The Turning - Seasons 1, 2 & 3: Episode 2 - Ep10 Révérence

Host: Erica Lance
Guests: Stephanie Soland, Chloe Angel, Theresa Ruth Howard, Katherine Morgan, Wilhelmina Frankfort, Sophie Flack

Introduction

In Episode 10 of Season 2, titled "Révérence," The Turning delves deep into the intricate and often tumultuous world of ballet. Hosted by Erica Lance, the episode features insightful discussions with ballet experts and former dancers, exploring the hidden dynamics, cultural expectations, and lasting impacts of ballet training.

Personal Ballet Experiences

Stephanie Soland begins by reflecting on her personal struggles with ballet, highlighting the emotional and psychological toll it took on her:

"[05:41] Stephanie Soland: I'm not very good at ballet. Like, I'm just not."

She connects her difficulties in ballet to broader issues of identity and femininity, revealing how unmet expectations in ballet translated to feelings of inadequacy in womanhood.

Erica Lance shares her nostalgic yet critical memories of ballet classes, emphasizing the routine and discipline:

"[03:14] Erica Lance: When I think about what it felt like to go to ballet class every day as a kid... I liked the quiet, the focus, the preparation."

The Hidden Curriculum in Ballet

A significant portion of the episode discusses the "hidden curriculum" within ballet culture—the unspoken lessons and societal norms inadvertently imparted to young dancers.

Stephanie Soland elaborates on how ballet teaches girls to embody specific feminine ideals:

"[07:25] Stephanie Soland: ...you learn in ballet is what a good woman looks like. How you're supposed to look, how you're supposed to move, how you're supposed to behave..."

This indoctrination fosters obedience, perfectionism, and the suppression of personal discomfort, contributing to long-term psychological effects.

Erica Lance connects her personal experiences to Chloe Angel's book, Turning: How a New Generation of Dancers Is Saving Ballet from Itself, underscoring the pervasive nature of these hidden lessons:

"[05:41] Stephanie Soland: ...I got to this section about ballet's hidden curriculum... How much of my personality... has been molded by spending every day in a ballet class."

Physical and Mental Effects of Ballet Training

The discussion shifts to the physical repercussions of intense ballet training on young bodies, as well as the mental health challenges faced by dancers.

Stephanie Soland highlights the irreversible damage done to dancers' bodies:

"[22:44] Stephanie Soland: Once you stretch a ligament, it never contracts back. It's not like a muscle... you won't be a dancer forever."

She emphasizes the long-term instability and health issues resulting from early and extreme flexibility training.

Erica Lance adds to the conversation by addressing the mental health struggles, including malnutrition and hormonal imbalances that affect brain development:

"[23:24] Erica Lance: ...malnutrition might affect their brain development... make them more vulnerable to broken bones and osteoporosis."

Balanchine’s Influence and Ballet Culture

The episode delves into the profound impact of George Balanchine on the ballet world, examining both his genius and the problematic aspects of his legacy.

Stephanie Soland discusses the near-mythical status Balanchine holds and the reluctance to critique his methods:

"[27:14] Stephanie Soland: ...are you trying to cancel Balanchine? And I was like, even if I wanted to, how would I do that?"

Erica Lance and Theresa Ruth Howard explore the gender and racial dynamics introduced by Balanchine, noting the lack of recognition for contributions by dancers like Arthur Mitchell.

"[28:30] Theresa Ruth Howard: ...Arthur Mitchell was vilified for the same characteristics that made Balanchine revered."

They argue that Balanchine's portrayal as a "genius" creates a toxic environment where questioning authority is discouraged, perpetuating generational trauma.

Generational Trauma in Ballet

The conversation moves to how the reverence for Balanchine and traditional ballet norms has instilled deep-seated trauma across generations of dancers.

Theresa Ruth Howard explains how the glorification of Balanchine masks the underlying abuse and oppressive culture:

"[34:28] Erica Lance: ...The Turning is a production of Rococo Punch and I Heart Podcasts."

She articulates that ballet's hierarchical structure and expectation of perfection contribute to ongoing psychological harm.

Katherine Morgan adds a poetic metaphor to describe the compartmentalization within the ballet world:

"[36:22] Erica Lance: Imagine that ballet is an old English manor house... So many people are dancing it in their own companies..."

This imagery illustrates the isolation dancers experience within their specialized environment, further entrenching trauma.

Life After Ballet

The episode poignantly addresses the challenges dancers face when transitioning out of the ballet world, highlighting personal testimonies of recovery and reintegration into "normal" life.

Wilhelmina Frankfort shares her harrowing experience of leaving ballet and the subsequent struggle with mental health:

"[50:08] Wilhelmina Frankfort: ...recovering from postpartum depression... I started taking my mental health more seriously."

Her narrative underscores the long-term effects of ballet training on personal well-being and identity.

Sophie Flack recounts her journey from being discarded by the New York City Ballet to pursuing education, illustrating the difficulty of redefining oneself outside of ballet:

"[44:42] Erica Lance: ...she decided the first step would be education. She'd go to college."

Katherine Morgan and Stephanie Soland discuss the residual impact of ballet on their lives, emphasizing how deeply ingrained ballet culture remains even after leaving the stage.

Conclusion

The episode concludes by weighing the profound beauty and personal fulfillment ballet can offer against its darker, often destructive underpinnings. Stephanie Soland passionately argues that despite the exploitation and trauma, ballet's transcendent moments and the sense of home it provides are invaluable:

"[56:14] Stephanie Soland: ...there's nothing like [the feeling of a perfect pirouette]."

Erica Lance reinforces this sentiment by emphasizing the lasting imprint ballet leaves on one's psyche and body:

"[58:32] Erica Lance: It matters that we get this right."

Révérence serves as a critical examination of ballet, advocating for necessary reforms to preserve its beauty while mitigating its harmful aspects. The episode invites listeners to reflect on the balance between artistic excellence and the well-being of those who dedicate their lives to the craft.

Notable Quotes

• Stephanie Soland
  "[07:25] ...you learn in ballet is what a good woman looks like. How you're supposed to look, how you're supposed to move..."

• Erica Lance
  "[03:14] ...I liked the quiet, the focus, the preparation."

• Theresa Ruth Howard
  "[34:28] We're mythologizing trauma for the art."

• Sophie Flack
  "[44:42] ...she decided the first step would be education."

• Wilhelmina Frankfort
  "[50:08] ...recovering from postpartum depression."

Final Thoughts

The Turning Episode 10 - "Révérence" offers a nuanced exploration of ballet's complexities, blending personal narratives with critical analysis. By highlighting both the exhilarating highs and the often-overlooked lows of ballet, the episode provides a comprehensive understanding of the art form's impact on individuals and culture.

For more details on the series, follow Rococo Punch on Instagram or visit theturning.cocopunch.com.