5. The Shank

Summary

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The Unforgotten – Season 4: Kill Site

Episode 5: The Shank

Date: January 12, 2026
Host: Wes Ferguson
Guest: Charlie Scudder (Reporter, Dallas Morning News)

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Episode Overview

In this gripping episode, Wes Ferguson and investigative reporter Charlie Scudder examine the troubled personal history of Christopher Whiteley, whose mysterious death outside the small town of Laipan, Texas was officially ruled a mountain-lion attack despite serious doubts and evidence to the contrary. Rather than supernatural explanations, the hosts argue for a more human—and far more disturbing—source of the violence that claimed Christopher’s life. Through examining Christopher’s criminal record, turbulent relationships, and the rumors surrounding his death, the episode explores how law enforcement’s perception of Christopher as a “junkie” and “criminal” likely shaped the handling of his case—and left crucial questions unanswered.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Rumors and Legends Surrounding Christopher’s Death

• The episode begins by acknowledging widespread rumors, including a popular YouTube video theorizing Christopher’s death was caused by a werewolf ([00:01]):

  "These days, some of the legends of Christopher Whiteley's death outside Laipan are crazier than ever... nearly 400,000 people have watched a YouTube video exploring whether Christopher was the victim of a real, honest to goodness werewolf." — Wes Ferguson ([00:01])

• Scudder wryly notes how, by the facts, the werewolf theory almost makes more sense than the official story:

  "This is one of the wildest cases of a death where those who point to a werewolf actually have the strongest argument by the facts in the case." — Charlie Scudder ([00:42])

• Skepticism prevails, as both hosts push back on supernatural theories and focus on human violence as the more likely explanation.

The Impact of Christopher’s Troubled Past on the Investigation

• The hosts emphasize the importance of understanding Christopher's background to grasp why law enforcement may have been dismissive:

  “Both of Christopher's parents have blamed law enforcement for not bothering to really investigate Christopher's death because they just didn't care. In other words, what's the death of one more criminal? A junkie?” — Wes Ferguson ([02:33])

• Scudder uncovers Christopher’s juvenile criminal record, including early burglary charges at age 10 and more serious offenses as a teenager:

  “Christopher's juvenile record shows that he landed his first criminal charge, burglary of a building, when he was just 10 years old… by 15, he admitted to the abuse [indecency with a child].” — Wes Ferguson ([04:22]) “There's another charge… for aggravated sexual assault of a child.” — Charlie Scudder ([05:12])

• The episode notes the escalation and tragic downward spiral of Christopher’s life, including his and Tyler's battles with addiction, domestic violence, and the eventual removal of their two children by Child Protective Services (CPS).
• Speculation arises that the perception of Christopher as a violent repeat offender may have colored the seriousness with which his death was investigated.

Domestic Abuse, Child Welfare, and Trauma

• CPS reports and police records paint a harrowing scene of mutual violence, substance abuse, and neglect in Christopher and Tyler's home.

  "This affidavit… paints a really stark picture of a home that is full of violence, of abuse, and of drug and alcohol use… they declined to take the drug test." — Charlie Scudder ([06:07])

• Key incident highlighted:

  "Christopher hit Tyler in the back of the head with a pipe." — Wes Ferguson ([08:12])
  “It's reported that she's currently has bruising from domestic violence by Christopher Whiteley. Drugs and alcohol are involved. And this is a really interesting line to me. Christopher Whiteley has a history of incarceration. It is unclear, but Christopher Whiteley may have ties to the Aryan Brotherhood or Aryan Nation.” — Charlie Scudder ([08:23])

• Scudder and Ferguson address the gravity and consequences of these domestic abuse claims, and also clarify there is no real evidence tying Christopher to white supremacist gangs.

The Crime That Landed Christopher in Prison: The Shank

• A detailed recounting of the violent assault in June 2015 for which Christopher was imprisoned:

  “Whiteley called 911 and told them that Tyler had cut herself doing dishes… Tyler told both medical staff and the police that Christopher had stabbed her… He had made a shank out of a tree trimmer and an x acto knife and slashed her on her right wrist.” — Charlie Scudder ([13:05])

• The weapon itself was strange and improvisational, underscoring the kind of escalating violence present throughout Christopher’s history.
• After this incident, both Christopher and Tyler voluntarily terminated their parental rights ([15:26]).

Contextualizing the Victim’s Troubled Past

• Ferguson and Scudder wrestle with the ethics of presenting Christopher’s criminal history—not to vilify the victim, but to understand systemic failures:

  "It's not our intent to just… blame the victim, run him through the mud. But why do you think that it is relevant… how they possibly approached this investigation of his death?" — Wes Ferguson ([16:05]) “If the attitude was, oh, it’s just another drug user, we don’t need to worry about, why should we spend the resources on this investigation for someone like that? And that’s a problem. That’s a miscarriage of justice." — Charlie Scudder ([16:49])

• They observe that small-town law enforcement may plausibly neglect thorough investigations in cases involving marginalized or troubled individuals.

The Scene of the Crime: Small Town Suspicion

• Charlie recounts his own tense visit to Laipan, where he and a photographer felt watched and intimidated by locals:

  "We stuck out like a sore thumb… then we noticed the car was coming back and the bed was full of men… they followed us back onto the main highway… and they stop, do a three point turn, and go back into town." — Charlie Scudder ([21:56])

• This encounter heightens the sense of secrecy, suspicion, and possible danger permeating the case.

Tyler’s Perspective and Unanswered Questions

• Charlie attempted multiple times to contact Tyler Messina (Christopher’s girlfriend at the time of his death), but only ever managed brief, fraught text exchanges:

  ‘She said, eh, Is anyone really okay after they lose the love of their life? The father of my children and my high school sweetheart. Lol. I'm trying to be. At least it is what it is, I guess. When he left a whole part of me left too. I still can't sleep for shit…’ — Tyler Messina via Charlie Scudder ([26:15])

• Their relationship was tumultuous and violent, but Tyler’s subsequent grief and trauma are acknowledged.
• Tyler’s behavior on the day Christopher disappeared remains suspicious and murky:

  “When Christopher's mom texted her asking if she'd seen Christopher, Tyler said they were napping together. But Christopher had been gone for hours. … Chris says, hold on, I gotta go deal with these people, and hangs up. You know, it's like, what was that noise? Who were those people?” — Wes Ferguson ([28:42])

• The reluctance of key figures to talk only deepens the mystery.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On supernatural rumors:
  “I know a lot of people really like talking about werewolves and Bigfoot or whatever, but that's never really been my thing. I just don't buy it.” — Wes Ferguson ([01:11])

• On investigating Christopher’s life:
  “There's a person there that we didn't know. And it was important for me, it's important for journalists to understand a little bit more about who this person was beyond the circumstances of their death.” — Charlie Scudder ([03:10])

• On violence and law enforcement neglect:
  “If this was a known property to the sheriff's office… oh, it's just another drug user, we don't need to worry about… that's a problem. That's a miscarriage of justice.” — Charlie Scudder ([16:49])

• On the case’s significance:
  “This is such an important accountability story as well. If this could happen to someone like this, who's to say it couldn't happen to somebody else?” — Charlie Scudder ([18:12])

• On intimidation in Laipan:
  “We got in the car and left, and they followed us back onto the main highway… I think that was time to gtfo.” — Charlie Scudder ([22:17])

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Important Timestamps

• [00:01] – Opening: rumors and theories about Christopher’s death (werewolves, cover-ups)
• [04:22] – Christopher’s juvenile record and escalation of criminal activity
• [06:07] – CPS intervention: documenting violence and neglect
• [08:12] – Allegations of domestic abuse and hints of gang connections
• [13:05] – The "shank" assault: description of the crime that led to prison
• [16:49] – Discussion of law enforcement indifference and its consequences
• [21:56] – Scudder’s unnerving visit to Laipan, local hostility
• [25:24] – Text message exchanges with Tyler Messina
• [28:42] – Unanswered questions about Christopher’s final day

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Tone & Style

The tone throughout is investigative, empathetic, and unflinchingly honest. Both Ferguson and Scudder strive to give context to Christopher’s troubled life without sensationalizing it, balancing compassion for a victim whose violent past shaped but did not justify the indifferent investigation into his death. There is an undercurrent of frustration at systemic failures—inadequate policing, child welfare shortcomings, the cycles of addiction and violence—which tempers the more chilling, mysterious aspects of the case.

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Summary Takeaway

Episode 5, "The Shank," does not offer easy answers. Instead, it pulls back the curtain on a life marked by generational violence and addiction, and forces listeners to confront the uncomfortable question of how social stigma and institutional bias can render some deaths all too easily forgotten. The official story doesn’t add up—but neither do the rumors. As Wes prepares to make his own trip to Laipan, the path toward truth remains shadowed by fear, silence, and the human cost of neglect.

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Transcript

[Wes Ferguson]

Just a heads up, this episode contains references to domestic abuse and child abuse. Please listen with care. You know how anytime there is a strange and unexplained death out in the woods, especially outside a small town, it starts with all these rumors. And the rumors quickly grow into legend. These days, some of the legends of Christopher Whiteley's death outside Laipan are crazier than ever. Just to name one example, nearly 400,000 people have watched a YouTube video exploring whether Christopher was the victim of a real, honest to goodness werewolf.

[Charlie Scudder]

This is one of the wildest cases of a death where those who point to a werewolf actually have the strongest argument by the facts in the case.

[Wes Ferguson]

And remember how the medical examiner bleached Christopher's body, destroying any DNA evidence of the killer? Talk about a cover up.

[Charlie Scudder]

That's also why they destroyed the DNA on the body and destroyed the DNA on the genes is because they had found something that isn't supposed to exist.

[Wes Ferguson]

I know a lot of people really like talking about werewolves and Bigfoot or whatever, but that's never really been my thing. I just don't buy it. Remember what Christopher's dad said he heard voices and a commotion inside the house on the morning Christopher was last seen. And then there's Christopher's friend Paulie, who told authorities that people had been threatening him. Christopher's own girlfriend Tyler said Christopher had enemies all over the place.

[Charlie Scudder]

He always has had enemies. I mean, everywhere. But this just. This doesn't make sense.

[Wes Ferguson]

If a mountain lion didn't kill Christopher and we don't believe in werewolves, why not another creature that's extremely prone to violence? Why not another human being? From Free Range Productions, in association with the Dallas Morning News, this is season four of the Unforgotten Killsite. I'm your host, Wes Ferguson, and this is episode five, the Shank. Here's something I've been wrestling with. How much of Christopher Whiteley's background do we need to get into what's relevant to his story and what's not? Both of Christopher's parents have blamed law enforcement for not bothering to really investigate Christopher's death because they just didn't care. In other words, what's the death of one more criminal? A junkie? I don't know if his parents argument is true or not, but if we're going to take their claims seriously, we kind of need to know what Christopher did that supposedly made law enforcement so indifferent to his death. Because Christopher Whiteley's public record paints a portrait of a life stalked by violence almost from the Beginning.

[Charlie Scudder]

The first thing we do is basically run a background check on anybody we're writing about, positive, negative or otherwise.

[Wes Ferguson]

This is reporter Charlie Scudder.

[Charlie Scudder]

Again, you know, the kind of salacious details about the death itself are one thing, but there's a person there, right? There's a person there that we didn't know. And it was important for me, it's important for journalists to understand a little bit more about who this person was beyond the circumstances of their death. So that's where we started, is just a general background check on anything we could find. And pretty quickly, we found quite a bit.

[Wes Ferguson]

During the course of Charlie's reporting for the Dallas Morning News, he actually came across Christopher's juvenile record, which is usually kept sealed.

[Charlie Scudder]

If you are sent to juvie, to juvenile correctional facility, those records are not public. Right. You're a minor. I wouldn't know anything that happened to Christopher before he turned 18. This document, because it lists everything, includes that past, and that's really telling, that it shows not just his adult life, but that his criminal life started from a very young age.

[Wes Ferguson]

Christopher's juvenile record shows that he landed his first criminal charge, burglary of a building, when he was just 10 years old. That's also how old he was when he started smoking marijuana. Two years later, Christopher was arrested for criminal mischief and he was put on probation.

[Charlie Scudder]

The next year he had three charges. So he was in and out of juvenile probation. Then in 2007, he is accused of indecency with a child sexual contact.

[Wes Ferguson]

We're not going to get into the specifics of the indecency charge. During my one phone call with Kimberly, she said the charge was taken out of context and Christopher didn't do anything wrong. But the records show that Christopher admitted.

[Charlie Scudder]

To the abuse, so he was sent to Jumie for it.

[Wes Ferguson]

And how old was he at that time?

[Charlie Scudder]

He would have been 15 years old. There's another charge here from later that year for aggravated sexual assault of a child.

[Wes Ferguson]

God, that's awful. And Kimberly brought that up and indicated to me that it was some kind of trumped up charge.

[Charlie Scudder]

But again, according to this document, he admitted to it.

[Wes Ferguson]

Is his juvenile criminal history relevant to the story?

[Charlie Scudder]

I think it paints a particular picture of Christopher as. Especially as it continues to escalate. Right. We start with burglary of a building, but he keeps getting sent to probation. It escalates. It paints a violent picture.

[Wes Ferguson]

Charlie found all these records in a report filed in 2015 by a caseworker who was seeking the emergency removal of the two Children that Christopher had with his girlfriend Tyler.

[Charlie Scudder]

This affidavit, which again, is trying to prove that it's an unsafe home, paints a really stark picture of a home that is full of violence, of abuse, and of drug and alcohol use. When the caseworker went to go interview Christopher, the notes say that Christopher mumbled most of his words. He was off topic throughout the interview. He talked about the sexual abuse charges against him. He said that there are registered sex offenders and history of mental illness in his family and that he is diagnosed with explosive depression disorder and anxiety. That he was taking two different medications for it but was off his meds. That he had run out and was off his meds. Went on to say Whiteley stated he recently got really drunk off a whole bottle of whipped cream vodka and, quote, took an ax to his house. He said that Tyler had left with the children when he had started getting violent because they were in the house at the time. At one point, Tyler and Christopher are both asked to take a drug test by this caseworker. And they ask, if I'm around people who use methamphetamines, will it show up? And the caseworker says, no, it won't show up if you were just around them, but if you used it, it will. And they declined to take the drug test.

[Wes Ferguson]

Wow.

[Charlie Scudder]

It lays out multiple different incidents where Christopher and Tyler are violent toward each other, toward other family members. It says specifically, there's no signs of direct violence against the children necessarily, but that they are dirty, they're wearing old diapers, they're around this environment that's, again, full of smoke and. And violence.

[Wes Ferguson]

I mean, and they're still teenage parents, right?

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah, Tyler's about a year younger, but, yeah, they're at most 20, 21, 22.

[Wes Ferguson]

Now, this isn't the most upsetting detail in the report, but it's up there. It's the allegation that Christopher hit Tyler in the back of the head with a pipe.

[Charlie Scudder]

It's reported that she's currently has bruising from domestic violence by Christopher Whiteley. Drugs and alcohol are involved. And this is a really interesting line to me. Christopher Whiteley has a history of incarceration. It is unclear, but Christopher Whiteley may have ties to the Aryan Brotherhood or Aryan Nation.

[Wes Ferguson]

The Aryan brotherhood is a neo Nazi prison gang and organized criminal syndicate. Christopher's family adamantly denies that he ever had anything to do with them. And there's not any real evidence in the public record that ties Christopher to the gang.

[Charlie Scudder]

And I remember when I saw that, I. I Kind of had to put it down for a second because it seemed like such a. It's a very serious claim.

[Wes Ferguson]

Right, right.

[Charlie Scudder]

If you know anything about the Aryan Brotherhood, it's not something you accuse someone of. Likely this isn't an official state document.

[Wes Ferguson]

But it was kind of like vague. You said it was just like, we've heard that.

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah. All it says is, it is unclear, but Christopher Whiteley may have ties to the Aryan Brotherhood or Aryan Nation.

[Wes Ferguson]

Did you ask anybody that knew Christopher like his mom or anybody else whether they that claim had any validity?

[Charlie Scudder]

I believe I asked his mom and she said it was total crap. I also made sure to check based on the medical examiner's documents, the police reports, and the photographs of Christopher's body. Another big piece is gang tattoos. I didn't see any. None were noted that were particularly that way.

[Wes Ferguson]

Just to make that really clear, Christopher did not have any gang tattoos. So Christopher and Tyler refused to get treatment for their drug abuse. And so the children were removed by court order, right?

[Charlie Scudder]

Yes. That's basically what this document did. They tried to get Christopher and Tyler into treatment. They called treatment centers, got him a spot, he refused to go, and then Tyler refused to go. It ultimately came to a head basically, when Tyler and Christopher made it clear that they were not going to seek treatment after CPS did everything they could to grease the wheels.

[Wes Ferguson]

God, I mean, that's in the throes of addiction. It's really, really sad.

[Charlie Scudder]

It is. It's really sad. And it's clear. Everything in his life, in Tyler's life at this moment was consumed by drunk's alcohol.

[Wes Ferguson]

So they lose their. Their two young children, their boy and the girl, and then, yeah, I guess not terribly long after that is when Christopher gets arrested again.

[Charlie Scudder]

Right. Children were taken away. This affidavit was signed in September of 2014. By June of the next year is when Christopher was arrested and ultimately sent to prison.

[Wes Ferguson]

What did he do?

[Charlie Scudder]

So this is kind of a tale.

[Wes Ferguson]

Okay. After the break, the shocking crime that finally lands Christopher in prison. So I thought I was placing an order for myself to get a gorgeous and soft crew neck sweater from Quince.

[Charlie Scudder]

And what actually happened was that I got a beautiful wool sweater from Quints.

[Wes Ferguson]

Yeah, that thing migrated from my side of the closet to my wife's very quickly.

[Charlie Scudder]

And I don't think you're going to see it again. Oh, gosh.

[Wes Ferguson]

Starting the year with a wardrobe refresh. Quince has you covered with luxe essentials that feel effortless and look polished. They're perfect for Layering, mixing, and building a wardrobe that lasts. Their versatile styles make it easy to reach for them day after day, unless your wife steals them from you.

[Charlie Scudder]

Guilty.

[Wes Ferguson]

Refresh your wardrobe with quints. Don't wait. Go to quints.com unforgotten for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada, too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com unforgotten to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Qu.com unforgotten so much of Christopher's life was defined by violence. Not the kind of violence that comes from a predator in the woods, but the human kind, the kind that leaves scars that don't show up on an autopsy report. And if we're going to find out what really happened to him, we need to understand that. Here's Charlie again.

[Charlie Scudder]

On June 4th of 2015, Christopher Whiteley and Tyler Messina were living in a small home they were renting in Dublin, Texas, which is a small town. And that day, Whiteley called 911 and told them that Tyler had cut herself doing dishes and to send an ambulance, they took her to the hospital. While they were there, doctors called police, had them come talk to Tyler. Tyler told both medical staff and the police that Christopher had stabbed her and had abused her before. Her aunt told police that Christopher came to pick her up and told the police at that time that Christopher had tied her up in the bathroom for days without food or water. When they talked to Tyler, they said that she said that she had been beat with electrical cords and poked with knives in the past. And she said that in this particular assault, Christopher had made a shank out of a tree trimmer and an x acto knife and slashed her on her right wrist.

[Wes Ferguson]

I have a hard time visualizing that. Tapes up the x acto knife to the end of the tree trimmer.

[Charlie Scudder]

I have trouble as well, understanding that it's described as there was a tree trimming device and an x acto knife that was used in the assault. Officers discovered the tree trimming device that had been taken apart in the center and could be used as a shank. And then they found the x acto knife with blood on it. So I don't. I'm. I can't quite picture it myself. But it's again, like, I can't picture that. Yeah, I can't picture what drives someone to do that. But also like the thing itself, the weapon itself. And, yeah, it's, again, this becomes a tipping point where before, especially in the affidavit from CPS Tyler mentioned some of this violence, some of this abuse, but is kind of, oh, it's nothing. I fell on this time. I. Whatever happened, kind of downplaying it. This is a moment where she's telling police and medical staff the extent of the abuse, and it's. It's tough.

[Wes Ferguson]

And this is what sends him to prison.

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah. So he was charged with aggravated assault, deadly weapon. He pled guilty and was sentenced to five years in prison and about $2,000 in fines and fees. After Christopher was arrested, after he pled guilty, both he and Tyler signed documents with the court to voluntarily terminate their parental rights. So the children have been taken away, Christopher has been sent to prison, and both parents voluntarily sign these documents to hand over custody to the state of Texas.

[Wes Ferguson]

When I talked to his mom, Kimberly, and maybe to his sister also, you know, said, it's not my intention to just drag his name through the mud again. I know that it was really. It hurt for Christopher's loved ones to read your stories where you're just laying out the facts. You know, he was accused of this, he was convicted of that. He lost the children. He had this, you know, long history of. Of drug abuse. I feel like it's important to say that it's not our intent to just, you know, blame the victim, run him through the mud. But why do you think that it is relevant and specifically in context of the local law enforcement knew about Christopher and how they possibly approached this investigation of his death?

[Charlie Scudder]

I really thought about that a lot, and I'm glad you asked, because I knew it would be something difficult for the family. And we do have, you know, culturals that don't speak ill of the dead. And I don't think that's what we're doing here necessarily. What we're trying to do is understand what led Christopher to that moment in that trailer and how he ended up there. Right. I think the fact that he had gotten clean in prison and was starting a new life is relevant. It also becomes extremely relevant when this is certainly something that Christopher's family has brought up. The idea that if this was a known property to the sheriff's office, if this was a known individual or group of individuals that, you know, to put it bluntly, if the attitude was, oh, it's just another drug user, we don't need to worry about, why should we spend the resources on this investigation for someone like that? And that's a problem. That's a miscarriage of justice.

[Wes Ferguson]

If that's the case from what you know about small town law enforcement in Texas, I mean, is that even plausible that law enforcement might have that mentality?

[Charlie Scudder]

I think it's plausible. It's really difficult to, you know, to understand what someone's thinking in a given moment. Right. And even if they tell you, you don't know if they. That's really what they think or believe. So I don't think we'll ever really know exactly why this was given such little scrutiny. What we do know is that it was given very little scrutiny. I also think that this is such an important accountability story as well. If this could happen to someone like this, who's to say it couldn't happen to somebody else?

[Wes Ferguson]

Right, right.

[Charlie Scudder]

And who's to say if you, you know, get in an argument with the sheriff, they're not going to pay it as much attention if you die, if that's the way that these investigations are being treated. He, you know, was adjudicated through the courts and more importantly, through a lot of this. He was in the throes of addiction, that kind of all consuming, you know, devil on your shoulder. And I'm not excusing it. I'm not excusing domestic abuse. I'm not excusing any of his actions. But again, you have to have them in context for what he did. He should have been convicted and he was, and he was sent to prison and he served a sentence and he got out. And that doesn't mean that he gets.

[Wes Ferguson]

To get killed, you know, with so much violence in his past and into these explosive, violent episodes. You know, we don't know what happened on the morning that he was last seen at that house, but it could make sense that he could have been involved in some kind of severe violence with whoever else was there that day that we don't know about.

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah, that's. Again, I'm not a cop, but, you know, I've read enough Sherlock Holmes in Washington CSI to know. Okay, you've got this past. At least look into it.

[Wes Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Charlie Scudder]

You know, especially when you have scientists saying that your leading theory is physically impossible. Again, I think when I mentioned that shank. Right. The X acto knife and tree trimming thing, that also was interesting to me because, you know, again, I don't know what made that wound on Christopher's neck, but it's not a common tool. Right. So the fact that there's this violent history with unusual weapons also rose an eyebrow for me. The idea that there's this makeshift shank. And then again, you know, you look at the photos and it's. It left such a strange mark, which is also something our brotherhood does. No.

[Wes Ferguson]

Is it really?

[Charlie Scudder]

Well, yeah. Part of their kind of notoriousness is the gruesome lengths they go to when they do kill somebody. Which is part of why, you know, we were really cautious about going out to laipan.

[Wes Ferguson]

You didn't want to get shanked by a tree trimmer.

[Charlie Scudder]

I didn't want to get shanked by a tree trimmer or strand up.

[Wes Ferguson]

After the break, Charlie starts poking his nose around Lai Pan, the little town where Christopher was killed, and things get really weird. During his reporting, Charlie drove out to Lai Pan with a photographer from the Dallas morning News.

[Charlie Scudder]

We stuck out like a sore thumb real bad when we were driving around taking pictures of stuff when it's not easy to be incognito. We drove out to the property where Christopher died. We didn't go onto the property. We didn't have permission to go onto the property, so we did not. But we parked by the creek.

[Wes Ferguson]

Remember, that dry creek was in the woods next to the house where Christopher had been staying with his girlfriend, Tyler.

[Charlie Scudder]

Christopher's body was found on the other side of the creek. So this creek is somewhere where large mammals might, you know, hunt or hang out. So it was an important place that the officials looked for things like trail or scat or whatever. So we went down to that creek. And I remember it was. I think it was springtime, but it was like an unseasonably hot day. And it was so still, it was a little freaky, like just there weren't any bugs. You know, normally you hear some bugs or crickets or something. There was no noise. It was just still and quiet, and the water was barely moving. And it just kind of gave me the heebie jeebies. And so me and the photographer, we got what we needed. And as we were driving around, we started noticing the same pickup drive back and forth past us. And we continued poking around, taking pictures. And again, in public property, we weren't hiding who we were. We had badges on the whole thing. But then we noticed the car was coming back and the bed was full of men. What, the bed of the truck? Yeah, it was full of men. And they were coming toward us with what looked like a cop car behind them. And so we got in the car and left, and they followed us back onto the main highway all the way out. And we passed the welcome to Lai Pan sign. And they stop, do a three point turn, and go back into town.

[Wes Ferguson]

God, that's like something out of a b Movie.

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah, right, exactly. The first or second pass, I was like, okay, they're trying to see what we're up to. But then when we saw them coming with backup, it was like, all right, time to gtfo.

[Wes Ferguson]

Yeah.

[Charlie Scudder]

So that's. We did not go back after that.

[Wes Ferguson]

To my knowledge, Lipan doesn't really have a reputation as a sketchy place. But what I'd heard about Christopher's last days, the way the sheriff's office seemed to sweep his death under the rug, and Charlie's own story about his visit to Lai Pan had me feeling kind of intimidated. But I also knew that I could only find out so much by reading documents and making phone calls, especially when almost nobody would talk to me. I had to put boots on the ground, knock on some doors, and see what I could shake loose. I also needed to do everything I could to let Tyler share her side of the story. Charlie had tried too, and he had actually exchanged some messages with her.

[Charlie Scudder]

I never was able to get her on the phone, but we did text back and forth quite a bit.

[Wes Ferguson]

What did y' all text about?

[Charlie Scudder]

So at the beginning, I was just trying to get to know her, right. Like she was an important character in the story. I wanted to know what her memories of Christopher were. She was with him that night, so I wanted to know what she remembered that night, those kinds of things. Wanted to set up a time to call. She would say, sure, that time sounds great. Then I would call and she wouldn't answer. Or then she would call and I would miss the call. That kind of thing. But it would be at weird times, like 2 o' clock in the afternoon. I would say, hey, when would this be a good time? And she would say, well, I just woke up, so how about in a couple hours? And I would call in a couple hours and nothing. That kind of thing. She lost my number at some point or forgot who I was. I had to reintroduce myself. Should I just read part of this?

[Wes Ferguson]

Yeah, sure.

[Charlie Scudder]

Okay. So I said, this is Charlie Scudder with the Dallas Morning News. I'm working on a story about Christopher. She said, hey, sorry, been really rough on me here lately. I said, there's no need to apologize. I'm sorry to hear that, though. Are you okay? I was worried about her at that point. She said, eh, Is anyone really okay after they lose the love of their life? The father of my children and my high school sweetheart. Lol. I'm trying to be. At least it is what it is, I guess. When he left a whole part of me left too. I still can't sleep for shit. And I say, cooped up in my room 24 7. And I told her that was part of what I wanted to hear about. I wanted to hear about how difficult it had been for her in these months since. And asked if we could catch up the next day because it was late in the evening at that point. And she said, yeah, very much so. And then never heard back from her.

[Wes Ferguson]

I assumed you tried, and she just didn't. She stopped responding.

[Charlie Scudder]

Yes.

[Wes Ferguson]

What's your takeaway from all that?

[Charlie Scudder]

They had a raucous relationship. They had a.

[Wes Ferguson]

Very.

[Charlie Scudder]

Frankly, they had a very violent relationship.

[Wes Ferguson]

And.

[Charlie Scudder]

And I don't know. I know that in relationships with abuse, there can still be a deep feeling of love. And I think that's what she's expressing there. It's another one of those things that this case just surprises you, no matter which way you look at it. And it's one of those where it's impossible that everyone I spoke to is telling the truth.

[Wes Ferguson]

Did it seem sincere to you?

[Charlie Scudder]

It seemed sincere. It seemed like she was clearly going through something very, very difficult. It certainly felt like she was struggling with something emotionally, mentally, you know, with substance. I don't know. I don't. I just don't know.

[Wes Ferguson]

Gosh, we've talked so much about Christopher being the victim, and obviously he was, but what about Tyler in all this? She had been through so much both when Christopher was still alive and then when he died at the same time. Her behavior on the day that Christopher disappeared still just didn't add up. When Christopher's mom texted her asking if she'd seen Christopher, Tyler said they were napping together. But Christopher had been gone for hours. Christopher on his last morning, I think they said that they had partied till like 4am but when Chris called his dad to come pick him up, that call was made at around 7am and they're talking and then there's some commotion. And Chris says, hold on, I gotta go deal with these people, and hangs up. You know, it's like, what was that noise? Who were those people?

[Charlie Scudder]

Yeah, we have no clue who else was on the property, near the property. Which also leads to these unanswered, uninvestigated questions that were just ignored.

[Wes Ferguson]

So many unanswered questions. I'd heard that Tyler had changed phone numbers, and then I heard that she was still living on the same property where Christopher was killed. I knew what I had to do. I had to go to Lipan myself.

[Charlie Scudder]

So I'm just telling you to be careful when you go out there to talk to these people because they're fucking nuts.

[Wes Ferguson]

That's next time on the Unforgotten.

[Charlie Scudder]

He come down and talk to me that night and the next day, you know, the car was gone. I don't know if they left him there. All of a sudden I hear he was attacked. They found his body out in the woods. They found blood and all.

[Wes Ferguson]

And then after that, I hear that.

[Charlie Scudder]

They'Re accusing Tyler of getting rid of.

[Wes Ferguson]

Thank you for listening to the Unforgotten. To dig deeper into the story and see photos, case files and more. Check out our [e-mail] the Unforgotten is a free range production. Season 4 Killsight was produced here at Free Range in association with the Dallas Morning News. Editing by Aislin Gaddis Sound design and audio engineering from Austin Sisler with Eastside Studios. Charlie Scudder and I are executive producers. Special thanks to Morgan O'. Hanlon. Don't forget on forgottenpod.com, see you soon. If you're an H vac technician and a call comes in, Grainger knows that you need a partner that helps you find the right product fast and hassle free. And you know that when the first problem of the day is a clanking blower motor, there's no need to break a sweat. With Grainger's easy to use website and product details, you're confident you'll soon have everything humming right along. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgrainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.