The TTPOA Podcast - Episode: "You’re the Damn Police, Go Do Police Shit" with Chris Palmer

Release Date: December 2, 2024
Host/Author: TTPOA Host
Guests: Chris Palmer

Introduction

In this episode of The TTPOA Podcast, hosts Derek and Brandon engage in an in-depth conversation with Chris Palmer, a seasoned police officer with 25 years of experience in Arizona's metropolitan areas. The discussion delves into critical aspects of police work, including training, tactics, leadership, and the cultural challenges faced by first responders.

Guest Background

[02:25] Chris Palmer:
Chris Palmer introduces himself succinctly, emphasizing his quarter-century tenure as a police officer in Arizona. This extensive experience forms the foundation of his insights into effective policing and training methodologies.

Training and Personal Responsibility

One of the central themes of the episode is the assertion that many criticisms about police training overlook the efforts already being made within agencies.

• Chris Palmer:
  “Cops need more training. I've got training.” [03:38]

  Palmer challenges the notion that additional training is universally needed, suggesting that many departments already provide substantial training but fail to emphasize personal accountability.

• Derek:
  “Why are we here? Like, you need more training.” [04:32]

  This rhetorical question underscores the discussion about whether the focus should be on increasing training resources or enhancing individual dedication to existing programs.

Cultural Challenges and Accountability

The conversation shifts to the cultural issues within policing, particularly the resistance to change and the lack of accountability for underperforming officers.

• Chris Palmer:
  “We are our own worst enemy in that. We allow a narrative to go out without answering it or just being reasonable about it.” [06:13]

  Palmer criticizes the internal defense mechanisms that protect underperformers, hindering overall departmental effectiveness.

• Brandon:
  “It's a defense mechanism. They can use that to avoid taking personal responsibility.” [06:13]

  Highlighting how complaints about training can mask deeper issues of personal and professional accountability.

Instructor Development and Effective Training

A significant portion of the dialogue addresses the shortcomings in developing competent instructors within police departments.

• Chris Palmer:
  “How do we develop people internally? That is a void we have.” [47:03]

  Palmer points out the gap in properly training instructors who can effectively convey critical skills to officers.

• Derek:
  “Most instructors aren't built to teach effectively. They just have certifications.” [48:56]

  The need for a more rigorous instructor training process is emphasized, moving beyond mere certification to ensuring practical teaching competence.

Scenario-Based Training and Realism

The hosts and Palmer discuss the importance of realistic, scenario-based training that prepares officers for unpredictable situations.

• Chris Palmer:
  “There is nothing good that has ever come from talking to the police.” [66:44]

  A perspective highlighting the necessity for officers to master effective communication and de-escalation techniques through practical scenarios.

• Brandon:
  “When you use those tactics, you're making them better critical thinkers.” [55:18]

  Emphasizing that realistic training scenarios enhance officers' critical thinking and decision-making skills in the field.

Use of Force Policies and De-Escalation Techniques

The episode delves into the complexities of use of force, advocating for clear policies and the importance of de-escalation.

• Chris Palmer:
  “Our job is not to decide who lives and dies. Our job is to make people safe.” [56:27] [56:55]

  Palmer argues that the fundamental responsibility of police is to ensure public safety rather than making life-and-death decisions.

• Derek:
  “We need to hold officers to a higher standard and ensure they understand the ‘why’ behind their actions.” [58:00]

  The necessity of officers articulating and understanding the reasoning behind their use of force is highlighted to maintain accountability and public trust.

Community Relations and Body Cameras

The interaction between police and the community, especially through the lens of body camera footage, is scrutinized.

• Chris Palmer:
  “When someone watches your BWC and it gets broadcast... it just looks like chaos.” [10:50]

  Discussing how body camera footage can skew public perception if not contextualized properly.

• Brandon:
  “Positive reinforcement from body cams can validate good behavior and set examples for others.” [30:58]

  Highlighting the potential of body cameras to showcase commendable officer conduct, thereby fostering better community relations.

Mentorship and Leadership within Police Teams

Emphasizing the role of mentorship and effective leadership in shaping competent officers.

• Brandon:
  “As instructors, we need to mentor officers continuously and provide constructive feedback.” [16:25]

  The importance of ongoing mentorship in enhancing officer performance and adherence to departmental standards.

• Chris Palmer:
  “Chalk it away, put it in the memory bank, try to pass it on.” [45:30]

  Advocating for a culture of learning from mistakes and reinforcing positive behaviors through shared experiences.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

The episode wraps up with the hosts expressing their appreciation for Chris Palmer's candid insights and his contributions to law enforcement training.

• Derek:
  “Chris, I always enjoy how you approach things with common sense and relay them effectively to the end user.” [84:12]

• Brandon:
  “Your explanation of de-escalation techniques really helps in understanding their practical application.” [75:30]

Palmer’s pragmatic approach and emphasis on personal responsibility, effective communication, and realistic training methodologies provide valuable takeaways for first responders aiming to enhance their professional capabilities.

Notable Quotes:

1. Chris Palmer:
   “Cops need more training. I've got training.” [03:38]

2. Chris Palmer:
   “We are our own worst enemy in that. We allow a narrative to go out without answering it or just being reasonable about it.” [06:13]

3. Chris Palmer:
   “Our job is not to decide who lives and dies. Our job is to make people safe.” [56:27]

4. Brandon:
   “When you use those tactics, you're making them better critical thinkers.” [55:18]

5. Derek:
   “We need to hold officers to a higher standard and ensure they understand the ‘why’ behind their actions.” [58:00]

6. Chris Palmer:
   “Don't violate principles. Do whatever you want. Yeah, other than that. Go for it.” [81:34]

Key Takeaways:

• Personal Responsibility: Emphasizing that individual officers must take ownership of their training and professional development.

• Accountability: The necessity of establishing and maintaining high standards within departments to prevent complacency and underperformance.

• Effective Training: Advocating for realistic, scenario-based training that equips officers with practical skills for unpredictable situations.

• Instructor Development: Highlighting the need for robust training programs to develop competent instructors who can effectively impart critical skills.

• Community Relations: Utilizing body camera footage constructively to build trust and demonstrate positive police-community interactions.

• Leadership and Mentorship: The role of experienced officers in guiding and mentoring newer recruits to uphold departmental values and standards.

This episode serves as a compelling discourse on the multifaceted challenges within law enforcement, advocating for a balanced approach that combines rigorous training, personal accountability, and effective community engagement to foster a competent and trustworthy police force.