Nick Viall (2:29)

All you have to do is go to VI Files. Plus you can and you will be lucky you did.

Podcast Co-Host (2:34)

What's up, everybody? We have a very exciting announcement for all the Ask Nick audience out there. We have new Instagram and TikTok specifically for Ask Nick. So if you want to avoid all the pop culture and reality TV content that we're putting out there and just focus on all things relationship, dating, interpersonal relationships, and just Ask Nick content, just please give us a follow. It's Ask Nick Viall on Instagram and Tik Tok. So give us a follow and enjoy.

Nick Viall (3:05)

We'll be glad that you did. All right, let's get to our first.

Podcast Co-Host (3:09)

Caller, but not before you go on.

Nick Viall (3:12)

And give us a follow. How's it going?

Riley (3:17)

Doing good, Nick. How are you doing today?

Nick Viall (3:19)

I'm good. What's your name?

Riley (3:20)

My name is Riley and I am 30 years old.

Nick Viall (3:22)

How can I help, Riley?

Riley (3:24)

I thought I was going on a bunch of really, really bad dates and I am noticing that I might be the problem now.

Nick Viall (3:32)

Okay, what makes you. What made you notice that?

Riley (3:35)

I've been single for two and a half, going on three years, and ultimately I have been on a lot of dates. I've tried a lot of different types of people, different energies, their careers, whatever, lifestyles, and I am just feeling kind of defeated because nothing seems to be like a good fit. But I'm noticing this reoccurring avoidance and commitment problem.

Nick Viall (4:06)

From you?

Riley (4:07)

Yeah, from myself.

Nick Viall (4:09)

Okay, you said you were single for like two and a half years. What did that last relationship look like?

Riley (4:13)

So my last relationship was very happy. We were super loving with each other, had a great time, we're best friends, adventured a lot together. But ultimately I was just sat down on a very random day and told that he wasn't happy anymore. And I kind of had to pry it out of him that he was breaking up with me. And so it came pretty suddenly after living together, planning out our life together, deciding that we wanted to have a future as far as marriage goes and things.

Nick Viall (4:44)

And so was it devastating for you? Were you like, I kind of see what you're seeing and maybe it wasn't so bad. Like, what, what was that like for you?

Riley (4:52)

It was pretty earth shattering, honestly. It came out of left field. I was not expecting it. We had been in couples counseling just to adjust to living together because he was super introverted and I was really extroverted. And so just trying to understand how those styles can mesh within a household. But then maybe a month before this, we had both come to the agreement that therapy was going great, and maybe we take a pause on it and just keep implementing what we had been implementing because we were both really happy.

Nick Viall (5:23)

How did you process that breakup?

Riley (5:25)

Not well at all. We tried to be friends because, like I said, we were best friends during our relationship, that we tried to be friends. And ultimately it was almost like he was my boyfriend without him being my boyfriend, just helping me out still, and, like, showing up and whatnot and emotionally being there.

Nick Viall (5:43)

How long did that last? God, he offered way too long. It was like he offered to be friends to feel less bad about breaking up with you. And you accepted the invitation to be friends in the hopes that he would change his mind and you could win him back.

Riley (5:59)

You know, maybe. I think I was pretty certain that he was done. He's never gone back to a relationship, so I had accepted that we were done. But I was a little delusional in hoping that we actually could be friends.

Nick Viall (6:10)

I'm sure you probably, you know, had a. You weren't delusional in the sense that you were like, I can definitely get him back. But, like, I don't think deep down if you truly believe that there was no hope you would have. You know what I'm saying? Like, so when did you. How long did you guys pretend to be friends for?

Riley (6:26)

Like, maybe three to four months.

Rebecca (6:30)

So quite a while.

Nick Viall (6:31)

And then what happened?

Riley (6:32)

He started dating somebody that was in our friend group and told me about it, and that's when I decided that we could no longer be friends.

Nick Viall (6:42)

So it's almost like two breakups in a way.

Riley (6:46)

Yeah, I guess so.

Nick Viall (6:48)

And then how did you deal with that?

Riley (6:50)

Not well. I definitely obsessed over it. I thought about it constantly.

Nick Viall (6:55)

Where are you now with it?

Riley (6:56)

So, you know, now I don't miss him. Like, I very much accepted that we are not each other's people.

Nick Viall (7:05)

Okay.

Riley (7:06)

And that that was not a good path to go down long term. However, I am still hurt by how that went about, and I think I'm really scared to hurt, commit to anybody.

Nick Viall (7:18)

How are you hurt?

Riley (7:19)

Because it was so sudden and unexpected. I have a really, really hard time trusting other people and trusting myself. So I feel betrayed. Like, it. I wish he could have been a little bit more clear maybe leading up to that, that he wasn't happy or maybe even honest with himself. Sure. I have a really hard time trusting.

Nick Viall (7:41)

Well, how much in terms of you guys not being for each other. Like, are you. You totally believe that. You totally feel that.

Riley (7:49)

I believe that. I would like to have a person that emulates Similar qualities, just as far as, like, wanting to do similar hobbies. Has a very light, excited, carefree spirit. But I don't want him at all because I've realized he has some deep seated issues if he couldn't communicate with me.

Nick Viall (8:12)

You're basing that solely on how he broke up with you?

Riley (8:14)

There was other things. I mean, he lied to me, so him and I both are sober and haven't drank for years, but he lied to me about how long he had been sober because he was afraid that I would judge him for that and run away. He didn't want to spend, like, Christmas with a lot of people. Like, he was very limited on his ability to be with other people during the holidays. So there's definitely things that I really don't think long term would have been a good fit. Okay.

Nick Viall (8:45)

You know, listen, I think obviously that breakup affected you in a way that I think is, you know, meaningful. And quite honestly, almost kind of sounds like there's still, like, some leftover debris from that breakup that still affects you. You know, I don't necessarily suggest you, like, spending more time and energy thinking about, like, why you shouldn't be together, but, like, did you. Did you get individual therapy? Like, in terms of just dealing with that breakup and processing that loss and moving on from it?

Riley (9:11)

I got into therapy a lot later than I probably should have because I think in the moment I thought I was handling it well, but hindsight's 2020 and I wasn't. So maybe about a year and a half ago, I started going to therapy and I was a lot more, like, cagey and guarded than I had normally been in therapy before. Normally I'm a pretty open book, and it took about, like, nine months for us to actually talk about anything substantial.

Nick Viall (9:37)

Do you still find yourself thinking about how he broke up with you?

Riley (9:41)

Absolutely. Yeah. The how, I think is what's hardest.

Nick Viall (9:45)

But if he's not your person, why does the how. Why does the how matter? Why does the how matter? Why does the I don't know if that makes sense. But you don't why is how he broke up with you matter?

Riley (9:55)

I guess it shouldn't then.

Nick Viall (9:58)

I mean, have you ever been in a tough situation where you just were a little bit confused about your feelings and then you knew that those feelings might affect other people, but at the end of the day, it's how you felt and you weren't really sure how to communicate it? And maybe you tried your best to communicate it the most honest and effective way, but, like, you were also a Little confused about, like, you know, knowing that it would hurt someone else. And. And you. Have you been in that position?

Riley (10:23)

Yeah, definitely since that breakup. I've been in that position at least a few times, you know, where I'm probably now the one that's super suddenly cutting things off.

Nick Viall (10:33)

But I. You know, I just want you to think about that because you're. It sounds like you've spent a lot of emotional time and energy not being able to get over how he ended things. And you spend a lot of time and emotional energy ruminating about how he lied to you, which is not untrue. But I think you're probably painting a narrative that's probably a little harsh, both to yourself and to him. And ultimately, like, what does it accomplish? And I think there's a level of forgiveness that would benefit you. It's just like letting go of that relationship. I mean, you're only 30. You know, you have a long life ahead of you, and relationships are complicated. It sounds like, just from what I'm hearing, you're just. You've really, like, again, you were victimized and you were hurt, and that was a very difficult time for you. But you have not let go of that pain, and. And you have kind of sulked in it a little bit. And I. You know, I've been for different. You know, I've been in your position before, and I. I remember, and I started using the feeling of I love to hu. Hurt so good. You kind of get comfortable with that pain. It almost becomes an identity. Like when I was in your position, feeling wronged by former partners, I. I. Fuck it. I. I held on to that, like an identity, you know, it was. You know, I would. Especially when I was in my lowest. I would, you know, anyone who would talk to me, you know, boy, I had a story to tell. And that story was, you know. You know, it was like this Greek tragedy of. And I was the victim in that story. You know, when I told that story, I wanted people's sympathy, and I bec. I kind of became addicted to that. I kind of. It really became who I was. This person who was wronged by their partner, lied to, misled. All I was ever doing was chasing love and trying to be a good partner. And this person just couldn't be honest with me about their feelings, you know? But the reality is, he was honest with you. He broke up with you. Like, how he got there probably a little, like, not as clean as you had hoped, but at that time, he broke up with you. You loved him. You. You Thought you wanted a life with him. There was this no version of him breaking up with you that was going to be like, cool. Yeah, actually. No, I get it. You know, I'm totally. You know, there is this no version of that. Right. And I'm not saying he deserves a pass and I'm not saying he probably could have done things better, but it's kind of gotten to that point where you've given him too much power and you have. It's really got it in your head to the point where now you are feeling it affecting, creating life going forward. And it sounds like you maybe haven't really fully forgiven him, you know, or yourself. It is still something that you think about from time to time.

Riley (13:19)

Yeah, no, absolutely. We've had to see each other a lot recently. We haven't seen each other in about two years, but we had a mutual friend who unfortunately died.

Nick Viall (13:28)

I'm so sorry.

Riley (13:28)

And so. Thank you. We went to the memorial and I knew I was going to probably run into him there. And it's just been a lot of accidentally running. Not accidentally, but like having to run into him lately. And yeah, I do have anger towards him still. Like I have anger towards his now new wife. You know, like, I really struggle. Why? With them or her?

Nick Viall (13:55)

Yeah, sure. Specifically her.

Riley (13:57)

But yeah, with her because we were becoming friends and then she ended up going and dating my ex, but they're now married. We did a lot of. Yeah, no, for sure.

Nick Viall (14:09)

I mean, well, there's only two. There's two possible outcomes of that relationship. Either they are truly happy together and that's how it should be. And despite your ego feeling a certain way about it, you know, he's not your guy. And you didn't lose. You know, it's just how things played out. Or they're wrong and eventually they'll have an even messier breakup than you had with him. And her time will come, so to speak, either way. The energy that you are, I mean, you just have. You have to see it this way. Right. You know what I'm saying? Like. Like you feeling any type of hatred towards her is. It's hurting you. You know, it's. It's, it's. It's sucking. Literally sucking energy out of you that doesn't do you any good and in fact, probably causes harm. Right? Like, it just. That's not energy you're putting into yourself in a positive way, you know? And. Yeah, I can't help but wonder if, like, you know, with. How. How can you date with so much anger that you're holding on to still.

Riley (15:12)

Yeah. I mean, it seems almost impossible, especially with my experiences.

Nick Viall (15:19)

Why do you say impossible?

Riley (15:20)

I guess just anytime that I do feel like I like someone or have the potential to like somebody, I get totally freaked out and run away or I start nitpicking and finding reasons why they're not my person very easily.

Nick Viall (15:37)

But, I mean, do you think it's impossible for you to move on from this anger that you have?

Riley (15:43)

No, I don't think it's impossible to move on from it. I think it's impossible to be happy and find my person being angry.

Nick Viall (15:50)

Definitely making it harder for sure. Yeah. Yeah.

Podcast Co-Host (15:53)

I think you got to try to.

Nick Viall (15:54)

Let go, it would seem. Yeah, I mean, I agree with you. It'd be very difficult for you to truly move on and find your person when you're still hanging on to some bad feelings that are two years old for a person who's moved on. And that's. That's the problem with you not processing this loss in an effective way is that, like, he has since moved on. It's been a reasonable period of time. He is literally married now. And because you've held on to this anger, now when he's moving on, it still feels like in fuck you to you. You know, this guy's just living his life. You know, the Frank, you know, it's not fun to finger. You know, it's like you weren't friends with her, you were becoming friends with her, you were friendly with her, you know, and the reality is, is that, like, if the roads were reversed, you would have done the same thing. If your heart was healthy and you had a. You know, and you met a guy and you. You had this acquaintance, you know, it's like you wouldn't say no to a love interest because of an acquaintance of that used to date someone, nor would you be expected to. Would you agree?

Riley (16:56)

Yeah, it sounds silly when you say it like that.

Nick Viall (16:59)

It's not silly, but it's all personal. Like, listen, like, this is your life, right? Like, you are the main character in your life. And I think that's just something to be cognizant of. Is that in your story and how you're telling the story to yourself, you were wronged and you haven't had to be too delusional or make too many leaps to be like, yeah, it's fucked up what he did. It's fucked up. He started dating my friend, and it's fucked up. He married her. And it's like, it was bad enough he broke up with me and wasn't on with me then he just. He couldn't just. You know, he definitely doesn't see it that way, and a lot of people don't, but, like, you do, because that's the story you've been telling yourself.

Riley (17:41)

Yeah, I'm just processing a lot of what you're saying.

Nick Viall (17:45)

Are you still in therapy talking about this stuff?

Riley (17:49)

I am, yeah. We have.

Nick Viall (17:52)

Really? What do you guys talk about? Have you talked about any of this?

Riley (17:55)

No. Oh, absolutely.

Nick Viall (17:59)

What does your therapist say?

Riley (18:01)

So she has made it aware to me that I have quite an avoidant attachment style.

Nick Viall (18:07)

What does that mean to you? I've heard of avoid attachment style, but I'm just wondering what that means in relation to everything we just talked about. Like, because again, I don't. I'm not. I'm not an attachment theory expert. I understand the concepts and I think they're interesting, but I don't know what that has to do. You know what I'm saying? A general question. I'm not denying it, but it's just more. Talking to you for five minutes, it seemed pretty clear that that breakup you up, it's still fucking you up, and it is taking a lot of your emotional energy, and it's energy that's making you. It's negative energy. And I don't know how that doesn't affect people. To me, that's the thing that I would love for you to process. Again, I've related to your experience. Right. And I've been in your shoes. And I remember when I was doing the thing that I think you're doing now, I was a victim in my story. Right. I was in my main character version of the reality that through my perspective, I was wronged. That was the narrative when I would talk to my lady friends at work. I wanted their sympathy. I told the story through the. Isn't this fucked up? I couldn't have seen it coming. I sh. You know, I did everything I could. I fought for this. They didn't. Yeah. You know, and it's just long past it mattering, you know, and it wasn't until I finally was like, I had to stop. Right. And those thoughts don't just magically go away, but when they do pop in, it's just. It's literally telling yourself to kind of get over it, to just be like, all right, I can't keep thinking this way. Listen, we're not supposed to be together and telling yourself you're happy for them, or if you can't get them out of your head. It's like you fake it till you make it. It's being happy for them. When I felt wronged by a girlfriend the first time, I got engaged briefly and then moved in together and felt blindsided. When she got engaged, you know, I don't know, like, nine months later to the guy, and I ran into her, I was like, I, I. And I. At first, I didn't totally believe it, but I was like, I'm really happy for you. I mean, like, yeah, I realized I really didn't want to be with her. I knew she wasn't for me. I. My ego was still bruised, but I really had to, like, change that narrative in my head, and I had to, like, you know, say it out loud. And when people asked, I stopped being sad and the victim. And if. If people offered me sympathy about that, I was more like, you know what? I don't need that sympathy any good, you know, Like. And I wasn't always good at first. I think that stuff goes a long way, I think, you know, like, saying things to yourself matters. Like, the pictures we paint in our head are our reality. The things we tell ourself become our reality. So if you tell yourself you're not okay, it's hard to feel okay. You know, if you tell yourself this is the right thing for me, even if I don't feel right now, it'll eventually. You'll eventually get there. And I just feel like for. You know, it's like for the past two years, you've been telling yourself you're not okay. What has your therapist telling you? That you're an avoidant attachment. How has that helped you?

Riley (21:19)

I guess what has helped me is, like, now we're starting to have conversations about understanding how I am in relationships with other people. Not even just, like, romantic, but even, like, friendships and family and whatnot. And we're trying to figure out how to, like, communicate that to another person.

Nick Viall (21:38)

Can you give me an example?

Riley (21:40)

We've just started going down this path, so I don't have a ton to reference, but essentially, like, I really struggle, like, sticking it out when I get uncomfortable. And I tend to want to flee rather than communicate what's going on with me and that, like, what I'm needing in those moments or just, like, letting somebody know what's actually happening rather than cutting and running because that's what's comfortable.

Nick Viall (22:14)

Just out of curiosity, any of these men you're kind of referring to that you've cut and run, do you regret any of them? Do you miss some of them? Do you feel like you fucked up.

Riley (22:24)

Yeah. I mean, one of them for sure. I feel like we had a really good thing going. It was so recent. After, like, my ex and I broke up, it was only maybe six months after that, so it was still pretty soon. But the moment that I had a reason to run away, he, like, isn't the biggest fan of dogs. And there was a big elephant in the room because I have a dog, and he's very hairy dog and a very needy dog. And there's a lot of things about him being a dog. And so the second that I found out he's not a big fan of dogs after dating for, like three months, I just, like, cut and run. And I think I had a very big attitude of, like, nothing's going to change my mind. Like, this is what's right.

Nick Viall (23:07)

Did he. Did he try to stop you from ending it? Did he fight for you?

Riley (23:11)

No, because he told me, I can tell that you're really serious and nothing I say is going to matter. It's like, I have a lot of things I would like to say, but I don't think anything's going to matter. And I walked out the door.

Nick Viall (23:22)

And what about any of the other guys?

Riley (23:25)

More recently, like, literally, as of this last week, I ended things with somebody very great person. I don't think there's anything wrong with him, but I just keep believing that we're not compatible.

Nick Viall (23:40)

Why?

Riley (23:42)

You know, a lot of my reasons are kind of silly and ridiculous. Like, you know, like, he wants to be helpful and starts giving me tips on how to run my business. And he wants to, like, be helpful and send me things throughout the day, like food and coffee and whatever that I never asked for. And it just feels overwhelming. And so I push him away and he lives in another state.

Nick Viall (24:09)

Are you asking for help to run your business?

Riley (24:12)

I mean. No.

Nick Viall (24:13)

Is it helpful what he's doing?

Riley (24:16)

No. I typically already know what he's telling me, so then it makes me feel like he thinks I'm stupid.

Nick Viall (24:21)

Yeah. So kind of mansplaining to you and feels a little condescending.

Riley (24:26)

Yeah. Although I feel like I could maybe communicate that.

Nick Viall (24:30)

Okay.

Riley (24:31)

Looking back and I don't know, maybe that's just who he is and that's how he would be an entire relationship.

Nick Viall (24:37)

But, I mean, listen, I think it's. I think it's great for you to identify that you probably could be better at communicating some of these little potential pet peeves, you know, that you are seeing as non negotiables. But I also just like wonder if maybe none of these guys are maybe your guy. I don't know.

Riley (24:55)

How do I determine if somebody is my guy? Like, I have lists and things of what I would like, but.

Nick Viall (25:01)

But I mean, listen, I would love.

Riley (25:03)

To have a partnership one day without.

Nick Viall (25:05)

Being able to spend too much time with you on the phone. I feel confident in saying you got some work to do when it comes to still healing from that breakup. And I think, and just correct me if I'm wrong, if I'm saying anything out of pocket, but I still think you're spending a lot of. When that relationship pops in your head. And I think it does more than it should. At this point, two and a half years removed from it, you still have very negative angry thoughts and feelings towards the relationship, towards him, towards her. And that, I think that is really affecting you in ways that I don't know if, you know, we can fully understand. And I think that's something you should look into. I think you need to get over that last breakup still. And I think, you know, hopefully therapy can help, and I'm sure it can. But I think a lot of it starts with you having the discipline to check your thoughts and not allow yourself to ruminate and change the narrative in your head to stop being a victim of that story. You were wronged. You gotta kind of. You kind of have to get over it. Try to just let it. You. I think you have to almost say, I forgive, I forgive him. I forgive them. I don't want to be with them. Like, yeah, he hurt my feelings. There's no good way to break up with someone. I was always going to be hurt for that relationship to end. I was always going to be hurt. And that doesn't make it okay. You know, he probably could have done better, but like you, you have probably re litigated what you think or what your ego thinks he should have done to make it less hurtful for you. And you just keep replaying that movie in your head. Imagine what you could have done for your business, you know, with all that energy you've invested in that. And partly it comes to just not needing your ego's validation to say, yes, you were wronged, you were. Like, you deserve to be sad. Why aren't people understanding how great you are? And why aren't more people feeling sorry for you? And I think there's that voice in our, our head that wants that, you know, compassion when we're hurt, you know. Yeah, I think you've just, you've. It's become a bit of an identity to you where you have to like, change that. You have to look in the mirror and see it. Not the person who was hurt by him, you know?

Riley (27:19)

Yeah, I agree with that.

Nick Viall (27:22)

You have this business, you know, you're doing these things. You have to get better at being kinder to yourself and knowing you deserve better and you're doing great things and, and seeing that relationship truly is something that needed to end.

Riley (27:37)

Yeah, I mean, I know I'm a lot better off. I would have never had this business.

Nick Viall (27:40)

And so wait, you wouldn't even have had this business if this relationship didn't end?

Riley (27:45)

Yeah, probably not. I think I feel like I've gained a lot of independence.

Nick Viall (27:49)

And when was the last time you said that out loud to yourself?

Riley (27:53)

A few weeks ago. I mean, I do acknowledge it when. But I guess I like need to give it more power.

Nick Viall (28:01)

A lot more power. So much more power. I mean, that's the.

Riley (28:05)

I mean, I'm a totally different person than when I was in the relationship. I told myself I couldn't live in the city alone. I couldn't have this business that I dreamed of having. I couldn't do all these things. And then that's.

Nick Viall (28:17)

I mean, the fact that you can tell this story in such a vivid way where I can. I can feel how sad that breakup made you feel. But in the reality, that breakup led to you having your own business, opening up a lot of doors in terms of like, it eliminated some self limiting beliefs that you had about yourself. And yet that is not the narrative that in your head is something you should work on. And when you can master that, I think attachment theory and all that aside, I think I would be surprised if your heart wouldn't be a lot more in a better place to receive and give love.

Riley (28:57)

For sure. I can definitely focus on the negative more than the positive at times.

Nick Viall (29:04)

Well, how to challenge yourself to do that. And a lot of it is again, it's having those kind of say it to yourself, repeat it to yourself. You kind of, you have to, you have to be, you have to be tougher on yourself when it comes to the narratives you have in your head.

Riley (29:20)

Totally. And I think like, sometimes what feeds into the negative mindset is definitely the drama aspect. Like you've said. I will admit that I'm a hairstylist. So when people ask what's going on with your dating life, It's a lot more exciting and entertaining. And I can pretty much have a script of like the rundown of what's happened since their last appointment.

Nick Viall (29:45)

You know, and let them vent to you. And let them. Yeah, but, like, you be the listener. Don't. Don't relate to their pain. And when they're venting to you about ways in which maybe their life isn't happy, be mindful about, like, again, not relating to their pain, but, like, give yourself that acknowledgment of, like, I know what it's like, like, when you talk, you know, I'm several years removed. I can be like, yeah, I know what it's like to have been in your shoes, but I am so grateful. I don't think the way you're thinking right now. And I'm so glad I've been removed, because, like, you, I wouldn't be sitting here today if some of those relationships didn't end. I mean, my life would be a lot different, you know, in the worst possible ways. And, you know, you. You have to free yourself of this narrative. And again, you know, actual tangible energy. You know, this thing I talk about all the time is, like, how much this. You're not giving this away. This is ca. It's literally costing you, even if it's just time. And then, yeah, I. I can only imagine how subconsciously it is impacting your decisions about the men you're dating and, you know, triggering your attachment disorders and things like that. But I would. I would try to focus on the narrative in your head.

Riley (31:03)

Agreed.

Nick Viall (31:04)

Was this helpful at all?

Riley (31:05)

Yeah, I mean, I think I, like, had already overcome some hurdles that sometimes you disclose to people, and that's what's challenging, is being like, oh, you got to look internally. But I think it's good to, like, hear a different perspective of how I need to look internally and where maybe might be helpful to heal from.

Nick Viall (31:25)

Yeah, you got a lot of things to be proud of about what you've accomplished and what you're doing, and I don't think you're giving yourself enough credit. You got to let go of that girl who was wrong. You know, you gotta. You know, you gotta forgive it. You gotta let that, you know, I don't know, some kind of ceremony or something, but you gotta let that. Truly, though, you got to let that go. You got to try to let it go.

Riley (31:47)

Awesome. Thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Nick Viall (31:50)

All right, take care.

Riley (31:51)

All right.

Nick Viall (31:51)

All right.

Riley (31:52)

Bye. Bye. Bye.

Nick Viall (31:54)

A new year.

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Gabriela (33:27)

Hi. I'm good. How are you?

Nick Viall (33:28)

Good. What's your name?

Gabriela (33:29)

My name is Gabriela and I am 27 years old.

Nick Viall (33:32)

How can I help, Gabriella?

Gabriela (33:34)

Should I break up with my boyfriend or am I just being dramatic?

Nick Viall (33:38)

Why are you considering breaking up with your boyfriend?

Gabriela (33:41)

So there's a couple of reasons. So I made a pros and cons list. If I can just go through that with you.

Nick Viall (33:48)

Love it. How old are you again?

Gabriela (33:49)

27.

Nick Viall (33:50)

How long you guys been together?

Gabriela (33:51)

I want to say four months now, but he is an ex so we dated previously.

Nick Viall (33:56)

How long did you previously date?

Gabriela (33:59)

It was about six months the last time.

Nick Viall (34:02)

And how long are you separated for?

Gabriela (34:03)

Four years.

Nick Viall (34:05)

Oh, okay.

Gabriela (34:06)

Yeah. And we didn't talk at all in that time.

Nick Viall (34:10)

Okay, and then how old is he?

Gabriela (34:12)

He is 30.

Nick Viall (34:14)

Okay. All right, let's hear this pros and cons list.

Gabriela (34:16)

Okay, so the pros was pros for.

Nick Viall (34:21)

Dating, staying together or pros for breaking.

Gabriela (34:23)

Up, pros for staying together.

Nick Viall (34:25)

Okay.

Gabriela (34:25)

And cons are why I would want to break up with him.

Nick Viall (34:27)

Understood.

Gabriela (34:28)

So the pros are. So he was a little messy, but I had a conversation with him, and he was very receptive. So he has gotten better. So, like, for example, he's a pilot, and I do events for a living, so I'm home a lot more than he is. And when he leaves, I take that opportunity to, like, fully clean the apartment.

Nick Viall (34:49)

You guys live together?

Gabriela (34:50)

I stay with him. I want to say maybe like, five or. Yeah, like, five days out of the week. So that's more than when I am, like, alone.

Nick Viall (34:56)

You're playing house?

Gabriela (34:57)

Pretty much, yes. And we also have two dogs, so I kind of just.

Nick Viall (35:03)

We have two dogs.

Gabriela (35:04)

He has his dog, I have my dog, and we bring them together.

Nick Viall (35:08)

Okay.

Gabriela (35:08)

Yeah. I clean everything. And then whenever he came back, it was an issue of, like, he would just leave his clothes on the floor. I would wipe down the kitchen and everything, and he plays video games till, like, 2, 3 in the morning, and, like, leaves a plate in the sink and, like, chips are out. Like, just stuff like that. And I just could not do that. So we had a conversation. He was good. He's gotten better. He puts his laundry away every time. I just do it. I don't. I kind of just, like, put it. I fold it for him, but he puts it away. He does not leave plates in the sink overnight anymore. He washes them.

Riley (35:37)

Now.

Gabriela (35:37)

Another pro is, like, he just comes from a good family. I've met his family. Like, we get along well. Very nice. Like, I think they would get along with my family. He also, like, doesn't go out. He's not, like, a party guy. He stays at home most of the time. So those are the pros, the cons. I feel like I have to explain to him regularly how it is that I want to be treated, which I feel like these things are kind of, like, not. Not that I want him to read my mind, but it's like, you should know that, like. Like, I want to go on dates, right? Like, I want to go on dates every now and again. That's not something that we just do in the beginning, and then now it just kind of, like, fades away and we don't go out anymore. If he gets, like, frustrated, he yells a lot, and I am not a person that likes that. I don't like to be yelled at. I don't like to take any, like, disrespectful. I am able to, like, communicate how I feel. I feel like, calmly. And if I can't, I don't know, like, I go for a walk or I do something to get my mind out of that headspace. He does not do that. He, like, literally just goes from, like, 0 to 100 and, like, yells at everyone, even the dogs. And I'm like, what do the dogs do? But anyway, that's, like, another thing I don't. Yeah, I just feel like he cannot effectively communicate how he feels. I don't feel like I'm being valued, especially when I do those things. Like, I am cooking for him, I am cleaning for him when he's gone, because it's something that I want to do to, like, make his life easier. And I feel like he doesn't do that or reciprocate that for me in any way. Yeah, I just feel like in that sense, he is also is, like, a little selfish. It's always like, me, me, me, me, me. Like, I work a lot. I'm tired. I'm this, I'm that. And I'm like, okay. Like, I. I work, I go to the gym. Like, I cook, I do my meal prep. I'm also in the process of becoming an officer for the Navy. So I just submitted my application. So, like, there's a lot of stuff that's going on over here, too. It's not just, like, your life and everything that you're going, like, you're dealing with. O1 incident. This one's a little crazy. I feel like I was cleaning the closet, the guest bedroom closet, and I found, like, a bag of, like, photos and notes of him and his ex.

Nick Viall (37:35)

Okay.

Gabriela (37:35)

And I kind of, like, honestly, I wanted to put it out on the counter just so he can, like, see that I saw it. But I sat on it for a couple days, and then I had a conversation with him, and he basically said, like, oh, I didn't know that was there. Like, my mom cleans pretty much, like, the apartment when I'm not here. Whatever. Like, I had no idea. So I'm like, okay, cool. Can you just, like, throw it out? Because, like, why would you have that there? So anyway, he's like, yeah, yeah, I'll throw it out. Never throws it out. So one day I asked him to take out the trash, and I kind of just put all the trash together, and I took the stuff that was in the guest bedroom in that. In, like, that little bag or whatever, and I put it next to the trash. And he's like, oh, like, what is this? And I'm like, that's the stuff with you and your ex they said you were gonna throw away that you never threw out. So those are some cons.

Nick Viall (38:15)

Did he throw it out?

Gabriela (38:16)

He did, yeah. I watched him throw it out. But it's like, why am I telling you and watching you and having to, like, hover over you to do this?

Nick Viall (38:23)

Have you ever. You don't have any. You don't have any memorabilia from past relationships?

Gabriela (38:28)

I do. However, they're not, like, physical items. Like, I have maybe a couple photos on my phone that, like, I just haven't gone through to, like, go and delete. But it's not something that I physically have, like, with me, you know?

Nick Viall (38:40)

Why not? What do you mean you don't physically have it? It's literally on your phone. You're carrying it around with you.

Gabriela (38:44)

I feel like it's different when you have, like, these wooden frames or, like, literally, like, little love notes that you guys wrote each other.

Nick Viall (38:52)

Do you think he's, like, reading them?

Gabriela (38:54)

I don't think he's reading them because I spend a lot of time with him, and I. I can see what he's doing. But at the end of the day, I just.

Nick Viall (39:00)

Why haven't you deleted those photos from your phone?

Gabriela (39:03)

I guess I just haven't. Like, there's a lot of photos on my phone that I need to delete that I haven't deleted. You know, it's not just, why.

Nick Viall (39:09)

Why haven't you deleted them?

Gabriela (39:11)

I just haven't taken the time to, like, go in my phone and delete it all.

Nick Viall (39:14)

But, like, you know, you've seen them, right? I'm guessing you've, for a variety of different times, have looked for old pictures and you've kind of scrolled through, right? Like, you've done this thing and then you've. Oh, there's that photo. Oh, yeah. And they just kind of keep going. You're like, oh, you see an old photo and it kind of reminds you, keep going. But, like, why. Why not be like. Why not stop and take the literal half a second it would take to delete any of these photos?

Gabriela (39:38)

I feel like I have for some of them, but not for all of them. Because it would take a lot longer than just, like, a second, you know, it would take me.

Nick Viall (39:45)

I'm only. I'm only. Like, listen, like, we will get in the other stuff, but specifically, just talking about the memorabilia, whatever. I think that's one of those situations where we have a lot of double standards about when. When we see that, right? When you see that of your Boyfriends. You internalize it, and then you. You know, like, you have a feeling about it. Right. It's hard. I totally get why you see it, but then you. You assume why, you know, or why you think he's hanging on to this. And then when it's you, you know, or don't know, you know, it's like, when I'm asking these questions, why me? Delete it. The truth is, you're probably like, I don't know. I just really gave much thought to it. And I certainly, like, I don't have feelings for this person. Used to be. But it was a part of my life. And I don't know. I don't feel like erasing that part of my life, because I know deep down I don't care about this person. I'm not, like, pining over it. I'm not, like, room. I'm not, like, reminiscing over this photo that's in my phone. It's just like. I don't know. It was a part of my life, you know? It was a lived experience that I had. And I'm guessing that's why you haven't deleted those photos, because they're not affecting you. They're not like. You know what I'm saying? And the way that you kind of, like, worry that it could be affecting him, you know, it's not affecting you to have these old photos. And, like, I just think sometimes we just, like, we don't want to eliminate parts of our life. You know, it's easier to hang on to things, not because we need. You know, it's like, I doubt very much that your boyfriend's hanging on to them. Him. Because, like, he's. Just in case we get back together. No, it's just more like, I don't know. That was just, like, memory. Literal memorabilia from his life.

Gabriela (41:18)

Yes. But I feel like if I found it and we had a conversation, and you say you're gonna throw it away, but then you don't. It's kind of like, maybe my phone. And he was like, hey, I saw these photos of you and your ex. Why do you still have those? They make me uncomfortable. For whatever reason, I would have no problem deleting them.

Riley (41:34)

Maybe.

Nick Viall (41:34)

Yeah, I guess I get that. But it just. I don't know. It's just kind of sometimes weird to feel like you're eliminating something. And you guys have only dating for four months, and you've made a really long list of why you should break up with them, and you're. I'm. It Sounds like you're gonna break up with this guy. Your. Your list of cons are. Are far more. Well, it's a longer list. And. And that list is a lot more like, your pros were like, you know, he took a note about dishes and his. His. His family's nice. Your cons were like, he doesn't make me feel good. And I'm just objectively, you know, it's like, you know, this guy. This guy's about to throw out parts of his life of someone who's about to break up with him.

Gabriela (42:12)

I mean, is that, like, crazy, though? I think the things that I would want, like, I would want to be made feel special by my boyfriend. Is that, like, am I being dramatic in that sense?

Nick Viall (42:22)

You know, just talking about the photo memorabilia stuff, do I think you're being a little dramatic? Tough word, but I think that's the least of your concerns. And I think I'm just focusing on this because I think it's very relatable. You know, I think anyone listening, we've all, like, I've been. You. You've. You know, like, you know, we've all been triggered by this types of stuff, right? I've been in your shoes. I have felt. How have you. Have you felt? I'm, you know, having been removed from it. I just. I think we can all realize when in those situations, I think we often have a double standard that, like, what we say, we think it could mean and why we think it's up that this person hasn't got rid of X, Y, or Z. But when we hang on to something, I think it's much easy for us to give ourselves grace as to why. Like, it's not because we're obsessed. It's not because we haven't let go. It's not because we, you know, it's just like. I don't know, it's just like. It's like memorabilia from your life in a weird kind of way. So I think in general, like, you know, you've only been in this guy for four months. I think the fact that you guys got together for. I mean, that was a whole four years ago. That's like a whole different people. That's a whole, like, it's.

Rebecca (43:34)

Right.

Nick Viall (43:35)

It's almost like a complete reset, right? It's. And then, you know, you've been dating for four. Four months, which is no time at all, all right? And you're essentially living together. You're saying things. Our dogs, you know, and things like that. And. And quite honestly, like, I mean, like video games till 2 in the morning is a bit much. But the things that are irritating, you sound like pet peeves, but they feel like non negotiables because again, like, the way you're describing your relationship, you're describing it as like two people who are living like they've been together for five years and you're kind of playing. You're playing house. And yet, and rightfully so, some of the little things that you're realizing that he does early in this relationship and you're going to learn more things that he does are kind of annoying. And the things that you find obnoxious and annoying, you know, honestly sound annoying, but they, you know, you don't have the. You know, you're like, you. You skipped the honeymoon phase and you went right into like, being annoyed. He plays video games and, and leaves the dishes in the sink and doesn't take you out on dates. But like, I don't know, you're also just like, living at his house and like, sharing dogs and like, playing house. And there's no. You're not dating each other. You're not courting, you're not. He's not. He's just like, yeah, this is my girlfriend. You know, like, part of building a, an emotional connection early in dating is just like, almost not having that security early on is a good thing. Right. It makes us like, wonder if they let, you know, makes us kind of keeps us on our toes, you know, and things like that. And that's just kind of a human thing.

Gabriela (45:01)

So how would you suggest then that we kind of. If I. Let's say, if I don't break up with him, right, And I want to stay with him, should I just, like, take my stuff out of the apartment and just say, hey, like, I'm taking my stuff. I think we should just go back to like, dating how we did in the beginning.

Nick Viall (45:15)

I don't think it has to be so drastic in that where it feels like a step back. But I think, you know, you guys could sit down and say, I think, you know, we've only been for four months and we're kind of playing house. I think we need to, like, slow down a little bit. And I probably should spend more nights at my apartment than I spend at yours. Like, it can be this gradual thing and you can say, like, listen, I want to date. You know, like, you don't. We've been in four months and you don't even. Like, he just has so much access to you early on.

Riley (45:46)

Yeah.

Nick Viall (45:46)

You know, you're you're acting like a wife.

Riley (45:49)

Yeah.

Gabriela (45:50)

You know, I mean, I figured that's, like. I don't know what he would want when we first started dating.

Nick Viall (45:54)

I guess I'm sure he probably does a lot. He probably really likes the fact that you're there a lot. And he probably likes the fact that you do a lot to take care of him. And you've probably made a lot of, like, parts of his life easy and convenient. So much so that he's like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't need to ask her on a date. She's gonna. She's gonna. She's here.

Riley (46:12)

Okay.

Gabriela (46:13)

That's fair.

Rebecca (46:14)

Yeah.

Gabriela (46:14)

I'm gonna tell him about that, that we should slow things down as far as, like, the yelling. How do you think I should address that? Because literally just this morning, he was running late. And so yesterday I told him that I was gonna put the tree away. The tree is still up. And I couldn't because I just, like, I went to go do my grocery shopping, then I started my meal prep. Then my mom called me. So I went to my mom's house. Like, just a lot of things kind of came up in the day by the time that everything was done. I got back at, like, 7. He's landing around, like, 8, comes back at, like, 8:30. I'm making dinner for him, a separate dinner. I'm making my meal prep. I'm done with everything. But I didn't have time to put the tree away. So this morning, he's running late. He's like, oh, we have to put the tree away. Because his dog is literally psycho and goes to the tree all the time, breaking everything. So he's like, help me put the tree away, and starts, like, yelling. And I'm like, why are you yelling? Like, it's. I literally just woke up. I'm helping you do something, whatever. And he's like, well, if you would have done this yesterday, it wouldn't have been an issue. And. And I'm like, why is it your job? Exactly. It is not my job. I'm here to help you. And it's like, I told you that things came up throughout the day that I couldn't do it, and you were fine with it yesterday. Now all of a sudden, you're running late. It's your problem. So I literally said, that's totally fine. If you want to yell me, that's okay. You can put the street away by yourself. And I walked away and went back to the room.

Nick Viall (47:33)

What do you say?

Gabriela (47:33)

He was just, like, kind of, like, not, like, moping around, but, like, kind of, like mumbling under his breath like, this is so stupid. And just, like, yelling at his dog to move. And then he stepped on. Okay, so his dog is like, pee pad train. I'm not judging, but it's a. It's an Australian shepherd. They have high temperament. That dog needs to be walked. So the dog went on the pee pad, and he, like, stepped on the dog's poop on the pee pad. So now he's like, oh, now I have to clean my shoes and da, da, da, da. Just kind of having, like, like a crappy morning, basically now because of this whole tree situation and his dog and this. And I didn't help. So I'm, like, in the room getting ready. I'm going. I'm getting ready to go to the gym, whatever. So that whole thing happened, and then he left. He didn't say bye, nothing. Just, like, stormed out the door and then decides to text me and says, just, when you leave, I would gratefully appreciate it if you can make sure nothing is accessible to the dog. Lock the doors, fix the kitchen camera. Thanks. I'm gonna be over the Gulf of Mexico, so I won't have WI fi. Like, I would gratefully appreciate it. Why are you talking to me like that?

Nick Viall (48:35)

What do you. What's wrong with that?

Gabriela (48:37)

I don't know. Like, he normally is just like, hey, babe, can you just do this really quick before you leave? Like, I don't know. I just feel like there's no apology, and now you want to talk to me. Like, if, like, I'm like, your co worker or something.

Nick Viall (48:49)

I mean, I. I interpreted that, you know, him better than me, that. Him. He probably felt bad for overreacting, and he was just trying to, like, say, I would really appreciate if you could do this. This would, you know, listen. That's better than saying, why didn't you do the tree? Which it wasn't your job. And him acting like it is your job. This is more like, listen, this isn't your job, but you would be doing me a huge favor if you could help me out. Like, honestly, I felt like that was probably an over correction by him. I mean, but listen, as far as his other stuff, you. You probably, like, you know, right? You know, like, we all have bad days. Some of us are a little bit more reactive than others, and I think, for the most part, 90% of people, our population kind of work within this. Like, you know, I don't know, like, we just all have different temperaments, but it's all, like, fine and okay, and sometimes we might get a little triggered, and then we might act out, we might have to apologize. But, like, for the most part, we can be checked by our friends, our family, our partners, and say, hey, like, you can't talk to me that way. Whether you get that apology immediately or like, they cooled out and a half a day later, like, hey, listen, and I'm. I sorry. And, you know, couples have to work through that. Right. That being said, if this is something where he's not receptive to feedback, he never backs down. And it's truly just a regular thing where it's, you know, to the point where it feels really toxic and it feels not healthy and it's never gets better, you know, Like, I guess, you know what I'm saying, you just kind of have to use your common sense. So whether you feel like this temperament he has is truly, like, something that isn't manageable for you or him or, you know, is it just like, you know, he just. You know what I'm saying? Like, you. You'll have to be the judge of that. I think you have the common sense to know whether his temperament is manageable and he's able to acknowledge it or not.

Riley (50:40)

Yeah.

Nick Viall (50:41)

As far as the other stuff, you're just kind of playing house. And I think it's hard for you to assess this relationship because you're. You're. You guys are acting and living like a married couple, but you've only been dating for four months, and you probably have a lot to learn about each other, and neither of you are taking the time to really, like, build that emotional connection and grow into something, and I think that would probably be helpful for you guys to do.

Gabriela (51:03)

So just start off with the conversation of, like, we should just kind of go back to dating for a bit and see how that goes, and then proceed with kind of like, the way that you yelled at me yesterday. Just did not. It didn't feel good. I don't like to be spoken to that in that way and then kind of just see how things move forward from there, basically.

Nick Viall (51:23)

Yeah. But I just. Be careful how you communicate that, because the way you're communicating that, it sounds like you yelled at me. So now I'm moving out.

Gabriela (51:29)

Okay, so how should I communicate that without him thinking that?

Nick Viall (51:33)

Well, I think you don't have to have him. Well, I don't think you have to have it all in one conversation. I think one. Just how you guys are going about your relationship, which is like, it sounds like it's playing house a little bit. Is to say, hey, listen. Well, I don't. And I don't want to put words in your mouth, but assuming, like, overall, like, hey, listen. Like, this is. I like where things are going, but I don't. I think we're kind of moving in an unhealthy way. I don't. Like, we just started dating and we're kind of already playing house, and I'm getting annoyed. And I think we. I think we're getting frustrated at each other for things that people who have been dating for only four months, you know, getting frustrated at. And we don't really have that kind of foundation. Like, it's got to be jarring for somebody you've only been dating for four months to yell at you about why you didn't put the Christmas tree away. Yeah, it's like.

Gabriela (52:18)

It's like, huh, Exactly.

Riley (52:21)

Yeah.

Nick Viall (52:22)

We just been dating for four months. You put your own goddamn tree away. You know, but like, that's weird that you guys have this comfort level to, like, have these demands over each other. So I think it's just trying to have a healthy, mature conversation about, like, just slowing it down a little bit. He's like, well, what does that mean? He's like, well, it doesn't necessarily mean anything, but I don't think I should be spending five, six nights a week at your house and living there. You know, he's a pilot, so he's probably out of town. Like, I can. But, like, that's the thing. Does he have a girlfriend so that when he's leaving that you can eat so he has something to take care of his dogs?

Gabriela (52:52)

Yeah, no. Here's another thing, too. So he's not like a airline pilot. He does private. So he's home a lot. Like, he will maybe fly and then come home that night, or the max he's gone is maybe like four or five days, and after that happens, he gets like a whole week off. Okay, well, so he's not like, you can do some of this stuff on your own.

Nick Viall (53:10)

Yeah. So anyways, it's just trying to have a healthy balance in your life. And hell, nowadays people are like, we'll date for four months. And they barely are exclusive. You guys are like, basically have moved in with each other.

Gabriela (53:20)

I guess it was just like the history that we already had.

Nick Viall (53:23)

And four, like, you dated for a few months four years ago.

Gabriela (53:27)

And we probably would have stayed together, but I moved for a job.

Nick Viall (53:31)

But you didn't stay together.

Gabriela (53:33)

Yeah, because I was Like, I'm in a new city, I'm a big girl.

Podcast Co-Host (53:35)

That's fine.

Nick Viall (53:36)

Yeah, but, like, you weren't talking in that time.

Gabriela (53:39)

Yeah, no, we didn't. So we got together and it kind of. It did seem like we were the same, but a little different.

Nick Viall (53:44)

So you had some familiarity with a guy four years ago, and in that time, you both lived different lives and you grew up and you learned about life and you both changed as people you didn't like. You didn't change completely. And again, there's a familiarity there that you guys have that obviously, like, draw you guys together and allowed to get together, but, like, your acting as if you kind of casually dated long distance, licensed for four years, kept in touch, and. And this is just like you guys taking things to the next level.

Gabriela (54:10)

Okay, Yeah, I guess I'll talk to him then and just kind of see where that goes.

Nick Viall (54:15)

You guys shouldn't be fighting over who's putting the Christmas tree away four months into a relationship.

Gabriela (54:19)

Yeah, it wasn't it just. For me, it's not so much the Christmas tree, it's more so, like, just. Why are you talking to me like that? You know, like, I didn't do anything.

Nick Viall (54:27)

He needs to work on that. I get that. But help yourselves out because, again, you guys are fighting about that.

Riley (54:32)

Like.

Nick Viall (54:32)

Like married couples fight about. You know what I'm saying, though?

Gabriela (54:35)

I do, I do. I can either text him or I can wait until he comes home tonight, and I will probably be out of work.

Nick Viall (54:41)

Maybe around, like, text him what?

Gabriela (54:43)

Just kind of like how we should maybe take a couple steps back. Like the. What you kind of. What you just said. Like, I like where this is going, and I want to be with you, but maybe I should spend, like, less time in your apartment with you.

Nick Viall (54:56)

Yeah. And I think you should talk to him. Like, this is the decision you're making together. Don't you think it's a little silly that we're playing house the way it is? Like, I don't. Why are we fighting over Christmas trees? Yeah, we just started dating. Like, why. Why we should be. This. We should be in a honeymoon phase, which we should be still giddy about, like, excited about going on dates and missing each other.

Gabriela (55:14)

No. Yeah, I do want that.

Nick Viall (55:16)

You know, it's like the way you're acting now is just like, you have, like, a shared calendar and in. And you're fighting over, like, he didn't run the errands and. And pick up your prescription or something. It's just like, what?

Gabriela (55:28)

Okay, so it Seems more like a conversation we need to have in person than.

Nick Viall (55:32)

Yeah, you know, just communicate. And it's far. Again, like you, I will say your pros and cons list is. Is a little one sided, which I.

Gabriela (55:39)

Feel like is something I need to take into consideration.

Nick Viall (55:41)

Maybe. I mean, if you don't think this guy is, you know, four months in thinking about, like, how in ways he can make you happy. But again, like, I don't know, he's only. Only been dating you for four months. He isn't a mind reader. And, you know, like, he also hasn't.

Gabriela (55:54)

Had to tell me though, like, ways that I can make his life easier. Those things are just coming from, like, within me because I want to do that for my partner.

Nick Viall (56:02)

Do you know that you're making his life easier?

Gabriela (56:04)

I mean, I would assume so. If he's coming home and the apartment is clean every day, he doesn't have to do anything other than just like chill and relax.

Nick Viall (56:11)

Yeah, maybe he's just taking you for granted. Yeah, I think it's crazy, but in the guy for four months you've been picking up his mess and making him dinner.

Rebecca (56:20)

Oh, my gosh.

Gabriela (56:22)

Okay, I'll just talk to him then. I think this was pretty eye opening, actually. I think maybe. I guess I just probably shouldn't have moved in or just spent so much time with him in the beginning.

Nick Viall (56:34)

It's not the end of the world. I mean, again, I think a little communication can go a long way and get things back on track. But it's just being like, listen. Yeah, it's just like I. We just started dating and I'm making you. I'm like your maid. Made like you're, you know, like your mom. Yeah, that's the thing. It's just like my boyfriend's a little messy. Like, I don't know, like, honestly, four months in dating someone who's a little messy should be the least of your concerns because it's like, I don't know, they got their place, you got yours. You might notice something like, oh, you're kind of messy, but it shouldn't really be inconveniencing you because you should kind of still have your own independence in life. But you've just like started dating and we're like, all right, well, I'm just gonna spend every night here.

Gabriela (57:13)

Yeah, thank you. I will talk to him. I don't know, I'm kind of nervous to see how it's gonna go.

Nick Viall (57:18)

But this, I mean, you guys should be able to have these types of conversations and if anything else, not being able to have this conversations would. Would be an indicator of maybe.

Gabriela (57:30)

I honestly feel like if I tell him just that we'll dial it back and kind of get some stuff out of here, he might take it immediately as like, I want to break up, like, I don't want to be with you anymore.

Nick Viall (57:41)

Well, don't communicate it that way. Don't say things like step back and ask him questions. You know, like, hey, how do you feel like this is going? I don't want to be picking up after you and I don't want to be making you dinner.

Riley (57:53)

Yeah.

Nick Viall (57:54)

You know, not yet, at least. And listen, if he goes nuclear, it's just like again, if you're. If you're trying to just have a conversation, you can't have a conversation. And take a note. That might be an indication that he's, you know, I don't know, maybe not your guy.

Gabriela (58:07)

All right, understood. All right, sounds good. Thank you so much.

Nick Viall (58:10)

All right, take care. Keep us posted on what happens.

Gabriela (58:13)

Okay, we'll do.

Riley (58:14)

Bye bye.

Nick Viall (58:15)

Bye bye.

Podcast Co-Host (58:17)

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Nick Viall (59:12)

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Nick Viall (59:53)

How's it going?

Rebecca (59:54)

My name is Rebecca. I'm 26, and I am wondering if I should move cross country for a man who possibly chose me second.

Nick Viall (60:03)

Okay. Why do you feel like he chose you second?

Rebecca (60:06)

So just a little backstory. I've known him for 17 months around. I met him. It was like a blind double date thing. We've been official for 10 months and we made it exclusive. Like, two months in. We're kind of semi, like, long distance. He lives in Miami, I live in New York. And so we see each other a lot, though, because his family lives here. Like, prior to, like, being official, because it did take like seven months. It was kind of a cat mouse game of like, I wasn't sure if I would say, I'm not sure if I want to do the long distance. And so, I mean, I. That was kind of on me. But he would always ask me my timeline and I just would just ask him back. I wouldn't answer. And his timeline, like, he's 28, and his timeline was he wants to be married at 29 and have kids by 30, 32. So he was always asking those questions, like, about kids, marriage, like, if I love him before committing. So he was. I don't know, he kind of had that mindset of dating to marry, which I really appreciate. And before becoming official, we've been on many trips. He flew me out to where he lives in Miami a bunch of times. Pays for everything. Is like. It was like a fairy tale relationship, honestly. And he made it official in Puerto Rico. He invited me to a wedding, and that was like seven months in. And during that trip, he made it official and he would say things like, I need this to last. Like, I'm all in. I don't want to ever do this again. I'm never dating again. Like, this needs to last. Like, don't do anything stupid.

Nick Viall (62:03)

He said, don't do anything stupid. And he needs this to last.

Rebecca (62:07)

Yeah, it was kind of like it's. It almost seemed like he wanted. He kept asking, do you love me? Before he made it official. It was kind of like, I need you to be all in because I don't know. He took it very seriously, in my opinion, I guess.

Nick Viall (62:26)

Where is it you feeling like your second choice? Come in to play.

Rebecca (62:31)

So that is. So we Were together. I mean, we made it exclusive two months in, but now we've been official for two months. And I went to another wedding in Miami that he invited me to, and after the wedding, we got back to his apartment, and that's when everything kind of blew up in front of his friends, too. So this kind of happened by, like, the grace of God, honestly. I ended up, like, losing my phone as soon as I got to the apartment. And we have each other's locations. So I asked him. I was like, can I see your phone? I need to check my location. And he gave me the phone. And for some reason, I went straight to his notes app. Don't know why. Straight to his notes app. And then I found this message that he was writing about his ex. His ex from five years ago. That's when they dated five years ago, saying, like, you, like, you're the love of my life. Like, it would kill me if I never told you this. Like, we can make this work. We're doing everything that we said we always would do. Yeah. So that I freaked out.

Nick Viall (63:40)

How long did it go to you write this note?

Rebecca (63:43)

So it was literally two weeks before he asked me to be official.

Nick Viall (63:47)

Oh, okay. So you. You were in his life, though.

Rebecca (63:49)

I was, yeah. We were, like, exclusive. We've been seeing each other for, like, eight months. It was pretty serious. But it was before.

Nick Viall (63:57)

Okay, we made it.

Rebecca (63:58)

He made it official.

Nick Viall (63:59)

I mean, if it was before you guys had met, then I would definitely, like, give him a pretty long leash, you know, in the sense that, like, before you. And, you know, before you entered his life, he could. Should be feeling alone. And, you know, when we. When we haven't found someone who excites us or that we see potential in, it's, you know, pretty easy to ruminate about the past and. And glorify the past in a way that maybe isn't accurate. Yeah. Had he done that before you entered his life? I could see why it would still be upsetting to you if that were the case. But I could also be the one. If I'm, you know, a friend of yours, I could be like, listen, you know, like, everything changes when he entered his life. But the fact that you were in his life and that you were dating and that you were kind of exclusive but not committed and he was doing that is definitely, like, not great for you.

Rebecca (64:48)

It was weird. Yeah. Because it's been like, eight months in, like, we. He's asking me if I loved him, blah, blah. We've had this future talks. We've been Together so much, all these trips. And, I mean, this is after, like, a wedding and everything. And so. And that's the thing. He. He asked me to be official two weeks after writing that. So I'm like. Like, am I the backup plan? But that's not just that. So that night, I ended up checking his phone. Yeah, I was like, let me see your phone. And I looked on his messages, I searched her name, and I found out he met up with her on one of his business trips. He was in la. He met up with her. And so I freaked out more in front of his friends, too. But I freaked out because I'm like. Like, I don't know. This is. We've. It's not like we've been talking for two months. Like, this is eight months in. We know. It's a thing where we've been exclusive for two since two months. Like, he's saying, like, he sees the future with me and everything. And so I found that out, that he met up with her, and he said it was foreclosure, which, I mean, they dated five years ago. And he said that as soon as he saw her, the feelings were gone.

Nick Viall (66:11)

Well, that's obviously a lie.

Rebecca (66:12)

Yeah, because, I mean, I always hear you say, guys don't need closure.

Nick Viall (66:17)

Well, no, everyone needs closure. Well, everyone appreciates closure. But, like, you saw the note app, and the note app was him saying he still has feelings. And he wasn't looking for closure. He was looking for reconnection.

Rebecca (66:29)

Yeah. Saying she was the one and every. Exactly. So in my mind, well, he went into that meetup thinking, she's the one. Thinking, yeah, she's the one. But he told me he met up with her, the feelings weren't there, it was awkward, so he didn't feel the same way anymore. So he didn't end up telling her what he wrote in that note. But in my mind, I don't know if that's true. She could have rejected him. I don't know. It's true. She could have rejected him.

Nick Viall (67:02)

What's your gut tell you?

Rebecca (67:03)

Yeah, I do believe him when he says that it felt awkward and that she wasn't the same person, and he didn't feel the need to say what's on the note because those feelings dissipated. He said, I kind of believe that. I mean, I didn't know what to believe, but I'm leaning more towards that. I don't think he actually shared the note. Maybe he wanted to even share the note, but he was too nervous. I could see that happening, but I Don't think he confessed the feelings that he had. But then, I mean, we were already together for two months when I found this out, like, officially. So this was two months prior before making it official with me. So I was like, was I the plan B? Like, if. What if you met up with her and she was exactly who you thought it would be? Like, we already had, like, two week and two weeks from that meetup. We had that wedding planned to go to Puerto Rico. Like, what would have happened? And I asked him that. I was like, what would have happened if she was that person like, that you remembered? And, like, would you keep talking to both of us? Would you just cut me out? And he just kept saying, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. Which made it worse. And we've been, like, at this time, when I'm talking to this about, like, with him, we've been together for two months. So he kept saying, like, I don't know what would have happened. I don't know what would have happened. So.

Nick Viall (68:31)

But he wants you to promise that you will never hurt him.

Rebecca (68:34)

Right?

Nick Viall (68:35)

Why are you thinking about moving at this stage?

Rebecca (68:37)

Oh, that's a whole nother thing. I have a lot of questions for you, Nick. So after that, I forgave him. It took a while. He made it up to me. Like, he flew me back to Miami the next day weekend, because I wanted. I wanted to visit my sister there. Anyways, so he sent me the flight confirmation. It was like a $900 flight and everything like that.

Nick Viall (69:01)

Why? And that made it up?

Rebecca (69:03)

No, he made it up in over a span of few months. I mean, I totally just let it go. And since then, we've been on, like, he's taken me on so many trips. He really does treat me like gold. Like, I've never had to reach in my wallet once. He's perfect in, like, every other aspect besides these little things.

Nick Viall (69:30)

So he pays for.

Rebecca (69:32)

Yes. But also he's good in every other way. Like, the communication. We have so much fun together. Like, okay, yeah. So we were in Vegas, and I brought up just like, a hypothetical aid. Like, when do you see us, like, moving in together? Like, because we are, like, semi long distance. And it's been like, a year at that point. And he was like, January 1st. And I didn't really think anything of it. Like, we were kind of drinking, whatever. But the next month, my life completely, like, turned upside down. Like, I totaled my car. And then on the same day, I got fired and evicted from my house.

Podcast Co-Host (70:11)

Oh, my God.

Rebecca (70:12)

On the same day.

Nick Viall (70:14)

So what happened?

Rebecca (70:15)

Bad luck, I guess. Same day all at once. So that was, like, four months ago. I've been staying with my friend, but in my mind, I'm like, I need to start somewhere fresh. And I've lived here in this small town my whole life. I didn't. I didn't want to start fresh here. Like, I finally have an opportunity to start fresh somewhere. So I mentioned that to him, and he would say, like, just come. Like, with a plan. Like, come, but have a plan. And I was like, okay. And then it's kind of me asking him, like, what are your concerns with me moving in? And so he would go back and forth, and he has. He had a bunch of concerns because he does have a roommate, and he's never lived with a girl and things like that. And so, yeah, so that's where it was kind of like a month ago. But now he's more so accepted it because, honestly, I kind of just came to the decision. We came to the decision. I feel like. I don't know if I convinced him, but I am moving in two weeks to Miami to stay with him. Okay. I call it. I tell him is I'm just staying with him. Staying with you for a few weeks until I could get a new place. And he said he doesn't like that term, staying with me because it sounds like he's just my friend, but in a way, that's what I'm doing. I'm staying with him until I get my own apartment, which I don't think would be a big deal because he stayed with me at my place for weeks on end.

Nick Viall (71:49)

So does he believe you that you're gonna get your own apartment? Does he support you that you're gonna get your own apartment?

Rebecca (71:55)

Yes. But he's like. He's back and forth.

Nick Viall (71:58)

How long ago was a notes app thing?

Rebecca (72:00)

That was like, eight months ago now.

Nick Viall (72:03)

Okay.

Rebecca (72:03)

It's still lingering.

Nick Viall (72:05)

But why is it lingering? Because you haven't gotten over it, but. Or there are just some things that pop up that remind you of it.

Rebecca (72:12)

He's never mentioned his ex, ever. That's why it came as such a surprise. Like, it was blindsiding, because he's just never mentioned her. He. That was his only. His first and only girlfriend. But it's just kind of like I was. I. Plan B. Like, is that the person, I mean, you wanted?

Nick Viall (72:34)

Hard to say. I mean, your first love, it fucks you up. It's hard to get over. You know, I think the biggest issue is how he went about it kind of behind your back. It was still a relatively new relationship. I think the big, most important thing is how have you guys grown from there? And do you feel like. Do you feel like you're communicating better? Do you feel like you're. You're building trust, you know, in a safe space for you guys to be vulnerable and just open up about things that are bothering you, you're feeling insecure about? Do you feel supported by each other, you know, in this, you know, your current situation? This sounds like a guy, you know, he's only 28, so, you know, I did a lot of this stuff that your. Sounds like your boyfriend does, which is, like, the idea of things, the principle of things, the sound of things, what it means to him. You know, does he feel emasculated or not emasculated? But at the end of the day, like, you know, you kind of have to have common sense. Right now it seems probably a little premature for you guys to move in with each other, right? He has a roommate. You've only been dating for less than a year. You don't have your own place of yourselves. You're kind of in this transitional period of your life. So there's a convenience around moving in, but that's a. That's playing a big role in why you're quote, unquote, staying with him. Because you kind of really don't have a place to go. You're at your friend's house, and deep down, you know that. And. And you probably would rather, like, move in with your boyfriend under, like, more. More organic conditions where it just, like, feels right where you're both like, you've been dating for a couple years, and. And you're both like, I would really like to live with you. And the other person's like, I would really like to live with you too. So, like. And then you're both like, yeah, let's live with each other because it's what. What we both want to do right now. That's not the situation. You're like, you're trying to kind of convince yourself that it's okay to move in with your boyfriend even though he has a roommate and even though he's kind of not sure how he feels about you moving in. And your boyfriend's kind of like, he wants his girlfriend to want to live with him, but he also, you know, has his own feelings about his girlfriend needing a place to stay, and he's having conflicting feelings, you know, and so. So it's the situation that seems A bit, like, not ideal. So I think it's just. Better be honest with yourself, you know, and who knows how things might play out, you know, like, for example, like, when Natalie and I first started dating, she, you know, she lived in Savannah and I lived in la. And, you know, we were like, all right, well, let's date. And then it was like, well, if we're gonna date, you know, I don't. I'd rather not do long distance. And it was like, are you willing? You know, she moved. She offered to get her own place. And then we thought about that, and I was like, it seems kind of silly because you don't really know anyone here. And I bought this house, and, like, I just. It seems like it's going to be silly. And even though, like, probably it's not something we would do if. If, you know, like, if we both live in the same town, you're going to replace. I wouldn't. So we just kind of acknowledged the reality of the situation, which is, like, we probably wouldn't do this if this wasn't our situation, but we're going to go ahead and do it anyways, knowing that, like, we're making some exceptions. And your version of, like, just saying, well, you know, you're trying to be like, well, I'm just calling it staying with you. Who cares what you call it? You know, I think it's just more you guys sitting down and saying, hey, listen, I don't have a lot going on in New York right now. I certainly don't have anything that's keeping me here. I don't even have a place. So, like, it would be.

Podcast Co-Host (76:03)

I'm.

Nick Viall (76:04)

I can move to Miami, right? And I also can move back here. And even if we're not dating, this could be a fun experience for me and your boyfriend. I would love him to be like, yeah, that's right. You know, right now, your boyfriend sounds like the type of guy who doesn't want to hear that if things don't work out, this could still be a good decision for you. And that's just, like, an objective reality. Right? But that is, like, triggering for your boyfriend because he doesn't want to think that you're even like, you know what I'm saying? Like, he's like. He wants you to know without a shadow of a doubt that you'll be in love with him forever. And it's like, I don't. I mean, that's just not realistic, you know? That's not how relationships work. He can't. He can't you can't promise him anything. You know, you can promise him that to like, you really like where it's going and that you are committed to making this work and, and you're willing to put in the energy and the effort to make this relationship work as long as he's also willing to do the same. And that's all you guys can do. So it's just like, it's just having more mature conversations around your guys situation and just making the other person feel like it's, it's like you can, you can move to Miami mostly because of him knowing that it's not an ideal, like part of your situation is not ideal, knowing that you don't really have a place to go, so you probably are going to crash with him for a while, see where it goes. But know that it's, it might be healthy to get your own place and still date without it feeling like you guys are taking a step in the wrong direction or having him play that cat those mental games where he's just like, like part of him wants you to want to stay with him because he wants you to want to need him while simultaneously like being weird about like his girlfriend staying at him and his roommate's place. Does that make sense?

Rebecca (77:44)

Definitely. Yeah. Yeah. And we had all these conversations too, because when I was thinking about just staying here or going to Miami, I really said, I was like, I honestly would move first to Miami, first myself first, because I could see potential there. I, when I do visit there, I have a lot of motivation there. I have friends there. I want to move for me. So that's like first. And then, you know, obviously for the relationship too, it's been long distance, it's been a little harder. And then now he's at the point where we've had all these conversations and it's kind of me asking him his concerns. So that's why he mentions the concerns so much. But now he's at the point where it's like, we'll just, we'll see what happens. Like, we'll see one month in, we'll know if it works or not. And he's like, you know, we might just love it so much. You, like, you might not maybe, we might not want you to leave.

Nick Viall (78:42)

Maybe. Maybe. Yeah. I mean, listen, I think the only thing to like figure you just have to be able to talk through things. Right. And I, you know, the, as far as like the notes app and the ex girlfriend, you know, not, you know, how it went down. Not ideal. But I don't Think it's the end of the world. And what's. I think what's more important is how you guys have been since. And was that, like, just kind of a bump in the road for him personally, that he had to kind of work through that and he needed some closure for a relationship that maybe he pined over too much prior to meeting with you and kind of had in his head that he would always get back together with her and just. It's definitely believable that, like, he met up with her. Who knows what he wanted? But, like, after he met up with her, it was like, yeah, maybe this is not what I expected. I don't think it's the end of the world. That notes app thing, not ideal. And again, how is your communication since, you know. And again, you move into Miami. As long as you, like, you're not only moving for this guy, you know, it's like, I'm not hearing a situation where you're like, I. I don't even. I don't want to be there. Like, the. I would. He's the only reason I would go, and I don't even know if he wants me there. That's not what I'm hearing. Like, if you have friends there, you have a community there you can make in a life there. It sounds like you like the city. So if it doesn't work out, you might. You. There's a good chance he won't run back to where you are now anyways. So get it out of your head that you're moving for him. Like, you're moving for yourself. And he's a big part of that equation, and that's exciting, but, like, don't put unnecessary pressure on the move and just be open to seeing where the relationship goes, you know?

Rebecca (80:16)

Yeah. A thing that keeps popping in my head, though. Like, sometimes I'm like, what if she does text him or tries to get in contact with him and wants him back? I don't know if he's. And I will. I guess I won't know, but I just don't know if he is fully over that first love feeling and everything like that.

Nick Viall (80:35)

Have you talked to him about it?

Rebecca (80:36)

Yeah. I mean, yeah, I've asked him that. And obviously he's like, no, never. Like, that ship sailed. Like. Like she's not the same person. But, I mean, I guess it's just something that over time, I'll have to get over.

Nick Viall (80:50)

Yeah. Or just, you guys will have to get through it together, you know? I think it's more about that than you just getting over. Because I think you do have the right for it to bother you. You know, he did up. You know, he needs to be. He needs to acknowledge that he needs to help you work through this.

Rebecca (81:06)

Yeah.

Nick Viall (81:06)

While he may have made an honest mistake and maybe there's a version where it's not like so up that he did that. It was like, yeah, you kind of. He shouldn't have done that. And like, you know, but he needs to help you work through that and. And make sure that, you know, whatever he needs to do to make you feel secure in this relationship and that you are a big priority for him and you'll know what that is. Before you even brought up the whole notes app thing, you were. It sounded like a guy who, you know, has some scars from previous relationships. Like, she sounds like she broke his heart and that him up a little bit, you know, and that happens. That happens all of us. I think it's just more about make. Working on communication with him.

Rebecca (81:43)

Yeah. And even before the whole notes app thing, before we were official, like, six months in to talking, he just randomly asked me these questions. But he asked. He's. He asked me if I think I met the person I'm going to marry. And every time he asked me these things randomly, I'm caught off guard. So I'm like, I don't know. Do you. Do you think so? And he, like, kind of chuckled and he's like, yeah, it's between two people. And then so, like, remembering that.

Nick Viall (82:14)

Why does he say that? I mean, it's kind of up.

Rebecca (82:16)

Yeah, he said it. Kind of like a joke, I guess. I mean, we were talking about.

Nick Viall (82:22)

It's definitely not. That's definitely not something to joke about, considering how, you know, he hurt you regarding his ex. I mean, I just think you have the right to be like that. That's not a joke. It's like, if you don't know the answer, fine, that's. But like putting me on the spot and then like, with me, like, I don't know, like. Like he seems to want you to almost feel insecure in a way. That's the vibe he kind of gives with some of his actions.

Rebecca (82:44)

In some ways. In some ways. Yeah, in some ways. But, yeah, that was before. That was like, only in, like, three months into talking to him when he said that.

Nick Viall (82:52)

Oh, that was before the notep. That was before the.

Rebecca (82:54)

No. Yeah. This was three months into talking. I wasn't bringing up any timeline, married, kids, anything. He was bringing those things up. And that's when he Said that. And, I mean, we weren't talking about our future yet, so it just kind of took me by surprise. But it's something to note now, after knowing what ended up happening with the notes app, that he was probably serious. It's probably. He was probably serious.

Nick Viall (83:20)

Yeah. There was definitely some truth to it. She was definitely lingering in his mind.

Rebecca (83:24)

One of his other concerns about me moving in is he does have his own business, and he works from home with his roommate. His roommate is his. Like, he works for him. The roommate works for my boyfriend. So they're just kind of always in the living room working. So he was worried about, like, you know, the vibes being off and workflow being affected and all of this stuff, which are valid concerns. And we've talked about that. He's fine with that now.

Nick Viall (83:57)

That's just like a logistic thing, you know?

Rebecca (83:59)

Yeah. But his other concerns, like, that he would mention afterwards would be. He would say, like, are you using me just to get to Miami? Or he keeps saying, like, are you just gonna meet a billionaire and leave me a billionaire? Yeah. And then I mentioned, when I first get there, I brought up, like, I want to get a job as soon as possible. Like, I'll work at, you know, a little restaurant or something at first until I can get an actual job in my career. But he's. He's specifically. He's like, no, you're not working at any of those places. He's like, I'd rather just. He. And he keeps mentioning. Even before I decided to move to Miami, he's like, come if. When you come to Miami, I'm gonna get you an Equinox membership. Kept saying that, which I never even mentioned. I don't even have one. He doesn't have one. But, yeah, he's like, I would rather you just stay home and not work, and I'll get you an Equinox membership, and you just stay home. You are not working at Moxies or any restaurant like that.

Nick Viall (85:05)

I mean, listen, it sounds like you guys both have some insecurities about each other, and it sounds like you guys need to work on that. And I think you guys, I think, have a way of poking each other and testing each other's insecurities and make you guys feel. Make each other feel more. You know, it's just like, if you're insecure, you see how he reacts. You poke the bear, and then you see if he reacts in the way you want. And that's not. Not a healthy way of working through insecurities. The healthy way is saying, I'm a little insecure about this. You know, I am a little insecure about, you know, you coming to Miami and, and seeing, you know, more, you know, maybe more established, successful men, like, win you away from me. You know, that's an honest thing. You have your own insecurities about, like, things he might, you know, and you, you guys should just. Should be able to talk about that. And then the other person should be the one saying, listen, it's not how I feel. I really care about you, and you're the person I want to be with. You guys can't promise the future, you know, but you can promise, like, you're the person I'm really committed to working on this with. And you guys have to both be vulnerable enough to know that, like, yeah, like, you know, relationships are a risk and you're risking your feelings, but you guys are. You guys are testing each other in a way that it feels a little toxic. And, you know, and I think there's probably a healthier approach to you guys working through some of your insecurities. And it sounds like you both, both have some as. As many people in relationships do. And I think you guys need to just do a better job of, of addressing those insecurities without poking the bear and testing the other person, you know?

Rebecca (86:37)

Yeah. Definitely more adult conversations.

Nick Viall (86:40)

Yeah.

Rebecca (86:41)

Well, current day, so current day. Now he's being like, like I said, he, he, he knows it's a thing now that I'm going in two weeks, and he says he wants me there and he's ready to do that part of the relationship. And so he's been planning on going to the super bowl for a whole year now. And he's been telling me this for the whole year. He's been planning to go to the super bowl because he works in that field. So he's been planning to do that to network. And I just found out my move out date last month, okay. When I have to be out of my friend's house. So I just found that out last month. And that's exactly when he would be going to the Super Bowl. But he was like. And then he's like, he's been super supportive and he said, here's what I'm gonna do. I'm just gonna cancel going to the super bowl completely, and I'm gonna come to New York, help you move out.

Nick Viall (87:38)

And how. And do you want him? Is that an expectation you have? Is. Did he already have tickets, like, in this situation? I guess I don't know the right Answer. And I don't think there's a bad answer, but I think the question is, is, you know, could you move without his help? You know, you're not moving. You're probably, what, bringing a couple suitcases? Because like you said, you're staying there. You know, he might travel.

Rebecca (88:01)

Exactly. I'm not moving any stuff he might.

Nick Viall (88:04)

You know, or are you doing it to see if he's willing to do it for you is like a test of the relation, you know what I'm saying? It's stuff like that that you guys have to try to avoid. So it's just like if. If deep down you he has tickets and he has plans and, you know, you don't mind him taking a trip to the boys super bowl, then, you know, there's a world where you say, hey, listen, like, obviously I would love your help and I appreciate your help, you know, and if you don't really want to go to the super bowl, by all means, I would, like, I could use the help. But I also, like, I know you really want to go, and if this is something you want to do, like, I can figure it out. It's not the end of the world. I have some friends, like my girlfriends, whatever, and just we'll celebrate me, like, like moving when you're back from the super bowl. Like, again, it's just. It's just about having the mature conversation without, like, using it as some sort of. Like, everything isn't a test about how much you guys love or don't love each other, you know, like, getting your partner to do something just, just, just because to prove it doesn't, like, do anything. Now, that being said, like, if, you know, if you really, like, deep down, be like, I really need his help and I really, you know, and like, whatever. Like, you just have to, like, like, be honest with yourself about what you really need from your partner and what you don't need and be willing to, like, know that they have friends and other things they want to do and not everything they do without you is a threat to your relationship and how they feel about you. And, like, you guys have to, like, you know, focus on those kind of thoughts and feelings. Does that make sense?

Rebecca (89:34)

Yeah, completely. And I didn't even meant. I didn't ask him to do that. I didn't want him to do that. I already planned for my mom to come and help me, but he's the one that insisted on doing that.

Nick Viall (89:45)

And what did you say, though?

Rebecca (89:47)

I said, well, at first I was like, no, I can't Let you do that. You've been planning this for a year. And then he's like, you're my person. I want to be there for you. Like, I'm gonna do that. So I didn't push any further.

Nick Viall (90:01)

Okay, well, I mean, so he's. Yeah, I'm not saying the right off.

Podcast Co-Host (90:04)

But there could have been a response.

Nick Viall (90:06)

Be like, whether you go to the super bowl or not, I'm still your person and I really appreciate your offering, but like, I, I will be. Okay, so, like, you know, like, you don't want to make someone do something you think they could resent in the future. You made me not go to the super bowl, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it's just like, just make sure he's not doing this because you kind of like low key guilted him into doing this. You know, it's like, oh, I didn't ask him, but like, maybe you've made comments. I don't know, like, you know, it's just like, you know how you guys communicate. I just think you should be supporting each other. Help, you know, healthy, not passive aggressive comments and things like that. And it sounds like you guys have a way of, as many couples do, having a way of testing the other person when you guys are feeling insecure about where you guys stand. And I think there's a healthier ways to go about communicating your insecurities about things. And like, lead by example, like, do the thing for him that you want him to do for you. So if you want him to act securely attached, as they say, when it comes to attachment styles, then you should lead by example in a sense. You know, if, again, if he's like, listen, I don't really want to go to the super bowl, it's not the end of the world. Yeah, I've been planning it, but like, honestly, my team lost and it's just like a bunch of money that honestly, I'd rather save. And honestly, this could be a really exciting start for us and I really want to do this. Then great. But like, just make sure he wants to do it and make sure like, without and you know, don't let him be like, well, you don't want me there. You know, it's just like, it's like, no, of course I want you there. I just, like, I know this is important to you and I know I'll, I can, can, I can do this without you, and I don't want you to miss something for me that I, I, you know, of course I'd love your help. Of course it'd be better with you, but I just want to make sure that I'm not causing. I don't want me moving to Miami to, you know, inconvenience you or stop you from doing the things that you want to do. And, like, you know, this is. This isn't some, like, random night out to the clubs that he didn't have planned. This is like, something, as you say, he's been planning for a year. Year, so.

Rebecca (92:05)

Exactly. You know, I definitely need to have another combo with him about that because, yeah, I feel guilty, and I don't want him to resent me and I don't want him to. That's a huge thing.

Nick Viall (92:17)

Yeah. We'll be okay. I know. Like, this. You going to the super bowl or not going to the super bowl doesn't change us being, you know, doesn't change you not being my person. And I really appreciate your willingness to do that, and it means a lot that you would be willing to do that. But it's. It's also like. Like, I want you to go if you want to go, and I'll be okay. And let's celebrate, you know, like, there's other ways to celebrate that. It's just trying to have healthy conversations. The big thing is not testing each other in ways.

Rebecca (92:42)

Yeah, absolutely. So now he's. Yeah. So now where we are again, he's saying, like, we're two weeks away from what we wanted six months ago. I didn't picture it, like, picture us living with the roommate, though. But, like, I want you here, and it's going to be great. So now I'm getting that support that was kind of lacking in the beginning when I was asking him what he thinks about me making that choice. But, I mean, again, I was more so asking him for concerns, not, you know, the positives or. I don't know. So I guess it's already decision. So.

Nick Viall (93:22)

But. Yeah, it's just. But, yeah, but. But your mindset and how you approach this will go a long way again if. Don't put up. Don't put unnecessary pressure on the relationship that it doesn't need. Don't test it when it doesn't need to be tested. When you're feeling insecure, just address the insecurity and ask for his help rather than passive aggressively, like, throw out a question that has a right or wrong answer in your mind, and the right answer means he loves you, and the wrong answer means maybe he doesn't. You know, like, try to. Try to avoid that.

Rebecca (93:52)

The childish stuff. Yeah, well, I have one last question to you is do you think that I was essentially the plan B?

Nick Viall (94:02)

No, probably not. I mean, no, I think it's very believable that this was a woman who was his first and only love. That is a. That fucks us all up when that happens. Maybe he never really got the closure he thought he had and you entering his life kind of like made him wonder like is, you know, and kind of he had some, maybe some confused feelings about her. Usually for example, like, I mean that's not a one for one situation. But when Natalie and I were dating but not together, you know, we were dating other people, you know, we stopped talking at times. But like when there were times where I was like, I don't think I can date her and I need to move on from talking to Natalie. And so then I would try to date other people that would just kind of make me miss Natalie, remind me of Natalie. And I think if this guy really had feelings for this other, other person, like he just, he, he would almost kind of get not the ick from you, but like it would just, he. It would be harder and harder for him to develop feelings for you because of that comparison, if that makes sense. So I think it's probably, it's. I think it's, it's. I think there's a really good chance that he was confused about her. Maybe like wrote in the notes app and he had this idea and maybe never did anything with it and yeah, maybe went out to LA and looked her up and it's a very believable story he's telling you. Obviously he went about in a way that like broke and viol your trust. But you're, you know, the way you talk, it sounds like you guys do have a lot of positive interactions and there's a lot of good things about this relationship. And I just. No one put it this way, no one wants to feel like they're settling. So if he felt like you were a backup plan, I don't think he would be moving forward with you because it's not just you or her in this world. If, if he felt like you weren't enough to get over her, I think he would move on from you. So yeah, I don't think you're a backup plan to her. I think you're just part of, she's part of his story. And we all have a story. You have a past, you know, and it, you know, he, that was just him processing that loss. But I do think it, he probably could mature a little. Bit in how he processes loss. And he probably has some lingering hurt from how that all went down. But that. I don't think that means he's in love with her or misses her or. Or thinks she's the one.

Rebecca (96:18)

Yeah. There's a separate thing, though. His roommate's a little younger. He's a little insecure. He's a little younger. He's on the heavier side. He feels like he can't really get girls. His roommate, the guy that works for him. And so my boyfriend has told me that he occasionally hires prostitutes, hookers, and that they have. Have came to the apartment. My boyfriend is sleeping. He wouldn't have known. He finds out later. But then. Yeah. And my boyfriend assured me that wouldn't have happened. Would never happen if I'm living there. But I'm, like, creeped out by that whole thing. I mean, side note, prior to becoming official, like, four months into talking to my boyfriends, you know, we were talking, and he was telling me about the previous job he had where he was working for someone still in the same, like, sports industry, and they were, you know, on an island somewhere, and they were with, like, basketball players and everything, and they hired a bunch of. I don't even know what I could say on this podcast. They hired a bunch of prostitutes, right? And my boyfriend was there, and this was, I guess, like five years ago, probably. He was 22. And I kind of got it out of him. He was at my house. I kind of got it out of him. I was like, did you sleep with one? Like, you could tell me. I kind of gaslit him into it. You could tell me. I'm not gonna think of you any differently. Like, did you sleep with one? And he kept saying, no, no, no. Then I again, gaslit him into it. I was like, I know you did. And then finally he admitted. He was like, find one. He did one. And I threw my pillow at him and I kind of kicked him out of my house. And I was like, that's disgusting. And I needed a couple days to think about it, like, because my morals. That was just disgusting. So I needed. That was before we were even official, but. So that was one of the things that happened. So those. Between those two things. Those two things are the only things that have went wrong so far. But another one of my concerns is he travels a lot for work, and he, like, when he travels, he stays in hotels with his roommate and his other co worker, who also dabbles in that kind of thing, like, on the regular.

Nick Viall (98:53)

I mean, listen, I. You Know, listen, I. You. It's. It definitely is gross. You, it's.

Riley (98:57)

Come.

Nick Viall (98:57)

Do you trust your boyfriend? You know, not an ideal situation but like, as you know, you're not planning on staying there and let that reality be the fact that like makes you not get too comfortable playing roommates with your boyfriend and his roommate and get your own place as soon as possible. But like, you know, make it clear. It's just like, you know, obviously you living with your boyfriend with a boy guy roommate, regardless of his appetite for sex workers isn't ideal. Regardless. Right. So in the meantime, you could yeah. Politely ask for him to not to do that and have your boyfriend try to enforce that. And hopefully your boyfriend recognizes that. Like, you know, if he is going to have his girlfriend like move in with his roommate, then he needs to create an atmosphere and environment that she feels safe, you know, and that's part of, you know, I think that's a fair expectation for you to have. You're going to have to ask yourself if this is a reflection of who he is today or is it like, you know, did he do something gross and learn from it? Put it this way, if he was my roommate, I'd been like, dude, do what you want. You can't do that shit here.

Rebecca (99:57)

Here. Because he's the boss too. Of.

Nick Viall (100:01)

Yeah, he could probably. Yeah, I would. If I'm you. I would have put. I would expect him to put a stop to it.

Rebecca (100:06)

Yeah. But the thing is too. Yeah, they like when they travel for work, he has a bunch of.

Nick Viall (100:11)

You can't get his own hotel room.

Rebecca (100:12)

He does. He, he. Well he shares a usually hotel room with his roommate. You know, why not save money, whatever.

Nick Viall (100:19)

But save money and not hire a prostitute.

Podcast Host (100:22)

Yeah.

Rebecca (100:23)

He says that the roommate and the other worker doesn't hire prostitutes during those times. I just, it's. Again, I guess I just have to trust him because he does travel a lot for work, all different sorts of places. He stays in these hotels. And it's just. I never would have thought he was that type of guy. So in my mind it's kind of like, yes, he was 22, but you've done it once and then you are surrounding yourself with people that continue to do it.

Nick Viall (100:55)

Like that's a little bit of rough.

Rebecca (100:56)

And they go to the casino and drink and everything too after work. Like so it's like, I mean, I guess, I don't know.

Nick Viall (101:03)

I don't think you fully trust your boyfriend the way you would hope to.

Rebecca (101:06)

How do I. Is that something that time will build.

Nick Viall (101:10)

Or more like communication. I don't, you know, like he, I, I think if you feel like somebody doesn't trust you, people go out of your way to like be transparent and open so that it makes it easy for people to trust you. You, you know, if he should care that like that bothers you to the point where he's showing you that it doesn't bother you anymore.

Rebecca (101:32)

Do you think it's concerning?

Nick Viall (101:33)

I think there's some red flags with that behavior. Yeah, for sure. I don't think him doing it five years ago is that is the end of the world or whatever it was when he was 22. I think it's a little weird that he's pretty casual about his roommate bringing sex workers over. Yeah, I wouldn't, Yeah, I wouldn't be like once. Okay, well, is that, do you believe that?

Rebecca (101:55)

I mean, I don't know what to believe because I'm like, where does he find them? Because I know there's these websites and the apps or whatever. He, my boyfriend just says, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. So he doesn't tell me extra information.

Nick Viall (102:08)

Listen, there's definitely some red flags with it, but I don't think it's. I think you just have to ask more questions and I think you guys have to communicate but better. And I think right now I think you guys are a little bit more passive aggressive in your communication rather than just direct and vulnerable. You're like always trying to like figure out the right way to ask. And you guys test each other and you can just be like, listen, that bothers me. But again, like, just try not to do the whole like, it's fine, I won't judge you and then freak out. You know, like, you have to find a way to be like, I would really like you to be honest with me and I feel like you did that and I. Can we just talk about it and like said I, I. A great way to like get trust in a relationship is to say like, listen, I can't promise that you're not. You might get upset me and I might upset you. And we have to be okay with allowing each other from time to time to upset the other person. And then, you know, the other person can't just flip out and name call, whatever. You can get mad and be like, I'm really upset with you right now. But like, let's. I'm, you know, you're gonna left to allow me to be angry, but I'm not leaving you. And I'M not leaving, like, going to name call you and, like, let's see if we can work through this. I'm not saying it's your. But, like, when you do the thing that's like, hey, you can trust me. You can trust me. You can tell me anything, and then he tells you the truth, and then you do exactly the opposite. You promised him you. You're not sending a healthy precedent or a lane for him to be honest with you in the future. That's when you get the whole, like, well, I didn't tell you the truth because I didn't want to upset you. You know, but you have the lot. You have the right to be upset, but how you handle those emotions, like, like, you know, it's like, you got to find a healthier balance to, like, for you guys to communicate your frustrations and work through your frustrations without. Without triggering the other person. Cool.

Rebecca (103:52)

Yeah. All right.

Nick Viall (103:53)

All right, well, good luck with the move. Again, like, you're moving. It doesn't necessarily mean anything. It's just a. It's a part of your life, you know, he is big part of the reason why you're moving. He's not the only reason. Whether you guys end up together won't be because you're destined together or what you guys promise each other today. It'll be the work you guys put into it. And whether you guys are willing to work through whatever, like, incompatibilities. Your incompatibilities, or insecurities you have. And. And are you guys prioritizing, you know, making the other person feel less anxious, more than more anxious? Are you going out of your way to. To calm them rather than trigger them? You know, are you. You, you know, and things like that, you know, and then hoping the other person does the same thing, that's. That's what will matter. It won't be, you know, some of the stuff that you guys are focusing on right now.

Rebecca (104:40)

Definitely. I guess we're just gonna have to see how it goes.

Nick Viall (104:43)

All right, well, take care.

Rebecca (104:44)

Thank you so much, Nick.

Nick Viall (104:45)

My pleasure. Good luck. Keep us posted how it all goes. All right.

Rebecca (104:49)

All right. Definitely will.

Nick Viall (104:49)

All right. Bye.

Rebecca (104:50)

Bye.