Wes Ferguson (2:18)

At some point in the past 30 years, Moly, someone has snuck in or requested this case file, which anyone in the public can do because it's public information. But someone was reading through the file. And when no one was looking at the district clerk's office, they slid out those three pages. The most damning three pages in the entire case file. All are missing.

Carol Dawson (2:44)

Holy shit. Are you kidding me?

Wes Ferguson (2:48)

And the. The little clerks working there were really nice and very helpful and, you know, interested in what I was doing. And just the sweetest ladies and I, when I pointed out to them, they were just like, huh, well, that was before my time. You know, they just like. It just didn't. It didn't compute, you know, And I. So I think they went and asked the district clerk about it, and she also just kind of blew me off, from what I understand. So yesterday I wrote a letter to her and I sent copies to the district judge, the district attorney, and to Sheriff Bodhi Hillhouse saying, you know, this happened. This is tampering with public documents. This is very important. I'm asking you to track down this document and restore it to the public record and send me a copy. Hopefully that will light a fire under her to find that document because I'm sure with it being an active investigation, I'm sure that's still in, you know, the sheriff's office records or maybe the, you know, DA has a copy of it or something.

Carol Dawson (3:55)

Okay, I'm sorry. This absolutely blows my mind because it is just so corrupt. And that's an extension of all of these convolutions of corruption that have gone on around this case. I'm just stunned. That's the only word for it. And the other part of this is that you have to wonder who had the interest to go and do that, how recently that happened. I mean, if those ladies were saying it was before my time, it was before my time. Well, how much before your time was it, honey? And do you have. Do they have records of people who have come in and requested to look at those case files? I mean, there's some way to track down who this could have been?

Wes Ferguson (4:44)

No, I don't think they keep that record. They didn't ask me to sign any forms or anything. When I checked it out, they just gave it to me.

Carol Dawson (4:50)

It could have been anybody. It could have been anybody. This is just mind numbing. Who could have done this?

Wes Ferguson (4:58)

Well, you have to think, you know, who stood to lose by having that information out in the public for anyone to see.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (5:08)

My name is Wes Ferguson and I'm Carol Dawson. You're listening to the Unforgotten. Season one, the Labor Day Ghost. Chapter four, Nothing But Blood.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (5:26)

I was upset that I couldn't see the entire affidavit for the search of Jerry Mack's house when he was being investigated for Shelly's death. So much key information, public information, just gone. It hadn't been sealed by a judge either. Someone took it. The letter I sent to all the county officials did get their attention. A Deputy clerk asked around to see if anyone had the complete document. It turns out the copy of the affidavit in the District Attorney's case file was also missing those same three pages, which was really strange. That either means someone in the DA's office tampered with the file, or the affidavit was missing those three crucial pages before it ever landed in the DA's office. Who knows? And get this, the Sheriff's office said they didn't have the affidavit at all. Not a single page. Which was even weirder. You could run wild with conspiracy theories. We asked around, looking for answers.

Wes Ferguson (6:27)

No, I have no idea.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (6:29)

This is former Assistant District Attorney Mike Head.

Wes Ferguson (6:32)

There was not any sort of motion to seal or anything of that nature. Removing those from the file would be a felony.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (6:41)

Nor did it make sense for the Sheriff's office not to have the affidavit. It's at the heart of one of the county's most notorious unsolved cases. And it was written by their own investigator, Larry Warrick. He didn't know who removed the pages either.

Wes Ferguson (6:56)

Why would they do that?

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (6:58)

Well, good question.

Wes Ferguson (6:58)

Well, that's part of Duramax thing again.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (7:02)

Then I came up with a last ditch idea. I've been a reporter long enough to know that what often looks like a conspiracy or corruption from the outside is usually just government incompetence or indifference. The Sheriff's department probably had the file this whole time. They just couldn't be bothered to go look for it when their colleague at the District Clerk's office asked about it. So I did what I should have done from the get go. I put in a formal request using our state's Public Information act, which legally requires government officials to hand over documents to average citizens like me. I figured the county would fight me on this one. They'd say the affidavit was part of an active case and sharing it with me would compromise their investigation, even if the investigation had gone cold over the decades. Six days after I filed my request, I was back on the phone with Carol.

Carol Dawson (7:54)

Are you kidding?

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (7:56)

Yeah, they had it.

Carol Dawson (7:57)

Oh, my gosh. Was it at the sheriff's department?

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (8:02)

Yep. It's so funny. I mean, they told the deputy clerk that they didn't have it, but when I filed the request, I guess they were legally obligated to do the actual digging for it. And there it was. So we have all five pages.

Carol Dawson (8:16)

Fantastic.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (8:17)

Wes.

Carol Dawson (8:18)

Oh. Oh, and you've got a copy of it now?

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (8:20)

I do, yeah.

Carol Dawson (8:21)

Okay, Please shoot it to me.

Wes Ferguson (8:25)

Please.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (8:26)

No exaggeration. This was a huge break for us. The old news articles from the local newspapers in Corsicana and Athens were not always precise and they were written on tight deadlines which could result in errors. They often didn't give the names of witnesses either. Now we had those names. It also told us more about Shelley's last day at the lake when her sister in law said she seemed nervous and jittery. And it lays out Jerry Mack's alleged actions on the days after Shelley died. You know, it has a lot about the timeline about when Jerry was, you know, when he took the car to Dallas, when he told Lewis.

Carol Dawson (9:04)

What is, what does it say about.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (9:05)

When he told Lewis?

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (9:07)

So he told Lewis on September 9 that Shelley had walked away from their residence. He waited to report her missing. If you'll remember, Jerry Mack's friend Louis Palos, the Corsicana police sergeant, had told newspapers that Jerry Mack informed him of Shelley's disappearance on September 7, the very next day after she was last seen alive. But the affidavit said Jerry Mack actually didn't inform Lewis for another two days. An interesting discrepancy. Poker queen Carolyn Taylor also makes an appearance across the street from the Watkins residence. Carolyn was at home on September 6th and 7th that night with, they said she had several friends over for a party, but that's the poker game, of course. And, and she said at 12:30am she noticed that both of the Watkins vehicles were home in the driveway. Jerry's red Jeep and Shelly's white BMW. And the lights were on at their residence. And at 4am she noticed the cars were still in the driveway, lights still on in the house. And Carolyn said that it would have been obvious to Shelley that Carolyn was home and awake and at approximately 11:30 when Shelley left.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (10:23)

Yep.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (10:23)

So she's saying, like Shelly would have come over here if, if something was wrong. She didn't do that. So she wouldn't have just been stomping off into the woods or, or onto Interstate 45.

Carol Dawson (10:36)

I've always, I've also heard that, you.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (10:39)

Know, she would have gone next door to Carolyn, across the street to Stacy's house, because Stacy Johnson, she were very, very close.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (10:49)

So, yeah, most of this was stuff we already knew, but the affidavit confirmed it. The affidavit also brought up David Williams, the neighbor you heard in Chapter three. The investigator, Larry Warrick talked to David Williams. According to this affidavit, which is interesting because David told me that he had never spoken to him.

Wes Ferguson (11:09)

I don't know all the Details, I just know bits and pieces. I just was a neighbor.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (11:14)

But I kind of would assume that David just doesn't remember that from 30 years ago because his name's all over the affidavit. So Warwick has a taped statement from David Williams. Williams said that his wife got home at about 11pm that night. The lights at the Watkins house were off. Williams said he got up at 1.30am and again at 3.30am and noticed at both times the lights at the Watkins house were on. David indicated he thought Shelly and Jerry Watkins were fighting because of the late hour and the lights being on.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (11:49)

That's important. We have two neighbors, David Williams and Carolyn Taylor, who both noticed all the lights on, both inside and outside the Watkins house, long after Jerry Mack said that Shelley walked off and he went to bed.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (12:04)

And then. So then on September 8, which would have been, you know, two days later, David saw Jerry at the Watkins house and asked him about Shelley. And then that's when Jerry told David that he took Shelly's BMW to Dallas to have it cleaned and get new tires. William stated he felt this was odd because of Shelley's disappearance.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (12:27)

That it was literally the next day.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (12:29)

Yeah, that he.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (12:30)

That he whisked that car to Dallas, got new tires and got it detailed.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (12:36)

After being awake all night with the lights on. He told the same thing to his other neighbor, Robert Johnson, about taking the car to be cleaned. And Robert also thought this was strange since Shelly was missing.

Wes Ferguson (12:49)

Wow.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (12:50)

We have no way of knowing whether Shelley's BMW was ever driven onto the banks of the Trinity river where she was wrapped in plastic and thrown in the water. But let's think this through. If her BMW was driven across the bare ground near the water's edge, it probably would have left some dirt on her car. Shelly had relatively new tires. Her tires would have left tread marks on the ground. And these tread marks could be traced back to the BMW. These would all be good reasons to get a professional cleaning and four new tires. And remember that guy, John McCollum, from the last chapter? He claimed to see an expensive car on the Trinity river bridge at 4:30 the morning after Shelly was last seen. He also reported seeing an individual engaged in some unknown task on the bridge. He later identified this individual as Jerry Mack. Watkins, you have an eyewitness that picked.

Wes Ferguson (13:44)

A man out of a lineup that's parked on the bridge that crosses the.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (13:48)

Trinity river where her body was found. This is Larry Warrick again. That's pretty incriminating evidence if you ask me. We talked to the bridge witness John McCollum on the phone a couple of times. He was reluctant to share what he remembered.

Wes Ferguson (14:04)

I just wondered, you know, if we write a story, we put names to things, if they can't sue me for slander, you know, and it could always go back to trial, I don't know what the laws apply to that.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (14:18)

I got the sense that John felt like he was burned the last time he came forward.

Wes Ferguson (14:23)

They did release my name and everything, and that's true. They shouldn't have done so. I will say that our judicial system that was in place there was really corrupt all the way through, and that's why we're still where we're at.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (14:37)

After two short phone conversations with John, he stopped answering my calls and he wasn't home when I knocked on his door. I'll keep trying. But for now, as for what he saw that morning on the Trinity River Bridge, we can only go by the information provided in the affidavit, which we now have.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (14:56)

November 15th. Almost exactly two months to the day after Shelly Watkins body had been retrieved from the Trinity River, a special grand jury convened in the Athens Henderson County, Texas courthouse. They were there to decide whether anyone should be indicted for Shelly Watkins violent homicide. In the process, they would review all the evidence that had been gathered so far by Texas Ranger Ray Nutt and chief investigator Larry Warrick. Jerry Mack Watkins hired a famous Houston criminal defense attorney named Jack Zimmerman to represent him.

Wes Ferguson (15:32)

Jerry Mack. Yeah, I don't get lowered up real quick.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (15:36)

On November 30th of 1993, Larry Warwick finally signed a sworn affidavit naming Jerry Mack Watkins as the chief suspect in his wife's death and asking for a warrant to search the Watkins house and property. Amid Gerry Mack's alleged refusal to cooperate with investigators or allow them onto the property, it had taken nearly three whole months for Warrick to get the search warrant issued. Now, with the judge's authorization, Warrick and other members of the sheriff's department, Texas Ranger Ray Nutt and fellow Rangers and members of the District Attorney's office who were ready to enter the Watkins home, hoping their search would yield strong physical evidence tying Jerry Mack directly to the crime. Larry Warrick's affidavit states that during the nearly three months since Shelley's death, her husband, Jerry Mack and their two daughters had been staying at his sister Janice Watkins King's house, leaving his own house untended since the night of the murder. But there were several potential contradictions to the untended theory. One of them comes from a message left on a telephone answer machine.

Carol Dawson (16:56)

I understand from Sandy that you were about to go and visit her. Well, and that's what was the very haunting part for me, too.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (17:05)

This is Linda Dupuy, a friend Shelly had held dear since their kindergarten years together in Toledo, Ohio.

Carol Dawson (17:13)

It was two to three months before her death that almost like out of the blue, she contacted me. And we talked on the phone for like two, three hours and caught up on everything, laughed about things that happened when we were little. And I said, hey, why don't I try to see if I can come to Texas and visit you? So we're like, oh, that's great, you know, let me know when you make the arrangement.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (17:39)

For the past two months, Linda and Shelley had planned for Linda to come to Corsicana for a reunion. She already had her plane ticket booked. But when she tried to call Shelly before her trip, only the answer machine answered. Jerry Mack had already taken his two daughters and left the house empty. He did have someone else dropping in, though, someone who might have just been there to check on the house or to clean up and take care of any outstanding business, such as checking the answer machine for messages to Jerry Mack or Shelley.

Carol Dawson (18:13)

So then two weeks before, I thought, well, I better call her and tell her, you know, where to pick me up, what the flight is, and all that. So I called, didn't get an answer, and I left a voicemail. And the next day her brother in law called me and said, oh, she's been dead for two weeks. Oh my gosh. And I was, I was just. I was shocked. I just, I didn't. I don't think I really asked him too many questions because I was, I was in shock. It was like, my God, I just talked to her like a month ago. We made all these plans. I think I asked him, oh, my God, what happened? And I believe that he's the one that said, oh, she went out for a pack of cigarettes one night and never came home again. That's what he told you? That's what he told me. That's all that I had heard at that point. Oh, my word. Yeah, I'm sure you already know that that is actually not what happened. Yeah, I know that's not what happened at all.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (19:16)

Presumably, Ronnie Watkins had been over at his brother's house for security checks, answer machine updates, or whatever other cleanup or maintenance chores needed doing. So he was able to return Linda's call and let her know to cancel her trip plans. But another of those contradictions about the untended house was expressed by Former Assistant District Attorney Mike Head. On the same day the judge executed the search warrant of the Watkins house. Mike followed Texas Ranger Ray Nutt, investigator Larry Warrick and their search crews on the drive from Athens to the Watkins Corsicana residence. He had been asked to do so by his new boss, Henderson County District Attorney E. Ray Andrews.

Wes Ferguson (20:00)

I remember it being a high priority with Erath, you know, that they were going to do a thorough investigation, that they really were looking into it. I so long as an assistant DA on the execution of the search warrant. And that was unusual that we would actually send someone from the DA's office.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (20:26)

The search crew was determined to sift through every item and inch of the Watkins home for any link to her death. They took nine hours to do it, conducting a minute examination of everything in the house and garage. Unfortunately for most of the clues they'd have looked for, their search fell just too late.

Wes Ferguson (20:47)

Ray Nutt used what was called Luminol at the time to try to see if there was any evidence of blood in the garage or driveway. And my recollection is that he had had the concrete floor of the garage repainted and the driveway repaved as well.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (21:11)

Wow.

Wes Ferguson (21:13)

Which, you know, I guess if you have the resources to do that, it covers the trail pretty well.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (21:22)

Gary Cripps, Sandy's husband and Jerry Mack's brother in law, also says the Watkins family poured a slab of concrete inside a pole barn on some of their property up the street from Jerry Mack and Shelley's house not long after Shelly's death.

Wes Ferguson (21:37)

Abandoned that barn before was paved. We took a tour of his little farm, you know, the, the zoo that they had out there and it was a huge pole barn and they had little jeeps where they would take school kids, you know, by the dozens out there and, and do all of that. And it was a big barn, but it was still a dirt floor barn. That's where she was taken care of in a private place. I mean you're not sitting on the long the side of the road wrapping up a body and doing these things. You need some privacy to do that.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (22:09)

Gary is speculating about Shelley's body being wrapped and taped in the barn, but it is a theory shared by law enforcement. Investigators would not search the barn until later, after the home search. Jerry Mack's attorney, Jack Zimmerman, told the Athens Daily Review that Larry Warwick's affidavit was riddled with inaccuracies. He also said that the search of the Watkins home and Shelly's car had not turned up a shred of evidence. Zimmerman's assessment made for a splashy headline, but it wasn't quite accurate. Christy and Larry Warrick can comment on that even now, 30 years later.

Wes Ferguson (22:50)

And they searched the house and used luminoluminol on everything.

Carol Dawson (22:57)

I don't know what y' all found in the house. Do you remember what y' all found in the house?

Wes Ferguson (23:01)

Nothing but blood.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (23:02)

The return and inventory document that Larry Warrick swore to and filed with Navarro county after the search concluded states this list. Four samples of suspected blood. One sample from the front door handle and three taken from the garage floor of the Watkins residence. One towel located in a storage room inside the garage of the Watkins residence with suspected blood. But what did the luminal really reveal? Could its use help discover a physical link between Jerry Mack Watkins and his wife's death? And did any cleanup, such as bleach wiping, repainting, or soap scrubbing that might possibly have occurred anywhere after she died, make a difference as to whether or not such evidence could be used in court? Luminol can detect blood stains even when surfaces have been cleaned with bleach, as well as getting concealed by up to eight layers of water based or solvent based paint after getting bleach cleaned. Balluminol is a water based agent that can also dilute blood stains, especially blood that has already been diluted through a cleaning process and therefore can push the stain beyond the genetic marker analysis detection limits. This also makes it hard to identify exactly when the blood got spilled or how old it is.

Carol Dawson (24:34)

My name is Haley Spence and you are currently employed by the University of Texas at Austin Police Department. So, like Longhorns. Yeah, so I'm on the university campus crime scene evidence supervisor. Fantastic. Oh, that's wonderful. Thank you, Haley.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (24:54)

If you didn't quite follow that, I'm on the phone right now with Haley Spence. She's the crime scene evidence supervisor for the police department at the University of Texas at Austin. Haley uses a luminol based test substance called Blue Star to detect unseen blood.

Carol Dawson (25:14)

Well, this is what I want to ask you about. This case was being investigated in the late autumn of 1993 and they did use luminol to track down some blood stains. And at least three of the blood stains had already been painted over on a garage floor, but they were still able to detect them. And knowing what you know about previous use of luminol, could you tell me how much luminol could detect given any sort of cleanup or painting over or anything like that? Yeah. So you don't need a lot. Basically, you know, you spray it, and it will illuminate in, like, a bright blue color. And so one person is kind of spraying it, and then another person is taking the photo at the same time. But it being grade, because it doesn't stay kind of lit up is the best way to say that for very long. And so you want to capture the photo kind of as it's happening. And you know, that's for the use of blood that you can't see. So you wouldn't use luminol. If you can see blood that's only blood that's been cleaned up or you can't see it on the surface. It kind of shows you that, like, something's at least been cleaned up but still gives you some kind of data to go off of. But just maybe you won't get everything you need out of that stain.

Wes Ferguson (26:45)

Right.

Carol Dawson (26:46)

That is very interesting because as I said before, three of these blood stains were detected underneath a painted surface, and one was detected on the front door handle. So they would have been able to tell, for instance, on the door handle if bleach had been used to clean it up. No matter what. When you spray these types of chemicals on an area and it gives you a positive reaction, you're still going to swab that and send it to a DNA lab. You can't just confirm right then and there that that's blood until you send it off. So it's kind of just like a presumptive positive. So you're presuming that it's positive, that you don't have clarification yet, and that's what the lab does for you. I see. Okay. Well, what about luminol used on a painted surface that has blood underneath paint? Can it detect it? Very well. It should be able to detect blood.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (27:44)

The four samples of suspected blood found on the garage floor and front door handle of Shelly and Jerry Mack's home were seized for testing by the Texas Department of Public Safety forensic lab. None of the old news accounts we've read ever stated whether the samples turned out to be blood or were not blood or the tests were inconclusive. Larry Warrick says the investigators found blood on the Watkins property. But several months after the search, Jerry Mack's attorney, Jack Zimmerman, filed a motion claiming just the opposite. The samples were tested, and he said they were not blood. It seemed that the evidence obtained so far would have to remain under the classification of circumstantial, with the exception, of course, of John McCallum, the witness who claimed he had seen Jerry Mack Watkins on the Highway 85 bridge crossing the Trinity river, engaged in some kind of activity next to an expensive parked car at 4:30 in the morning, about five hours after Shelley was last seen alive. There was just one problem.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (28:54)

Do you remember your impression of him and his credibility?

Wes Ferguson (28:59)

The story he told was probably the strongest link we had.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (29:06)

This is Mike Head once again because.

Wes Ferguson (29:10)

As I recall, and again, this has been close to 30 years ago, but that Watkins had a. I believe it was a white BMW and this guy was coming back. I believe he had gotten off work and like worked a night shift and was coming from west to east on that road, came around the corner and saw what appeared to be a white BMW with the trunk open and saw someone getting what looked like a bundle out of the trunk. He didn't, didn't stop, didn't really think anything out of the ordinary enough to make any sort of report or do anything that was contemporaneous as far as notes or anything like that. I think the big issue was where he came around the corner. It was a long distance to where the bridge was. And there were questions about could he have really identified Watkins. But I mean, he was certainly someone we intended to use at trial. I don't remember him having any sort of convictions or conflicts or anything that would have made him particularly impeachable as a witness. It was really just more a matter of recollection and you know, why it would have stood out in his mind that he would have really noticed a white BMW and that sort of thing just without having some other information to make it interesting to him at the time, if that makes sense.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (30:50)

Yeah.

Wes Ferguson (30:51)

And he.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (30:51)

But he picked Watkins out of a lineup too, right?

Wes Ferguson (30:55)

I believe he did. I believe that's true.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (30:58)

Sensing weakness, Zimmerman attacked McCollum's credibility during the grand jury hearings. He also filed an affidavit in motion claiming that McCollum had given contradictory statements, although he didn't say what those contradictions were.

Wes Ferguson (31:15)

I don't remember it being so much an issue of law enforcement not believing him as much as we just felt like he was really going to get picked apart by the defense lawyers and we needed other things to try to tie it together. But he was, in my opinion, probably the strongest thing we had, other than just circumstantial stuff.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (31:44)

Mike had a lot of respect for Jerry Mack's choice of counsel. Jack B. Zimmerman. A lot of people around Texas recognized Zimmerman for the big cowboy hat he always wore, but he was just as well known for his legal prowess. Not much later, Zimmerman would enter the national spotlight as one of the negotiators for the Branch Davidians during the notorious FBI siege in Waco.

Wes Ferguson (32:06)

Zimmerman's a very good lawyer. I've known him for years. He's very honest, ethical, hard, charging, aggressive lawyer.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (32:16)

Although Zimmerman declined our request for an interview, he was on an interview show called the Killer Cross Examination Podcast a couple of years ago.

Wes Ferguson (32:24)

My guest is none other than legendary trial lawyer, criminal defense lawyer, and American hero Jack Zimmerman. What I. What I try to do on cross examination is be totally prepared as to any statement that person has given, any statement that somebody else is that, you know, is contradictory to that state, to.

Carol Dawson (32:48)

What their testimony is going to be, and try to lock them in to.

Wes Ferguson (32:52)

Taking a position that, you know, you can attack later on successfully.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (32:57)

That's exactly what Zimmerman tried to do for his client, Jerry Mack Watkins, while questioning Texas Ranger Ray Nutt. He got Nutt to admit that, yeah, he had some reservations about the credibility of John McCollum's testimony. Claiming to have seen Jerry Mack on the Trinity River Bridge the morning after Shelly vanished, Investigator Larry Warrick also admitted that McCollum's story seemed just a little too good to be true. With fresh doubts raised about John McCollum's testimony, Jack Zimmerman declared there was no real evidence tying Jerry Mack to his wife's death. He was truly an innocent man. Zimmerman also said the suspected blood spots found in the garage and at the front door were just insect debris. And what about the four new tires for the BMW and having all the soft linings completely replaced in the car trunk? Zimmerman said Jerry Mack was only trying to please his wife and smooth their relationship when she got back. If Jerry Mack had wanted to hide the work done to Shelly's car, Zimmerman added, he wouldn't have paid for the transactions with his own check and credit card.

Wes Ferguson (34:06)

So there's a conflict. You're creating a conflict. And then the jury decides which version is true.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (34:14)

On December 20, 1993, five days after his 40th birthday and three days after Shelley's 36th birthday, the grand jury reconvened and brought an indictment against Jerry Mack Watkins for his wife's murder. He surrendered in Athens the next day, December 21st. There, he was formally arrested and then was released on a $75,000 bond. Two men stood surety for the bond's amount. One was Ronnie Watkins, Jerry Mack's older brother. The other was Jerry Mack's close friend and civil attorney, Glenn Sod of Dawson, Sod, Moe and Means, the law office housing the Watkins families and business lawyers in Corsicana, Texas, my own father's law firm. In April of 1994, Jerry Mack Watkins sat through his pretrial hearing in Athens, Texas. At that time, the judge, Jack Holland, set his trial date for Aug. 15. Late in the summer, less than 11 months after Shelley vanished into the night from the home she shared with Jerry Mack and her daughters and one month short of the date when her body was recovered from the Trinity River, Levine.

Wes Ferguson (35:35)

And Zimmerman were pushing for a speedy trial. Our thought process was they wanted it tried quickly because they were concerned that something else might come up, that the longer the investigation went on that there might be some other witness pop up or some other information. And so they were hoping they could get a not guilty verdict in a jeopardy bar in case anything else ever came up.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (35:58)

As the date for the trial approached, it began to grow more and more clear that some people considered Jerry Mack Watkins upcoming moment in court would have a highly possible outcome, one that the defense would not like. Facing off against prosecutors E. Ray Andrews, Mike Head and the other assistant district attorney in Andrews office, Donna Little these days, Donna little, Bennett When E. Ray.

Wes Ferguson (36:25)

Was not drinking, he was a very good lawyer. I think if, if E. Ray and Donna and I would have tried the case, I think there was a better than 50, 50 chance of getting a conviction.

Various Interviewees (e.g., Mike Head, Haley Spence, Gary Cripps) (36:38)

And then came another twist of events, one so publicly unexpected and so wild that no one outside of the most important players could have predicted it. That's next time on the Unforgotten.

Wes Ferguson (36:58)

Sam.

Narrator/Reporter (likely Wes Ferguson) (37:24)

Thank you for listening to the Unforgotten. Get updates, photos, case files and more when you sign up for our newsletter@unforgottenpod.com the Unforgotten is a free range production. Season 1 the Labor Day Ghost is created, written and hosted by Carol Dawson and me, Wes Ferguson. I'm the executive producer here at Free Range Audio recording, editing and mixing by Austin Sisler at Eastside Studios in Austin, Texas. Scored by Austin Sisler and Jamie Cummins. Our theme song ghost is written and performed by Corsicana's own Will Mechatron Jones. If you support our efforts to shine a new light on Shelly Watkins cold Case, please like subscribe, give us a review and tell your friends. Thanks again and see you soon.