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The Triple Option
Spring Games Disappearing, Nebraska's Matt Rhule Joins, 2025 Heisman Trophy Predictions
00:53:29
Spring Games Disappearing, Nebraska's Matt Rhule Joins, 2025 Heisman Trophy Predictions
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- [00:00]
Urban Meyer
Are you concerned about those, you know, the Nebraska versus Arkansas, Nebraska versus Oklahoma. It's great for fans, but is it great for Matt Rule and the Huskers?
- [00:09]
Rob Stone
Coach Meyer, I'm at a lucky point in my life where at my fourth job and after getting fired in the NFL, I kind of say what I feel nowadays. I could care less. Why in the world would a Big Ten team who's already playing nine conference games, why would you ever play one of those games?
- [00:33]
Mark Ingram
There's the music coach. It just doesn't hit the same without Mark Ingram.
- [00:36]
Urban Meyer
How's he do it? Like this. Not happening.
- [00:40]
Mark Ingram
Nope, nope. That's all right. We leave it to the skilled talent over there. Welcome to the triple option presented by Wendy's. Go to Wendy's and taste the difference in hamburger. Rob Stone, Urban Meyer with you this week. Our friend Mark Ingram will be back next week. This week on the triple option, we're going to talk Heisman betting favorites, all things Nebraska football. Their head coach, Matt Rule will join us. And does the spring game still have a place in the college football calendar? Please rate, subscribe at Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever it is that you get your podcast as well as across social media at 3x option. Show again new episodes coming your way Every Wednesday on YouTube and wherever you get your podcast. So we crowned Ohio state as our 202425 football national champions after the first year ever of this 12 team college football playoff. So what's next on the college football calendar? Spring football. Right now, a lot of programs are in it and a lot of them end with the spring game. Those games, they actually start. Coach. March 1, Liberty has a game. March 1 runs all the way to May 2. Washington has their spring game. Coaches, certainly fans love spring football. I know the coaching staff loves it because so much happens in it. So tell us from a coaching perspective, what purpose does spring football and maybe that spring game at the end serve the program?
- [02:04]
Urban Meyer
Well, it depends on your team. You know, if you're taking over Bowling Green, you're, it's scrimmage every day. Every, you know, there, there weren't the rules that it was back back then that there are now. But if you're taking over a program that's, you know, like the Ohio State last year and the Wolverines year before, your veteran team, man, you're not hitting much at all. You know, I used to have a 2000 club and a 1000 club. And 1000 club is that means you have 1000 competitive reps. You're basically a starter for a Year. When you're a starter for a year, we start pulling you back early in spring practice. If you're a 2000 rep club, that means you're a, a two year legitimate two year starter that plays a lot of reps. You're not getting hit in the spring. You know, I used to have a list of them because I want the other players to see that too. There used to be just kind of back guys off, but I want players to be rewarded. You're a two year starter, the last thing you need is spring practice. You need to just get stronger, faster, get that body in shape. Unless there's a certain skill set that you need to work on. For example, I'm an outside linebacker, moving inside linebacker. Then you need to get reps. I'm an outside receiver, moving inside receiver. Then you got to get reps if you're playing the same position. Those guys didn't get many reps and I promise you they didn't get hit. So it depends on the team, depends on the player. And then I'm finding out after my visit to Oregon last year for spring practice, it really depends on this, this nil. And the transfer thing is real and spring practice is impacted by it. For example, Oregon last year, Dan Lanning, I was asking about, say, where's your first string? Why is the offensive line not together? And he made a comment or his assistant did that. We don't put them all together because first of all we want to give everybody an opportunity. Second of all, if you start naming a kid a first trainer, second strainer, third string, that third string might leave. I mean like leave during spring practice.
- [03:52]
Mark Ingram
Which like during that practice caught me off guard. Yeah.
- [03:56]
Urban Meyer
And then, you know, you hear Matt Rule, who's going to visit us here shortly, he's going to, he's going to maybe not do the spring game because he's worried about showcasing players for other schools to come and try to get. Maybe not the starters, but, but some backup plays well. And I promise you, other schools, they have transfer portal, portal stabs now. And you know what the transfer portal stabs do? They watch the lower level programs. They can go get a starter or they can go watch like in Nebraska and see a backup. I need that, I need that receiver to come start for me so that it's really an amazing time of college football.
- [04:31]
Mark Ingram
We're going to get to that Matt Rule comment in just a second. I wanted to follow up on spring drills and you're talking about the thousand snaps and the 2000 snap guys. What about when you have a legit competition, and obviously the main competition typically is a quarterback competition. So if you know you have a quarterback competition and you should always theoretically have some level of quarterback competition, I get it. But when you know that starter is gone and you've got two, three, four cats fighting to who's going to be number one in the fall, how do you manage that in the spring?
- [05:03]
Urban Meyer
Well, we had a really famous one. We had Joe Burrow and Dwayne Haskins, and it was. It was right. I mean, first of all, it's great because you got two great players, but I made sure every. Our quarterback coach charted every play, every competitive snap was charted because I wanted. I knew both these players were probably going to be NFL players. Joe Burrow put in his time. He broke his hand the year before. Dwayne Haskins came in, became the backup, had that. He went in and in the game we were losing to the Wolverines and won the game. So he was kind of the projected starter. But I wanted to make sure that everything was charted and it was very close. So that's a whole different animal, especially at that position and especially as high profile. Plus, the player deserves that. You're going to make a decision on a player's career, you better have some data in front of them and make sure that data has been worked over. Worked over, worked over. And when you have a conversation with the families, it's not just, hey, I feel this guy should be the starter. Here's what we got. And it was, you know, you go back to that time, and it was extremely close. And we named Dwayne right after spring practice because I didn't want to lose Joe, but we felt Joe had that, should have that opportunity, end up going to LSU and being one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time.
- [06:19]
Mark Ingram
Yeah, no kidding. So we talked about that unexpected wrinkle that Matt Rule threw in there. Here's his comment that he had recently talking about why the Cornhuskers were debating what to do with the spring. Due to everything that's gone on with Nil and the transfer portal.
- [06:39]
Matt Rule
I don't know that yet, but I'll be honest with you, I highly doubt it. And I think it's really fundamentally, I.
- [06:43]
Rob Stone
Hate to say it like this.
- [06:44]
Matt Rule
It's really because, you know, last year we're one of the more televised. We were one of the more televised spring games. And I dealt with a lot of people offering our players a lot of opportunities after that. So to go out and bring in a bunch of new players and Then showcase them for all the other schools to watch. But it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. The word tampering doesn't exist anymore. It's just absolute free, open common market. And so I don't necessarily want to open up to the outside world. I don't want these guys all being able to watch our guys and say, wow, he looks like a pretty good player, let's go get him. So, but I don't know yet, you know, I don't know anything. I just thought it was important that, you know, we at least started to broach that, that subject of it not being televised yet. At the same time I do want to show, I do want to show off our players in some way. So what exactly it'll be yet? I mean, I, I, I have not worried about anything other than recruiting right now, you know, both the portal and into the 26 class. So now I have to kind of turn my attention to all those things.
- [07:47]
Mark Ingram
I applaud him, number one for his honesty. And you're going to hear a lot more honesty coming up from coach Rule who joins us in our next segment. We're going to talk about his plans or lack of plans or whatever his plans are for the spring game. But coach, first time you heard that comment that a high level program was thinking of pulling their spring game, what jumped out to you?
- [08:08]
Urban Meyer
Well, I'm, I'm, I'm used to it now. I would say a year ago I'd be like, what the hell are you talking about? You know, who cares? That's not, but I get it. I think that of the things ahead, that's why I think he's a successful head coach. He thinks outside the box. He's has, he's a visionary. He's, he looks down the road. You know, sometimes as a head coach you get caught on the moment. He's looking past the moment. And I get it. You know, at first, like I said two years ago or a year ago, I'd say what are we talking about? But I think transfer portal, the reality that people have coaching staffs, assistants that are set, that's all they do is they watch other teams players and as they said, tampering does not exist. So that that player has a good game. You know what happens the next day an assistant coach from another school calls the high school coach, might call the player now because there are no rules and say, hey, I got this amount of money for you and you'll be a starter at this school. Or they'll contact a Representative of that player. So I get it.
- [09:07]
Mark Ingram
Yeah, it's. It's crazy. Wow. Spring transfer portal coach, April 16th through the 25th will only reopen for players whose head coach leaves. This is kind of last chance for these players to transfer ahead of that 2025 season. Last spring, more than 1200 players entered the portal. Per one source, we had over 2700 players enter in December or after the playoffs, with only about 58% of those players currently committed to a new school and about 4% of the players removing their names and returning to their original school. And it brings up the point to you, hey, man, there's a bunch of dudes that leave, and then there's this gap from guys who find new homes and guys who don't. And college careers can end because you jump into the portal. It's not always a good thing. We always seem to hear the success stories, right, coach? And, man, there's a lot of other cautionary tales out there about the transfer portal.
- [10:08]
Urban Meyer
Yeah, I think there's A and B, and I want to hit these both really hard. Number A or letter A is the fact that what happens to that thousand players? That. That's a thousand that have not found a home. And maybe more, maybe less, but maybe it's four. Who cares? It's still someone that the minute you are, you have that third uncle, which, once again, a third uncle is a person that should not be in that meeting, but it's in the meeting, or you have an agent or you have some advisor giving advice, pull yourself, put yourself in the portal. You know what the commitment of the school is. Once a player puts his name in the portal, the school does not have to honor that scholarship anymore. And he gets caught. He thinks the grass is greener. That offer does not come, the money does not come. You're left without a scholarship, or you got to go a much lower level than maybe you had anticipated, and you're starting over. For some people, that's good. For some people, it's not. And the second thing is, I read an article one time where a high school coach was very upset, and he actually banned the school from coming in to visit because that school really doesn't recruit high school players anymore. So they would come in, look at their players, but they don't really sign high school players. They just sign portal guys. And I get it. The high school coach is pissed off and said, you know why you come in? You know, you're wasting my time, you're wasting our players time. Yet you don't scholarship you don't go after high school players anymore. There are. I'm sure there's going to be data. It's going to be hard to find, maybe, but there's going to be a bunch of high school players left out there that otherwise might have been able to go to some of these schools.
- [11:44]
Mark Ingram
Yeah. In the 2024 transfer cycle, Coach, over 3,300 players entered. 68% of those 3,300 committed to new schools, with just over 3% returning to their original school. Fresh moves of the week brought to you by Wendy's. Go to Wendy's and taste the difference in a hamburger. So this is these numbers. You're right. We're kind of becoming comfortable listening to them, but they still make me uncomfortable, Coach, if I don't know, what is the solution out there? Are there too many, you know, transfer windows? You know, does there need to be a guarantee that these kids can. Can fall back to their original commitment? You know, what is the school's commitment to these players that they originally committed to? It's. It's a wild world out there. What do you think would make the system a little bit better right now?
- [12:35]
Urban Meyer
What a tough question. And I think that's on everybody's mind across the game. You know, we talk about, is there going to be a commissioner sometime? Will they. Will there be an umbrella of everybody under the same rules? I made my point very clear a couple of weeks ago. No chance that's happening. The rich will get richer and the weak will get weaker. So I don't have an answer for that, that the error is out of that balloon. It will never get fixed. It almost makes me laugh when they say, let's get Congress involved. And I watch the news every night, so I'm not sure. They got their own issues. So I'm not sure the answer. I just don't like when players get hurt. And I'm not talking about the kid losing his opportunity to play. You know what? At some. We're all grown men enough to say this. A small majority of those players have a chance to move on. Very small. And it's probably going to get smaller. I've always been the big proponent. Get your degree, get a job, utilize the network of the school you're at. You know, we're going to visit with Matt Rule. You tell me a football player that does it right, that lives a good life, gets good grades, he's probably set if he networks himself through the net. Corn Husker nation. I know that's a fact. At Ohio State The Ohio State player goes through the process, is loyal to Ohio State buses. But forget about the NFL. He's going to get, someone's going to give him that opportunity at, you know, outside of football. So that's my biggest concern.
- [13:58]
Mark Ingram
Yeah, I agree. There's still student athletes. And I know it's hard to, it's hard to hear that term sometimes and be like, really, really? You think this, this person over here with his, with his third uncle is, and trying to cash in this, this check and drive this car is a student athlete? They are student athletes. And there's way more student athletes than. There are just athletes out there. And I want to see those, those young men, those young women still have.
- [14:22]
Urban Meyer
And I know this for a fact. People are making decisions for $15,000. Yeah, they're making decisions and they don't, you know, the representative gets a cut of that, whatever it is. And, and here a guy wakes up somewhere where he doesn't want to be and just gave it away because someone advised him to move on. There's great stories, Dylan Gabriel and some, there's some great stories out there. You got Will Howard won a national championship. Great story. That's, that's very small.
- [14:49]
Mark Ingram
Hey, I'm going to talk Will Howard. Coming up a little bit later on the triple option. But coming up next, we're joined by the head coach at Nebraska, Matt Rule here on the triple option presented by Wendy's. When it comes to making the best hamburgers around, the basics matter. And Wendy's, well, they've really got those burger basics on lock and boy, does it show.
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- [15:30]
Urban Meyer
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- [17:27]
Mark Ingram
Welcome back to the triple option presented by Wendy's Urban Meyer, Rob Stone and a guy we've been trying to get on for a couple weeks now. Super excited to have Nebraska head coach Matt Rule join us right now from his office. We always are curious about the things behind the coaches when we interview them. But as Urban said off camera, it wasn't so much the things behind you, Coach Rule. It's, it's the stuff that's happening up top here. This, this shade of gray that always seems to hit head coaches after a certain point. First thing coach knows it's the lighting.
- [17:59]
Urban Meyer
He said it's the lighting.
- [18:00]
Mark Ingram
The light.
- [18:02]
Rob Stone
Yeah. You know what? It's, it's, this is like the part transfer portal, part nil, part, you know, Big Ten being at 18 teams now. Just a little bit of everything.
- [18:13]
Mark Ingram
Maybe a little spring game in there as well. We'll get to all that in a second. Coach.
- [18:18]
Urban Meyer
Hey, Coach Rules. Great to hang with you, man. And much respect. You know, Tom Osborne was a dear friend. Is a dear friend. And I go back in my career and I just, I studied in Nebraska at a very young age. They were the first school Rob to invest in the Student athlete. And I mean that sincerely. They. In the strength training, and this is way back when, and. And so I've always been a huge fan of Nebraska. One year we went and played them. I had my manager get a golf cart. I put a hat and sunglasses on. I just asked him to drive around. I wanted to see this crowd. It's. It's the best. As good a crowd as there is. And then the 90s, they were the mecca of college football. You joined the Big Ten, I think, in 2011, and they've had some good years, but not the great years. What obstacles have you seen since you've been there? And what promise is there someday, Nebraska and get back to the Nebraska vault?
- [19:13]
Rob Stone
You know, I. I kind of always likened it. I've kind of always tried to explain to people what I saw when I got here. Like, you know, sometimes you go into a. You know, you go down south, you know, you go up north, wherever, and you see, like, these beautiful old mansions, right? And beautiful pillars, just. Just beautiful bones. But the paint's chipping, the windows are old, The. The. The landscaping's dead. And that's kind of what this felt like. It felt like, you know, you have this amazing fan base, you have this history of excellence. You have a beautiful stadium, great facilities, yet the things that really matter, dominance in recruiting being on the forefront. And I think what you said, coach, is really important. There was a day when everyone in the country came to Nebraska to see what Boyd Epley was doing, to see what Tom Osborne was doing, whether it was offense, defense, life skills, study hall, nutrition. My wife was a dietitian at Temple when I was an assistant coach for Al golden there. And she put in the training table, and she didn't know how to put in a training table. She actually went to Nebraska and studied. Hey, how do you put a training table in? And she went back and did, like, this little miniature version of Temple. So we were always on the forefront. And when I got here, it was like there was this real feeling of, well, we can't do anything new, because this is how you do it in Nebraska. We've been. You know, this is what won for us. We were doing things in 2022, 2023, very similar to what we had done in 1995. And as I talked to Coach Osborne, it wasn't about recreating the past. It was getting back to that mindset of, let's be on the forefront of technology, sports, science, recruiting. Let's do things better than anyone else is doing them. And I think that shift was maybe a little uncomfortable for people. It sometimes feels like, hey, are we not being respectful to the past? But I'm blessed that Coach Osborne has really kind of paved the way for me and said to everybody, like, if Matt wants to flip sides of the stadium, let him flip sides of the stadium. If Matt wants to change the locker room, change the locker room like Coach Osborne did that. And so we're trying to be the best. I mean, if you came and saw our building, I think we probably have the best facility, the best training table. We are at the forefront again, and I think that'll hopefully help us attract players.
- [21:39]
Urban Meyer
You know, one thing that's always intrigued me about Nebraska is the recruiting piece that back in the day, I think California and Texas were the biggest, you know, the, the home state, as you will, because there's just not enough players in Nebraska. And then they went to the Big Ten. And I always wondered, like, where would you go reach as far as, you know, it's more national recruiting now with the access, but where do you go, where is your home recruiting base now that you're a Big Ten back in the Big 12 era or Big Eight even, you know, you had that quarter of teams along there, the Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, Texas A and M, and you go get those players, great players. Where do you, where do you see that Nebraska fits as far as recruiting?
- [22:20]
Rob Stone
Yeah, you know, we kind of refer to it as like the 500 mile radius, but. But for us it's really, it's really Kansas City, St. Louis. You go back, you know, the history of the players who came out of those places and came here and had success. So sort of reestablishing ourselves in those two cities and then the schools between going up to Chicago, battling for guys in Chicago and then, and then it's Nebraska up to Dakotas. You know, I, during my time in the NFL, Carolina, I went out to North Dakota State and I went and watched Tristan Murph's at Iowa. I did Northern Iowa. I just never went to Nebraska. And I was like, well, why are all the, why are all the best linemen coming out of these FCS schools? Like, you know, like the Dakotas, and they're not coming out of here. And so we take, we take Montana, we take North Dakota, South Dakota, really, really seriously, especially for big players. And so sort of that Dakota through Nebraska into, as I said, Kansas City, St. Louis, Chicago, we've had some success in Denver. And then we're going to go to Texas, California and Georgia, Florida, as you said, things have gotten so national. I think, as you look at, across all schools, you'll go to Ohio State, like amount of OHIO Guys maybe 20 years ago to now, how much more national is. Think of Penn State. You know, how many Penn State, Pennsylvania guys till now, how national is. So we want to be relevant kind of in all the major metropolitan areas. So if we get them on the first crack, great. If they go into the Portal, there's still a lot of relevance with us. And I think now with usc, UCLA going to California makes a lot of sense. You know, it's. It's a quick flight to Nebraska. It's not too far. You know, your nil goes a little further here than it does in California because of taxes. If you want to leave the state, it's a good place to come, and then you'll probably have a chance to go back and play a game in your home state because of. Because of the teams that are there.
- [24:11]
Urban Meyer
One more question about. One more question about recruiting, because I think this is intriguing. It's probably ever changing, but do you have a percentage of high school versus transfer? You know, back in the day, you remember what you did? You saved these three, four for junior college. Now I'm not even sure. I don't even hear about junior college. But do you. Do you. Do you have a percentage? You want to be 50. 50? Do you want to be. What. What's your. Do you have a mindset of what that would be?
- [24:38]
Rob Stone
Yeah. You know, coach, it changed so much for me, like, this year. This year, the Portal, this year was unlike anything I'd ever been a part of. You know, I'd been a part of the Portal, you know, previous two years, I'd been a part of free agency. This was like, unlike anything, I mean, anything I'd ever seen. It was. It was almost a little bit invigorating in some ways. It was like I came in every day and I had a list of like 30 guys to watch. I just sat here and cranked it out like a scout watching guys off. Pff. And trying to find guys that fit us and then getting to know them. So I actually kind of. Actually kind of enjoyed that process. But I would still like to bring in 15 high school guys a year. I mean, I still would like to be, you know, 65, 70% high school. It's just got to be. There's got to be the right guys. And I would say this, you know, with the new 105 limit and the ability to probably scholarship more guys, you know, while we're trying to find the five star, day one starter, walk in. I'm also always looking for the Temple guys. You know, the guys that came in for me there that, that were big and fast and could run, that just needed to develop. They're like the new walk on. You know, they're the guys that show up and if they're willing to stay for three years, you might develop into a really good player. So we're thinking about recruiting like high end recruiting, not necessarily walk on, but like trait players, like players that we think we can develop and then go get the guys we need on the portal.
- [25:59]
Mark Ingram
Last year, you guys, seven and six overall after that Bull win, which reversed a sub 500 season in your first year. So there's something about year three under Matt Rule in the college game. Obviously you did it at Temple, you did it at Baylor, and here we are closing in on year number three for you at Nebraska. What is it about year number three with coach Matt Rule?
- [26:20]
Rob Stone
Well, I think it's just always been about the players. You know, I've never really walked into a place that the roster was ready to win. You know, we walked in a Temple and we were going from like, you know, the Mac into the Big E. Flash, American, right? I walked into Baylor and there was this huge scandal, came here and you know, they hadn't really won and you know, so there were always good players at those places. But to me it's always been about we've taken young players, we've taken our lumps early with the young guys and as that quarterback, you know, P.J. walker at Temple, it was Charlie Brewer. At Baylor when they got to year three, it was their team. We had a good defense and guys kind of knew what to expect here. You know, Dylan's in year two, we've had a good defense, we've had a top 20 defense the last two years. We just haven't scored any points. And so year three, I think guys know what to expect and when you're asking, you know, when you're doing it the way we try to do it, you know, and I'll be, I've copied a lot of the stuff that I do. I've copied a lot of it from Coach Meyer. Like, you know, I work for Steve Adasio who came obviously under coaches too. I mean everything from the plan of the win to plan to win to the off season program to the different things I learned from Steve, from coach, we tried to implement a lot of that and it's hard. And so in year two, a lot of times guys are like, man, why are we doing this? It's, you know, we're not undefeated and you got to get, you got to kind of get to year three, you know, got to get to the point where they're, they're like, listen, it's not changing. We know how to work hard. We've had a bunch of close losses. Now it's time to go win. And I think we have the guys to do it. You know, certainly we have a quarterback. You know, when you have a quarterback, you always have a chance. And so I just think it's always been like a process of teaching, molding, developing, and then when the time comes, man, go in.
- [28:02]
Mark Ingram
You talked about your quarterback, Dylan Raiola, going into his second year as a starter. What's been the off season focus for your staff in, you know, getting him to that third year level, if you will.
- [28:15]
Rob Stone
Yeah, I think, you know, you play year one at quarterback sometimes, you know, you play so much of it off of like, just feel and adrenaline and, you know, just trying to make plays. And then, you know, you get to year two and you're really trying to master all the parts of the offense. I think for us it's him doing that while at the same time becoming dominant in the little things, his weight, making sure that he's a guy that can extend plays, making sure that he's a guy who's nimble and making sure that he's a guy who can run. You know, he's a much different quarterback at, you know, 225. They will be at 245. And so him buying into that, you know, he comes in every morning, does cardio before he throws and lifts. Right. So he's, he understands that, you know, he's a big man and wants to keep his movement skills. I think it's him, you know, take when you're a freshman. Last year he was trying to win the job. Now it's him every day with those receivers, like, hey, here's what we're going to do today. Like, here's here, here's what we're working on. Outside of what the coaches want. Leading by example, but by also demanding that the guys come be there with him. And then like anybody else, like any other young player, being good at the things you don't like, you know, I'm like, I'm the quarterback. I want to throw routes on air. But, you know, I know coach has matt drills and I'm going to go do the matt drills or I don't know what a Prowler push. Race has to do with me as a quarterback, but I'm a competitor and I'm going to go do it. And being great at all those things that none of us really like. I think when you see your quarterback out there, you know, he's. He's going to be on the front cover of a magazine. He's going to, you know, but when you see him grinding next to you, then you're kind of okay with all that. So I think Dylan's done a good job of embracing all those aspects of his game.
- [29:52]
Urban Meyer
You got the hair on the back of my neck standing up on Matt Drills, man. So I'm going to go on record of the host. Ingram's not with us. Ingram could make it. Stoner went last, I'm saying two and a half minutes. So, Matt Drill, do you.
- [30:05]
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You.
- [30:05]
Urban Meyer
I don't know if you can still do it like we did in the old days. You're not allowed to have the combatives and all that. So. Matt Drills, old school in Nebraska.
- [30:12]
Rob Stone
Yes. Yeah, we're old school. Yeah.
- [30:14]
Urban Meyer
Oh, my gosh.
- [30:15]
Rob Stone
Yeah. Like I said, I was saying earlier, Coach, I, you know, I worked with Coach Dazio and, you know, Fry and all those guys. Piranho. Those guys came up from you. And so I had taken kind of what you guys have done and then sort of the pen some of the Penn State world. And so you're right. Some. Some of the combatives you can't do, but there's ways you can do some things. I mean, it's crazy to me, somewhere along the way we've said that, like, two guys wrestling is bad or two guys fighting over a med ball's bad. Yet people pay like, till you do it, I might lose my job, but people pay like $100 a month to go to a box and do CrossFit and do crazy things. And then the people that are saying it's bad to do this to kids are the ones. Listen to David Goggins. They run 400 miles. Like, doing hard things and doing tough things and challenging yourself is what our society and our children need now more than ever, ever, ever. And so, like, our coaches, they want to walk through and they want to do route trees and all that. I'm like, you can do that later. Like, we're coming in twice a week and we are challenging our minds, our bodies. I'm challenging the coaches and, you know, players, like, what does it have to do with winning? And coach, the famous coach maternal line was always. It has nothing to do with Winning. But it has everything to do with winning. It's like, so, yeah, I believe in it, and I'll never, ever, ever. They'll fire me before I quit doing it.
- [31:33]
Urban Meyer
All right, I'm a bigger fan of. I was a huge fan of Nebraska.
- [31:36]
Mark Ingram
Now you're all in.
- [31:38]
Rob Stone
Let's go.
- [31:39]
Mark Ingram
So coach rule, My. My mom's listening back there in Lakewood Ranch, Florida. She has no idea what a mat drill is. All right, so. So tell.
- [31:47]
Urban Meyer
Careful, careful.
- [31:48]
Mark Ingram
Tell her what a mat drill is. She's all right. She. She produces Division one athlete. She's all in.
- [31:54]
Rob Stone
So it's really two things, right? So it's. It's the overall. It's like a series of stations where we're in sort of competitive. Can't say combative anymore. But competitive things will replace pushing ourselves to the limit. And then for us, the true mat drill is, you know, we're gonna. We're gonna line up. We're gonna line up eight lines deep across a mat, and we're gonna. We're gonna do agility drills and movements and off of command. And if, you know, one guy messes up, we all go back and you learn the power of accountability. You know, you learn the power of, like, you know, I'm gonna go hard, but if the guy next to me doesn't go hard, the guy behind me is just a little bit off. Then. Then. Then we have to do it again. And it's. I think it's really good. You know, there was a day, like, when the players came to college and they wanted to see what their dorm room's like. Now most players come to college and they want to know if they don't have to have a roommate. You know, we all just want to be so kind of separated and isolated now, and, you know, the world's changing. I get it. But there is something about a unit, and there's something about knowing who you can count on or. And who you can't count on. So it's. It's a challenge. And I run the. Like, the actual mat itself. I run the mat like, that's my one thing I do in this program consistently, because I want. I want to be able to watch the players and see who. Who's embracing some of them. That's hard. And who's getting through it. Anyone can get through it, but you know, who's attacking it. And if they can leave our program and they learn to attack hard things, then, I don't know, they're probably gonna have a better life.
- [33:17]
Mark Ingram
Is there a Mat drill. Is there a mat drill winner out there, Coach? Like a crown, a belt? Do you?
- [33:23]
Rob Stone
No, no. But what we do is after. After every. We watch them. We watch them. And after every day, we. We. After every practice in the different groups and the biggest common skills, we either. They're either in a black shirt or red shirt. Like, they're, they're tiered, so they know kind of exactly where they stand. Right? So there's, you know, there's, there's a. There's honest feedback based upon your performance.
- [33:43]
Urban Meyer
I think the greatest thing you said is mat drills, Rob, is the, is the accountability and discipline. Yes, the drills are really hard. Times are miserable. But the fact when an older player is in that first line and they get through and that freaking freshman or sophomore comes up and his foot's on the line, he's not in a football position, he twitches when he shouldn't twitch, and then they have to go back. You see some by, I mean, you see some stuff now, a great leader is not going to put up with that very long. So this is your show, though, Matt Row. I love it, though. Hey, let's, let's flip the switch here. So the spring game, you made an interesting comment. I went to visit Oregon last year. Dan Lanning had me speak to the team, and I loved it. And also I looked around, I said, where's your offensive line? He said, well, we really don't have a first string, second string, third string in spring because guys might move on if they're not where they think they should be. Their agent or whatever tells them move on. I was like, oh, my gosh. And then I see the potential of Nebraska. Robin, Nebraska spring game is like a game. It's like Ohio State. It's like one of the four or five programs in America. You have that kind of fan base if you pull a spring game. I can imagine there's. Husker Nation is going to be a little pissed off, but I get it. And the real reasoning is because of tampering. Is that what I kind of heard?
- [34:58]
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- [34:59]
Rob Stone
Well, I think there's really two things, right? I mean, I think, you know, we're still going to do spring the way.
- [35:03]
Matt Rule
We'Ve always done it.
- [35:03]
Rob Stone
We're still going to. We're still going to be physical. We're still going to strike. We're still going to tackle the scrimmages, but in controlled settings. You know, last year we got in our game and one of our best receivers got hurt. And, you know, you lose a couple games in the last drive of the game, you're like, man, I sure could use. I sure could use Demetrius out there. So, you know, game's always a little different. There's always a little more to it. But really, you know, our game last year was televised. A ton of people watched it. And then on Monday, there was, hey, coach. I got a call from so and so. I got a call from so and so. So it just, you know, when you think about the risk reward, when we're paying players already, and then with the portal, you know, portal's kind of in spring, but some guys will graduated. It just. I just don't know that I want to showcase for people what's out there. Plus, you know, two new coordinators, like, why let them see it? So we'll do something like the Pro Bowl. We'll go out there and we'll. We'll have, you know, seven on seven competitions. We'll probably bring back some former players. We'll do some skills challenge. We'll do all those things because I do want. I do want all the kids across the state of Nebraska who maybe can't get to a game to be able to come sit in Memorial Stadium and watch. Watch their players. And what I did love about the Pro bowl is, you know, you get to see the guys with their helmets off. You get to see their faces. You get to see their personality. So we'll do something. And we're not going to back away from physicality in general. But, you know, I was watching those FCS playoffs, I was watching Montana State, and, you know, guy makes a big block. I'm like, who's that? And they're like, well, he's already. He's going here and he's going. I mean, it's just, you know, you're showcasing. You're showcasing your players. And so with no contracts, the day we get contracts and the day we get some rules, I'll back. Back off. But, you know, I saw it firsthand last year how much it put us at risk, and I'm not really willing to do that. I think. I think we want to keep as many guys as we can for the fall.
- [36:55]
Mark Ingram
Makes sense. It's the grim realities of what college football is these days. All right, coach, give Oscar Nation some parting words that should have them up. Upbeat and excited about the 2025 campaign.
- [37:07]
Rob Stone
Oh, geez. Well, you know, I'm going to start our team meeting today. It's really the first one I've had before Matt drills, and I'm going to start it with I don't know if you've seen there, there, there's a, there's a, there's a three part documentary on the Red Sox and the Yankees and you know, the comeback when the Red Sox were down.03 and they came back and won it. And they talk about Curt Schilling and Kurt Shilling talks about breaking the curse. He's like, you know, I came there because I wanted to play in that game. He goes, but it was really just a curse of talent. There's no such thing as a curse. You got to be good enough to win. And so, you know, so much that happens here. People are like, you know, are we, are we snake bit or why do we lose so many close games or what? We're just, just, you know, you lose close games when you're just not quite good enough. You know, you're able to hang in because you're tough. But I think between what we've done recruiting, I think the way the guys are working, I think I think we're gonna have a chance to compete in every game. And you know, we went to Ohio State, I saw Coach Meyer was at the 50s celebrating with his national championship team and you know, we played Ohio State. And I think in that moment on that day, our guys felt like, well, we can play at this level. It's there. It's one thing to take over a program that's been winning and continue to try to get it to win and maybe take it up a notch. It's way harder to take over a program that hasn't won in nine years and teach them how to win. Because every step of the way everyone's like, well, why are we doing this? And you know, I think our guys see that we're close. And so it's nothing, it's nothing magical. It's not the uniforms we wear. It's nothing special that we're going to do. It's. It's just getting better. It's getting our players better. And so that's kind of a Nebraska type approach, right? That's kind of like a farmer every single day just going out and doing his job. And I think our team's finally kind of getting that and so I expect us to compete.
- [38:50]
Urban Meyer
Hey, one last question before I let you go. I just intrigued by this and I made a comment a couple weeks ago that I'm really worried about the non conference schedules because it's the right thing for Ohio State to play Texas. But why? You know, at the end of the day, Ryan Day has got to make the playoffs. Matt Rule's got to make the playoffs. This playoff thing has become, I think it's great, but do you, are you concerned about those, you know, the Nebraska versus Arkansas, Nebraska versus Oklahom, you know, where it's great for fans, but is it great for Matt Rule and the Huskers or does it just get to the, get to the playoff?
- [39:28]
Rob Stone
Why would you, why would you ever, why would you ever play one of those games? We're being completely honest. Like Coach Meyer, I'm at a lucky point in my life where at my fourth job and after getting fired in the NFL, I kind of say what I feel nowadays. I could care less. Why in the world would a Big Ten team who's already playing nine conference games, why would you ever play one of those games? Like what? Like you, you look at a lot of teams like there's, and I love that it's not anti sec, but like there's some SEC teams that last year only played three away games in another team's stadium. 3. We're in a league where some, some years you have five home Big Ten games. Some year you have five road, you have to go on the road five times in the Big Ten with no, with no. Like, you know, Florida, Georgia, like, you know, in a neutral site. So, you know, they proved to us this year when they did all the seating and all that stuff that early season wins didn't mean a thing. That really it was at the end of the day, what you look like in the last month of the season, that's, that's what it all proves.
- [40:24]
Urban Meyer
I agree, I agree.
- [40:26]
Rob Stone
If you look at, and when I say what it looks like, it's really how good your offense is. If you're scoring points and blowing people out late in the year, you're going to make it into the playoffs. So, you know, we beat Colorado. That was the same weekend coach, that, that Notre Dame lost to Northern Illinois. And so that was a huge win for us. That was a huge loss for them. They made the playoffs. Obviously we did not. So I don't know why, you know, I don't know why, what the incentive is. Unless at some point the Big Ten SEC get together and they say, hey, we're doing this, we're doing that. But when I joined the Big Ten, the thought of playing Oregon would have been like, wow, that'd be a great non conference game. Well, now they're in the league. You know, USC is coming here next year, going to ucla. We've, we've already added in those big games. And so I, I don't see much, I don't see much cause for it. I think Ryan's a great guy to go to play Texas again to start the year off, but I don't, I don't know what the point is in terms of if you're a Big Ten team getting to the playoff.
- [41:23]
Mark Ingram
The fans appreciate it, right? The Ohio State fans, the Texas fans, the college football fans love those big games. And you've got some big games, as you mentioned, Coach, to close the season, you guys got a great opportunity to close strong at Penn State and then home to Iowa. And you've got two big Cornhusker fans cheering for you right now. Coach Matt Rule. Enjoy. Enjoy the rest of the spring drills. Get those kids on the mats immediately.
- [41:48]
Rob Stone
Let's go.
- [41:48]
Mark Ingram
But Coach and I are going to go wrestle on the mat over or something. I don't know what two and a.
- [41:53]
Urban Meyer
Half minutes it would take. Coach Rule. That's it. He tap out.
- [41:57]
Mark Ingram
Give me 245. I'll go 245. Coach Matt Rule of Nebraska, thanks so much for joining us on the triple option presented by Wendy's.
- [42:05]
Urban Meyer
Light it.
- [42:09]
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- [43:10]
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- [43:40]
Mark Ingram
Welcome back to the Triple Option presented by Wendy's Urban Meier. Rob Stone back here with you this week, time for pick six, brought to you by BetMGM. Add a parlay wager, minimum odds of plus 400 to your bet. Slip bet up to the specified max stake and activate your token. If you win your bet with the token applied, you'll score extra winnings on your wager. Now, last week, coach, we talked about the mighty Hartford Whalers and the NHL and everything that came with hockey. Right now this week, coach, we get back to college football. The top six front runners for next season's Heisman Trophy winner. Okay, we're talking Heisman next year. I'm going to give you the top six and their numbers in a moment. But number one, what's it like to go into a season coaching a player that you know is a Heisman candidate?
- [44:28]
Urban Meyer
Well, we had it almost every year. You know, it started back at, at Utah when I had Alex Smith. Did I know Alex was going to be a Heisman? Utah never really had a. I don't think they had one and I'm sure they didn't. And Alex, as the season started to progress, I started hearing the word Heisman. Matter of fact, I'll go one before that. Josh Harris at Bowling Green, you know, had such a year that people were starting to vote for him for the Heisman. So as a head coach, safety of players is number one. But also getting your best players ball, I would always say is number two. But then also making sure that the players get what they deserve, their value. You know, obviously you got making sure guys are ready for the NFL draft, but also if you have a guy that's in, you know what that does for your school. More importantly for that player, you got to make sure that he's getting his stats. For example, J.T. barrett was a Heisman candidate, I believe, for two or three years. And one game. I knew we were playing a team that wasn't real good and we're going to beat him. We. He threw, I think he threw for five or six touchdowns in the first half because I told our coordinator, no runs. We're going to throw the ball every snap because I owe that to that player. I knew we were going to run the ball in the second half to kind of end the game. So I think coaches do a good job Most coaches do a good job. You got a Heisman candidate, the first job, win the game. Second thing, make sure that player is in the running. And does that impact your play calling? When I had Tebow and when I had some of these other guys, yeah, it did. I want it in my mind is saying, does he need. I would actually look at the stats on the scoreboard, say how many yards did he throw for and make sure he's at least in the running for that thing.
- [46:01]
Mark Ingram
Yep. All right, so again, according to BetMGM and these lines always change, right, Coach, here are your early, early, early season front runners to win the Heisman. Arch Manning at Texas is plus 700. Quarterback run here. Garrett Nussmeier, LSU plus 850. Go to Clemson, Cade Clubnik sitting there at plus 1100. Finally a non quarterback, Buckeye wideout, Jeremiah Smith at plus 1200. And then from there we go back to the quarterbacks and back to the Big Ten. Drew Aller at + 1300. So here we are hanging out in the early parts of spring and we're already talking Heisman, who's got the early edge right now. And again, by the way, this is a, this is a trophy that is won in November, but here we are talking about it in spring because people love talking about the Heisman Trophy and so do we. Coach, who do you like?
- [46:56]
Urban Meyer
Well, the best player in the country maybe in the last decade is Jeremiah Smith. He's the best player. I'm going to go through each one real quick. Arch Manning to be determined. I said that in. I think some Texas fans got a little upset saying he's the next coming. He might be. He's really good. You know, he's only thrown 90 passes and he had nine touchdowns, two picks. So the quiet guy, that really club neck of Clemson, he had 36 touchdowns throwing last year and he's back and he's. You've seen steady improvement from his quarterback. So that if I had to say it's only plus 1200. Arch Manning is number one at plus 700. As far as the betting, I'm going to say Jeremiah Smith's going to be the first receiver in a while to win the Heisman Trophy.
- [47:41]
Mark Ingram
Wow, wow, wow. Four wide receivers have won the Heisman, right? Tim Brown at Notre Dame, Desmond Howard at that program up north, devonte Smith and of course Travis Hunter last season. Although Travis, you know, I think he won it not just because he was a wide receiver, because he was, you know, an excellent defensive player as well. Just to go back to Arch@ +700 as you mentioned, doesn't have the numbers. Certainly has the name, has the pedigree. I go back to this statement that Heisman's are one in November, Texas, obviously they open up the season in Columbus against the defending champs Ohio State, but they closed November with Georgia and then they host Arkansas and Texas A and M. So those are three games you can, you can win a Heisman with Garrett Nussmeier at lsu. The Tigers open up at the Tigers, Clemson in August against Cade Clubnik. And that might be Clemson's marquee game of the season. They don't have Miami on their schedule this year. They do host SMU and Florida State and close at South Carolina. Jeremiah Smith, 1300 yards, 15 touchdowns. I think a lot of us think he's just the best player in college football. And it's interesting coach, because you know, Travis Hunter was the best player in college football last year. We all felt. And that conversation was able to maintain itself throughout the year and Colorado had a good enough season and the guy was doing enough spectacular plays on both sides of the ball that that conversation was able to carry on. Jeremiah Smith was just shut out of a couple games because defense has just said we can't let him beat us. Right? And again the problem with, with the question with, you know, with Smith is who's going to be his quarterback. Julian Saiyan, Lincoln, Kyle, the freshman, Tavian St. Clair, all in the competition right now saying appears to be the, the leader right now. Spring will have a lot to say.
- [49:32]
Urban Meyer
I will say this though for the, for everyone to understand though as important as that quarterback is, that is number one. But do they. Who's the Ameca on the other side? Yeah, you can take away a good receiver, you can't take away two. When I had Lewis Murphy, Percy Harvin, when I had Terry McClure and Michael Thomas, you know, you can't take away two because you can't rotate the COVID So will Carnetate develop enough to be that to take the heat off of Jeremiah? Because you once again, you saw it, you can take away a good receiver, right?
- [50:02]
Mark Ingram
I think Tate, I think Tate will be good enough. Also be questioned who takes over at running back as well for Ohio State, right, they lost their two headed monster and that obviously takes a lot of pressure off of quarterbacks and wide receivers. Of course, the last one, Drew Aller at Penn State plus 1300 through for over 3300 yards, 24 touchdowns, eight interceptions. Able to rush it though. Six scores, 302 rushing yards. And again, the story about Penn State, can they win the big one? They are bringing a lot of guys back a la what Ohio State did last season. And that's going to be a big talking point through the course of the off season in the early stages of college football in the fall. All right, make sure to follow subscribe rate us on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you get your podcast, as well as across social media media. You can always find us at 3x option show. Our thanks again to our wonderful sponsors Wendy's and BET. MTM. Matt Rule thanks for joining us. Mark Ingram, we can't wait to have you back. Come back from safari and join us. We'll see you again next week.