TTPOA "Train-Up's" - Ben Stoeger discuses Grip

Summary

The TTPOA Podcast: Episode "Train-Up's" – Ben Steger Discusses Grip

Release Date: October 28, 2024

Hosts: Derek and Brandon
Guest: Ben Steger

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Introduction

In this episode of The TTPOA Podcast, hosts Derek and Brandon welcome special guest Ben Steger, a renowned competitive shooter and instructor in the firearms industry. As active-duty police officers leading SWAT teams in Texas, the hosts aim to provide valuable insights into tactics, training, and leadership for first responders. This episode delves deep into the fundamentals of firearm grip, exploring Ben's unique philosophy and teaching methodologies.

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Guest Introduction: Ben Steger

The episode kicks off with Derek introducing Ben Steger, highlighting his reputation in the shooting community. Ben agrees to join the conversation, expressing enthusiasm about discussing the foundational aspects of shooting—particularly grip.

Notable Quote:

Derek [01:36]: "If you don't know who Ben is, just Google him and you'll figure out who he is. He's done some things in the shooting world. Competitive shooter, author..."

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Ben's Philosophy on Grip

Ben Steger challenges traditional grip teachings by shifting the focus from prescribed techniques to establishing conditions that allow shooters to understand and develop their own effective grips. He emphasizes the importance of maintaining a stable and predictable connection with the firearm rather than adhering to rigid grip percentages.

Key Points:

• Connection Over Technique: Instead of dictating how to grip a gun, Ben creates training environments where shooters can naturally develop a grip that works for them.
• Avoiding Percentage-Based Grips: Ben critiques methods that prescribe specific percentage distributions (e.g., 60-40 grip pressure), arguing that it's challenging to quantify and apply consistently.

Notable Quotes:

Ben Steger [04:04]: "The big evolution for me was set the conditions so people can understand it."

Ben Steger [07:17]: "Maintain a stable, predictable connection."

Ben Steger [07:25]: "The gun's not sliding around in my hand while I'm shooting."

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Common Shooting Issues: Trigger Freeze and Excessive Grip Strength

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around common issues shooters face, such as trigger freeze—a condition where the shooter's hand tenses up, hindering proper trigger reset and follow-through. Ben attributes these problems to excessive grip strength and the incorrect attempt to control recoil through brute force.

Key Points:

• Trigger Freeze: Occurs when shooters over-grip, leading to tension that impairs trigger control.
• Over-Controlling Recoil: Ben advises against trying to manage recoil by gripping the firearm tighter, as it can be counterproductive.

Notable Quotes:

Ben Steger [09:21]: "Trigger freeze is when people's hand tenses up and they can't even reset the trigger."

Ben Steger [07:39]: "It's actually kind of counterproductive. Right. Because all my fingers are connected."

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Ben's Teaching Methods: Principle-Based Instruction

Ben advocates for a principle-based approach to teaching firearm grip rather than strict, technique-focused instruction. His methods encourage shooters to understand the underlying principles of grip and apply them dynamically across various scenarios.

Key Techniques:

• Aggressive Shooting Drills: Ben employs drills like doubles, one-shot returns, and transition awareness to train shooters in maintaining a stable grip under stress.
• Allowing Exploration: By permitting shooters to make mistakes in a controlled environment, they learn to recognize and correct grip flaws organically.

Notable Quotes:

Ben Steger [13:38]: "It's a different philosophy than what most people are going to learn."

Ben Steger [15:32]: "People rise to the expectations that you give them."

Ben Steger [17:03]: "Fill your magazines up. It's like, do the drill."

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Adapting to Different Firearms

Ben emphasizes the importance of training with various firearms to develop adaptability and understanding of different platforms. This practice ensures that shooters can apply their grip principles effectively, regardless of the firearm in use.

Key Points:

• Versatility in Training: Ben advocates for training with multiple gun types to build comprehensive grip adaptability.
• Knowledge Transfer: Principles learned on one firearm can be seamlessly applied to others, enhancing overall shooting proficiency.

Notable Quotes:

Ben Steger [21:13]: "I like doing shooting. I like training."

Ben Steger [22:08]: "As a function of all the international travel and then training with different units, it's advantageous for me to shoot different guns."

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Impact on Shooters: Personal Anecdotes and Feedback

Throughout the episode, Derek shares personal experiences and feedback from trainees who have benefited from Ben's teaching methods. The freedom to explore and understand grip principles has led to significant improvements in their shooting performance and confidence.

Key Points:

• Empowerment Through Principles: Shooters feel more confident and less constrained by rigid techniques, allowing for more natural and effective firearm handling.
• Positive Feedback: Trainees report feeling more liberated and effective in their shooting, attributing their progress to the principle-based training approach.

Notable Quotes:

Derek [19:44]: "When you hear someone who is a world champion... that you are human. And that is a good thing to hear..."

Ben Steger [17:56]: "You're not just going to shoot one thing for three months and pick up another gun and immediately be like, world class with a gun you haven't touched."

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Conclusion

The episode concludes with both hosts expressing gratitude towards Ben for his invaluable insights into firearm grip and training methodologies. They underline the importance of understanding and applying fundamental principles to achieve proficiency and adaptability in shooting.

Notable Quote:

Derek [23:32]: "Hope you listen to the next one. See you train hard, stay safe."

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Final Thoughts

In this engaging episode, Ben Steger provides a refreshing perspective on firearm grip, advocating for a principle-based approach that fosters adaptability and confidence among shooters. His emphasis on connection over rigid technique, combined with practical drills and real-world feedback, offers first responders and firearm enthusiasts alike valuable strategies to enhance their shooting performance. Whether you're a novice or an experienced shooter, Ben's insights are instrumental in elevating your training regimen.

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Train Hard. Stay Safe.

Transcript

[Derek]

Foreign officers, military and all first responders.

[Ben Steger]

We'll be talking training tactics and leadership.

[Derek]

With the best subject matter experts around. Here are your hosts, Derek and Brandon. Well, hello folks. We're still trying to get the new intro in since Derek's no longer with us. I mean, he's still with us, but just on the podcast anymore. We got a special, special guest here. We got a special series that we're starting thanks to Ironside Podcast. Scott out there kind of gave me an idea. I was listening to his podcast not too long ago, so I thought about having some series with some instructors. And our first guest is going to be Ben Steger. The notorious Ben Steger.

[Ben Steger]

Hello.

[Derek]

Hey, Ben. So we're going to talk about. We're going to break this up into several different categories and do like 15, 10 minute, 20 minute podcast about different things that we see in the fire firearms industry as far as like the foundation of shooting fundamentals and things like that. So let's get this started. We'll see how successful this is going to be here. And we got some video for the first time. So this is interesting. So now I can't just look stupid all the time. I gotta pay attention to the camera. So, Ben, how you doing, man?

[Ben Steger]

I'm living my best life, man.

[Derek]

You are, man. You do have a great life. Travel around, teaching people to shoot, drive the country, see everybody. This is good.

[Ben Steger]

I shoot a lot.

[Derek]

Yeah, you do.

[Ben Steger]

Nice.

[Derek]

It's a good deal. I was talking to the president today. He was at your class, and I was like, man, Ben's girl, you got a cool life. Just gets to shoot and do his own thing and you're your own person. I love that.

[Ben Steger]

You did tell me that. You're like, hey, you're kind of your own man.

[Derek]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Which is. It's not normal anymore.

[Derek]

No, it isn't. It isn't. Because we're all. I mean, I still work for a department and there's things that I have to watch out for. And, you know, most people, you know, have to do that. But you, man, you're free.

[Ben Steger]

I am a free. I am a free man. Say and do as I please.

[Derek]

I like that. I like that.

[Ben Steger]

It doesn't make. It doesn't matter.

[Derek]

I'm impressed. I'm impressed. But you worked hard. It wasn't like you just all of a sudden just poofed saying, you're just here, so.

[Ben Steger]

Right. And if I try to get a job, like let's say I want to be a Sig rep or something like that, that's a hard job for me to get. Maybe impossible, but I can keep doing the thing I'm doing now, no problem.

[Derek]

Yeah, you do what you do, and, you know, that's a good thing, man. I think sometimes the freedom is way more. More than anything else. So. All right, so, man, if you don't know who Ben is, just Google him and you'll figure out who he is. He's. He's done some things in the shooting world. Competitive shooter, author, authors. One thing. I've read some of your books.

[Ben Steger]

I like that you Google Rule 34, Ben.

[Derek]

Rule 34, Ben. Yeah, that has to do with maybe some USPSA shooting stuff.

[Ben Steger]

Let's say yes.

[Derek]

Yeah, let's say yes. Yeah. So. No, but what I like about Ben is that there's no secrets. He doesn't keep the secret to himself. And you got to come to his class. I mean, you can Google him, go on YouTube, and you'll see his whole damn class. And each one's a little different. He always, Every. Every time I go to his class, there's always something that he's adding to and stuff. So I really appreciate that. He's not a gatekeeper of knowledge, so that's a good thing, especially in us on law enforcement. So I've talked with a lot of instructors over the years, and I think one of the main things when I want to ask them, hey, what problem do you see when it comes to shooting a handgun? Grip? And we talked about that earlier today, and you said, yeah, that's. That's the main thing that you see. So how do we fix grip? What is grip? So, man, I'm just going to let you take it and we'll go from there. So take this, guys, as a. As a study training lesson here and really take notes and really dive into this because he's going to give you some good stuff about grip.

[Ben Steger]

Yeah. Well, I think the shift for me started when instead of trying to tell people how to grip the gun, I set. I set up the course and more. My thinking is set the conditions so that they can understand how to grip their gun, which is different than telling them how to do it.

[Derek]

Yeah, right.

[Ben Steger]

Because people may not understand that. And a lot. There's a lot of. A lot of stuff gets lost in translation. And then, of course, everybody's built a little different. The guns are sized a little bit different, and you're going to understand and articulate your grip differently than other people's.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

So when I say, hey, the big evolution for me was set the Conditions so people can understand it. That meant set. Set it up so that we get people shooting really aggressively and then give them the tools so that, like, the principles that we're trying to. To do, which to me is connection, so stay connected to the gun, all right? And then. And then that gun is going to go where I'm looking, right? So. But all I need to do as far as my grip is maintain a stable, predictable connection. And really, I'm not looking to do anything else. I'm not trying to stop the gun from recoiling. I'm not trying to be, you know, like, I guess I'm in control of what I'm. What I'm doing, but I don't feel like I have more control if I grip the gun harder for that, if that makes sense. And then people develop their understanding of what it is of this stuff while we're shooting, like, really aggressively. So you weren't there this morning, but it's not anything new for you. You know, doubles is a good drill, you know, one that I use for that. There's other drills as well, like one shot return, or we did. We did a, A transition awareness exercise as well. But you just set up, like, what I do now is I set up these exercises and give people the principles and have them shoot aggressively, and then they're able to understand and articulate what's.

[Derek]

Going on for that. So when I was going through the academy, it was like 60, 40, 70, 30. So throw that out the window.

[Ben Steger]

Yeah, they. I mean, well, yeah, yes and no. So, so that's one thing. So grip, that's like, oh, let's do 60, 40 or 70. So what that means is some percentage of the grip or some percentage of your total strength, I'm not sure what they mean goes into one hand and as some other percentage goes into the other. And that. That concept is rooted in the principles that I'm talking about. But that would be like. I would consider that now if I tell people that, like, that's a mistake for that I'm making a mistake telling them that because for one, that may not really be what I'm doing. You know, it's hard to measure percentages of my grip that's actually applied on the pistol while I'm shooting.

[Derek]

Right.

[Ben Steger]

That's very difficult. So it's like, that may not be what I'm doing. That may not be what they should do. Right. So it's like, it's just. I wouldn't articulate it that way. The way I would say to say, hey, I want to maintain connection to the pistol and I want to be able to move my trigger finger quickly and independently. Right? Yeah. So I want to grip the gun firmly with my dominant hand, but I'm not trying to crush it or bear down on it. I need to maintain connection to it.

[Derek]

Okay.

[Ben Steger]

Meaning there's a stable, unchanging relationship between my hand and the gun. Like, the gun's not sliding around in my hand while I'm shooting.

[Derek]

While you're shooting. Right.

[Ben Steger]

So now I'm connected to the pistol. I don't need to grip it harder than that. It's actually kind of counterproductive. Right. Because all my fingers are connected. So if I clamp down and bear down with my dominant hand now it's very difficult to move my trigger finger quickly and independently.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

All right, so now by. When I explain it in a principles way like that, hey, get the connection. And then you don't need to go further than that. Right now that makes more sense. And it's not really a percentage thing. It's like, this is what I'm trying to accomplish.

[Derek]

You'll fill it by shooting and experimenting and.

[Ben Steger]

Yeah.

[Derek]

And you doing it. You being in the right shooter, not.

[Ben Steger]

You being the shooter. Like you would feel that. And then the other thing that I think that I. I changed a lot from in the classes I was doing is in when people are trying to understand this concept, like I have them shoot really aggressively and then they start doing. It's essentially you're doing a walk back. Like you just keep walking further away from the target. So you will shoot bad shots. Yeah, you will. Like we're going to set it up so you'll do that. But the idea is that you get people to learn from that and understand it. So again, typically with their dominant hand, like, let's say that they don't like the way the pistols recoiling. Their pistols recoiling up. And they're trying to control it so they can shoot really fast. They tense up their dominant hand, drive the pistol down. Like, I want to create the conditions where people do that and then they start to develop. The understanding is like the problem here with my grip is that I'm trying to control the gun in a way that's not going to work. And I just need to focus on the core principle is just be connected to the pistol and trust my vision that it's going to come back to where I'm looking for that.

[Derek]

No. So. So someone who's out there listening and working on their own when they. What causes trigger Fees. When, when, when, when that happens and you're a right handed shooter. What, what causes that? What do you, what do you, what would you tell someone, hey, you just stop doing this or this is what's happening.

[Ben Steger]

So typically when you tell people, hey, go faster, go faster, go faster with whatever they're doing, they're going to add tension, right? I mean they'll tense up their shoulders, they'll tense up their hands. Tip. The most common thing that's going to tense up is a dominant hand.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

So let's say you've got a nice stable connection to your pistol. You're shooting the gun aggressively, it's all good. Then for whatever reason you decide you need to shoot faster or shoot better. So like let's say I'm engaging a target and I fire around that I judge is bad. Like it's a miss, whatever. Then my, I'm like, oh, like I'll have this conscious reaction. Oh, like that's bad. That's not what I want. And then my dominant hand just takes over, tenses up more and starts driving the pistol. I start driving the pistol with my dominant hand back into the aiming area that I'm trying to hit. Okay. So now I've, I'm violating what I'm trying to do. What I should be doing is just be connected to the pistol and look where I want it to go and it's going to go there. And when I, soon as I start changing the tension of my hand, try to drive the pistol and force it to where I want through like brute force. Now I'm getting, I'm gonna, the results gonna get worse, right? Yeah, like, and add in more tension, add in more tension and then eventually you can't move your trigger finger properly at all. So trigger freeze is when people's hand tenses up and they can't even reset the trigger.

[Derek]

Yeah, right. Yeah. Definitely have felt that before. Yes, I've definitely felt that. So what are some good exercises, drills, whatever you want to call them, to work your grip, to really focus in on, hey, this is what I'm doing. I'm feeling it. What are some things you mentioned? Doubles.

[Ben Steger]

Doubles is good, but it'd be pretty much any single, like single target. So we want to isolate whatever we're doing. Right. So get rid of multiple targets, get rid of a movement element. Right. So if you're just isolating your grip, working on a single target is good. And then you want to like, you want to build up speed. Right. So any, any drill that has those components is going to be some kind of test of your grip. Like a build drill is a good test of your grip, but that's in a different way. But it's a good test for that. Yeah, doubles is a good test of the grip. Those, like, you don't need to reinvent the wheel. All those things are good tests. And then if you want, you can layer it on, make it more complicated, where, let's say I'm drawing and shooting a couple rounds, reload, shoot a couple more. And that's again, a very good test of your grip because you get on the grip quickly and then you're changing magazines and get back on the grip for that.

[Derek]

Yeah, it's easy to. To get one shot off. You don't have to really have a good grip. A lot of times get one shot off an accurate shot, but it's those second, third, fourths that you start seeing the grip really start falling away. What's your thought of why that is such a problem with people? Is it bad instruction? Is it just. Is it just because it's. It's simple in principle, but it's just hard to do or what. What is your thoughts on that as.

[Ben Steger]

Far as, like, why the grip is so challenging? Yeah, I. I do. I think it's. I think. I wouldn't say bad instruction, but it's. It's kind of the way that shooting has developed and. And people talk about shooting technique and where stuff gets put into little boxes. It's like. So, for example, like, people might talk about grip, and that's one thing. And then maybe they talk about trigger control over here, like it's a totally separate thing. And then like, one. One exercise that I like a lot in class, I call one shot return, where we just index the gun on a target and fire a shot. Like fire a shot on a signal. We don't even assess where that round goes. All you're doing is returning the gun precisely, exactly to that aiming area. Right. And there's a lot of issues that get conflated. It's like, how am I holding the pistol? What am I trying to accomplish? Like, what am I doing when I pull the trigger? Like, what concept is in play? And then at a core level, what am I trying to accomplish in terms of controlling the gun? Or, like, managing the recoil? Which is. I'm not trying, like, in my head, I'm not trying to force the gun back down to a spot in a particular time. I'm just looking where I want it to go and letting my eyes take care of it while I stay connected to the pistol. Right. That's a different philosophy. It's a different concept than what most people are going to learn.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Right. So if I put it in a box, like grip is over here, trigger controls over here and it's like. But these things are all interrelated ways that you can't really unwind them. Yeah, right. And the thing that's driving everything you're doing is your concept in your head of what you're trying to accomplish. Which again, from like where I think the people fall down is that they think they're going to control the pistol by working harder.

[Derek]

Yeah, no, that is true. I see it a lot because I'm like, there's no reason my bullet should be down the crotch area because the gun's going to only go up so far and it's going to come back down and it's going to stop where I index it at. But I, I'll push it down. And I'm like, I'm like, it just drives you crazy when, when you put too much input of that gun because of your dumb ass. Yeah, I hate that.

[Ben Steger]

Yeah. I mean I think I, I have a different philosophy just how to approach this stuff.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

With people. Like for example, I did a, like a one on one coaching thing with a, like a young like new shooter type of person. Very little experience, hardly any work from a holster. And what I had them doing is just like, nope, we're going to shoot really aggressively. I'm allowing misses.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

I'm having like. But in two hours they're shooting, you know, holding the A zone five seven yard doubles. They're shooting and moving effectively, hitting A's. But it's like, it's, I'm, I'm not feeding them like, hey, you dogmatically grip the gun like this, you know, hold it like this, stand like this. They didn't get fed all this technique, they got fed principles and then they were given some rope and some room to explore. When I'm like, hey, I'm not going to be mad if you fuck this up. Like just not just shoot the gun aggressively. Like, see what happens. It's like, okay, do you understand why the rounds are going down there? To understand why they're going up there and yeah.

[Derek]

You know that that's been a huge light bulb moment for me every time that I've been around you and like Pranka and some other guys that teach the inductive way of like, hey, here's the principles. I want you to feel it. I give you Permission to just get off the rails. I get on the gas and just see what happens. And I've really taken that philosophy now personally. And then when I teach guys, and I was in Arkansas tactical last week teaching a covert class, and a lot of those guys up there, at first, they were. They didn't really know what to do with the permission, hey, you can get outside of that a box. You can get outside this little circle and towards, like, lunchtime. We had a conversation, and they're like, man, that was so freeing. Like, we've never been told that. I'm like, it is nice. And then by the end of the day, man, these guys were totally different shooters the next day. It was a good thing when you give guys permission, because I know I was the same way in law enforcement. It's got to be all in this little circle. I got to put the big old hole at the end of the day. And now my targets look, like, just crazy. But I also know when I dial it back a little bit, man, it's so much easier to dial it back when I need to, as opposed to now. I got to speed up. I've never sped up before and things like that. So, man, kudos to y'all of just really transferring that knowledge and letting it be a truly learning experience for the. For the end user, the shooter.

[Ben Steger]

Well, it's what I think is, like, people rise to the expectations that you give them. So, for example, today, it's a. It's a class for police. So they show up, and what's the question I'm getting from a bunch of them is like, how many rounds do I put in my magazines?

[Derek]

Yes.

[Ben Steger]

Right. You're shaking your head. You're like, God damn right. So it's like, I'm not. It's just your philosophy. I'm not telling you how many rounds to put in a magazine unless it's, you know, actually important. Yeah, in this case, it's like, no, fill your magazines up. And then I'm like, this round. This drill's eight rounds. And I don't tell dudes to reload. I just, like, they are adults. Like, they will figure out to manage their own. And what do you know? You just don't say anything. It was like, fill up your magazines. It's like, do the drill. Give them start signals. They rep out the drill. Yeah, we're done. Like, holster your pistol. Like, but what do you know? They figure out, get ammo, put it in the mist, keep. Keep filling them up, and we're just going to keep Training.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

And instead of, like, trying to control every part of the process. Right. So you just apply that to everything.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Give them some principles, like, this is what. How we're diagnosing the target. This is what we're looking for.

[Derek]

Yeah. I think you do a great job, too, of the demos. That really has helped me of watching you demo something in a way that, you know, guys are going to do wrong, and you see it, and then you see it, you do it, and then you do it yourself. You're like, oh, okay, that's. Now I saw it, now I felt it. And that. That really connects a lot of the. Of the brain and the body and everything to me. Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

When I like demonstrating it.

[Derek]

Yeah. I'm always amazed that I'm like, even your up demos, I'm like, damn, it's a good target still. So it's still. Still pretty good. It's funny, you were talking about new shooters and stuff. My son, we went and shot, I guess, Sunday. Yeah. Yesterday was Sunday. And he hadn't shot when. Probably about a year or so. And we're working from concealment. And I. I told him the same stuff, man, like, hey, get on the gas. Let's just shoot. I gave him a little cheater and a little paster and stuff. Like, hey, go after it. I was so impressed with just. I mean, it was Alpha Charlie's. Alpha Charlie's. A lot of alphas, maybe four or five deltas the whole day. And we were moving left and right, back and forth. So it was just that whole deal because the light bulb came on from him and he felt. I'm like, hey, what'd you do there? Well, I did this. Or. Yep. I chased my dot and I saw the dot and I shot it up there. I'm like, to me, that's a huge deal of learning. Like, which ones? One of y'all said it was talking about how you learn more from your misses than you do from your hits.

[Ben Steger]

I could. I shoot a lot of misses. Learn how to shoot fast.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

I have fired rounds that missed hundreds of thousands of times in my life.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Not exactly hundreds of thousands of times.

[Derek]

And I think that's when. When you hear someone who is a world champion, a national champion and shoot as much as you do, that that's a. You are human. And that. That is a good thing to hear, because sometimes we beat ourselves up, which is we should. Obviously, the range. I'm like, shit, man. Should I just go to a shotgun? But it is. You come back and it is addicting. And stuff. But I think the way you're teaching it is so beneficial to law enforcement. And that's why I, you know, wanted to have you on. That's why I always bring you back to my region. Because I've seen what you've done for me and I've seen you what you've done for guys on our team and some other guys around that I follow and talk with. And so that's why I think it's important to have you out there, because of the way you teach. If no one's ever been to one of your classes and you're intimidated by Lloyd, what you see on Instagram or what, man, come out to a class, it's all about shooting. Like you. That's all it is about shooting, man. It's funny because that's what you're about. Like, this is your life. And it's not fake. It's not. It's. It's true genuineness. And if you got a question, you're going to answer it. And you push the students. I like that. But you do it in a good way of like, hey, I see your potential. You'll tell, speed up, man. Like, you got the accuracy. Speed up.

[Ben Steger]

Hey, man, this is what. This is what I like doing. I like doing shooting. I like training. I've always. I've always been into training. More like competition for me was just something to drive the training. It gave me somewhere to push the training.

[Derek]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Gave me something to do, something to train for.

[Derek]

Yeah, I think, too. What's impressive with you is that, man, you'll see just a stock Glock and then you'll pull out some other gun and then you'll pull out this other gun and some other cheese dick site that it's just.

[Ben Steger]

Well, I mean that. So that's another thing. Like, at this point, I. I'm going to shoot a lot because that's what I'm doing. I train a lot because that's what I'm doing. But within that, it's like, I could just shoot one guy, shoot a Glock if I just shot a Glock all the time. No. Like, nobody would complain. I could just shoot a Glock.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Or I could spend a little bit of money and get other guns and apply the same principles to those guns and, like, learn those platforms very, very quickly, which is something I've been doing. I mean, it happened over the last, I'd say more than 10 years where I was doing a lot of international classes, so it's easier just to go borrow A gun?

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

And that changes things when you are like, just go borrow one in my. I'm. People are expecting magic in class. When I shoot, they're expecting magic. And that's not really feasible with a borrowed gun. That's not how it works.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

Like, that's. Regardless of what people think. You got to train with, you know, the gun you're shooting. You're not just going to be shooting one thing for three months and pick up another gun and immediately be like, world class with a gun you haven't touched. That's not how life works. But as a function of all the international travel and then training with different units, I. It's advantageous for me to shoot different guns. And I've just leaned into that more and more over the last few years, and now I'm just doing it on. Yeah, I'm making a show of it on social media, but it's something I'd be doing anyway.

[Derek]

Yeah, no, I think. I think that's good because different guys show up with guns that are like, well, I shoot that too, so. Okay, well, here's my issues.

[Ben Steger]

That was nice today. I, like, showed up. I walked around, I looked around. It's like, I got a box. I got Glocks, I got staccatos. Probably I'll use one of them. I got other stuff with, you know, look around. It's like, what's it going to be? Is it Glock or staccato? Because we got a law enforcement class.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

TTPOA in Texas.

[Derek]

Yeah.

[Ben Steger]

So again, I'm expecting some staccatos.

[Derek]

Man, they have grown since the six years I've been doing this, man. It went from one dude to now. The hell there'll be half a class now and stuff.

[Ben Steger]

Classes. It's.

[Derek]

It's crazy. It's crazy. So anything else on Ben on Drip that we need to talk about? Ben?

[Ben Steger]

I don't think so.

[Derek]

All right. You think we're good on that one? All right, boys and girls. So that's your first edition of our little training session out here in the backyard. Honky tonk. So we'll come back with another one, and so I appreciate it, guys. Hope you listen to the next one. See you train hard, stay safe.