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- [00:03]
Kayla Brantley
The Crime Desk Arresting Podcasts
- [00:09]
Podcast Host
we're here today with the latest on Alec Murdoch and his double murder case that was overturned by South Carolina's top court in May. The court found Colleton County Court Clerk Rebecca Hill acted inappropriately during Murdoch's 2023 trial for the murder of his wife and son, and that communication she had with jurors may have been problematic. Now Murdoch will face trial again for the same crimes. He maintains his innocence, but has admitted to a separate set of financial misdeeds. Daily Mail's Rachel Sharpe was in South Carolina last week for Murdoch's first court appearance since his conviction was reversed. We'll find out when the next trial will take place and how the next one may look different than the first. I'm Kayla Brantley and this is the Trial usa. We'll be back in a moment.
- [01:09]
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- [01:38]
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [01:50]
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- [02:07]
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- [02:38]
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- [03:05]
Kayla Brantley
Refreshers contain caffeine.
- [03:10]
Podcast Host
Welcome back. And Rachel, thank you for joining us.
- [03:13]
Kayla Brantley
Thanks for having me.
- [03:14]
Podcast Host
So, Rachel, you were just in the courtroom last week for Alec Murdoch's first appearance since his convictions were overturned. What was the purpose of Monday's pretrial conference and what was the outcome?
- [03:27]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah. So, as you say, this hearing is the very first court hearing in his retrial, and it's also the first time that we've actually seen him in public since April 2024, when he was sentenced in federal court for his financial crimes. So this court hearing was a status conference. So it was very much about scheduling and logistics for the second trial. So during that, you had both sides, the prosecution and the defence, sparring over various things, including discovery, DNA evidence, what Alec Murdoch is allowed to wear in the courtroom, whether he's allowed a laptop in prison to review the evidence in the case, and where this new trial should be held. And we also got a new trial date. So we learned that Alec Murdoch will go on trial for a second time for the murders of his wife and son on April 5, 2027.
- [04:21]
Podcast Host
So April 5, 2027, that is nearly nine months from now. You said that there was a lot of back and forth over discovery and what can be brought to trial. Was this date a date that parties agree, or was there debate over this as well?
- [04:36]
Kayla Brantley
So this date was decided by the judge, but both sides agreed that they were happy with it. The state made it very clear that they wanted the trial to happen soon. You know, you got the impression that, you know, they've done this once, they just want to get it done. Whereas the defense said that, you know, they need more time. They said that they need at least six months to go through evidence. Particularly, they argued that they need to test DNA found under Maggie's fingernails. This was DNA that they said, you know, was found during the original investigation, but actually was not tested at the time. But it is clear that it was not DNA that matched Alec Murdoch or anyone else who is a direct relative of the Murdoch family. So they are wanting to send it to othram, which is a genetic genealogy lab, the same lab that identified Bryan Kohlberger as the murderer of the University of Idaho students. And they say that is a process that can take time. So they are keen to, for one, get that DNA and get that tested as soon as possible. But they also said they needed a bit of time before the trial date to get things in motion and get that all tested and review all the other evidence. So the judge set that date, and she made a point of saying that when she sets the date, she sticks to it. She said, that is the date, and there better be a really good reason for any possible delay to that. So by all accounts, we're expecting it to be there.
- [06:00]
Podcast Host
Can you explain for us, if they had this DNA evidence under her fingernails, why wasn't it tested for the first trial? This seems like it's a huge piece of evidence that would have helped the defense.
- [06:12]
Kayla Brantley
You know, you make a really good point, and that's the key piece of debate between the prosecution and the defense. The defense is saying, you know, that was not tested and that should have been. And, you know, they're saying that is a crucial piece of evidence for them. Whereas, you know, the prosecution, they actually said in the courtroom, you know, we are happy for you to test that, but we think that's a red herring. They said that there is no evidence that Maggie was involved in a struggle. She had no defensive wounds, no scratches on her. And, you know, they point out quite rightly that DNA sits under all of our fingernails. You know, from everything that you touch, you pick up DNA from people just day to day. So right now, our fingernails could have bits of DNA from random people from, you know, getting the subway and things like that. So it's difficult at the moment until that is tested, I guess, to know how crucial that actually is to the case. But, you know, that's obviously something that the DNA is keen to explore as they obviously looking to see if there's other suspects they can identify.
- [07:11]
Podcast Host
I mean, it seems like in the first trial, a lot of the evidence was circumstantial. And now you have DNA being introduced by the defense. Is there any DNA being introduced by the prosecution that would help make their case that Alec Murdoch is the killer?
- [07:26]
Kayla Brantley
So they haven't mentioned any new evidence per se. So I guess that's something that we'll find out closer to the trial, or possibly not even until the trial if there is new evidence that the state has. They haven't obviously been investigating this because it was, you know, a done deal, case closed. So I guess that's something that they'll see over time. But as it stands, from the first trial, there wasn't DNA evidence or blood spatter. There wasn't any of that that physically tied Alec Murdoch to these crimes. And that's Something that, you know, the defence tried to pick holes in at the time.
- [07:59]
Podcast Host
Can you tell us a bit about this new judge and why we have
- [08:03]
Kayla Brantley
a new judge to begin with? Yeah, so the new judge is Circuit court judge Deborah McCaslin. She was assigned the case just a few weeks ago when this new trial was ordered. And, you know, she was just assigned to this case fresh off the bat. It's important to note that the old judge, Judge Clifton Newman, he actually retired in 2023. He obviously oversaw the last case and, you know, a new judge is required for this one. But, yeah, she was quite impressive in the courtroom, actually. You know, she made it clear that she is not gonna be messing around. And, you know, she made it clear that unlike everyone in this courtroom, I actually don't know the case super well. So basically, take it that this is starting from scratch. Don't assume that I know anything about this. You need to just be starting very much from SCRA with this. And she also made it clear that, you know, this is, you know, even though she's only just been assigned to this, she's really fresh to this case. She said now it's the oldest case on her docket because obviously this dates back to crimes from 2021. So she also has made it clear, you know, I want to get my docket cleared. Like I plan to get this done.
- [09:09]
Podcast Host
The Murdoch family was very well known. They were very prominent family in the low country. This case, obviously a huge deal in that community and nationwide, if not worldwide. You were there in South Carolina. Can you just tell us a bit about what the vibe was like? You spent a few days there.
- [09:29]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah. So the. The hearing itself was actually held in Lexington county rather than Colton County. Colton county was obviously where the first trial took place. And that was, you know, not far from where the Murdochs lived and, you know, where the crimes took place. But this hearing was in Lexington county, so that was around a 90 minute drive away from there. So not specifically in the area where it all happened, but I did have the chance to visit Colleton county and speak to some of the locals around the area. And one thing I'll say that I really noticed is how quiet the area was. I mean, a lot of things were closed. It was a real far cry from obviously the circus that descended on the town for that first trial. And, you know, the locals I spoke to, I mean, it was very clear that everyone knows about the case. Everyone knew of the Murdaughs before this case happened. And there was a mixed feelings about whether there should be a new trial. I think the sense that I was getting from many people was, you know, they accept why the court has decided to do this, that because of the jury dampering, but that they also kind of think it's a waste of time
- [10:39]
Podcast Host
because they think that Alex Murdaugh did this, and it's just going to produce the same result.
- [10:44]
Kayla Brantley
Exactly. I mean, some people said that the community is a bit torn, that some people think that there wasn't evidence proving beyond reasonable doubt. It seems like it is a very much a kind of torn community as to whether he did or didn't do it, and also as to whether there should or shouldn't be another trial. But one thing that was resoundingly clear was that everyone I spoke to made it clear that they do not want the trial back there. So obviously, Alec Murdoch is pushing for it to be moved to another location, saying, you know, he wouldn't be able to get a fair trial.
- [11:13]
Podcast Host
And this is why. This was held in a different county.
- [11:16]
Kayla Brantley
So this has just been held in Lexington County. That doesn't mean that's where the trial's gonna take place. Right where the trial will actually take place is still yet to be decided. But that was just where the initial hearing was held, because that is where the judge who has now been assigned the case is. The next hearing is gonna be held there, but the venue for the actual trial is still something that's up for discussion. But, yeah, the local community in Colton county made it clear they do not want it back there. I think they're very much like, we're done with that. It cost a lot of money, and they kind of are happy for him to take the trial elsewhere.
- [11:52]
Podcast Host
So what can you tell us about the scenes inside the courtroom and outside of the courthouse?
- [11:57]
Kayla Brantley
So, as I said, this was only a status hearing, so this isn't a really lengthy hearing. You're not going to get lots of new information by the way of evidence and things like that. And yet it was actually a very big turnout. So there was, you know, dozens of journalists, many of whom covered the case gavel to gavel at the last trial. And there was also around 30 members of the public outside before the courtroom opened, which, you know, as I say, for a hearing that lasted, say, an hour, is quite telling how much this case, despite the fact that there's already been a trial and despite the fact that he's behind bars for financial crimes and things like that, that this case still resonates with people and still has so much intrigue and interest I mean, these people outside the courtroom, I spoke to some of them. One girl had driven nine hours from Mississippi to be there and she was kind of like, even if this hearing's short, it's worth it for me to get there.
- [12:55]
Podcast Host
Why? What does she get out of it?
- [12:58]
Kayla Brantley
She said she's just like so intrigued by the case. And what was interesting is she actually didn't follow the case the first time. She said she didn't know about it until afterwards, but then has then had watched every minute of that six week long trial. So she'd caught up with that, which is obviously hours and hours and hours of footage. And she caught up with that and she was just so intrigued by it.
- [13:20]
Podcast Host
Was she there to support Alex Murdock?
- [13:23]
Kayla Brantley
She was more intrigued with the case itself. But she does believe that he's innocent. So. Yeah, yeah, she said she does think, you know, based on what she saw from the first trial, that she thinks he's innocent. Others as well were there. So there was spectators, some of them who'd watched it the first time, some of them who hadn't, some local, some further afield. There was also actually Reverend Raymond Johnson, he is a reverend from South Carolina, lives in Marion county. And he was actually at every day of Alec Murdoch's first trial, turning up every day in his robes and, you know, wearing his crucifix and holding up banners reading justice. And he'd actually traveled two hours to Lexington county to be outside this hearing as well. And he told me that he's here for justice. He didn't want to go into what he thinks justice looks like in this case, you know, whether that's Alec acquitted or convicted. But he said he's there for justice. He said Maggie once came to him in a dream and he feels that he needs to be there, boots on the ground to support justice. So it was just very interesting that this is the first hearing for the second trial. And we obviously know the first trial attracted so many people to the courthouse and outside the courthouse and thousands also watching proceedings on TV because it was live streamed. And based on that hearing, to me it seems like we are shaping up for a repeat of that with round two. This was called the Low Countries trial of the century, the first time round. And it seems to me that it's, it's going to be the same again.
- [14:56]
Podcast Host
And what about Buster Murdoch? Buster is Alec Murdoch's older son. He was not at the estate when his mother and his brother were killed. Did he attend this trial? Is he supporting his father? What do we Know about him?
- [15:11]
Kayla Brantley
Yes. So he did not appear at the hearing. And actually none of the Murdoch family members were there, which was interesting. Obviously, the first trial they really put on a united front, showing up every day of that trial. So it's interesting to see that they weren't there for this hearing, but obviously we'll see whether they do attend the trial. But yeah. Buster has not publicly commented on the fact that his father has a retrial. While I was in South Carolina, I did approach him and he made it clear he very much did not want to speak. He didn't have any comment, and, you know, didn't want to answer any questions. But Alec Murdoch's attorneys have told me that Buster does still support his dad and that they do still speak to each other while he's in prison. And I've also learned that Buster has actually recently had a child and that he's actually named his son in honor of his dad. So, I mean, that sounds like a show of support. Wow. Yes.
- [16:03]
Podcast Host
His son is named Alec.
- [16:04]
Kayla Brantley
We don't know his actual name because obviously Alec Murdoch's full name is Richard Alexander Murdoch.
- [16:09]
Podcast Host
Okay.
- [16:10]
Kayla Brantley
So not clear on what his exact name is, but just that he named his son after his dad. And the last time we did hear from him, Buster, he's only ever given one full sit down interview, which was in a Fox Nation documentary that was just a few months after the first trial. And in that, he very much said he believed his father was innocent. And that was after the conviction. So be interesting to see, obviously, Buster testified at his dad's first trial in his defense. So I guess we'll see whether he again takes a stand to testify in his defense again at the next one as well.
- [16:44]
Podcast Host
And Rachel, can you tell us a bit about Alec Murdoch's demeanor in court? How does he look today? How does he look any different from how he looked since we last saw him?
- [16:55]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah, I mean, he looked quite well. He's a towering figure. I mean, he's 6 foot 4. But, you know, he looked fairly well. He's, you know, thinner than some of the old images that we saw of him back in the day. Obviously, we know that he had struggles with opioids and he looked fairly healthy considering, you know, he's obviously been behind bars for the last few years. But in terms of his demeanor, I mean, it was quite hard to read what he was thinking during that time. He came in, he was smiled at his attorneys, he was sitting in his chair, he was rocking back and forth and a bit fidgety. At times he was very much watching intently both the prosecutor and the defense as they were speaking and the judge whispering to his defense attorneys. But I mean we have to remember that this guy was a lawyer. So by all accounts it seems like he's very actively involved and always was very actively involved in his own defense. But when the trial date was announced, he nodded along. So it seems like he approves of the time frame for his second trial.
- [17:56]
Podcast Host
We're taking a quick break after.
- [18:10]
Skyrizi Advertiser
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- [18:39]
Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.
- [18:51]
Now there's nothing on my skin thanks to Skyrizi and that means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic and psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.
- [19:09]
McDonald's Advertiser
All new drinks are now at McDonald's with refreshers like the Strawberry Watermelon Refresher and the Mango Pineapple Refresher with popping bottom to crafted sodas like the Sprite Berry Blast with berry flavors and cold foam. Who knew ice cold drinks could be so fire six? All new drinks are here now at McDonald's.
- [19:36]
Kayla Brantley
Refreshers contain caffeine.
- [19:42]
Podcast Host
Rachel, how do you expect the second trial to be any different from the first when it comes to potential new evidence, potential new witnesses? Are we going to be seeing something that is just a repeat of the trial that we saw in 2023?
- [19:56]
Kayla Brantley
So it does seem like it's shaping up to be quite different. I think that was the kind of sense that we're getting from that first hearing and also because of the ruling by the State Supreme Court. So in the ruling that overturned his convictions, the State Supreme Court also ruled on the financial crimes evidence as well. So during the first trial we heard a lot about Alec Murdoch's financial crimes. At that time he hadn't yet been convicted of them. But we heard from witness after witness. So that was law firm colleagues, clients, close friends who all testified how he had stolen millions of dollars from them. And this really played into the motive because at the time, Alec Murdoch's financial crimes were on the brink of being exposed. His law firm partners had confronted him about the fact there was missing money and that the CFO had confronted him on the morning of the murders. And his finances were also coming under a lot of scrutiny because of a lawsuit brought by the family of Mallory beach, who was the 19 year old girl who was friends with Paul and she was killed in a boat crash when Paul was driving the boat and her family was suing Alec Murdoch. And that was going to, you know, really expose his finances as well. There was a hearing for that suit set for just three days after the murders. So during the first time we really heard a lot about this financial crimes evidence and that really was part of the prosecution's motive, saying that his crimes were about to be exposed and so he'd killed his wife and son to almost distract from his growing problems and that it was this perfect storm, which
- [21:38]
Podcast Host
sounds like such a huge stretch to me personally. You know, you're going to be exposed for financial crimes and so as a distraction, you kill your wife and son. How did the prosecution make that connection between his financial crimes and the killings?
- [21:57]
Kayla Brantley
So it was very much this was a man in sort of crisis. This was a perfect storm of all of these scenarios, just building up pressure, pressure, pressure, pressure. At the time, his father was also ill and actually passed away just a few days actually after Maggie and Paul were killed, that this was just a man on the edge and it just culminated in those murders. And when you've heard from multiple people getting up there and saying, he did this, he stole from me, you know, this was including his best friends was on the stand and he broke down in tears because he was like, if he'd asked me, I would have given him money. It was quite compelling. But we're not going to hear. We don't know to the extent, but the state Supreme Court has ruled that this time around that the scope of that financial crimes evidence needs to be more limited. So that could have quite a big impact because obviously, as we say, that really plays into the motive. So that is also shaping up to be quite different. And then there's also obviously the matter of the DNA that we've just discussed as well. The defense has also said that they have other evidence. They've not revealed what but They've said, we've got other new evidence and new information. They've also said that they have had multiple people come forward to them with information, with evidence that they're now pursuing as well. So it does seem like it's shaping up to be a little bit different. I mean, one of the things that they mentioned was, was that several people approached him with information. And Dick Harpoutlian, Alec Murdoch's attorney, said that they'd had some information. What he described was extraordinary evidence that potentially linked Paul's murder to the murder of Stephen Smith. Now, Stephen Smith was a nursing student. He was found dead by the side of the road in Hampton county, not far from the Murdoch estate back in 2015. And his murder remains unsolved. The investigation into it was reopened and it was officially classed a homicide not long after the murders of Maggie and Paul. Now, again, we don't know what that information is. We don't know if it's just a tip, we don't know if there's anything substantiated in there, but the defence is very much indicating, you know, we've got new information and we plan to look into it and we plan to present it. So this second trial could actually look quite different to the first.
- [24:17]
Podcast Host
And what about some key witnesses from the first trial? You have Blanca, the housekeeper. You have Cousin Eddie, who is accused of being the murderer for hire assassin. That was completely botched. Do we expect to see them at the second trial?
- [24:33]
Kayla Brantley
So at the moment, we don't know yet. Cousin Eddie actually didn't testify at the first trial. He was on the witness list, but neither side actually called him. So it'll be interesting to see whether they do bring him to the stand. I mean, what's also interesting is, as you mentioned, that whole bizarre roadside shooting plot, that case still hasn't gone to trial. So Cousin Eddie and Alec Murdoch have not yet gone to trial on those particular charges, which is interesting because obviously, again, that was five years ago. Cousin Eddie has denied Alec Murdoch's version of events about the roadside shooting. He has also denied any involvement in Maggie and Paul's murders and his never been charged in connection to the killings. So it'll be interesting to see whether he is called to testify. And I think it'll also be interesting to see what the defence presents, you know, whether they will this time present actual names of alternate suspects during the trial.
- [25:32]
Podcast Host
Rachel, what was the crux of the defense's case from the first trial? If you could just give us a bit of an overview.
- [25:39]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah, so they very Much, you know, sought to pick holes in the investigation and that it wasn't thoroughly investigated, stated that the state just honed in. And the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division said that they just honed in on Alec Murdoch from the get go and didn't really look at any other options. They also argued that there was two shooters, and that was largely based on the fact that there was two guns used. So Maggie and Paul were killed with two different guns. And they said that indicated that there was actually two people there, not Alec Murdoch, which is also interesting because, you know, some people, you know, state witnesses have said since the trial they believe Alec Murdoch did it, but they also believe that he likely had help at least cleaning up the scene. So that's an interesting thing that I think also could be quite different as well.
- [26:26]
Podcast Host
And the murder weapons have never been found.
- [26:29]
Kayla Brantley
Exactly. Yeah, the murder weapons have never been found.
- [26:32]
Podcast Host
And Rachel, in this pretrial hearing, what legal arguments were discussed?
- [26:37]
Kayla Brantley
So they went over several motions that the defense had filed ahead of the hearing. So that included the testing of the DNA evidence that we mentioned and also a request to change the venue for the second trial as well. So Alec Murdoch's attorneys want the case to be moved out of Colleton county, where the first trial took place and where obviously Becky Hill, the court clerk, used to work. They also want it moved further afield as well, though. So they're also asking that it not only is it not in Colleton county, but that it is not in any of the other four counties that make up South Carolina's 14th Judicial Circuit. So that's Allendale, Beaufort, Colton, Hampton and Jasper. Because they're saying, you know, the Murdoch name has been synonymous with the local legal system there for nearly a century. That's because Alec Murdoch's family, so three generations of the Murdoch family actually held the position of the 14th Circuit solicitor for nearly a century, up until 2006. That was when his own father, Randy, stepped down from that role. So that's why this, like, Murdoch name is so prominent in that area. You know, they actually ran the judicial system for nearly a century, and the defense want it moved out of there. The prosecution didn't really put up too much of an argument against that. They actually said, when it came to that point, they actually said both sides are discussing that and they're going to have a discussion, see whether they can kind of agree on a potential location. If they can't, then the judge will make a decision. But it seems like there's discussions there. The other things that they also Discussed as well was what Alec murder wears in the courtroom. So the defence is saying they want him to be able to wear civilian clothes rather than the bright orange prison garb and him being shackled around his waistcoat, his waist and his ankles. They're saying that already prejudices him in the eyes of the jury. However, the state says that is standard procedure in South Carolina, that a convicted inmate, which Alec Murdoch is, he's still convicted of a slew of financial crimes and is serving 40 year and 27 year sentences for those, that it's standard practice that he is being treated the same as any other South Carolina inmates. So they kind of sparred over that a little bit. There was a bit of a performance in the courtroom where Dick Harpoutlian told Alec Murdoch, stand up so they can see how you're shackled. And he obligingly did. And, you know, he said, you know, this is not a dangerous serial killer. He's not Ted Bundy, basically, you know, arguing that he should not be shackled like that.
- [29:15]
Podcast Host
And when will the judge decide this? Is there another hearing? Soon, before this trial starts?
- [29:21]
Kayla Brantley
So there's another hearing in August, August 14, but she could decide before then. She took the matters under advisement and said she would decide before then. The same with his desire to have access to a laptop as well. So he's arguing that he should have access to a laptop so he can review all the evidence in the case and prepare for the trial. But again, as a South Carolina inmate, the state has said, you know, that's not something for a security reason inmates and not allowed to have a laptop in the cell. And, you know, the judge said she'd already spoken to the prison and found a kind of workaround in that scenario, that he would be able to have access to a conference room and review evidence on a laptop with a representative from his legal team so that he can prepare for trial. Because obviously he has a right as a defendant to be able to have access to all of that material and to prepare for his own trial. But they also have the matter of he's in a maximum security prison and security is obviously an issue. So it was about balancing both of those as well.
- [30:27]
Podcast Host
Are you hearing anything from legal experts about whether it's an advantage for the defense to have a second try at an acquittal?
- [30:34]
Kayla Brantley
Speaking to legal experts, they've definitely said that it is something that does benefit a defence team because, you know, the prosecution's played their hand, they've shown what they've got, and obviously this time around, you know, we mentioned the financial crimes evidence. The limiting of the scope of that is obviously a win for the defence. But there's also other aspects of that first trial that will be difficult to replicate. One of the big pieces of evidence from that first trial was the video at the kennels. So that was on the night of the murders. Paul had taken a video of a dog down at the dog kennels because he was looking after the dog for his friend. So basically, Alec Murdoch had claimed that he was never at the dog kennels that night. He was never at the crime scene where Maggie and Paul were murdered until he came home from his mom's house and found them dead. He kept up that lie until his trial. Whereas in the courtroom, the state played video footage showing a dog inside the kennel, and Paul was filming that to send to his friend. And in the background, you could hear three voices. Paul, Maggie and Alec, and person after person who knew the family took the stand and was asked by the state, what voices can you hear in that video? And all of them said, Alec Murdoch. Dozens of people said that. And it really did land because, you know, it showed not only was he at the crime scene, but for more than a year, he had lied about being at the.
- [32:08]
Podcast Host
This is the smoking gun. That video was essentially what put him away, because how did he then try to explain it away?
- [32:15]
Kayla Brantley
Exactly. And that's the thing. So he then obviously took the stand and said, okay, I admit it. I lied because I was really distraught about, you know, finding this scene. And also because he had an opioid addiction. He said he was really paranoid. Anyway, so he said he initially lied and that the lie just snowballed and he just continued to lie. But obviously, you know, he's got on the stand and he's admitted that he. That he's a liar. So it's a difficult one to win a jury over if you get on the stand and admit that. And I think it did really land with the jury that this person has lied. And can you trust what he's saying now? But this time around, obviously, it's going to be difficult to replicate that. And obviously now Alec has admitted that he lied. So this is no longer the first time he's finally admitting, because we now know that evidence. So that was a really powerful piece for the state during that first trial that is gonna be very difficult to replicate.
- [33:11]
Podcast Host
You were in South Carolina for a few days. Is there anything else noteworthy regarding the Murdaughs that you came across while you were there?
- [33:19]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah. So I also spoke to people around the town in Walterboro about Becky Hill. So Becky Hill's a. Obviously the court clerk. And as well as talking to them about, you know, the first trial and what they think about the second trial, it was interesting to get their thoughts because obviously the whole reason he's got this new trial is because she tampered with the jury. You know, she made comments to the jury, and it was her conduct that has led the state Supreme Court to say, we have to give him a new trial. Because they said that she placed her hands on the scales of justice. So I was keen to know what the sentiment is. You know, are people mad at her that they're having to go through this all again? But surprisingly, it was actually very sympathetic. This is a small town, and a lot of people knew her and said, you know, this image of her as someone who was after a payday that was wanting to sell her book and make some money, that that isn't the person that they see. And, you know, they said they think that, yes, she did make a mistake, but that they thought it was an innocent mistake.
- [34:21]
Podcast Host
It's worth noting that Becky Hill's position, she's elected to it. So the people of the community did elect her to that position. And like you said, it's a very small community. Everyone knows everyone. But it is surprising that she tampered so, so greatly in this case and that people would still be behind her. That's surprising.
- [34:42]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah, absolutely. And that was my thoughts as well. But, you know, they said that what's been said about her in court documents and, you know, on court records isn't the person that they see and that actually she's an upstanding member of the community and a very nice woman. And I actually also managed to briefly speak to Becky herself as well when I was there.
- [35:02]
Podcast Host
How was that?
- [35:03]
Kayla Brantley
So she said that she couldn't really speak too much about the situation because of the legal constraints, you know, there preparing for a second trial. And also she is in a legal battle now with Alec Murdoch. Alec Murdoch has obviously filed a lawsuit against her because of the jury tampering, but managed to speak to her a little bit. And these are the first comments that she's ever made since he got a new trial. And she told me that she would like to speak, but legally can't. But she did say that she doesn't have any regrets, but she is sorry that the state has to go through the process of another trial all over again. And she also said that the community, her local community, had actually been very supportive of her, that people had actually been very supportive. And the people that know her have actually been very kind to her that she, you know, she understands this criticism online. But the general consensus she's had from the community has been positive.
- [36:00]
Podcast Host
Well, no regrets from Becky Hill. Interesting.
- [36:04]
Kayla Brantley
Yeah.
- [36:04]
Podcast Host
Rachel, is there anything else you think our audience should keep in mind as we await Alec Murdoch's next trial?
- [36:12]
Kayla Brantley
I think just that the stage has kind of been set for this to be as big of a saga as the first time. I mean, as well as the crowds at the court and the fact that there is these lawsuits still going on and there is still all of these little webs of the case that are still yet to be tied up. This isn't over. And I think that's what's kind of baffling in the courtroom. You know, was chatting to the reporters and you know, the sense was a bit like, I can't believe we're back here doing this all again. But I think that's the thing. It's like it is back. But I do think it's gonna be different this time. I think we're gonna see some different information. I don't think it's just gonna be a total repeat of the first trial, but I think it also just shows like the saga of Alec Murdoch and all of the scandals and saga surrounding him is just far from over.
- [37:02]
Podcast Host
Well, thank you for joining us, Rachel.
- [37:04]
Kayla Brantley
Thank you for having me.
- [37:06]
Podcast Host
We will continue to follow Murdoch developments as they come. Thanks for listening. So that's it for today. We'll be back with a new episode next Wednesday. The Trial USA is part of the Crime Desk. Subscribers can listen ad free, get early access to new shows, full access to the archive and the member only podcast the trial. Plus visit thecrimedesk.com to find out more. A link is in the show Notes. Follow us on TikTok at the Crime Desk and on Instagram he trialpod. Leave a comment on Apple podcasts or Spotify or send us a voice note on WhatsApp 447-796-57512. Start your message with the word.
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Kayla Brantley
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