My mom: Getting married young, Hawaii, and Parenting Now vs. Then

Summary

The Unplanned Podcast with Matt & Abby

Episode: My mom: Getting married young, Hawaii, and Parenting Now vs. Then

Release Date: May 20, 2026
Guests: Lori Biswell (Abby’s mom)

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Episode Overview

This heartfelt episode dives into three generations of family perspectives as Abby and Matt welcome Abby's mom, Lori Biswell. Together, they reminisce on growing up in a small town, parenting across eras, getting married young, and navigating the transitions of adulthood, marriage, and motherhood. The episode also spotlights Lori’s new travel book for kids and explores how family values, career decisions, and a tight-knit support system shaped the Howard/Biswell family story.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Growing Up in a Small Town: Quincy, Illinois

• Quincy’s "Big Fish, Small Pond" Culture

  • Abby describes Quincy as a close-knit community with a "big city" reputation among nearby towns.
  • Lori: "Quincy's the big city compared to everywhere around it. People drive in for restaurants, Walmart shopping." (05:00)
  • Abby reflects on the unique opportunities like performing arts and direct community involvement (e.g., performances, mayoral events).

• Influence of Community on Childhood and Arts

  • Lori highlights Quincy’s strong fine arts presence and how Abby got involved in musical theater early.
  • Abby’s family encouraged her passions, leading her to big opportunities such as the Muny in St. Louis.

2. Abby’s Journey into Theater & The Muny in St. Louis

• Parental Support for Creative Passions

  • Lori recounts Abby's non-shyness and the family’s all-in attitude toward her theater pursuits.
  • Memorable Story: Lori would drive Abby two hours from Quincy to St. Louis for auditions/rehearsals at The Muny, underscoring whole-family dedication.
  • Abby: "You went 150%, like, the whole time, nothing but support from both my parents... 'Go do it. Chase your dreams.'" (09:06)

• Matt & Abby’s First Meeting

  • Both participated in The Muny youth program, a common ground for their relationship’s beginnings.
  • Abby's mom met Matt’s family through theater connections before the kids started dating.

3. Family Ties and Parenting Philosophy

• Tight-Knit Family Dynamics

  • Abby observes the rare closeness of her family, with sibling and cousin collaborations, celebrations, and frequent get-togethers.

• Parenting Now vs. Then

  • Lori reflects on her teaching background and raising kids in the '90s/2000s:
    • Stricter about cleanliness/rules than Abby is as a parent but still prioritized connection and togetherness.
    • Being a teacher provided structure and opportunities, though Lori wishes she could have stayed home more, acknowledging changing opportunities for parents now.

• Comparing Generations

  • Lori: "I think it's harder to parent today just because of social media for one thing... so many avenues you could get in trouble." (82:15)
  • Abby notes the "small world" feeling of her own childhood compared to the overwhelming access kids have today.

4. Marriage Young: Fears, Traditions, and Family Reactions

• The Proposal, Parental Anxiety, & Family Change

  • Lori shares how difficult it was to adjust to Abby marrying young:
    • Emotional about “the family changing,” rather than mistrusting Matt.
    • Matt "grilled" by Lori and her husband on finances and readiness before getting approval to propose.
  • Lori: "It was just hard to accept the whole family thing changing because it was, like, perfect... I didn't want it to change." (38:01)

• Community & Church Involvement

  • Lori called in trusted friends, pastors, and "The Don't Get Married Avengers" to talk sense into Matt & Abby about the realities of young marriage.
  • Matt: "...one of the couples just said, ‘Honestly? It’s pretty freaking great.’" (34:07)

• Unique Family Experience

  • Both couples (Abby's parents and Matt & Abby) married young, but Abby’s mom insists there's a big difference between graduating college before marriage (her time) vs. marrying during college.

5. Starting Over: Moving Away & Maintaining Close Family

• Big Moves, Family Expansion

  • After marriage, Matt & Abby moved to Hawaii, causing more emotional upheaval for Lori, but eventually, the whole family followed them to Arizona.
  • Today, three generations live nearby, showing the power of family loyalty and adaptability.

• Parent vs. Grandparent Roles

  • Lori relishes her ‘Honey’ identity as a creative, present grandmother.
  • She shares joy at experiencing favorite "mom" activities again with grandchildren.

6. Spotlight: Lori Biswell’s Travel Book Series for Kids

• The Birth of "Let's Travel to Hawaii"
  • A dream with her sister, Gina, inspired by lack of quality children’s travel books and the goal to make travel engaging for kids.
  • Features educational content, art, and family photos for Easter eggs.
  • Designed for 3rd/4th grade, but enjoyable for broader family audiences.
    • Lori: "I wanted something... visually appealing but had good facts about the place... that's kind of why we decided to write this book." (17:25)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

Parental Support & Young Love

• Lori (on accepting Abby’s marriage):
  • "I think I knew it was the right thing. It was just hard to accept the whole family thing changing because it was, like, perfect." (38:01)
• Abby (on her parents’ encouragement):
  • "I just feel like I never really struggled with confidence... both my parents fully believing in me from the day I was born." (88:34)
• Matt (on his side of the proposal):
  • "I got grilled. I got grilled. Let me just clear the room." (37:46)

Small-Town Upbringing & Values

• Abby: "We show our love by teasing each other, and we've really teased my dad about this...But then there comes a point where, like, no, this is, like, actually serious." (01:45)
• Lori (on Quincy): "I have only positive things to say about Quincy." (67:30)

Parenting Differences, Then and Now

• Lori (on discipline):
  • "You want to make sure...sometimes maybe I went overboard but like, you'd ask, correcting things at home if you saw certain behaviors at school." (52:07)
• Abby: "When you think about it...my world was so small." (82:46)

Grandparenting

• Lori: "...at some point, I'm like, I could actually do this all over again. Because I kept thinking there was like, this was, like, the end...It doesn't have to be over. You can actually start all over again and do the same stuff again, but just slightly different." (60:29)

Intergenerational Humor & Self-Awareness

• Abby, joking about parental favorites: "Do you secretly have a favorite kid?"
  • Lori: "No, but...you have your kids. One of them is your favorite for fill in the blank here, one of them's your favorite for another...not favorite overall." (79:05)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:44–03:50: Lori introduced, family background, and stories about Abby’s dad’s camera anxiety.
• 04:08–07:34: Growing up in Quincy, small town life, and Abby’s early theater involvement.
• 09:06–11:06: The Muny, Abby and Matt meeting, and family sacrifices for the arts.
• 14:55–16:28: Lori as matchmaker and shaping high expectations for Abby.
• 17:12–22:02: Launching "Let's Travel to Hawaii," writing process, and teacher legacy.
• 23:06–27:22: Young love, parental hesitation/support, Matt’s proposal process.
• 34:07–38:18: Family struggles and emotional acceptance about early marriage.
• 40:20–44:19: Moving across country, family migration, maintaining closeness after moves.
• 49:30–53:41: Comparing their parenting styles, teacher insights, and public school myths.
• 58:03–61:29: Grandparenting joys, themed parties, and recreating childhood magic.
• 66:50–68:28: Lori’s adaptation to Arizona after a life in Quincy, what she misses and loves.
• 69:13–71:22: Marriage dynamics, love after decades, and displays of affection.
• 73:09–75:26: Vicarious parenting and letting kids find their own passions.
• 82:15–84:20: Social media & modern parenting challenges.
• 86:04–86:33: When Lori realized Abby’s job as a content creator was legitimate.
• 87:22–92:59: Building confidence in children, parental expectations, and supporting adult children’s life choices.

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Listener Questions & Lightning Round

• Were there any almost-marriages before your spouse? ("No.")
• How do you keep love growing in a marriage?
  • "Thinking about the other person, not putting yourself first, keeping things fun, going on dates, conversations..." (71:04)
• Favorite children?
  • “No favorites, but connect on different levels for different reasons.” (79:05)
• Grandparent boundaries & rules?
  • "You have to respect the parents' decisions, even if it's not how you would've done it." (79:42)
• Is parenting harder now?
  • "100% harder now—so many more avenues with social media and less control." (82:15)
• When did Lori believe Abby's social media career was legit?
  • When Abby could graduate from college and support herself financially. (84:44)

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Final Thoughts

This episode offers a warm, honest look at family transitions, love, and legacy. It’s packed with generational wisdom, laughter, vulnerability, and a celebration of the enduring bonds between mothers and daughters. Whether you’re raising children, wondering how to stay close with grown kids, or wondering about being a “Disney adult,” you’ll come away with encouragement—and perhaps a new book for your family library.

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To support Lori's book:

• Grab "Let’s Travel to Hawaii" (What a Smart Cookie Publishing) on Amazon
• Follow @whatsmartcookiepublishing on Instagram and Facebook

Closing Quote:
"It doesn't have to be over. You can actually start all over again and do the same stuff again, but just slightly different." — Lori Biswell (60:29)

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For more, listen to the full episode on your favorite podcast platform.

Transcript

[Matt Howard]

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[Abby Biswell]

Mom, you can just confront him right now.

[Lori Biswell]

This was a moment that I was dreading for years.

[Matt Howard]

What happened?

[Lori Biswell]

Bringing up a lot of stuff.

[Abby Biswell]

Matt, you're bringing up her trauma. Do you secretly have a favorite kid?

[Lori Biswell]

No, but I.

[Abby Biswell]

That's not true.

[Lori Biswell]

I think I have.

[Abby Biswell]

It's Blake.

[Matt Howard]

It's you.

[Abby Biswell]

I don't think there was ever gonna be, like, a time that you were like, yeah, take her from me.

[Lori Biswell]

No, it was just hard to accept

[Abby Biswell]

the whole family thing.

[Lori Biswell]

I didn't want it to change.

[Abby Biswell]

All right, you guys. Welcome back to the unplanned podcast. This week, we have a very, very special guest. Probably my favorite guest we've ever had on this podcast. It's my very own mom.

[Matt Howard]

Hey, give it up for Lori Biswell.

[Abby Biswell]

It only took over three years of this pod, and I do think that I need to open by addressing the elephant in the room.

[Matt Howard]

Where's this guy?

[Lori Biswell]

The elephant is at the park.

[Abby Biswell]

The elephant is at the park with my sons. Because my mom is happily married to my father, has been for over 30 years. They are honestly attached at the hip at any given moment, at any time. Except for if there's a camera on filming moments.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, they can't. They can't do anything. Not together.

[Abby Biswell]

Not together.

[Matt Howard]

Except for being on camera.

[Abby Biswell]

Except for being on the podcast.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

No, you guys are always together. We are and pretty much always. And I think it's really sweet, but my dad does have. What do you call this, anxiety phobia.

[Lori Biswell]

It hasn't been diagnosed officially yet, but

[Abby Biswell]

it's got like a. You guys, my family, I was raised very. I would say sarcastic. We show our love by teasing each other, and we've really teased my dad about this. But then there comes a point where, like, no, this is, like, actually serious.

[Matt Howard]

Oh, yeah, No, I think. What was it? What's the story, Abby? You guys were at Disney World, and then he was worried that he was gonna get the camera on him at the Laugh Floor.

[Abby Biswell]

You guys know, at Disney World. No, he. Here's the thing. He doesn't get to defend himself because he didn't show up. So he. And also, we say this with love because. Because I'm also acknowledging he has a real thing, which is so funny, because he is.

[Matt Howard]

You cannot be more different than your dad.

[Abby Biswell]

I know.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

I have to say, I'm probably a little bit closer to dad than you, though, in this regard.

[Abby Biswell]

But, yes, totally. But, you know. Okay, so Disney World has this Monsters, Inc. Laugh floor thing. It's like a comedy show. It's literally for kids and just for fun people on vacations. But they do, like, put the camera on audience members, and the sheer thought of that has my dad drenched in sweat and he has to vacate the premises.

[Lori Biswell]

I thought about this, and I think here's where it all started. When we were, like, probably first married, there was a comedy club in Quincy, if you can believe it. And we sat in the very front row, and this comedian the entire time pointed us out and said stuff to us.

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, so he has trauma.

[Lori Biswell]

I think it's PTSD from that comedy club.

[Abby Biswell]

I've never even. How have I never heard this story? I don't know.

[Lori Biswell]

We've tried not to talk about it.

[Abby Biswell]

You guys went to a comedy club?

[Lori Biswell]

I know it doesn't sound seem like.

[Abby Biswell]

Was it clean?

[Lori Biswell]

I think so. Well, you know, it's. I think mostly.

[Abby Biswell]

Okay. Wow. So mom brings up Quincy. So we. I was raised, and my mom lived her entire life in the town of Quincy, Illinois, which is, I always say small town, but I say this like it's a little level of fear that I'm offending people in Quincy. Do people in Quincy recognize it as a small town?

[Lori Biswell]

I mean, probably a lot of people don't exactly, because there's so many smaller ones around it.

[Abby Biswell]

Right.

[Lori Biswell]

But, you know, it's like 40,000 maybe.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. I didn't grow up thinking it was small, but then when you leave, you're like, oh, yeah, that was small.

[Lori Biswell]

Because we know. We all know people in, like, the littler towns around us. So that's the small. Those are the small towns.

[Abby Biswell]

Quincy's the big city compared to everywhere around it. Like, people drive in from other towns

[Lori Biswell]

and come to medical stuff and for restaurants, for Walmart shopping.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. What can you tell us about a young Abby Biswell when she was, you know, a kid growing up in the small town of Quincy, Illinois?

[Lori Biswell]

Wow. The good. Some of the good things about Quincy is they're very good with fine arts and the music and theater, you know, a lot. She didn't necessarily play an instrument for very long, but vocally, the vocal stuff going on in Quincy, and I think those are all really big positive things in Quincy. And I Think you had some great training and a lot of those things. Maybe more attention than you would have maybe in a bigger city.

[Abby Biswell]

Big fish in a little bit.

[Matt Howard]

Because Abby did some sort of professional show of Alice in Opera Land. Right? Wasn't she Alice?

[Abby Biswell]

That's the criticism.

[Lori Biswell]

That's the biggest one you can.

[Matt Howard]

Wasn't that, Wasn't that your claim to fame?

[Abby Biswell]

There's so many.

[Matt Howard]

You were Alice in operand.

[Abby Biswell]

I was.

[Matt Howard]

You were. You were something. There really is a Santa Claus. What's the.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes, Virginia, there's a Santa Claus. Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

You used to have that framed up in your house.

[Lori Biswell]

Was on the front of Arts Quincy. Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

Wow.

[Abby Biswell]

I was on the front of Arts Quincy. I was in a couple commercials.

[Matt Howard]

You were friends with the mayor. He used to. You, the mayor were buddies.

[Lori Biswell]

He gave a little speech for the mayor when he was running a few times.

[Abby Biswell]

I. Oh, bridge lighting. I did a little bridge lighting with the town. I feel like that's like one of the really special things about growing up in a small town is that you kind of, like I said, you're a big fish in a little pond, but also like it's a small, tight knit community. So then like, you just had so many opportunities to like, like. And what situation am I going to be talking with the mayor of where we live now?

[Lori Biswell]

You know what I mean?

[Matt Howard]

We just need to get Jonathan Vaness on the podcast because he's another Quincy legend. He's another Quincy legend.

[Lori Biswell]

You know, I know Jonathan from when he was a little kid.

[Matt Howard]

Did you teach him in school?

[Lori Biswell]

No, but I was. When I was in high school, I was a pool waitress at the country club and he was a member there as a little toddler. And I can remember him walking around there and hanging out with him at the country club and he wanted to pretend like he was a pool waitress with us.

[Matt Howard]

That's cute.

[Lori Biswell]

As a little kid. I don't know him as an adult, but wow.

[Abby Biswell]

It's a tight knit kid.

[Lori Biswell]

But very nice family. Super nice family. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Wow, that's awesome. And so I was very involved in the arts, which is actually kind of funny because I feel like you and Dad, I mean, certainly not dad, but not even you really were. What was your motivation then? Was it because I was so shy at first?

[Lori Biswell]

I don't think you were shy.

[Abby Biswell]

Really?

[Lori Biswell]

No, I can remember just. I think it started with dance and you were like a preschooler and I can remember talking to some of my friends about where you should go to dance and then like go to Cheryl Kaiser school dance because she does a lot in musical theater kind of stuff. I thought that sounds cool. Like, shows and stuff. So I think that's where it started. And then when you were in second grade, is that when.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, I was in second grade.

[Lori Biswell]

The best Christmas pageant ever, they were doing at the community theater.

[Abby Biswell]

I had one line.

[Lori Biswell]

And you took a class right before just to kind of be comfortable, and got cast in the show as well as Blake, his debut as well.

[Abby Biswell]

Little brother. It was so difficult to work with. Your little brother would never recommend it. Whenever he would misbehave, I felt personally responsible for him.

[Lori Biswell]

He kind of fell through the cracks on the whole thing.

[Abby Biswell]

I was like, oh, my gosh. Please ignore. Do you know the first line from the show that I was. Do you know the one line I had?

[Lori Biswell]

An angel broke my. An angel.

[Abby Biswell]

My wings are bent.

[Lori Biswell]

Okay. My wings are bent.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. I was named Juanita, the baby angel that has one line.

[Lori Biswell]

Sweet.

[Matt Howard]

I feel like the questions people really have for you or about your first impressions of me, your first impressions of, like, us dating. But to get to there, I feel like we first need to talk about the Muny. You know, that's kind of the. That's the theater in St. Louis that Abby and I met. So what's the story behind how you and Abby ended up in St. Louis for musical theater at the Muny?

[Lori Biswell]

I think somebody had said that they, like. I didn't even know it was a thing to audition for there.

[Abby Biswell]

And then because it's two hours from

[Matt Howard]

where we live, which, for context, for people that have no idea what the Muni is, it's the oldest and largest. Oldest and largest outdoor musical theater in North America. It's like a St. Louis tradition. It's been around for over 100 years. They do summer theater every single summer.

[Abby Biswell]

Like, it seats, like, 11,000 people.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, it seats 11,000 people. They have, like, free seats in the

[Abby Biswell]

back, where, if you want to go 1000 free seats.

[Matt Howard]

Is it over a thousand?

[Lori Biswell]

5000? I was thinking. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but

[Matt Howard]

I don't think it's 5,000 free seats. But it's a lot of free seats. It's cool. It's a St. Louis tradition. And it's in Forest park where they had the World's fair back in 1904. So back in the day when, like, they used to do World's Fairs all over the place, St. Louis held it, and then I think it was. Yeah, not too long after the World's Fair that they converted that part of Forest park into the summer theater. And so it's cool. You guys, like, they bring in super talented people from Broadway every single summer. And then they have a youth program for St. Louis kids and teens to get to work alongside this, like, high caliber of Broadway talent. And Abby and I were some. Some of those kids and teens growing up, and that's the place that we met.

[Abby Biswell]

So, yeah, I was really an outsider of sorts coming from, like, not, like, not being local, but I have to shout out my mom because she really, like, saw this passion and drive in me. And just, like, you went 150%, like, this whole, like, the whole time, like, nothing but support from both my parents. Because also, like, my dad couldn't just leave for the summer, you know, like that. But he was, like, more than. He was, like, go do it. Like, chase your dreams. And so that's what led you to having, like. Honestly, I think you. You heard from other moms about this audition.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. I can't remember how we knew about the audition, but I think the first

[Abby Biswell]

year to make it.

[Lori Biswell]

You're right. Well, I think we, like, decided, like, the night before something crazy like that. And then the next year, we kind of had a little bit more knowledge on what to do. And, you know, we're prepared for it. But I can remember how exciting it was, like, when you got a call back for it. And then.

[Abby Biswell]

I'll never forget that.

[Lori Biswell]

That was such a fun night. And we spent the night.

[Abby Biswell]

We were so happy and giddy together. Like, we were like, I guess we gotta get a toothbrush.

[Lori Biswell]

We went to Target and we bought a little. Because we didn't think we were gonna spend the night, but I actually secretly had packed a few little things in the back of the car just, like, hoping. Yeah. Like, some extra clothes just in case. But anyway, so that was super fun. And so you got cast in that first show. I think you were in between your eighth and ninth grade year.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

And we really didn't know at all what to expect because we were there maybe a month by the time it had rehearsals and the shows. And then Matt's mom, Teresa, did you

[Matt Howard]

meet her first before? Did you, like, meet my mom before you met me?

[Lori Biswell]

I think so.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

I think so. Well, yeah, I knew your mom definitely

[Abby Biswell]

from, like, before that and stuff.

[Lori Biswell]

I can't remember exactly. Yeah, A lot of those moms I met from there and then. Yeah. So I can remember you guys, like, playing cards together. Like, all the kids would play cards when you weren't on stage.

[Matt Howard]

There was a lot of Downtime, because we weren't necessarily in every number of.

[Abby Biswell]

We were in, let's just say about 90 seconds of the productions.

[Matt Howard]

I mean, it depends on the show. Yeah, it depended on the show. Like, if it was a show, like, you got to be in 90 seconds. Some shows, like, I want to say, there was a show that I was in, like, half of the show.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, because you were the muni golden child.

[Matt Howard]

That's not true. I was for a little bit. And then I feel like I got blacklisted for a little bit because I went and I did shows at another theater, the Scandal. I did. I did shows at stage of St. Louis.

[Abby Biswell]

Isn't it funny, though, how high stakes kids theater, dance, sports, like, how high stakes it can get?

[Matt Howard]

There's politics to it.

[Abby Biswell]

There's.

[Matt Howard]

There's politics even in kids stuff. You know, it's totally. But I. What's funny, Lori, is I remember my mom telling me probably when I was in eighth grade, like, yeah, this. This, you know, cute girl and her mom invited you to come, like, do shows and in their small town of Quincy, Illinois. And I was like, oh, that's cute. Like, I just didn't like.

[Abby Biswell]

It was. It was like a week long. It was like some sort of boot

[Lori Biswell]

camp is a big deal on Quincy.

[Matt Howard]

I didn't know that.

[Abby Biswell]

Like, I couldn't sleep the night before it started. Like, I was so excited.

[Matt Howard]

Which. Yeah. Which anyway, I. Looking back, if I could go back, I probably should have done the boot camp because I probably would have learned to act better. I spent so much time dancing. Like, it came time to act, and I never really. I never really, like, learned how to act until maybe my senior year of high school.

[Lori Biswell]

It's never too late, I think. Yeah. Brandon Thompson, who was the director of the theater and was for your whole time in Quincy, I mean, I think he taught you so much and stuff. I don't think that you would just learn from random classes if you were somewhere else.

[Matt Howard]

And so, Lori, was that your first attempt to put Abby and I together when we were in eighth grade?

[Lori Biswell]

No, not in eighth grade.

[Matt Howard]

When were you trying to, like, do your matchmakers?

[Abby Biswell]

I feel like the sprinkling started around my brain.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. When did you become a matchmaker?

[Lori Biswell]

I think, honestly, getting to get. Like, we'd come, like, there were some. Those classes or whatever at Christmas time, like, around.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes.

[Lori Biswell]

And so then that would be.

[Abby Biswell]

Theater connection is what it's called.

[Lori Biswell]

A second time that we go to St. Louis. I don't know if you always were at it, but, like, I get together with your mom still and we'd have coffee and talk, and I'm like, gosh, our family seem like a lot alike and maybe I just really liked your mom at first. And then I was like, that's important. But Matt seems like, you know, obviously you came from a nice family and so I got to know you kind of through your mom. I'd say, ah, okay.

[Abby Biswell]

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp.

[Matt Howard]

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[Abby Biswell]

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[Matt Howard]

You don't have to be on this journey alone. Find support and have someone with you in therapy. Sign up and get 10% [e-mail] Unplanned Podcast that's better. H E L P.com Unplanned Podcast I

[Abby Biswell]

remember I feel like whenever I would talk about boys around my mom, which I will say wasn't that much, I was not the most boy crazy girl. Even though I get accused of being boy crazy.

[Lori Biswell]

No, you were. Not at all.

[Abby Biswell]

Thank you.

[Lori Biswell]

Not at all. And not even just like you just didn't seem like. Yeah, there was nobody.

[Abby Biswell]

I was too driven. I had a purpose.

[Lori Biswell]

I had other things that were important to you and it wasn't boys yet.

[Abby Biswell]

And I loved hanging out with my friends and my friends weren't really like that either. No. So I feel like if my friends were more like boy crazy, then maybe

[Lori Biswell]

it would be like the girls would hang out.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, they were good influences on me. That's probably the craziest of all of them, which is pretty crazy. But I remember when I would talk about other boys, they would be like. Or my mom would be like, he's no Matt Howard. I would say that the standard. And so she really got in my

[Lori Biswell]

ear bigger and bigger, and I was

[Abby Biswell]

like, mom, he has no idea who I am. He has no idea who I am.

[Lori Biswell]

And it might have been true.

[Abby Biswell]

And honestly, I don't think you thought a thing about. About me.

[Matt Howard]

I'll be honest, I did not pay much attention until high school.

[Lori Biswell]

Rude.

[Matt Howard]

Sorry. Sorry. I think you just, like, got more attractive. I don't know.

[Abby Biswell]

I don't know what the.

[Matt Howard]

We both did. Look at the picture of us. I had, like, pimples on my face. I don't even know. What did you even see in me?

[Lori Biswell]

There was a lot of humidity that night that you guys had that first picture taken.

[Matt Howard]

Should we throw the picture? The OG pic of Abby and I from when we were in. It was just Mary Poppins.

[Lori Biswell]

It was very humid, 2013. You can't control it.

[Abby Biswell]

My hair was cut way too short for how thick and frizzy it was.

[Matt Howard]

It's weird to say that was 13

[Lori Biswell]

years ago, but also, it was a close show.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. That's a long time.

[Abby Biswell]

I just looked down. I'm like, wait, I need to bring this up.

[Matt Howard]

What?

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, yeah, my mom's book. Also, mom doesn't just do a hiatus from the podcast for three years for nothing. She's an author now.

[Matt Howard]

Yep.

[Abby Biswell]

She's on her official press tour.

[Matt Howard]

She's doing the circuit. She's going on all the big podcasts. She was just on Always Here with the Abby Howards. And now she's on unplanned, promoting her brand new book.

[Abby Biswell]

First ever book that she wrote with my aunt called let's Travel to Hawaii. Mom, talk about your book a little bit.

[Lori Biswell]

All right, well, so I don't know. So Jean and I, my sister and I had decided, I mean, like, I don't know, 15 years ago, we were gonna do a travel book. And I think we first thought about it because, you know, we did a lot of nice traveling, as, you know,

[Abby Biswell]

it was a priority.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. I mean, you know, everybody decides what to do with their money. And I think we. It was important to us to travel.

[Matt Howard]

And so I always thought you guys did the coolest trip because it was your parents that would take you guys on these, you know, different vacations.

[Lori Biswell]

In Greece, we would go to Disney every time.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

Because that's our place. It still is my place. But otherwise we did go with. We went with my mom and dad and my sister and her husband and their cousins Brett and Bennett, and we did some really nice traveling. And so whenever we would go, you know, I would think, oh, I want, you know, if you have more buy in if. And you're more. It seems more fun if you have some knowledge about the place. And so I'd always look to see what kind of books could I get for the kids or, you know, to learn about it. And honestly, there really. There just weren't anything that was quality that was out on the market that I could find about any of these places that we'd go to. And we went to Hawaii, we went to Alaska and Europe and some different places. And I'd always look and you couldn't find anything good. And honestly, to this day, so you'd think this many years later there would be some good books out now, but there really aren't. The things you can find a lot of times are just like, you know, write your thoughts about the day or, you know, but I wanted something for you guys at the time and now that was, you know, visually appealing but had, you know, good facts about the place. And so that's kind of why we decided to write this book. So it's. It's the first in the series. And Hawaii, Hawaii is out now, but Florida's already in the works. And then we're gonna, you know, do some international or we're not sure. What should we do next after Florida?

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, comment down below. What should you see them cover next? What's really cool is that this feels so fitting for a multitude of reasons. For my mom, first of all, she was a teacher, elementary teacher for 27 years. And her teaching never stopped in the classroom because I was certainly raised by a teacher. I'm a teacher's child because I have memories of us road tripping to Florida from Illinois because we surely drove most years.

[Lori Biswell]

We did a lot of times.

[Abby Biswell]

And I remember, like, when we would cross state, you know, you're crossing over a lot of states and you're driving from Illinois. There were some times where mom would prepare for every state border we crossed a new state activity, like worksheet activity,

[Matt Howard]

like some type of work, elementary school teacher fashion.

[Abby Biswell]

And it's summer, you know, we're on summer break. And here we are, we have crack out our. Oh, we're now in Georgia. Get out your peach thing. And so this is very fitting for you. And the book is beautiful. We could open it Up.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. Correct me if I'm wrong. Did you teach elementary school for 20 years. How many?

[Lori Biswell]

27 years in education.

[Matt Howard]

27 years.

[Lori Biswell]

Couple of years where I was doing a few different things.

[Abby Biswell]

She was a star guide.

[Lori Biswell]

Well, for a few years she was the behavior influencer. At the last few years it was. I mean, it's kind of like, I love it. A dean for elementary school children kind of a thing. I guess I'm thinking, I'm hoping, you know, even adults would think it's fun to. To look at it. I mean, you know, you're not going to get everything you need to know about Hawaii if you're trying to do. But I'd say it's a good overview of, you know, the main things in each place and in a fun to read way.

[Matt Howard]

And what would be like the best age, you think, for a kid to really enjoy this book? Because obviously the pictures are cool. I think Griffin, our three year old, would love just looking through the pictures. But to actually read it, do you think it's more of like a third

[Lori Biswell]

grade or fourth grade, which is the grade I taught?

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, I'd say probably so.

[Matt Howard]

That's really cool.

[Abby Biswell]

It's really cool. It's very. Here's the thing, it's great for anyone's home library too. Just like, okay, how many times are you doing a project on a certain stay or you just, I don't know, it's just so visually appealing. And here's the best Easter egg of all.

[Lori Biswell]

Oh, yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Did you notice me and my cousins in Hawaii?

[Lori Biswell]

So we're trying to do a little Easter eggy thing on each book, on each book, on that same page, a picture of you guys, you and Blake and your cousins at those. Wherever it is.

[Abby Biswell]

So it's really cool. And also it's just the perfect collaboration between you and your sister. Our whole family is. You're gonna see this trend if you haven't already with us, very tight knit. And I think I took that for granted until, honestly, I was about 27. I was like, this is unusual what we have here. But the fact that you and your sister are working together combining your skills as both moms but teachers and a professional journalist, author or really a writer is what Gina is now authors to create this awesome resource for families and kids. And really proud of you, mom. Thank you.

[Matt Howard]

Was your job. More of the illustration and Gina was more of the writing.

[Lori Biswell]

Almost all of it. Yeah. And then my mom and grandma also helped.

[Abby Biswell]

And grandma also helps.

[Lori Biswell]

Was on the team with some of it. But yeah. Gina did the writing, and I did the graphic design.

[Abby Biswell]

Let me say that I am so proud of what my mom is doing, but it would mean, like, so, so, so, so much to me, you guys, if you follow them on Instagram, purchase the book if you can. It's on Amazon. It's on Prime. We all have Prime. It's really easy. It's a quick buy. It's great to add to any library. I know a lot of you guys have kids or just. I don't know, it's a. It's just a beautiful book to add to your library. And I just really think that it would just be such a. I would be so grateful if you took the action of just supporting my mom, because honestly, loving my family and supporting my family is, like, the greatest act of supporting and loving me. So thank you so, so much in advance. For all of you that do that, write a review. If you buy it, give it five stars, and we'll link it down below and also follow. What a smart cookie, publishing. And thanks, guys. Really thankful for this community.

[Matt Howard]

Is it okay if we circle back to our love story through Lori's eyes?

[Abby Biswell]

Yes. I think we need to get back.

[Matt Howard]

I feel like we've talked a lot about, like, yeah, this is what my parents said, and my parents did not want us to get married. And we just haven't, like. And we haven't really, like, talked that through with your mom. And she's right here, and we can. We can ask her literally whatever we want.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes. So we were scandalous, and we wanted to get married before we graduated from college. I feel like we've talked about this a lot.

[Matt Howard]

Even before that, though, I feel like. Wasn't like your mom was just like,

[Abby Biswell]

oh, yeah, she has a specific memory.

[Matt Howard]

She would drive. Can we just address this? Lori would drive Abby from Quincy two hours away to St. Louis all the time.

[Abby Biswell]

So, yeah, I wasn't allowed to drive on highways like you would.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. So you weren't allowed to drive to visit me. And so you would go and stay at, like, a hotel using points.

[Lori Biswell]

Let's be honest that the driving part was more dad not wanting to drive.

[Abby Biswell]

Another one of his phobias.

[Matt Howard]

That's right. Your dad would drive because he didn't want to drive.

[Lori Biswell]

He's got a little safety thing.

[Abby Biswell]

Well, also, in Quincy, the fastest road is full 40 miles per hour. So I had no experience driving fast.

[Lori Biswell]

And that's maybe a stretch, 45 years.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. I don't even think my car could

[Matt Howard]

have even gone see Abby, like, that's just, like, finally dawning on me, like, why the highway was so scary for you guys. Because, like, driving on the highway was just, like, part of life for me.

[Abby Biswell]

Dude, when we moved to Phoenix, that was the first time I've. I was like, how am I going to drive here?

[Matt Howard]

We drive on the highway every day.

[Abby Biswell]

That's the reason why my grandma can't move here. That's the reason why, like. Oh, yeah, your mom was worried about driving.

[Matt Howard]

She was worried moving here because of the driving. Yeah. It is a big change.

[Abby Biswell]

I'm talking about Vicky, too.

[Lori Biswell]

We're talking about different grandmas, I think.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Abby Biswell]

Everyone was worried about driving. Let's just say that everyone in the family.

[Lori Biswell]

Phoenix is probably not a good example of moving to bigger city with the driving.

[Abby Biswell]

But seriously, you were very supportive of the.

[Lori Biswell]

I was supportive of the dating.

[Matt Howard]

Why did you. Why did you.

[Lori Biswell]

Because I just thought, you know, it just seems like you guys have a lot of the same values.

[Abby Biswell]

You. As I said, you got along with Teresa.

[Lori Biswell]

I loved your family. I remember going out to dinners and stuff with your whole family. I don't even know if you guys were dating then.

[Abby Biswell]

Maybe.

[Lori Biswell]

Maybe you were.

[Abby Biswell]

It's almost been 10 years ago.

[Matt Howard]

When did. When did I freak you out for the first time? Okay, can we talk about that?

[Lori Biswell]

Yes, Mom.

[Abby Biswell]

You can just confront him right now.

[Matt Howard]

You can just. Yeah, let's just have this conversation right here.

[Lori Biswell]

I can remember where we were. You and I were in the car.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

It was Abby's senior recital. Dance recital, the last one, as well as her graduation from high school, was all on the same weekend.

[Matt Howard]

So you're just feeling so emotional.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

As was I.

[Lori Biswell]

This was horrible. This was a moment that I was dreading for years and years. This moment when it's like. I distinctly remember just so many times just being sad and upset about Abby growing up. And dad would be like, don't waste your time, you know, thinking about the. Don't think about that now. Don't waste time now.

[Abby Biswell]

But anyway, you've unfortunately given me that quality. I've already cried about Griffin and Augie leaving. This was the climax.

[Lori Biswell]

This was the big weekend that I. Four years.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

Was dreading.

[Matt Howard]

Dreading that weekend. Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

And then here we are in the

[Matt Howard]

car, and what do I say to you?

[Lori Biswell]

You ask, could you take. Could I take you to go get some flowers for Abby for either the dancers or graduation? Yes, I can. And then you're like, hey, Laurie, I've been thinking about this. What would you think if Abby and I got Married young. And I was like, thinking in my head, you have got to be kidding me. This is the moment you chose, of all moments.

[Abby Biswell]

He's never been one for timing. Timing.

[Lori Biswell]

It was just them, you know?

[Matt Howard]

See, I had no.

[Lori Biswell]

I think I'm gonna say it. I think I'm gonna say it. And then you said it, and I thought. I'm pretty sure I said, this is not the time to have this conversation.

[Abby Biswell]

You've always been comfortable. I feel like you're also extra comfortable with Matt because you literally met him when he was a child. You know what I mean? So I feel like there's just a different level. Like, when we were dating, he stayed in our house.

[Lori Biswell]

That's the thing. It's not just like a typical dating thing because of the. You can't just go on a quick date and come back home at night. So he would come home.

[Abby Biswell]

We were staying at each other's houses

[Lori Biswell]

and stay at our house. Was that for weekends?

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, I would like. Yeah. That's the thing with long distance is, like, we were just hanging out. Like, we're just. I'm like, I'm at your house.

[Lori Biswell]

We do all the meals to get, you know, meals together. We, you know, it's like he's already

[Abby Biswell]

a part of the family.

[Matt Howard]

I know. Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

And I also remember. And Matt. My. My Matt. Kate.

[Abby Biswell]

Just so everybody knows, my dad's name is also Matt.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

Very confusing.

[Lori Biswell]

My Matt. Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

As well. And Matt. Al.

[Lori Biswell]

Matt's a lot of abbeys. Lotta.

[Abby Biswell]

You know, maybe we should name this baby Matt.

[Lori Biswell]

That'd be fantastic.

[Abby Biswell]

It'd be very fantastic.

[Lori Biswell]

I can remember being somewhere I was on a Sunday, and it was like you had come for the weekend and you had to go back. You were gonna go back, and you're like, oh, I'm pretty sure the weather looks really bad outside. I think. I don't know about this ice outside. And we're like, there's no ice outside. You're like, I think it's gonna get bad. I think I better just not go back tonight. And so you stay another night. And you're like, there's no ice outside at all.

[Matt Howard]

So I loved being at your house. Like, it was just so much fun. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Played a lot of games. That was a staple growing up.

[Matt Howard]

Gosh, if I could. If I had a time machine. I wish I could just go back to that time.

[Abby Biswell]

That was so fun.

[Matt Howard]

Just to be like. Just to be young and in love again. Like, oh, wow. But, like, now you're just older than loving. No but, like, to. Yeah, just. I don't know. It's just like, everything is so exciting.

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, yeah.

[Matt Howard]

Literally everything.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

Every date we went on was just like, I can't believe I'm taking this pretty girl on a date. Oh, my gosh.

[Abby Biswell]

So fun.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. Was that before? So that conversation where I told you that I wanted to marry Abby Young, was that before, after we had talked about me getting a promise ring for Abby, or did I just. Did I just spring that on you guys? Did you just find out?

[Lori Biswell]

I don't.

[Abby Biswell]

After the fact, she blacked out because

[Matt Howard]

she's wearing it right now. I got her a promise ring in high school that is a real diamond. And I went and I negotiated the price down at the jewelry store.

[Lori Biswell]

That sounds like something you would do.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, it would. Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know. This was. This was her high. So you probably got that first, huh? I don't know.

[Matt Howard]

I got that. Yeah, that was.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, this is probably that conversation because you gave it to me in June of after high school.

[Matt Howard]

I remember I was in music theory class and telling, like, some of the girls who were in the class be like, yeah, I'm gonna get my girlfriend this promise ring and tell her that I'm like, want to marry her? And I was like, what do you guys think about these? And like, oh, that one's cute. And then I went and bought it at the jewelry store. Thank you to Ladder for sponsoring today's episode. If I'm being completely honest with you guys, at first, the gym was very overwhelming to me because I didn't really have a workout plan. I would just go in and start doing, like, random workouts until I actually had someone sit me down and walk me through exactly what I needed to do to hit my fitness goals. And that's exactly what Ladder does. They pair you with an expert coach and set up a workout plan for you that can be done from anywhere. If you haven't heard of Ladder, Ladder is an expert strength training plan. It's real progressive programming designed by certified coaches.

[Abby Biswell]

When it comes to fitness and my own personal fitness journey, I think the most important thing for me has been accountability and consistency. And I love that. Ladder makes sure that you hit both of those things. When you are paired with a coach, you have that one on one accountability that makes you get the workout done, and it's specifically tailored for you. And you also have that consistency because Ladder allows you to do it wherever you need to get your workout in. Plus, with Ladder, you get a new plan each week that builds on the last, there is an in ear coach that guides you through each set with cues, form reminders and motivation. The app remembers your weights, reps and sets so you can see yourself getting stronger over time.

[Matt Howard]

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[Abby Biswell]

What's funny is that I remember I always was really. I mean I've always been really close with my mom and I was like, we had the type of relationship where I feel like I would just like tell you things that like maybe other high school girls wouldn't feel comfortable telling their mom. And I remember like literally a week. No, no, A month after us dating and my mom, he would drive to pick me up because you would have to stay the weekend like in a hotel or like what even happened with that?

[Lori Biswell]

I can. Well, his. Matt's prom.

[Abby Biswell]

No, this was. Must have been homecoming. But like just so I could hang out with Matt. Yeah. And I remember I asking you, I was like, mom, do you think that Matt and I are going to get. Or do you think that. Do you think we're stay together or something like that? Or do you think we're gonna break up ever? And you're like, I can't picture one of you breaking up with each other. Like I remember thinking that and like having that validation from mom of like. So did you actually take it seriously at that point or were you kind of just like, yeah, she's just infatuated as a high schooler.

[Lori Biswell]

I think because I'd been thinking about it for so many years, like in my head I kept thinking this just seems like perfect. Like so then it almost seemed weird when it got to the time when you actually went on a date. I'm like, how did this actually happen? How did I manifest this? Because that would be a very weird thing to actually have work out. Because being in two completely different cities and you know, being young and right.

[Abby Biswell]

And so when we were in high school, did you actually think we'd get married?

[Lori Biswell]

I think I did. Yeah. But I just didn't think about it that soon.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, that was the big thing. She really wanted us to graduate college. Was it the fear that I would drop out of college or was it.

[Lori Biswell]

No, I. No, it really Wasn't that. I think the biggest fear was just, like, changing our family structure so soon? It was just, like. Because, I mean, that's, like, been, you know, like the most important thing.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

Just, like, the four of us, our

[Abby Biswell]

core family unit was, like, gonna change.

[Lori Biswell]

And that's. It wasn't that I didn't want Matt included in it. It was just, like. It was just, like, too soon.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. You weren't ready for that to change. That's valid.

[Matt Howard]

Can we talk about the conversation of me asking you and Matt to marry Abby? If I could marry Abby.

[Abby Biswell]

I wasn't there, so I can't comment on this.

[Lori Biswell]

It didn't go the way I said it should go.

[Matt Howard]

What. What happened? What do you remember?

[Lori Biswell]

Well, I mean, this is a lot of.

[Abby Biswell]

You're bringing up her trauma.

[Lori Biswell]

So anyway, it was a long struggle of accepting that. Trying to accept this or not accept it, like, fighting about it.

[Abby Biswell]

Lots of conversations and talking to other people.

[Lori Biswell]

And after we talked, I think you

[Abby Biswell]

made us meet with, like, several people.

[Lori Biswell]

I taught. We had.

[Matt Howard]

Oh, yeah, we did. You put together the Avengers to try to convince us. Wait, wait, wait, hold up. Lori literally got to get together. The Don't Get Married Avengers. You got all these, like, married couples that you knew from your community and your church to be like, well, you guys know that, like, when you get married, you can't do this, and you can't do this. And then, like, you have finance. And they're, like, trying to, like, convince us not to get married. And then one of them eventually, like, we went to, like, get tacos with one of these couples. And then one of the. The guy was just like, honestly, it's pretty freaking great. It's like. And we're like, wow. I. I don't think you got the memo from Lori.

[Abby Biswell]

One of them said to us, which we'll never forget. They're like, well, you just can't. When you get married, you just don't have. You can't be selfish anymore. And we're like, well, is that what we're supposed to be striving for?

[Lori Biswell]

Well, I. We had talked about. So I was just, like, panic mode. So Matt and I had gone to go talk to our pastor and his wife, and I was like, they're going to be on my side. This is. This is it. What do I. They're going to tell me? And finally, I can remember his wife saying, you know, so, you know, basically what you. What we like about you. You know, if there's anything we were like, were there about Mal and so she's like, you know, you might lose the battle, but you're gonna win the war. I think you need to accept this whole thing.

[Abby Biswell]

So I was like, you never told me that. Okay, do you wanna know who told me that?

[Lori Biswell]

Pawpaw.

[Matt Howard]

So that's hilarious that you heard that from your papa.

[Lori Biswell]

Here's what happened then. So I was like, all right, Matt. That's what they told us to do. So I said, matt wants to talk to you by yourself. So I know that's what this is.

[Matt Howard]

This is freshman year of college. So I'm 19.

[Lori Biswell]

I'm like, I'm not gonna be at home.

[Matt Howard]

Abby's 19.

[Lori Biswell]

I'm not gonna be at home. You take this. You do this conversation. He's like, okay. So you. So I'm just supposed to be like, okay? And I said, yes.

[Abby Biswell]

Can I just clear my record? I had no idea that this was taking place.

[Matt Howard]

This was before I left for the summer to be in Orlando. And so I was like, I need to have this conversation now. Cause I knew I was gonna pop the question at Disney World.

[Abby Biswell]

You told me you didn't know that.

[Matt Howard]

Well, I was gonna pop the question at Disney World. Cause I knew that you wanted me to propose in front of the castle. I knew that that would be, like, your dream place to get you set up.

[Abby Biswell]

A lot of lies. Cause I thought you were gonna pose at Christmas time. But that's.

[Matt Howard]

Well, I was like. I was also, like, thinking.

[Abby Biswell]

She wasn't totally sure.

[Matt Howard]

I was like, yeah, that's a lot.

[Abby Biswell]

So, mom, you were like, you wanted dad to have a conversation without you?

[Lori Biswell]

Well, Matt officially had asked dad, just. So I was like, I'm gonna be out of the house. So he goes, all right. So I'm gonna be like, yes, it's fine. I said, yeah, I think that's. They told us to do that.

[Abby Biswell]

Does this mean that you wear the pants in your relationship?

[Lori Biswell]

No, we just. I think he knew I was more upset. I think I had the most struggle with that. So he's like, all right. So I walk in the kitchen. I can remember where everybody's standing in the kitchen. I walked in from the garage, and I was like, I. You know, he must have already. You must have already asked. And he was like, okay. I don't know. You know, I wasn't there. But then I can remember thinking it just started bubbling up against again. And I was like, I can't accept this. So then I started arguing again and about kind of it. And then later, Dag was like, what

[Abby Biswell]

Was that you told me we were

[Lori Biswell]

gonna go for this thing, and then you go back on it.

[Matt Howard]

The conversation with Matt was like, maybe 60 seconds. I think we talked for over an hour. You asked me a lot of questions about it. I don't know, what are you gonna do to pay the bills? How are you gonna afford this?

[Lori Biswell]

I was trying to come up with anything I could do.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, I know. And I was. And I came prepared. I was like, look, I've been working a job since the day we, you know, started college at Missouri State. And then we even. We found low income housing that fit our budget because, you know, shocker, we were low income. So just. It worked. It all worked out.

[Lori Biswell]

Just.

[Abby Biswell]

This is stressing.

[Lori Biswell]

This is a lot of trauma.

[Abby Biswell]

So you love.

[Matt Howard]

I got grilled. I got grilled. Let me just clear.

[Abby Biswell]

Clear the room.

[Lori Biswell]

She loved me.

[Abby Biswell]

Wanted me to get married to him.

[Lori Biswell]

Yes.

[Abby Biswell]

It was just the timing. And I don't think, if we're totally honest, Mom, I don't think there was ever gonna be, like, a time that you were like, yeah, take her from me.

[Lori Biswell]

No, I think I knew it was the right thing. I just. It's. It was just hard to accept the whole family thing changing because it was, like, perfect, you know, I thought, yeah, everything was perfect. And anyway, I didn't want to change, so.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, that's hard. But I feel like mom and I, like, all growing up and even to now, like, I think what you didn't know maybe then is that we would still be.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Super close. Like, through it all.

[Lori Biswell]

I guess in my head, the whole thing's over, you know?

[Abby Biswell]

Right.

[Lori Biswell]

You get married, the whole thing's over. And everything I, you know, loved was different and. But it's not because it was growing

[Abby Biswell]

up, it was me and mom kind of like a tight unit. And then Blake, my little brother, and my dad were like a tight unit.

[Matt Howard]

So then we get married, you know, you think that everything's fine.

[Abby Biswell]

What do you mean?

[Matt Howard]

We're posting, and then we're posting on YouTube every week.

[Abby Biswell]

This is her other trauma. Don't bring up all the traumas, okay?

[Matt Howard]

We don't need to go.

[Abby Biswell]

Mom hates social media. That's okay.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't.

[Matt Howard]

Let's be honest.

[Abby Biswell]

You hate us being on social media.

[Lori Biswell]

I. Again, I. I wouldn't say that that strongly. There are things I like more than others.

[Abby Biswell]

She dislikes us being on social media. No, she doesn't like us being open.

[Matt Howard]

I think it's hard for parents to see their kid get, you know, it's Hard for a parent to see people, like, be mean to their kid.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

So that's why, like, we have to tell our parents to stay out of common sections.

[Lori Biswell]

And I do. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, you do now. But you used to screenshot them for me and text them to me. I was like, mom, you're just actually re. Traumatizing me every time. You're like, go and delete this.

[Lori Biswell]

I learned. I learned.

[Abby Biswell]

So that's fine. But now Mom's learning how to make reels. She's.

[Matt Howard]

She's making reels for smart. What a smart cookie? Publishing.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes. So shout it out, everyone. You guys, seriously. Actually, I'll do a private plug. Not in front of her, but if you could support it, that would be very, very awesome and sweet and mean a lot to me. So then the next chapter, which also, I will say, my brother got married and didn't face any. A single trial.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, I think you're skipping a step, though, because you kind of forgot about the part in the story where we're like, hey, Mom, I know we just got married. And, like, we got married way sooner than you wanted us to. We're moving to.

[Abby Biswell]

And we're moving to Hawaii. Yeah, we. Honestly, mom, this should be our formal apology.

[Lori Biswell]

There's a lot of. Maybe a lot of trauma wrapped up in why I wrote the Hawaii book. I don't know, but

[Abby Biswell]

I.

[Lori Biswell]

That was. That was horrible. Yeah. And I can remember being at Grandma and grandpa's house in Chicago and just crying and crying about it.

[Abby Biswell]

Sad. I'm the worst daughter ever.

[Matt Howard]

No, you're not.

[Abby Biswell]

We just put. I put you through a lot all

[Lori Biswell]

at once, you know, you actually.

[Abby Biswell]

I was an adult.

[Lori Biswell]

Right.

[Abby Biswell]

For all of these things, I was. Was it easier to parent me as a child than as an adult?

[Lori Biswell]

Thousand percent.

[Abby Biswell]

Oof.

[Lori Biswell]

Not because you were necessarily doing anything wrong as the adult, because I'm not. Like, in retrospect, none of these things were wrong. It was just not how I wanted

[Abby Biswell]

it to be right.

[Lori Biswell]

So it was really all a selfish thing. It wasn't because you had done something wrong. It was all selfish stuff that I didn't want to.

[Matt Howard]

I could see, selfishly, how if, like, Augie's like, hey, dad, I'm gonna move to New Zealand and, like, go surf in New Zealand. And I'm like, dude, I can't. I would have to take, like, a 20 hour journey to come see you, you know, so I can see how, like, Hawaii is not quite that far, but it's still, like, you know, Quincy to Oahu is like, a 10 hour journey.

[Abby Biswell]

So more than that, because actually you

[Matt Howard]

gotta drive to Chicago. Yeah. You first gotta. Oh, you take the train to Chicago and then you can take the plane.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

But. Yeah, that's like a 12 hour journey.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. It was a big stretch, I think. Yeah. I'm thinking about all the things that mom just had to process.

[Matt Howard]

Were you regretting giving the permission?

[Lori Biswell]

No.

[Abby Biswell]

She wouldn't admit it if she was.

[Lori Biswell]

No, she wouldn't.

[Matt Howard]

She regretted. We can just say it. She regretted it. She was like, why?

[Lori Biswell]

It was a very. To say I gave permission is still a little like, did I ever really. I don't know. It was all.

[Abby Biswell]

She's like, I never said yes.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know.

[Matt Howard]

I will say Laura.

[Lori Biswell]

I would say yes and then I'd fight. Like, I'd get upset about it again. So I don't know.

[Matt Howard]

I had no idea that Matt and you had a conversation beforehand about like saying yes to my.

[Abby Biswell]

You guys didn't seem like a unit on that one.

[Matt Howard]

I had no idea.

[Lori Biswell]

Well, that's why he was like, what are you doing?

[Matt Howard]

Hearing that is really funny. Cause I had no. I had no clue.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

He was like, we talked about this and I'm like, I know, but I couldn't go through at the end.

[Abby Biswell]

Where was I during all this? I don't know. I don't know.

[Matt Howard]

Dance class maybe doing something at like the theater or something or maybe. No, you're probably watching Wes and Elise, the kids who used to babysit.

[Abby Biswell]

That's true. Yeah, that's true. But I'm thinking it's like so funny because, like, it seems like, you know, we were just kind of out here gallivanting, making our own decisions, but also our family. We came back to visit family so much, and family came out to visit us so much, even in that short amount of time that we were living there. And then when it came time to move, we were going to move back to like the mainland. We were like. We were telling our family, we're like, okay, so we're thinking between Utah and Arizona, everyone. Our family is like, we'll move to Arizona. Like, we could see ourselves moving to Arizona, but we never moved to Utah. We're like, okay, fine.

[Lori Biswell]

I had never been to either place, so I don't even know if I weighed in on that. I never been to either place before.

[Abby Biswell]

But you were like, I don't want the cold.

[Matt Howard]

If we would have moved to California, do you think anybody would have followed?

[Abby Biswell]

I don't know.

[Lori Biswell]

I think I was secretly voting a little Bit Florida. But I don't know if that was ever in the movie.

[Abby Biswell]

It was kind of Florida.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. Was Florida ever in the picture?

[Abby Biswell]

Nothing was off the table at this point.

[Matt Howard]

What's crazy, too, is we've vlogged all this. This is literally on our YouTube channel. Like, us going back and forth about where to move.

[Abby Biswell]

That was real.

[Matt Howard]

It was real. It was 100%. None of. None of it was scripted. None of it was real. Than any reality we, like, legitimately did not know we were.

[Lori Biswell]

People would say, why did they decide to move to Phoenix? I'm like, I think they thought it was be fun.

[Matt Howard]

And honestly, that's the answer I would have given.

[Lori Biswell]

It was not a solid read. Like, people think there's a big reason. I'm like, yeah, I think they think it would be fun. And they had some friends here, and that was.

[Abby Biswell]

That was it. We just like the sun.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

That was really it.

[Abby Biswell]

And you know what? Since then. Since we have moved here four years ago, mom and dad. My parents moved out. My grandma moved out, My brother and his wife, and they now have a daughter. Your brother and his wife, and they now have two children.

[Matt Howard]

Yep. And so we brought out 10 people, but then again.

[Abby Biswell]

And they're multiplying.

[Lori Biswell]

There's a lot of other parents of some of the other parents that are, like, temporary residents.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

Holy cow. Okay, wait. So between you and I and Griffin, Augie, and I'm not gonna say our son's name. We already know what it is. And then we have your parents and then your grandma, and then Caleb and Abby.

[Abby Biswell]

Their two. Two kids.

[Matt Howard]

Their two kids. And then Blake and addie, and they're Brielle.

[Abby Biswell]

15 people.

[Matt Howard]

15 people.

[Abby Biswell]

And also, Addie's parents come often. Your parents come often. Abby's parents come often.

[Matt Howard]

So if we move back to Hawaii, our family's gonna literally.

[Lori Biswell]

Oh, my.

[Abby Biswell]

I don't think. I don't think Lori could survive that. She has weathered so many storms. Don't do that to this woman.

[Matt Howard]

We ever move back, we'll bring her back on the podcast.

[Abby Biswell]

Here's the thing I know about mom, though. Here's the thing I know about mom.

[Matt Howard]

Well, you love Hawaii. You wrote a book about it.

[Lori Biswell]

I do.

[Abby Biswell]

She is a. She doesn't go by grandma. In fact, we get in trouble if we use that term. Our kids don't even know that you are their grandma, but she goes by honey, and she will not be separated from her grandchildren, Right?

[Lori Biswell]

No.

[Abby Biswell]

So I do think that even if we had decided to move to California, which Would not have been her choice. She would find. She would have found a way to be there.

[Lori Biswell]

I would go, true.

[Abby Biswell]

And so would my dad. Ga is his name.

[Matt Howard]

Well, yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

So the funny story behind Honey and Gah is really not that funny. It's kind of just my mom's like, when I. When you guys have kids, I'm going to go buy honey.

[Matt Howard]

And then that was because there was a kid that would call his. Or her in my class. Yeah, there was a kid in your class that would call her grandma honey.

[Abby Biswell]

And then he's like, my honey's picking me up. And then she, like, loved that. And so she had already known that that was gonna be her name. But then she's like, asking my dad, she's like, matt, what are you gonna be? And he's like, I'm gonna let the kids decide.

[Lori Biswell]

And we're like, that's what you get.

[Abby Biswell]

That's what you get. You get a name like Gah. Yeah, because when they're one year old and they can't talk, and that's. That's what they can do. And so it's Honey and Gah. And I remember Blake and Addie were like, we're not calling him Gah. It's so dumb. And then now, sure enough, they're like, brielle, look, it's Gah.

[Lori Biswell]

Everyone is like, I mean, that's who he is.

[Abby Biswell]

That's who he is.

[Matt Howard]

My favorite is when Griffin in full, like, not even stuttering once, goes, hey, guys, this is. Meet my honey and my Gah. This is my honey.

[Abby Biswell]

Ga. He introduces his friends to his Ga.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, well, he introduces dad as his friend. My friend Ga. Like, I don't think he knows. He thinks dad is a peer of his, and dad plays with them like a peer act like he's a peer. So. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, okay. That's the thing. You guys were really young, having. Getting married.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. What the frick, Lori? So you guys got married young. What was the big deal?

[Abby Biswell]

I was 20 and you were 20.

[Matt Howard]

Because that's the thing. We thought you guys were gonna be on board when we asked permission because Abby was like, my parents got married when they were young, so this was totally gonna be.

[Lori Biswell]

Dad had graduated approved two years earlier, and I graduated three months earlier.

[Abby Biswell]

I think you were 22, Mom.

[Lori Biswell]

Something like that. But seems like a big difference. Plus, dad was two years older than that.

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, well, I should have found myself an older man then, apparently.

[Lori Biswell]

I guess so. It seems different, though, if you're in college or if you're outside of college. Like, it just seems like you're in a different stage of life.

[Abby Biswell]

That's true. It is really weird being a married college.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't think I knew other kids that were married in college at the time.

[Abby Biswell]

We were weird for sure. But yeah, I think most of those kids don't end up going to college. There are a lot of kids that get married young, but not usually. No, it happens.

[Matt Howard]

If you could see yourself now, Lori, you know, all these years later, gosh, we're looking at coming up on a decade of Abby and I being a couple. So this was nine years ago when I first brought up marrying Abby. If you could have just like shown yourself when you were having like one of the saddest days of your life after you saddled and you could just see Griffith. Well, I.

[Lori Biswell]

Isn't that like a lot of things like you'? Like, if I could just see how it turned out in the end, I would have been okay. But. But yeah, of course, yeah, I would not have changed a thing then. But I just needed somebody to tell me that, that needed a magic ball.

[Abby Biswell]

And I feel like the same goes for us doing social media because like, you don't like us being public facing or like all the things that come with that. But you do love some good PR and some good social media. Some influencer benefits,

[Lori Biswell]

you know, on occasion

[Abby Biswell]

it has its purpose, happens.

[Matt Howard]

You've taken your parents on a trip before, right? Yeah, we've taken. Yeah, kind of. We've done some fun, fun travels.

[Abby Biswell]

Fun travels. Thanks to social media and some pr. Some fun opportunities. So do you think that I'm similar to you as a parent? Obviously I was like, I remember like you're my mom. I remember things. But I'm like, I really only have memories obviously of when I was way older than the age my kids are. Do you think I'm a similar parent? Like, do I think I parent my kids like you parented?

[Lori Biswell]

I probably was a little stricter than you are about things. I'm not saying that's good, but I'm just saying maybe because of teaching and like needing things to be orderly and needing, you know, things to be calm. I probably had more rules on some things than you do. And I'm. And again, and I probably, I probably needed to let more things go and it wasn't like, not behavior wise, but just like messes and it was more blank, you know, than you.

[Abby Biswell]

But noise, yeah, messes and noise.

[Lori Biswell]

Maybe because I had so much mess and noise during the day that when I came home I just really needed it to be more calm and orderly. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Let's talk about being a teacher because I feel like the combination of being a teacher and being a mom, especially to Littles at the exact same time, had to be. I know that. I mean that overstimulating, sometimes super overstimulating. Yeah. And how do you think being a teacher, like, impacted you as a mom? Thank you to Wayfair for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. If you are anything like us, if we have the opportunity to be outside, we are going to be outside. It's just a way to keep the inside of your house clean. And also the fresh air is so good for us. Also, also our physical health. The thing about your outdoor space is that it should feel like you. It should feel like an extension of your own home. I feel like we've really accomplished that in our backyard and that's why we want to spend so much time out there as well. Wayfair is awesome because they have everything from furniture and decor to organization solutions and outdoor essentials.

[Matt Howard]

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[Abby Biswell]

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[Abby Biswell]

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[Lori Biswell]

I mean you see it's. I mean at school the way other kids are behaving and you want to make sure sometimes that my maybe and maybe I went overboard but like you'd correcting things at home if you saw certain behaviors at school and maybe not behavior wise. But I also Was always very aware of, like, things you needed to know in school, you know, like benchmarks. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

I hear this. It's okay if we talk a little bit about teaching. I feel like there's a lot of teachers that listen to our podcast, too, that find this interesting.

[Lori Biswell]

Teacher Appreciation Week.

[Abby Biswell]

It's Teacher Appreciation Week as well.

[Matt Howard]

That's amazing.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes.

[Matt Howard]

It won't be by the time this episode goes out.

[Abby Biswell]

I know, but you should appreciate the teachers.

[Matt Howard]

We appreciate all of the teachers.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. I think that something I hear you say and something a lot of teachers that have taught for, like, through the years more, like, have some more experience, say, like, teaching is not what it used to be.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. I just think the main thing. I mean, I think it's a lot of things, but a lot of it is. Is the discipline in the schools and things that, you know, kids are probably not raised quite the same as they were.

[Abby Biswell]

You think it starts at 30 years old.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. And therefore, at school, you're getting the kids coming from those households that are very different than maybe some. Than some of them they were in the past. And it's hard to know what to do with that. Then your hands are tied a lot of times. And a lot of times the parents don't, you know, are not on your side, are not on the teacher's side.

[Abby Biswell]

Mm. What's the thing that frustrates you the most about, like, how schools and specifically you taught at a public school, like, how public schools are talked about in America, like, now in the media? Like, what's the thing that bothers you the most?

[Lori Biswell]

I mean, I can only speak for the Quincy public schools, and the Quincy public schools are great. And the teachers I know are super hardworking, and they spend countless hours at school. They love the kids in their classes. And so I think, unfortunately, in the news, you're gonna have, you know, there's gonna be this random teacher in this state, did this thing, and this random teacher, but that's. You could do that for any profession that you can find somebody who's not doing what they're supposed to be doing and who's done something wrong. But. But for the great, great majority of the teachers, it's not that way. And so I kind of feel like they're getting a bad rap for a small amount of people that are doing something, because the teachers that I know work super, super hard. And it's not just teachers. It's the para educators, it's the administrators, who also get ripped on by people unfairly. Because I do know I work Closely with the administrators the last few years and how hard that they work and, you know, having to juggle between what the parents want, what the school district want, the superintendent wants, what the. About the kids. And it's hard.

[Abby Biswell]

I think that's frustrating, too. Like, I obviously can't know personally, but just being closely related to many teachers. You. Both my grandmas like the fact that teachers have to face criticism from parents, the public, like, everyone. And then they're also just, like, severely underpaid and working so hard that it's just like, I feel like it's. There are there points where, like, what the heck am I doing this for? And what does it boil down to?

[Lori Biswell]

It's. It's tough. And I think about all the time now that I'm not teaching, and I'm like, wow, you know, you can. You really appreciate that when you're not in it at the moment anymore, you know, like, that's so. It's so much work and with not a lot of give back to you, I guess I don't.

[Abby Biswell]

It's kind of like, yeah, well, it's for the kids.

[Lori Biswell]

Yes.

[Abby Biswell]

And also, mom always told me that she chose the job, like, being a teacher primarily because she was like, it'll be the best schedule for having kids. And that was great. We spent all summers together. Obviously, I went with mom to school and then went home with her to school. She was my very own third grade teacher and Blake's. And so we were basically, like, always attached to the hip when you really think about it. And I think that's something. One of the many things that I, like, got from you was like, just this prioritizing of motherhood. And it just. It wasn't even something I consciously thought about. Like, it just happened where I was like, we have to find something that works for having kids, like, so I can spend as much time with them as possible. Because that is, like, the most important thing.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

That's what led us to. Honestly, what we're doing now. Obviously, I didn't even foresee this as being an option because I did go to school, end up going to school to be a teacher, because I was like, well, I guess this is the best schedule for kids. And in so many ways, I was

[Lori Biswell]

like, because that was my priority. Being a parent was my priority.

[Matt Howard]

Right.

[Lori Biswell]

But also, I needed to earn an income, so that was the best thing I need to do.

[Abby Biswell]

And I followed your footsteps nearly exactly.

[Matt Howard]

It's kind of funny the degree paths we went down, because after I got grilled by your mom on, like, having finances together. I was like, I guess I need to do, like, finance.

[Abby Biswell]

I gotta switch finance.

[Matt Howard]

I gotta figure out this money stuff so I can afford to be married.

[Lori Biswell]

Theater thing in the beginning was a little.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah. I was like, I don't want. I don't want, like, her parents to hate me because I, like, married their daughter. And now we're, like, broke and can't pay for our food. Like, we gotta figure this out. It is weird. It's weird, though. Like, the. The freaking changes. Like, we were so set on doing theater and so set on being performed,

[Abby Biswell]

and we honestly dropped it so easily.

[Matt Howard]

We dropped it because we just put ourselves. We put our relationship first.

[Lori Biswell]

It was. I was shocked. It was like, at Christmas time, when you're. You're like, I think I'm changing my major, education, and Massachusetts to finance. I'm like, wow.

[Abby Biswell]

And, you know, I don't know how to explain it, but at the time, it was just.

[Matt Howard]

It was natural.

[Abby Biswell]

Like, it wasn't that sad. It wasn't that scary. It was just like. I guess we just.

[Lori Biswell]

So.

[Abby Biswell]

We were very young, I feel like, to have, like, we really had our priorities.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Clearly mapped out for.

[Matt Howard]

It was like, it was us before careers. 100%.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. And, like, family, marriage, and it's always kind of been that way. And I think it's because of the people that raised us that. That made that not, like, anything crazy at the time. Okay. So we talked about you being a honey. I've asked mom this before, but, you know, for the sake of the cameras and the mics.

[Lori Biswell]

Okay.

[Abby Biswell]

Matt's mom says that she enjoys being a grandma more than she enjoyed being a mom.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

She doesn't mean. And that sounds bad the way I'm saying it, but she's saying, like, basically what I hear a lot of grandmas say. They're like, you get all the perks of the children. Like, you get to have them. Like, when it's fun, it's not overwhelming, but you don't have to deal with, like, you know, the sleepless nights, the, like, you know, the discipline, things like that.

[Lori Biswell]

But what would you say that all makes sense? That. I mean, that all makes sense. But I also want to say that I loved being a parent so much that. That I never thought that that would be matched or topped. And so that's why I was saying before, like, for so many years before you graduate, I was, like, dreading, dreading, dreading, dreading, dreading. Because I didn't want it to be over and at. At Some point, like, in the last, I don't know, four years or whatever, you know, before Griffin was born, I was like, wait a second. Because the things I like, I liked doing so many things, like, doing fun things for, like, the holidays or, you know, any of those things.

[Abby Biswell]

Mom has so many themed dinners, and

[Lori Biswell]

so I love doing those things. And I'm like. And so then at some point, I'm like, I could actually do this all over again. Because I kept thinking there was like, this was, like, the end. This is the end of my fun. This was the end of everything I loved. Because you guys are grown. It's over. And then I'm like, you know what? It doesn't have to be over. You can actually start all over again and do the same stuff again, but just slightly different, you know, she's already started.

[Abby Biswell]

She's had, like, little parties for the kids, and.

[Matt Howard]

So cute.

[Abby Biswell]

You're raising them to be Little Minnie. They're mini honeys on their personalities in some ways. Like, Griffin loves a party. He loves a theme. And I think Augie's gonna be the same way, but he's just not able to vocalize it as much. And so, yeah, like, it's just fun

[Lori Biswell]

to think, you know, that that doesn't have to actually end in your life. It can just repeat it in a slightly different way. And that's what I'm. I hope to do.

[Abby Biswell]

They had, like, a little Grinch party at her house over Christmas and things like that. This is not new for her, though, because growing up, I remember we did dinners around the world. So, like, we would have, like, a themed night, and mom would try to prepare food from. Now, I don't know how authentic. Authentic they were, but we. I like Italian night.

[Lori Biswell]

I got CDs from the library for the music to go with it.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, we had CDs for music.

[Matt Howard]

You weren't you attending, like, some sort of kids college course?

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, mom taught kids college.

[Matt Howard]

You taught kids college?

[Abby Biswell]

It was ratatouille. Disney theme.

[Lori Biswell]

Oh, yeah, that was.

[Abby Biswell]

That remind. Yeah. Mom taught a kid's college course. It was ratatouille.

[Lori Biswell]

I did a French and Italian cooking class that had a theme of, like, ratatouille or, I don't know, ratatouille lady and the Tramp.

[Abby Biswell]

Mom never stopped teaching, when you really think about it. And she also always found a way to tie in Disney, which leads my next question. Do you identify as a Disney adult?

[Lori Biswell]

Yes.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Lori Biswell]

But not in a creepy, weird way. I don't know what you consider a Disney adult.

[Abby Biswell]

But I don't know. I just feel like I. It was news to me that this was something that was.

[Lori Biswell]

I know there's some kind of a cult Disney adult culture.

[Matt Howard]

I think what that is weirder when, like, the Disney adults, like, have to get their picture with, like, all the characters.

[Lori Biswell]

No, I'm not that.

[Matt Howard]

And get them to, like, sign their book.

[Lori Biswell]

No, no, no, no, I'm not that. If you just consider Disney adults an adult who loves to go to Disney,

[Abby Biswell]

then yes, because I will say my parents take solo trips to Disney frequently. And here's the thing I need to know. Like, this doesn't follow Dad's personality. Not really. But he goes.

[Lori Biswell]

He would rather go there than, I think, you know, again, we had so much fun going as a family that, you know, you continue doing something that you've always loved. And honestly, the first time dad and I went without you guys, I'm like, this is not gonna be any fun.

[Abby Biswell]

And you had a lot of fun.

[Lori Biswell]

And it was really fun, you know, because you do eliminate some things. Not that we were doing this up until, you know, you're not pushing strollers. You're not. Although obviously you guys were going in high school, and we weren't doing that still. But, you know, it is something to be just.

[Matt Howard]

You can. You can start to understand, which I don't think there's any excuse for this, but you can understand, like, why some parents hit their breaking point. Like, at Disney, there's always some parent that's, like, having a meltdown at their kid.

[Abby Biswell]

I know that adults have meltdowns. And toddlers at Disney.

[Matt Howard]

I know. I'm like, chill out, dude.

[Lori Biswell]

You're the happiest place on earth.

[Matt Howard]

You brought your kids to Disney. But I will say, that last Disney trip that we took, I was so tired.

[Abby Biswell]

We were close to having a meltdown.

[Matt Howard]

Like, you know, you're waiting in a line for an hour just to ride a ride for 45 seconds. And then you're just like, ugh.

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, here's the thing.

[Lori Biswell]

It's not an easy vacation. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

We have such good memories of driving there and that, you know, the DVD players in the car. My dad had to leave in the middle of the night. Cause he was just too excited to wait till the morning.

[Lori Biswell]

There is an old commercial that people my age would know that, like, the kids are, like, in bed. They're talking. It's an old Disney commercial. They're like, I can't sleep. I'm too excited. And then at the end, it pans to the parents And I guess it's the dad saying the same thing to his wife. Like, I can't sleep.

[Abby Biswell]

I'm too excited.

[Lori Biswell]

And that's literally.

[Abby Biswell]

That was my. It's like, funny to make jokes about Disney adults, but there's actually just so much nostalgia wrapped up in it for our family. Because Disney used to have. They called it fast passes, but they were physical paper tickets to get a quick. Like, you didn't have to pay extra for them.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

You just had to get there first. And my dad.

[Lori Biswell]

Shy man about it.

[Abby Biswell]

What'd you say?

[Lori Biswell]

I wasn't competitive about it.

[Abby Biswell]

Very competitive. Like, he would, like, speed walk.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Sweating. Like, running to, like, I have memories of him, like, just sprinting to Splash Mountain. Oh, my gosh. Not even Splash Mountain anymore. Like, sprinting. Yeah, no, but just sprinting. And we got the paper tickets.

[Lori Biswell]

I can remember saying something to him about this. Like, don't. Just don't stress about it.

[Abby Biswell]

We had to wake up at, like, 5.

[Lori Biswell]

I want to make sure. He's like, I want to make sure the kids get to go on all the stuff that they want to do. And I'm like, okay.

[Abby Biswell]

Well, yeah. There was no question, always with family vacations, that it was. It was about the kids. It was about us. So that was really. We have so many good memories. And so I say Disney adult in a fond way, not in a weird, creepy way.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know what the definition of that is. I think they think.

[Abby Biswell]

I think the Internet thinks Disney adults are obnoxious.

[Lori Biswell]

That's not me.

[Abby Biswell]

That's not. That's not Mom. She does have a lot of special Disney backpacks and ears.

[Matt Howard]

She has every single one. I don't most of them.

[Lori Biswell]

I have a couple.

[Abby Biswell]

She has a couple little.

[Lori Biswell]

Do you know there's probably hundreds and hundreds.

[Matt Howard]

Really? There's hundreds of these things.

[Abby Biswell]

There's a whole cult behind us.

[Matt Howard]

How many, actually, do you have?

[Lori Biswell]

Four or five?

[Matt Howard]

Okay. How many? How many popcorn buckets, though?

[Lori Biswell]

I. The kids love them. Only half the.

[Matt Howard]

They are fun. I was so upset when you let us borrow your popcorn bucket and it didn't work at Disneyland. What the heck?

[Lori Biswell]

I did not realize that it should

[Matt Howard]

work at all the parks. Come on, people.

[Abby Biswell]

I guess I have two.

[Lori Biswell]

I have two Christmas ones so that when the boys come over Christmas time, they wear them around their neck and then I fill it with snacks for them.

[Abby Biswell]

Not popcorn. Cause we don't let them have popcorn.

[Lori Biswell]

Popcorn.

[Abby Biswell]

These are the puffs from Trader Joe's.

[Matt Howard]

If people were confused in the comments on why we weren't letting our kids Popcorn. They're like, like, you don't let your kids have popcorn, but you let them have a Slurpee. And I'm like, yeah, cuz a Slurpee is not a choking hazard, silly goose.

[Abby Biswell]

Choking. Talk to some nurses that have worked in icu.

[Matt Howard]

Grapes are choking hazard. Certain candies are. Yeah. Oh, nuts.

[Abby Biswell]

Certain nuts.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Abby Biswell]

And popcorn.

[Lori Biswell]

Younger maybe than your kids?

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, our kids love cashews.

[Abby Biswell]

No, I, I think it's really the shell aspect.

[Matt Howard]

Like, oh yeah, our kids are bougie. They love cashews and, and blackberries.

[Lori Biswell]

Could be worse. Could be.

[Abby Biswell]

It could be bougier.

[Matt Howard]

I used to think those were like

[Abby Biswell]

just, you know, what's actually bougie is the, is the Johnny Pops that they like. Johnny Pops because they go through so much of them.

[Matt Howard]

What even is that?

[Abby Biswell]

The no sugar added like popsicles.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Anyway, so now. Okay, back to Quincy. Quincy. Lived in Quincy your whole life, circling back.

[Matt Howard]

Okay.

[Abby Biswell]

Raised. And then you made the move out here to Arizona. I guess. Wait, is this too far back?

[Matt Howard]

No, we don't. I mean, I guess maybe, maybe the question is how is it living in Arizona now when you lived your entire life in this small town in Illinois?

[Lori Biswell]

It's weird, you know, like you get used to, here are the restaurants I go to, here are the, you know, things I do because it's what's available. And now, you know, there's like an endless amount of things that's available to do and places to eat and go. You don't have the same people here though, as we did, you know, so some of that, you know, it's. I would, I have only positive things to say about Quincy.

[Matt Howard]

Do you miss that small town community? Because everybody kind of knows everyone.

[Lori Biswell]

You know, honestly, one thing I miss are going to our high school basketball games, which are a big deal in Quincy.

[Matt Howard]

That's so sweet.

[Lori Biswell]

And I, that's one thing I love doing. And you know, certain restaurants, Tiramisu, Gym City, those are like, we still talk

[Abby Biswell]

about like TCY isn't even local, but it feels local.

[Lori Biswell]

Right. We, you know, have all these places to go here, but like, we're like, you can never get better Italian food than tiramisu or better pizza nachos than Gym City.

[Abby Biswell]

And so, you know, the town where there's just more Mexican and pizza combos than.

[Lori Biswell]

But it works.

[Abby Biswell]

It works. It works.

[Lori Biswell]

Somehow it works. And people that I taught with and other people, friends of mine, you know, I miss those kinds of things, but it's hard to beat the sunshine every day here. And honestly, if you guys had moved to some dreary place that I didn't like, I. We probably still would have gone.

[Abby Biswell]

Really?

[Matt Howard]

Seriously?

[Lori Biswell]

Of course, yeah.

[Matt Howard]

So if we move again, will you guys follow us?

[Lori Biswell]

We're not gonna discuss that.

[Abby Biswell]

She's like, no, Matt. Okay, so we polled our audience. They knew that you were going to be on the podcast. And we polled our audience and asked questions. I'm too afraid to ask my mom. And so they're gonna ask you those questions. Questions the audience you're representing, all moms.

[Lori Biswell]

Oh, this is a lot of pressure. Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

So don't take this lightly. Oh, this one's a random one.

[Matt Howard]

What is it?

[Abby Biswell]

It says, was there someone you almost married instead of your spouse?

[Lori Biswell]

No. Me personally?

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

No. Why are you saying no?

[Abby Biswell]

I'm not.

[Lori Biswell]

I'm like, no.

[Matt Howard]

Did you. Wait, did you ever date anybody that I date?

[Lori Biswell]

Other people, but not.

[Matt Howard]

What?

[Lori Biswell]

Nobody. Seriously?

[Matt Howard]

Just kidding.

[Lori Biswell]

In college. Here's the thing.

[Abby Biswell]

This is the example I had of my parents. Like, first of all, let me just. We can take this out if we need to, but there was a time when both the kids were really young and we needed to go to LA for a work thing, but we didn't want to leave the kids. We were like, mom, could you just come and just like, while we're working, you watch the kids and then we'll just be back and like, do it. And then the question you asked me was, but what am I gonna do with your dad? Yeah, it was like a two day trip. And I was like, matt, this honestly symbolizes like, they are.

[Lori Biswell]

This was right when we moved here too.

[Matt Howard]

This was when we interviewed Taylor Lautner and Tay Lautner.

[Abby Biswell]

Like, mom felt like she needed to. She, like, they just couldn't leave. Well, dad. And it's sweet because this is like, this is the example of marriage. Like, I feel like you guys were always. You were guys were. You were just a unit. Like, you just like, were always together. Like, there was never. So I think when I got married, there was some confusion for me. Like, when I. If I. If Matt was sick, he wanted to sleep in a different bedroom because he's like, I don't want to get you sick. But, like, dad would literally never think of that. Like, he would literally be like, if you're getting sick, I'm getting sick too. Like, we're both getting sick. Like that. And that was just like. It was like they were both like, there. It's just. It's not one's better than the other. But I think that, you know, you. You look at your parents marriage, growing up, and then you.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

Just think you're gonna do the same exact thing, and you're like, oh, wait, this isn't the same thing. And so when Matt, like, once, he's like, I'm gonna sleep better if I'm like. I'm like. But you don't do that. You simply just don't do that. Like, that was just. Whereas your parents.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, it's crazy.

[Abby Biswell]

Married.

[Matt Howard]

It's crazy that you married your father. You know, you married someone who's like, just.

[Abby Biswell]

You're nothing like my dad. You're nothing like my dad, but you're not, so. Okay, sorry. How do you keep love growing in a long marriage? Deep question, Mom. Try to go there for me.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know. Just like we were talking about thinking about the other person and not having yourself first always, and going on dates and doing fun things and not keeping everything the same always. And conversations and Maybe.

[Matt Howard]

Maybe some PDA in there as well.

[Abby Biswell]

No, mom is more PDA than she thinks.

[Matt Howard]

Your parents are 10 times more PDA than my parents. I don't even my parents. The most I'll see them do is be like, love you. Like, it's like. Like a one little, like, tiny kiss. And, like, your parents will just be, like, getting cozy on the couch.

[Lori Biswell]

Cuddle.

[Matt Howard]

Cuddle.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know.

[Abby Biswell]

You cuddle. You do a little butt smacking.

[Lori Biswell]

I do not do that.

[Matt Howard]

But, yeah, there's butt smacking's going on. Everyone's slapping each other's butts.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know.

[Abby Biswell]

No, she said, I don't know.

[Matt Howard]

Did you pant? Weren't you, like, pantsing Matt for a while? Was that a thing?

[Abby Biswell]

No, me and Blake did that.

[Matt Howard]

Oh, you were pantsing your dad?

[Abby Biswell]

Yes. Ah, yeah. No problem.

[Lori Biswell]

That's some good.

[Abby Biswell]

Classic.

[Matt Howard]

Were you off limits to the pantsing? I'm guessing probably not. Oh, my God.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't remember.

[Abby Biswell]

I'm sure there was an age that that became no longer. But I kept doing it to Blake. I still do it to Blake in my. I still did. That's messed up. Anyway, when did you know you were ready to have children?

[Lori Biswell]

Hmm. I think I. Like you were saying. I think I did a lot of the same things that my parents did. You know, actually, my parents met at the same college, then dad and I met the same college, and they got married right after they graduated. We got, you know, some of the same things. And actually a lot the Same professions, kind of between.

[Abby Biswell]

What is up with our family?

[Lori Biswell]

Dad and my dad and me and my mom. But anyway, I don't know. I think it was something I always knew we were gonna do. And after two years of being married, it seemed like about the right time. And was there. I don't know if I. What specifically? If there was a moment that I thought this was the right time, but I don't know, it just seemed, like, natural that it would be then.

[Abby Biswell]

This one's specifically for moms of girls. When moms have girls, do they try to live through them vicariously?

[Lori Biswell]

I think probably a lot of times they do. Probably. I mean, obviously, that's not what you should be doing, and I hope I didn't try to do that. I think I tried to just have you do what you like to do and what made you happy. They weren't things that I had done as a child, so it wasn't like, oh, I was. I failed at dance, so hopefully you're good at dance or something like that. You did your own things. But I don't think I lit, you know, I think you just hopefully want to see your child succeed and whatever makes them happy.

[Abby Biswell]

This reminds me of something that you brought up earlier. Like, towards the beginning, you were talking about how, like, I had done a short stint of, like, trying instruments, and I never liked playing instruments. But what's funny is that, like, a lot of parenting advice that I hear is, like, if your kids start something, make them finish it. But I remember mom got this piano. I think someone gave it to you.

[Lori Biswell]

No, that's kind of a bad story.

[Abby Biswell]

Why?

[Lori Biswell]

I can remember we first got married, and I was like, I'm gonna go buy. We needed some piece of furniture. I can remember on a Sunday, and I was gonna go buy it, and somehow I saw this auction, and I'm like, that's a nice piano. And so I can distinctly remember, because we always had a piano growing up, calling dad and saying, it's about to rain. And I actually just bought a piano at this auction. Could you come pick it up? Of course, that's not an easy thing to get. Instead of buying the thing I was set out to get that day.

[Matt Howard]

But anyway, you didn't tell them how much it was. You just went and purchased it.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. And that, like, hey, go get it right now. Somehow pick up this big piano, because it's about to rain. Of course, outside. And we had a very, very tiny house and no room for a piano. But anyway,

[Abby Biswell]

so we had a piano. And then mom finally, my mom, like, you were, like, hooking me up with a piano instructor. And just the thought of that for whatever. I was so young. Like, I was like, kindergarten or something. Apparently, in my little kindergarten head, I was like, that is not happening. And I was like, I refused. And she was like, fine. Get rid of the piano. We're not doing it. She did. I didn't do. I don't think I did one lesson.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't remember.

[Abby Biswell]

And I. And I was doing really bad at soccer. I was so bad at it. I was good when I was little because I, like, mentally knew the sport, but then when it required athletic ability and other girls were getting more aggressive, I just want to stop. Pretty sure you guys let me quit soccer in the middle of season, too.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know if those were good advices to give, but I think, yeah, we're like, if you don't like it, I don't know.

[Abby Biswell]

You're like, we were stricter than you, and then you just letting me drop out of it.

[Lori Biswell]

If you were quitting everything and you weren't involved in anything at all.

[Abby Biswell]

I was doing other things.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, you were doing a lot of things.

[Abby Biswell]

Thank you to Kindred bravely for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. I am a huge fan of dropping off a meal at a friend or family member's house when they've had a new baby.

[Matt Howard]

And you're so good at it. You do it all the time.

[Abby Biswell]

Well, the reason I do it is because so many people have filled in for us in that way when we've had both loss and new life, and it has made all the difference for us. A lot of times, I like to put in some new mom essentials. You could always, always use new or more nursing bras. And Kindred Bravely, I promise you, does nursing bras the best. But they also have so many other things. Whether you're in the middle of a pregnancy journey or adjusting to life with a newborn, you have things as a woman that are constantly shifting, including what feels comfortable. And having a bra that stretches to you and supports you is so necessary. I even just love their pajama sets that I'm using right now. I need jammies that actually accommodate the bump.

[Matt Howard]

And you look. Look so cute.

[Abby Biswell]

And they do. And they also just make me just feel beautiful and comfortable, even when I'm sleeping. Kindred bravely makes intimates and apparel for maternity postpartum breastfeeding, as well as baby essentials, all designed to make motherhood feel a little less overwhelming and a lot more supported. They have been trusted by millions of moms since 2015. And everything is designed by moms who've been there, which having products that support you in that critical season makes makes such a huge difference. So right now, Kindred bravely is offering our listeners 20 off your first order. When you go to kindredbravely.comUnplanned, that is kindredbravely.comUnPlanned for 20% off your first order. Make sure you use our link so they know that we sent you. Exclusions apply. What were you most nervous about having kids?

[Lori Biswell]

I think what I was nervous about was more things that were not in my control or even your control, like safety things or something bad happening or something that nobody could control. So I didn't think. I was never nervous about a decision you were gonna make or those kinds of things, you know, as a child or, you know, I don't think I was too worried about anything that we were doing on our part, but nervous about other things happening.

[Abby Biswell]

What's one thing you wish you did differently? Raising your kids? Do you don't want to answer that?

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know differently. I mean, I always wish that I was able to stay home full time and that I could have come up with a way at the time to do that. I just didn't know of a better solution. You know, there are a lot more opportunities now, I think, to work from home or, you know, have some kind of a flexible schedule that there weren't at the time.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, a lot of, like, this is

[Lori Biswell]

the best way to come up with. Yeah, it's like same schedule as your kids kind of a thing.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, Well, I didn't ever. I felt like we were always with you, so I don't really have, like, any type of. Okay. Do you secretly have a favorite kid?

[Lori Biswell]

No, but I.

[Abby Biswell]

Not true.

[Lori Biswell]

I think I have.

[Matt Howard]

It's. You.

[Lori Biswell]

I have. No, you have your kids. One of them is your favorite for fill in the blank here, one of them's your favorite for another, you know, for different reasons, not favorite overall.

[Abby Biswell]

Did you say fill in the blank year?

[Lori Biswell]

No.

[Abby Biswell]

Oh, here.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't know what I said, but basically, no, you don't have a favorite kid, but you have. You connect with each child on different levels for different reasons. And. No, that's not really a fair question. Anyway.

[Abby Biswell]

I never really felt like there were favorites, to be fair. How do grandparents take boundaries that new parents set?

[Lori Biswell]

I mean, I think you have to bite your tongue a little bit sometimes and say, this is not exactly the way I would have done it. But these are not my children. I'm not raising my children. So I have to. A lot of times, you know, well, mom, you know, mom doesn't want you to do this, so we're not gonna do this right now. Or maybe this is something, a rule that I know dad has on something. Not that you guys have tons of rules, but you know what I mean? Like these are things, you know, maybe with what they eat or something like that, that maybe it's not exactly the way you would have done it, but you have to go with what the parents want. So, I mean, if there's something big that is unhealthy for them for some reason, then you'd have to talk you guys about it, but the parents about it. But otherwise, if it's just a parenting style, you have to go with what the parents want.

[Abby Biswell]

I have to give you kudos because I feel like you do this really well. Like with the kids, you're like, well, you have to ask mom or mom says we can't do that. You don't really go off the cuff with disciplining them. Dad breaks the screen time rule.

[Lori Biswell]

Dad breaks several rules.

[Matt Howard]

Probably just pull up Darth Vader on his.

[Abby Biswell]

He gives them whatever he wants they want.

[Lori Biswell]

I think. Yeah, it's not just the screen time. It's if they ask jelly beans.

[Abby Biswell]

Probably, probably.

[Lori Biswell]

Who knows what they're doing right now.

[Matt Howard]

We need to have an intervention with your dad.

[Abby Biswell]

Sit down.

[Matt Howard]

Like, you need to come to us

[Abby Biswell]

before the parents lost cause because I know that she's gonna rein it in. So I'm like, thank you.

[Lori Biswell]

I'll correct him. But he doesn't sls.

[Abby Biswell]

But then once he hands them Darth Vader, I'm like, what are we gonna do?

[Matt Howard]

Game over.

[Abby Biswell]

It's game over. We've lost. We've lost to gah. But you do a really good job of that.

[Lori Biswell]

Thank you.

[Abby Biswell]

Can't give this. I can't say the same for dad. Do moms really not judge? This person says, my mom says she won't, but she seems to have strong opinions.

[Lori Biswell]

Judge what?

[Abby Biswell]

I'm taking this as, like, parenting decisions.

[Lori Biswell]

I'm sure a lot of parents do.

[Abby Biswell]

Like among your friends, they're like, are they like, oh my gosh, my daughter or my son in law or my son is doing this?

[Lori Biswell]

I don't think too many of the people that I'm talking to do okay. Which would be.

[Abby Biswell]

We would know who they are.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, no, they're not doing that. I Think. I think the parents of people, the kids your age, whatever, the grandparents are pretty supportive of what their kids are doing with their grandkids. That's sweet.

[Abby Biswell]

That's gracious too. Do you think it's harder to parent today or when you were raising kids? We talked about this on Always here.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, I think it's harder today just because of social media for one thing. Just access to so much more that you didn't have. You had more control over where your kids were, what they were viewing or what, you know, who they were talking to then, now. And now there's so many avenues that you could get in trouble, I guess, and have issues. So I think it's harder now than in the past.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah. When you think about it like me growing up, my world was so small. It didn't feel that way until I got probably to high school and I was like, oh, there's things I want to do that I can't do here. But like the, and that was the first time I had social media too was when I was like in high school. Like the world felt so small and now it feels like because of the access. The world is so big, which is good for so many reasons. But just when you're, you're developing brain, like it's almost like that was a good like growing zone, like a healthy, safe environment to grow in, to be prepared for the world at large. But now it's like they're just like dunked in the deep end.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Abby Biswell]

You know what I mean?

[Lori Biswell]

There are a lot more decisions you have to make now on what you can allow or what you don't allow. Whereas those things weren't available then.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, like life was pretty. I don't want to say it was

[Lori Biswell]

simple but like it seemed safer or it seemed. And maybe that's not true, but it, yeah, it seems like that.

[Abby Biswell]

Like you could have, I mean I wow, this feels really fear mongering. But you could have like a predator in your own house just on a device, you know what I mean? Like things like that, that feels scary and like the fact of like things getting posted, like something could be happening and then it's also made public to so many more eyes. Like if you think about bullying or

[Lori Biswell]

things like that, I mean now if for your child to watch a movie, they have access to everything, seriously in the world unless you've put some, you know, controls on your tv. Whereas in the past you put a, you got a dvd, Disney dvd, you put it in there, you had to watch thousands of. That's you know what they're gonna see.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

You don't have to make even Disney plus.

[Matt Howard]

Like, Disney plus has R rated movies, so you gotta make sure that your kid is watching, like the Disney plus kids version, you know? Yeah, you're right. It's harder.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah.

[Matt Howard]

When did you realize that Abby's job was legitimate?

[Abby Biswell]

I think when I know what she's gonna say.

[Matt Howard]

What?

[Abby Biswell]

Go ahead.

[Lori Biswell]

When we. We were at a Hotel in St. Louis. I don't know what we were doing there. And you're like, mom, I think I might. I might quit college now to pursue the social media. And I'm like, this seems bad idea.

[Abby Biswell]

I don't remember this conversation.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah, I remember where we were sitting in the booth in. In the hotel.

[Abby Biswell]

What hotel was this?

[Lori Biswell]

The Hyatt Hyatt place.

[Abby Biswell]

I was gonna quit college or was I gonna graduate early?

[Lori Biswell]

You first were gonna quit and then

[Matt Howard]

you found out that you could graduate.

[Lori Biswell]

And then I said, please do me a favor before you just quit, can you please go talk to somebody and see if they can look at all the credits, if they can gather together

[Abby Biswell]

to make a degree that made this possible, that I could have a degree.

[Lori Biswell]

I think that's true.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, you kinda.

[Lori Biswell]

And then a couple days later you're like, hey, yeah, they said, I can get this degree. I have enough credits for this degree. And I'm like, okay, well, there's something

[Abby Biswell]

there when you're like, I'm gonna drop out. And they're like, actually, you have enough credits right now to graduate. And I was like, oh, sick, sick. Let's walk in.

[Matt Howard]

Graduation, Was that in the summer?

[Lori Biswell]

No, no, it was like at a crossover.

[Matt Howard]

It was around Christmas time.

[Lori Biswell]

Wait, so I don't know if it's Christmas, but at least it was the end. It was like getting towards the end

[Abby Biswell]

of that fall semester.

[Matt Howard]

Wow. Yeah.

[Lori Biswell]

So maybe. I don't know if I thought it was legit then, but at least I thought you thought it was legit at the time.

[Matt Howard]

But I remember having the conversation with my dad where I was like, I was so proud to tell him that we made six figures because that was like. Like when I was a kid, that was like the number that my dad was like, if you can make six figures, that you've made it.

[Abby Biswell]

You know, like, that's like with inflate inflation, it's gotten.

[Matt Howard]

Now I think it's higher than that, but yeah. No, I was like. I was like, dad, we made six figures.

[Abby Biswell]

No, that was something you'd really be proud of.

[Matt Howard]

And then. And I was like, sorry that I dropped out of college.

[Abby Biswell]

I'm sure he was. Your parents have always been really supportive, too. So someone wrote in and I'm not making this up. How do I get my kids to turn out like Abby?

[Matt Howard]

That's a good question. You're a perfect person.

[Lori Biswell]

To be honest with you. I've had other parents ask me that. I can remember a parent in my class asked me that about you guys. And I'm like, so sweet. Yeah. I remember the parent who actually has wonderful girls. Like, so she obviously was on doing the right thing. And so I'm, you know, I'm not gonna be Take credit for that. But you were a really easy child and obedient, and it was. That's probably why I didn't want anything to change, because it was easy and it was fun. And I don't think there's any big secret that I.

[Abby Biswell]

When I think about you as a parent, like, I think about. Like, I don't remember there being a lot of rules or, like, you described yourself as strict. I don't remember that. But I feel like you had really high expectations for us that gave us the confidence to, like, achieve that, because it's like, you held it. Like, I feel like a trap of parenthood that I'm afraid to fall into is like, I don't ever want anything to be hard for my kids.

[Lori Biswell]

Like, I don't.

[Abby Biswell]

I want to make it easy. But then I think that you, like, expecting, like, no. Like, having that expectation. It wasn't even like, oh, I hope you can do this. It was literally like, no, this is the standard. It gave me the confidence. I was like, well, I must be able to meet that standard. And that went for behavior. But I'm also thinking about, like, in school, like, I was like, you weren't like, you have to do this. In fact, I was telling Matt the other day, I was like, you let me skip first hour. You encouraged me to skip first hour.

[Lori Biswell]

Well, I think at one time, I was like, you're working too hard.

[Abby Biswell]

Slow down, girl.

[Lori Biswell]

Yeah. And I'm like, you don't have to get an A in everything. You can just. B's are fine. And if you. You know, because you were working really hard and were involved in everything, and I was like, just like, I wanted

[Abby Biswell]

to try out for everything. And it. I, Like, I really felt like, I always talk, like, talk about this. Like, I have such a huge ego, apparently. But also growing up, and even I'm gonna say I care. It carries into adulthood. Like, I just Feel like I never really struggled with confidence. But I don't think that was just an ax. Like, I don't think I was born that way. Like, I think it was truthfully, like, both my parents fully believing me from the day I was born to, like, never once stopping. Like, I always tell the story about dad saying, like, you could be president

[Matt Howard]

of the United States.

[Abby Biswell]

I could be president of the United States. And I was like, yeah, I could. But, gosh, that doesn't sound very fun. Like, I literally believe that. I was like, I'm personally.

[Lori Biswell]

Now, actually, I said that to him the other day because I heard you bring that up. And he goes, she could still now if she wanted to.

[Abby Biswell]

Like, this is the people that raised me. Like, how do you ever. Like, because she could still do that.

[Lori Biswell]

She could still do that. But. And yeah, I don't think I was strict as. As in. I think that I. Maybe that is the wrong connotation. Like, I don't think I was. Because I don't think I had to be strict with you guys. I just, you know, like, I don't.

[Abby Biswell]

I. I was never grounded growing up.

[Lori Biswell]

I don't recall you ever really being in trouble, like, because you just did it.

[Abby Biswell]

I think the main thing I did was sass back. And I remember that I remembered saying duh to you guys and getting in trouble for that. And I also did this when they were talking to me.

[Lori Biswell]

And I.

[Abby Biswell]

You only do that once. You know, there's a couple things you only do once. You only say duh once. You only call your brother a maggot once.

[Lori Biswell]

Did you do that?

[Abby Biswell]

Yep. I heard. Liz, I was on Lizzie McGuire and actually a kid at recess told me that was a bad word, but he actually was mixing that up with, he's like, such a bad word. And I was like, really? That's crazy, because it's on Disney Channel. And I like. And here's the thing in my head then it was a bad word and I could never say it again. There's so many things I'm like, I grew up so sheltered, but I went to public schools. And I think there's a lot of parents are, like, so fearful of public schools because they're like, what is my kid gonna be exposed to? Which is so valid.

[Matt Howard]

Even our 2 and 3 year old learned the word shut up up from freaking Monsters, Inc. Who. Who would have known that?

[Abby Biswell]

Monsters, Inc. Those two little, like those two monsters that work at the factory, they're like, they'll just. You'll shut up. And then Griffin Said that. And he goes, the guy on Monsters Inc. Said it. Shut up. And I was like, oh, gosh. Oh, my gosh. What can you show your kids these days? But. And then I was like, I grew up watching that, and I'm okay. But, like, I also remember, like, okay, this is how sheltered I was going to a full public school, also in a small town, but also, you know who I mean. Everybody is exposed to everything. And so I just. I remember a girl said to me. She's like, there is a bad word that starts with F, and it's three letters. And she's like, it's F, U, C. And I was like, that's not a word. And I was pretty much right. But she's like, no, my dad said it, and it's a bad word. And I don't know why. Like, in my head, whatever I said around my friends, they believed. So I was like, don't worry. That's not a word.

[Lori Biswell]

She was like, buddy, stay calm.

[Abby Biswell]

She's, like, confused. Like, she's like, hey, guys, it's not a bad word. When Chloe told me about periods, I was like, that's not real. Don't worry. I was like, it's just pee. There's no blood. Don't worry. And I just, like, told everyone on that. Then I was at a Subway, said it, it's fine. Abby said, that's not real. And I'm like, everybody, it's fine. There's nothing. Nothing to worry about here.

[Lori Biswell]

You might need to cut a bunch of. What I said, what'd you say?

[Abby Biswell]

That was wrong. Here's the other thing. Mom made me so confident, and then she struggles with confidence herself.

[Lori Biswell]

That is actually very true. Maybe that's where I was, like, trying to live vicariously through you. Not in just in the sense that, like, I probably haven't always been super confident, but I thought you should be. And so I appreciate that about you, that you are confident and that

[Abby Biswell]

I

[Lori Biswell]

always hoped that I was raising you to not care what other people thought. And maybe that went to the extreme here. I don't know.

[Abby Biswell]

Yeah, I mean, I really broke the mold. I did social media. I did so many things because you gave me the confidence to make my own decisions to the point where, when I was an adult, I was like, I'm gonna hear you out. But ultimately, I felt like I was equipped to make an adult decision on.

[Lori Biswell]

And it's true.

[Abby Biswell]

It's hard to accept marriage, career, kids, where I lived. And it was hard for me to. But you did. You respected it.

[Matt Howard]

Well, make sure to pick up your copy of let's Travel to Hawaii. Hawaii Travel Guide for Kids by what a Smart Cookie Publishing, which is again by Abby's mom Lori and Lori's sister Gina. And we'll link this in the description.

[Abby Biswell]

It's on Amazon so it's a really easy purchase.

[Matt Howard]

Yeah, if you just like search the

[Abby Biswell]

title's got Amazon prime.

[Matt Howard]

It's on Amazon. I know that they would appreciate you guys supporting them. And let's read a review. Thank you guys for supporting our show so we can keep doing this and putting out these episodes. We really appreciate when you guys leave us reviews.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes, this review is from Chloe Dixon. It says most impactful. Matt and Abby have already made a huge impact on my life, workday and way of thinking. I've always followed them on other social medias but my sister in law recommended listening to their podcast. So glad she did because I look forward to listening to new episodes and I get to listen to the old ones. Thankfully I'm going to be real sad when I run out of old episodes and I can't listen to a new to me episode all the time. Oh, so nice.

[Matt Howard]

That's so sweet.

[Lori Biswell]

So sweet.

[Matt Howard]

And who's that from?

[Abby Biswell]

Chloe Dixon.

[Matt Howard]

Chloe, thank you so much.

[Abby Biswell]

Thank you to your sister in law for recommending and you guys should also take that seriously. There's probably someone you should share a podcast too that might enjoy this as well.

[Matt Howard]

Maybe if you share this chitchat it'll make them have more positive share with

[Abby Biswell]

your mom, your sister. Yeah, and I just, I think that like I said, I really taken for granted until I started my own family and have gotten closer to 30, which I know I still have a lot to learn in my life, but that it's very rare to have such good relationships with your parents as adults, especially in our culture in this day and age. And I just think that that comes a lot from the people that raised me and they did such a good job and I'm so grateful to them and I'm really grateful that my mom put herself out of her comfort zone. Very this was a really far stretch for her, you guys. Clearly my dad couldn't make it happen.

[Matt Howard]

Everybody go hype Lori up in the comments right now to let her know how great of a job she did on this episode.

[Abby Biswell]

Yes, thank you guys so much and please follow what a smart cookie.

[Lori Biswell]

Publishing.

[Matt Howard]

Publishing on Instagram or Facebook.

[Abby Biswell]

We'll tag it below. Follow it on Instagram, follow on Facebook. Just bombard them. Buy the book. It's on Amazon, write reviews and just interact. It really just means so much to me.

[Matt Howard]

Sweet.

[Lori Biswell]

Thank you.

[Matt Howard]

Thanks, Lori. Sweet. Thanks for listening, guys, and we'll see you in the next episode. Bye.