← The Underworld Podcast
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- [00:01]
Danny Gold
Hey, Sal. Hank. What's going on? We haven't worked a case in years. I just bought my car at Carvana. And it was so easy. Too easy.
- [00:09]
Sean Williams
Think something's up?
- [00:10]
Danny Gold
You tell me. They got thousands of options, found a great car at a great price, and it got delivered the next day. It sounds like Carvana just makes it easy to buy your car, Hank. Yeah, you're right. Case closed. Buy your car today on Carvana. Delivery fees may apply. Shopping is hard, right? But I found a better way.
- [00:33]
Sean Williams
Stitch Fix online.
- [00:34]
Danny Gold
Personal styling makes it easy. I just give my stylist my size, style and budget preferences. I order boxes when I want and how I want. No subscription required. And he sends just for me, pieces plus outfit recommendations and styling tips. I keep woodworks and send back the rest. It's so easy.
- [00:52]
Sean Williams
Make style easy.
- [00:53]
Danny Gold
Get started today@stitch fix.com Spotify. That's stitchfix.com Spotify December 23rd, 1978. El Paso, Texas. In the law office of Lee Chakra. Lee has had a hell of a year. The late 70s have been a wild time in El Paso, especially for its most prominent criminal defense attorney. See that border with Ciudad Juarez in Mexico? It's seen hundreds of millions of dollars of weed cross it available to any enterprising and bold young man willing to risk it against the newly formed Drug Enforcement Administration. And for those young men, the ones that get caught, Lee Chagra has always been there to help them get free. Usually on some technicality. Something like the feds having failed to dot their I's and cross their T's on their wiretap requests. It's earned him a hell of a lot of cash. So much so that he's been able to indulge his other career. I staked gambling. I'm not talking five to ten dollar limits. I'm talking blowing through hundreds of thousands of dollars a night in Vegas, going up and down millions. The kind of guy that Caesar's palace sends Learjets to pick up when he feels like having a weekend at the tables. But it's not just money. His criminal defense skills have earned him. It's also earned him the hatred of a whole lot of prosecutors and judges who also seem to think that that Lee might not just be a criminal lawyer, but a criminal lawyer. The feds, they think Lee is a kingpin. Not helping his case is the fact that his brother Jimmy has been bringing in tens of thousands of tons of weed. First Mexican weed in small plains over the border. And then massive steamer shifts of Colombian weed. Into the Massachusetts Bay. Recently, he shifted his operations to South Florida and the feds have have been on the brothers non stop, looking to build a massive indictment. The brothers know it. Both Jimmy and Lee, in fact, a few months earlier when three men opened fire and tried to kill a prosecutor who was targeting Jimmy. Everyone seems to think the Chagras are behind it. And Lee, he's been spitting out. He lost half a million in Vegas earlier that year and owed big time. But Lee, he was hoping to put that behind him in the new year 1979. He had just won a big case in Arizona. His law practice, which had suffered a loss of business due to the feds harassing him, was getting back on track. The night before, he had just gotten home to El Paso and his wife and two of his children picked him up in a new stretch limo she had bought him as a surprise. He'd also just taken out $7,500 from his office to pay off a mysterious outlaw known as the Indian, whose job it was to collect debts for the casino. And he was about to wipe his slate clean. But none of this is going to happen because that night in his office, Le Chagra is gunned down, murdered. And $450,000 money he was supposed to pay New York Mafia boss Joe Bonanno for a drug deal gone bad disappears El Paso. The entire city is shocked when the news breaks. His, his family, especially Jimmy. They think the DA or the FBI had something to do with it. The media is talking about organized crime, a disgruntled client, but nobody has any idea. The family goes so far as to hire psychics. They even get some old mafia associates to do a private investigation. And not even six months later, another even more shocking murder is going to occur in the orbit of the Chakra brothers. The assassination of a federal judge done by a hitman who also happens to be the actor Woody Harrelson's father. This is the story of the Chakra family, A tale that spins the dusty border towns of Texas and Mexico, the glittering casinos of Las Vegas, and the marble halls of federal courthouses. It's a story about three brothers, Lee, Jimmy and Joe, who rose from humble beginnings to become central figures in one of the most audacious criminal conspiracies in in United States history. The assassination of a federal judge. This is the Underworld Podcast. Welcome back to the Underworld Podcast, the audio visual program that takes you you on a weekly tour of the international organized crime underworld, brought to you by two journalists who have done this sort of reporting all over the World, myself, Danny Gold, and my co host, Reform Menace and former Berlin party boy turned long form print artiste, Sean Williams. Sean, any, any New Year's resolutions, bud for the year? Last year it was, you're gonna spend less time on Onlyfans and more time with your child. Were you able to, to make that happen?
- [05:53]
Sean Williams
Yeah, that was a, that was a terrible idea. I'm like reversing it this year. It's gonna be more onlyfans fathering more feed picks. So yeah, hopefully I'm gonna make some money.
- [06:04]
Danny Gold
Yeah, I think the fans wanna, wanna see those. But thank you guys too. It's beginning of the year, so I just want to say you guys have been like tremendous support. We get a lot of positive comments and we really thank you guys for supporting us. My resolutions, I don't know, man. I'm gonna order more biltong off Amazon, which isn't really a resolution, but I'm just gonna, I'm gonna keep doing it. We, we have gotten a lot of messages about the Venezuela app to do a follow up. I guess we're kind of still waiting to see what happens. But yeah, I was definitely, I don't know if I said it in the episode. I definitely said it in our group chat when Dale like two months ago was like, we gonna invade Venezuela. And I was like, no way, dude. He's just bluffing. So definitely not accurate on that. But the oil thing too, people are, are. I don't think I said. I, I think we talked about like Trump doing it for, for oil. But my whole point was that for Rubio, I think the communism thing and overthrowing Venezuela, Cuba is much more of his motivation. He's kind of the one leading it. So I kind of still stand by that. You know, Trump wants shiny things. So like, it is what it is with that. But I still, I still stand by the Rubio thing. I don't think I'm wrong on that.
- [07:11]
Sean Williams
No, you're not wrong on that. It's funny though, because like, for this story that I'm writing at the moment, which is already out of date, it's ridiculous. I read John Bolton's book from a few years ago and he, and it's the same thing was happening then. They were like, okay, democracy, like we're gonna try and do this and that in Venezuela and they're like, whatever you do, don't let Trump speak to the media between now and then because he's gonna be on the phone to like Russia or something and he's gonna change his mind. And he gets out in front of the cameras and he says something completely different. They're like, jesus Christ, man. So you cannot keep that man on topic. And I think he's just kind of proving it at the moment. He's like, he's amazing. It's just so. I mean value.
- [07:50]
Danny Gold
Anyway, yeah, I've been doing the. The Kalshi prediction markets. You can do it for a wine. I shouldn't have said their name because they us any money. The prediction markets in general. You can bet on like what people are going to say in a press conference. And that's sort of my new. My new thing right now for, for gambling, which I highly recommend. You know, definitely, definitely gamble. Try to do it above your means too. That's what makes it fun and exciting if you actually can't afford to lose the money. That's where the rush comes from. Everyone's like, oh, gamble within your. Within your means. That's the wrong idea, guys.
- [08:18]
Sean Williams
You got nothing to lose, you got nothing to gain.
- [08:20]
Danny Gold
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. As always, we do a lot of bonus episodes on patreon.com normal podcast and you can also sign on Spotify or itunes ad free underworldpod.com for merch the Underworld podcast@gmail.com for advertising inquiries or tips or just to say what's up, you know, let us know how, how you're doing. Maybe you have a favorite biltong brand that I should purchase from. Maybe you've got some exciting New Year's resolutions.
- [08:44]
Sean Williams
I'm sure you can do better than purchase jerky once as your New Year's resolution.
- [08:49]
Danny Gold
It's not jerky, my friend. It's better than jerky. And I'm not talking about ones. I'm talking about becoming a regular consumer. Great macros on that. All right. Well, we are.
- [08:58]
Sean Williams
We were so on YouTube, by the way. We should say that because we get.
- [09:01]
Danny Gold
We are trying to get more people on the YouTube. Our YouTube is. Is lagging. Spotify, we dominate. We get those markers, those 50 75K markers. But YouTube, we are slouching anyway.
- [09:12]
Sean Williams
Yeah, you've even managed to pay for a nice. Pay for a nice light there, haven't you?
- [09:16]
Danny Gold
You look like you're in a. I did. I bought a new. I bought it. I bought a ring light. I bought the influencer ring light fresh from a factory in China to. To spice it up when I'm recording from home and not at Spotify studios. Moving on. Okay, yeah, we'll get to it. Interesting one, because there's some. There's some Competing sources, and it's just kind of confusing. Look, so the primary source on this book is on this episode is this book by the journalist Gary Cartwright, who covered this stuff live the, the Chagra, and it's pronounced Chagra, which I thought was weird. I thought it'd be Chagra, Chagra sort of stuff. Live for Texas Monthly, which is a fantastic magazine. He wrote articles about it back then too. And then he wrote the book on it, which is called Dirty Dealing. And why the whole thing is so murky, besides the usual when it comes to drug dealers and criminals, is that he writes this whole book under the assumption from his research and tons of reporting that Lee, the older brother, the one who's, who's killed in the cold open, the defense attorney, you know, was not involved in the drug dealing or any real gangster stuff besides like a little bit of money laundering. And then in the postscript, which I think he wrote maybe five or 10 years later to the book or the edition that I have, there's an addendum where he's like, actually, also, Lee was definitely heavily involved in drug smuggling too. I didn't know about it and no one can prove it at the time. So, you know, you have the, the whole thing kind of laid out, but without mention of that. And then on the other side of that, there's a bunch of articles and stuff you can find which calls the brothers specifically Jimmy the biggest weed smuggler in the US in the 1970s. And I think one even said if you smoked weed in the US in the 70s, it probably came from him, which all of that scene sounds like extremely unplausible, like a really big exaggeration just for having done all the stories we've done on smugglers and that era. And really having looked into it, I don't think there's any way that's true. But you know, you got to, you got to move stories, got to get those superlatives in the headlines. Yeah.
- [11:10]
Sean Williams
What's the, what's the title of this episode going to be then?
- [11:13]
Danny Gold
Oh, it'll be something like that. I don't know if I'm going to go with Biggest Weed Smuggler of All Time. But it'll be something, I haven't decided yet. It'll be something that is definitely sensationalized. But here's an example. The, the journalist George Knapp, who is a big time Vegas journalist and I think also does a bunch of UFO stuff. He wrote an article about Jimmy. I think he actually interviewed him as well, or his partner, Jack Sheehan, did that said, quote, the pot king of the Western world with the subhead quote, if you smoke pot during the 60s or 70s, the chances are pretty good that your supplier was a Las Vegas high roller named Jimmy Chakra. Again, I don't. I don't think that that is true. So he spent time, or his partner in the project did, with Jimmy after he got out of prison. And he was in the witness relocation program, so he might just be taking Jimmy at his word. The article continues, quote, for a period of several years back in the heyday of reefer, Jimmy Chagra was the undisputed marijuana kingpin of the Western world. He imported more high grade ganja than anyone, tons at a time, planeload after planeload. He used Las Vegas casinos to help launder some of the mountains of money his illicit enterprise earned. But at the height of his power, he also had approximately $100 million stashed in foreign bank accounts. So, yeah, it is a little tough to parse when you have all those competing things going around. And this is before we get into the wild murder trials involving Woody Harrelson's dad. False confessions not only from Woody Harrelson's dad about other murders, but also from. From Joe Chagra. Different brother. A not guilty and a guilty verdict for two different people in the same murder conspiracy. Which happens when you have separate trials or can happen when you have separate trials. So, yeah, I mean, I talk about this a lot, but the overall murkiness with this episode, it's. It's a lot. But we'll. We'll get there when we get there. Yeah. So this, this is like our episode about the infamous Mexican border trafficker Pablo Acosta. A story, really about the borderlands of America and Mexico. And just like Pablo Acosta about that sliver of El Paso, Texas, and Juarez, Mexico, that the Rio Grande bisects. That's where the Chagras come from. That is where they build. And as Gary Cartwright so poetically writes, quote, outsiders tend to forget the obvious. This is a pass, an opening. A collector of lost souls. El Paso and Juarez had thrived on mystique, greed and corruption. But all of its promises were in the eyes of the beholder. El Paso has always attracted a special breed. Bounty hunters, gunslingers, fugitives, adventurers, gamblers. A variety of shady and desperate characters drawn by an ironic prospect of wealth. So if you actually add in ketamine fiends and transgender burlesque dancers, it actually sounds like Sean's apartment when he lived in Berlin in the early 2010s.
- [13:59]
Sean Williams
Yeah. Transgender Pearlesque dancers in wheelchairs, maybe. But yeah, I mean, Berlin is actually the El Paso of Europe. I mean, everyone knows that they're actually twin cities.
- [14:08]
Danny Gold
It actually kind of. If you go back to, like, the, you know, pre 89, that actually kind of sounds a little. Yeah, probably a lot less open, but you get what I'm saying? But, yeah, that is. That's a great couple sentences right there. I mean, I was very in. I. I love that kind of writing, you know, I thought it was great.
- [14:23]
Sean Williams
Yeah, it's cool.
- [14:24]
Danny Gold
No.
- [14:24]
Sean Williams
Yes.
- [14:24]
Danny Gold
Are you on board? Okay, finish. Now. When the Civil War kicks off in America in the 1860s, there's only 400 people living in El Paso, and 16 of them are gamblers. There's also a whole lot of smugglers. So you got gamblers, smugglers. And what goes with gamblers and smugglers? Hookers. Until there's a reform movement that gets going, and it inspires the Texas Rangers to chase all the fun people across the border. This is in 1934, into Juarez. And I don't need to tell you guys about what happens in Juarez or what Juarez becomes. If you're listening to this podcast, you know about Juarez. Now. The Chagra patriarch, he shows up a. Be it before then. He's an immigrant of Lebanese descent, and his first stop is actually Mexico, where he moves in the 1900s. The original last name is. But the patriarch, Joseph changes the Chagra to sound more Mexican, and he changes it during the Mexican Revolution when things get kind of dicey for foreigners. There's a bunch of Syrian and Lebanese families that kind of follow the same path. Many of them start off as small traders, peddlers, that sort of thing. It's actually very similar to, like, the. I guess you would say, Eastern European and German Jewish peddlers that sort of went to Latin America as well in the 1890s and early 1900s. So he goes. Joseph goes. He flees. Not flees. He leaves Lebanon, go to. Go to Mexico City to follow a woman who had actually fled Lebanon to move there. She was escaping a bad marriage. They get married. But the Mexican Revolution is kicking off in the early 1900s, like 1910. Hundreds of protesters are getting killed, so it is time for them to leave. He's actually thrown in jail during that time. There's a lot of turmoil, but he manages to escape and he flees to El Paso.
- [16:08]
Sean Williams
Yeah.
- [16:08]
Danny Gold
What is.
- [16:09]
Sean Williams
I mean, I don't really know much about Lebanon, but why do so many Lebanese people, like, move to Latin America during that time? Is there anything Particularly going on. Do they become independent around then or.
- [16:20]
Danny Gold
I don't know if it's definitely during that time that was the main amount of people leaving. But I know that there's, there's heavy, you know, sort of Levant populations in Latin America, you know, countries like Chile, even Central America too. And they're, they're like very, they've done well for themselves. You know, they're like very, very high up in business elite, like very, very successful. You know my whole theory with that and, and same thing is, is that like, you know, there, it's a, you know, the Middle east was, was a market culture. You know, people are, are small businessmen and this is obviously based on like nothing factual whatsoever that I've not looked into. But the theory is that I assume that it's like, it's like, you know, these are, these are crossroads for a long time. They're markets. People have a history of business. So you have these people that work very hard. They move to these countries. They start off and it's a very similar thing with Eastern European and German Jewish immigration. The same era. They start off literally going town to town like pedaling wares, you know, are like making shoes. And then they, they just build up and they work hard and they, they've. You see it a lot I think Costa Rica. Dr. You have like very Trinidad even too. You have like very, some very powerful Lebanese and, and, and Syrian families that have been.
- [17:32]
Sean Williams
Yeah, yeah.
- [17:33]
Danny Gold
Anyway, yeah, they actually, I probably should look more into it. It is, is fascinating the story, immigration patterns and the way that works out. So they actually flee from Mexico City to Juarez, but then the war comes there so they head to El Paso after that. Joseph does odd jobs before becoming a police deputy. He also opens a produce stand and gambles a bit. So we're going to see a lot of gambling in this. He's a son named Abdo and they mingle with a bunch of other Syrian and Lebanese trader families that call El Paso home. Abdu soon, soon marries into another one of these families. They tend to be kind of insular those communities. He has three sons and a daughter. The oldest son is Lee, followed by Jimmy and then Joe. Lee is a hard working kid. He pulls shifts at the produce stand and he does well in school. He also starts a little high school gang called the Gents with a Z because you always, always with a Z. They seem like they're more like young knuckleheads. Not really, you know, not really like, like dealing drugs or any. Or committing big acts of violence. Not really criminals, though. They gamble a lot on everything. They're kind of like, you know, betting on, like, foot races and just whatever they can. The Chaguas don't actually have a lot of money at this point, but Lee gets into college, Texas Western, and he actually graduates at the bottom of his class.
- [18:45]
Sean Williams
So I guess it's a good time to get into some of your latest bets. You're telling us about betting on the specific words in a press conference sound how crazy.
- [18:53]
Danny Gold
Yeah, dude, I've been doing that a lot. It's been. It's been up and up and down. You know, some of them hit, some of them don't. I. I do. I make a lot. I've been making a lot of big bets on things that are like, 85 certain. Like, I bet on Trump not meeting with Justin Trudeau in, like, December, which I think they thought there was like some. Some, like, legalese term that he was getting off. But I made. I made bank on that because I put big money on it. But yeah, I'm big on. On press conference bets. Press conference bets, on terms. And then I want to get into insider trading on geopolitics, you know, because there's a lot of that going on. Did you see, like, a guy bet on, man, like, eight bets on, like, an invasion of Venezuela.
- [19:34]
Sean Williams
Yeah.
- [19:35]
Danny Gold
Happening. Or a bunch of which, you know. You know, it's a Delta guy who just was like, let me. Let me go for it. Which, you know, more power to him. There aren't. The regulations aren't there with prediction markets? It's a free. It's like crypto. It's a free for all, man.
- [19:48]
Sean Williams
Yeah.
- [19:49]
Danny Gold
They do get to make their own rules, though. So they will. They will cancel you if I think and not pay you if they think it's too insidery. But I've made so many bad bets already. No one's going to be like, this guy's on the inside. He knows what he's doing. But I'm actually. I'm up, dude. I'm up pretty big.
- [20:03]
Sean Williams
Yeah, but you're playing a slow game, man.
- [20:05]
Danny Gold
Yeah, it's just like I said, it's.
- [20:07]
Sean Williams
Just very slow time.
- [20:08]
Danny Gold
You should get into gambling, dude. Get a new vice, you know?
- [20:12]
Sean Williams
Okay. Okay. Yeah. I need lots of vices. I haven't got any.
- [20:16]
Danny Gold
Your son, we've been paying attention. He's not. He's not going to that college money is not going to be necessary. I'm just kidding. But that's say to that to my brother all the time with My nephews, I'm like, bro, you don't need to save for their college. Let's. Let's trade school these kids. There was some more money on the.
- [20:29]
Sean Williams
That money themselves. Anyway.
- [20:32]
Danny Gold
Anyway, Lera is the first college graduate in his family. And then he goes to the University of Texas Law School where he gets his act together. He graduates fourth in his class in 1962. He's a go getter. Writes student, court, law review, all that. He's a sharp legal mind. The guy's going places. He also marries into a prominent Syrian Orthodox family called the Abrahams. And he joins his father in law's law firm, right? At a school. He passes the bar. He has some kids. So far, so good. Right away he immerses himself in criminal defense, usually for clients who couldn't afford much in the way of lawyers. He gains a reputation as. What else? A Robin Hood type. He takes on drug cases most say no to. He starts to wear a cowboy hat. He's got fancy boots and jewelry. Like when he goes to trial, like very flamboyant. One of one piece of which is a gold bracelet that says Freedom on it in big letters. He's kind of a real like, swaggering, flamboyant guy. And soon enough, he is making headlines.
- [21:30]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I mean, I just looked up a few pictures of him and yeah, holy moly. Guy looks like a sort of Garth Brooks character. I mean, he definitely doesn't look like much of a lawyer or at least one that is going to take on many prestigious cases. But, yeah, who am I to say? He looks pretty amazing.
- [21:48]
Danny Gold
70S. Yeah, he's got that 60s and 70s, sort of like outlaw Texas swagger, you know, Southwest. Yeah. Dress as well. It's cool. I mean, I think if he was still alive at this era, he'd be wearing a lot of turquoise jewelry and he would be pulling it off, you know, in a bolo, which is a sick look if you can pull it off. Most people can't.
- [22:08]
Sean Williams
Most people can.
- [22:09]
Danny Gold
Now take note of this moment in time, right? It's the mid late 60s. The DEA doesn't actually exist yet. And the drug war hasn't really gotten going into what it's going to become, Right? But you got to realize if you're in El Paso, in the El Paso region, building up a rep as a criminal defense attorney, especially for winning hard to win drug cases. Like drug cases, buddy, you are building a foundation. Like, talk about right place, right time. It'd be like setting up a penicillin shop next to Sean's apartment in Berlin the day he moved in.
- [22:40]
Sean Williams
Okay, that's two. You're only, what, 10 minutes.
- [22:45]
Danny Gold
To two an episode? I think that's. That's enough. We're creating lore for you, man, you know?
- [22:50]
Sean Williams
Oh, I'm so great creating.
- [22:52]
Danny Gold
Yeah, it's great creating lore. So Lee is set to be making a fortune in the next couple years. But much like his dad and his grandfather before him, he loves to gamble. And I don't mean like, like, I do like here and there's. We are talking like he is throwing thousands of dollars per hand out in Vegas, Going up hundreds of thousands, down a million. Like really going for like 36 hours. I mean, he gets started in high school, he just keeps going. Him and his crew have been going to Vegas for a while. You know, the first they go and beat up cars with $500 a piece. And actually at his first trip to Vegas, Lee loses $1,000, like a stake right away. Takes out a loan at check cashing spot for 20% interest. He turns that, he turns $300. What he's down to into 8,000 and then into 40,000. I mean, the dude loves to run at the tables to the point that by the late 60s, Vegas casinos are sending Learjets to pick him up to take him out there to gamble. And this is the Vegas of that era, right? We are talking like swinging 60s, Rat Pack, Sinatra, old school mafiosos, you know, spilotro, glamour and glitz. And Lee is all about it, writes Cartwright. Quote, he had an affinity for cards and dice, for dope dealers and shady politicians and nightclub singers, for dabblers in the black market and exponents of the fast book. They were all scammers, everyone he knew or cared about.
- [24:17]
Sean Williams
Scoop, right?
- [24:20]
Danny Gold
He sounds fun, sounds like a good time. And this is before he gets super into. Into doing tons of drugs too. Anyway, it's okay not to be perfect with finances. Experian is your big financial friend and here to help. Did you know you can get matched with credit cards on the app? Some cards are labeled no ding decline, which means if you're not approved, they won't hurt your credit scores. Download the Experian app for free today. Applying for no ding decline cards won't hurt your credit scores if you aren't initially approved. Initial approval will result in a hard inquiry which may impact your credit scores. Lee loves to gamble. He's constantly going up and down, going to Vegas any chance he gets. And he's also coming up with, like, hair brain money making schemes that Never work out. We're talking like racehorses. That he's investing in potential pro golfers inventions, Colombian coffee markets, like everything and everything fails. He sounds a lot. You know, it's like looking in a mirror basically for me. Real like crime against humanity that we don't have a Calci sponsorship yet. Anyway, he's nothing if not a gambler. Both in that he loved gambling literal millions at the tables, but also in that he took risks. Right. Instead of doing corporate litigation, lining himself up for a whole bunch of money and some quiet, he took on being a private defense attorney. And what sort of criminals or alleged criminals do you think are now going to be hitting the justice system in a Texas border town in the 70s, in the late 60s. That's right, Sean, your favorite perverts. No, I'm just kidding. Drug traffickers. Massively big drug traffickers. Drug smugglers, dealers like the old school bandit desperado types. Also he was banging his secretaries a whole lot. So he's a risk taker in that way as well.
- [26:05]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I mean no man who dresses that way is faithful. It's just not happening.
- [26:09]
Danny Gold
Also the 70s, so maybe not that risky at that time, you know. So as the 60s turn to the 70s and the drug war ramps up and these strikes out, Lee decides to strike out on his own. He starts focusing on representing pretty much only weed dealers and smugglers. It is the golden age of marijuana smuggling where everyone is getting involved, just waltzing across the river to pick up a garbage bag full. One of the people getting involved is a guy by the name of Jack Strickland Jr. Who's an upper middle class kid with a wild side. He's going to end up becoming one of the pioneers of selling dope around El Paso during this period. And interestingly, his dad is the VP of El Paso Natural Gas Company. So basically, like, like Billy Bob and Landman, he grows up, you know, he goes to a military academy, then the Navy where he gets arrested and serves time in the brig for selling weed. When he gets out, he goes back to El Paso and he starts crossing the river in to Juarez to buy wheat. By the time he and Lee link up, he has a solid crew and he works with the Columbus Air Force to transport big shipments. So the Columbus Air Force, it's a group of former military pilots known for their wild flying that get deep into the smuggling game. And they're called that because they operate out of the nearby towny town of Columbus, New Mexico, where there was like an airstrip. They actually grow like kind of infamous. There's a very famous Popular Science article about the, the stuff that brought them down. Like the new technology that the feds were using, the planes. But this was the days of like cat and mouse pilot games with the feds. I might actually do a full episode on them or a bonus. Yeah, because they, they pop up a lot in border stories in the 70s. Now back then, like I said, the smugglers are bringing tons of weed just right across the river, hidden in vehicles, packed on mules, ferried across the river in the dark of the night. It's a massive business generating millions of dollars. And they need lawyers like these guys. These guys get caught and there are federal cases now and you're going to need someone there having your back who knows what's going on. Lee Chagra becomes that lawyer. He is a magician in the courtroom, right. He's great with local juries. He's meticulous at finding technicalities that get cases or evidence thrown out. Especially when it comes to illegal wiretaps, which it feels, feels like every case that, that he takes and that they go into is like something to do with an illegal wiretap that like wasn't supposed to be happening. And Lee always gets them on it. His reputation grows and grows. It spreads through criminal underworld like wildfire. By 1971, even the big boys, the ones doing like 600 pound shipments, are hearing Lee's name when they get busted and they start showing up at his office. Here's a story from an old issue of Texas Monthly quote. Lee had already made a name for himself before he began taking drug defendants. But the string of cases that would make him one of El Paso's most famous or infamous figures began in the early 70s when U.S. customs agents busted a smuggler from Tennessee named Tom Pitts and two other men who were attempting to bring 600 pounds of marijuana across the Rio Grande. It's Rio Grande or Grand. It's Grande, right?
- [29:04]
Sean Williams
It's.
- [29:05]
Danny Gold
We're doing Spanish.
- [29:05]
Sean Williams
I mean, it's grande in Spanish, but I've heard people call it the Rio Grande. Right? I don't know.
- [29:10]
Danny Gold
Yeah, well, we like to, we like to adhere to local customs here at the Underworld podcast. All right, I'm going to continue. Since he was a stranger to El Paso, Pitts asked a local smuggler named Jack Strickland for the name of a good lawyer. Strickland hadn't yet met Lee Chakra, but he knew Chagra's reputation. I'd grown up in El Paso, Strickland recalled. I didn't trust Arabs. But everyone said Lee was the best. Pitts arrived at Lee's office looking like a hippie who had just crawled out of a Goodwill box, but acting like the owner of a seat on the New York Stock Exchange. It's what. So we call that business hippie, right? And they are great at drug dealing.
- [29:45]
Sean Williams
Oh, yeah.
- [29:45]
Danny Gold
The article continues, quote, chagra laid out the cold, hard facts. I can't save you. You're going to get five years each. You'll do at least 18 months, and I'm going to charge you $10,000. Lee meant $10,000 for all three defendants. But Pitts didn't understand that. Pitts fancied himself a big timer, concluded that Chagra must be pretty big himself if he was demanding 30 grand. The Tennessee dope dealer rolled down his sock and slapped the cash on his desk. Lee didn't say anything. He just picked up the money and tossed it in a draw. But his eyes spun like a blur of cherries on a slot machine.
- [30:18]
Sean Williams
That's good writing. I mean, I don't know how anyone's eyes would roll around like cherries on a slot machine, but I like it.
- [30:25]
Danny Gold
Also, 30 grand from a sock doesn't make. That feels like too big a roll, right? How big is that a roll if There was that? 300. 300?
- [30:37]
Sean Williams
Yeah.
- [30:37]
Danny Gold
Dude.
- [30:38]
Sean Williams
I don't know. Zimbabwe and maybe.
- [30:40]
Danny Gold
But yeah, I've carried like 20 grand on me because we used to, like back in the old days, like first advice, like, they didn't have the financial systems worked out, so they would literally wire to my personal account. Because, like when I was going to Central African Republic, right? There's no, there's no, there's like one ATM. There are no ATMs there, right? So I'm like, you're going for two weeks. Like you need cash on hand to pay the hotel, pay fixer, emergency supply, whatever it is. So I'm going there. And they were like, literally wire it to my personal checking account. I would go, have to go to the bank, take out 20 grand and then like, I think I would split it up like me, like 9, 9009, 9. And then my partner or my camera guy, which Robert King at the time, who should look him up. So we would each take like 9, 9 90. So you don't have to declare it like in our. In on our person, like in the airport and then land in this. In this incredibly poor African country undergoing a civil war. But that was probably the most, most cash I've ever had for now, for Now?
- [31:39]
Sean Williams
Yeah, until. Until what? Like, until Gustav Petro does a speech about oil or some shit that you're going to bet on in half a week.
- [31:48]
Danny Gold
Dude. Oh man. Anyway, soon enough his reputation is cemented and every drug trafficker in the region has him on speed dial. And he actually partners up with Strickland to run an import export company, which. Come on guys, try a little harder. That is mainly used to launder cash from smuggling ops. That's the thing I don't understand. He's clearly doing money laundering. And, and the way Car right talks about it is like, you know, he kind of kept his hands clean for the most part. Like he was whatever. But we'll get to that. So he's rolling in the dough right now. And the Feds are starting to get pissed that he's defending all their targets, usually successfully. They're starting to think he's actually the kingpin and they want him locked up. And it starts to get personal with prosecutors, judges and agents. That becomes a running thing throughout the 70s with the chakras. By the early 1970s, he is making extraordinary money. He's wearing custom tailored suits that cost thousands of dollars, driving Jaguars and Mercedes. This is a beautiful home and a lifestyle that would be the envy of anyone making serious bank. But in 1973, a heroin addict slash dealer gets busted. A guy who works with Strickland. He offers the Feds info on Le Chagra. He says they'd let him, that he let them use his office to negotiate deals to get a cut. Which is apparently a lie, but definitely makes him as part of the conspiracy, right? The Fed seize on the opportunity. They hauled in Lee and a bunch of other El Paso dealers to jail. And for Lee, this is hugely embarrassing, right? He's 38. He's established as a big time and widely respected criminal defense attorney. And this is a black mark on his record, right? You want to be a criminal lawyer, not a criminal lawyer. You know what I'm saying?
- [33:21]
Sean Williams
Is that, Is that you? Is that the Sopranos? That one.
- [33:24]
Danny Gold
It's not me. I think it's Better Call Saul or Breaking Bad. Great quote, right?
- [33:30]
Sean Williams
Yeah, it's amazing.
- [33:31]
Danny Gold
Fantastic, fantastic quote. Should have owned it reads. Texas monthly quote. On June 20, a team of narcotics agents appeared at his law office with a warrant for his arrest and hauled him away in handcuffs. A grand jury in Nashville had indicted Chagra and 40 others on a charge of conspiracy to import and distribute marijuana. A few Hours later, the 38 year old attorney, stunned and bewildered, found himself being transferred to the county jail. So the case actually drags on for two years before it's dismissed. Because they don't really have anything on him, right? But it tarnishes his name and it screws up his law business, which I feel like, really, I mean, wouldn't that make the dope boys love him more? You know, like, wouldn't they be like, this guy, this guy gets us, right? But I guess it makes him. It makes him too hot. And this whole era, things are really changing, right? The Drug control Act of 1970 is passed which establishes the Kingpin Law, which they don't actually use for a while, but we'll get to that. G. Gordon Libby, who's Nixon's like big drug warrior, he flies to El Paso to do something called Operation Intercept where in a three week period the Fed stop and search. Five million US's.
- [34:33]
Sean Williams
Five million, man, that's nuts.
- [34:35]
Danny Gold
Yeah, or maybe like two million guys twice, like back and forth, you know. Two and a half million. Now, during this time, while Lee is succeeding kind of despite these hiccups, he's eventually joined by his littlest brother, Joe Chagra as an attorney. DRO is going to end up being the most straight laced one, right? He doesn't seem to get involved too much until the end. And Jimmy, the middle brother, it's kind of a goof, right? He's a screw up. And Lee is always bailing him out of trouble. He keeps growing up, right? He's writing bad checks. He's always involved with family businesses. He's running blackjack games on the side. He's selling a little dope. Spending a lot of time in Vegas too, because he also loves to gamble, even though he doesn't really have the bankroll for it. Fail it for it fails a lot, goes broke a lot. He always leaves his more responsible and successful brother Lee to clean up the mess. He actually runs the family carpet store for a bit before he fails at that too. And he tries to make it as a professional gambler, which is again, these guys are both. They're just like me, you know? For real.
- [35:29]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I, I'm. You got there before I could. I mean, nice work. So at this point. So you're an inveterate gambler and I'm some kind of like sick, twisted pervert? Is that, Is that where we are now?
- [35:40]
Danny Gold
No, reform. You're a reformed, Reformed, reformed party.
- [35:44]
Sean Williams
Okay.
- [35:45]
Danny Gold
Yeah, we're cr. It's creating lore, Sean. You know, this is how you do it with the kids these days, actually. In all these, right? Every, every, every Journalist book. I've read every amount. It's all just creating. Everyone's just creating lore. Then one day, the story goes, jimmy gets a phone call from an old buddy who's just back from Vietnam, who's a highly decorated helicopter pilot, can't find a good job, he's really struggling. And he knows Jimmy is fluent in Spanish. He's a smooth talker with connections, and he's got the hustle streak in him, right? Likes to play on the other side of law. He wants Jimmy to go in on the marijuana business with him, which, as we discussed, is flourishing in America and bringing in millions to whoever is daring enough in El Paso, writes the Las Vegas Journal Review. On their first drug run from Mexico City, in a rented plan, Jimmy and Pete unloaded more than 700 pounds of grade A weed to a band of trust fund hippies in aspen. They netted $85,000 on the transaction. Jimmy Chaga would never look back. Over the next 10 years, Jimmy and Pete and their posse of renegades would become arguably the largest marijuana importers in the world. Would they? Would they, though? I don't. I don't know if I buy that.
- [36:49]
Sean Williams
I mean, this is like prime Thai stick era. Like Nepalese, Afghan, Moroccan hash. Like, there's got to be more money being made out in Asia at that time. I think one of the earlier quotes actually sort of alludes to that, right? Says the Western Hemisphere or something, I think you said earlier on. So, yeah, maybe they're getting it. I don't know.
- [37:07]
Danny Gold
I mean, a lot coming in from Mexico and Colombia too. I just don't think. And. But so many people involved. I actually did one of our earliest interviews with the Patreon was this guy who was a surfer who smuggled Thai stick in, like, sailing ships. I think in the late 70s, early 80s, he wrote a book about it. And that's a life, man. Forget El Paso, Watertown. Like, imagine being in. In running around Thailand and Cambodia in the 70s and 80s, like, dodging all sorts of shading the chaos of there. I mean, it's a fascinating story.
- [37:32]
Sean Williams
Yeah, we should do it. We haven't even done a tie stick episode. We should do one. There's so many good stories around that stuff.
- [37:38]
Danny Gold
Get his book and. And do it up the. Do it up that way. In the mid-70s, Jimmy teams up with Jack Strickland, of all people, and he starts innovating. He looks at smuggling £2,000, £600, £700 of Mexican dirt weed in small planes, and he says, let us think bigger it's called being a disruptor, Sean. He's going to get better weed, Colombian weed that he can sell for more like 400 to 500 bucks a pound instead of 80 to 100 bucks a pound for the Mexican stuff. And he's going to bring not like £500 or a thousand pounds or even £2,000. He's going to bring in 50,000 or so pounds of it from Columbia on a tramp steamer, which is also known as a big ass ship. So Jimmy flies down to Barranquilla in Colombia to try to meet some contacts, not knowing anyone. Within a week, he connects with Colombian grower families, and he finds out that they're willing to not only front the weed, but they'll also pay for the ship. And this is a game changer. He links up with some partners who have connections to the mob in Boston. I think it's likely the patriarchal crime family to help them bring the weed in because they're actually going to offload it in a northwestern part of Massachusetts Bay where no one suspects a thing.
- [38:45]
Sean Williams
I mean, this guy's what, like, floating down the Rio Magdalena on a choo choo liner? He's got. He's got like £50,000 of weed in a boat. Like he's some Fitz corraldo. Like, what. What is going on? Why is no one arresting this guy?
- [39:02]
Danny Gold
He's nuts. To those days, man, you could get away with this kind of thing. And by the way, I want to add, I. I don't know if the patriarchal family was actually helping them unload it or whether he was just getting tax and paying the tax to, like have their protection essentially to do it in that territory. I believe it's probably the latter. So these are. These are multimillion dollar deals, right? Definitely. Tens of millions of dollars by today's money. And the plan, it goes off without a hit. In 1975, Jamie and his partner's empire grows to a fleet of six planes and four freighter ships. They get the prime minister of the Bahamas on the payroll to allow their ship safe passage through the Bahamas. They also pay DEA officials and border cops to look the other way. The money starts to pour in as the dealers and distributors and wholesalers sell it off. Because remember, the boys, they got it on consignment. So of course, as soon as the money starts coming in, what do the Chagras do? They hit Vegas like a tornado in the summer of 76. Both brothers are basically competing to see who can lose more money. Caesar's palace sends The Learjet, Everything is comped. Jimmy's in the Sinatra suite. They're playing blackjack in roped off VIP sections, putting down like $3 a hand, five hands at a time. They're dropping 10k on the craps table every roll. And they're also doing quite a bit of cocaine, which is getting popular and kind of goes to the territory for where they're operating. At one point, Lee basically stops even practicing law. But he loses so much money that summer that he eventually has to go back to it.
- [40:28]
Sean Williams
I can't. I can't believe that he's still practicing. I. I just assumed at this point that he's. He's giving it up. I don't know why. I guess he's always in every game.
- [40:36]
Danny Gold
Still, Still. Still hustling. Well, you know, you. You tell. You know, we're talking about two different people here, right? There's Lee and there's Jimmy.
- [40:43]
Sean Williams
Oh, see, now I. I'm making a mistake, right? So Lee is Lee. Wait, but Lee is. Lee is Mr. Cowboy, right?
- [40:51]
Danny Gold
Am I gonna have to redo this whole episode? Is this not clear?
- [40:53]
Sean Williams
No, no.
- [40:54]
Danny Gold
Yeah, he is. Lee is. It could be not clear. Lee's the cowboy lawyer, right? His brother Jimmy is the screw up who's like, big time in the weed game.
- [41:03]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I got that. Right. Okay, cool. I. I just assumed that Lee was like, still, he. He jumped out the game as well. But, yeah, okay, it makes sense that he would just do everything.
- [41:12]
Danny Gold
His business suffered a lot in the. Because of the arrest in 73. So he lost a lot of business. He was obviously involved in the weed smoking. I don't think he was as active as Jimmy was. He was involved in the money laundering. Might have probably put some money into it, but I think he still loved being a lawyer and still was doing this sort of stuff. So he's still, at this point, at 75, 76, he's actually getting big cases again, pissing off federal judges and prosecutors who are now eyeing Lee, not Jimmy, as the kingpin. Despite Jimmy doing the real big boy deals, by the summer of 77, he's fighting against really strict DEA regulations and prosecutors and judges who really have it out for him to the point where he's, like, asking for cases to be recused because there's personal situations. He's kind of at the end of his rope, too. And that summer, Jimmy's crew gets busted in Oklahoma with 17,000 pounds. As their smuggling planes touch down, Jimmy's able to somehow get away. But 10 of his boys are busted and it's huge news in El Paso. Then in December of that year, a plane of Jimmy's carrying a big load goes down in Colombia. They had actually overloaded the plane. They were trying to make up for the loss of the Oklahoma weed because they still owe the supplier. That plane crashes, the pilot is badly burned. So Jimmy and some of his buddies, they go to launch a rescue mission with a different plane. But they get caught and imprisoned in Colombia. They end up being locked up for a few weeks, but the Colombians couldn't actually find the plane that went down. And eventually they managed to bribe their way out. The Feds in America, they know about this. Like, they know what's up. They have everything on Jimmy. And the pressure keeps increasing on the Chagras, as does their cocaine consumption and gambling.
- [42:45]
Sean Williams
Oh yeah. Repp in Oklahoma today. I didn't even realize that. So, yeah, yeah. Finally. Finally, after all these years, I don't get what the. So the feds, what are they waiting on now? They've got this, these guys, Sea Fleet.
- [43:00]
Danny Gold
They don't have evidence on him. Well, they haven't got, they haven't caught him red handed. Right. The plane goes out in Colombia. They're not, it's not like it is in the, in the 80s and 90s where they're all over the place, you know what I'm saying? Like, they don't have any Evans in Colombia. They, they know that he's involved, but they don't have it. So what they're doing at this moment though is trying to, like trying to turn like those 10 guys that get busted, they're trying to turn them, to get them to, to, you know, offer up evidence on or, you know, turn state's evidence, become an informant on the Chagras. But they don't have anything on them yet or enough to make a case yet.
- [43:32]
Sean Williams
Got it? Yeah. As my understand, it's just crazy. It's just crazy what they're actually doing and not in jail at this point.
- [43:38]
Danny Gold
Yeah, I mean, they, they don't have much on them. Right. They're. They're not even that careful. They just can't get them red handed. So you got prosecutors, though, and judges. Everyone wants to bring them down. The da, they've all got their eyes though, on Lee. The DEA is putting massive pressure on the guys they bust in Oklahoma, one of whom is Jack Strickland, who we talked about earlier to snitch on the Chagras, threatening them with the kingpin act. Lee is actually defending Strickland in the courts. He's his lawyer. Jimmy actually hightails it out of El Paso. He relocates to South Florida. South Florida at that point is like the capital of bringing drugs in and, and not even cocaine yet, I think. I think in the late 70s, it's.
- [44:12]
Sean Williams
Still, still pre bum fire focused.
- [44:15]
Danny Gold
Yeah, yeah. After those two bad beats, right? The Oklahoma bust and the Columbia stuff, he goes to work for a man named Henry Law Wallace, who operates out of a small town in New Mexico and is said to be a major weed supplier in the Southwest. Great nickname. His nickname. They call him the Fat Man. Classic. Wallace is connected in Mexico, but eventually they decide to use Jimmy's connects in Colombia. That's when Jimmy relocates to Florida. Things go south though, with the Colombians. A shipment gets busted by customs. The Colombians, they're kind of pissed again, everyone blames Jimmy. He kind of gets cut out. But before that, he is able to unload a couple shipments, including a big one of £24,000. So he is making a fair bit of scratch. Meanwhile, all these other guys in their circle, the El Paso boys, other big dealers and smugglers, they're all getting caught up in stuff in the US and the Feds are always trying to get them to give up something on Lee and Jimmy. At some point, they actually bust Henry, Henry Wallace, the Fat Man. And he starts giving up info secretly on Jimmy. Unbeknownst to him, as the Fed start looking for a big indictment, Jimmy actually now relocates again to Vegas as the case is build. And Lee is losing his mind in El Paso. He's really struggling. Jimmy actually made so much money off the weed, he's paying some of these bills for a change, writes Gary Cartwright. Quote, for the most part, 1978 turned out to be just a continuation of the long slide that begun in 1977 for Lee's lawyer business. Except for a few faithful clients like Jack Strickland, Lee's practice was at rock bottom. Jimmy's Florida operation, far from being an immediate disaster, disbanded after successfully offloading 50 tons of grass from a Colombian freighter in March. So it's been like, I mean, close to a decade now that the Feds have been after the Chagras, trying to take them down. And it's gotten super personal. In fact, Lee thinks he's really getting unfair treatment in the trials he's working on as a lawyer because of this. And there's really two guys at the center of this targeting of the chakras. If you used Babbel, you would Babbel's conversation based techniques Teaches you useful words and phrases to get you speaking quickly about the things you actually talk about in the real world. With lessons handcrafted by over 200 language experts and voiced by real native speakers, Babbel is like having a private tutor in your pocket. Start speaking with Babbel today. Get up to 55% off your Babbel subscription right now at babbel.com Spotify spelled B A B-B E L.com Spotify rules and restrictions may apply.
- [46:40]
Sean Williams
Well, before we learn about them, I just want to know how he would articulate that argument. So he's. He. He claims he's not winning cases because law enforcement has a grudge about his millions of dollars weed importation racket that he's helping to run.
- [46:54]
Danny Gold
Well, I think it's. He's saying, they suspect me of this, so they're unfairly targeting me.
- [46:59]
Sean Williams
And.
- [46:59]
Danny Gold
And they're like, you know, it's personal with them. They have this unfair opinion of me, so they should recuse themselves because it's like they're tainted.
- [47:07]
Sean Williams
I get. Yeah, it's. It's boshy, but, yeah, it kind of makes sense.
- [47:11]
Danny Gold
No, I mean, it's. It's. It's a. It's a legit case to make that, like a judge and a prosecutor out, like, have special feelings towards you, especially if you're seeing them all the time. You know, I just love that he's.
- [47:21]
Sean Williams
Doing all this in his outfit.
- [47:23]
Danny Gold
Yeah, they have. Yeah, they haven't proven that He's. You know, he's still not considered because he's not convicted or anything yet. So the first one of these guys is U.S. attorney James Kerr, who is the lead prosecutor that's been investigating them. He's clashed with Lee in other trials, too. And the second is U.S. district Judge John Wood Jr. A federal judge known as Maximum John because he always handed out the highest possible sentences in drug cases. In 1970, President Richard Nixon appoints Wood to the federal bench for the Western district of Texas. It's the beginning of an era that would see Wood become one of the most, if not the most controversial judges in America at the time. Wood believes deeply, like almost religiously, that the drug trade is destroying America. And he sees it as a moral cancer, eating away at the fabric of society, corrupting youth, funding organized crime, and undermining everything he held sacred. When drug defendants appear before him for sentencing, Wood shows absolutely no mercy. None.
- [48:19]
Sean Williams
Yeah, that seems like a solid foundation for a good legal system. That's it. He hates this. So he's Just gonna, like, completely screw people. But I guess that's what judges do.
- [48:29]
Danny Gold
Well, the federal sentencing guidelines of that era give judges, like, enormous discretion. Right. A judge could send us a drug trafficker to anywhere from a few years to life in prison, depending on the circumstances and the judge's assessment. Most judges kind of, like, try to factor in stuff like criminal history, their role, whether they cooperated, family stuff, prospects for rehabilitation. Wood does not think about it at all. He just gives the maximum sentence by law, which gives him the nickname Maximum John. It spreads through this nickname, through the criminal defense bar, like wildfire. Right. Defense attorneys begin filing motions to get him off all drug cases. They argue that it's already predetermined, like what his sens. Sentencing approach is going to be. It violates their client's rights to individualized sentencing. Wood denies all these motions. Attorneys, like, beg prosecutors to move their cases to other districts or other judges. Anywhere but in Wood's courtroom. And they often don't. Don't. Aren't able to make it happen and would. He has a personal issue with not only Jimmy Chagra, but Lee as well, whenever he finds him in his courtroom representing the defense.
- [49:37]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I love that. Like, we think you're corrupt, and we're filing the case against you. I'm not corrupt. I'm going to throw out the case against me. Done. Great. This guy is like, what? This is like some. I don't know, it feels like another era, but I guess it's. I guess it's just like, what is this now, 80s. So we're like, yeah, it kind of.
- [49:55]
Danny Gold
Is a different late 70s, late 70s. I don't know if it's corruption as much as bias. Right. It's not really corruption. He's not taking bribes to doing this stuff. It's more biased than corruption. So it's probably a lot harder to, like, to get that. To prove that or to get it out, you know?
- [50:08]
Sean Williams
Yeah, yeah.
- [50:10]
Danny Gold
This whole time. Right. They're also getting a ton on Jimmy through Henry Wallace, quote, Texas Monthly. He had no information incriminating Lee except that he confirmed that Lee had set up some dummy corporations to launder money. But he was willing to finger Jimmy as the kingpin. The prosecutor's strategy was to indict Jimmy on multiple counts and wait for him to break. He believed that one way or another, Jimmy would take him to Lee, and he'd better. They had worked so hard selling the media on the contention that El Paso was the hub of dope trafficking in the Southwest, that everyone took it as Gospel. Now, the feds had a yard of hot real estate on their hands. They desperately needed someone to buy it. Then, In November of 1978, care the prosecutor. He's in his car in San Antonio when three men unload on it. Actually, two men. One is the getaway driver. They fire 19 shots at him. He's meant to be killed, right? But he survives. And eventually he picks out the mug shots of some members of the Bandidos motorcycle gang, a gang that Lee had defended on different charges and Jimmy had worked with. But no one is ever charged. Everyone suspects one of the Chagas called in the hit. Years later, Jimmy actually confesses to it.
- [51:15]
Sean Williams
Yeah, if you come for the cur, you best not miss. That's more my level, isn't it? Yeah. We're back. We're back.
- [51:22]
Danny Gold
I guess you could call it that. And then a month later, we get the cold open. Lee is shot to death in his office. It is a wild scene. No one knows anything about it for quite some time. Some suspect, like the Chagres, that the DA like, actually did it themselves. The media say it has to do with organized crime. $450,000 is stolen. The family is desperate. They're hiring psychics. They're getting mafia pals to launch their own investigation. Much, much later, it's going to come out that the $450,000 is actually money that he owed the New York Mafia boss Joe Bonanno for a drug deal going bad. And Bonanno, according to author Gary Cartwright, offers him $40,000 to keep his name out of the book. Dirty dealing.
- [52:04]
Sean Williams
Wait. So to rewind, Lee gets almost half a million on tick from Bonanno. He can't pay it back. But then Bonanno is actually offering gary cartwright the 40 grand, right, to keep him out of Cartwright's book. Is that right? Yeah.
- [52:17]
Danny Gold
Like, like, like a decade later or out of his reporting. I don't know if it was a book or reporting whatever it was, but we're talking about, like 10 years later.
- [52:25]
Sean Williams
Wow.
- [52:26]
Danny Gold
Oh, yeah.
- [52:26]
Sean Williams
I mean, we will take a lot less than that to keep anybody's name out of this show. By the way, if you want to send us an email, if you worry.
- [52:34]
Danny Gold
A couple bags of built. Couple bags of biltong. Eventually, though, the case breaks and it's really out of left field. Two soldiers from nearby Fort Bliss, young guys, confess that. Confess that they were hired by a distant relative of Lee's. A sleazeback who sometimes did coke with him, was a speed addict who knew that he kept lots of cash in his office. The relative told Lee the soldiers needed legal help. And then in the office, while they were robbing him, they get spooked. Apparently while he's lighting up a cigarette with his lighter, one shot goes off and they kill him. The money is never recovered. At the same time, this is breaking the investigation into the attempted murder. The prosecutor care which law enforcement all think was ordered by the chagres, but they can't prove that's all ongoing too. And then In February of 1979, the Hammer finally drops on Jimmy and he's indicted on major drug smuggling charges. Lee, of course is dead, can't represent him. So he hires his brother Joe and the notorious Oscar Goodman. Now, if you don't know who Oscar Goodman is, he is probably one of, if not the most infamous mob lawyers in America. Not only does he represent pretty much all the big mobsters in Vegas, including Tony Spilotro, he's represented Meyer Lansky. But he also later becomes the three time mayor of Las Vegas. And then when he's done, his wife gets elected mayor. I mean, this is just incredible stuff. Like incredible town, Las Vegas. And he is like. I mean, I actually, I spoke to him a couple times on the phone. I was doing this mob series on Milwaukee in the 70s and the casino stuff, movie Casino essentially had a big part in Vegas. And I was trying to get Oscar to go on tape to let us interview him. And he's trying to hustle me out of an appearance fee of like 500. I'm like, dude, you own a steakhouse, you're mayor for, for like three terms. And we're like one of the biggest defense attorneys in America. Like really, man. It's just classic mob defense attorney stuff. I mean they, I love interviewing big time defense attorneys. They are often hilarious. They give the best quotes and they're just kind of fun guys to like talk to and hang out with.
- [54:34]
Sean Williams
Oh man. Tell us more. What was he like? Like, like this is, this is cool. You actually talk to the guy Goodman.
- [54:40]
Danny Gold
I spoke to a couple times. I mean, he was like 80 years old by then, but you know, he was, he was charming at the same project. I actually, on a different project, same company I met in Chicago with mob attorney Joe the Shark Lopez, who also like incredible, like incredible quotes. Like all these guys are like out of central casting. You know, they wear the suit that looks like the suit that they should be wearing. They got the hairdo, the sunglasses, the lifestyle. I mean, Joe was cool. Lopez, I think he just got lost his license for Six months. I don't know what for, but I looked him up right before I was doing this. A lot of fun, though. Nice guy.
- [55:18]
Sean Williams
Nice.
- [55:19]
Danny Gold
Anyway, Jimmy hires his brother Joe. He hires Goodman. And he's also convinced at this point that judge Wood and the D. A and everyone are corrupt, that they're out to get him, that they had Lee killed. And he's nervous that without Lee. That without Lee having his back, he's going to prison for life. He's out on bail, and he's just kind of like gambling millions in Vegas, losing his mind at Binion's, which is the only casino that would have him because of his reputation at this point of being a drug smuggler. The trial is major in the media. Joe Chagra is actually leaking stuff about Judge Wood and the prosecutor being insanely biased, having enough for the family and how they should recuse themselves. So it's a. It's a whirled one. It is a scene then In May of 1979, the World Series of Poker week in Vegas. It's a big deal. Jimmy's doing his thing. The city is packed. Every huckster and gambler and degen is in town. Jimmy's famous at this point for his gambling and for his trial. He bumps into a blackjack dealer he knew he hung, who hung with all sorts of gamblers and other kind of degenerates and criminals. She introduces her new husband, who's like a strong kind of burly, sandy haired guy who tells Jimmy he just got out of prison for murder. His name is Charles Harrelson. He's the father of the actor Willie Harrelson. They make fast friends. They go to the craps table together. They gamble. Jimmy makes $350,000 in one night. And a couple days later, Jimmy's having lunch with a crew. Harrelson comes by and he tells him, look, if he can be of any help with him going to prison, let him know. Jimmy starts looking into him. And it turns out Harrelson has already been on trial twice for murder for hire. Ironically, Harrison Harrelson himself is a card shark. And he was actually in Vegas working on a plan with an associate to lure Jimmy into a card game and hustle him and some of his other friends. They're also scamming Jimmy at the time. They're cheating him in a high stakes. In a high stakes golf game where they have associates on the golf course, dress as groundskeepers, and they hide the balls and kind of rig other balls, which is really somewhat looney tunes ass hustling. Working on this guy who's supposed to be like this expert gambler, but I assume he's coked to the gills and like has no idea what's going on. It's a fascinating world. These high stick gambler guys like all this sort of stuff. Really fascinating. They end up taking him for $508,000 and Jimmy, intent on making the money back, he gets involved in some rigged dice and cards games that they also set up and he loses another million.
- [57:40]
Sean Williams
Oh man. And Apple chose to make that absolute dog shit show about golf with Owen Wilson. Instead of that I would watch, I would watch a show about the Harrelson golf hoaxters like all day, every day. This is amazing.
- [57:53]
Danny Gold
I mean this whole thing is insane, right?
- [57:55]
Sean Williams
Yeah, it is.
- [57:56]
Danny Gold
Things get get murky here. The timing is kind of off because you know, they say the he meets at the World Series of Poker in May and then this shooting that we're going to talk about happens at the end of May. Though Harrelson also did pre work so it's, the timing is off a bit. But Harrelson also, it's murky because he's an inveterate liar, right? The kind of person who confesses to crimes that he didn't do for the notoriety and for the fame because. And because like I said during the ensuing trials everyone seems to have lied, including Joe Chakra who confesses to playing a role in the crime and he never actually did in this murder conspiracy that we're about to talk about. But whatever, however it happened, you know, with near certainty you can say that at some point Jimmy Chagra hires Charles Harrison to assassinate Judge Wood. At the end of the month in May, Judge Wood is outside his condo in San Antonio the Tuesday after Memorial Day weekend. It's in the morning around 8:30, he's getting into his car when a gunshot rings out. Witnesses report hearing what sounded like a loud backfire. Then seeing Wood's body kind of twist around and fall. He had been leaning into his car. Sniper shoots him once, killing him. A federal judge, the first one killed in over a century. And this is a big deal. The killer disappears, blends into traffic. A real pro. The Feds launch a massive manhunt. One of, if not the most expensive manhunts and investigations in U.S. history. I don't even know if they suspect the Chagres at first, right? He has Jimmy's trial coming up. There's obviously beef, but he's tussled with and he's tussled with them before. But this is maximum, John. Right he spent a decade locking up the biggest dealers and worst criminals Texas has to offer. So the list of dangerous people who want him dead and had the money and the capacity to pull it off, that is a very long list. We are talking pages and pages. But the feds, for a while, they're just. They're not getting anywhere. At one point, they even subpoena the brother of infamous New Orleans mob boss Carlos Marcello. We've done an episode on him, too. He's caught on a wire saying he heard a third hand rumor that some Lebanese brothers from El Paso had something to do with the hit. So now they get like a little bit of a bite, right? Even though they're having these sort of false breaks all the time. They even interview Harrelson. Hell, they interview everyone, but again, they've got nothing. Meanwhile, Jimmy's still on trial for the drug charges, right? Under a different judge, who's now actually Judge Sessions. William Sessions. Who? You know, you guys know that name if you pay attention to American politics at all. A host of former trafficker and business partners cut deals with the government. They testify against Jimmy, and then Jimmy testifies at his trial. And it is a disaster. He's found guilty, but he jumps bonds, he disappears. He's on the run for months before he messes up. In typical Jimmy fashion, right, he'd been traveling across the country in Winnebago with his family. There's wanted posters everywhere. But he can't help himself, right? He needs to get back on the tables. He heads to Vegas, checks into a cheap hotel and calls a waiter he knows at a casino to buy him and his family some wigs so they can go gamble. The waiter promptly dimes him out. Some people say he was actually there not to gamble, but to see a plastic surgeon who was known for helping underworld figures change their appearance. But whatever the case, the feds bag him up a little while later while he's driving on the Vegas strip.
- [61:09]
Sean Williams
This is starting to feel little bit too much like a Rob Schneider movie now. This is crazy, man. You should just pitch this. This is such a cool story.
- [61:18]
Danny Gold
I'm sure it's been pitched like dozens of times, you know, not by us. Here's the. Here's the. The New York Times on the. On the arrest quote. Before federal agents captured him as he drove down the Las Vegas Strip in 1980, Mr. Chagra, who went by the name Jimmy in those days, led a flamboyant life of crime, smuggling marijuana and cocaine from Mexico and Colombia and gambling at high stakes tables. In Las Vegas, a Federal Bureau of Investigation wanted poster described him as a carpet salesman, professional gambler and narcotics trafficker. At his sentencing, he gets 30 years, no parole. And in April 1980, at 35 years old, he gets sent to USP Leavenworth. Meanwhile, the investigation into the murder of Judge Wood continues, with a lot of people now suspecting the Chagras are going to get charged somehow. Joe Chagra, the only free Chakra brother, the straight arrow. Still a defense attorney, he gets introduced to Charles Harrelson and ends up being his defense attorney on some gun and drug charges that he had caught. Joe at this point, has no idea Harrelson was involved in the murder. Harrelson is like the charming sociopath type, right? Old school, holds the door for women, doesn't curse in front of them, does card tricks for little kids. Also loves cocaine, as does Joe Chakra. And they end up doing a whole bunch of it together when they link up.
- [62:33]
Sean Williams
He sounds kind of British, actually.
- [62:35]
Danny Gold
Why?
- [62:38]
Sean Williams
Polite, but also.
- [62:40]
Danny Gold
Yeah, that's true. Joe starts beginning to suspect, though, that Harrelson had something to do with the murder and that maybe he was trying to blackmail the family. I think at one point House and even confesses to him. And then they both get so zonked off blow that they actually don't even show up to Harrelson's trial. Harrelson becomes a fugitive, and at one point, he gets so high and strung out, he's tweaking in a cheap motel thinking there's black helicopters chasing him. He's shooting up heroin now. I mean, not heroin, cocaine. He borrows a Corvette, gets into an accident, is so tweaked out on the highway that he gets into a six hour standoff with the police where he's threatening to off himself before a girlfriend or wife, I think, finally talks him into surrendering. As the cops take him away, he confesses to killing not only Judge Wood, but also jfk and the JFK thing we'll, we'll get to. But first we have to learn a little bit more about how he got there. Harrelson grows up on a farm in Southeast Texas. He's the youngest of six children. Older brothers, relatives in law enforcement. After his parents divorce, an older sister largely raises him, joins the Navy, later moves to la, where he sells encyclopedias door to door. During that period, he also begins stealing. He gets arrested, and at times even then, he's confessing the crimes he did not commit, believing it's going to build a reputation for himself. Harrelson eventually returns to Texas and Works as a gambler and debt collector. He likes to dress well, drive fancy cars. Cultivates the image of a hustler, really good with women. And over time, he becomes suspected of involvement in a bunch of murder for hire schemes. By 1968, he's accused of killing a man for $1,500, allegedly tied to a $7,000 debt that the man owes. Another version of the story suggests the killing stems from the guy telling major gamblers that college basketball game is rigged. The game is not rigged. They lose large sums of money. He is ultimately found innocent. In that case. This sounds like something that would happen to me. The losing money on a supposed rig game part. He's later put on trial for the contract killing of a grain dealer. Reportedly paid $2,000 for the murder, allegedly connected to a $50,000 life insurance policy. The first trial ends with a hung jury, but he's tried again. Convicted and sentenced to 15 years in prison. Harrelson is paroled in 78. By then, he has a reputation as a playboy again. Good looking, charismatic. And women find him irresistible.
- [65:01]
Sean Williams
Wow. And he got that rep while he's in prison. He must have been. Must have been a hungry boy.
- [65:05]
Danny Gold
Easy, Sean. Well, the holidays have come and gone once again. But if you've forgotten to get that special someone in your life again gift. Well, Mint Mobile is extending their holiday offer of half off unlimited wireless. So here's the idea. You get it now, you call it an early present for next year. What do you have to lose? Give it a try@mintmobile.com switch limited time 50 off regular price for new customers. Upfront payment required. $45 for 3 months, $90 for 6 month or 180 for 12 month plan taxes and fees. Extra speeds may slow after 50 gigabytes per month when network is busy, see terms easy. While when he's locked up, he allegedly agrees to plead guilty for the murder of Judge Wood in return for certain conditions with his prison sentence, including where he's going to serve. But he's turned down. There's some thought that he actually wasn't even involved, but again, trying to get fame and recognition. He also confesses at this point to Joe Chagra, who is his lawyer at the time that Harrelson's locked up. The feds are going to keep pursuing the angle of who hired him and why and could they prove it. Harrelson isn't giving up names yet. And even if he did, they don't really trust him. Despite all this, he does eventually plead not guilty, right? But soon the case starts getting cracked a bit. Harrelson, the weekend before the murder, had been at what could only be called like a outlaw wedding for friends. Everyone's got guns and drugs. One guy shoots himself in the foot by accident. Another wedding guest gives the couple a wedding gift of a live alligator. He pulled off the side of the road on the way there, put in the back of his pickup truck. One guest at the wedding, later arrested for murdering a drug dealer, starts talking to the feds about Harrelson having had him buy a rifle two weeks before the wedding. Eventually, some garbage collectors find the barrel of a gun believed to be the murder weapon and are able to trace it to Charles Housen's wife, who had given a fake name to the gun owner or the gun guy she purchased it from. But the fingerprints that you had to give match one guest at the wedding. Later, it's arrested for murdering a drug dealer. He tells the feds that Harrelson was trying to have him buy a rifle two weeks before the wedding, right around the time the shooting was going to happen, or right right before the shooting happens. Eventually, some garbage collectors somewhere else find the battle of a gun believed to be the same one used in the murder, and are able to trace the Charles Harrison's wife, who had given a fake name to the gun owner or the guy selling the gun. But the fingerprints match, and it happens 12 days before the murder that the gun was purchased. The whole thing is very convoluted, to be honest, as is the way the trial plays out. Harrelson and his wife or girlfriend are soon charged with the murder, as is Jimmy, or at least conspiracy to be involved in it. His wife and Joe Chakra, absolutely crazy. Media feeding frenzy afterwards. And then Joe actually pleads to it and takes a deal. And this is where it gets even more confusing. Joe pleads guilty, says that he'll testify against Harrelson, but as part of the deal, he won't testify against his brother. So the feds have to split up the trial into two trials, one for Harrelson, his girl and Jimmy's wife in San Antonio, and a separate one for Jimmy in Jacksonville, Florida. And as part of Joe's deal, he pleads to having, okay, having played a role in the murder conspiracy, talking to Jimmy about it, which is actually not true, but they were threatening him with 40 years for some other drug charge, and he did not. He didn't want to risk it, and he just decided to cop a plea, get whatever five, I think, or seven years that he gets. And now he has to testify against Harrelson.
- [68:28]
Sean Williams
That's kind of Woods's final revenge then, right? Bagging him up on the threat of four decades inside on a drug rep.
- [68:34]
Danny Gold
Well, not Joe, because Joe was never targeting that stuff. Jimmy and Lee were, huh? Yeah, Joe was the straight lace brother. Well, straight lace compared to his other two brothers. The trials are predictably a circus. Harrelson becomes a celebrity. He mugs for the cameras. He has to be separated from his girl for being, like, too touchy feely at one point. And at one point, the government accuses Jimmy's wife and Harrelson of being bigamists so they can testify against their partners. If they were, like, married to multiple people, it, like, nullifies them. And at one point, Harrelson admits to sleeping with his stepdaughter, which some people say is the moment of inspiration for Sean's favorite genre of video.
- [69:16]
Sean Williams
Yeah, I. I do watch a lot of organized crime trial videos. Correct.
- [69:21]
Danny Gold
Yeah, that. That might count as number three right there, you know.
- [69:24]
Sean Williams
Yeah, that's three. That's a lot.
- [69:26]
Danny Gold
That's a pretty solid, though. That's some of my best work.
- [69:31]
Sean Williams
So wait, why did he just confess to shagging his stepdaughter for. No re. Like, how did that come out in questioning? What happened?
- [69:39]
Danny Gold
You know, I don't know the details of that. I don't know if it's covered completely in the book. The transcripts are out there. It's a good question. Yeah, it is a good. Slightly tangential. Trying to establish his. His lack of character. I don't know. But it comes out. Comes out on the trial. So that trial, that trial ends, reads the paper, quote. In December 1982, a Texas jury convicted Mr. Chagua's wife, Elizabeth, and a hired assassin, Charles V. Harrelson, father of the actor Woody Harrelson, in the plot to kill the judge. The star witness was Mr. Chakra's brother, Joseph, who agreed to cooperate with prosecutors over a recorded conversation that implicated him. In return for the reduced sentence, Joseph Chagra testified that his brother had ordered the murder because he thought he was never going to have a fair trial. A jury agreed with the prosecution that Jimmy Chagra had used his wife to deliver $250,000 to Mr. Harrison. Was who pulled the trigger. Harlon's wife, also guilty. Joe gets 10 years in the plea. I think he only ends up serving 6.5. Jimmy's wife gets 30 years for delivering the payoff, which seems pretty harsh. Haron gets two life sentences. But, you know, it is the, The. The murder of a federal judge. So I think they're not taking it it easy. In the second trial in Jacksonville, Oscar Goodman, the lawyer, he works his magic, right? He. This is why he gets known as being the best mob lawyer ever. He gets Jimmy off. Not guilty, right? Wow. Not guilty in a trial that already. Murder that already went to trial, and everyone else involved is convicted, but he gets Jimmy off. Incredible, incredible work, right? But of course, he still has 30 or so years to serve for his drug charges and a few more charges I think they throw on during the trial, but not the. Not the murder charge craziness. Years later, Jimmy eventually admits to the judge's murder and the attempted hit on the prosecutor to get his wife out of prison, but she is not freed and she dies of cancer at 41. Jimmy's freed around 2003, paroled after turning state's evidence on a bunch of other people. And he lives in a trailer in Arizona for five or so years until he dies in the summer of 2008. His Witness production name, by the way, James Madrid, which. It's like they're not even. They're not. They're not even trying.
- [71:55]
Sean Williams
That's great.
- [71:56]
Danny Gold
Two of those, those reporters I mentioned, I think Jack Sheehan and George Knapp, the Las Vegas, like, you know, real old school crime reporters, they actually find him and interview him. I think that's supposed to be a documentary that never came out, but that's interesting. Harrelson eventually dies in prison. He actually had abandoned his famous son Woody when he was a baby. But eventually they. They kind of, I think, reunite maybe before he's really famous, right? When he starts to get a little famous, they find their way back into each other's life. Woody campaigns to get his father out of prison. Does not work. Apparently. Oliver Stone tries to interview Charles for his JFK movie. He's thinking, you know, it's Stone. So he's thinking that he was involved in the JFK JFK hit because he said so. Charles was alleged to be one of the three tramps on the Hill that no one knew. Eventually, though, they find out who those three tramps are. Charles is like, not one of them. Kind of nowhere near the murder. Everyone kind of like basically surmises that Charles had nothing to do with it and everything involving him being involved was debunked. But years later, Stone cast his son Woody to play a killer in Natural Born Killers. Woody, I think by then was kind of seen as like a nice guy, right? He was in Cheers. Yeah, he was like the very like. Like Kind of nice guy, whatever. And this is kind of what he's turned to, being edgy and whatever else. Kind of creepy move by stone, you know, a little bit. But. But great for promo, I imagine. So. Yeah. So there's that. Time is a flat circle. Although that was more McConaughey. Right. Anyway, recent update, a grandson of Jimmy's was just busted on drug charges of distributing cocaine, fentanyl and LSD agencies. Over 21,000 dosage units of LSD from his home. Who gets arrested for dealing LSD these days anyway? But there you have it, right? Detail of the murder of a federal judge and the Brothers Chakra and everything that. Including with it, including Charles Harrelson.
- [73:50]
Sean Williams
Easy for you to say. Yeah. That was nuts, man. That is maybe our longest episode of all time as well. So well done for that. I think it could be.
- [74:00]
Danny Gold
It's like an hour, hour 10.
- [74:02]
Sean Williams
It's not longer, is it? It's gonna be like 125, I think something like that. 120.
- [74:09]
Danny Gold
Get those, get those, get those. Watch minutes from Spotify. But yeah, guys, thank you for tuning in. Patreon.com podcast I might just do a bonus episode on the. On the Columbus Air Force because it's cool and we want to get more bonuses up. We've been getting more Patreons. Sean, you've got a bonus from Cyranami, right? Don't you have one coming up right now?
- [74:27]
Sean Williams
Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna do one on one of the kind of side characters in that episode as well. So we'll have that coming out soon. And we're gonna do more stuff like that, I think, aren't we, to see what we can do with the Patreon.
- [74:37]
Danny Gold
Yeah, we want to get it up there anyway. Subscribe Spotify, Patreon, itunes. Do it. Love you guys. Thanks for watching. Thanks for supporting.
- [74:47]
Sean Williams
Out over now. It. Sam. Sa.