S3:EP 12 - Postscript: Christa

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Turning – Season 3, Episode 12: "Postscript: Christa"

Podcast: The Turning: River Road (Rococo Punch & iHeartPodcasts)
Air Date: September 9, 2025
Episode: S3:EP12 – Postscript: Christa
Host: Erica Lance
Guest: Krista (former member of River Road Fellowship)

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Overview

This episode of "The Turning: River Road" serves as a reflective postscript, focusing on Krista's voice and her lived experience within the River Road Fellowship, a notorious Minnesota cult led by Victor Barnard. Through an intimate conversation with host Erica Lance, Krista discusses the experience of having her story publicly told alongside Lindsay (the season’s main survivor), the complexities of memory and narrative, and the ongoing journey of personal healing after cult life. The episode goes deep on how survivors process trauma, the nuances of community abuse, differing survivor perspectives, and the long, painful but hopeful process of rebuilding a life after escaping extremism.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Impact of Hearing & Sharing One’s Story Publicly

• Liberation Through Storytelling: Krista describes the feeling of having her story, and Lindsay's, shared in the podcast as “liberating.” She notes how validating it is to have their voices heard simultaneously and to compare similarities and differences in their stories.
  • “It feels liberating...It feels very validating honestly.” (Krista, 03:12)
• Imposter Syndrome and Memory: She discusses the gaslighting survivors endure and the relief of having her reality affirmed through another’s parallel account.
• Disconnect with Other Survivors: Krista notes that despite overlapping experiences, she and Lindsay barely knew each other inside the group and processed things differently.

2. Multiple Realities Within Cult Communities

• Different Experiences of the Same Group: Krista observes how members had varied perceptions of River Road—some, like her mother, focused on “good memories” and were unable or unwilling to see the underlying abuse.
  • “She just wants to remember the good things. I don’t fault her for it...but I really didn’t [have that frame of reference].” (Krista, 07:06)
• Denial, Memory, and Disagreement: Not all ex-members agree on what took place—notably around issues like whether young people were moved as “spies.” Krista and Lindsay recall these dynamics differently, but Krista clarifies that the culture of reporting and surveillance was real, even if not always explicit.
  • “It was a conditioning. It was a manipulation to be foot soldiers to report back what they saw—and they absolutely did do that.” (Krista, 12:32)
• Family Responses: Her mother wants to focus on positive memories and her sister refuses to engage with the podcast, instead choosing to “leave the past in the past.” Krista finds this both understandable and isolating.

3. The Mechanics of Cult Control

• Creation of Insular Groups & Shifting Status: Krista describes various subgroups within the cult—Shepherd’s Corps, Maidens, Auriga’s Band, Gilead Gamblers—and how status was both granted and revoked by Victor to control young members.
  • “It became a name only really...you never really knew what it meant.” (Krista, 21:45)
• Gendered Oppression: Women were far more regulated than men in matters of dress, behavior, and freedom of movement.
  • “Women were absolutely different, expected to be quieter, more submissive…the rule of walking in twos only applied to women and girls.” (Krista, 24:33)

4. Recognizing the Cult for What It Was

• Krista reflects on the moment she first acknowledged (to herself and aloud) that River Road was a cult—adopting the label internally before using it to explain her situation to an outsider.
  • “I kind of always just had it in the back of my head that yes, we were a cult, but we were like the ‘good kind’ of cult… when it was solidified was when I watched the story with Jess and Lindsay…that was when it solidified for me.” (Krista, 29:20)
• Red Flags: She outlines classic markers of cults—especially isolation and the presence of a charismatic authority figure who replaces individual free will.

5. The Aftermath: Healing, Setbacks & Growth

• Early Pain: After leaving, Krista describes feeling lost—struggling with basic decisions, emotional regulation, substance abuse, and toxic relationships.
  • “I didn’t know how to be a person…I didn’t know what to eat, I knew nothing.” (Krista, 43:38)
• Seeking and Finding Support: Key turning points included reaching out to a former clergy member who validated her grievances, entering recovery from alcoholism, seeking therapy, and slowly building a community and healthy relationships.
• Faith Deconstructed: Krista’s journey with religion evolved. After initially rejecting religion, she reclaimed faith on her own terms, viewing God as loving rather than punitive.
  • “I started realizing that my god was a god of love and a god of healing...and that the people who said that they were acting in God’s name were false prophets…liars.” (Krista, 48:55)

6. Lasting Effects—and Signs of Hope

• Ongoing Struggles: Krista remains in therapy, particularly around disordered eating rooted in cult life. A moment of self-realization listening to the podcast helped her seek help.
• Parenting as Healing: She finds profound healing in watching her young daughter grow up fearlessly, determined to safeguard her from the abuses Krista endured.
  • “I think Maddie is everything that I would have been had I not had my entire personality beat out of me at a young age…I’m just so happy for her that nobody’s ever gonna take that from her.” (Krista, 51:24)
• Words of Encouragement for Other Survivors: Krista urges listeners that healing is hard, messy, but real and possible.
  • “Healing is available. It is hard and it’s messy but it can happen. You don’t have to hurt forever.” (Krista, 53:01)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Liberation & Validation
  • “It feels liberating...especially to have my voice and Lindsay's voice heard simultaneously and being able to hear the differences but also the similarities in our stories. It feels very validating honestly.”
    – Krista (03:12)
• On Cult Label Realization
  • “I kind of always just had it in the back of my head that yes, we were a cult, but we were like the good kind of cult...when it was solidified was when I originally watched the story with Jess and Lindsay and they talked about it as being a cult. That was when it solidified for me.”
    – Krista (29:20)
• Red Flags in Cults
  • “A big one is isolation. If they are telling you that you can’t talk to your family or your friends…that is cult red flag 101 in my opinion…The main thing people need to look out for.”
    – Krista (31:09)
• On Hope and Healing
  • “I want people to know that healing is available. It is hard and it’s messy but it can happen. You don’t have to hurt forever. It’s available to have a happy life.”
    – Krista (53:01)
• On Victor Bernard’s Mugshot
  • “He looked weak, he looked thin and sickly, he was missing a tooth, he looked small. And I looked at him and I said that’s who he is—that’s who he always was underneath the guise of what he tried to portray to us—he’s small and weak and ugly and man that felt good.”
    – Krista (53:01)

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Important Timestamps

• 03:12 – Krista discusses the liberating feeling of having her story told.
• 06:38 – Reflections on the varied experiences and memories of River Road members.
• 12:32 – Krista explains the culture of surveillance and “reporting” within the group.
• 18:54 – Life at the Melita property and details about Shepherd’s Corps.
• 24:33 – Gender differences in control—Krista describes rules for women versus men.
• 29:20 – Krista recounts the process of internally and externally labeling River Road as a cult.
• 31:09 – Warning signs and red flags for cult-like environments.
• 33:29 – The struggle for narrative integrity and frustration with media coverage.
• 41:24 – The first turning points after leaving the group, seeking validation.
• 43:38 – Krista’s emotional and functional struggles immediately post-escape.
• 48:55 – The rebuilding of faith and how personal tragedies led to renewed belief and healing.
• 50:24 – Ongoing struggles, especially with disordered eating.
• 51:24 – Krista’s joy in her daughter’s fearless spirit as personal healing.
• 53:01 – Krista’s message on healing and taking power back from Victor Barnard.

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Final Thoughts

This poignant, reflective conversation provides both an important historical record and a roadmap for trauma recovery. Krista’s narrative resists easy closure, holding complexity—joy beside pain, hope beside loss, and the ongoing tension of survivor memories. Her message is ultimately one of self-compassion, resilience, and a belief in the possibility of healing—not just for herself, but for others walking similar paths.

Transcript

[Krista]

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

Are you doing i'm doing really good it is the hottest day of the year today so oh no i'm sitting in a room where they can't have.

[Erica Lance]

Air conditioning oh no we better make this quick then should we just call.

[Krista]

It it's okay no it's okay from.

[Erica Lance]

Rococo punch and i heart podcasts this is the turning river road i'm erica lan i have to ask as you are listening how does it feel to have your story out there in this way.

[Krista]

It feels liberating that's the best way i can describe it is liberating especially to have my voice and lindsay's voice heard simultaneously and being able to hear the differences but also the similarities in our stories it feels very validating honestly in what way i think when you go through something like she and i went through there can sometimes be a little bit of a sense of imposter syndrome or you've been gaslit for so long like maybe this didn't actually happen this way and so to hear her side which is arguably very different than what i experienced it feels very.

[Erica Lance]

Validating i can imagine because i believe you and lindsay hadn't really been in contact so you're hearing a lot suddenly from her about many years that had passed and she's hearing about you but you had never really spoken about it.

[Krista]

With each other before we had not so i mean we knew each other but we didn't run in the same circles at all yeah never really talked to her at length ever in my life and like i had said in the podcast i knew jess very very well but i didn't really know lindsay.

[Erica Lance]

At all jess the other youngest maiden lindsay's friend and your friend yes my.

[Krista]

Parents and jess's parents were very close in fact her parents lived with my mom all the way up until twenty twenty three from twenty twelve the end of twenty twelve till the end of twenty twenty three wow so and i don't have contact with her parents anymore and that's my choice but you can understand that our families they were very intertwined they kind of had a aunt and uncle feel to them more than even my own aunts and uncles so i knew her well and her brother and sister i knew them well too but lindsay i didn't so everything that i had heard from her it was projected in a in a way that spun a narrative right what do you mean by that so when i would listen to interviews like the hunt with john walsh there was a twenty twenty in an instant or something like that that was put out about was all very heavily on the the sexual aspect of it when there was so much more beneath the surface that led to that happening that this wasn't just like a quote unquote sex cult this was so much more and there was so much more abuse that was taking place and it was very systemic the abuse.

[Erica Lance]

Took many forms and people experienced it differently or experienced different parts of the abuse and that's something i've been reflecting a lot on lately is how different people can have different experiences of the same person or the same group and i wonder how you've seen that come up do you think that like what are some of the different versions of experiencing river road that existed for members.

[Krista]

There'S a few that i am aware of for example my mom when she and i talk about this kind of stuff she i have a hard time talking with her about it at length anymore because she always kind of brings it back to herself and she said i just wanted to learn god's word which is a beautiful thing right and i think she has a lot of guilt for what happened to me and whenever i start talking about that she kind of gets really uncomfortable because she just feels the consistent need to apologize and what she sees is we came together to do a ministry and she was like i didn't see the other things that were going on beneath the surface the reality is i think she did i think everybody did but nobody wanted to pay attention yeah when i say everybody i mean those who are old enough to discern obviously i was a child i was just there for the ride but i know that there are people who have said you know in hindsight this is a very unsurprising thing that happened so you know there's that she just wants to remember the good things i don't fault her for it but then again she also has a whole life previous to that to fall back on right she has a frame of reference for what life is outside of the culture whereas i really didn't so there's that i talked to a woman after she listened to several episodes of the podcast she was very close to my parents and to the barnards she actually was the bernards being.

[Erica Lance]

Victor bernard and his wife victor being the leader of river road yes yep.

[Krista]

Yes and she had left in nineteen ninety three so i was still a very young child i was only about a year and a half when she left but she was very dear to my parents and even though they never saw her again they talked about her quite a bit so she reached out to me on social media and she talked about how she was listening to the podcast and obviously a lot of the things that she heard happened after she left and she was asking herself like how did it get there how did that happen how could that have happened and she said but to be completely honest i can see how it could have gotten there so you know there's that and then even lindsay and i have had disagreements nothing like major but there were things that i have said in the podcast that she didn't agree with and brought them to my attention so for example i had said that they were moving these young people around to spy on us and while i do believe that that in a sense is true she didn't see it that way and i'll explain where she came from and where i came from and sort of the middle ground that was probably the reality and you're talking.

[Erica Lance]

About how one time a maiden was very quickly moved into your home and then very quickly moved out again which happens sometimes people moving around all the time you never know where you're going to live even if you own a house it's not really yours and you felt like that maiden maybe had been sent there to kind of spy on.

[Krista]

Your family and it wasn't just the maidens there were quite a few few young people that were moved around very randomly very quickly and it happened to us more than once now lindsay when she heard that she sent me a text and said that she didn't believe that that was the case when the maidens were moved out from their home it was usually because victor believed that they weren't doing well spiritually and kind of as a punishment kind of as a punishment yeah that having been said i bounced this off of a couple of people who i grew up with and grew up around and what i came to was maybe the intention that was told to them wasn't you know go in there and report back whatever you see but these young people were so conditioned to basically tell the leadership or even tell victor anything that they saw that could possibly be you know darkness or sin everything has to be.

[Erica Lance]

In the light in other words victor has to know everything so you feel like you're always being watched yeah so.

[Krista]

Even if victor didn't say so and so you're going to move in with the lester family which was my family to report back to me what you see would happen was and this i know this i know for a fact and it wasn't any of the maidens it was a couple other young women who lived with us who were around the same age as the maidens but they weren't the maidens they lived with us and they would see things that happened in my home and then they would report those to the leadership or to victor and then my parents or even i would you know get in trouble for whatever it was so i felt the need to clarify that there wasn't this network of like spies but it was a conditioning it was a manipulation to be foot soldiers to report back what they saw and they absolutely did do that and it was a.

[Erica Lance]

Culture where it was really hard to have privacy exactly and live the life that you wanted i mean you had to live by certain rules and if you didn't you would hear about it.

[Krista]

What i was gonna say was did lindsay ever do that i have no idea because she never lived with us and that's not something that i feel is worth nitpicking about what i do know is that it happened so you know there are definitely differing stories differing opinions there's still people who believe that they were there to live the word of god like my mom she doesn't deny what happened happened but she has a really hard time wrapping her head around that it could have been all bad you know and i don't think it was all bad but she really doesn't want to address the things that.

[Erica Lance]

Were she wants to hold onto the good things and say some bad things happened exactly in your conversations with her exactly and i think a lot of people can relate to that when they're talking to parents you know more extreme example you're in a cult other examples you have issues from the family dynamic or things that happened when you're a kid and different people kind of focus on different parts of the memory that can make it hard sometimes to talk about the past without feeling invalidated or without feeling like you're kind of talking.

[Krista]

Past each other then my sister she doesn't even want to listen to this podcast which is fine with me she's in a place that i know that a lot of people i grew up with are where she just wants to leave the past in the past and move forward a couple days after the first episode aired i brought up the podcast and was talking about some of the things in there and she said you know i i know a lot of bad things happen to you and i'm really sorry about that but it's i feel like i'm in a really good place in my life right now and i think i just need to leave the past in the past and i hope you can respect that and of course i can of course i can but something that lindsay and i have talked about is how hard it is to have all of these people that you grew up with and who experienced the same life you experienced for the most part and nobody wants to talk about it yeah and so i'm thankful because lindsay and i are now talking and i'm very grateful to have somebody that i can talk to about things that come up for me because sometimes i will have the most random memory of and to have somebody like that i can just text and be like you know i just thought of this and isn't this crazy yeah it's.

[Erica Lance]

Really someone who actually gets it yeah.

[Krista]

It'S a huge blessing definitely very healing to have somebody like that what are.

[Erica Lance]

Some of those memories that have been popping up lately one of the things.

[Krista]

That popped up for me a few weeks ago was going to heaven we used to say that we will be with jesus christ for all eternity that's a wonderful thing but then somebody was like well why would we want to be with somebody that we don't even know and then somebody was like basically spun together that because victor was jesus christ in the flesh that who we were going to be with wasn't going to be some stranger we had never seen before but that it was going to be victor that victor was going to take that personification of jesus christ.

[Erica Lance]

That'S such a stark statement that victor is jesus even when you go to heaven the jesus you meet will be.

[Krista]

Victor yeah so that's not biblical at all and to be quite frank i feel as though i know jesus and when i see his face i will know him and it won't be victor's face and it won't be victor's face thank god but yeah that was a really fun one to kind of remember remember and actually be able to chuckle about and be like we were really that far gone.

[Erica Lance]

Hindsight yeah yeah in the series we tell your story and we talk a lot about your early childhood you were in the group since you were born and essentially your parents knew victor for a long time and we talk about kind of your middle school years that were so terrible for you because jan was insisting on these awful diets and then we kind of fast forward to your early twenties when you're living in washington state with other members of river road fellowship and the news is coming out about lindsay and jess going to the police about the sexual abuse i'm really curious if you could tell us about the years in between because there's probably about a decade in there what was going on or what are some of the memories that are most vivid for you during that time of your life during that time.

[Krista]

In my life between the ages of twelve and seventeen we had moved back home to the house that we owned on a satellite property originally it was known as eagle's nest and then victor changed the name to melita which is the biblical name for the island of malta oh so i lived there from the ages of twelve to seventeen without moving once my life definitely calmed down a lot melita was kind of the location where conforming non conformists lived if that makes any sense people who were a part of the church but maybe they didn't fit the idea or the mold of like the model cult member so we were a bit more laid back melita was actually a really great nickname for our property because it was kind of like an island the island of misfit toys if you will so we lived there it was during that time that i had been sort of inadvertently looped in with a group of young people that i don't think we really talked in this series about specifically known as the shepherd's corps yes and.

[Erica Lance]

The shepherds and we did not get.

[Krista]

Into that yeah which is a whole probably a whole other podcast series if.

[Erica Lance]

We'Re being honest because there were a number of groups especially for young people like the maidens and shepherd's corps was another way that you're kind of showing your commitment you're getting more deeply involved with the church so you kind of it sounds like became part of the.

[Krista]

Shepherd'S corps i did you yes the shepherd's corps was originally i think like six or seven younger people and then in two thousand three victor opened it up to anyone over the age of twelve i was eventually kind of brought in in two thousand five and my.

[Erica Lance]

Impression is that the shepherd's corps was kind of like a very intense church youth group would you say that's one.

[Krista]

Way to look at it yeah it's a really funny thing to talk about because at the inception of the shepherd's corps victor's idea of what it was going to be was going to be very similar to the way corps of the way international which is the group.

[Erica Lance]

Victor was a part of before creating river road fellowship and this was kind of a branch off of the way very influenced by the way a lot of former members of the way joined.

[Krista]

River road yes so that was his kind of blueprint what it became was not that at all there were shepherd's core principles that we had to follow there were verses that we had to memorize it became a name just a name only really you didn't really know i never really knew what it meant to be shepherd's corps he would take us on like camping trips sometimes or there would be classes and i know that i talked about the classes the original shepherd's corps had been given like these sweatshirts that had the shepherd's core written on them but it was kind of like when lindsay had to give back all of the things that she was given when she left the maidens if victor didn't think that these young people were like spiritually well or if he got mad at them he made them turn in their sweats i never had to do that because by the time i came around nothing was being given to the shepherd's corps it was just sort of a name that victor would throw around to make the young people feel good it's interesting how he.

[Erica Lance]

Creates these like status symbols that he gets to choose who has them and so he can give you that status or take it away at any time for any reason and you might not know why yeah and that just it turns into such a mind game and.

[Krista]

So manipulative yeah so within the shepherd's corps there was the maidens which were kind of part of the shepherd's corps but kind of not and then there was another group known as auriga's band which was seven young women who were around the same age as the maidens some of them were younger sisters of the maidens and some of them were maybe young women who had joined the church after the maidens were formed and then there was a men's group that was eight young men and they were known as the gilead gamblers and from my understanding these groups i mean they lived together they did all their stuff together auriga's band they had a commitment similar to the maidens to remain unmarried the gilead gamblers from my understanding it's funny because my brother in law is a former gilead gambler they had a commitment i believe it was for seven years to remain unmarried and then they could get married if they wanted to.

[Erica Lance]

So interesting how the girls and the boys are treated differently where the girls groups you're never getting married right could you talk about a little bit about how men and women or girls and boys were treated differently in the church.

[Krista]

Women were absolutely different expected to be quieter more submissive the way we dressed was more regulated the way we talked was more regulated where we went was.

[Erica Lance]

Regulated was the rule of walking in twos only applied to women and girls yes wow i didn't know that yes.

[Krista]

Men could go wherever they wanted whenever they wanted yeah it was that's so wild it was a very that's so oppressive yeah very oppressive so gross.

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[Krista]

Why is this taking so long this.

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[Krista]

Com.

[Erica Lance]

One thing i've been wondering about is i remember when you were living in washington and you finally had that brave moment where you said i'm leaving i know right beforehand you were dating someone at the time who you had met through a co worker and you finally told him at one point i'm in a cult and i need to get out and i don't know how and it's really interesting to me that you use the word cult and i'm curious when did that transition happen where you actually in your brain i'm guessing that's the first time you said it out loud and i'm wondering when in your brain you started thinking this is a cult that i'm in that's a.

[Krista]

Really great question because it actually is a lot earlier than one might think people always called us a cult you know and victor would talk about people who called us a cult and how you know they were wrong and really yeah and i remember the mother of one of the grown women in our church coming to visit at one point and she was telling her daughter she's like you are in a cult and the daughter was like no i'm not and she said you guys live together you eat together you work together you buy food together she's like for all intents and purposes this is a cult and the daughter the woman in the church she said oh i guess i guess it is well that's great and just kind of like moved on so i kind of always just had it in the back of my head that like yes we were a cult but we were like the good kind of cult and that it was fine it wasn't like jonestown where we were all gonna drink something and die like we would never do that so that was sort of when the seed was planted but when it was like solidified was when i originally watched the story with jess and lindsay and they talked about it as being a cult that was when it solidified for me that yes it was indeed a cult and yes it was not the quote unquote good kind of cult that it was very very dark what do you think made.

[Erica Lance]

It a cult you know beyond the obvious terrible abuses that were happening if someone is joining a new group joining a new religion a new community what should people watch out for or what.

[Krista]

Did you see i mean the list goes on but a big one is isolation if they are telling you that you can't talk to your family or your friends that you have to cut those ties that is cult red flag one hundred and one in my opinion i think that there is definitely the opportunity and the availability for people to come together and work together and live in a communal environment and i think that there is the availability for it to be good but when there is somebody when there is a figurehead in the middle that is everything's trickling down from you cease to have free will because everything revolves around this one person and if you look at cults throughout time that's really the determining factor is that there is this one figurehead that is not god not jesus it's a person who has put themselves in a position of authority and has started making these rules and begun to isolate you into this community i think that that is the main thing that people need to look out for but also it's not lost on me that a lot of people realize that too late they're too far enmeshed it can feel like.

[Erica Lance]

A fine line at first especially because we all want someone who has all the answers or who can guide us we all want a mentor we all want someone to help us figure out what to do in life and once you find someone you trust it very quickly can veer into an unhealthy balance of how much they're influencing you and yeah that can be hard to identify sometimes and i it does seem to me that it can come in different forms i mean sometimes it's religion sometimes it's not religion based but it is a controlling situation yeah i'm curious as you listened back to the series you're hearing yourself you're hearing lindsay's story did anything surprise you or did anything kind of make you see things differently you.

[Krista]

Know i can't say that there was necessarily like an aha moment for me there were definitely things that lindsay said in general that i was like oh thank god she remembers it that way too because sometimes you wonder if you're remembering it correctly like i said at the beginning and you want to make sure that you are speaking the truth because if you're not then the credibility of all of our stories goes out the window in my opinion so i guess that that was a really really big deal for me is like hearing actually hearing her speak and tell her story her way like i said earlier on the podcast how her story was so spun to fit a narrative of that this was a sex cult and that gave their young daughters over to.

[Erica Lance]

This man you're talking about in some of the media coverage the media coverage outside of interviews we've talked about this how you felt like a lot of the media coverage it didn't feel right to you right or how would you.

[Krista]

Feel it didn't feel right it felt very inaccurate and then there were like a lot of third party tellings of whatever these podcasters heard on the media and i was like none of this is accurate like this is such a skewed telling of my life and it made me so mad and i actually reached out to a podcaster that was like a third party narrator of the story who just basically gathered all the information that they had from the media and talked about river road fellowship on their podcast and oh i was furious and i was like they don't have the story none of what they're saying is even like factually accurate and i actually reached out to them on instagram and was like hey i grew up in this cult if you want to know what really happened go ahead and reach out they never did which is fine but that was really what made me want to start talking about my story and really like talk about the nuance of what was going on behind the scenes of this big blow up that happened because there's just it was it went so much deeper and there was so much more going on that led to this this terrible thing that happened with these young girls.

[Erica Lance]

So hearing lindsay now tell her story that felt yeah what did that it felt it.

[Krista]

Kind of felt full circle in a way i guess and realizing that that wasn't her like oh my god they took sound bites bits and pieces to make it sound a certain way and get the story across yeah you're saying.

[Erica Lance]

That the the other coverage when sometimes it felt inaccurate it wasn't lindsay's doing.

[Krista]

I don't know it wasn't lindsay's doing it was people piecemealing things together to make a story and which is fine the end result was victor bernard was put in jail that was what needed to happen but also lindsay deserved to be heard she deserved to share her truth and so listening to her share her story on this podcast i was just so happy for her i'm so happy that she's gotten so much healing and that she is living a wonderful good life with her child and that she seems happy and that she still is willing to speak about this and that her intention is very similar to mine and that this story our experiences can help people can help other survivors can help people trying to figure their way out of these situations our stories can help with that.

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[Erica Lance]

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

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[Matt Rogers and Bowen Yang]

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[Erica Lance]

I know that once you left river road fellowship it was a really dark time for you you talked about what do i do with my life now i'm leaving behind everything and everyone i know and i wonder if you could talk about some of the turning points or the stages you went through to get to your life now.

[Krista]

How much time do we have so i left in march of twenty fifteen right after victor bernard was arrested in brazil he hadn't even been extradited to the united states yet he was still in prison in brazil and there was a lot surrounding that a big turning point for me like maybe the first turning point was when i got in touch with one of the former clergy in river road he had actually left the previous year after he was kind of pushed out because he had called out some of the stuff that was going on in spokane very bluntly very frankly and there was a lot of dishonesty going on about why he left so when i left i got in touch with his son and i said get me in touch with your dad because this is a man that i trusted i knew that something had to have happened that caused him to walk out okay this is and you want.

[Erica Lance]

To know you want to know what.

[Krista]

Happened this is a man that victor called his true son in the faith like if he left something had to have happened that was a really big deal okay so his son got me in touch with him and i ended up going over to their house for dinner and after dinner he and i sat out on the porch and he's like so you said you wanted to talk to me what can i help you with and i said i want to know what happened i want to know why we're sitting here today and not back there still and he basically told me that the church had gotten so far from the standard of the word of god that he just couldn't watch it anymore and he had shown the leaders in spokane in the bible where things were going wrong and they sent him away so that was a big turning point for me to have some like validation that what i experienced was being seen by other people other people were being abused by this abuse of power.

[Erica Lance]

It seems that when you first left was really the hardest hardest.

[Krista]

Period i didn't know how to be a person it was literally like that i did not know how to function in a world where my life wasn't regulated i didn't know what to eat i knew nothing i didn't know how to manage my emotions because everything had just been pushed down so i didn't know how to like manage and regulate my emotions at all it was just like i was a teenager i was.

[Erica Lance]

A child how did that come up.

[Krista]

In your life relationships relationships you know i had been casually seeing this guy and that ended very poorly i had been raised to just let people walk all over me and he sometimes would be like you're acting like you're twelve like grow up i'm like i that's because i was i was emotionally stunted at twelve like i don't know how to be a person and that was actually like actually a real concept to me that was like i i think that all of these things are coming to the surface because they couldn't for.

[Erica Lance]

So long these things being like kind.

[Krista]

Of emotional emotions experiences like like suddenly i'm going through some sort of like psychological puberty of sorts like it's all just coming to this you know rushing in and my whole world is new and it's overwhelmingly new and it's not that great and i didn't know what to do with myself and so i drank a lot to numb whatever i was feeling put myself in a lot of dangerous situations with men which i i know that lindsey talked about as well and it is a miracle that i am alive let's just put it that way yeah i poisoned myself with alcohol on more than one occasion ended up in the psych ward it was just really really really bad moved home to help take care of my dad got away from the pain of like the environment of spokane but the pain was still very much within me i didn't know how to deal i got involved with another really unhealthy young man that ended very badly after he broke up with me in september of twenty sixteen i reached a point of i was so broken i just didn't want to exist i did not want to exist i didn't want to die but i also didn't want to live and i was in the shower and i asked god i said god i don't know if this is even possible but i need you to heal me and immediately the thought popped into my head that i needed to get sober i needed to quit drinking and so i did that day i reached out to a person i barely knew to take me to a recovery meeting and i started building a bit of a community there and that was a big time of growth for me i started going to therapy during that time i started learning how to heal so i got into another relationship and then broke up with him middle of COVID while my dad was dying after that met my husband one thing i wanted in a partner was somebody who wanted to better themselves wanted to grow somebody that i could grow with and build off of and they could build off me and i found that in my husband i lost my dad in october of twenty twenty twenty twenty one had my son these are all like turning points things you know growth times of growth my husband is a recovering addict and thirteen days after my son was born he overdosed and i'm so sorry krista and he was revived and there is no reason logically scientifically that he should be alive today because he was on some very quiet side street in a very quiet neighborhood in his truck when it happened so it wasn't like he was out in public he was just alone and somebody found him and revived him and my therapist had said to me because i couldn't make sense of it i was like i don't understand why this how this happened like i'm happy he's alive but i don't understand why or how and she said krista sometimes miracles just happen and you just have to be okay with that it was really just like blood and it was in those moments following that that i started to actually believe in god again i started realizing that my god was a god of love and a god of healing and forgiveness and patience and goodness and that god never wanted to hurt me that he only wanted to see me thrive and that the people who said that they were acting in god's name were false prophets essentially and that they were liars earlier this year i finally had the courage to walk into a church again which is something i never swore i'd do and god met me there and i don't know what you believe erica but that's what i believe in my heart.

[Erica Lance]

It'S so powerful to hear how you've built a life that focuses on being loving and focuses on the love part and not the punishment and the blame and all of the self criticism you had to live in for so long and to find something that can lead to just this happy life that you have i'm sure there are not happy parts too.

[Krista]

There are definitely not happy parts there's definitely still stuff i struggle with i'm still very traumatized when it comes to eating and diet which is something that i am in therapy for now that is a big i actually should bring that up that that was a big aha moment i did have when i was listening to myself and i realized that my eating patterns were disordered and they've been disordered since i was a teenager so that coming to light was a big deal for me and i was able to get back into therapy with my old therapist so i get to address that now and she's wonderful.

[Erica Lance]

You'Ve realized that you are still carrying some of those disordered behaviors and way.

[Krista]

Of thinking yes absolutely and i will probably always you know to some extent carry some part of it with me it was my entire childhood so it's not like i can erase it but i think even if i still have things that i need to heal from which i know i do i can address it in a healthy way where it doesn't take me out emotionally physically because i have such a beautiful life.

[Erica Lance]

Now what is your life like now.

[Krista]

It'S very simple which is what i wanted i wanted a simple life i live in a three bedroom apartment in a college neighborhood i have two dogs that are very crazy i have a wonderful husband that i've been married to for almost three years our third anniversary is coming up i have a son and a daughter who are the loves of my life and i know that i've talked about my son in this podcast but since then i've had a daughter and she is wild and i say that in the best sense of the word she is wild and she is joyful and she is fierce and she is fearless and i kind of said tongue in cheek a couple weeks ago to somebody i said i think maddie is everything that i would have been had i not had my entire personality beat out of me at a young age and i'm just so happy for her that nobody's ever gonna take that from her that she gets to grow up and shine and be bright and be be loud and people are gonna love her for it and that is so amazing to me i don't need that i have built my life around whatever happened to me and have integrated that into who i am now and it's you know maybe not who i would have been had i not had those experiences but i love myself i love who i've become but to see people just light up when they see my daughter's face because she has so much joy and she's so fearless it's healing it's so healing to watch.

[Erica Lance]

Is there anything that comes to mind that you want to share or you want people to hear before we close.

[Krista]

I looked up a recent mug shot of victor bernard a few weeks ago when the podcast first started airing i hadn't seen his face in years many years but i was curious and so i looked up a recent mug shot of him and he looked weak he looked thin and sickly he was missing a tooth he looked small and i looked at him and i said that's who he is that's who he always was underneath the guise of what he tried to portray to us he's small and weak and ugly and man that felt good oh my god that felt good i want people to know that healing is available it is hard and it's messy but it can happen you don't have to hurt forever it's available to have a happy life.

[Erica Lance]

So true thank you so much for talking with me for all the interviews we did before for this one today it has meant so much to both aelin and me and i know it's meant a lot to people who have listened so it's not easy to talk about this stuff and i think we all just.

[Krista]

Really appreciate it well i appreciate you giving both lindsay and me a platform to tell our stories in the way that we wanted to tell them so thank you.

[Erica Lance]

The turning is a production of rococo punch and i heart podcasts it's written and produced by aen lance lesser and me our story editor is emily forman mixing and sound design by james trout grace doe is our production assistant fact checking by andrea lopez crusado our executive producers are john peratti and jessica alpert at rococo punch and katrina norvell and nikki etor at iheart podcasts you can follow us on instagram rococo punch and you can reach out via email theturning at rococo punch dot com i'm erica lance thanks for listening.

[Krista]

In.

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[Krista]

This episode is.

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[Krista]

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[Krista]

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