coming in. This is a material deal. But they're intervening a little bit before.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah, I think both sides are doing what you'd expect them to do.

[Matt Bellany]

Yes.

[Lucas Shaw]

The south park guys are trying to get the best deal possible. Skydance is trying to intervene on a deal that it's a little bit nervous about. And the result is you have the south park guys upset because they don't. They're already going, oh, God, is David Ellison and is the Skydance regime going to be kind of less friendly to us than the previous one? Because they've had a long and checkered history with this company where, you know, they create the show and it becomes this huge hit. And, you know, everyone's happy back then because they've got this massive hit during the Philippe Dumont era where Viacom is kind of a struggling, failing company and they're trying to cut costs and the relationship between Viacom and the creators of the show becomes very. Not nasty, but bad. And then Chris McCarthy comes in and is, you know, he's basically picked two or three guys who he will never say no to.

[Matt Bellany]

Right. Taylor Sheridan being the other big one.

[Lucas Shaw]

Correct.

[Matt Bellany]

He's in another situation with the new ownership where there's been a lot of chatter around town about whether David Ellison wants to renew Taylor Sheridan or continue to allow him to spend 20, 22 million dollars an episode on some of these shows. And Sidney Holland, who's going to be the TV head at the new regime. She has been telegraphing to agents, according to my sources, that she wants the budgets to come down on some of these shows. And that's not something that Taylor Sheridan is used to hearing. Right?

[Lucas Shaw]

Taylor Sheridan, certainly not used to hearing that. If you look at the kind of the history and a lot of the reporting on his relationship with Paramount and the south park guys, you know, they've been doing it for long enough that Trey and Matt are used to people just saying, sounds great. Do what you do. Right?

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. Well, very different. The cost of south park is a lot. Well, yeah.

[Lucas Shaw]

South park costs a tiny fraction of what a Taylor Sheridan show costs. And it still prints money. Right. It's like the only thing other than the Daily show that matters on Comedy Central.

[Matt Bellany]

It's so crazy. I did an interview with a group of high school kids for my summer movie roundup that I. That I've been doing, and I asked what they care about and they're all like, south Park. We love South park. And these are 15 year olds in 2025 who were certainly not alive when this show premiered. Producer Craig was barely alive when this show premiered, and it still delivers an audience. It's kind of amazing. I mean, is there another show that has lasted this long with the original creators st still doing it? I don't think there is. Well, the Simpsons, but no, Matt Groening checked out a long time ago.

[Craig Horbaugh]

It's just snl.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, snl. That's a good one. And Lorne left for five years.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah. I mean, what's worked for south park is that they only make 10 episodes a year. And so they have a period of the year where they're really cramming and churning out episodes. And then they have a bunch of other time to either go on vacation or pursue other creative pursuits or make.

[Matt Bellany]

Their Kendrick movie that hopefully will come out next year.

[Lucas Shaw]

And so I think that is also one of the issues here is that if you're skydiving, you're looking at it. You're saying we're paying these guys all this money and they're essentially making ten half hour episodes a year. Like, can we get more out of them?

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, that's a whole separate thing where a couple of years ago they decided that to get around the HBO Max deal for South Park, Paramount would pay them a bunch of money to do specials. Scare quotes, mine. Because obviously HBO Max did not see it that way. And they started putting specials on Paramount plus and HBO Max. Soon and that's still going on?

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, south park was like Yellowstone, where it was one of the crown jewels of the company that Viacom, Paramount, Viacom, whatever you want to call it, licensed out to a third party at Real. It was a really great deal with HBO Max. Right. They got paid more than a hundred million dollars a year for South Park. Even with sharing with Matt and Trey, they're getting more than $50 million a year for the show, pays for the whole thing. But then they said, oh wait, we are launching Paramount plus and we don't have South Park. Wouldn't it be great if we had South Park? And so they tried to conceive this workaround that like kind of worked, kind of didn't.

[Matt Bellany]

It's kind of amazing. It's very emblematic of that company that has valued the short term money boost over the long term value creation. And their two biggest television assets arguably were Yellowstone and South park. And they didn't have them on their own streaming service.

[Lucas Shaw]

And I wrote a story to that effect at the time and guess what? The executives at Paramount were not happy about it.

[Matt Bellany]

No, but I mean, what could they say? I mean, I did a thing about how the whole Yellowstone deal happened and it turned out it was a David Nevins decision. And there were other factors as well, but they freaked out. But it's like this happened. They did not. This was a company wide ethos. This has been going back 25 years at that company where Sumner Redstone would stare at the stock price. And the things that impact the stock price are money this quarter, money immediately. And they ended up mortgaging the long term health of the company. And guess what? It ended up being sold.

[Lucas Shaw]

Right. But it's a little bit of a wrinkle in these negotiations is that the deal that has been on the table would be splitting it between HBO Max and Paramount Plus.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. Why do they want to do that? Is that just they want to have money and they want to have it on the service?

[Lucas Shaw]

Correct.

[Matt Bellany]

But no. But why? Why not keep it for themselves?

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, one, you reduce the exposure of south park on Paramount Plus. Paramount plus is just not that big a service.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, but maybe it gets bigger if everybody who loves south park, all these kids that I interviewed, would go over there.

[Lucas Shaw]

It's a marginal addition this way, under the deal that had been discussed, at least they would get paid essentially the same amount of money or just a little bit less than they're getting paid under the current deal. And they'd get to still put it on Paramount plus and Use it to generate interest in it. So that one makes a lot of sense because otherwise you do the Netflix thing and you get paid more money, but then you don't get no benefit to Paramount.

[Matt Bellany]

Right. Maybe more money. But yeah, and I agree that they're probably looking at the data and the Paramount plus audience is different than the max audience and they could essentially have their cake and eat it too.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah, the Paramount plus audience is the Taylor shared an audience. The NFL audience.

[Matt Bellany]

Yep. And yeah, it makes sense that they would want to get money. Psst.

[Unknown]

Your payments are showing, but with Apple Cash, your payments are private by design. There are no public feeds, awkward reactions or unnecessary payment drama. Apple Cash lets you send cash and messages right in the conversations you're already having. Or with tap to cash paste someone next to you without looking up a username or scanning a QR code. Don't just hold your iPhone near someone else's to send. Switch to Apple Cash and start sending privately. Apple Cash services are provided by Green Dot bank member fdic.

[Matt Bellany]

It all gets to the timing of when Ellison and Jeff Shell are going to actually control this. And we got an update last week on this with the settlement of the Trump litigation. By the way, who do you believe in this scenario? Do you believe the press release that said that paramount is paying $16 million and will not apologize and is not paying anything else on the side deal or anything like that? Or do you believe Donald Trump who went on television this past weekend and said, we did a deal for about $16 million plus $16 million or maybe more than that. In advertising, it's like 32, maybe 35 million. Now, Skydance has not said whether that is true or not. My sourcing on it say that that is not true. They have not agreed to pay anything extra in a side deal that would be illegal if it were overt. You know, a quid pro quo. I talked with Brian Seltzer about this last week. We both think that perhaps the FCC will extract the PSAs, the ads that they will have to run and would bring the value up. And that Trump thinks that Brendan Carr is going to be able to get that in his deal with Paramount to clear the sale. Where do you stand on that one?

[Lucas Shaw]

When in doubt, you don't trust what Trump puts out there.

[Matt Bellany]

How dare you?

[Lucas Shaw]

Or you trust someone else over him because he's more likely to stretch the truth. But I think one thing that Trump is very good at is he will sort of deceive but not outright lie a lot of the time. And so I think that the deal is the $16 million deal, but there probably have been conversations around the PSAs. And to your point, there could be some part of, of getting the deal approved by the fcc or there could be a backroom, wink, wink handshake with the Ellisons of how certain things that may happen in the future but are not officially part of the deal.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, we, we know they were literally in a back room at UFC talking and Ari Emanuel organized the whole thing. He's an Ellison adviser. He used to represent Trump and they talking about something behind the scenes there.

[Lucas Shaw]

So I default to trusting Paramount while also not being surprised if you, you end up having some PSAs.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, I believe.

[Lucas Shaw]

I mean, and I think the FCC approval is, we've had, you know, months of hand wringing over what the settling the suit with Trump means. This FCC approval is not going to be nothing.

[Matt Bellany]

Right. They still have leverage. Trump has shown that he will use whatever leverage he has. And even though this lawsuit has settled, they still have the FCC approval leverage.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah, there's going to be agreements around DEI and all sorts of things that will make people very upset.

[Matt Bellany]

Right, I know. That's the thing is we were talking about how the no apology thing is actually good for CBS News because I don't think we're going to see mass exits or resignations right now. But it's not over. No. And what if part of the settlement is CBS News or 60 Minutes has to add, you know, their version of Scott Jennings, the CNN guy, to be a socially conservative commentator.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah. Or they'll agree, they'll agree to diversity viewpoints, although they will impose some internal watchdog that the administration is okay with. I mean, look, the Paramount I think so far has sort of made the best of a shitty situation. But yeah, they're not, they're not through the woods yet.

[Matt Bellany]

Right. And this all impacts the south park situation, I think just because it's yet another example of the chaos that has enveloped this company in limbo. We still don't know when this deal is going to be approved, if it is going to be approved. And this has now impacted the premiere date for the show. They've said it, it's only a two week delay right now, but I checked in this morning and there's no movement on this. Like how long can this be dragged out?

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, the impact is, is twofold. One on the one hand, they don't want to introduce the new season of south park until they have a long term streaming deal. But a lot of the long term streaming deals or at least some of the streaming deals that they want to do are predicated on the extension of that other deal, the overall deal with Matt and Trey that we discussed. And Ellison has basically said, I don't want to talk about a new overall deal until I own the company. And that's not going to happen for at a minimum a month or two. Right. And they're going to want south park to premiere before then, I have to imagine. So they might have to negotiate some other streaming deal.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, what does that mean? They might like what, what is the quick fix here?

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, they would do the deal that Ellison wants where they do a five year licensing streaming deal instead of a ten year.

[Matt Bellany]

Okay. So they would essentially capitulate.

[Lucas Shaw]

They could, yes. Allison could say, look, you're getting paid just as much money. Why not do a five year deal? So doing though, he kind of directly antagonizes these creators that he's in bed with and he doesn't want to do that before he takes over the company. He doesn't want the creators of south park just shitting on him every other episode.

[Matt Bellany]

I was going to say, next thing you know, there's going to be a 40 year old kid of a billionaire who takes over the town in south park and becomes the villain of every season.

[Lucas Shaw]

I mean, it's funny. So I had Matt Stone, the co creator, spoke at my conference last year and I asked him about David Ellison and he was super complimentary at the time. He's like, we've spoken. I like the guy. I like made a joke about how, how he seemed like someone who he would normally make fun of on the show. And he's like, yeah, we're not going to do that.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, famous last words.

[Lucas Shaw]

But now it feels almost inevitable.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, we were joking, but obviously this is not the most talent friendly thing to be doing when you're about to take over a studio. And I think if everyone around town is looking at David Ellison as the savior, who's going to come in with hundreds of billions of dollars and rescue this studio and be everybody's friend, this is not a good start to that.

[Lucas Shaw]

It's one of the reasons that I think they saw what David Zaslav did and they have avoided doing much press thus far because they don't want to be portrayed as the savior at this point when they know that they're going to have to do a bunch of things that people don't like. There's going to be more cost cutting, there's going to be some sales, there's Going to be some hurt egos.

[Matt Bellany]

No, he's been quiet. He didn't. Ellison didn't go to Cannes and he's a producer on Mission Impossible and he's not going to Sun Valley. He's not doing a lot of things that the moguls typically do and that David Zaslav really got caught up in when he took over Warner Discovery. He's not doing the, you know, the Friday afternoon lunch at the Polo Lounge and that, you know, corner booth where everybody sees him. He's, he's kind of laying low and I think that's probably smart given what is coming at that company.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah. You don't want to set expectations too high or be unreasonable. Like if you are going to be the savior of Paramount, that's a multi year project. It's not something where he comes in and immediately things get so much better.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. And if the casualty of that is some talent relationships though, with people like Taylor Sheridan and Matt and Trey, if.

[Lucas Shaw]

Taylor Sheridan and Matt and Trey are both gone in a couple years, that does not look like good for him.

[Matt Bellany]

No, but it would be in a couple years and there's time to salvage that. I'm not, and we're not saying that the Taylor Sheridan relationship is like destroyed.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah. They have time left to, to improve the relations with, with both of them and make sure that everyone's on the same page.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. And the proof will be in the pudding. Next time we see Taylor Sheridan get a green light for a Yellowstone spinoff where the episode costs are, you know, 15, $20 million. We'll know exactly what David Ellison thinks of those deals because those shows rate. They do very well on Paramount.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah.

[Matt Bellany]

And obviously the same will be true of CBS News. I think everybody in New York is freaking out about what's going to happen to CBS News when Ellison takes over. Because obviously Trump is saying nice things about the Ellison family. And maybe Trump knows something that the people at CBS News don't know about what is coming for that news network.

[Lucas Shaw]

Yeah, I think the incoming owners at Skydance are supportive of having news at the broadcast network and certainly supportive of the broadcast network.

[Matt Bellany]

But that's easier said than done next time. 60 Minutes has a very critical Trump piece. It's going to be interesting to see what happens.

[Lucas Shaw]

Well, and as everybody knows, news accounts for very little of the profit and the vast majority of the headaches for any of these media companies.

[Matt Bellany]

Also influential though, you do it right, your morning show can promote your movies and you know, you're, you get a lot of goodwill with people from having.

[Lucas Shaw]

That symphony and synergy.

[Matt Bellany]

Yes. But you also get a lot of negativity. I don't know. I think any other broadcast network would gladly take 60 minutes these days. Yeah.

[Lucas Shaw]

It's still one of the most watched shows on television.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah. And I think ultimately Ellison knows that.

[Lucas Shaw]

We were talking about institutions that have been around forever. Right. And you don't have the same person in charge of it, obviously, but it is, along with snl, one of the longest running institutions on television.

[Matt Bellany]

I think I found a solution. South park shorts at the end of every 60 minutes. Terrence and Philip shorts every episode just instead of the end segment. I'm Scott Pelley. I'm Terrence and Philip. All right, Lucas, thank you.

[Lucas Shaw]

Thanks, Matt.

[Matt Bellany]

We are back with the call sheet. Craig, some big news over the holiday week when most people were not paying attention, myself included. The Social network sequel that Mr. Aaron Sorkin came on this show last year and talked about. It's now official. It is now at Sony. It is called the social network part two. And he claims it's now not a movie about January 6th, which it might not be.

[Craig Horbaugh]

He might have changed it. It's been a year since he spoke to you at that panel. It could be a part of the story, but perhaps not the entire story.

[Matt Bellany]

Maybe I think Sony is now downplaying that aspect of it. He said in a panel I did last year that was broadcast on this show that he blames Facebook for January 6th and that he was writing. And now we know he is also directing. He is writing a movie, he said, about the connection between social media and the violence that occurred at the Capitol. And maybe there are other aspects of it as well. I have not read the script and I want to give them the benefit of the doubt, but it's gotta have that as its framing device. Right. That's the news. The impact of social media on the world in the 15 years since the Social Network.

[Craig Horbaugh]

It's funny. This is all so much obviously more charged now. Like, even if Jesse Eisenberg's coming back to play Mark Zuckerberg, him doing it in 2009 is a completely different situation than it is in 2025.

[Matt Bellany]

Exactly. And that is my prediction today is I think that despite all of the pressure on him not to do it, I think Jesse Eisenberg will come back and play Mark Zuckerberg in this movie. Even though it's going to be attacked, it already is getting attacked. And that's why I think Sony downplayed it. Even though he's now A real filmmaker with an Oscar nominee film. A real pain. And he's got other stuff. I think Jesse Eisenberg will feel the not obligation. But, you know, that was the movie that really made him into a star and got him the Oscar nomination. And I think he'll come back and do it. Eisenberg also not averse to commercial stuff. The dude was Lex Luthor in the man of Steel movies. He is doing now. You see me three. He's coming back for that later this year, so he's not one to pass up a paycheck.

[Lucas Shaw]

Well.

[Craig Horbaugh]

And I think people are a little bit disappointed that it's Sorkin directing and not Fincher. But I think Eisenberg returning as Zuckerberg will legitimize this sequel more in people's eyes. If he didn't do this movie, then I think it would be much more in trouble.

[Matt Bellany]

Well, no, they could recast. They could recast as the, you know, 40 year old Zuckerberg.

[Craig Horbaugh]

No, Eisenberg is 40 years old. It's perfect. You can't recast.

[Matt Bellany]

Oh, he was amazing.

[Craig Horbaugh]

If you recast Zuckerberg, then the thing has sequelitis. It already has equalitis a little bit. But the whole thing is, I think everybody is kind of hesitantly excited for this. Similar to the David Fincher directing the Once Upon a Time in Hollywood spinoff that's going to Netflix. Everybody's like, I guess. I mean, I don't, you know, it's not the perfect scenario, but I guess we'll take it. I feel like that's the way we feel about the Social Network part too.

[Matt Bellany]

Yeah, the Fincher not directing is a problem. And, you know, Sorkin, amazing writer, has had less success as a director. And there was something about that combination of the Sorkin script and Fincher's very signature directing style that made Social Network into what it was. It's going to be tough to recreate that magic, but hopefully they can pull it off. I'm. I'm cautiously excited.

[Craig Horbaugh]

Yeah, I think that's the right way to feel.

[Matt Bellany]

All right, that's the show for today. I want to thank my guest, Lucas Shaw, producer Craig Horbeck, Art, Jesse Lopez, and I want to thank you. We'll see you a couple more times this week.