S3:EP 4 - Predator and Prey

Summary

The Turning - Seasons 1, 2 & 3
Episode: S3:EP4 - Predator and Prey
Release Date: July 15, 2025
Hosts: Erica Lance and Aelin Lance Lesser

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Introduction

In Season 3, Episode 4 of "The Turning", titled "Predator and Prey," hosts Erica Lance and Aelin Lance Lesser delve deeper into the harrowing experiences of Lindsay Tornambe and Krista Lester within the River Road Fellowship cult. This episode unpacks the intricate dynamics of control, abuse, and the desperate yearning for freedom that defined Lindsay's and Krista's lives.

The Life of Maidens in River Road Fellowship

Role and Responsibilities

At its core, River Road Fellowship imposed strict roles on its members, particularly the young girls designated as Maidens. Lindsay was chosen at 13 to become one of the youngest Maidens, a role that came with significant responsibilities and manipulation.

[03:21] Lindsay: "It always seemed like the musicians were kind of put on a pedestal too, you know, like it was just something."

Music was not merely an activity but a strategic tool used by Victor, the cult leader, to exert control and instill a sense of purpose. The Maidens were central to the cult's operations, tasked with creating and performing music that Victor deemed essential for their spiritual warfare against evil spirits.

Music as a Tool for Control

Through music, Victor maintained a facade of piety and community. However, it also served as a battleground for Lindsay's internal struggles, where she grappled with fear, hope, and the desire for escape.

[03:46] Lindsay: "With the music. A lot of times, he said, it was a battlefield, and playing music for God is a battle against spirits."

Relationships and Personal Bonds

Lindsay and Jess' Friendship

Amid the oppressive environment, Lindsay found solace in her friendship with Jess. Their bond was a beacon of normalcy and mutual support, providing a rare sense of safety and understanding.

[05:23] Lindsay: "She and I were bonded from the beginning."

Their shared passion for music became their sanctuary, allowing them moments of reprieve from the constant scrutiny and fear imposed by Victor and the cult leadership.

Krista's Outsider Experience

Contrastingly, Krista Lester, a peer of Lindsay, never received the same recognition or favoritism. Her exclusion from the Maidens' inner circle fostered feelings of isolation and inadequacy.

[10:04] Host 1: "Krista Lester pitch, the girl whose books were burned to please Victor, was around the same age as Lindsay. She wasn't chosen to be a maiden. She was on the outside looking in."

Control and Abuse by Victor and Leadership

Enforced Rules and Appearance Standards

Victor's regime was marked by an array of stringent rules designed to suppress individuality and enforce conformity. Maidens were required to adhere to strict dress codes and grooming standards, with any deviation viewed as a moral failing.

[11:21] Aelin Lance Lesser: "So what I'm picturing is kind of like little house on the prairie FLDS type garb."

Extreme Diets and Physical Abuse

Victor's disdain for overweight women manifested through extreme dietary restrictions and physical punishments. Lindsay recounts the damaging effects of these practices on her physical and mental health.

[22:20] Host 1: "I was put on a diet that was known as the rotation diet, which is a calorie deficit program. I was 12 years old and I was being fed as little as 600 calories a day."

Surveillance and Manipulation

The cult employed constant surveillance, moving members frequently to prevent the formation of supportive external relationships. Lindsay describes the intrusive oversight and the psychological toll it took.

[12:57] Aelin Lance Lesser: "I have a suspicion it was to spy on us and report back to leadership."

Personal Struggles and Mental Health

Lindsay’s Internal Battle

Lindsay's role as a Maiden was a constant source of internal conflict. The music that was meant to be a source of solace became a medium through which her internal battles were fought.

[03:54] Erica Lance: "But over the coming years, for Lindsay, music wasn't just a battle against spirits, but a battle within herself."

Krista’s Feelings of Inferiority

Krista's exclusion from the Maidens fostered a pervasive sense of inadequacy. The enforced hierarchy left her feeling unworthy and perpetually striving to meet unattainable standards.

[24:06] Host 1: "My whole being felt like there was something about me that just wasn't good enough because that literally was how I was treated."

Attempted Escape

Planning to Escape via Pregnancy

Desperate to escape the cult's clutches, Lindsay and Jess contemplated using pregnancy as a means to secure help from the outside. Lindsay recounts this pivotal moment of bravery and desperation.

[32:44] Lindsay: "I thought that if I were pregnant, then I'd have to go to the hospital and then someone there could help me. This was my chance to get out."

Despite meticulous planning, their attempts were thwarted by Victor's ever-watchful eye, resulting in deeper control and manipulation.

[34:51] Lindsay: "She had to do what he said. Her plan wasn't going to work."

Forced Recommitment and Further Control

Lindsay’s Brief Freedom

Lindsay briefly experienced freedom when she was sent home, but the return was anything but liberating. Home no longer felt like a safe space, overshadowed by the stigma of being rejected by the Maidens.

[43:53] Lindsay: "I didn't get to say goodbye to the maidens at all."

Recommitment to Being a Maiden

Victor's insidious manipulation forced Lindsay back into the role of a Maiden, this time with an elevated status implying greater responsibility and control over others.

[52:10] Lindsay: "He told me, no matter what time of year it is, when you look up, Lyra will always be overhead in the sky."

Through this forced recommitment, Victor reinforced his dominance, ensuring that Lindsay remained ensnared within the cult's oppressive framework.

Conclusion and Reflection

Lindsay’s Transformation into Lyra

Victor bestowed upon Lindsay the name Lyra, symbolizing her elevated role within the cult and cementing her position as a leader among the Maidens. This renaming was not just a title but a tool of further control, binding her identity to the cult's ideology.

[52:25] Aelin Lance Lesser: "He told her, no matter what time of year it is, when you look up, Lyra will always be overhead in the sky."

Realization of Being Prey to Victor

Ultimately, Lindsay's journey in "Predator and Prey" illustrates the intricate mechanisms of control and the psychological traps that kept her and others imprisoned. Her transformation underscores the profound impact of cult dynamics on personal identity and the relentless struggle for autonomy.

[52:48] Lindsay: "I think about that night, I remember in that moment feeling really special. But also when I think of it now, it was almost like he prophesied his own demise for all those years. You know, Victor was the predator and I was the prey. And then he became the prey."

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Notable Quotes

• Lindsay on Music as a Battlefield:
  [03:46] Lindsay: "With the music. A lot of times, he said, it was a battlefield, and playing music for God is a battle against spirits."

• Krista on Feeling of Unworthiness:
  [24:06] Host 1: "My whole being felt like there was something about me that just wasn't good enough because that literally was how I was treated."

• Lindsay on Forced Recommitment:
  [52:10] Lindsay: "He told me, no matter what time of year it is, when you look up, Lyra will always be overhead in the sky."

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Final Thoughts

Episode "Predator and Prey" offers a poignant exploration of the psychological and emotional turmoil endured by members of the River Road Fellowship. Through Lindsay's and Krista's narratives, listeners gain a profound understanding of the complexities of cult dynamics, the struggle for personal identity, and the desperate quest for freedom against insurmountable odds.

For those yet to listen, this episode serves as a compelling testament to resilience and the human spirit's capacity to seek liberation in the darkest of circumstances.

Transcript

[Host 1]

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[Aelin Lance Lesser]

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[Erica Lance]

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[Aelin Lance Lesser]

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[Lindsay]

There's a time and a plate for.

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A filet of fish, but breakfast is for sausage biscuits.

[Host 1]

McDonald's breakfast comes first.

[Erica Lance]

Possibility means you have a chance.

[Host 1]

Passion opens the door to all possibilities.

[Advertiser 1]

When I feel like anything's possible, I feel kind of giddy. To be an astronaut, an artist, an.

[Host 1]

Actress to visit another country. All I need is a backpack and.

[Advertiser 1]

A pair of shoes and I'll find.

[Lindsay]

A way I'm able to do anything I set my mind to.

[Advertiser 1]

I've never felt like more things are.

[Host 1]

Possible than right now.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

In the right shoes, anything's possible.

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Dsw, countless shoes at brag worthy prices.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Imagine the possibilities.

[Host 1]

Is the true way.

[Advertiser 1]

Jesus.

[Erica Lance]

Life in River Road Fellowship was full of music, and that's part of what Lindsay loved about it. Now they didn't have radios, and after the bonfire where they burned their belongings, there weren't any records or CDs or cassettes from life before. So they made their own recordings, wrote their own songs and listened to their own music.

[Lindsay]

It always seemed like the musicians were kind of put on a pedestal too, you know, like it was just something. They worked closely with Victor. They got to sing in front of the church and help out at different functions.

[Host 1]

One God, one Lord, one day.

[Lindsay]

With the music. A lot of times, he said, it was a battlefield, and playing music for God is a battle against spirits.

[Erica Lance]

Victor saw it as an actual war against evil, and that they had to do everything they could to stop that evil. Their souls and the fate of the world were at stake. But over the coming years, for Lindsay, music wasn't just a battle against spirits, but a battle within herself. Music was the realm where she worked out the competing forces inside her, the voices that screamed at her to get out or to stay. And Victor's voice was always in her head.

[Lindsay]

Victor said that, you know, Lindsay is the old flesh, and you need to become a new man in Christ. Lindsay has to die.

[Erica Lance]

From Rococo Punch and I heart podcasts. This is the Turning River Road. I'm Erica Lance.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

And I'm aelin Lance Lesser.

[Erica Lance]

Part 4 Predator and prey on the outside, music was part of Lindsay's role as a maiden. Victor dubbed the Maidens the main music makers of River Road Fellowship, replacing the adults who led it before. And Lindsay and her friend Jess. The two youngest maidens became the guitar players of the group.

[Lindsay]

She and I were bonded from the beginning.

[Erica Lance]

Music brought them even closer. Their favorite thing to do was to put fresh strings on their guitars together.

[Lindsay]

Oh, the new guitar sound, like the new string sound. We both loved it so much.

[Erica Lance]

They'd go to a secluded spot, the deck that jutted off the chapel. Giant trees grew up through holes cut in the middle of the deck.

[Lindsay]

So the wind would be blowing, the trees would be swaying, and you could almost feel the leaves moving. We wouldn't pick a song. We would just start playing chords. And it was like we were so in sync with one another. Maybe we would start humming, making up a melody I'd like, try to pick apart different notes while she would strum. And it felt like the rest of the camp wasn't there. The worries and the fear, it kind of just melted away. All the bad things and all the good things, none of it mattered. The weight I had to carry. Every single day, I was able to take off, set it aside, and just be myself with Jess. And I could sit back and relax and breathe. This moment of just feeling safe and loved by her, like just a true sister and friend, not feeling judged or afraid.

[Erica Lance]

Actual love.

[Lindsay]

Mm. Felt like we were the only two People in the world in that moment.

[Erica Lance]

Sometimes having another maiden nearby, especially Jess, Was the thing that brought Lindsay the most happiness and comfort. But there was also a layer of regimented control in how she interacted with the other maidens. Lindsay could never be alone. They weren't allowed to be alone. The rule was that anywhere the maidens went, they went in twos.

[Lindsay]

Two people were always assigned to Victor.

[Erica Lance]

Victor lived in what they called the lodge, A big log building at the center of the camp. He often met with his followers there, too.

[Lindsay]

And working for Victor was considered a privilege. Like, oh, wow, you get to work at the lodge. And what that meant was you. You would clean the lodge. He smoked all the time. Cigarettes. So run the air purifier and clean up the ashtrays and make the coffee. Get the shower ready for him. Turn it on so it's nice and warm. Maybe hand him his towel while the other one was making breakfast. Lay out his clothes. Remember having to put lotion on his legs after he'd get out of the shower. Just like, weird stuff that made me feel so uncomfortable. Like.

[Erica Lance]

There was one part of this job she dreaded the most.

[Lindsay]

You'd go wake him up in the morning. You'd physically wake him up in the morning. And one thing about Victor was he was a hard sleeper. I mean, so difficult to wake up. And it scared me because if you kept letting him sleep, you know, you'd go in there and you're like, victor, like, it's time to wake up. Good morning. He wouldn't wake up. You'd go back in. There were so many times where I couldn't get him to wake up. It took me 30 minutes to wake him up. I mean, that sounds crazy, but it legit took me that sometimes he'd wake up late, and then I'd get in trouble for not being more aggressive in my head, too. He wasn't just a man. He was a man of God. He was pretty much Christ in the flesh. So even little things like picking out his clothes was very stressful.

[Host 1]

The maidens were definitely idolized.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Even though Krista Lester pitch, the girl whose books were burned to please Victor, Was around the same age as Lindsay. She wasn't chosen to be a maiden. She was on the outside looking in.

[Host 1]

After they were moved to the shepherd's camp, into that fourplex and given the title of the maidens and started serving Victor, they started to, over time, kind of become the gold standard of how a young lady should behave and act and what she should aspire to.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

These Young girls were a tool. They often had an effect on how expectations were rolled out.

[Host 1]

There were a lot of rules. Women were required to wear their hair back and ponytails or buns or something. And eventually, we also weren't allowed to have bangs because bangs, victor believed, came from Egypt, and egypt was evil. And Cleopatra and, you know, they're all whores and this and that. So long hair. And then it was shortly after that, you know, the maidens had all moved to the camp. The women weren't allowed to wear jeans anymore. We had to start making our own clothes. Dresses. Very much prairie like dresses.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

So what I'm picturing is kind of like little house on the prairie FLDS type garb.

[Host 1]

Yeah. And the dresses or the making of clothes. A big part of it was Victor wanted himself, and he wanted the maidens to wear homemade clothes specifically, because a lot of clothes are made by, you know, children in sweatshops in other countries. And they might have devil spirits attached to them. That was another big thing. Devil spirits, evil spirit spirits. And then the rest of the churches kind of followed. It's like, you don't want to be the weird one out who's still wearing jeans. And the styles changed over time. Like the way that the maidens dress, Those became kind of like the basis of fashion. Essentially. You'd see one of the maidens wearing something and being like, oh, I want that pattern. I wanted to wear that dress. And so you'd go and you'd check out the pattern. And because we had, like, a whole pattern library, and we would go and get fabric from this fabric room, and you'd make it to fit you. Yeah.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

The maidens often felt distant, untouchable. But then there were times leadership would bring the maidens front and center.

[Host 1]

One of them came to our house and basically told me that this particular maiden was moving in with us. They probably asked, but it was never really a question. It was always like a question with the expectation that you were going to agree.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

So a maiden showed up at krista's door.

[Host 1]

None of the maidens had very much stuff. So it was, you know, just a few boxes of personal belongings, Clothes, toiletries, you know, a few personal sentimental items, and she moved in. The way that the church worked, they got people unpacked very quickly. Everybody came over and just would unpack A person or a family. Within a day, our house would be set up, decorated and ready to go. I remember leaving to go somewhere for a little bit. It was about six hours. Came back, and they were moving her out. And it's gonna sound really paranoid, but I have a really good reason for saying it. I have a suspicion it was to spy on us and report back to leadership. Because that was absolutely a thing that happened. And not just with my family, with all a lot of different families where they would move these young single people around with the intention of having eyes in these people's houses. And I know that because they told me many, many years later.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Jess, the youngest maiden with red hair, would later write in her diary that she moved 22 times in River Road. This kind of thing was normal and not just for the maidens. It happened to Krista and her family too.

[Host 1]

Victor would come to our house and be like, you're moving to this location regardless of whether or not we own the house. And we would be packed and moved within 24 hours and life would uproot and change. It was very disruptive. There were families who moved regularly, like once every couple of months, especially leadership. Leadership would switch and move around a lot. When I say he was building an army, I'd say he was forming a group of individuals who would literally do whatever he wanted them to do. And that's honestly terrifying.

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[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Of who leadership valued, and she could tell she wasn't in that group. It's not that she wanted to be a maiden, but she noticed she was never picked to work with them, something that was considered an honor.

[Host 1]

One time my sister got to go help the maidens with something and I remember sitting my sister down and being like, don't do anything that's going to cause them to like not want you to come back. Because I was like, I don't know what I did, but I Did something and they don't want me there.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Christa really felt like an outsider when her family was moved to yet another River Road property. It would be the worst year of her life. This new location was overseen by Jan and her husband. Neither of them responded to her requests for comment. Even though she'd known the couple her whole life, Christa found the husband intimidating. He was quiet and tall and let Jan take the reins.

[Host 1]

She was a very strong willed woman. She was very much a leader. She was Victor's right hand. She was whispering in his ear. She was counseling him. She was the person that he bounced things off of. She was an extension of Victor. What she said was as good as if it came from the mouth of Victor.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Christa says Jan and her husband were almost militaristic in how they ran the satellite property. When Krista's family was moved there, her dad got a lot of assignments at Riverroad's butcher shop and cabinet shop, so he was almost never home. Victor told Krista's mom that she should do whatever Jan told her to do. And one thing Jan decided was that Krista could be better. Christa started having daily room checks to make sure she was organized. Victor said an organized sock drawer meant you were doing well with God. That did not come naturally to Krista. And when she didn't meet Jan's standards, she was punished or publicly shamed.

[Host 1]

I was never like a super skinny fit girl like everybody else in my age group. I was a little heavier than the other girls, maybe 10, 15 pounds. And so I was heavily bullied, not by other kids, but by adults about my weight. I was put on extremely restrictive diets as early as the age of 11 years old. Victor detested overweight women. He thought they were disgusting. And that was one of the reasons that such a emphasis was put on weight control. And any of the women in the church who were a little heavier were consistently being told to work on their weight. They took my morning animal care away from me so that I could get up and exercise every day. So while everybody else was, all of my friends were out taking care of the animals, I was walking back and forth on the road getting exercise.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Krista was homeschooled with a group of kids by a mom a couple of houses down. And Jan made a rule that she couldn't eat while she was there, even when the other girls did.

[Host 1]

I was put on a diet that was known as the rotation diet, which is a calorie deficit program. I was 12 years old and I was being fed as little as 600 calories a day. I was hungry. I started to think it was normal to go to bed hungry. This is what it should feel like when you go to bed.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

How do you feel about her at the time when you were being put on those extreme diets?

[Host 1]

That is a really good question, because there is the way I actually felt, and there was the way I was supposed to feel and tricked myself into believing I felt how I actually felt was abused. I felt it was wrong. I felt that she had set the standard so high that I was set up for failure. And I was terrified. I was so scared of her and of the people who reported to her because I was constantly doing something wrong.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

That must have been so hard to feel constantly sort of left out of the loop or rejected. And you don't know quite why. It sounds to me like by categorizing people, raising certain people up to a higher position or creating a hierarchy, it both makes people feel special or makes people feel rejected. And then both types of those reactions could pull people in further. Because it's like if you feel accepted, you feel great about it, and if you feel rejected, then you feel like, oh, I need to prove myself.

[Host 1]

Yeah, exactly. I need to do better. I need to try harder. I need to strengthen my walk with God. I need to study the Bible more. I need to be more active in fellowships. I need to, you know, all of these things go through your head, and then you do them, and nothing changes. My whole being felt like there was something about me that just wasn't good enough because that literally was how I was treated. The mental gymnastics that I went through trying to figure out why they didn't like me, especially when it was people that I looked up to. It was something that became a part of me is believing there was just something wrong with me and that I was not likable or lovable by the people who mattered. That feeling of inferiority, I don't think it will ever completely go away.

[Erica Lance]

While Krista struggled as a kid, looking up the social ladder of River Road, on a different property at the camp, Lindsay faced the pressures of being a maiden like Christa. She got criticized about her body, in this case, directly from Victoria.

[Lindsay]

He thought I was getting too overweight. I think as I was developing into a young lady, I was getting more curves and just naturally how my body is. But he said that I was gaining too much weight, and he wouldn't have sex with me at all until I lost the weight, which to an outsider, you might think, oh, my gosh, he should have been so happy. But for me, it felt like I was so ugly and being so rejected. He had told me, you know, all those times that him having sex with me was God's love for me.

[Erica Lance]

Lindsay's body was controlled in many ways. Like around that time when she was 15, she also started having some health problems. Really bad headaches and trouble going to the bathroom.

[Lindsay]

Then they started having me do something called the colon cleanse.

[Erica Lance]

In their colon cleanse, Lindsay couldn't eat regular food for seven days. Only certain fluids and a combination of pills.

[Lindsay]

I was so hungry and so weak because we still had to keep our schedules. We had to be up, we had to be working. I think I did the cleanse, like, a total of maybe 14 times. And when I think back on, even, like, the physical aspect of what they had us do to our bodies, it's crazy. Victor had me try smoking at one point cigarettes to try to help me go to the bathroom. They one time chopped up garlic and put it on my stomach with Saran Wrap and then put a heating pad on top, which made my stomach burn so bad. I had these huge blisters all over my tummy. It was so, so painful. It wasn't just like mind control. It was like so many things combined into this control and breaking you down and hurting me. Even physically.

[Erica Lance]

Lindsay was always under Victor's microscope. One time, she and Jess were set to play at a church service for all 150 members of River Road. So the night before, Lindsay and Jess got together to do their favorite thing, change their guitar strings. Victor was not happy about this.

[Lindsay]

Victor told us that we did it to seek attention because it was, like.

[Erica Lance]

In a public setting or something.

[Lindsay]

Because we wanted everyone to hear that we had new strings on our guitars and we. We should have waited. And we did it because we wanted to draw attention to ourselves.

[Erica Lance]

So he got in trouble for that.

[Lindsay]

Yeah. It's like crazy going back through even all these little things that happened. Telling it now like it's a, what, a one, two sentence story, but just how much damage even that can do.

[Erica Lance]

It's like, it's not just that he was chastising you for a small mistake. It's that he was saying this mistake shows that you have bad character and you're not a good believer and there's something fundamentally wrong with you.

[Lindsay]

Yeah, it made me. I feel like, question everything then and made you so scared to do anything.

[Erica Lance]

Whenever she could, Lindsay disappeared to a quiet spot with her guitar. She tried to remember the songs she loved from her past for before any of this. Like in the Little Mermaid, when Ariel sings part of your world.

[Lindsay]

One of my favorite movies from growing up was the wizard of Oz. And me and my pop would sing over the Rainbow. And I think a lot of those songs helped me through that time because I was feeling so alone. And it sounds maybe so silly to draw on Disney movies, you know, but all these people, all these girls you saw were trapped, and they had these songs of hope and longing and wishing. So there were times when I would try to figure some out on my guitar, and I couldn't do it in public with the rest of the maidens, but when, like, in my own quiet time, I'd try to figure some out and play some. And there were so many times I remember laying on the couch, the upstairs unit in the fourplex, the one to the right, the couch in that unit, and just, like, dreaming. Gosh, what would it be if I somehow got a hold of my grandparents and I was able to move in with them and they'd help me and I'd be able to go to college and just dreaming of stuff like that and just leave everything and have a whole new life and get out of there. Yeah, I just was dreaming that maybe one day it would happen. Some of those songs help me stay strong and get through some of those times. If happy little bluebirds fly over the rainbow why, oh, why can't I?

[Erica Lance]

There was one person Lindsay could be honest with, who she could tell all her daydreams of leaving. Jessica.

[Lindsay]

I would say she was my best friend. And, I mean, we fought just probably like sisters do, but overall, we were just thick as thieves and had talked about trying to run away together.

[Erica Lance]

Music was Jess and Lindsay's escape. But When Jess was 13 and Lindsay was 14, they thought about escaping for real, getting out. They thought maybe they could commandeer the camp van.

[Lindsay]

We talked about trying to drive it to Petrie's Bait and Tackle Shop, the gas station in Finlayson. I remember us talking about even running through the woods at one point and just keep going. And for some reason, our destination was always Petrie's.

[Erica Lance]

Their secret conversations gave shape to their wildest dreams. They talked it out. How would they get to Petrie's? When would they go? Once they got there, what would they do? Would they try to call someone? Would they ask for help? They considered all the potential pitfalls of their plan. They considered it in a real way, thinking out how they could navigate the logistics of being two kids running away from this isolated compound. But they Always came to the same conclusion. They'd never driven on main roads before. They were too young for a license.

[Lindsay]

And then who would believe us? You know, who would we even call? We didn't have any phone numbers of anyone. Jess brought up one time, well, we don't even have any identification on us. And I remember saying, yeah, they'll probably just end up calling our parents. And we'd kind of just look at each other and shrug our shoulders and be like, okay, well, I guess this is it for now. Kind of felt like you were stuck with no other options.

[Erica Lance]

So she kept to her regular life. She went to their fellowships, listened to teachings from Victor. And then sometimes she'd spend time alone with Victor at night. And that gave Lindsay an idea. Maybe their sneak out could be more subtle. She knew that Victor had the maidens use a type of birth control, a spermicide, when they were with him. So one night she thought, what if I use it wrong? If all went to plan, she could get pregnant and use that to save herself. If she were pregnant, then she'd have to go to the hospital and then someone there could help her. This was her chance to get out. She was only 14. But at that point. To Lindsay, even being pregnant at 14 seemed better than staying where she was. So that night at Victor's lodge, she faked her application. Did it just halfway. But almost immediately, Victor noticed and corrected her. She had to do what he said. Her plan wasn't going to work. Eventually, Victor got a vasectomy so it wouldn't be an issue anymore. Lindsay would never become pregnant from Victoria. Another escape plan. Lost.

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[Erica Lance]

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[Lindsay]

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[Erica Lance]

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[Host 1]

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[Erica Lance]

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[Lindsay]

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[Erica Lance]

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[Lindsay]

Get started risk [e-mail] iheartra Victor wanted.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

To know everything about the maidens. All of their sins. Even from years ago, he was constantly wanting them to confess things, especially when he got angry. One day, Victor ordered the maidens to stay in Alamoth together and confess. They couldn't leave. Victor wasn't even there. But they did as they were told. For three days, the maidens sat alone, confessing to each other.

[Lindsay]

Literally. That's all we did. We would eat, and then all 10 of us would go around the room confessing prior sins. I felt like I had almost nothing to share. I did not know what big sin I had in my life that was so big that we had to stay in Alamoth for three, three days. And so I had this necklace, this gold necklace that I'd had, I think, since I was a child, and I think a family member had given it to me. I made up this whole story that I bought it in 1996. So this was pre made in at a fortune teller's tent.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

So Lindsay told the other maiden that she went to a carnival with a friend, she had her fortune read and got a necklace, and she never got rid of it. She told them.

[Lindsay]

I didn't realize the effect it had on me because of the spirits that the necklace carried. That was the big sin that I made up and confessed just to say something, because I literally had no idea what to say. Here I am lying, which is a sin. Sinning, confessing sin. That wasn't really a sin.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Another time, Victor accused Lindsay of not, quote, claiming God's promises. Victor often used obscure phrasing from the Bible, the exact meaning unclear. Sometimes he gave her tasks in symbolic language that felt impossible to obey, like he was messing with her mind. Maybe a good example is a story that started one day when Victor was upset with her and another maiden named Lisa. He sent the two of them out on a cryptic quest. He said Lindsay had to find the white stone and Lisa should find the bright morning star. Victor said not to come back until they completed the mission. The white stone and the bright morning star are mentioned in the Book of Revelation, the enigmatic part of the Bible about the Apocalypse. But these two kids had no idea what they were actually supposed to do. They got to work doing chores at Lisa's family's house, confused about their mission. So they sat at the kitchen table discussing how to find the white stone and the bright morning star. Lisa thought maybe baking some muffins for Victor would help. So they brought him a basket of freshly baked muffins during breakfast at the dining hall where everyone was gathered. But this was not the right move.

[Lindsay]

I remember him getting so angry, so angry that we had come with muffins. And I remember him saying stuff like, can't you see him eating breakfast? Like, why would I need these muffins?

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

They hadn't found the white stone and the bright morning star. Victor sent them back out to keep looking, this time with a deadline. They must meet him back at the lodge by noon. What would happen if they arrived empty handed? What would happen if they didn't show up at all? After a long discussion about what to do, they arrived late, which made Victor even angrier. He told them he'd been sitting under the apple trees with two empty chairs for them. They stood him up. They disobeyed God's word. Victor told Lindsay to pack up her belongings at the camp. He was sending her home immediately. She felt scared and sad at the same time. She had daydreamed escape plans. But at this point, these people were her home and she was being cast out. Lindsay saw her future melt in front of her. They loaded her stuff into a truck. As one of the elders of the church started driving out of the camp onto the dirt road, Lindsay saw Victor. She told the driver to stop and jumped out of the car. Her body trembled. Her heart began to beat faster. She started to confess.

[Lindsay]

I don't even know what words were coming out of my mouth at the time. Most of my reproof over the years had to do with me pleasing people and having to get out of that mindset. And so I'm sure there was something in there of me talking about how my eyes had been maybe on some of the other young men. Or I had been thinking about maybe wanting to get married someday. Which aren't bad things to be thinking about. That's what a normal teenager is probably thinking about. If they want to get married, if they want to have kids, what they might want to do in college, or a crush they have on a cute guy.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

But Lindsay was learning to think and behave in a different way.

[Lindsay]

There was nothing left of myself to me. It was just this empty, shallow of this empty person in there walking around, being filled with what Victor wanted me to think. Not any of my own thoughts or things that I had passions about.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Lindsay can't remember the words she used to confess, but something about them clicked for Victor. He'd later tell her that was the moment she'd found the white stone. She could keep living at the camp, at least for now. But within a couple months, Victor was unhappy again. She wasn't clear why.

[Lindsay]

Victor said I wasn't doing well spiritually.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

So Victor sent her home to her parents. She wouldn't have the honor of living with the maidens.

[Erica Lance]

Lindsay hadn't lived at home in almost two years. But being there wasn't a relief. Home didn't feel like it used to. It felt awkward and weird. When she got home, her mom cried. It was considered a disgrace to have her daughter tossed out of the maidens. And Lindsay missed them. They had started to feel like home. Then late one summer night, Lindsay lay asleep in her bed when she heard music outside her window. Suddenly she heard Victor's voice ringing through her bedroom. She slipped out of bed and ran outside. Victor was there with one of the other maidens. Lindsay hugged him. The song they were singing was based on an old hymn text written in the 1800s. It was the poem that had been read right before the maiden ceremony when they all made a vow to Victor. I found a friend, oh, such a friend he loved me ere I knew him he drew me with the cords of love and thus he bound me to him.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

I found a friend.

[Advertiser 1]

Such.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

A.

[Lindsay]

He loved me ere I knew.

[Host 1]

Him he drew me with the cords of love.

[Advertiser 1]

And thus he bound me to him.

[Erica Lance]

This is a recording of River Road members singing it. Lindsay had set the poem to music herself. Now Victor, in a maiden, sang it for her as a reminder.

[Advertiser 1]

For I am his and he is mine forever.

[Host 1]

And.

[Erica Lance]

They spoke a few words with Lindsay. And then they left. Lindsay had not been invited back. Her head swirled. It all felt so complicated. Like music. Her own music was now a weapon being wielded against her.

[Lindsay]

I can still remember watching them drive down the road. I remember in that moment feeling so alone, so helpless, so unworthy. Almost so dirty. Like I didn't. Like I was being rejected. Almost like wanting to die. Like so worthless. It was almost like there was nowhere to go. I had no one that wanted me.

[Erica Lance]

That same night, Victor came back. The same kind of whiplash Lindsay faced all the time. Hot and cold. Showing up, going away, then showing up again. He picked her up, took her to the lodge. He yelled at her all night until she confessed something again. When the sun came up, he finally accepted Lindsay back into his good graces. Then Victor said she had a choice. He offered her two paths. She could recommit to being a maiden, or she could leave the maidens and eventually marry another man.

[Lindsay]

Which, honestly is crazy. Like you're asking a 15 year old to make these kind of commitments. You know, I mean, I look back now and it's just crazy when I think about this stuff. Like these major life decisions that he was having me figure out and decide.

[Erica Lance]

Lindsay had just been through so many iterations of Victor's anger. Been rejected so many times. So many of those times. She's starved for his attention, to be in his favor. In God's favorite. Still, after all this manipulation, Lindsay knew what she really wanted. She wanted to leave. And this was the first time she would have the guts to say it. And not just to anyone. To their leader and prophet.

[Lindsay]

I told him that because of all the trouble I had caused in the maidens. And tears that they had on my behalf. I wanted to not be a maiden any longer. And to get married someday. Thinking back, I honestly don't know how I got the guts to say what I did. Because I was so scared to go against anything that he was saying. And he was really quiet and eventually said, okay. And I remember feeling really good and at peace and really light. That I was finally not going to be a maiden anymore. And living like that and ready to move, move on.

[Erica Lance]

Victor told Lindsay to hand in everything she'd been given while she was a maiden.

[Lindsay]

Which was very hard. I don't think I expected that. Had me hand everything in. I didn't get to say goodbye to the maidens at all.

[Erica Lance]

After that. When she was around the maidens, they didn't talk to her or even look at her. Almost like someone told them not to. But she didn't care. She was ready for this change. No more constant scrutiny. No more living at the Shepherd's camp.

[Lindsay]

None of it had to do with the maidens anymore. It didn't have to do with Victor. It didn't have to do with remaining unmarried or even getting married. I wasn't thinking at all about marriage. It was all like me on my own journey now with God. And I think I was just feeling so free.

[Erica Lance]

She felt like she could connect with God on her own terms now. And then three days later, there was the phone call.

[Lindsay]

Somebody got a call from the Shepherd's camp staff. Inviting just the leadership to come to a campfire at the camp and to bring me along.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Lindsay arrived back at the Shepherd's camp and joined the group around the fire pit on chairs and blankets. The fire was in the middle of the camp by the pond. Not far from Victor's lodge. Many of the camp elders and the maidens were there. It was on a warm summer night, and Lindsay could see the water. Stars glistened off the pond.

[Lindsay]

Victor did a teaching. Lord, what would you have me to do?

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

His point was, they should submit themselves to God's will. They shouldn't focus on their wishes or.

[Lindsay]

Desires, but God's ultimately, if we really look at it, it was Victor. What would you have me to do?

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Then Victor turned to the maidens and asked each of them to recommit. The maidens were clustered together on a hillside. He went one by one and one by one, they recommitted.

[Lindsay]

And I remember feeling in that moment like I have nowhere to go. Like, I basically am being trapped again into being a maiden. Like, what am I going to say? Nobody's supporting me. Nobody's helping me. I was literally so happy for the last few days, so free, so light. And here I am with all the leadership, with Victor, with my parents, with the maidens. And so I said, yes.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

Lindsay had returned. She would become a maiden again, and Victor would honor her for it.

[Lindsay]

Victor said that God had told him to give me a new name. He said that the name was going to be Lyra, which Lyra is a constellation in the heavens, which is an eagle with a harp.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

He told her, no matter what time of year it is, when you look up, Lyra will always be overhead in the sky. In giving her this new name, Victor was not only labeling Lindsay a musician, but a leader among the musicians, a place of high honor. Even among the maidens, it held responsibility and power.

[Lindsay]

He talked about how in war, the musicians are always the one who went first in battle. And in our spiritual warfare, it's always the musicians who, like, go first and sound the battle cry. And he said that that's what Lyra is about. He basically said that I was going to be this, the forefront of the maidens and making sure no evil was around, casting down strongholds. I think about that night, I remember in that moment feeling really special. But also when I think of it now, it was almost like he prophesied his own demise for all those years. You know, Victor was the predator and I was the prey. And then he became the prey.

[Aelin Lance Lesser]

The Turning is a pretty production of Rococo Punch and I Heart podcasts. It's written and produced by Erica, Lance and me. Our story editor is Emily Forman. Mixing and sound design by James Trout. Grace Doe is our production assistant. Fact checking by Andrea Lopez Cruzado. Our executive producers are John Peratti and Jessica Alpert at Rococo Punch and Katrina Norvell and nikki etor@iheart podcasts. You can follow us on Instagram at Rococo Punch and you can reach out via email. Theturningcocopunch.com I'm Aelin Lance Lesser. Thanks for listening.

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[Aelin Lance Lesser]

This is an iHeart podcast.