Welcome to Plathville, Saving our first kiss, and the tragedy that broke my family w/ Lydia (Plath)

Summary

The Unplanned Podcast with Matt & Abby

Episode: "Welcome to Plathville, Saving our first kiss, and the tragedy that broke my family"

Guests: Lydia Plath Wise & Zach Wise
Date: January 7, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this deeply personal and wide-ranging conversation, Matt and Abby Howard sit down with Lydia Plath Wise and her husband, Zach — known from TLC’s "Welcome to Plathville." The discussion spans their upbringing in a large, unique family, the pressures and misconceptions of reality TV fame, the whirlwind story of their own relationship, and, most poignantly, Lydia’s rarely shared experience of family tragedy and its long-lasting impact. Insights into maintaining authenticity, navigating rumors, faith, loss, marriage, and the importance of processing trauma as a family frame the episode’s central theme: embracing genuine connection and healing amidst public scrutiny.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Life on "Welcome to Plathville" and Growing Up Plath

• Unconventional Upbringing: Lydia explains her family's rural, self-sustaining lifestyle in Georgia with nine siblings — no processed food, limited mainstream media, and a home environment far removed from the norm.

  • “We grew a lot of our own stuff... I thought it was normal at the time.” (05:00, Lydia)

• Sheltered but not Fundamentalist: While the Plaths were perceived as fundamentalist or even compared to the Duggars, Lydia clarifies their family didn't fit neatly into any denomination or stereotype. The lifestyle was primarily her mother’s vision, shaped by her own difficult childhood rather than strict religious dogma.

  • “I couldn't say that...it was like, yes, I was raised in a Christian home...it was more just a lifestyle that my mom wanted.” (07:00, Lydia)

• Behind the Scenes of Reality TV: Lydia shares the strangeness and disconnected reality of being recognized, the family's tiny town origins, and their approach to privacy in the face of fame.

  • “I never had this, like, perception of being on TV was cool...it didn’t mean much. It was just me living my life.” (04:21, Lydia)

2. Lydia & Zach’s Relationship: Whirlwind Romance and Guarded Beginnings

• Meeting IRL—Not On TV: Lydia was adamant that Zach hadn’t seen "Plathville" before they met, ensuring the foundation was genuine.

  • “If they’ve watched the show...it’s like, hard to genuinely get to know each other, because they already know everything about me, supposedly.” (03:09, Lydia)

• Six-Month Courtship to Marriage: Their relationship developed quickly—meeting to engagement in four months, engagement to marriage in two months.

  • “Meeting to day of marriage was three days shy of six months.” (22:47, Zach)

• Saving Their First Kiss: They waited until their wedding day for their first kiss — a fact both find meaningful and, in retrospect, humorous:

  • “We saved our first kiss for the wedding day...We kissed five times on the first kiss.” (41:41, Lydia & Zach)
  • “It was long, you guys.” (42:18, Zach)

• Facing Rumors and Family Questions: Zach was subject to public speculation (including being asked if he was gay) and admits the quick timeline brought misunderstandings and judgments.

  • “People calling me gay, you know, literally the day I proposed...I just answered the question and moved on.” (15:04, Zach)
  • “Of all the questions I was going to be asked, I didn’t think that was going to come out.” (21:02, Zach)

3. Navigating Family Expectations, Reality TV, and Healing from Loss

• The Tragedy That Shaped the Plath Family: Lydia opens up about her brother Joshua’s death at 17 months—an accident she witnessed at age four.

  • “I was in the car when it happened...I saw him and...it's terrible...I just told Isaac, ‘Don't look, just get out the other door.’” (00:20 + 67:32, Lydia)

• The Lasting Impact of Unspoken Grief: The family never truly processed Joshua’s death, which Lydia believes contributed to later family strains and her parents’ divorce.

  • “Honestly, I think that has more to do with my parents’ divorce than the show. Not talking about the hardest thing in our childhood...I can't imagine how that affected my parents.” (00:40, Lydia)
  • “The hardest part for me as I’ve grown up was how little he was acknowledged… I don’t think I visited his grave till I was like nine.” (59:00, Lydia)

• Learning from Trauma: Matt, Abby, and guests reflect on how trauma shapes families, the importance of acknowledging pain, and how avoiding hard conversations creates further barriers.

  • “Families go through traumatic events...don’t know how to talk to their kids about it. Hearing you...wish there were more open conversations...can shine a light for a lot of families.” (63:13, Matt)

4. Choosing Authenticity and Managing Public Scrutiny

• Handling Fame, Rumors, & Misunderstandings: Both couples talk candidly about the emotional toll of public life, the necessity of therapy, and the strategy of tuning out negative or false narratives.

  • _"Humans are just simply not designed to have this much feedback from people." _ (49:30, Abby)
  • "There's no end to that stuff. And I've just had to completely, like, lay aside at this point...if there's peace under my own roof, that's my world." (84:23, Matt)
  • "That doesn't matter...it's been like a good month now that I haven't looked into anything, seeing what people are saying." (85:22, Lydia)

• Mission Statements and Staying Grounded: Matt suggests couples in the public sphere maintain a mission statement to remain rooted and make decisions aligned with their values.

  • "Creating that mission statement helps create a standard...Does it fit that? And I think you could create a mission statement for your marriage, for your family, for your social media..." (81:50, Matt)

5. The Plath Family Band & Journey to TV

• Music as Family Glue: Lydia describes their family band, its folk roots, how they played at 111 churches/events in their busiest year, and how a viral music video led (indirectly) to TLC’s involvement.
  • "We traveled everywhere...we had a family band...piano, violin, accordion, mandolin, banjo, guitar, upright bass..." (73:09, Lydia)
  • "That's how you got discovered from that music video?" (76:39, Abby)
  • "We said no for about two years, but then here we are...season." (76:53, Lydia)

6. Building Their Own Family & Looking Ahead

• On Parenthood & Family Size: Lydia and Zach openly discuss when they might want kids, how many, and seeking advice from Matt and Abby on this transition.

  • "How long did you guys wait?" (31:32, Lydia)
  • "We decided… wait a year and have the conversation, but we want to be parents pretty soon. Just young parents." (31:09, Zach)
  • "Are you guys going to have nine kids as well? ...Three to five." (79:32, Matt & Lydia)

• Travel Fever & Community Roots: They share their travel adventures and Lydia’s desire for community over van-life isolation.

  • "We've been to almost all 50 states now, and somehow our employers have kept us?" (35:48, Zach)
  • "We're such people-people; we need community, we need time with our friends..." (34:44, Lydia)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Processing Family Tragedy:
  “The hardest part for me as I’ve grown up was how little he was acknowledged. I think that has more to do with my parents' divorce than the show.” (00:40, Lydia)

• On Public Rumors:
  "Why are you...what if I’m struggling with infertility and I see this, that you’re posting a pregnant picture of me? How hard would that be?” (83:40, Lydia)

• On Newlywed Life:
  “Love is not an emotion. Love is a decision...choosing daily and sacrificing for each other daily.” (29:28, Zach, quoting their pastor)

• On Grounding Themselves Amidst Fame:
  “I just had to tune everything else out…it’s been so freeing too, because then I feel like I can also just show up as authentically as possible, for our audience. And then I also can just sleep well at night…” (84:49, Matt)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:20] – Lydia’s first memory of family tragedy
• [04:21] – Lydia on being on TV, family’s approach to fame
• [05:00-07:00] – Plath family’s upbringing and faith
• [15:00] – Zach on handling family and public suspicion
• [21:02] – Zach discusses surprising family questions
• [22:47] – The timeline of Lydia & Zach’s relationship
• [29:28] – The wisdom of love as a daily decision
• [31:09-33:32] – Their plans for starting a family
• [41:41-42:19] – Saving their first kiss for marriage
• [59:00] – Lydia discusses the unacknowledged grief over Joshua
• [63:13] – Matt connects Lydia’s experience to the broader importance of processing trauma
• [73:09-76:53] – The family band and how they got on TV
• [79:32] – Conversation about family size
• [81:50] – Matt explains the importance of a mission statement
• [83:40] – Lydia on the cruelty of internet rumors
• [84:23-85:22] – How the couples keep public opinion from invading their peace

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Final Thoughts

This episode delivers a rare, transparent look at real people behind reality TV personas. From Lydia’s reflections on grief and loss to the couple’s vulnerability about marriage, fame, and faith, listeners are offered both practical advice and profound empathy: about healing through honesty, the dogged pursuit of peace in the public eye, and the importance of choosing intentional love in marriage and family life.

Memorable closing advice:
"As long as there’s peace under my own roof, that’s my world." (84:23, Matt)

“Love is a decision.” (29:28, Zach)

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For fans new and old, the episode is both a window and an invitation: to see beyond the headlines and find courage in authentic conversation and connection.

Transcript

[Zach Wise]

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart choice. Make another smart choice with Auto Quote Explorer to compare rates for multiple car insurance companies all at once. Try [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance and affiliates not available in all states and situations. Prices may vary on how you buy.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I was in the car when it happened and I got out, I saw him and I just, it's terrible. And I just told Isaac. I was like, don't look, just get out the other door. We gotta go.

[Abby]

You're freaking foreign to have to tell your sibling like hey, don't go out this door. Yeah, just like no 4 year old should have to experience that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

The hardest part for me as a grown up was how little he was acknowledged. Honestly, I think that has more to do with my parents divorce than the show. Not talking about the hardest thing in our childhood. Can't imagine how that affect my parents.

[Abby]

Today on Unplanned, we sat down with Lydia Plath Wise and her husband Zach from Welcome to Plathville, the TLC series documenting two parents raising their nine kids on an isolated farm in Georgia. They met, dated, engaged and got married all within six months while saving their first kiss for marriage. But there's a deeper part of Lydia's story that she rarely opens up about publicly. In 2008, her 17 month old brother Joshua was accidentally run over on their family farm. In addition to that, we talk about behind the scenes of filming a reality TV show. The rumors about Lydia's husband Zach and so much more all on today's episode.

[Matt]

I feel like America was fascinated by your family for a number of reasons. Did you say that? Yeah, like the way you live was just, you were brought up was just totally different from, I would say like the average American child experience.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Talk about that a little bit. Yeah. I come from a family of nine kids, grew up on a farm in South Georgia and When I was 15 we started on a TV show called welcome to Plathville. And to this day I still don't know how I'm in this place I am in now and just trying to make the most of it. And married the best man in the world nine months ago. Sackwise therefore I am Lydia Wise now. Still getting used to it.

[Matt]

When you guys met each other, had you ever seen the show?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

No, that was very important to me because if he would have seen the show, just dating in general, anyone who had seen the show, like I would have a hundred questions, a thousand questions. So Zach not knowing who the show, what Anything about the show, who I am, anything like that? Like, none of his family followed me? No, like, nothing. Just genuine, raw us. And then I. I told him about it later.

[Abby]

So that was a fear of yours because you didn't want some creepy stalker to, like, find you and try to marry you?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

There have been.

[Zach Wise]

There have been instances when you put it that way.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I won't get into it, whether it's me or someone else in the family, but there have been instances where, come to find out, they've been watching the show for a long time.

[Zach Wise]

That's creepy.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And so. Yeah.

[Abby]

How did you vet him? Was there, like a questionnaire he filled out? Like a Google form.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Answer these questions? No, but. Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

So we've gotten to this point of our relationship, just in general.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Like, if they've watched the show and seen every season and followed all the things, then they already know me. And now it's, like, hard to, like, genuinely, like, both of us get to know each other on the same level because they already know everything about me, supposedly. And, like, but half of it's out of context or all these things. So it's just, like, starting from scratch, both of us not knowing anything about each other.

[Zach Wise]

I think it's also like him thinking.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

He knows everything about my life.

[Matt]

Right. You know, that makes sense.

[Zach Wise]

I think it goes to intention, too. Like, I think if I knew all this stuff about her, it's like our kind of intentions, as.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. What is your intention here? Like, do you actually think I'm a cool person or do you think being in the public eye is cool? Like, explain yourself.

[Abby]

So then you knew that there was no inclination of him wanting fame out of.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

This is truly for you. Motive.

[Abby]

Yeah, no motive of that. Has. Has that happened before? Have. Has there been.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Not really to me.

[Abby]

Okay, not to you, but maybe to someone else in the family.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Someone else in the family.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Zach Wise]

But just.

[Abby]

That's purely. Just speculation. Like, nobody knows for sure.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I know for sure. I'm just not going to disclose anything there. All right.

[Abby]

We just got into some deep tea there, I guess. Stay away from that. Okay.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I was actually just thinking about this last night. So we didn't have, like, TV growing up. We had, like, a box TV that we would watch old movies on, but we didn't have, like, anything mainstream. So I never had this, like, perception of, like, being on TV was cool or the cool people were on TV or anything like that. So when I was on TV and it just. It didn't mean much. Didn't like, I wasn't all of a sudden, cool or anything like that, you know, it was just me living my life, so.

[Zach Wise]

But I said, you're pretty cool, though.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Oh, yeah. But, yeah, lots of things with my childhood, looking back, were quite different. Even though I thought it was normal at the time, I'm sure.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

But, yeah, like, we didn't. A huge thing was like, we didn't drink Coke, but it was like, no sugar. We didn't have any sugar of any kind. You wouldn't find it in our pantry. Nothing. So but for that, like, we were all really healthy. Everything we ate was organic, natural. We grew a lot of our own stuff. And like, even when, like, the season would come around and people would get sick, like, it would go through the family in. In a week. In a week's time with 11 people. So it was like we were, like, really healthy and active and grew up on 45 acres with how not houses, horses, cows. Horses, cows, chickens, ducks, guineas, gardens. We all had our own garden at.

[Abby]

One point, but that's so hard.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We had, like, the family garden that we would all tend to. And then we all reached a certain age, we wanted to do our own garden, and some did better than others. I had. My garden did not do good. I remember, like, trying to keep my garden alive for like, two years, and I got a few things. I remember getting a watermelon this big. I was so proud of that watermelon. But it was funny because, like, after I just let my garden go, the soil there, or like, the weeds there were so rich.

[Matt]

It was like the whole field, they were thriving.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And then the weeds there were so rich. Like, well, at least I helped the weeds out.

[Matt]

That's so funny. Now your family like, living. I want to. I'd say, like, kind of like homesteading style. Would you say that?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I guess we set the trend because that seems to be really trendy now.

[Abby]

Ballerina farm. You know, Narsman, right? Everybody's doing that. It's trendy.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Wearing these nice dresses and hanging the laundry on the line.

[Matt]

That's beautiful.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Eating the garden.

[Abby]

You guys are the OGs.

[Zach Wise]

Wow.

[Matt]

Well, you guys hung laundry on the line and everything?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, yeah, we had to wash it.

[Zach Wise]

Okay, good.

[Matt]

Just did.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

You would do about six loads of laundry a day.

[Matt]

Your parents motivation for raising you guys like this. Was it, like, religiously motivated?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I think for my parents, they both just experienced a lot in the world and just wanted to protect us from that. My mom was own child with a single alcoholic mother, and her mom wasn't really in her life till she was, like, 12, 13 years old when she was threatened to be taken away. So my mom had a pretty rough childhood and was just, like, experienced a lot of. Just the world and the hurt and the. You know, just all the. The toxic things that come from that. And so that led to just being a lot more sheltered than most people, which I think there's definitely an aspect of that. But I don't think you need to, like, pretend like it doesn't exist to protect your kids from it. So I think I couldn't say that. Like, it was like, yes, I was. I was raised in a Christian home, but I don't think my parents did a really good job of, like, I never perceived that the way I was raised was because that's what God wanted type of thing. You know, it wasn't like a you have to do this, you have to dress this way. You have to do these things to be good. And, like, it wasn't like that. It was more just a lifestyle that I guess my mom wanted. She wanted to have lots of children. She wanted land. She wanted all these things. And they just. We were way out in the country, and I remember going, like, two months without even leaving the farm one day.

[Zach Wise]

I was like, holy cow.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I haven't been to town in a long time.

[Abby]

And what is town? How many people are in town?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Well, our address was Wiggum, and that was 600, but Cairo is where we would go. It was only, like, 10, 15 minutes away. And that's what's popular. Shakira.

[Zach Wise]

2525.

[Abby]

Holy.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

2500. I think 10,000.

[Abby]

10,000 people is nothing, though.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, like, that's.

[Abby]

Man. So you guys were really out in the boonies.

[Matt]

Like, you're really to go to town.

[Abby]

Very often, and so all you see is your family all the time.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. And the goats, man.

[Matt]

Did other families come to your house?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, we would have. There's one family that we've. We've known them my entire life, and still to this day, like, can't get away from them. They just. We wind up in the same place and friends forever. And we had other families that we would hang out with. But even some of that got to the point where it was like, okay, a lot of these. There was. I don't want to get into that, but there was one family that we would, like, go to fellowship with for a while. And then eventually my parents were like, this is not healthy. This is not God. This is just pure legalism. And so we, like. I think it was hard for my Parents. Because they didn't want to. Like, they wanted us to be in church, but they didn't want just the. I don't know, the production of it, if you know what I mean.

[Zach Wise]

Well, yeah.

[Abby]

What do you mean about a family, like, just following pure legalism? Were they doing things? Were there certain actions they were taking that they.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It was something where, like, women couldn't speak.

[Zach Wise]

Oh.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And, like, you had to wear dresses and, like, all these things. So it was like.

[Abby]

Like, no pants for women sort of thing. And was that IBLP or was it something different?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I have no idea. I didn't hear about IBLP until a few years ago, but.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

No, I think it was something different than that. Just their own big family. But anyways, so, like, the first church I was ever a part of is the one I'm a part of now. I started going there when I was 17. So, like, growing up, we. We were raised in a Christian home. We would, like, read the Bible together as a family every night, but we weren't like a part of a church. We would have home groups now and then with other. Other families, other people. But it was always hard finding people who were like, families who are, like, truly after, you know, the heart of the Father and not just like, a lifestyle or, you know, legalist or legalistic or just, like, production or all these things. So fundamentalist or fundamentalists or things like that. So. Which I think that's. That's something that was perceived like my family was a funnel. Fundamentalist, Christian, large family, homeschool, these things was like that. Yeah, that's.

[Abby]

That's the case when you say fundamentalist. Like, I. I'm. Yeah. Just enlightened me here a little bit, because when I've seen videos and pictures of the show, you know, I'm. I'm thinking of, like, the visual I saw of you and all your siblings, like, playing instruments, and you're like, yeah, nicely dressed. Yeah. And it's just like, the first thing I thought of was, oh, they're like the Duggars. Like, you know, they're. It seemed like a very similar sort of thing going on, and I didn't know if you were. I just assumed, oh, maybe they're. Maybe they're Mormon. Maybe they are Mennonite or. What's the other? Amish. Amish is like another group of people that, you know, I don't know. It's just that that was, like, my initial assumption.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

But I guess what you're saying is that wasn't really a group that your.

[Zach Wise]

Family like, went into.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, we weren't even, like, part of a denomination or anything. Like, we were. I. I look back on it, I'm like, I don't know. Like, my parents never taught us, like, this is how you should dress or anything like that. Like, my mom just like, yeah, we grew up wearing dresses, but once I started doing my own shopping, it was never, like, I was never told that you had to wear dresses type of thing.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Like, my mom shopped for us, and those were the clothes she bought us. And then, you know, when I'm 13, 14, out there buying my own clothes, I bought whatever I wanted. So it wasn't the type of thing where I could. I could totally see how, like, looking at a picture of my family, it's like, oh, they are, you know, X category, whatever.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

But I. I don't know. What if I was to have to put my family in a category? I do not know where I would place us out there.

[Zach Wise]

I mean, I would you say out there. Out there. That's a good one. I would just say, like, I feel like there's so many assumptions around just different denominations in general. And what's so often misunderstood is that there's a lot of belief systems around. Around denominations that are very similar. I'd say, honestly, like, 80% similar across denominations. But what is disagreed upon is, like, is what's most talked about. And so that's what's coming to the light in terms of the show is like, oh, this picture of them. Look, they are this denomination, so we can talk about that with them. And like, even though they probably agree on all these other things, and they're probably living in a good way or. Or following practices in this good way. It's like, we can talk about the things that may be controversial more because that's often just what is more talked about in general.

[Abby]

And so I feel like the big question everyone's. Everybody probably wants to know is, do you guys drink grape juice during communion? And do you baptize babies?

[Matt]

I know, I know.

[Zach Wise]

And this is like, you know what? What's the difference?

[Abby]

We can't move on until we get an answer. I know.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Well, I've had some.

[Matt]

I've had.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I've had grape juice and I've had real wine for.

[Abby]

Oh, my gosh, Real wine.

[Zach Wise]

Alert.

[Abby]

Alert.

[Zach Wise]

I know, but this is the thing. This is the thing. Like, there was an episode where, like, after she turned 21, she was having a drink with her parents. Like, just a casual drink, champagne, to.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Celebrate with my parents. And I Can't tell you how many people were like, shame on you. I'm like, oh, I didn't realize having a few sips of champagne was a sin.

[Matt]

I want to talk a little bit about your upbringing. Yeah, I heard a lot of backstory on Jeremy and Ginger's podcast, which. Shout out to their podcast.

[Abby]

Shout out to Jeremy and Jerry. We love them. They're friends of ours.

[Matt]

Something that you had still a decent sized family is you and two sisters.

[Zach Wise]

Yes.

[Matt]

Not nine siblings, like, not nine kids all together. But something that stood out to me that I wanted to ask you guys. You said you grew up in a household where basically, like, you were able to talk about emotions and, like, it was a very, like, emotionally, I would say, sounds like intelligent household where people were, like, very open about this stuff. I want to talk about that a little bit because I feel like that is something that our generation is struggling with now because it's like, it wasn't talked about a lot, like, when we were kids. And, like, what did your parents do? Right. That, like, made your house seem like such a safe place for that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's helped me so much, too.

[Zach Wise]

Well, I think, like, there's a lot of balance between my two parents. Um, my dad was just always present in a lot of ways, very intentional about his time with us. Um, he would work, like, 14 hour shifts as a nurse and then play tennis with me or, like, go do something with the girls or something like that. And so he was always very intentional about his time and always was a man of his word. So it's like, if I asked him, like, hey, can we play tennis tonight? And he's like, oh, sorry, I'm just a little tired, but we can do it tomorrow. Like, he would make a point to make sure it happened. And so that was just like, super encouraging, not only as an example, but also just as a son, just to have a dad who is just that intentional with me. So. But then my mom, she was very, very, just emotionally in tune with each of her kids. Just very much like, okay, like, you know, she'd ask us about school, but she would actually, like, want to understand how our day at school was. It wasn't just like, okay, how was school? Oh, math sucked. Okay, have a good one. Here's some food or whatever. Like, it was actually, like, we would say something, and she could tell that, like, something was a bit off and just like, hey, like, you can. You can tell me. It's okay. And, like, it's like, yeah, someone kind of, like, picked on me today. And, like, we would go in depth about it, and she'd help us understand our feelings or understand our anger and talk it out instead of just being, like. Like, not having a conversation about it. And so that was just. Really helped us just through our school years and just our years at the home where we all talked to each other. And even when, you know, siblings had our tiffs, we would. We would talk to each other and we'd, you know, apologize and actually mean our apology, not just be like, sorry you feel that way. It's like, no, sorry I did that to you. And, like, I have to own my piece. It's not. It takes two to make this happen. So I'm sorry that I did this. And so, I mean, it just bred that natural, I guess you could say, emotional intelligence in me. And we dealt with a lot, you know, around our wedding, and I just. I didn't have reactions a lot of people expected in terms of, like, you know, people. You know, there's people calling me gay, you know, literally the day I proposed, and, like, all this extra stuff that didn't make sense. And it's like, okay, but coming from the standpoint of your life and what you've been through, you might be projecting things. And, like, Ethan, in particular, he has dealt with a lot. He just went through a divorce recently, and then, like, he sees his, you know, sister getting proposed to, and it's like, on the same farm that he got married on and everything like that. So it's like, there's a lot of emotional tension, I'm sure, for him. And so recognizing that and not being like, how could you ask that? Or, like, getting all frustrated at him? I'm just like. I just answered the question and moved on because.

[Abby]

Was that something that happened, like, on the show? Was that, like, a disagreement you guys had?

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, that was. That was one of the big things on the show, actually.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That kind of protected me from a lot of that.

[Abby]

You just weren't even aware it was going on when it was being filmed, essentially.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Well, so, okay, so it was, like, leading up to the proposal. I didn't even know Zach was in town. He completely surprised me.

[Abby]

Oh, wow.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

With everything. And. Yeah, so, like, he was dealing with a lot leading up to it. My whole family was there with him, like, setting up everything. And when I got there, you know, proposed, beautiful, all these things. He surprised me. It was crazy. So, like, I was experiencing the beautiful side of it while he was, like, just.

[Zach Wise]

It was beautiful.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Handling.

[Zach Wise]

I had a great time.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. He was just, like, protecting Me from. From all that. And you, like, had the conversation with my brothers and everything. And he later told me, like, yeah, like, Ethan asked me if I was gay. And I told him, like, that's ridiculous. I just proposed to your sister. You know, they asked me some questions that just. I don't. I don't know where they were coming from. And, like, I was really frustrated about it and everything, but it was never, like, I didn't even watch it either, because Zach just, like, he was like, this is our proposal day. Like, you. You just remember our proposal.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And we'll, you know, deal with everything else later as it comes.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, I just. I didn't feel the need to fuel that fire, like, because I wanted to give fuel to what was going well. And. And so, you know, there was a lot of things that happened, and I did tell her about a lot of them in due time when they were necessary, but it was more like in the weeks following. And even just, like, until after we were really married was. I was like, oh, yeah, like, this happened, and this is a big deal. We can talk through it and figure it out, but in the time you didn't need to know it because that it would have hurt you. And it. And it's not like. It's not like she didn't get some of that in her own right. Like, her brothers talked to her several times about, like, different things, so she knew some of that stuff already before the wedding. So it's not like I'm. Like, your brothers are saying all these things, and I'm not telling you about anything. Like. No.

[Abby]

That must have been really hard for you, because I can't imagine, like, in marriage, you're becoming your own family, but at the same time, there's so much connection with your existing family, too.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

That probably felt. That's probably very hurtful to hear that from someone who you're about to essentially be brothers with. So I guess. I guess, like, my. My question for you was, how did you handle that on. On your own? Because regardless of the context of the situation, just accusing somebody of something without really, like, knowing more and then that being, like, publicly something that's shared all over the world, like, you're. You had no idea who she was when you. When you guys met. This was never about famous, is never about a TV show. It's kind of just like a life you almost married into.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

So was that, like, a very stressful time for you then?

[Zach Wise]

I wouldn't use the word stress. I would more say it's just it was confusing. I didn't know how to react really. Especially because it was, like, the last thing I expected in terms of, like, okay, like, I approached them to have the conversation. I was like, hey, guys, like, ask me any question you want. I want to be an open book. I know this isn't usually, you know, this is a quick timeline. Everything like that. I want you guys to be as engaged and understanding as possible leading into our marriage. And, like, of all the questions I was going to be asked, I didn't think that was going to come out.

[Abby]

And so was the quick timeline any. Was that a concern for anybody, or was that. Not even, like, it was brought up?

[Zach Wise]

But it was very brief. It wasn't like, the main point or the main focus. It was. It was more so like just quick judgments on my character. Like, he doesn't do this, he doesn't do that. And it was, like, off of very little things that I actually didn't like, was just honestly taken out of context. Like, when I moved there, I had to put all my stuff in a very small room, and I couldn't really keep it tidy because I was in transition. So it's like, you can't really tidy up until you're in a place where you can actually put everything.

[Abby]

Totally.

[Zach Wise]

And one of the brothers saw that as I'm messy and I don't clean up after myself. And I literally was just going there to sleep, and then I'd help Lydia with the wedding. We planned a wedding in two months, so that's very.

[Abby]

That's super fast. Abby's mom planned our wedding, so that was a huge blessing for us.

[Zach Wise]

Neither one of us.

[Abby]

We just showed up. We're like, what's happening at this wedding?

[Matt]

Okay, so you brought up the timeline a couple times, and I'm sure that was, like, a part of the show as well. Like, you guys, from meeting to getting engaged was like, less than a month, right?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

No, meeting to get engaged was like four months.

[Zach Wise]

Four months.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It was engagement to marry. That was two months.

[Matt]

That's okay.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Yes. So meeting to day of marriage was three days shy of six months.

[Abby]

Okay, that is gnarly.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

I looked it up once. I think it was 100 years.

[Abby]

Dude, you guys made your own TV show just about you. I would watch it. I like, like that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

The cameras could have only been there for him.

[Abby]

That's such an interesting social film about this.

[Zach Wise]

So we've talked about this, though. We were like, we need to, like, write this all in a journal and, like, write a book about It.

[Matt]

Thank you to Esker for sponsoring this portion of today's episode.

[Abby]

One of the most frustrating things we've run into when we travel is trying to fit all of our stuff in a suitcase. There's a lot of clothes, diapers, there's wipes, binkies. And that's why we're huge fans of Esker's Travel Pack. What this Travel pack does is you put all of your clothes in it and then you suction all the air out that way. It's nice and consolidated. Yes, that's the word.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And I think we're really incentivized now, especially with kids, to put things in SVU bags. Bags as possible. Plus, you know what the airlines charge for multiple bags. It's crazy. So the Travel Pack is an excellent way to make your travel experience way more seamless.

[Abby]

It also includes a portable USB C recharging air pump for compression on the go. Obviously, the Travel Pack vacuum kit is genius, but Esker also offers a card Holder Pro, which is a smart wallet that's trackable. So you can find your wallet whenever you lose it. I lose stuff all the time, so I'm really happy we have one of these things.

[Matt]

We don't even need to talk about. How many E readers I've lost?

[Abby]

You've lost a ton.

[Matt]

I wish those were trackable.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Matt]

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[Abby]

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[Zach Wise]

So the reason behind the timeline. Our idea. We both talked about it. We both talked about it well before. We were like, yeah, six months. We're done. Like, we didn't expect that at all. But our idea behind a timeline would be like six months to two years is like engagement period of like, makes like you would know in that. About. About that amount of time.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Right?

[Zach Wise]

And just like, how much we did in such a short amount of time. Those first three weeks, we hiked five 14ers in three days, we went skydiving.

[Matt]

By the way, what's a 14er?

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, it's a 14 foot mountain.

[Abby]

Holy crap.

[Zach Wise]

In Colorado, you guys did five of those? We did five in three days.

[Abby]

Oh, my gosh. So it's like, you guys are so fit. That's amazing.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

She's fit.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Like, we get here, I, I, I'm like, in Colorado. I'm like hyping her up. I'm like, okay, you got, you have to experience Colorado for real. Because she was telling me with her friend, she's like, yeah, we've, you know, gone to Loveland Pass and we drove to a 14, 000 foot mountain. I'm like, all right, you guys haven't experienced Colorado then. And I told him, you have to hike a 14,000 foot mountain. It's a challenge, but it's also an experience because you get on top of this mountain, 360 view of just mountain range. It's stunning. So to tell her about this, she freaks out. She's just like, yes, I need to do this. And so I plan it with her friend, I bring a couple friends and we go and we like, get out of the car, round a corner, and I'm like, guys, look, there's the peak. She just gone. She's like going already. I'm like, lydia, where are you going? And, and so, like, I have to catch her, make sure she's okay because she's from Florida. So I'm like, you're gonna die about. And she keeps going, and we're talking back and forth.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

She's stuck in that mountain.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah. I'm like, trying to get to know her because I like her. And I'm like, yo, like, you're amazing.

[Matt]

Wait up.

[Zach Wise]

And like, we're talking back and forth and I'm like, starting to lose my breath. And I'm like, I'm from Colorado. This shouldn't be happening right now. Like, how is she out outpacing me? Well, she grew up in a family who doesn't eat sugar, so all the organic fueling you. No, she's super healthy and we had a great time, but, like, it gets exhausting and it's like you're huffing and puffing.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It was kind of funny because I hate to admit this, but it was in the time where I was still trying to avoid you. We've all heard about it. I was trying to find him, but I also at the same time really wanted to spend time with him because I was curious about who this guy was. And so, like, yes, I wanted to just beeline it to the top of the mountain and just get there. But I also was wondering, curious if I got ahead, if you would get ahead and then we could be together. The two of us.

[Matt]

She was luring you.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Because I would have stuck the group. You would have spent half time with me, half time with other people. So in my trying to avoid you, I went ahead so you could get ahead so we could hike together.

[Zach Wise]

She got me.

[Matt]

Now, that is some mind games.

[Zach Wise]

Hook, line, and sinker right there.

[Abby]

Had you guys dated before you met?

[Zach Wise]

No.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

You mean other people?

[Abby]

Yeah, like. Oh, yeah, both. Okay. So, yeah, I didn't phrase that question.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I was like, how do we date before?

[Abby]

Yeah, most. Most people date other people before they meet. I didn't know.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Did you guys date before you met? No.

[Matt]

We actually didn't. No, we literally didn't.

[Abby]

Yeah, we.

[Matt]

That's a weird question.

[Abby]

I. I said that. Really weird. There could. There would have been much better. Yeah. Like, from our. Our story, we had never dated other people before we started dating. I know if that had gone a.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Couple of days, but I wanted that to be my story.

[Abby]

But knowing how hardcore you guys are.

[Matt]

Ridiculous to be.

[Abby]

Your five months and 27 days, though, that's hard.

[Matt]

I get what you're saying, though, because, like, when you. I feel like when you. Especially when you go on a hike, you do a challenge together, you're talking the whole time you. I heard that on when you first met, you, like, go in right away asking all the deep questions. Yeah, you find out a lot of things pretty quickly.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And also, we, like, before we even started dating, we kind of just established that, like, this dating world out here, people just play too many games, and we're not about that. Like, I'm not gonna talk to you for five months, see if I want to go on a date, and then go on a date to see if I want to date you, and then date years and, like, take three years to see if you might be okay. It's like, you should know. They're like, it shouldn't be. Take that long to know their character, because that's what matters. Like, you know, other things are gonna change about them, but it's their character that matters. So.

[Matt]

Yeah. And how you view marriage, because, like, I feel like ultimately we've talked a lot about, like, ultimately, there's lots of different fields of thought on this, but what we believe, it's like, it's a choice to stay married and to keep working on your marriage and to, you know, keep strengthening it. And so ultimately, it's not like we're gonna ever reach where it's like, oh, you got a perfect score. You get to be my partner. It's like, oh, no, we just, like, are aligned on, like, what marriage is for and, like, how we view it.

[Zach Wise]

It's funny you say that, because our pastor, during our ceremony, it's in our wedding video. He says, love is not an emotion. Love is a decision. And it's like choosing daily and sacrificing for each other daily to.

[Matt]

That was in my vows to you.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Stay together and you know what you do today?

[Matt]

I'll teach you every day.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Beautiful.

[Zach Wise]

Boom.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

You know what's going to prepare you for marriage the most? Marriage. Now, there's nothing else that's going to prepare you for marriage. That's marriage. Well, because same with children. We've been talking about that.

[Matt]

Here's my other thing.

[Abby]

You guys are talking about children. That's been a topic of conversation.

[Zach Wise]

Okay, so we Talked about the five 14ers in three days, right? No, I'm getting to the topic. Okay. We did four in one day. And that was when she was like, all right, I'm gonna say yes to this. You know, this is a big deal. I'm gonna say yes to moving forward with us.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And in the rain on the side of the mountain, dancing.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Gotta add that.

[Zach Wise]

That was fun.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Wow.

[Zach Wise]

But we were driving back, and we were getting to know each other, and I was like, okay, do you like. Like, cats or dogs? Which one do you like better?

[Matt]

Babies.

[Zach Wise]

She said babies? Yeah, she said babies, like, from the beginning. So she's had baby fever forever.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I get that.

[Matt]

I get that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Sister was like, my baby. I like, she was everything. And so the minute she started walking, I was like, I need another baby in my life. So I keep telling him, like, yes, I have baby fever. But I've also wanted a baby in my life for, like, nine years now. So I'm surviving. I'm doing okay. I can wait another day.

[Zach Wise]

Day. Another day.

[Abby]

I love. I love the pause there before day.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, yeah, no, we're doing good. We. Yeah, we decided, you know, wait a year and have the conversation. But we. I think we want to be parents pretty soon. Just young parents.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's exciting. You're going to be the best dad in the world.

[Abby]

So, yeah, what's going to happen is a year from now, she's like. She's in approach you and say, okay, so we're having a kid, and likely. Here we go.

[Matt]

Yeah, that's what happened. Matt said, time. I was like. On the day. I was like, well, here it is. It's time.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

How long did you guys wait?

[Abby]

Two years before we started.

[Matt]

Three years.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Three years.

[Matt]

Oh, three Years before we had our first son. Yeah, but, but what happened is on our anniversary, our second anniversary, I was like, it's time. And you were like, no, I'm not ready. And so we waited a few more months.

[Abby]

Well, I think. Well, yeah, I guess we got, we officially got pregnant in October and our anniversary was July. Yeah. So it took three months. Three months from our, our second anniversary. Yeah. Three months after our second wedding anniversary, we got pregnant.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And what would your advice be to Zach? Because I know like, as a dad, provider, all these things, like you want to be a dad, but at the same time there's so much like, not fear, but just like unknown around it. So like, and there's nothing that's actually going to prepare you to be ready to be a dad. So I'm not saying convince him. That's not at all what I'm saying. But what would you have for him if he is going to be a dad in the next two, three years?

[Abby]

Oh, totally. Yeah. I think if you just like go right into it, I think you're definitely going to be probably unprepared right away and just be like, what has happened? Like that, you know, you're, you're keeping another human alive that you're fully responsible for 24 7. And it's, it's a lot. But then, you know, you get past those, those initial months of having a baby and then, you know, you get to where we're at now where we have a two and three year old who not only entertain each other every given second, they're like, that's awesome. They're like glued together, they do everything together, but they're so fun. And now like where our kids are at an age where we have like full on conversations with them. So, yeah, I don't know. I would say you can't go wrong either way. I think it's just you, you have to recognize that maybe, yeah, if you have kids right away after getting married, your life isn't going to look as if you had taken a couple years and just lived the, you know, no kids life for a bit. But then you also get this unique, cool experience with kids at a young age that other people don't get. If you choose to do that, you know, like right away, that's awesome.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

For sure.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

And I feel like, I mean, even.

[Zach Wise]

This, even this year we've like had that kind of like married life, just the two of us experience.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We've been everywhere, been to two countries, 15 states.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Just done a lot.

[Abby]

You okay. You said 15 states. I thought I heard you say on a podcast or something. 38.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. That was 20, 23 before you guys met.

[Abby]

You went to 38 states.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

And now together you've been. Now you've been to 15.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. So I'm just like, we've seen it all. Like, we're ready.

[Abby]

Have you guys ever thought. Have you guys ever thought of, like, doing van life or, like, getting a pilot's license? You could fly a plane and go different places.

[Zach Wise]

But now you're making me want to do.

[Abby]

Because I've been a Van life. I've been a big fan of van life. But then recently I was like, okay, Abby doesn't like camping, but what if I learn.

[Matt]

I've never can.

[Abby]

What if I learn to get, like, fly a plane and then maybe one day we can, like, lease or rent or whatever it is, like a small private plane that could just fit our immediate family. Yeah. And if I have enough hours and I don't, like, that's just, like, such a cool way to travel. I bring that up is, yeah, you guys like to travel.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. So I think 100%, like, I've totally thought about van life. I'm like, I've travel so much. It would make sense, but at the same time, like, it wouldn't work for us because we're so much. We're such people. People.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We need community. We need, you know, time with our friends and in rich, you know, rich friendships. And I feel like the van life would just take from that. So the travel aspect and the, you know, waking up at sunrise in the mountains with your coffee like, that would. That would be the dream. But all of that would just be for myself and my own enjoyment. And there wouldn't be giving. There wouldn't be community. There wouldn't be the rich aspect that comes from that.

[Zach Wise]

I've thought many times about, like, what I want to accomplish with travel. And Lydia and I have very similar, like, travel motives in general. And it's just like, I think the big ones are, like, just. I think the western national parks just, like, going through California and looping back around to Colorado, that kind of big loop with national parks. And then we want to go to Switzerland and that sort of stuff. But, like, Alaska is one. I've been to Alaska, and every time I bring it up, she's like, we need to go now. But. So we have our ideas, but I think for the most part, we're. We've also traveled to almost all 50.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

States now, and somehow our employers have kept Us?

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

I want to know getting engaged, like, your timeline, Just under six months.

[Zach Wise]

Yes.

[Matt]

Had you guys had a fight before you got married?

[Zach Wise]

A couple disagreements, but nothing like major.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

The biggest tension actually, before we got married actually was whether or not we were gonna film our wedding. That was the biggest tension. And it was pretty big because it was like his family, you know, just wanted it to be the wedding. And. And this was like, well, this is my life. And it's hard. No, I don't. I don't want. So that was. It was really hard. But we. We resolved that within three hours. I think we were both just like, okay, we need to take our own time. And then we came back together, and we. Because I think initially Zach was like, you need to make a decision. This is your wedding. I was like, no, it's our wedding. This is our life. We need to make the decision. So, yeah, there were definitely aspects that were tough about it, and we wanted. We tried to, like, make it as guest friendly as possible. We told the guests, like, if you don't want to be on camera, just don't sign this and.

[Abby]

Because you have siblings, right, that don't want to be on camera.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, I have. I have an oldest sister. She's amazing. She's living her happy life with her four kiddos and her husband.

[Matt]

Wow.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And.

[Abby]

And she, like, loves only five more to go.

[Zach Wise]

She loves. She loves the family, too. And, like, I think a lot of people think that because she's off camera, she hates the family. But she's.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

People have spread.

[Zach Wise]

Everybody's close.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

People have spread like the family was toxic, so she moved away type of thing. And it's like, what are you saying? But now she. Yeah, she's close with everyone. She comes around as often as she can. She lives far away, though. But, yeah, she just. Her and her husband don't want to be in the public eye. And I 100% respect that. And I am jealous sometimes. Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

I think a big thing that we've, like, learned with just disagreements that we have is, like, I think the. One of the things we focus on is we're a team against whatever struggle it may be in terms of, like, whether that's dealing with the cameras or just disagreements at our wedding, we're just like, yeah, well, this is our wedding, and, like, we're getting married. And, you know, some people may not understand the timeline, but this makes sense for us.

[Abby]

And.

[Zach Wise]

And so let's. Let's face this as us and not, you know, let it be. Like, I'm. I think this way and you think this way and I won this argument and you lost this argument or something like that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It's like, yeah, we are a team. It's not you fighting against me, it's us against the problem.

[Zach Wise]

And that's what, that's what happened with.

[Abby]

The camera versus the producers.

[Zach Wise]

Okay, right, well, but that's what, that's what happened is I was like, this is your decision because you've dealt with this more. I was putting it on her and she's like, no, like, you're in this with me. I need, I need to help with this decision because it's all the same yours.

[Matt]

That's good. Because then when, if something does go wrong, it's not like you chose this. It's like, no, we both have to face whatever consequences come of a decision we make together. Because I feel like that's like, that it's just a common thing in marriage where it's like, okay, well, you did this and I did this. It's like, nope, everything's us. Everything's we.

[Zach Wise]

Yep.

[Abby]

This might, if this question is too much, just no need to answer it. But I'm just so curious because I know a lot about the social media side of things, but not the reality TV side of things. When it comes to like, revenue and finances. With the revenue you get paid on the show, is that enough to like pay your bills or do you have to get like another job to supplement what you're making when you're on tv?

[Zach Wise]

Lydia went about this like, in the best way possible.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

So I mean, maybe you could live just off of it, but not, not really. But. So when I was 16, I was just like. Or just at the beginning when we started filming, I was just like, I don't want any of this to change who I am, how I go about life, how I see things. So when I was 16, I started working and I was like, I'm not gonna, like, I'm just gonna save the money from the show, set that aside, get a job and live off of that so that I'm just a normal person. Like, I want to just be as grounded as possible. So I started working. I had like six to seven part time jobs when I was 16. 17 and 17, yeah. Six, seven part time job.

[Abby]

Oh my gosh.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Everything from like, you know, just two hours babysitting in the morning, like working eight hours a day, seven hours a day for a mechanic and his wife who had a farm. And so I did everything from like office job to helping him in the shop to like Digging trenches and tear. Cutting down trees, built, building fences, all the things that's. So I started doing that when I was, like, 16, 17. And then at 17, I started working as a bank teller. Worked that job for about a year, and then worked at a jewelry store. So, yeah, I kind of just went at it like, I don't want to rely on the show. I don't want that to be my identity. I don't want, like, that to be who I am. So started working and live off to that. But it was awesome because, you know, that. That just set me up for, you know, even more savings.

[Matt]

I want to talk about newlywed life, because that's so fun, and it's such a special season, and I still, at our first year of marriage, like, so fondly. We talk about it all the time. So what has that transition looked like for the two of you guys? Very young and married. Because you're 21 and 24. Like, what is that like? Because I think a lot of people are, like, thinking about getting married, like, late 20s, 30s, like, they don't know what this kind of can look like in your early 20s.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah. I mean, obviously, the big thing, moving in together. I think that was really fun.

[Matt]

Just wait. Yes. Because I remember this was a part of the show. You guys didn't even kiss until you were married. They were crying about everything.

[Abby]

I didn't realize that.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, we saved our first kiss for the wedding day.

[Abby]

You saved your first kiss for the wedding day?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Crazy.

[Abby]

Because that is rat.

[Zach Wise]

Wow.

[Matt]

Okay. Right?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It was almost.

[Abby]

Were you, like, making out with your hand to prepare? Dude, I legitimately did that before our first date.

[Zach Wise]

We had relationships before. We had kissed people before.

[Abby]

So you knew how to kiss?

[Zach Wise]

We knew how to kiss.

[Abby]

Okay.

[Zach Wise]

But we had to practice, like, okay, how are we gonna kiss? We knew how we would not kiss. It was like.

[Matt]

Oh, the temptation.

[Abby]

It was.

[Zach Wise]

It was tough, but it was good.

[Abby]

And how long did you hold the kiss for? Was it. Was it a quick.

[Zach Wise]

It was long, you guys.

[Abby]

It was a long.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We kissed five times on the first kiss.

[Abby]

Did people have to look away at the wedding? Where did you make it all uncomfortable?

[Zach Wise]

Okay, good.

[Abby]

Dude, you should have made people uncomfortable just for the heck of it.

[Matt]

Just make your grandma uncomfortable, everybody.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Oh, my God.

[Matt]

You can wait for five minutes.

[Zach Wise]

Sorry. Sorry. That was too far. No, but, like, the show really, like, pointed that out, actually. It's like they took, like, all the clips of us, like, during our photo shoot and during, like, our reception, and every little piece of us, you know, kissing Each other. It's like, now that they're married, they're kissing, and they had, like, a montage for a minute of us kissing.

[Matt]

You're like, no one needs to see this.

[Zach Wise]

I'm like, everybody kisses on their wedding day.

[Abby]

Like, did you guys watch. Did you watch the Season or. No?

[Zach Wise]

No, I. I watched some here and there was like, friends, but it wasn't. Yeah, it wasn't, like, a lot. It was more just like, because my friends are watching.

[Abby]

That must be crazy to have it all go out and you don't even know what's getting posted.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Well, you know, because everyone's DMing you.

[Zach Wise]

Oh.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's how I found out what's on social media. I don't watch it. I just look on social media, see, read, like, two, three DMs. I'm like, okay, interesting.

[Zach Wise]

Or, like, they'll comment on the post. They'll be like, I'm so sorry that this happened. Or, you know, I'm so excited for you.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I've already moved past that. Thanks for the reminder.

[Abby]

Is that how you found out about, like, the whole, like, thing with her with her brother? When people. People, like, reach out to you and they're like, dude, I just, like, saw you get in this massive argument on live television. Or, like, I don't know.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Like.

[Zach Wise]

No, it was more. I. I had told her.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Like, everything.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

But it's definitely.

[Zach Wise]

But when it, like, I think the details came out, when the show was kind of airing and everything of like. Yeah, they. This is the timeline of when they did it, and this is why they did it. And, like, just some of them weird.

[Abby]

Too, to relive all that stuff. Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That is the hardest part.

[Abby]

How many months afterward?

[Zach Wise]

I think it was, like, six months.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Abby]

That must be so weird.

[Zach Wise]

The thing about it was, like, we had had a lot of conversations privately with some of the family, and so we're, like, getting past a lot of this stuff, and then it, like, comes up again.

[Abby]

Right. That's such an interesting world to be in.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Y. What happened was awful and wrong and all these things. But then. Then you're having thousands of people message you, like, you need to move away from your family. They're toxic. All these things. And it's just, like, it makes it so much bigger.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Than what happened.

[Zach Wise]

I think the biggest thing that makes people say that stuff, too, is, like, their own experience.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Like, so many times we would get, like, we did the tortilla slap challenge. I'm sure you've seen it all across and, like, it was so fun. Like, it was a great experience. Half the comments were like, this is abuse. This is abuse. This is the early signs of abuse and trauma and everything like that. I'm like, what? The lady had just.

[Matt]

She's slinging to her face.

[Zach Wise]

I'm worried about Zach.

[Abby]

His face is red.

[Zach Wise]

That's what I'm saying, though, because, like, we edited it so that, like, it was almost every one of Lydia's slaps. She was like. And it was just like real quick form and like, it was. It was funny. But, like, the other half of the comments, I need to see this video. I want to see Lydia just take you out. Why am I laughing so much? No, it's good. It's good. It's.

[Abby]

It is.

[Zach Wise]

She does take me out. I'm like, oh, wow.

[Abby]

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[Matt]

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[Abby]

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[Matt]

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[Abby]

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[Zach Wise]

Just like switch the interview here.

[Matt]

Sure.

[Abby]

Okay, now we're on the spot.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah. Ask us a question to Unplanned.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, the unplanned way.

[Zach Wise]

But basically, like, you guys went from obviously working jobs together.

[Abby]

Yeah, we.

[Zach Wise]

The only way, like we really prepared for this. Was listening to like your two interviews from like 2023 or something.

[Abby]

No, it was so fun. It was awesome.

[Zach Wise]

We're really excited to just get to know you guys generally. But. But you guys workshops together and then like this stuff blows up and like it kind of, I feel like changed your life and a lot.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Totally feel like.

[Zach Wise]

And so it's definitely changed mine. Being in the public eye, obviously you get a lot of opinions and I feel like there's haters are gonna hate. I feel like that's the common thread around influencers and stuff like that. What has been kind of the biggest, one of the biggest blessings and then what are some moments where it's like you realize it's just overwhelming or it's like, yeah, because I mean several times for us it's been like, okay, let's go buy a farm and like just exclude ourselves from all this and just be done.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

And it's like, have you guys had moments like that and then. Or like, what does that look like for you?

[Matt]

I'll start with the blessings. Yeah, the blessings that we get to work together. That is something that it's like we spend so much time together. I think about a lot of my friends where their husband goes off to work all day. I'm like, that's so sad. You only see him from six to whenever you go to bed. I'm like, that's sad. And then if someone has to do something that night, you don't see them all day. We spend a lot of time together and we've always just been that type of clingy couple anyway. So it's so fun that we get to spend all this time together. And now that we have kids, we get to spend so much more time with our kids than most families get to. And I feel sad that that's their experience. But for us, I'm like, gosh, this is so great. We get to really, both of us get to be the biggest influence in our kids lives. And it's not like a stay at home mom or a stay at home dad. Like we both get to be so hands on with our kids. And that is something I do not take lightly at all. Like, I am so grateful for that for sure. As far as the downsides, they have been, we have therapy. I mean truthfully, that's what it is. We have individual therapy, we have marriage therapy. We have a lot of things because no one. Humans are just simply not designed to have this much feedback from people. Like you're used to having Your neighbors, random people you see in public who would never say the things that they say online.

[Abby]

I kind of love. Sorry to interrupt, but I kind of love that you guys were able to work through family conflict off. Off of the TV show without other outside opinions, even though, like, all that stuff still aired six months after there was, you know, conflict and drama on the show. Like, think about going through that live and then trying to navigate that when you have a million different people telling you what to do. So kind of. That kind of almost makes me. Because I don't want to. Yeah, the content we make is so different from reality tv, but there are some similarities. And so it's like, man, sometimes when we're going through stuff and there's, like, all. All this noise that's happening, it's. It's like, man, that'd be sick to, like, you know, film everything and then slowly release it, like, six months later. So if anybody has an opinion that could mess with you, you're just like, oh, they just. They're just. They're kind of just sharing their own experience, and it has nothing to do with me.

[Matt]

Yeah, we hate to talk about, like, the negative stuff, but it is a reality of it. And I think the thing that's been such a blessing is that we were married when we started all this, and then it started slow. We had a really strong foundation. Not that you guys, like, this isn't, like, comparing our situations, because they're totally different, but we had this foundation of, like, okay, we'd been together for three years. We'd been married for a year before anything, like, really four years of, like, us really growing up and being together. Like, we were a unit. And so there was never a time where someone said something about me and Matt questioned anything about me, or someone said something about Matt and I questioned anything about Matt or someone said anything about our marriage and I questioned our marriage. It was never that. It was always like, you're saying us versus this. And, like, it has. It has been such a. Like, there's a maturing process that this has expedited in me where it's like, okay, I have to really know what I believe about myself. I really have to know what I believe about my husband. I really have to know what I believe about our marriage and our family and all these things, because there are so many other voices that could be telling me otherwise. But it's like, oh, wait, we come back to, I know where our identity is. I know what this is all rooted in, and nothing can shake that. And so it has made us stronger in a lot of ways.

[Abby]

And I also. And I don't want to, like, get too much into stuff that, like, involves your family, but not necessarily you guys. But just with prepping for the episode, it also made me sad that there's been, like, divorce in your family, which, like, the first thing I thought of immediately was like, man, the. The public eye was too much.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

Like, I literally, like, that was the first thing that I thought of and made me so sad because it almost made me think, like, man, would it. Would these relationships would have, like, would they have worked out if there was no sort of outside, you know, pressure? Because some people can't take it. Like, some people can't take all the other voices and all the noise, and it's very hard. So I'm sure it was. I'm sure being on reality TV was very stressful on your parents and really stressful on your sibling and their spouse, you know?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. I mean, that's something that I have to keep myself from thinking about is what would life be right now if we weren't on tv?

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Because it would be completely different, and there's so many unknowns and. And, you know, could make me just not grateful for where I am right now because, yeah, there have been. We've walked through some really hard things in the public eye, and there have been. And, you know, it's been a struggle doing that. And I'm sure if we weren't in the public eye, life would look way different. But I can't compare an unknown to where I'm at right now and not be grateful for where I am. So I know being in the public eye did add a lot of stress with my parents. I don't think it was being in the public eye with my brother. I think the public eye really affected his ex, and I think she spent. Put too much of her validation identity in what people thought and how much attention she got from that. And so that kind of just carried her off. But with my mom, with my parents, I don't think it was like, I couldn't say, if the show didn't happen, my parents would still be together.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

You know, so. Yeah. But it's definitely something I have to keep myself from thinking about was like, where would life be? I do know I wouldn't be married to you because I wouldn't have had the freedom to travel for six weeks to go to Colorado and meet you and just go hike some 14ers and say yes to whatever the Lord has for Us to get married six months later.

[Matt]

Mm, that's sweet. Yeah, that's the thing. You can't. You can't pick and choose only the good or only the. You know, you get to.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

There's no way back.

[Matt]

Take it as it comes, and then you do with it and steward what you have. Well, and I think you guys have really done that. I'm curious, since you brought up like, your parents separating, was that difficult planning, like a life with someone that you're saying, like, we're spend forever together, is that difficult coinciding, like, with the reality of what was happening with your parents marriage?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, 100%. I think there was. There was a point shortly after my parents separated where I was just like, I just didn't want anything to do with any relationships. Like, it's like, what's the point? Type of thing. Because this. This one, you know, marriage that you've looked up to your whole life has come to nothing. Not nothing, because there's children and there's proof from it. But it's like, so what is it worth? Type of thing. So I definitely had to work through that for a while of just like. Like, you know, love is a choice, and you can choose to work through things or you can choose to go your separate ways also. Just like, I'm not gonna let fear hold me back from anything. Like, that's not gonna be the reason I do or don't do something. So. But then with, I think with our relationship, like, my parents had been separated for like three years of that when we met, so I had kind of had time to process that. But what was really hard was like, I think it was like a month after we got married was when their divorce was finally finalized. So it's just like, whoa, we're starting our marriage. And.

[Zach Wise]

And actually, I'll even add to that. My parents, they didn't have like. Like, it didn't go big or anything like that, but they've had their struggles before. And so, like, I also had that in the back of my head. And so it was like, so like.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

My parents were getting. Got a divorce right after I got married. His parents were struggling. So it's just like, what's happening here?

[Zach Wise]

So, like, for her, like, there was resolve because it finally was like, the divorce was finalized. And for me, it's like they're. They're getting to resolve. My parents are stepping in the right direction, which is great. And they're learning a lot and doing great. And so it's. It's interesting to start a Marriage. When you see struggles in the examples of what marriage is to us. And so like, I think the biggest part was understanding that we're creating our own family and we're creating our own understanding between that and so like a lot of our conversations were around like, how does your family do this? And how does my family do this? And like, what do we want for our family that's different from the two? And so like really creating our own identity as a family instead of kind of, of taking what expectations we may bring from our own families.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

What do they say? There's like a quote, it says like, you marry your unfinished business. Like so just like the fact that you're already forward thinking of like, okay, wait, we need to dismantle, rebuild, and start from scratch in some areas. And I think that's what every new couple has to like examine or if you don't, it's gonna, you're just gonna keep repeating. I think that's what, that's just what humans do. That's what our nature wants to do.

[Abby]

I couldn't help but think with, you know, talking about struggles in marriage. I something that just like absolutely shattered my heart when I was listening to you guys share your story on other podcasts you've been on. Was hearing about your sibling that died at 17 months.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

And I just cannot, like, as a parent, I can't think of a more horrific thing to go through as a sibling. I can't think of something more horrific to how the heck do you navigate that? Like how, how does that work?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Honestly, I think that has more to do with my parents divorce than the show. That's a lie. I think that brought a lot. I think because our household wasn't necessarily one to just talk about everything and be vulnerable when that happened, we didn't know how to talk about it. And especially with it, you know, being in the hands of my mom, we weren't going to dare talk about around her. So I think, yeah, definitely with us, like not talking about the hardest thing in our childhood, it kind of just bred that in general, like we just don't talk about hard things. And I can't imagine how that affected my parents about just like not facing the hard things, not talking about the hard things, and kind of having to shut up your emotions a little bit because it's too painful to feel again after something like that.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

So like, it's so sad because I can see it in my mom sometimes with just like, does she know how to connect and how to feel and how to, like, know her emotions and all those things. And I'm like, at times I can be like, can't you just see this? And other times I'm like, I can imagine she can't and. Because she's had to shut that up because it's too painful.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

So I think that's definitely affected our family more than most of them realize because it happened so long ago, so it's not relevant today. But no, it's. It's here still with us. But yeah, that was definitely really hard to walk through as a family. But I think the hardest part for me as I've grown up was how little he was acknowledged.

[Abby]

Yeah. Well, that makes me so sad.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Thank you. Yeah. I don't think I visited his grave till I was like nine because it was just too hard to go back to.

[Matt]

That's so hard because like you said, like, you have so much empathy for your parents being like, I want to visit these emotions. I don't want to visit the guilt and the pain and. But they're there. And I think even just probably having to talk to their kids about it in a much different way, like, even talking. We just had a late term miscarriage and figuring out how to navigate that with our kids. I'm like, how do I talk about this? Like, how do I. I can't imagine with your parents without outside support knowing how to have those conversations. Because. How old were you at the time?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I was four. Four, yeah.

[Matt]

And you remember.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I remember everything too well.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah. I. I saw that as a massive. Just piece in the puzzle of a lot of struggles she had. And like, we've been to his grave multiple times since we've been together. And I've asked her every question I can just for her to remember it, because I know, I know it means a lot to her. I think, like, coming at a place of support instead of like, no, we can't talk about this has really been helpful for her. And like she said earlier, like, giving her a voice to understand things. And so.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And it's not like, like, now my family and I could talk about it like we do, but I think because we didn't, like, talk about it when it was raw and real and right there. There's just. I don't know, it just kind of built a wall to your emotions.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Matt]

So, yeah, like, there's a timing aspect to this.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

And it was unprocessed, so it's like, it seems like you had a process. You're still processing since it was something that you kind of just couldn't really talk about.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, I remember very vividly when I was still four, talking, like, asking questions about Joshua to my dad instead of my siblings. And, like, we started talking about it, but then mom walked in the room. He was like, we can't talk about this anymore, because she was there and just couldn't talk about it around her. So the one time I remember trying to talk about it, I couldn't. Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

And, yeah, I want to clarify, too. Like, all the family members are going through this, so it's not just like. Like, there's. This is nothing against the family for not doing these things, but I think there's a very real experience of, like, what they're going through today. Like she said, it's still very much present in what they're going through today of, like, just not always understanding the hard things or not always talking or acknowledging them. And so, you know, nothing against how Kim went about it. And, you know, I think there's a lot of healing that she needs to go through because of it. But I think. And obviously, there's. There's probably some things that needed to be talked about in those moments. But I just. I guess I just want to clarify, like, yeah, totally.

[Matt]

Like, it's like, it's a really hard thing. There's not necessarily a guidebook on what to do and things like this happen and everyone's hurting. But I think while a lot of people listening to this can't relate to that specific situation, I think families go through traumatic veterans. They don't know how to talk to their kids about it. But hearing you being brave enough to say, like, I do feel like it should have been acknowledged more. And I do wish that in that time there were more open conversations. I think that can shine a light for a lot of families. And it's like, it also gives you confidence and bravery as a parent and being like, okay, my kid. I can't just, you know, pretend like nothing happened. They're not gonna know because they're four years old.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Like, it's like, oh, they're so perceptive. And this honestly lays a fru framework for how your family and any family would continue to have emotional circumstances. I know what they say. Like, people go through traumatic mini traumas every five years on average, and then, like, a big trauma every, like, 25 years. Like, these things will continue to happen.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

We just interviewed a Harvard professor that said every five years, something horrible happens in your life. And it's like, how do you keep moving forward knowing that, like, you're still going to suffer, you're still going to struggle. There's still going to be awful things that happen in the world to you and around you. Like, how do you move forward amongst all that?

[Matt]

Yeah. Like that. How you handle that as a family lays a groundwork for how you will continue to handle many traumas, bigger things, even just conflict in general.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Gosh. Thank you for sharing that. That has to be really hard to navigate and process this many years later.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And, yeah, it does make me feel so much just compassion towards your parents, because I can't imagine a marriage. The statistics aren't positive. When a marriage undergoes something as traumatic as, like, a child loss, like, they're. They're not positive. And so it's like, I know that they were dealt, like, an incredibly hard hand in that.

[Abby]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Matt]

That's sweet that you visited his grave site. I think that's really precious and, like, that's very meaningful.

[Zach Wise]

I, like, it was really fun. I was like, like, okay, well, we got some extra time. Like, what do we want to do? And she was like, we can go to the farm. We can do this. And I'm like, well, I'm hungry. You want to go grab lunch and go have lunch with Joshua? And it was just like a super fun time. And it was just like, really?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I bought my eyes out for it. Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

It was like.

[Abby]

Feels special, though, to acknowledge it was.

[Zach Wise]

Fun in the sense of, like, just kind of sitting there kind of picnic style and like, having her reminisce with me and just, like, interactively. And it was just, like, cool to be brought into that.

[Matt]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

I think, because I didn't necessarily know too. Like, I knew some. Like, I heard the stories, but I was. I just wanted to ask the questions and, like, be really, like, brought into who he was before everything. So, yeah, it was really cool being four.

[Matt]

Like, that has to be one of your earliest memories.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, some of the earliest. I remember when he was born. Okay. I remember a few memories of his childhood, like, waking him up. I remember. You didn't.

[Zach Wise]

Did you carry him?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Let's go.

[Matt]

Do you really have that many kids? You're like, yeah, pick him up.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, I remember specific details about his childhood. I remember that afternoon he was sleeping on his blankie out in the sun. And then every detail of the accident, I remember too. Well, I was in the car when it happened, and, oh, my God, I. My mom, she, like, freaked out, got out, pulled him out from under the car, and then her and all my siblings Ran to the house to grab the phone. And Isaac and I, my youngest brother, younger brother, were in the car. And I got out, I saw him and I just, it was terrible. So I coined back in the car and I just told Isaac. I was like, don't look, just get out the other door. We gotta go. Those details I remember too well. But I am blessed to remember some moments of his childhood too.

[Abby]

Gosh, you're freaking four. And to have to tell your sibling, like, hey, don't go out this door. Yeah, just like, yeah, no 4 year old should have to experience that.

[Matt]

And I can even hear now you navigating like younger. And then our youngest, younger, like having to like reframe all that. And I remember on a podcast you share like one of your first times, like driving together in a car, you played a song that your mom wrote about your younger brother. And I feel like there's, it's, there's no coincidence that you felt safe enough to open up about like this incredibly hard thing because something very. Not to compare again. But something very similar happened to Matt and I the first time we drove in a car together. I told you about a loss that I had never really talked to many people about. And there's just something like, there's something you can't explain when you just feel like your soul is safe with like, with someone else.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Like.

[Matt]

And.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, that was, that was after our first mountain, before the four, before we were dating, anything like that. We were in the car at like 1am to try to get to the mountain before the sunrise. And he started out with just like, all right, let's, you know, pick a John, pick a genre, pick your favorite song, type of game.

[Zach Wise]

I call it the Spotify game.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Spotify game.

[Matt]

That's fun. You learn a lot about something that way. That's good.

[Zach Wise]

Seriously.

[Matt]

So we started the serious stuff.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, he started out, you know, with his genre. I did one and then he did one and then, and then I just went, I went deep all the way.

[Zach Wise]

I think I like jokingly said, like, what's the song that just like has a lot of meaning to you or like something you play often or even like something sad, I think.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

And I didn't expect that, but it was good. I like, it was, it was awesome to like.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That was probably what I told you, like about the family band, about me losing a brother. Like, I just dumped everything and then played the song. Song.

[Zach Wise]

She like, gave it the, the context. And I was like, thanks for sharing. Like, I really appreciate that. And then she shared the song and she started crying and. And his hand on my leg. She remembers that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Oh, he put his hand up when they do that.

[Abby]

That's a big move. Abby put her hand on my leg when I put my hand around her on the first date. And I remember I was like, I was like I was being struck like lightning. Like, my body was just.

[Zach Wise]

You can't move. You cannot. This is.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Oh, girl.

[Abby]

It's like, you know that inside out.

[Zach Wise]

Like, it's like, girl, girl, girl.

[Abby]

And the guy just froze. He's like. It's like he's looking at Riley, the guy that thinks Riley's cute or whatever. That was me on that.

[Matt]

I remember the way my hip hurt so bad because of the way I was leaning, but I was like, I can't move, right?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, you're uncomfortable, but you're just like, boy, I'm glad.

[Abby]

I'm glad. That moment was. Is remembered by the hand on the leg.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's later that day on the first mountain. He put his arm around me.

[Zach Wise]

Oh, my God.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And then I leaned my head on his shoulder.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah. And same thing happens.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Like, girl.

[Zach Wise]

Girl, girl, girl.

[Matt]

That's sweet. Well, I love. Even in that picture of like, you guys in the car, it's like, hey, like, this is, this is how I'm feeling. And then you saying, like, I'm here.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And I think that that's really, that's really beautiful. And that's essentially what marriage is.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

The.

[Matt]

It was what I'm learning so far. Like, and I think that, like, marriage is about like this lovey dovey, newlywed stage. It's like, that's so fun. And then like, also, like, later on, like, there's a harder stage. Like, harder season. Like, we're going through a harder season. I'm like, oh, I think back to that stage. I'm like, wow. Like, when everything was so fun, but we were all like, laying the groundwork to prepare us for like, this event and then we still feel closer because of it. Thank you to Huel for sponsoring this portion of today's episode. Now that we are in a season of life where our kids are sleeping a little bit more, our time in the morning has been cut dramatically. So we really need to get up and going and out the door in a short amount of time nowadays. And that is why these Huel nutritionally complete Ready to drink meals have been so convenient for us.

[Abby]

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[Matt]

They also have chocolate, vanilla and they have an iced coffee flavor too.

[Abby]

The strawberry banana, in my personal opinion, is the best. It tastes just like a famous yogurt I would drink and it just brings me back to my childhood. So tasty. I feel like sometimes the protein drinks that you have in the mornings from some of these brands are just a little off. This flavor though, killer. So good. So tasty. 10 out of 10 can't go wrong with a strawberry banana.

[Matt]

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[Abby]

I do want to talk about real quick. We've talked about so much, but you gradually mentioned your family having a band. I feel like that's so unique and so not like ordinary for a family to like go on tour to have.

[Matt]

Enough members of their family to create a whole.

[Abby]

You guys have a whole orchestra.

[Zach Wise]

Like what?

[Abby]

Exactly.

[Zach Wise]

Think about it too though. They went everywhere.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We traveled everywhere from like Minnesota in Texas was the farthest west we went. And then obviously Florida was farthest south we went Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina, like Kentucky, Virginia, that loop all in there kind of went there. But yeah, we had a family band. We had. Let's see if I can name off all the instruments. So piano, violin, accordion, mandolin, banjo, guitar, upright bass, two violins, two guitars. Yeah, we had a nice variety. And then my oldest brother has the best bass voice and then. Yeah, that's so impressive. Jammed out. Started. It started with us just jamming out at home because my mom was a music major in college. Sushi just naturally taught all of us music. You know, just the simple stuff. Piano, music theory.

[Matt]

Music ain't that simple.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It's not. When I said that I was like possible. But still it started with just us growing up, learning about music. Some, some of the children excelled more than others. I wasn't one of the ones that like really Stuck to a certain instrument. But then like my oldest siblings, they would get together just with their violin, cello and what else? Guitar maybe, and just play songs together. And then we decided to go to the local nursing home and just entertain the old folks. There's nothing better that's adorably like that. Anyway, so it started with that and then some of like the nurses or some people there would just be like, you guys should come sing at our church. And I remember the first church we got invited to, we were just like, we should probably learn some hymns or something because we were playing like folk. Forget the names of the songs we were playing. Like Red Red Wing, I think was one of them. Just like, just folk songs.

[Abby]

It would have been funny if you guys would have learned like modern pop music and done like, like a folk version of it. Like, like I've. I've seen some really funny tick tocks of people. Yeah. Taking like a unique style like, yeah, folk family music and then using especially like a rap song.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, I, I think that's hilarious.

[Abby]

I would come to that show, I would, I would find that very entertaining.

[Matt]

Like we need some hymns here.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Right? So we got invited to our first church saying that. And apparently somehow they liked. I look back and I'm like, like, oh my goodness. But I think we're more just entertaining than sounded good because seeing, you know, nine kids up there, including like a two year old who's just going around and picking at different things, we eventually got her like this little banjo that didn't make any noise or anything, but.

[Matt]

She would just stand there.

[Abby]

Oh, that's cute.

[Zach Wise]

See, I beg to differ though. I've seen these videos on YouTube and it's cute.

[Matt]

We did get better.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

We did get better as time went on. Like the video, the videos you've seen are much better than our first performance. But yeah, it, it grew like crazy. I think like within two years. I remember one year we sang at like 111 churches in one year or events in one year. And that was, wow, that was our busiest year. And then after that kind of, kind of slowed down a little bit. And then it's actually full circle. Kind of how the show came along too, because we had out of nowhere a connection from a friend of a friend. This videographer from California needed a place to stay and so we had a guest house. We were like, come stay at our place. First night he was at our place, we sang a few songs for him and he was like, I need to make a music video for you guys. So kind of as, like, as a place, you know, he stayed at our place for free. He made a music video for us for free.

[Abby]

And that's how you got discovered from that music video.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Sunnyside was the one that we did, and that. That went pretty big. And then, yeah, about a month or two later, we had. We had production reaching out to us.

[Abby]

No way.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Love. Love this. Would you guys want to do a show? And I think we said no for about two years, but then here we are season.

[Abby]

So they kept coming back. They kept me back and wanted to do a show on you guys.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. But then by the time we actually finally said yes and got everything worked out, all the things, and they sent the crew out, the band had ended because my oldest sister got married, and she was kind of like, the leading force of it. So she got married. She married a musician. So now.

[Zach Wise]

No.

[Abby]

Do they release music together?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah. Yeah, that's.

[Abby]

Oh, and she's the one that doesn't. It's not. She's not on the show anymore, but she's doing live shows, so that's cool that she's, like, following her passion. That's really neat.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Oh, yeah. She's a violinist. She married a pianist, and they. They're together. Amazing together. So, yeah, like, when once she left and got married, and some of the older siblings were just growing up, and they were like, yeah, I don't like this music that we do anymore. We need to do different. All these things. So the band kind of just ended, but then they were still like, well, we still have your family. We'd still want to, you know, cover you guys. So we started filming.

[Matt]

That's how it came to be. That's how it started. Okay, and now here you are. Just finished season seven.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

You're starting your own family now.

[Zach Wise]

See, but this, for me, it's completely different. Like, I remember we went to. We went on this road trip, kind of going around. We did 11 states in 30 days. And we went to my hometown and we went to church at my hometown, to a church I've been to many times. And we got recognized there. And they're like, what are you doing here?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

They look at.

[Zach Wise]

They're like, It's a city. 20,000 population in Kansas, middle of nowhere. I'm like, I grew up here. Like, this is where I grew up. And it's just, like. It's surreal seeing the difference of, like, I'm still the same person, but now I'm on a TV screen, and so people, like, recognize me and just the difference. And so Yeah, I just really. I call my sisters all the time and I'm like, yeah, I'm just going to be on. On, you know, Matt Navy or whatever. And like, my sister's like, no way. And just like, that sort of stuff. And like, you said that too casually. Like, I'll be on the phone and I'll say it like, yeah, we're just going to Arizona. I'm gonna be on a podcast. It's like, what podcast?

[Matt]

It creates so much disconnect in me. I'm like, that's so crazy that they even know who are.

[Zach Wise]

But I know. But, like, that's where I'm at. I'm just like, I don't know how. Because when I really got to know them, I'm like, they're pretty normal people. Yeah. And I think the more people we've gotten to meet, even people abnormally normal, surely normal.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

How'd you describe it? You said earlier. You said out there.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah, out there. Ye.

[Matt]

Awesome. So are you guys gonna have nine kids as well? Is that the plan once it happens?

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Not the plan.

[Zach Wise]

I think the number we agreed on is three to five.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That was the number.

[Matt]

I said three to five.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Let's go.

[Matt]

See, That's a good number. And it also gives you a little bit of. Gives you a range there. Yes. To try to feel it out.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

See how it goes.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

But also, like, Zach has to be a girl dad, like, at one point or another. So if. Like, if. If the first three are boys, we're just gonna have to keep trying till we have some girls.

[Zach Wise]

Random change of subject. But I do want to get back to something you said.

[Matt]

Oh, yes.

[Zach Wise]

Kind of been poking. You talked about, like, just dealing with the public eye and that sort of stuff. And even both of you kind of going into therapy and that sort of stuff. It's great.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Zach Wise]

And having to really know yourself in. In, like, what you're saying, how do you know when to kind of adhere to your audience and, like, what they're saying of what they want versus staying true to the content that you want.

[Abby]

Whoa, that's so good. That's a really good question. What would you say to that one?

[Matt]

I mean, I think that's something we've messed up and corrected and messed up and corrected and, like, learned through and fallen into such. Because also, it's like us as a couple. Right. Like, it's like, that is different than, like, us as individuals. But I kind of, like, created, like, a mission statement as we. So we're about to start another big project And I was like, man, this is something that I've learned is that this is a hard thing to navigate. That thing is one of those things you don't anticipate necessarily. So I think it's so incredibly, like, it speaks to you guys as people. Like, the fact that you're even asking this question, that you have such good intentions creating a mission statement. It sounds so cheesy. It sounds like something corporate. Like, someone's gonna have to. Like, we have to post this so we could check off a to do list, like, how to start this business. But creating that, like, mission statement helps create a standard that it's like, if there is ever a question where it's like, oh, it's this. We're kind of. It feels iffy here. Go back to that. Does it. Does it fit that? And I think that you could create a mission statement for your marriage, for your family, for your social media, for any business, any project you start. And that just helps create so much clarity where you're, like, having. You're facing so many decisions that you're gonna have to make. And it's like, okay, well, we can't have this many conversations. We can't always wait back and forth. But when it comes to, like, an area where it's like, okay, I can't really, really step forward, just bring back to the mission statement. Yeah, that adds so much clarity. And that's such a cheesy answer. But it's. It's very helpful. But also, even just creating that does so much for you. Yeah. To be like, okay, what is integral? What is, like, the most important thing? What is my goal in doing this? Like, what's the point?

[Abby]

Abby is so. She's always been so authentic online. She just gives no Fs, which I think is, like, really, really cool.

[Matt]

I never describe myself as that.

[Abby]

I give. I do give more Fs than I.

[Matt]

You have a couple Fs to give.

[Abby]

I do have a couple Fs to give. And so I think that's, like. Yeah, that's definitely made me, you know, bring things up in therapy to work through, because I'm like, man, I need to figure out, like, what.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Abby]

How my brain works and why.

[Matt]

I think the. The truth of it all, too, is, like, you show up as you are.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And if you're not showing. If I'm not showing up as the best version of myself, then that's what's.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's what's portrayed.

[Matt]

And I think that also just is a heavy responsibility and a high responsibility. When you have a lot of people looking at you, it's like, well, they're gonna see who you are. And obviously there's a ton of misunderstandings, misinterpretations, straight up lies and rumors.

[Abby]

But ultimately, it can be hard to have lies and rumors about, like, because for us, like, it's just about our relationship. But then now with your family, you have, like, everything.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I was gonna ask how you guys handle that, because, like, you know, there's some rumors, some lies out there that's just like, whatever. But then there's others that are just like, why would people do that? It's like, so not true. So out there, so hurtful. I've seen some where it's like, posted that my grandpa died or that my dad has cancer or that like. Like all these things, like, why would you do that? Just for likes and clicks?

[Zach Wise]

Or what's the big thing with.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

It's like, why are you like, what if I'm struggling with infertility and I see this, that you're posting a pregnant picture of me? Like, how hard would that be? So, like, why? How do you.

[Zach Wise]

It's the big stuff with AI, though. Like, these are all AI stuff.

[Matt]

I fall for that sometimes. Articles and stuff. I'm like, what? I'm like, oh, that's not real. I have to correct my mom and grandma a lot, too. I'm like, this isn't real.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

I'm just like, wondering if you guys have come across that or if that's just reality TV world. And if so, like, does it ever come big, Big enough for you guys to address it? Or are you just like, no, just live your life, I think. Focus on what you're doing and just let that fall aside. Because I've gotten so many messages of people are like, you had a baby in July. Why don't you put it on? Like, why are you hiding your baby?

[Matt]

And here's the thing, there's no end to that. There's no end to that stuff. And I think that's something that I've just had to completely, like, lay aside at this point.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's what I'm getting.

[Matt]

Your life. And you can continue to use this as it aids you in your marriage, your future family. And if it's no longer serving you, then it's like, okay, well, we were doing this for ourselves anyway. So, like, yeah. And we were showing up as we are, and all these other things just feel so outside.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

And so I think that's all you can do, honestly. There's so many different ways to approach it. But for me, I'm like, I just had to tune everything else out. And, like, it's just. It's been so freeing too, because then I feel like I can also just show up as authentically as possible, like for our audience. And then I also can just sleep well at night, like, knowing, like, oh, I don't have to. I don't have to cater to all of these other things because I only have to cater to my own family who's in my own. Under my roof. And that's just. Yeah, that creates so much peace in life. And ultimately I feel like that's what we're all searching for. It's just a little bit more peace.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

And so, yeah, I think that's where I've come to. Because there was was a period of time where I was just, like, so frustrated. Like, people are spreading these rumors, right. And it's like, just clarify. We didn't have a baby in July. That'd be impossible. So. So, yeah, I've had to come to a place where it's just like, you know what? That doesn't matter. And it's been like a good month now that I haven't, like, looked into anything, seeing what people are saying.

[Abby]

So that baby you guys brought with you, it wasn't yours?

[Zach Wise]

No.

[Matt]

I think that would be my best.

[Zach Wise]

Advice from what I've learned.

[Matt]

Obviously, you know, longer you've been in public eye longer, but I think that it's just like, just as long as there's peace with. Under my own roof, then, yeah, that's my world.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

That's as big as my.

[Abby]

It is funny, though, like, I'm sorry, sorry to interrupt, but like, mega, mega celebrities, like, legitimately do stuff like that. Like Kylie Jenner hiding her pregnancy for, I think she hit it for like six months, and then she's like, boom, I have a baby. But like, to think about up people, people like us that I guess happen to have people that know who we are in the world, but it's like, that's a completely different thing.

[Matt]

Yeah. You don't have, like, bodyguards.

[Zach Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

You'd be able to tell.

[Abby]

Yes. This one's like, oh, it was a shotgun wedding. They did it because they had a baby and they hid it from the public eye.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Look.

[Abby]

Yeah, I know, it's true. Insert AI picture.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Actually, no, those are the posts. It's like, it was a shotgun wedding, but. But yeah, I think, think, oh, what was I gonna say? Oh, yeah. They're like, I don't. I totally have had Moments where I'm just like, I need to meet the person who's creating this.

[Abby]

Yeah.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Speak to them. Because it's like, if they could just meet me face to face and have a one on one conversation with me and see that I'm just, just a human being like you and just live my life and just trying to figure out this marriage and just working and just girl doing all those things.

[Matt]

Listen, your efforts are so much more rewarded through doing something that's gonna build you up.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah, I've definitely had my moments like that, but I've moved so hard.

[Matt]

I'm acting like it's easy. But yeah, as much as you can tune all the outside stuff up and like, guide your energy and your focus and your just attention towards what's gonna make you the best version of yourself.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Yeah.

[Matt]

Then, like, I can definitely work on that as well. I'm speaking to myself as well, but I think that's my best advice. And I think that you guys are stewarding it so well. And I just know that I was like, just living, like, listening to your conversations. Like, it impacted me so much. I'm like, I just want to go home and kiss Matt. I, like, miss this. Like newlywed. Like lovey dovey, stage and mushy gushy.

[Abby]

Should we kiss right now? No. Dang it.

[Matt]

Anyway, he has that.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

Okay.

[Matt]

Sure.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

With that.

[Matt]

This was great. Everyone. Go kiss your husband.

[Abby]

Yes, go kiss your spouse. Lydia, Zach, thank you for coming on the show. Thanks for having us. So much fun.

[Matt]

New year, new me.

[Lydia Plath Wise]

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[Matt]

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