E856 - James Kennedy ARRESTED, Tom Sandoval Goes Live, Ultimatum’s Zaina, SNL’s Heidi Gardner, and RHOSLC

Summary

The Viall Files Episode E856
Release Date: December 17, 2024

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Overview

In Episode E856 of The Viall Files, hosts Nick Viall, Natalie Joy, Justin, and Heidi Gardner delve into a mix of high-profile reality TV drama, pop culture news, and celebrity gossip. The episode centers on the arrest of James Kennedy, the controversial behavior of Tom Sandoval, insights from Zaina of The Ultimatum, Heidi Gardner's experiences on Saturday Night Live (SNL), and updates on The Real Housewives of Salt Lake City (RHOSLC). Interspersed with humor and candid discussions, the hosts provide a comprehensive recap of the latest happenings in reality television and beyond.

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James Kennedy Arrested for Domestic Violence
Timestamp: 07:39 - 19:55

The episode kicks off with a major revelation about James Kennedy, a prominent figure from Vanderpump Rules, who was recently arrested for misdemeanor domestic violence in Burbank, California. The incident reportedly involved an argument where Kennedy allegedly grabbed and threw a woman to the ground, though no visible injuries were reported.

• Nick Viall comments:
  “I don't know much about the law when it comes to stuff, but how is the word battery and misdemeanor in the same sentence when it comes to domestic violence?” [08:57]

• Natalie Joy adds her perspective on the legal nuances:
  “That probably has to do to, like, injuries and what...” [09:15]

The hosts delve into Kennedy's history, highlighting past allegations of violent behavior and how the reality show may have shielded him from earlier repercussions.

• Justin explains:
  “In season four where we see Kristen and James get into a fight... editors had to have known about her being pushed into a bush before said shot was shown.” [10:21]

The conversation emphasizes the recurring pattern of Kennedy's behavior and the apparent protection he received within the Vanderpump Rules franchise.

• Natalie expresses frustration:
  “I don't give a fuck if it's a guy who's clearly had substance abuse problems.” [14:00]

The hosts criticize Lisa Vanderpump for not addressing Kennedy's actions publicly, underscoring a lack of accountability within the show's leadership.

• Nick states:
  “Lisa Vanderpump, you need to say something. You need to speak out.” [15:23]

Impact on Vanderpump Rules and Cast Members
Timestamp: 19:55 - 29:32

The discussion shifts to the broader implications of Kennedy's arrest on the Vanderpump Rules franchise and its cast members. The hosts discuss how allegations against Kennedy have surfaced over multiple seasons, with various cast members hinting at his aggressive behavior.

• Nick remarks on the embarrassment:
  “It's embarrassing because we talked with Michael about James...” [19:00]

• Natalie shares:
  “I really hope that she gets out of this relationship because it's clear that this is a pattern he's not going to learn.” [16:13]

The conversation underscores the challenges of addressing toxic behavior in reality TV settings and the personal toll it takes on those involved.

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Tom Sandoval’s Live Updates and Relationship Drama
Timestamp: 21:15 - 44:52

Tom Sandoval, another key figure from Vanderpump Rules, becomes the focus as his relationship dynamics come under scrutiny. Recent Instagram stories from his girlfriend Victoria suggest potential infidelity, leading to speculation and debate among the hosts.

• Natalie Joy cites Victoria's cryptic post:
  “She said, wow, you guys were right. Tiger never changes its stripes.” [21:44]

The hosts dissect the implications of these updates, comparing Tom's situation with James Kennedy's, and express skepticism about Tom's explanations and public persona.

• Nick questions Tom’s behavior:
  “It’s very icky for your girlfriend to post something cryptic and for you to go on a live and then refute.” [22:58]

• Justin adds:
  “He’s not to be put in the same bucket as James...” [21:18]

The segment highlights the complexities of maintaining personal relationships amidst the pressures and scrutiny of reality TV fame.

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Selena Gomez’s Engagement and Celebrity Gossip
Timestamp: 29:32 - 34:26

The episode briefly touches on Selena Gomez's engagement, stirring debate about the authenticity of the event and the intersection of celebrity news with commercial interests.

• Nick mocks the situation:
  “She said the ring so that we're not confused about that.” [30:13]

• Natalie Joy questions the presence of Taco Bell in engagement photos:
  “She really got engaged, but why is there Taco Bell?” [30:20]

The discussion reflects on how celebrity announcements are often intertwined with marketing and branding strategies, leading to public skepticism.

---

Drones Sightings in San Diego
Timestamp: 26:07 - 28:12

A lighter yet intriguing topic emerges with reports of large, SUV-sized drones hovering over critical infrastructure in San Diego. The hosts speculate humorously about the origins and intentions behind these mysterious drones.

• Justin describes the sightings:
  “They’re a cluster of large SUV-sized drones...” [26:10]

• Nick philosophizes:
  “Maybe this is the end of the world.” [27:36]

The segment serves as a humorous diversion, blending real concerns with speculative humor about potential extraterrestrial threats.

---

Heidi Gardner’s Insights from Saturday Night Live
Timestamp: 87:03 - 126:01

Heidi Gardner shares her experiences working on SNL, offering listeners a behind-the-scenes look at the challenges of live sketch comedy and maintaining a professional persona.

• Heidi recounts her first night:
  “I did kind of flub that line... because I just could have left it hard.” [84:22]

• Nick praises her adaptability:
  “It was a great story for all the people out there who have a dream...” [113:20]

Heidi discusses the importance of authenticity in performance and the struggle of balancing character work with personal authenticity.

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Conclusion

Episode E856 of The Viall Files presents a robust discussion on serious issues within the reality TV landscape, particularly focusing on domestic violence and irresponsible behavior by prominent cast members. The hosts provide a blend of critical analysis, personal opinions, and humor, making the complex topics accessible to their audience. Additionally, lighter segments on celebrity gossip and behind-the-scenes insights from Heidi Gardner on SNL offer a well-rounded listening experience. The episode underscores the ongoing challenges of accountability in reality television and the personal impacts of public scandals.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Nick Viall:
  “You have to be successful in your being a piece of shit and beating your partner...” [09:25]

• Natalie Joy:
  “There's so much manipulation involved where you feel like you have to protect that person.” [16:13]

• Heidi Gardner:
  “Junior is a pathological liar.” [66:27]

• Zaina from The Ultimatum:
  “I find Junior is a pathological liar. I'll just say that.” [66:27]

• Justin:
  “Do you think Lisa can protect James forever?” [15:23]

These quotes encapsulate the hosts' critical stance on the misconduct of reality TV personalities and the broader implications for the shows they are part of.

Transcript

[Nick]

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[Natalie]

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[Heidi Gardner]

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[Natalie]

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[Nick]

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[Natalie]

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[Justin]

Gift they'll never forget.

[Natalie]

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[Nick]

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[Natalie]

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[Nick]

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[Heidi Gardner]

You're crazy.

[Nick]

What's going on everybody? Welcome back to another exciting episode of the Vile Files Reality Recap Edition. I am your host, Nick. We got the household with us. Boy babe, on a scale of 1 to 10, did we have one of the most amazing weeks ever last week? Or like where would you put it on a where would you rank it in terms of top weeks we've had as a couple?

[Natalie]

Probably right after I feel like wedding and birth of river are tied and then this weekend, this week, that week.

[Nick]

I'm kidding.

[Natalie]

It was definitely right up close.

[Nick]

It was really great. Well, as you guys know, we went to Kathy Hilton's Christmas party, which if, honestly, if that is all we did, that would have been a great week because obviously we got to meet Mary. Well, yeah, and I felt like we met Mary earlier last year and she.

[Natalie]

Remembered that last year I was pregnant.

[Nick]

But we really met Mary this time.

[Natalie]

We really chatted with Mary this time.

[Nick]

Anyways, we'll get into obviously the drama that unfolded later that night. Kathy Hilton's party that we didn't know about regarding the. What we now to know the piece of James Kennedy. What the last name Kennedy. Anyways, so we'll get to that later. Then after said party, we Nally and I had to fly to New York for a interview that we're very excited to bring to you guys in the beginning of the year. Very cool. Very excited. Can't talk about it. Don't want to talk. We're not going to. We could. We. I mean, we could talk about it. We're not going to talk about it quite yet. I'm very excited.

[E]

Can I just get the height?

[Justin]

Can we just say it's huge?

[Nick]

It's big.

[Heidi Gardner]

It's huge.

[Nick]

It's big for. We think it's big. Yes.

[E]

It's the boat blocking the Suez Canal.

[Nick]

Big. Yeah. Well, like, you know, I don't know if you guys remember, like last year we kicked off 2024 with a pretty.

[Natalie]

Big interview that of Gypsy Rose. Right out of prison.

[Nick]

Right out of prison.

[G]

All I have to say is I'm dead.

[Natalie]

You're not alive.

[G]

I'm not alive.

[Natalie]

RIP Justin.

[Nick]

And we decided to go bigger this year. We decided to kick off 2025 even bigger than last year.

[Natalie]

Yes, we did. But it was our first time we have ever left River. It was a very.

[Nick]

Like, that part sucked.

[Natalie]

Y We've traveled with her everywhere. We've gone everywhere with her. We've been like, let's fly my mom in to help us. Like, we've, you know, we figured out a way to have river with us everywhere. Now we had just gotten back from Thanksgiving. She had been struggling with like a. Getting over a double ear infection over Thanksgiving. So we were like, you know, let's make this trip in and out. Let's fly my mom out to LA. We left river at home with my mom for 36 hours maybe.

[Nick]

Yeah, we brought Derek.

[Natalie]

We brought Derek with us. So instead of river, we had Derek. So Derek was sitting on your lap equally?

[Nick]

Yeah, he fit it really nice into the. The strap on. Carry on. I just had Derek right On my. Right. On me.

[Natalie]

Just kind of carried it great in the duna.

[Nick]

Yeah, it was great to have. You know what. Did you know what I found out about Derek? Did you guys not know this? I hope I can share this. We can kick it out of.

[Natalie]

He'll be editing this, I'm sure.

[Justin]

Tell us all of Derek's secrets if.

[Nick]

You don't want this in your. Derek's dad is a 911 survivor. Derek's dad was working at the. In the. The World Trade.

[Natalie]

Well, they've been.

[Heidi Gardner]

They.

[Natalie]

They talked the case.

[Nick]

Should get to know my employees better. Yeah, crazy. Anyway, so found that out spending time with Derek on the trip. But anyways, very cool interview. We did a real sit down. It was really cool. We got to go to this person's place and I'm excited to. We're excited to give it to you guys. January 8th, I think, right. The 8th. That Wednesday. Going deeper.

[Justin]

You took my punchline. I was going to say, did you go deeper?

[Nick]

Oh, we went so deep.

[Heidi Gardner]

So deep. How deep did you go?

[Nick]

Oh, my God. The deep. The deepest. Very excited I get.

[Natalie]

Anyways, how did you feel leaving River? Like, did you feel like we.

[Nick]

I was really proud of us. I was. It wasn't easy for us. I think we missed river more than she missed us. For sure. When we showed up home, thankfully, we had Grandma. Grandma's been with us. She's been with river from the beginning. Yeah. I was really proud of us. Did you.

[Justin]

Did you ever have a moment where you guys felt like you were forgetting something? Because it's like, I feel like you're constantly having to take care of a baby that it's like to not have one for a couple of days. That it's like, what am I doing?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

It was definitely like, it felt odd for us to be free. Oh, my God, he's in shackles. It felt odd for us to be like, out and not be like, oh, we have to change a diaper or, oh, we need to, like, figure out her lunch. Like, just to. Yeah. Not have to work, like, to know that she was being taken care of.

[Nick]

So well, get on the plane and raw dog.

[Natalie]

It just like, literally, I was like a movie on an airplane.

[Nick]

I just.

[Natalie]

Oh, my God.

[Nick]

And forever might have stood there and stared.

[E]

Awesome.

[Justin]

He was like, it's so nice to have nothing to do.

[Natalie]

Truly. It was wild.

[Nick]

Prepped for the interview. Thought, thought, you know, I just stood there because I don't mind. I'm not much of a note taker. I just stared in the abyss yeah, I'm sure Natalie thought some good questions.

[Natalie]

Of course I did.

[Nick]

Yep. On the plane she was. We took some edibles on the plane there and now I popped up. She's like, I have a great question for this person. And this person, when she asked that question, you could tell they were like. They were like. That is a great question. And this is a thought. Very thoughtful person. Yeah.

[Natalie]

But no, it was. I am definitely proud of us for. I think that's a huge.

[Nick]

We put this under dream guest.

[Natalie]

I was talking about leaving rumor, but yeah, for sure we can.

[Nick]

Yeah, I've moved on from leaving.

[Natalie]

No, of course she's fine.

[Justin]

You're asking about the priorities.

[Natalie]

Yeah. Interview this.

[E]

We're all in the future.

[Nick]

Yeah. Listen, we're trying to support and pay for her college. You know, this is all part of the plan. Yeah, we are. Yeah. So anyways, it was a. It was very exciting and then we came back and then we went to Seth McFarland's Christmas party on Saturday, which was a lot of fun. Legendary. Ran into Kristen Doty.

[H]

Love her.

[Heidi Gardner]

We did.

[Natalie]

Who you know, and we talked to.

[Nick]

Her about the obviously very unfortunate situation that is James Kennedy. Yeah.

[Natalie]

The piece of that he is.

[Nick]

Yeah. Really? That guy. Honestly, for those of you who don't know, James Kennedy was arrested did for domestic violence, the police reports are very disturbing.

[Natalie]

So law enforcement sources tell tmz, which love that for law enforcement, they're like, you know what? We don't give a. We're going to tell TMZ what this shit bag did. Burbank, California police were dispatched to a home in the area Tuesday night after receiving a call about an argument between him and a woman. A witness saw Kennedy and the woman arguing with the reality TV star, allegedly grabbing her at one point though we're told officers did not see any visible injuries on her. After investigating the situation, police say they determined it was domestic incident leading to James being arrested for misdemeanor domestic violence. Sources say Kennedy was released after posting a twenty thousand dollar bail. And then the arrest log came out and in that arrest log it says that James was arrested Dec. 10 in a home in Burbank on a misdemeanor charge of domestic battery upon a spouse or cohabitant after a unidentified woman inside stated her boyfriend lifted her up and threw her to the ground.

[Nick]

I don't know much about the law when it comes to stuff, but how is the word battery and misdemeanor in the same sentence when it comes to domestic violence?

[Natalie]

That is a great question. I Feel like a lot of it, unfortunately, probably has to do to, like, injuries and what, the.

[E]

Physical injuries.

[Natalie]

Yeah, physical injuries. And what, like, the victim is, you know, willing to.

[Nick]

So you have to be successful in your being a piece of shit and beating your partner or in order for it.

[Natalie]

Or the victim has to be like.

[Justin]

You know, my life was threatened.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Which, anyways, I mean, fuck James. I just. I don't know. I mean. And then we. We talked. Obviously we ran into Kristen Doty maybe. I guess I've been living under a rock, but I guess James has a history of this.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yes.

[Nick]

It seems to really have been brought to light since his arrest. I think we've all kind of watched James have a bit of a reactive temper on tv. You know, we never want to jump to conclusions, but I think it's sad.

[Natalie]

Because I think Kristen tried to talk about this, but I think everyone called her crazy, so no one believed her.

[Nick]

And when did Sarah. You've been obviously watching Vanderpump and following the franchise for a long time. How long is this, like, James is like. I mean, so ever since this arrest, what, you know, paying attention to it seems like this. There. My understanding after the arrest, there's been, like, whispers of this type of behavior with James for a long time now. Can you elaborate on what. What.

[Justin]

Yes, obviously there's. I want to say it's season four where we see Kristen and James get into a fight or break up. And they show the clip of her punching him she wrote in her book after she was let go of Vanderpump Rules, stating that she was in a toxic fling of a relationship and that it did turn physical. Apparently producers and other people knew about it. Clearly, editors had to have known about her being pushed into a bush before said shot of her punching James was shown. That was edited out, so I don't know if it was protection of James. Raquel has come forward and said things in the past about him being violent. We also have season 10 where Raquel was saying that Ally and James had gotten into a fight. It was like the first episode of the season and she was called a liar and that she didn't know what she was talking about. Friends of Kristen have come forward and said that this guy has been a piece of shit consistently throughout. But you have two ex girlfriends saying that he has been violent with them.

[Natalie]

As well, didn't he? I saw something about Rachel where she was saying that, like, she had just gotten her nose done and he had, like hit her nose or bumped quotes, bumped her nose and she Was like, I'm gonna have to tell my doctor.

[Justin]

So there is a scene where they go to a plastic surgeon. Lisa's involved, and she does ask her straight up, did James do that? And Rachel is still defending James at this point, saying, no, it was an accident. He went in for a kiss a little too hard, and it bumped her nose. But it just kind of seems like there's a history of James being protected on this show and the women being called liars who go through a hard breakup with him. You saw him spit on a door. You've seen him say very vulgar things. I, too, want to trust that he could have grown and learned from that.

[Nick]

But, yeah, that's. I mean, it's almost kind of embarrassing, I think. I mean, obviously, there's been a lot of pickup about our conversation that we had with Michael Rappaport. We saw James and Ali at Kathy's party. We talked to James and Ally. We talked to Allie a little bit more than James. And then, obviously, I told that anecdotal story about seeing James walk past me and yell and demand his friend hold his drink, which I thought was shocking and a bit, like, odd to treat your quote, unquote, friend that way. But now we come to find that maybe this behavior escalated later that night. But, yeah, it's embarrassing because we, you know, we talked with Michael about James, and literally that night, I remember talking with James about, like, wow, you really. You've. Vanderpump's over, but you really elevated your career. And James really gave especially, like, ever since Scandoval, and that was my introduction to Vanderpump. And obviously, we've gone back and we recap and yada, yada, and we've become really big fans of the franchise and the show. But James has really, like, taken scandal and been, like, seemingly the one guy willing to, like, quote, unquote, do the work, to grow up, to elevate himself and to learn from his mistakes. And, you know, that's as much for all the fun that we have on the show. That's something I think this show really talks about in terms of, like, you know, listen, we. We all up. We all have to take accountability and apologize, and there's room for growth if we all want to grow. And I think there was a level of even talking to Michael, a level of, like, you know, good for James, but, like, fuck this guy. I mean, if this is, like, really who he is, I don't. And honestly, I don't give a. I don't give. I don't. I Don't give a fuck if j. I don't want. I don't want to hear substance abuse, blaming it on that. I don't care. This is a guy who's clearly had substance abuse problems. He has blamed his substance abuse on his reactive personality. He has chosen to go back to those substances. And, you know, I don't. You know, whether it's because of the substance abuse or the drinking or not, clearly this is a type of behavior that has been ongoing and recurring. And I don't. I don't have any fudgeing patience for any guy who lays a hand on any woman, period, whatsoever. Like, you picked her up and threw her on the ground. You're a piece of shit, James. Fudge you.

[Justin]

Amen.

[Nick]

I hope he never works again. I hope his DJ career.

[Natalie]

I believe he lost his residency in Vegas.

[Nick]

Fuck him.

[E]

Let's go.

[Natalie]

Ali did post a Instagram story she posted and said, thank you to everyone who has reached out with love and support and for checking in on me. I'm okay. And taking the time I need right now. I deeply appreciate all the kindness and respect for my privacy during this time. Kristin posted the headline saying, finally, Rachel, Raquel Levis posted, or I guess her attorneys stated that we're aware of James Kennedy's recent arrest for domestic violence. This news is unfortunately not surprising. Rachel's revenge porn lawsuit describes in significant detail Mr. Kennedy's long history of erratic violent behavior and substance abuse.

[Nick]

Why is he part of that lawsuit?

[G]

I think she's going after the show, so he's grouped into the show if it all.

[Justin]

And I think she's saying that her mental state going into the relationship with Sandoval that she wasn't.

[Nick]

I'll tell you what. If you're right about the fact that the show has footage of James laying a hand on Kristen and editing that out, like, fuck. Fuck that. I mean, I mean, if that's.

[E]

I think it's representative of the time that Vanderpump started in to where it ended in where it's like, you have just in the way that, like, Kristen was narrator, narrative, eyes as crazy Kristen.

[Nick]

It's just like, has Lisa Vanderpump said anything? Because I know Lisa has been a huge supporter of James, protecting James. Yeah, yeah. Has she not?

[Justin]

I have no.

[Nick]

Lisa Vanderpump, you need to say something. You need to speak out. The fact that you haven't spoken out yet is embarrassing for you.

[Justin]

There was also a story that Teddy Mellencamp and Tamara had shared about being in a car with them. Headed to TomTom for an after party and that Ali and James got into it in the back seat and that the car had to pull over and that Ted and Tamara got out of the car. Ali refuted it, saying that that wasn't true. But I'm like, there's just been so many instances where it's like, you're hearing people being told that they're lying about a situation that clearly is indicative of his behavior.

[Natalie]

As someone who's been in a domestic abuse relationship, like, there is so much manipulation involved where, like, you feel like you have to protect that person. So, like, I totally understand where, you know, in the moments Kristin or Rachel or Allie have felt like they needed to say, like, no, that's not happening. No, like, you're wr.

[Heidi Gardner]

Wrong.

[Natalie]

Because they want to protect the person they love. They don't want to seem like, you know, that's their life or that's their reality, because, you know, for me, at least, it was, like, embarrassing that I allowed a man to hit me. You know, it was like, you know, I. I was raised my whole life of, like, you stand up to men, and you. My mom's, you know, was like, you're an independent woman. You, like, would never allow that. And so for me to allow that to happen, it was embarrassing.

[H]

Right?

[Natalie]

So it's like, I would never admit that to anyone. And so I just, like, feel so much for these women who, you know, went through this and felt like they couldn't tell anyone and felt like they were alone. And, like, I mean, I just. I really hope that Ali takes this. If it is Alli. You know, clearly that they don't name her in this arrest. But I. I just hope that she gets out of this relationship because it's clear that this is a pattern he's not going to learn. And I. I can't imagine what has happened behind closed doors 100%.

[Nick]

We confirmed that Lisa hasn't said anything.

[G]

She hasn't spoken out yet.

[Nick]

Lisa, that's embarrassing.

[Natalie]

I feel like she was like, she couldn't stop talking about scandal, you know.

[Nick]

I mean, regardless, though, like, this is someone who is on some level of great power and influence when it comes to vanderpump in general. She's obviously aware of. Of all the behaviors that this cast is doing both on and off camera. She is privy to a lot of the information that most people aren't. If all these rumors that you've talked about, like, there's plenty of smoke. You're telling me that, like, what. What is Lisa covering up? You know, like, what has Lisa been protecting and hiding? And for her to have had James back this whole time and this come out and for Lisa Vanderpump not to say anything, it's been how many days?

[G]

Four or five?

[Nick]

Yeah, it's been almost a week.

[Natalie]

Has anyone else from Vanderpump spoken out.

[G]

Besides nobody else from, like, the immediate cast? We do have a source that came out and said that a neighbor caught wind of the spat, overreacted and called 911 and that it was a misin. Understanding.

[Natalie]

Well, it clearly wasn't.

[Nick]

No, that's.

[Heidi Gardner]

That's.

[Nick]

That's pr. No, you read the police report. She was scared. You know what I'm saying?

[G]

Like 100.

[Nick]

In these situations, there's clearly a triggering event where the. The abuser reacts and does his. And. And gets big and scary. And in that moment, like, that's like she was scared.

[Natalie]

And if she felt police would have shown up and she would have said, like it was a misunderstanding. We were arguing about whatever. Like, you know, she would have called.

[Nick]

We could have said anything. The fact that they were called, it means like someone heard something where someone was scared. For someone, there was legit worry. And then even to Natalie's point, time had passed. And then it's still at an escalated level.

[Natalie]

Yeah. It took like arguing outside for neighbors to hear. Call the police. Police. We know it takes forever for police to show up in la.

[Nick]

Forever.

[Natalie]

And then for that to have then escalated inside, it is. Is.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

It's scary. It's up. He is a piece of. I hope that you.

[Nick]

You ruined your entire career, James. How do you. Who does that? I mean, man.

[E]

Piece of.

[Natalie]

Just a piece of.

[G]

I did also, to answer your question earlier, Nick, I looked up the difference or a common difference between a felony and misdemeanor battery. And a lot of the times it's physical, significant injury or involving aggravating factors.

[Nick]

So you actually have to hurt someone.

[G]

Well, this is just a common difference between the two.

[Nick]

Picking up someone embodieslam is not, unfortunately.

[E]

I mean, it's just another. To me that just reads as another instance to make it harder for victims to like, get protection. Get protection.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

It's just like, why bring it up if they're only gonna get a missing or it almost feels like it's like then you have. I don't know. Anyways, very sad situation. Our hearts go out to Ally. Wish her nothing but the best. Yeah. We just want to support her and get. Get her through this. And hopefully she chooses peace and happiness.

[Natalie]

And Also support just all the other women that he has done this to because I'm sure this is like re triggering for them to now.

[Nick]

Like, but the people around this guy who are actually hanging out with him and know this guy who call him like a friend, like why. Why is this if. If this has been going on, you.

[H]

Know, I think Rachel Levis also posted.

[Nick]

Saying the amount of times I convinced.

[H]

Myself that the abuse I endured by.

[Nick]

James Kennedy was a misunderstanding is sickening. So she has also come out and said something but at this point like yeah, the. I'm just more. I don't know. There's this people part of this Vanderpump world who clearly have been looking the other way who know James. I don't know how you get to any other conclusion 100%.

[Justin]

I think that it's one thing to try to make excuses for somebody, but like a repeat offender.

[Nick]

And I think like again, Lisa Vanderpump, like I went to Lisa Vanderpump's house once when I did her podcast a long time ago when she had a podcast for a second and she was very gracious and very nice. And when I left, James came in like I don't know. I think he was just like they're very close. Like Lisa looks after James.

[Justin]

James was best friends with her son for the longest time. I don't know how that she said.

[G]

James is like one of her sons ones. Yes, you said that before.

[Nick]

So the fact that she hasn't said anything matters and is a reflection on Lisa. It's embarrassing. Lisa, do you better.

[Natalie]

Clearly it will be hard to transition from that into our headlines.

[Nick]

We could just transition right into Tom Sandoval.

[Natalie]

Yes, we can. What is Tom Sandoval up to these days?

[Nick]

Well, 6am lives not the same. Not. We don't want to put him in the same bucket as James because that is. There's a huge difference between anything ever that that Tom has has allegedly done or done compared to what James is being accused of. But Tom's girlfriend Victoria, I believe her name is posted the all black Instagram story with the some white font she was venting to the Internet.

[Natalie]

She said, wow, you guys were right. Tiger never changes its stripes. He loves the best friend apparently. I feel like a fool. Completely heartbroken.

[Heidi Gardner]

Well, first of all, very cryptic, very cryptic.

[Nick]

I think it's spots and leopards, I think it's interchangeable.

[Natalie]

A tiger, a lion never changes its mane.

[E]

You know, lots of animals have notable markings in the same way that Tom Sandoval has a note of Stripes marketing.

[Nick]

Lisa will always defend James Kennedy, you know? Yeah, kind of like that. Something like that.

[Natalie]

So what do we know? Like, what happened or what? Like, where is this coming from?

[Justin]

She just posted a cryptic story and obviously insinuating to the idea that Tom has also cheated on her. I woke up this morning to a clip of Tom's Live where he's just not saying a word.

[Nick]

Tom's not alive, clearly not from having gotten up for a good night's sleep.

[E]

No.

[Natalie]

Yes. We know he loves to stay up all night, so he probably has a.

[Nick]

Podcast to do today that he was.

[Justin]

Staying up for, and I'll watch that, too. But he said, she knows she messed up last night, so he left, which is very icky.

[Nick]

It's very icky for your girlfriend to post something cryptic and for you to go on a live and then refute.

[Justin]

It with the public that have no idea what's going on.

[Nick]

No, he said something like, she knows. She. Like she.

[Justin]

Like she knows she messed up.

[Nick]

She's in trouble. I'm sorry, what?

[E]

Like, I will never believe a word that comes out of Thompson.

[Nick]

Well, not. But again, he's addressing this with us. And before she could say anything else, he goes online and says, no, no, no, no, no. It's my girlfriend's fault she's in trouble with me.

[Justin]

He also took the time to go through his Instagram and archive whatever photos, front facing of her in them.

[Nick]

So he took her off. Took her off? Yeah.

[Justin]

He's not. She's not found on the page until you scroll through photos.

[Natalie]

Well, I mean, she says he loves the best friends, apparently, which is a awkward sentence to begin with. Do we know who the best friends cuddling with?

[Nick]

Jax.

[Natalie]

It's plural. Best friends.

[Nick]

Best friends.

[E]

Best friends.

[Nick]

Orgy.

[Justin]

I honestly didn't know that they hung out with other people, so.

[E]

Yeah, doesn't he.

[Natalie]

Kyle Chan is.

[Justin]

Kyle Chan's one of the best friends.

[G]

Sarah's right, because they were called vampires. Yeah, they just stay inside.

[Nick]

Don't you ever want to grow up, guys? It's rhetorical.

[Natalie]

Yeah, Yeah, I do. I think I definitely did at some point. I was like, okay, time to hang up the hat.

[Justin]

I. Drama to myself kind of thing.

[Natalie]

I'll kick the bucket and I'll, you know, grow the up. So that is.

[E]

He is incapable of shame. It's crazy, right?

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

I mean, I honestly don't expect either of them to ever, like, really tell us what the these are about. I feel like they're just gonna act like nothing happened, and then they're gonna be back together.

[Justin]

They're gonna be back together. The photos will be unarchived and it'll be like, guys, you guys are so dramatic.

[Nick]

I think there's any chance they would come on the show.

[Natalie]

I don't know if I need another Tom Sandoval.

[E]

I don't think he would like me very much.

[Nick]

Yeah, probably not.

[E]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it would be reciprocated.

[Nick]

There's just.

[Natalie]

Honestly, nothing.

[E]

It would be reciprocated.

[Natalie]

There's nothing else to talk to Tom Sandoval about at this point. You know, I just.

[Nick]

I. You're not curious about his dynamic with his girlfriend?

[Natalie]

No, I don't give a. No.

[Nick]

Yeah, I really don't give a. I don't believe that.

[Justin]

Oh, wait, don't they live together?

[Nick]

They do. I don't know.

[Justin]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Does he still live in the house? Does he in the house?

[Justin]

I was under the impression that they were selling the house. I think Leia could have some more insight since it's in her neighborhood.

[E]

Yeah.

[Justin]

Is there a for sale sign?

[H]

I haven't seen him recently, so I don't know.

[Justin]

Is there a for sale sign in front of his house?

[Nick]

No.

[Justin]

So maybe it did sell, But I know that she bought a house and that he was moving in with her. Was the last update that they gave us.

[E]

He can't afford a house.

[G]

There's no Vanderpump next season for him. So.

[E]

Broke bitch.

[Natalie]

I'm sure.

[Nick]

I mean, honestly, though, when you. When you're used to getting whatever they made every year, that is a lot of money there. Sports.

[G]

And Sandy's is closing also.

[Justin]

Tom's kind of having a tough week. You're representing yourself in your legal case against Rachel. You just got in a fight with the girlfriend that you live with, so you might be homeless.

[Nick]

Maybe that's what they were fighting about. Maybe she was trying to give him sound legal advice. He's like, no, I got this.

[Justin]

I object.

[E]

Petition the court for my girlfriend to shut the hell up.

[G]

Did you guys see the drones in San Diego?

[Justin]

I did see.

[Nick]

I mean, I. No, I've not seen him in San Diego. Are they in San Diego now?

[G]

I saw that they were in San.

[E]

Diego, but they're in Jersey.

[G]

Well, maybe there are multiple spots.

[Natalie]

Oh, my gosh. Who is working these drones?

[Nick]

We don't know. That's a great mystery.

[Natalie]

So they're just like drones flying around cities and people are like, it's really giving.

[Nick]

It's giving independence.

[Natalie]

People don't think that it's some 14 year old boy in his backyard, like playing with a Christmas toy. It's like a bevy.

[Nick]

We don't know.

[Natalie]

It's a lot of them.

[Justin]

It's a cluster of large SUV sized drones.

[Natalie]

SUV size.

[Justin]

It's a class of teenage boys been seen hovering.

[Nick]

Listen, we don't know. I'm sorry. Go ahead, please.

[Justin]

No, it's okay. It's just that they've been cited hovering ominously over critical infrastructure and residential areas, power lines to reservoirs. And the Secretary of Homeland Security pretty much is saying that since they've allowed drones flying at night, that might be why. An uptick in sightings.

[Nick]

Huh?

[Justin]

But they still haven't given blame it.

[Nick]

On the techie dads.

[Justin]

And they still aren't giving us any clarity as to like, where they think they're coming from. Why so many? Why are they like forming structures in the sky? But nope, nobody cares who knows?

[Nick]

And we're not going to figure it out here, I think. Listen, there's probably, you're probably even surprised we're talking about this because I imagine there's many other shows and podcasts out there that are, are probably putting any type of political or whatever spin on this topic, as most do. This is just a reminder here, people, that whenever the end of the world happens, and who knows, maybe it's because of these flying saucers in the sky, or maybe it's a hundred thousand years from now.

[E]

Meteor.

[Nick]

Who knows? Every time there's like an end of the world movie. I, I was thinking about this last night with the drones. Maybe this is it. But honestly, if it is, what are we going to do about it?

[Justin]

Actually, take me out.

[Nick]

Let's listen to the show. Let's talk about the ultimatum. Let's talk about your favorite housewives. Let's just tune out. Out.

[E]

Honestly, this is your apocalypse soundtrack.

[Nick]

Yes.

[E]

Tune in now.

[Nick]

Like when it's the end of the world. Just listen to us because will there be a tomorrow? Will there not be? I don't know. But at least go out calm. Yeah, go out thinking about whether you're Team Brawn or Team Brittany. Like, not whether, like you're not going to stop the asteroid.

[E]

Like, honestly, I would prefer asteroid to drone.

[Nick]

If the aliens are smart enough to be here with drones, what are we going to do about it?

[G]

I also did confirm they've been spotted in San Diego as well.

[Nick]

I just like there. You know, there's just so much fear brewing around in our world today. People just spewing fear here and there and telling you to be afraid of this and tell you to be afraid of that. We're here to tell you not to be afraid. And just listen to us, you know, be not afraid, because what are you going to do about it? Nothing. So just unplug, turn off your brain. Enjoy us, because we're here not to scare you.

[Justin]

Worrying and stress causes cancer. So, I mean, so true, honestly.

[Natalie]

Hey, you want to go at the.

[Justin]

End of the world with that, too?

[Nick]

Yeah, let's all consider cancer. You're going to die of the aliens. So, like, what are you going to do about it?

[Justin]

Enjoy your life?

[Natalie]

Like a better death.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

So we're. We're here to just. Whatever you're worrying about right now, whatever. Whatever got into your head today, whatever seed was planted that told you to worry, I'm telling you to not to, because we're here.

[E]

And listen to.

[Nick]

I did genuinely think the world was ending last night because my dog was.

[H]

Acting super suspicious and I was hearing.

[Natalie]

Noises, and I really thought it was it.

[Nick]

I mean, who knows?

[Natalie]

Well, I thought someone broke in to our house in the backyard because I heard a bang. And then, like, the dogs kind of, like, chirped up. And then I was like, nick, did someone break in? And I turned around and he had headphones in, and I was like, perfect. I'm gonna die.

[Nick]

It was our neighbor on a ladder.

[Natalie]

It was our neighbor on the ladder.

[Nick]

Well, listen, listen. I think the point still stands. Why? Why? Enjoy your last remaining moments in this universe listening to people on a podcast telling you to be scared.

[E]

Yeah, yeah.

[Nick]

No. And these last remaining moments, you need to decide whether it was Brawin or Britney who was right or wrong.

[Natalie]

Selena Gomez is engaged.

[Nick]

Selena Gomez. Gomez is gays.

[Natalie]

She's what?

[Nick]

Selena Gomez is.

[E]

Wow, you really just stole that center right there. Sorry, Natalie. Had that teed up perfectly.

[Natalie]

We guess Selena Gomez is engaged to Benny Blanco. And it. You know, people are having some questions, mainly because it looked like he proposed on a set. There also was Taco Bell laying around perfectly, like, staged with the branding facing the camera. So they're like, is it an ad for Taco Bell? Were you on set for a Taco Bell commercial?

[Nick]

Did Taco Bell like, is she really not engaged?

[Natalie]

She really got engaged.

[Nick]

She said the ring so that we're not. We're not confused about that.

[Natalie]

No, no, no, no, no. It's just like, why is there Taco Bell?

[Nick]

Two birds, one stone. I love it. Yeah.

[Natalie]

Also, I think a lot of people are pissed off because we're mad at her. She got a marquee woman Live. She got a marquee diamond as her engagement ring.

[Nick]

Is that bad?

[Natalie]

It's like a diamond type of shape. And. No, but it's like, that was a very. I think the. The women who wanted the marquee diamond are now like, you made it mainstream. Like, she made it the new oval, which Haley Bieber made.

[Heidi Gardner]

Oval.

[Natalie]

Oval.

[Nick]

Oh, you guys, shut up.

[Natalie]

And people are now like, shut the fuck up.

[Nick]

Selena Gomez is the queen.

[Justin]

Stole your diamond shoes.

[Nick]

I'm sorry. Shut up. Selena Gomez is not allowed to have taste during her engagement.

[E]

She's not.

[Nick]

She's supposed to get something she doesn't like out of fear of making that thing mainstream.

[E]

I don't think you understand. Anytime Selena Gomez is the queen of literally doing nothing and then everyone being like, you're awful, we hate you.

[G]

I want to clarify, too. The Marquis diamond is a reference to her song good for you, where she says, I'm a marquee diamond. So that's why.

[E]

So she's been on it.

[G]

It was an homage to, like, her music history and, like, what she wants and how she sees herself.

[Justin]

So it's like a beautiful.

[G]

Exactly.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[E]

I will defend Selena Gomez until the day.

[Nick]

So let me get this straight. Let me get this straight. There's a bunch of ladies out there who are up in arms because they're upset that Selena Gomez took their super secret idea and made it popular.

[E]

Super secret idea.

[Natalie]

Well, she hasn't made it pop because it just happened. But, you know, as soon as Hailey Bieber posted her massive, gigantic oval ring, then that was like, oval is still to this day, like the most common shape.

[Nick]

But for all the people who, like, made it popular, it's just like, it's like, here's a perfect example. We named our daughter River. You may have. May or not have heard that. And when we came up with River's name, we were like, oh, that's pretty cool. Kind of gifts. Giving. Unique. It's giving original.

[E]

Not unique, but like, cute cute.

[Nick]

Like, not out there. Not like afternoon.

[Natalie]

But I also. But I also was like, there's, you know, from the south, there's a lot of boys named river or Rivers.

[Nick]

Turns out river very common. One of the most popular names of the year, mostly for the boys. But my point being is it was already popular. We just didn't know about it. Turns out there were a lot of parents with babies cooking in the bellies being like, how about River? And they were like, great. You know what I'm saying? And now we all became aware it's popular and this is just Selena Gomez getting engaged in all the. In all the secret ring that everyone's, like, thinks. It's like, I'm the one who's getting this, and no one's going to be talking about this. Turns out you all like the same shit.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Nick]

And. And Selena Gomez just made you aware. You're. You're basic. Yeah. Turns out you're basic and you're not special and let Selena live.

[Natalie]

But there's also so many of these women upset that it's, like, not unique.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Like, you're not special.

[E]

No.

[Natalie]

Like, you thought you were the only one that was going to be upset.

[Nick]

Nope.

[Natalie]

Turns out you're among friends.

[E]

You're not.

[Nick]

You're. You're. You're basically.

[E]

You're basic. You're just jealous that she's on a show with Martin Short and Steve Martin and gets to hang out with Martin Short and Meryl Streep, and they're all probably gonna be at their wedding, and that's why you're jealous. And I've even forgiven Selena Gomez for being in a show with my two favorite old men. And if I can do that, then you guys can shut the fuck up.

[Justin]

There's also, like, 25 different, like, diamond cuts, and there's about five that are prevalent and 15 undiscovered.

[Natalie]

It's like, if you want to be different today, bitch, get around. Get around. Because no one. No one has around these days.

[Nick]

Say that.

[Heidi Gardner]

I do.

[Justin]

There you go.

[Nick]

There you go.

[Natalie]

Be like Leia.

[Justin]

Be different.

[E]

Yeah.

[Justin]

There's triangle. Never seen a triangle one before.

[Natalie]

Go on. You know, maybe go.

[E]

Go gender neutral. Get a band.

[Natalie]

Get a colored diamond.

[Nick]

Ooh.

[Justin]

But you're also upset that, like, the most followed person on Instagram posts their engagement ring when they get proposed to, and it's like, oh, she stole my. Like, from who?

[Heidi Gardner]

Who.

[Justin]

Who did she take your thunder from?

[Heidi Gardner]

You know what I mean?

[Natalie]

Read your mind and, like, went into your phone notes app where you have, like, dream wedding engagement ring, like, listed.

[Heidi Gardner]

She.

[Nick]

She found that you got the idea from another influencer that you forgot about because you saw it online, it was probably Selena Gomez, and you just, like, blacked out and forgot and decided it was your original.

[Natalie]

They heard I'm a marquee diamond, and.

[Justin]

They were like, oh, my God, I'm a marquee diamond.

[E]

I'm a marquee diamond diamond. To be mad at Selena Gomez is such loser behavior.

[Justin]

Someone else bought her.

[Nick]

Literally.

[Justin]

Like, come on now.

[H]

Do you know who else is basic? Who?

[Nick]

Chapel Ron's Dad, I love that. I honestly, I saw that this morning. Chaperone did carpool karaoke with her parents. And my biggest takeaway is her dad's wearing a Patagonia fleece. It's giving Midwest basic dead love.

[G]

You say Patagonia so bougie. Say it.

[Natalie]

He says, he pronounces, like, every letter.

[Nick]

How I'm pronouncing it is I start it because I think I know how it's said, and then I just kind of mumble through the rest.

[Natalie]

It's like, I feel like he went to Dick's Sporting Goods and, like, he bought this jacket along with some, like, other random man shit.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

And. And. And Chapel's like, hey, dad, we're gonna go do car karaoke. And he just grabbed the old reliable fleece, zipped it up, got in the car. He could go to Costco and fit right in.

[G]

Her whole family is normal. I'll never forget, during COVID when Chapel was released from her record label, she worked at a storebucks.

[Nick]

I did not know that.

[G]

In the Midwest.

[Nick]

She's immediately my favorite celebrity.

[E]

She's just like me. She is just like you.

[Natalie]

Do y'all work together?

[E]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

Perfect.

[Nick]

She is one of the hottest music stars in the world right now, and so am I. And you are one of the new upand cominging podcasters on the biggest podcast.

[H]

Literally, in the world.

[Nick]

Basically the same.

[G]

Chapel did do an interview recently too, where she said that, like, she clarified Chapel, Ron is a character, and she can't always play that character because it is tiring.

[E]

Exactly how I feel on this spot.

[G]

There is a person and her family is very normal.

[Natalie]

Weird.

[E]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Did you see what Paris Hilton has done?

[Nick]

Good things.

[Natalie]

She has done great things. Justin, break it down for us.

[G]

So we know for a while she had a documentary in 2020 where she basically talked about the child camps that she was sent to. But recently, she on a unanimous vote in the US Senate, she got her Stop Institutional Child Abuse bill passed. So now it has to go through the House of Reps. She's like, it's our responsibility as adults to not put our children in the hands of. Of people that are exploiting children for money.

[Nick]

What's fucking crazy is the acknowledgement that these, like, for profit businesses that are, have been created to discipline undisciplined children have not been regulated. That's fucking crazy. How are they allowed to. Like, they're private, right? I mean, a lot of things that are private are still regulated. You know, there are still rules of things you can't do anything that involves kids is fucking crazy.

[Justin]

No, I remember seeing those, like, watching Mori show when I was younger, and it would always be like one of those episodes where it's like, bad kids or whatever, and sending them to these correctional facilities where they're getting screamed at, treated like they're in prison and they're 13, like, made to cry. And I'm just like, how is this.

[Nick]

We do not protect our kids, not abuse nearly enough.

[G]

Well, and like, Paris has been vulnerable and I think it's her strength in, like, talking about this because she also talks, as the Hilton family in general has spoken on it, saying, like, they thought that this was helping Paris once they realized retrospectively what was happening.

[Nick]

It's exact opposite now when you think about it, too. Right. So you get these misbehaved kids, whatever you want to call it, you ship them off to this place. You're shipping off kids who are already, quote, unquote, troublemakers. Right. And so I'm assuming when the kids come back and maybe report whatever actions that are going on behind closed doors, you would, you know, less likely to believe the troublemakers, so to speak. Oh, we're going to believe the. The people in authority and stuff like that. Good for Paris, man.

[Heidi Gardner]

Good.

[Nick]

Good for Paris.

[Natalie]

Makes you want to, like, hug your babies and, like, you know.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Protect them at all costs. Same thing with the whole, like, we don't need to get into it because it's, you know, been talked about everywhere. But the Hannah nurse. Hannah. Hannah Bill.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

I don't know her last name, but the girl who, like, started the 17 diapers trend, and, like, hers was about leaving 17 diapers around because I think she was probably lazy. And us mothers being like, you're not alone. Here's my take on 17 diapers. I did this, like, and she, you know, has been. There's people that are looking into all her videos where she's just, like, denied her kid food. She's said, like, it's 30 degrees, he needs a jacket, but I can't afford this $35 jacket. Then her next video is trying the $50 sandwich from Subway and then saying that she doesn't change his diapers when he pees because, you know, diapers are expensive. And then posting here's a stuff about the father, the video of him flinching. It's just like, seeing stuff is just so heartbreaking. And it's like, I just can't.

[Nick]

I mean, you know, I think if you have 17 dirty diapers lying around, I think it's Safe to say someone's not helping out.

[Natalie]

Someone's definitely not helping out.

[Nick]

Protect the kids. Protect the kids.

[Natalie]

Really quick. I just opened Instagram and I see that Luigi assassin who killed the CEO of United Healthcare, his grandmother left family members millions with the stipulation so long that they didn't commit crimes.

[Nick]

Oh, someone's not getting his inheritance.

[Natalie]

Looks like he won't be getting his millions, but he probably couldn't use them anyways while being in prison.

[Nick]

I think it's a real sad story about this guy. Obviously, it's a mental health issue we.

[Natalie]

Talked about a lot with Michael Rapaport.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

In last week's episode.

[Nick]

Anyway, that does it for household end lines, though. Let's we're getting into the Ultimatum now. We have a great show lined up for you. We got Zaina from the Ultimatum calling in in just a bit. Heidi Garner from SNL joins us as well to get to all things Bravo. She's a big Bravo fan.

[E]

She is.

[Nick]

Plus she's crushing life on snl. Excited to have her on. Before we get to the rest of our show, just know that we have an excellent, exciting, amazing. Going Deeper. The iconic, the one and only Mary is geeking out. Yes. Meredith Marks is with us in studio tomorrow for Going Deeper. It's going to be an incredible episode. I don't even know what to expect.

[E]

Dispelling all the rumors and the nasty about what you've heard about her.

[Nick]

It's gonna be great. Can't wait. What didn't we get to talk about on Household Headlines that we'll talk about on POP Extra behind Vile Files.

[G]

Plus, this week we have Madonna resharing AI generated photos of her and the pope. Tesla's optimus robots are learning to walk down slopes. Craig and Austin opened their new restaurant, by the way. And then we have Ms. Patricia posting a TikTok of her cane tour that she does not have to use.

[Nick]

That and so much more. That'll be on Friday on POP Extra. All right. Right.

[Natalie]

Vibes versus Stats.

[Nick]

This Vibes versus Stats segment of the VI is brought to you by Wonderful Pistachios. Wonderful pistachios with no shells come in a variety of flavors including chili roasted honey roasted sea salt and vinegar, smoky barbecue, sea salt and pepper, jalapeno lime, and the newest seasonal limited time edition sweet cinnamon with a wide range of flavors. There's a wonderful pistachios product for everyone. They're perfect for your game time gatherings or for taking with you on the go. Visit wonderful pistachios.com to learn more.

[Natalie]

Did we win?

[Justin]

Did we lose?

[E]

What's happening? We did, you know, 50, 50 Steelers lost us. So didn't we pick that for you? Yeah, but I just really wanted emotional support in that moment, and obviously I needed it. So. Sorry. But thank you for the support.

[Natalie]

Of course.

[Nick]

They didn't do well, Mary.

[E]

No, didn't do well at all. They didn't.

[Justin]

Pour a little salt on that wound.

[Nick]

I mean, it.

[E]

It's.

[Nick]

I was. I mean, I know I picked the Eagles, but I was. I was in my heart.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[E]

You don't want any NFC team to win.

[Nick]

I don't know. I was. So I was personally rooting for the. The Steelers.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

And they couldn't do it.

[E]

No, they couldn't. And let's not talk about that anymore. The Bengals won, which is good. Joe Burrow needed this, so shout out. So vibes went in that. So you picked the Titans to round some things out. So you lose that one, we go one on one. We're one and one. So vibes are. Vibes are at nine and 17.

[Nick]

Perfect.

[E]

And stats are at 14 and 12.

[Nick]

Okay.

[H]

So.

[Natalie]

Okay. We're right on your tail.

[E]

We're right on your tail. Crazier things have happened.

[Nick]

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[Natalie]

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[Natalie]

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[Natalie]

Scotty and Junior.

[Justin]

Yeah, for sure.

[Nick]

Okay.

[Natalie]

Junior needs to be humbled like he thinks he is the hottest shit to ever walk planet Earth.

[Heidi Gardner]

Earth.

[Natalie]

And like he's definitely handsome. He's, he's attractive as soon as he opens his mouth. He's the ugliest human being I've ever seen. He's the worst personality I think I've ever seen on a television show.

[Heidi Gardner]

Wow.

[Nick]

The amount of delusion, I wouldn't disagree.

[Natalie]

I mean, so does Scotty.

[H]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Yeah, Scotty's terrifying.

[E]

I would take Junior over Scotty, though. Scotty, like, Junior is just, like, obsessed with himself. And it's. I feel like it's. He's. Junior is not going to gaslight and manipulate you the way Scotty is going.

[Nick]

To disagree more, I think. I think in terms of who's more dangerous, I think jr. JR is more dangerous than Scotty. Scotty, like, he definitely is giving problematic and a little reactive, but he's also like, Scotty reminds me of those guys. Or, like, you know, even watching the show, it's just like, I always try, especially when it comes to reality tv, because obviously we love to jump to conclusions and make, like, you know, really sharp reactions. But, like, it is reality tv. Everything's heightened. When I see these moments, I do like to remind myself that, like, at our worst, we've all been these people, versions of these people. We just have. We've been manipulative, we've been reactive. You know, when it's caught on, we have. If we're all being honest with ourselves, we've all demonstrated certain behaviors that all of these people on these shows have demonstrated. That being said. Yeah. No, I think Scotty. Scotty reminds me of the guy who really wants to be a good. Like, Scotty gives a shit about being a good boyfriend, but he's so reactive and so insecure. I feel like him and Aria got together because, like. And she mentioned this. Like, she has, like, she talked about bad boyfriends before Scotty. And it seems like she met Scotty at a time where she was like, fuck boy after fuck boy boy situation, ship after situationship. And then here she met this guy who was very intentional and very much like, I'll show up. And, like, Scotty reminds of that guy who's just, like. He thinks showing up is all that matters. And because he shows up so much that he's constantly here, he's constantly going to remind his partner what she's doing wrong. And it's just like. And I think what's so interesting about that relationship, I think Aria can't figure out why she's so miserable in this relationship because she's in a relationship with a guy who, like, she's kind of told herself, like, he's, you know, so many green flags. At first he shows up and he's considered, and he talks about doing this, and he talks about being intentional, you know, and boyfriends before her were just like, yeah, you know, I'll call you in a couple days, you know, like, you know what I'm saying? So compared to that, she really liked that he was like showing up, but, like, everything that she does, quote, unquote, wrong in Scotty's eyes. He's always like, he's always criticizing her under the guise of how to be a better partner and we have to be better in this relationship. And he always centers their relationship as a way to like, guilt our Daria. And I think she can't figure out why she's so miserable because he's like, quote unquote saying the right things in terms of like giving a. About a relationship. But he's so like, he just puts her down and constantly belittles her and tells her what she's doing wrong that. You know what I'm saying? Like, we're like, you've been in these relationships where it's just like he says nobody cares because he cares about us and he cares about the relationship. But he's always just like nitpicking and.

[Justin]

Just because she cried about that.

[Heidi Gardner]

Right.

[Justin]

And she was saying that, like, I feel like no matter how much work I put forward, you only acknowledge or tell me the things that I'm doing wrong. And it's like, that is probably one of the most irritating people to be in a relationship with.

[Nick]

I do think Scotty though, to why I disagree with you is I think eventually he at least is willing to apologize. Scotty will apologize. I think he.

[Natalie]

I don't think at all.

[Justin]

He apologizes apologize ever.

[Nick]

He.

[Justin]

He explains why he's.

[Natalie]

He apologized on when we interviewed him because he had watched it back and he had probably had conversations with Arya in real life. I don't think he gives a. About her or anyone. I think he is. Is to watch. I don't know him in real life. He could be great in real life to watch. He is scary.

[Nick]

Maybe I mean, for doctor Just to mean seems so disconnected and delusional where he.

[E]

But you can clock that a lot easier. That's. I think that's what I mean by Scotty puts up a way better front than Junior does. Junior, like, pretty immediately you're like, okay.

[Justin]

Scotty can explain his behavior. Junior doesn't feel like he needs to.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Yeah. The way Scotty explains his behavior, though, is very like. No, no, no. Like, the way that you see it is wrong. Let me give you the actual. And it's just like a completely different off topic reason as to why he's doing something. And so it's like, no one's right about him.

[Nick]

Yeah, Scotty always does that. It's like, he doesn't. It's right. He does. He's like, so, yeah, I mean, I did that, but I did that because blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, contacts.

[Justin]

He always keeps up bringing up context that's not shown.

[E]

And it's like, the context is that, like, Aria always see. Sees that I'm like, could be doing something better. I could. And there are a lot of things I could be doing better. But in this single, it's just like, dude, shut up. And at least Junior isn't saying much. You know, I would take, like, versus, like, shut the hell up.

[Nick]

Yeah, maybe Junior just. Something about Junior just gives me weird.

[Justin]

He has religious trauma, and Junior doesn't take responsibility either. In a completely different way. Like, his excuses being. Being like, I am committed to this experiment or whatever it may be. It's like, homeboy, I don't know that you and your person, you and Zaina had an agreement to this level.

[Natalie]

That's also. And I think everyone. I hate when people do this, but I'm gonna do it right now. I think everyone watching can agree that, like, we don't give a fuck if you're, like, taking the experiment seriously. It's like that, you know, like, we're.

[E]

Suspending our disbelief for television.

[Natalie]

Yeah. Like, they keep saying this as if it's like, some sort of excuse to get out of bad behavior. It's like, well, I am taking this experiment seriously, and, like, I'm trying to, like, get the most out of this experiment. And it's like, this is your girlfriend of three years.

[E]

Is that. Is that the Ultimatums version of the Bachelor? Like, he's not here for the right.

[Nick]

Reasons, but to Natalie's point, it's like there's embracing the experience and there's being Junior. Yeah, that's the problem. Bothers me about Junior so much. Compared to Sandy. I. Yeah, it's just maybe, like, Sandy is faking accountability. I don't know. But with Junior, it's just like he. He seems to believe his delusion about, like, the seriousness of this experiments. Like, with Junior, he seems to have this, like, blank look on his face where he, like, he seems to be incapable of understanding anyone's point of view but his. At least Sandy seems to be able to fake empathy.

[Natalie]

I don't know. Sandy at that table, Sandy at the change.

[Nick]

I don't know. Maybe I'm just blinded by my. My disdain For Junior.

[Natalie]

Hold on. Two completely different people. When we had Sandy at the changeover, being like Nick, he tormented me. He neglected me, he disrespected me. He attacked me. He loved bomb me. Like, the longest list of terrible things someone can do to you.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

And then, like, they're right back at home, and she's hugging him, she's kissing. That's not someone who's. Torment.

[Nick]

Torment. Sorry.

[Natalie]

I'm not hugging the man who's tormented.

[Justin]

For me every week, crying in bed, looking at their dog, but being like, there's something I have to tell you.

[Heidi Gardner]

Like.

[Natalie]

Like, that was insane to me. I did think it was funny how she's, like, sobbing, crying. I don't know if anyone else caught this, but Junior goes to, like, reach for his handkerchief to give to her, and Nick clocks that he's, like, doing that, and he gets it out faster and hands it to her. And the look on Junior's face that he couldn't give her that tissue before Nick could. It was like someone kicked his dog.

[Nick]

I want to see what Nick's ex girlfriends look like.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Because their relationship just gives Sandy's the hottest girl he's ever dated. And their relationship gives that both Nick and Sandy are on the same page, and that is that Sandy can do better than Nick, and Nick's never done better than Sandy. That's how they both kind of operate this relationship.

[E]

So his insecurity is just, like, bringing out the worst.

[Nick]

Well, that. But she's also like, their whole relationship is what Nick needs to do better. Like, their whole relationship is about Nick stepping up and proving his love to Sandy. And I. I. There's either we're missing something from editing or whatever, but, like, Nick clearly seems to have his issues. But, like, the. The. The amount of apologizing Nick has to do for whatever Sandy's doing. Her ability to gaslight him is shocking.

[Justin]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Like, in a way that I've never. It's like, no matter what, it's just like eventually he's apologizing for something she did.

[Natalie]

Like, I need him to stick to whatever it is that he believes. It's like he is passionate about something. And then five seconds later, he's like, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I shouldn't have said that. I shouldn't have done this. And it's like, well, okay, but let's stop what you. I feel like you don't owe an apology right now.

[G]

Like, Cindy did say that. Like, before the experience, I went from him neglecting her to like, the second they got there, he was love bombing her.

[Natalie]

So that part is like, that feels valid, right? Like you're in this relationship. I guess I don't really understand the part if, like, he's neglecting her, but he also wants to marry her. It's like, how. I guess two things can be true at once, but I get that, like, he's not present, he doesn't see her, and then they go experiment and she's like, with this other guy. And he's all of a sudden like, holy fuck. You know, he wants what he can't have. Totally understand that that's possible.

[Nick]

But again, all we've seen this season is her figure out a way to blame him for her shit. So, like, I. I have. I don't know what to trust in terms of what the relationship was prior to this experiment.

[Natalie]

They have not been clear on the. What is the attacking. What is the. What has he been doing? Because if it's just texting you and.

[Justin]

Calling you while he's having a mental breakdown because he misses you.

[Nick]

Yeah. That seemed to be the only thing referring to is his quote, unquote behavior during the experiment when she was a floor above you sleeping in a bed with another fucking guy and like.

[Justin]

And telling you to go home instead of having a conversation with you, but claiming that she wants to be with you.

[Nick]

That's the thing that we're talking about. It's like, huh.

[Natalie]

I am excited to ask Zaina if she has any insight on that.

[H]

I also do want to say one thing. Something that pisses me off so much is when somebody trying to apologize and the person that they're apologizing to just keeps saying what they did wrong. And this happens with both Junior and Scotty, with Nick trying to apologize to Junior and he's just like sitting there.

[Natalie]

With his arms and he's like, well.

[H]

But then you did this, this and this. And Nick is like, I'm trying.

[Natalie]

I said, sorry.

[H]

And the same thing happens with Scotty and Aria.

[Justin]

But even the flipping of the script where it's like, okay, sure, you took the experiment seriously, Sandy. But then I'm like, even the conversation of what was done and the fact that Nick had to find out out about the second kiss or whatever through Zaina, and then she's like, I would. I was gonna tell you just like after we're done filming, after we're engaged.

[Nick]

Their last night for. Because also when they talk about how many kisses there were, they refer, they say, still lying. They say the word peck right yeah, they use the word peck to describe a kiss, so that tells me they're clocking each individual peck. And if we're clocking each individual peck, then their last night, they kiss each other twice in a matter of 12 seconds. Yeah, it was kiss. And then she went in for another kiss. There were. So now we're. They've kissed several times, and we're to believe that they only kissed on camera.

[Natalie]

But they're also saying Nick and Zana are referring to, like, a hot tub kiss.

[Nick]

Right.

[Natalie]

A jacuzzi kiss, I think. Sandy. We didn't see that one. We saw the one at the table before the. When the dating was happening, when they were just picking who they wanted.

[G]

They did kiss in the pool. We did, too.

[Natalie]

Kisses.

[E]

Yeah, they had. They had sex.

[Natalie]

I think they had sex too.

[Nick]

But, yeah, there's no ass. Even if they didn't. Let's say. Let's. Let's give them the benefit even if they didn't have sex. You mean to tell me in, like, after all the rubbing up and all that stuff and the cameras. Wifey and all the wifey talk.

[Natalie]

Ass smacking.

[Nick]

Ass smacking that when the cameras left, they just went to bed?

[E]

Yeah.

[Justin]

It's hard to believe.

[Natalie]

If you're gonna tell me what I cannot wear, you better be fucking me.

[Justin]

Literally.

[Natalie]

Like, you have, like, why would you tell me, like, you can't wear that without me if, like, we're just pecking? You think you've that control over me if we're just pecking? Yep. Bizarre.

[Justin]

And if you're gonna lie about how many times that you kissed or pecked, like, what else would you lie about?

[E]

Also the audacity to lie when you have kissed multiple times in front of cameras on a show that everyone will see.

[Natalie]

It's like, at least just say you don't know. It's like, how many times? Honestly can' remember.

[E]

I don't. I do not recall.

[Natalie]

Because Giving a number and then being wrong about that number.

[Justin]

Also tidbit. Love is blind. Same show. Take note because they had security cameras in the rooms. So we got to see. We got to see the stuff that. Like the conversations that happened when cameras weren't there. Why don't you do that for Love is Blind?

[G]

I think Sandy loves.

[Nick]

They made a creative choice.

[G]

Yeah.

[Justin]

They added that. Is that new?

[Nick]

No. My understanding is of whatever reason they do that for the ultimatum, and for whatever reason, they don't do it for Love is blind. I don't. Apparently I don't. There's a reason I Don't agree with the reason.

[Heidi Gardner]

Same.

[Nick]

But that is a creative choice.

[G]

I was gonna say I think Sandy loves Nick and just doesn't want to hurt him. So she's like withholding the truth. Which is wrong. Which is wrong.

[Nick]

What do you mean loves him?

[G]

Like her waiting to say that she kissed Junior multiple times.

[Nick]

I hate that you were.

[Justin]

If you love someone, you wouldn't kiss somebody else and then have to hurt them.

[Nick]

This whole thing, like I didn't tell you because I don't want to hurt you. I. I didn't tell you because you would be mad. I didn't tell you because of the way you reacted to it last time. Again, she's always blaming. It's always Nick's fault.

[G]

But it's a common.

[Nick]

That's not love.

[G]

But it's a common thing where you and I'm not saying I've done it or that a lot of people do it, but like where people say like I cared so much about them that I didn't want to tell them the truth to hurt them because it would hurt them.

[Nick]

That's not why. That's not. No. They didn't care about themselves. They didn't want to feel guilty and they didn't want to be the bad guy and they didn't want to be in trouble.

[Natalie]

That's the truth behind it. But he's saying a lot of people use that excuse as to why.

[Nick]

And that part where she's crying in bed and he's like, is it me or is it something else? I mean, Nick, trust your gut.

[Heidi Gardner]

But.

[Nick]

But like she's crying because she feels bad cuz she hates you and she doesn't. You give her the ick and she doesn't know how to tell you. My God. When he's just like, grow a pair, Nick. I mean, when I say that, Nick. And I say that knowing that when I watch I 20 something year old me has. Was. Was that guy who just thought I could just. I. I don't know. I didn't have any backbone anyways. When he's like, I love you so much. The dis. She's disrespecting him so much and all he can do is just get on a knee and say how sorry and how much he loves. Loves her. That is not how you get someone to respect you. He's doing everything wrong. I mean, and, and I say that having done everything wrong in the past.

[Natalie]

But like I also don't think we can say that Sandy loves him when she's sitting at a table in front of all these people, in front of all these cameras and accusing this person she loves of attacking her. Those are strong words. Attack, torment.

[E]

She is using inflammatory words.

[Natalie]

Those are huge words. And you don't like.

[Nick]

She said them the same sentence.

[Justin]

Yeah.

[Nick]

And she constantly talks about Nick. Constantly.

[Justin]

His art, what he's passionate about, him crying, whatever it may be. And it's just kind of like. Yeah, but you are the source of this pain.

[Nick]

I don't know who hates Nick more, Sandy or Nick.

[Justin]

Well, I feel like Sandy or Junior.

[E]

No, no, no.

[Justin]

Oh, Dick hates himself.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

You. There's got to be some self hate. Yeah. To allow someone to treat you that way.

[E]

Do you think that Nick kind of objectifies Sandy?

[Nick]

No more than Sandy objectifies herself.

[E]

Yeah, but do you think that's, like, the core of a lot of the. Of a lot of the issues of, like, he's seeing her more as, like.

[Natalie]

Definitely no more than J. R. Yeah.

[E]

Which I don't think it's specifically Nick, but it's like he's, like, trying to win this thing and prove that he can have someone as beautiful as Sandy. And by doing that, he's just breaking himself down.

[Justin]

And this is not a criticism to Sandy, but I also do feel like when it's like, leading with sexuality or being like, I'm Scorpio, so I'm good in bed. Like, it's like, kind of like, what do you think that that's implying?

[E]

Yeah, I don't mean. I don't mean this as having anything to do with Sandy. I'm just thinking of, like, how Nick views Sandy and how that, like, ends up reflecting on the way he treats himself in order to obtain Sandy.

[Nick]

Well, I don't think.

[E]

Versus, like, actually caring.

[Nick]

I think Nick's convinced himself that he, like, likes Sandy's personality and loves her heart. You know what I'm saying? Like, I don't think he's a way aware that. And again, who knows? We. We. We know so little about their actual relationship, but everything we're seeing about their relationship gives that, like, there's not a lot of respect going on there. And that she acts like she's out of his league and. And he acts like he's out of her league.

[Natalie]

Let's ask Zaina about it.

[Nick]

Yeah, Zaina is here already. Let's bring her up. Let's give her. Let's. Yeah, let's get Zaina's thoughts and feelings on this whole. Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

Hi.

[Nick]

How are you?

[H]

I'm doing pretty okay.

[Nick]

Well, you're easily. You're my favorite person on this show by a mile.

[E]

Mine as well.

[Nick]

Yeah, by a mile. You're great. In a sea of people who are not. Anyways, how. How has this whole experience been for you?

[H]

I just want to say thank God for my therapist, because if it wasn't for her, I don't know how I would be as sane as I am today. But the overall experience was just, like, really crazy because I went all. I was ready to, you know, do the experiment with Junior and see where we could go. But I was also very adamant about what I needed, and I was just, you know, met with a lot of lies from all in.

[Nick]

Yeah, let's. Can we talk about all in for a second? Because watching this whole show, Natalie references early, before you jumped on, when J.R. or anyone else on the show talks about how serious they're taking this experience or how all in they are. My prom as a viewer, I'm watching this, and I'm, like, saying, great for taking. You know, you got to embrace the experience. I'm all for that. But, like, where did you. I guess I'm curious the conversations that you and Junior had prior to going into this experiment, because I'm thinking you should be able to embrace this experiment and. And get the most out of it that the experiment brings you and still be able to respect your partner that you came into the show with. The way Junior talked about, like, Sandy, as if, like, she was literally his wife. And I'm just curious for you, like, what were your expectations going into the show? And you seem like you embrace the experiment as well. At the same time, you were able to respect Junior and yourself.

[H]

How did you see it before we did the experiment? Like, first and foremost, I was a little hesitant because I was just, like, nervous about it. It's like, all right, we're putting ourselves out there. And he reassured me that our relationship had a strong enough foundation to withstand the experiment. And he didn't want to go through, like, any, like, boundaries and things like that. But I left that with. We would still have mutual respect. Like, if you love me as deeply as you say you love me, you can go through this experiment and still respect me bare minimum. So the Junior that you guys see during dating week, dating Sandy, I've never met him. My friends and family watching this who have actually spent time with him, jaw to the ground, we're like, who is this person that he decided to be for the sake of this experiment? The way he was with Sandy was honestly, honestly, like, kind of the way he was with me. In our honeymoon phase, like, minus, like the overly sexualization, like, that is crazy. And I've never heard any of those things come out of his mouth before. But, like, the flattery, the lovey dovey physical touch, you're the, you're the best one dressed here. I've never been as vulnerable as anyone else before. Like, he said all of those same things to me. So the fact that he was doing all of that while it was being filmed in 4K, okay. And never came clean to me is like absolutely ridiculous. Like, I found out about everything, watching it back with y'all.

[Nick]

That's crazy.

[Natalie]

So he never came clean about. I mean, I think we just counted. I think we as the viewer saw at least four kisses on screen and he. You just watched that back. He never admitted to how many or what they did.

[Nick]

Never.

[H]

Or even the way he was acting, like, what he was saying. Like, none of that. Like, I found out about the kiss at the change over. Like, I tried my best to hold my composure, but when I tell you I was like steaming because it's after Girls Night with Sandy, I'm like, what the heck? We're all like, what's going on? He never said anything about it. And he also downplayed it. He said he wasn't attracted to Sandy. He said it was just a peck. She initiated it. It was just two. So in my head I'm thinking, like, okay, like, she just leaned in for a kiss. That's it. Like, I'm not seeing what all the other viewers are watching to see the drastic difference between, like, their connection and then like, ours.

[Nick]

And you're probably thinking there's not, there's no way he's going to lie about this because it's all on camera anyways. He's not that stupid at that.

[E]

In 4K.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

And then I think to have Sandy at Girls Night reassure you in a way of like, we're just friends. It's never been anything. What was that like? To clearly watch back, that she was lying.

[H]

Obviously they want us to keep everything very separate. I told production, I'm like, I need to have a conversation with Sandy or I'm going to have words with her off screen. So you either capture it or you don't. So we did film a scene that wasn't shown where she did kind of explain her pov. Like, she swears that they never did anything past the kiss. And she was trying to reassure me, girl to girl, that there wasn't anything there. They weren't leaving together. She's trying to make him a better person for me. All of the above.

[Nick]

So what. What she's trying to. She was doing you a favor. She said when she was like wigging up, wiggling her ass in the bed, just kind of up giving him.

[H]

It was like to then hear that back then and then see it in 4K once again. Because everything's captured in 4K. It's just been a lot to process and just really try to. Junior is a pathological liar. I'll just say that.

[Nick]

I think that's what's so scary about Junior. He's so calm and comfortable lying. Like, so calm he doesn't even look nervous.

[H]

I didn't see what was right in front of me. And that's the sad part. Like, obviously now I see a lot of things, but back then I was just being my normal self. I'm a giver. Everyone's talking about, why are you getting him gifts? Like, that's just my love language. And that's just how I love on like the people around me. So it's all just been so interesting to watch it all play.

[Natalie]

Back at the changeover, we heard Sandy accuse. Accuse Nick of some pretty intense things. She used very strong words against him, such as, you attacked me, you love bomb. Tormented, tormented, tormented me. Do you know of anything that had happened that, like, maybe we obviously as viewers aren't. You were there during the experiment because all that we are aware of is that he was texting and calling her a lot. Which as someone who was dating someone for three years, that feels normal. But I don't know if you know more.

[Nick]

Yeah, it looked like Sandy was tormenting Nick and then he was reacting to the torment.

[H]

But yeah, so I don't know a lot of details, but I do know that there was a lot of contact during. Like, obviously Nick was by himself and no one needed to be in that experiment, like, by themselves. Like, I'm sure he was going stir crazy and he actually found out about the kiss. Like, early on I was left in the dark, so I understood why he was just kind of spiraling, especially being by himself. But I remember Sandy telling me that, like, prior to the show, like, she did feel a lot of neglect in their relationship. So it's like, how do you go from neglect to now, like love bombing me and like doing all these things where it's like, you brought me here. So that's kind of where, from my perspective, where things landed with them, where she was just really confused by how he was acting or his reaction to.

[Nick]

What was going on back to Junior, I just want to just empathize with your situation because it must be a challenge to. To be with this man who his whole backstory was about the fact that he was cheated on and how his, you know, his ex wife, how poorly she treated him. And, like, he really paints himself as just trying to do good and have a warm heart and break his broken wings type of thing. It seems almost sinister to have this guy kind of weaponize his own pain and then, you know, do on to others the exact type of stuff that he talks about being the victim of. It must be kind of hard to watch for you.

[H]

Absolutely. It's diabolical. Like, I did nothing to Junior to ever get that reaction. Like, I just. To this day, I do not understand. I do not comprehend how he could do that to me. There are rumors going around, around that we're. We were in a fake relationship, obviously having some issues, but then for him to turn around and just, like, disrespect me with no regard, it's just, like, crazy to wrap my brain around.

[Nick]

How did you guys end up on the show? Because I am curious when, like, Sandy says things like, you brought me on this show, like, I kind of roll my eyes. It's like, you're all adults. You all signed up. You all sign your own individual contract. I am sure, I don't doubt that there was one person in the relationship that brought maybe the opportunity, the other person. But to me, it just seems like a. A cop out. It was. If Nick's dragged Sandy here and she had. She didn't want to. Like, you all wanted to be on tv, you know what I'm saying? Like, you all were aware of the benefits. Like, how do you see it? As someone who gave the ultimatum and things like that. Am I being too hard on Sandy when it comes to that, or do you see what I'm saying?

[H]

I've always said an ultimatum goes two ways. Someone has to issue it, and the other person has to accept it. In order to do a show like this, two willing participants have to be there. So with JR And I, ironically, there was, like, an ad that popped up that they were doing, like, the casting for our airline area. And I brought it up to him as a joke, and he was like, oh, we should apply. And at the time, obviously, when anyone's issued an ultimatum or that's on the table, there's a disconnect in the relationship, period. And I had felt a drift in our relationship in the months leading up to the experiment. So I thought Junior's, like, enthusiasm to wanting to do the show was him, like, actually prioritizing our relationship. I'm like, finally, like, there was discrepancies on social media and posting and he wanted to, like, not have me on his page and stuff. So I was like, wow, to go from that to now doing a global streamer show. Like, now you're trying to show the world that we're in this relationship and we can actually work on it. So.

[Natalie]

Did he ever show any signs of any shadiness or anything before? Like, this show had just, like, in the three years of your relationship?

[H]

I would say the first two years were very, like, honeymoon phase and very like, all. All in. I think when he made a transition from corporate to doing fitness full time and wanted to, like, build his brand as like a fitness influencer is when things started going downhill. And this was all leading up to the experiment. So he took me to Jamaica for my birthday in March of last year, and then I had him all over my page. Like, I can go to my archived photos in Instagram and show you guys, like, where he was on my page. When we got back from that trip, he asked me to stop commenting on his post because people will click on my page and then see him. And he wanted to be perceived as single in order to build his brand. And that was like a huge argument because I'm like, I understand building a brand and having things separate. If you had a candle line, don't post a girl. Like, it makes sense, but your DMs better not be like, you're single. So for me, like, that was like, where the disconnect started because I was like, well, what are your intentions, like, with wanting to be perceived as safe single? And that's when I think that's where he calls me petty. Like, petty zay. I ended up, like, archiving all of our photos because I'm like, it's not a two way. It's a two way street. Like, I'm not about to have you on my page. And you're now ask me not to comment as your girlfriend, short of you.

[Nick]

Being in sex work, I can't think.

[Justin]

Of a one job.

[Nick]

I can't think of a profession that you need to where people would be.

[Natalie]

Like, I was gonna work with him, but he has a girlfriend. Yeah, go. I'm not gonna book this trainer.

[Justin]

And like, you're a male personal trainer, which means I'm assuming that most of your clients are gonna be guys that wanna look like you.

[Natalie]

Or also the gym we wanna go and work out. We don't wanna be fucking hit on. So, you know what? The fact that you have a girlfriend, I feel safer.

[Justin]

Right.

[H]

Well, that was honestly, like. That was when I feel, like, the pivotal point when things started going downhill, which was like, six months ish into doing the Ultimatum. So when people are like, ooh, it looks like a disconnect, like, yeah, there was a lot of, like, disconnect in our relationship. And I was like, let's do this and, like, figure out, like, let's get to the bottom of everything and talk it through.

[Natalie]

Maybe it was a little harsh, but I said that J. R needs to be humbled. I think he is attractive, but as soon as he opens his mouth, he is ugly. And I don't think he has. And this is just from watching this show, he has not shown a great personality. He's not shown that he's a good partner. He's not shown really any good qualities about himself. I think him, you know, smacking Sandy on the ass. I think him saying, like, oh, you're going to wear without me? Then claim that, like, oh, all you've ever done is peck. I just, you know, I just don't believe you, unfortunately.

[H]

Oh, crazy. Like, this is all in 4K. Like, what is wrong with you? And the fact that he never, like, came clean about anything. Because if you value someone and you know that you want to still be with them, or if there's a proposal on the line, wouldn't you come clean about everything, knowing that it's going to affect your relationship?

[Nick]

The way that the whole apartment situation and cameras is set up, would it be possible for them to hook up off camera and no one know?

[H]

Well, we didn't have cameras in our bedrooms, so, yeah.

[Natalie]

And he shut that door a lot.

[H]

Anything could happen.

[Nick]

Like, what does your gut tell you? We really big on believing our guts. What. Like, what does your gut tell you? That they hooked up or your life's on the line and you have to give an answer of what those two did. What. What's your. What's your answer?

[H]

Oh, it's so hard because I'm just like, I. I just don't know. I'm like, only God knows. Do y'all have a lie detector in there? Like, that's the only way that we'll be able to.

[E]

That's a really good idea.

[H]

More. We still on the air? Like, I want to know.

[Natalie]

I don't know. I mean, I don't. We would have to have JR to do that, and I don't know. If we will, since he's asking for $10,000 to do press.

[H]

Wait.

[E]

What a loser. Oh, my God.

[Natalie]

Um, I do want to switch really quickly to Scotty. You obviously spent some time with him. Um, we interviewed him a week ago.

[Nick]

Last week.

[Heidi Gardner]

Last week.

[Nick]

And it was like, right after the first batch and he, he zoomed in and he was quick to like, I'm embarrassed.

[Natalie]

It was right after the whole, like, cryotherapy and, and hot air balloon eating.

[H]

Fundamentally.

[Nick]

Yeah. So what's your read on Scotty? I don't know if he's just like a guy who's trying his best, but he just can't get out of his own way because he's too insecure.

[Justin]

He also said that a lot of context was cut out of conversations that you had so that it was very clear that he was being sarcastic or that you were in on the jokes.

[Nick]

He said you guys were just have doing nothing but laughing.

[Justin]

But your interviews at claimed otherwise. So that's what's like, what was it really like during that trial marriage with Scottie?

[H]

Okay, that scene, there was no laughter. There was probably like, nervous chuckle of like, what the fuck's going on? But that was a very serious conversation, like even for me to say in the scene. So me turning down your two date ideas is a form of rejection. And for him to respond, there's no like, edits there. And I definitely felt like an energy shift with that. I. I think Scotty, overall, like, he's not a bad person. Like, I think he means well. I think he loves heart. I think he wants to love and build a family based on, you know, just based on what his mom and his dad had. So I do think there is a lack of self awareness that comes with Scottie where he doesn't necessarily see, like, what he's doing or how, you know, he gets triggered in arguments and then like goes crazy and starts throwing like, my age at me, like, bro, we're only two years away.

[Nick]

Part like, are you older or something?

[H]

Two years.

[Justin]

Remember he was like, what do 32 year olds do for fun then? And it was like, bro, you're 30.

[H]

Our child marriage was actually really great. Like, in the beginning, like, he was all in. Like, we were definitely trying to challenge each other with, like, emotional vulnerability. And I could tell, like, he wanted to put his best foot forward. But then everything happened with what I call the crash and burn, which. And ended up making me leave.

[Nick]

When did you leave? Was it how many days before the end of the trial marriage?

[H]

I feel like that was maybe like three or four days before May. Actually, no, I think it was like two days because I went to a hotel and I slept there and they were like, oh, you can come back and have a conversation with him and then go to the changeover together. So I think it was like, they.

[Nick]

Don'T really show that. I mean, I feel like that's kind of a big deal to need to leave. Leave days before you're supposed to because you don't want to be in the same room with them anymore. I feel like that wasn't really highlighted the way the way it was shown is. It's like you left five minutes before you were supposed to.

[H]

Guys night to. When I left was like three or four days of that same energy. And anyone who knows me, like, my friends and family know I'm a very patient person. So for me to have to, like, exit stage left, that means, like, I did not. Like, I couldn't deal with it anymore.

[Natalie]

In the moment when that whole you're cleaning up the apartment and he's like, you go to the bathroom at 1:32 in the morning and you take your phone and you're texting Junior, like, what were you thinking in that moment?

[H]

Mind you, this is probably three or four days in of him doing the same thing. And first and foremost, like, the whole conversation around me talking to Junior was so irrelevant to why Junior had negative opinions about him. Yeah, like, the moment. Moment I walked in from Girls Night, I knew it wasn't like, a safe place to have a productive conversation. He already had a narrative in his head of what happened and he wanted to put that blame on me. So I already clocked what he was doing. I'm like, you're trying to get me to say I would talk to Junior so that it can make sense in your brain as to why Junior came at you. Crazy. And it's a known fact that, like, everyone was talking, communicating with the original part partners. Like, literally a few days before he asked me, Scotty asked me to see if. Reach out to JR to see if he wanted to use his barber who flew in from la. So it's like, you know that there's been conversation, but yet you're trying to put me in a position where it's making it seem like I'm the reason why J. R hates you. That's why I refuse to give into it, because it's like, you know what. What it is. So now you're just badgering me by saying, well, you go to the bathroom with your phone, you Must be talking to Junior. Actually. I have a life. Actually, I had. Was also working remotely.

[Nick]

First of. Also, who cares if you were talking to your boyfriend? Like, I guess I'm just like, every time I watch these also, it just seemed kind of weird given that, like, Junior was very much giving. I'm looking for a hall pass. I'd love your opinion on that in a second. And I would have just loved Scotty. When Junior tried to, like, start some drama with Scotty, I would have. Scotty would have just manned up and been like, yeah, bro, you're giving. Wanting a hall pass. So, like, I didn't say that. But, like, I would be more concerned about how you're operating in this scene rather than. It would seem way easier for Scotty to come back and yell at you for something he had just made up in his head as opposed to just, like, confronting Junior and man to man and just calling him out for his shitty behavior. Now let's just go yell at the woman. Let's just go, like, why pick it out on me?

[H]

I'm having a great night.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[H]

Told me nothing was going on between them.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[G]

Yeah.

[Nick]

I've just been, like, the only right answer to Junior. Been like, yeah, dude, you. You look like you're trying to fuck everybody here.

[H]

And at that time, the whole hall pass thing, I was standing up for Junior. I was like, this is not in his character. He would never. Like, everyone is seeing it from, you know, watching it as a show but me in that moment, I was like, there is no way, like, Junior here for a hall pass. Like, never. So it was just all so ridiculous.

[Nick]

How do you see it now?

[H]

Um, yeah. Like, it's no question. If I was a viewer, I would be like, dang, you just wanted to.

[Nick]

Like, get some clout.

[Natalie]

At the changeover, he talked about how Sandy's family invited him to Christmas. And he was like, I'm probably gonna go. I don't. And, like, knowing he's about to go and live with his girlfriend for three weeks. I, like, I don't understand this guy at all. Like, did that conversation ever come up of, like, are you good?

[H]

Like, are you okay?

[Natalie]

Are you okay?

[H]

Are you okay? And I think in that moment, he just wanted to get under Nick's skin so bad that he did it with me right across the table. Like, there was just no. I just think there was no regard for me at all.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[H]

Like, I did not exist in Junior's world during filming.

[Nick]

To hear that is crazy. It's like. It's that Junior Prioritizing his hatred towards Nick, a man that he was tormenting because he was making moves on his girlfriend. And the fact that Junior was able to convince himself that he was the victim in that situation, so much so that he was so willing to disrespect his own girlfriend and a man who he was in bed with his girlfriend and act like he's the victim is wild behavior.

[H]

Diabolical.

[Nick]

Diabolical.

[E]

Diabolical is the best word for it.

[Nick]

Yeah. Well, we are glad that you made it out okay. And you look great. You look.

[Natalie]

I mean, we are excited to see what happens at Proposal. I can only hope with my fingers and my tongue toes crossed that you are not engaged to this man. I hope the same for Aria and.

[Nick]

Scotty, but it's these guys that they're casting. I just want one guy to root for on these shows.

[Justin]

Caleb.

[Natalie]

Caleb was great. What were your thoughts on Caleb?

[H]

I loved Caleb. He's. He's great. I think he was also, like, one of the guys who just. He just wanted to respect his girlfriend.

[E]

Yeah.

[H]

Like, I'm in this experience. I really didn't want to be here.

[Nick]

For real.

[H]

For real. But I'm gonna do it with you. And I just appreciated his approach with it, and I think he was a great pair for Aria because Aria needed someone that could be a little bit more softer with her and could help her calm down, like, and everything. So I really enjoyed Caleb.

[Natalie]

Who are you closest to from the show today?

[H]

Ari and I have been talking a lot lately. Chanel. We're, like, reconnecting. She lives all the way out in Arizona, so she'll be out out here this week.

[Natalie]

I hope that you get all the brand deals ever and you thrive in your world.

[Nick]

You're the only one brand deal worthy from this show.

[Natalie]

Maybe I want to buy everything yourself.

[H]

Give everyone brand deals.

[Justin]

Give everyone brand deals.

[Natalie]

I don't want to buy anything from Junior or Scotty or, honestly, Vanessa and Dave or Chanel and Micah. You know, we didn't get to know them. We did it. And that's why, like, I don't need to see, you know, or hear from them.

[H]

I'm just excited for you guys to see the finale and reunion.

[Natalie]

Yes.

[H]

And then for everyone to be able to talk more about, like, their story, because obviously, up until this point, we really couldn't share much. So I just think when you hear everyone's perspective, you might change your mind a little bit.

[Natalie]

Okay.

[H]

Okay.

[Justin]

Ooh.

[Nick]

Thanks so much for your time. We wish you nothing but the best on your journey forward. Thanks for being someone that's been funding to root for.

[H]

Thank you.

[Nick]

Because we've definitely been rooting for you.

[H]

Appreciate y'all for having me.

[Nick]

All right, take care.

[Natalie]

Absolutely. Bye, Zana.

[Nick]

Man, she's great. She's great.

[Heidi Gardner]

She's great.

[Natalie]

No, she's great.

[Justin]

She deserves so much better than Junior. Junior is the ultimate boy and I wish him nothing good.

[Nick]

I really, I, I'm. I'm happy to say I didn't like him from the beginning. Gave me the ick.

[E]

As soon as he put that cologne on his balls.

[Nick]

I was like, this man is way too much cologne.

[E]

Why do you have to put that there? What are you hiding?

[Natalie]

What are you going to do? Why is someone going to be smelling your dick?

[E]

Exactly.

[Justin]

Your butthole.

[Nick]

I call it a behind.

[Natalie]

Even worse if I. If Nick ever said my behind. Jail. Jail. Immediately.

[Nick]

Yeah, please smell my behind. I put some cologne on E. It's awful.

[Natalie]

It's really bad.

[Nick]

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[Natalie]

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[Nick]

It makes you feel just connected. You know, I often will listen to River Nap while I'm on a run. I mean, if you ever want to stay close to your child, obviously you want to make sure they're safe and you want to make sure they're sleeping well and nanitizing. Nana just it's like again, that's why they have a Nanit name because it's like a little nanny next year next to your child, making you connected.

[Natalie]

I love it because you can be on the phone talking to someone and you can still hear the monitor in the room. So even if you're on a call or doing something for work, like you can hear if your baby wakes up. And it's just it gives you that extra sense of peace of mind and it gives you that extra peace of mind.

[Nick]

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[Natalie]

The Nanit Baby Monitor is the MVP of baby gear. It's the one baby item we cannot live without. And of course, we have a special offer just for our listeners.

[Nick]

Get 20% off your first order with code Dream20. That's D R E A [e-mail] now that again, that's N A N I T.com Nana.com Use code Dream20. Heidi, how are you?

[Heidi Gardner]

Good, how are you?

[Nick]

Oh, we're Great. So happy to be with you. We're very excited to have you on. Yeah, we're just. We're just excited. Yeah. So bear with our excitement.

[Heidi Gardner]

Okay. Fun. I'm excited.

[H]

Okay.

[Nick]

Like, oh, my God. How have you been? How was your weekend? What you do other than work?

[Heidi Gardner]

Oh, my gosh. I worked and then we worked again. We had a little cast, like, photo we had to do yesterday. Yesterday. But then I went to a Christmas party.

[E]

Oh, nice.

[Nick]

How was that?

[Heidi Gardner]

It was good. I learned how to make eggnog.

[Justin]

Oh, how festive.

[Nick]

How do you make eggnog?

[Heidi Gardner]

So you. You take. This will be good for me. So now I can do it on, like, repeat or I'll know the next time. Even better.

[Natalie]

But you can watch this back.

[Heidi Gardner]

You take 12 eggs. You separate the eggs from the egg yolk from the egg white.

[Nick]

Okay.

[Heidi Gardner]

Those go in a bowl with sugar. Separate bowl. Milk, cream, vanilla.

[Nick]

Do the whites or the yolk go in the sugar?

[Heidi Gardner]

The yolk. The good stuff.

[E]

Okay.

[Heidi Gardner]

Keep the yolk. And then, yeah, you heat up that milk mixture, and then once it, like, just starts to boil, you slowly add it, ladle by ladle to the. The eggs and sugar, which is the scary part, because if you add it too quickly, then the eggs will cook. And you would, like, make scrambled eggs and not eggs. So kind of could be gross. Could be. You know, it's a lot going on. Wow.

[Justin]

There's an art to it.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[E]

Yeah. Who do you have with you today?

[Heidi Gardner]

So this is tweaky.

[Nick]

Tweaky.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Love.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah. It's just gonna hang.

[Nick]

You're a Chiefs fan?

[Heidi Gardner]

Oh, huge.

[Nick]

Oh, my God.

[Natalie]

Like, before. Taylor Swift. Chiefs.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

No shade to Taylor. I am happy for more eyes on the Chiefs, but I was born in Kansas City. This has been, like, since birth.

[Nick]

You've had a good run then. Yeah. You've been really.

[Heidi Gardner]

I know.

[Nick]

You've been a big winner. Is Patrick going to be. Is his Patrick.

[E]

Ankle injury?

[Heidi Gardner]

I mean, it feels like this ankle has been plaguing us for years. It just always seems like something's up with it and he works through it. So I'm trying not to be too worried and just. I mean, he posted here. Here's the thing. He posted something to Instagram stories today. So I just feel like if you're making a post, it can't be that.

[Nick]

Right. It can't be that bad.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Right.

[E]

Do you believe the conspiracy theory that it's the ankle? The ankle thing is on purpose because almost. Except for one time. Every time his ankle has been injured. The Chiefs have won a Super Bowl.

[Heidi Gardner]

So I did start to think, like, I'm like, oh, you do, like, maybe it is a good move to do the ankle thing to then make other teams think you're more. More vulnerable and then hit them with your best stuff. But that would just mean there's, like, so much theater.

[E]

He is performing.

[Heidi Gardner]

Really have so much other stuff, like plays to learn. Yeah, but I just don't know then his acting career.

[E]

Okay, gotcha.

[Natalie]

I recently saw you talk about your Beavis and Butthead break in character during that skit, and I went and watched it, and I don't think I have laughed harder. I think it is so funny when y'all break character. I know it's. It's probably, like, looked down upon. I'm sure you try your hardest not to do that. You take pride in not doing that. But it was so funny.

[Heidi Gardner]

Thank you. Yeah, I. You know, I don't even think it's looked down upon from what I can tell, because I always get such a, like, warm response. But I know I definitely was being a little too, like, method about it before breaking like that, you know, I just felt like I couldn't. I was just like, I have a job to do. It's to be in character and be funny, but never show that. I think something.

[Nick]

When you have moments like that that, like, the audience does love so much, do the. The powers that be, do they embrace it? Or do you sometimes. Do you guys get, like, a talking to afterwards where it's just like, how do you guys navigate the. The breaks versus, like, not doing what you're not supposed to do type of thing?

[Heidi Gardner]

I mean, I. Because that was my first time, I was really scared, and I was scared of what Lauren would think, because also when I, like, I left the sketch and I was like, oh, that was crazy that I laughed. And then I started to think about it. I was like, I think I laughed for a long time. I think I wasted time on the. You know, because every minute really counts.

[Nick]

Every second.

[Heidi Gardner]

You know, you're trying to get as many sketches in. So I was like, I wonder if I'm going to get in trouble. And then I saw him, like, between sketches, and he smiled at me, and I was like, okay. And then I actually don't know because I don't make a habit out of it. I feel like he would be able to tell if someone was using it as a crutch and if it bothered him, I'm sure he'd be like, come on, you know.

[Natalie]

Yeah, yeah.

[Nick]

We love to ask our guests what they're passionate about. And one of the things you wrote about being passionate about is being an overstimulated adult.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yes.

[Nick]

Can you talk more about that? That, please? Okay.

[Heidi Gardner]

Well, I don't know if I'm. I'm passionate about it. I don't know if I'm enjoying it. But I will say in life right now, I find I'm so, like, aware that I'm in, you know, a moment with my work. Like, especially it being like, the 50th season of SNL. I'm at a. I'm already at a job that's unpredictable. This season's more unpredictable week to week. Like, it was an election season. We have, you know, alumni and special guests stopping by every week. It's just like, just being on a roller coaster. So that part of it and then just in life, wanting to live a full and exciting life and, like, connect with my friends and family. And I just feel like lately I'm very aware that, like, everything I'm doing is, like, non stop. There's people around me all the time, you know, Like, I'm just like. I think I'm in that point where I'm trying to, like, juice everything out of life, but I might be doing it wrong because I think you also need to, like, just sit with your cats and stare at a Christmas tree and be quiet, too.

[Natalie]

It's like, after I feel like we record here, obviously it's a lot of talking. And then I get home and our babysitter has, like, the Alexa playing some, like, Disney song really loud. And I'm like, alexa, off, please. Like, turn it off. I need to silence. So it's weird.

[Heidi Gardner]

It's like one of those things that, like. Yeah, I just know exactly what you mean. Because whether it's like a friend, a partner, anything, when I come home and someone says anything to me, I'm like, I don't want to be looked at or talked to or engaged with or even complimented in any way for at least 25 minutes. And that's not even. That's not even me. Like, I'm a sensitive person who likes connection and love and effusiveness and the fact that something's happened in my life where now I have to, like, have that boundary. It's crazy.

[Nick]

Yeah. When you are trying to unwind, are you watching a lot of Bravo and a lot of Housewives?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah. And guys, I don't even know if that's the right thing to do anymore.

[E]

Either, because it's not calming.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah, it's not calming at this point. It's overstimulating. It's my only frame of reference in the zeitgeist now. I'm like, there's a lot of good movies out and I'm in entertainment and, you know, would possibly want to be in these types of things. And I. I'm not watching them. I'm just watching Housewives.

[Nick]

Is it Salt Lake? Are you fully. Are you caught up with Salt Lake?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Okay.

[Heidi Gardner]

Fully immersed.

[Nick]

Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's the best housewives on television.

[E]

Best show on television.

[Heidi Gardner]

I know. I had a friend who posted about it recently. Her name's Carolina. And she was like, it's so good. I'm taking notes. And like, she doesn't forget things like.

[Nick]

Where do you land on Broadway and Britney in terms of new cast and do you. How do you feel about their kind of involvement in the new season?

[Heidi Gardner]

I was really feeling Bronwyn because I was like, whoa, she's doing like a masterful job at, like, talking about people but admitting when she does. And then also when someone, like, when they roll the tape, I'm like, I agree with this. Like, someone brought up something about Lisa and she was like, hey, that would suck if that happened. But I've never had that experience. And so I was just, I was like, I'm on board with this. And I was finding it also really impressive how much screen time she was getting. And, like, I'm like, she's doing a good job being a housewife. Lately, I'm a bit exhausted. Like, I don't know how close you were to Lisa before, so maybe I'm not seeing it, but I'm just like, I would be exhausted if I release that after that trip.

[Natalie]

It's like, yeah, the whole rooms situation.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah. I'm like, Lisa had I learning. I find entertaining and hosting, like, to be a passion of mine as well. And I learned stuff from Lisa. I'm like, if I ever take friends on a trip, like, the fact that every bar they rolled up to the drink was already ready. No one was waiting.

[E]

Like, should have PowerPoint.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah, let's let the trip play out, Bronwyn, before you start complaining.

[Justin]

Well, even then, I agreed with her room assignments. I thought it made the most sense is how. How Lisa did everything. So it was like to do a whole 20 minute breakdown of, like, how you're upset when you got a suite in a beautiful villa right next door. What. What are we. What are we upset about?

[Heidi Gardner]

100%. And she would have been upset in the other one. She would have found a way, like.

[Justin]

Yeah, my room's too close to Heather.

[Natalie]

Where did you stand on high body count hair and Cornish vibes?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah. I just feel like Britney is a conundrum because, you know, I love her so much. She is living a life. She is for sure. It's a choice that I'm fully on board with. Like, do your thing, you know, but the fact that you kind of have to hide behind religion. I. I think she's an actress and I think she's acting a lot. And I can just tell.

[G]

I don't know if you saw, but she did an interview recently, and her voice, it was. Watch what happens live. Her voice is a lot deeper. She talks different. So people are saying that her appearance on the show and the after show is like a character, I believe.

[E]

I think so. She was a Disney cast member. She was, like, at, like, Orlando doing Disney stuff.

[Heidi Gardner]

It was in a Christmas movie called the. I think Mistletoes.

[E]

Yes.

[Natalie]

Where he felt like she was.

[Nick]

I'm obsessed with her character on the show if it's that the only. The really hard part I have with her is, like, every once in a while we're reminded that, like, she just casually throws out that, like, yeah, my kids aren't speaking to me because of my last thing. And it's just, like, such an afterthought for her, like, her children not to be speaking with her. And all I want for Britney is for her to only care about is reconnecting with her kids. And she seems way more interested in everything else.

[E]

Jared Osmond's Instagram stories. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

Like, I also feel like the kids thing is something you could just so casually not bring up because, you know, none of us are really gonna be sensitive to that given the other context that's going on. I'm like, right.

[Natalie]

We could have had Britney without knowing that she.

[Nick]

Yeah, she could just feel like, I don't want to talk about my kids. Not just casually throwing out with a photo include of, like, these are my kids. They don't tell.

[Natalie]

No, no. It's the Making an announcement.

[E]

Not even her first. It wasn't even her first announcement, though. That was not on the list of her announcements. That was, like, down there. Jared Osmond was the first on her announcements, and then it was her kids on her announcements.

[Nick]

Which is she. Is she trying to convince us that her and Jared haven't slept together? Is that actually a thing?

[Justin]

Yeah, that's what she said at the dinner table while showing off crotchless panties.

[Nick]

I just find it fascinating that she's trying to convince us that. Yeah, she's first trying to convince. Convince us that they haven't slept together, and then she's yelling at the rest of the ladies that she can do whatever she wants behind closed doors. It was like, yeah, no, for sure. But, like, just say. Just admit it. You had sex. What. What happened? Was Heather in this last episode all that much?

[G]

She was ordering the drinks at the table.

[Justin]

Yeah, Heather was actually kind of out of the drama this. This episode.

[Nick]

Good for her.

[E]

Who out of the Salt Lake cast do you think would make the best SNL host?

[Heidi Gardner]

I think Meredith would be, like, too woke and too aware, actually. So not her. Lisa. Because Lisa's unaware. She'll just do so. She'll lean in if you say it'll be popular.

[E]

Or Lisa's monologue could change lives.

[Heidi Gardner]

Not that that's what we do, but that's the best kind of host where it's just, like, everything. Nothing's off limits. Like, when we had Kim Kardashian, I think we were all. All, you know, she's just, like, a big deal in the world. And so all of us, I think, and. And in the new, like, there's just a lot of stories about her out there. And so you're just kind of like, oh, I gotta. Don't let something fly out of my mouth. And she came in, and she just totally put everyone at ease by just saying, like, everything is on the table.

[H]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

And I feel like that's how Lisa would be.

[E]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Has there been anyone that you've kind. Kind of, like, channeled throughout your skits from any of the Housewives? Like, have you taken any inspiration from anyone?

[Heidi Gardner]

You know, what's interesting is recently, two weeks ago, I did a character on Update. It was mom whose son just got famous.

[E]

Yes. That was incredible.

[Heidi Gardner]

And I was do. There was a way that I was flipping my hair, and I was like. From the time I did it at Table Read to then on the show, every rehearsal, I did it. I was like, I am. Who am I being right now? This. This hair thing. What am I doing? Who is this? And I was like, I know it's a housewife, but it's like I was watching. I was completely caught up that week. I was like, I could not figure out what housewife I'm doing. What is going on? And then my friend texted me, like, a day later, and she was like, oh, Like, I was watching Mamadou Key. And the way you're flipping your Hair is MIA from Potomac.

[H]

I was like.

[E]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

I was like, thank you for thinking about so much. But it's weird how that just gets in you. You know, just watching her every week.

[Nick]

Is there ever been a housewife who has hosted or.

[Justin]

I don't think so, no.

[Heidi Gardner]

No. I don't even think we've had one, like, guest just pop in, talk to Lauren. It would be iconic.

[Nick]

I think it is time.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Have you. Have you caught up with Southern Charm?

[Heidi Gardner]

Southern Charm. I'm like, I have, like, 10 minutes left of the most recent episode, but I'm at the. The horse thing right now. Like, and I've caught. You know, I know what's happening.

[Natalie]

Are you sad that JT is not going to be on next season, or are we. I'm so glad over him.

[Heidi Gardner]

I never really got his character or why we even brought him into the franchise in the first. Like, it just felt like something to kind of, like, shit on Austin or cause drama. But I'm like, those guys create enough drama. Like, I actually feel like every time they tried to bring in a dude like Pringle, or it's like, I don't know, like, Craig Austin and Shep got enough.

[E]

Yeah.

[Justin]

Like, and then you throw Whitney in there every once in a while to throw spice up a little something.

[Nick]

I forgot about him.

[Justin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[E]

Whitney terrifies me. He's amazing. Television.

[Natalie]

Him telling Molly that she shouldn't eat the cupcake.

[E]

Oh, my God.

[Natalie]

Was like, the most insane thing.

[E]

Yeah, that was right at the end.

[Natalie]

He said it was just so. Yeah, you probably have 10 minutes left. But he was like, you probably shouldn't eat that. And it was. It was jarring.

[E]

Was mad.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Nick And I don't really understand the Ms. Pat of it all. It's kind of giving the Lisa Vanderpump of Vanderpump, you know, just kind of someone who pops in and out and you don't really understand their character.

[Nick]

Isn't Whitney, like, a producer?

[Justin]

Whitney's an executive producer and, I think, creator of the show. And then Ms. Pat is his mom, so she's just.

[E]

I love having her there. She's wonderful.

[Justin]

Like Southern royalty.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

But how did he get to be the creator? Like, what? He just had this idea.

[Justin]

Like, I know the idea. Yeah. Me and my friends bring a camera around, see what happens. And then they shot a pilot, and Bravo picked it up.

[Heidi Gardner]

Have you guys been watching since the beginning of Southern Charm?

[Justin]

I have.

[Nick]

Some of us Die Hard.

[E]

I just started the beginning because I.

[Heidi Gardner]

I probably started two seasons ago. And just started whatever current it was. And I thought it was entertaining. And then my friend Amanda was like, go back and watch from the start. Because even how it started is so different. It's just about these Southern gentlemen. And also I think that first season, so I thought that was crazy. But Thomas Ravenel and Catherine, that first season, I'm like, they couldn't have gotten better tv. That was wild.

[E]

The fact that he went on thinking it was gonna help his political career and then he got like a 21 year old. It's, it's, it's perfect.

[Justin]

Oh, and it keeps going so good. Their storyline for the next, like four seasons after that is just like mayhem. But I love all of the shows that are like, Southern Charm. Vanderpump Rules Summer House. Like, I like when it's just like an eclective group of people, just bright bring in their stuff. But it's not, oh, we dug up things about each other. It's like, no, this is literally what happened last weekend. And we're just talking about it.

[Nick]

That's a good question. Like, what do you think their storyline is going to be this season? Because it really seems light on storyline so far. It's just like JT handing out canes and delusion.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Justin]

I'm like, well, Madison is just a great TV maker in general, but I'm like, we've got JT and his conspiracy theories. We've got.

[Nick]

But that's what I'm saying. We got a bunch of little nothing burgers, little appetizers, a little bit of this, a little bit of that. But there's no, like, main, like, you know, we really counted on Taylor and Olivia last season, you know, to kind of the big drama. You know, it's like I feel like there's always some kind of big thing.

[G]

That'S weighing on the group, that someone has multiple girlfriends. Who was it? Was it. They were talking about it in the bus.

[Heidi Gardner]

Austin.

[Justin]

Oh, they're saying Austin's girlfriend. But I think we're gonna have a lot of stuff coming up with Taylor, Gaston and Shep and his new love interest. That does not seem interested as a fan of the show.

[Nick]

Heidi, did you. Did you follow Vanderpump Rules at all?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Have you kept up with the latest news on. On some of its cast members that happened over the past week? Any thoughts?

[Heidi Gardner]

A lot has happened, right?

[Nick]

Yeah. Well, we have James turns out, total piece of shit. Yeah. We ran into him that night. Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

Whoa.

[Nick]

We were at that party, turns out. Yeah. And then Tom Sandoval. Well, did you hear about his. The post from last night? That drama?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah. So she posted something that basically was like, yes, he's a cheater. But then just a little bit ago, she was.

[Nick]

We have something new. Yeah, we actually don't even have. Do we have the update Breaking news. Well, it's like an hour ago or something.

[E]

Oh, yeah.

[Nick]

Sadly. Sadly. I think Tom Sandoval got to her.

[E]

No, she was typing it as if.

[Natalie]

He was holding a gun to her head.

[Nick]

She writes, I would like to sincerely apologize for my previous post. Yeah, Tom's standing over her. I had a true misjudgment in a situation. Okay. Tom did not do anything. From my own personal trauma and experience, hearing false accusations about him all the time clouded my judgment and got the best of me. Please respect him and know he's actually being the most supportive of partner. The Internet can be harsh and sometimes I'm learning about how to block out the noise.

[Heidi Gardner]

This is why I hate this so much. Is like, this is the truest form of him not being a man. Say all of this is true. Say she got something totally wrong. Like, why put her on blast even more? Like, he has done. He is. He's not redeemable at this point. He should know. He's tried so many different, different things. And it's like, to put her in this vulnerable spot of being like, I was a. And he's the best. Like, once again, he doesn't care about her, like, and he just cares about himself. It's just. Oh, just walk away from everything, dude.

[Natalie]

I know. I want to see him just like, on like, an island selling time shares, you know?

[E]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Like, I feel like that would be for.

[Heidi Gardner]

At least for a bit. And then come back and do if you need. Need it. If you're driven by that and seeing.

[Natalie]

It on, like, a beach bar, you know, it's. I don't know, just like, for summer at least. I don't know. We had ego on a while back and we very much picked her brain on. On all things snl. I do want to know if there's a favorite sketch of yours that did not make it into Final Cuts.

[Heidi Gardner]

I did one last season. We did it a couple times and kept trying to get it on. Me and a couple of the writers, Jimmy and Kira, where it was just like, it's like a Miami Dolphins cheerleader calendar shoot or something. Very contrived. But I was just this really cocky cheerleader who had, like, just gotten extensions before the shoot and was very proud of my hair. And then once they Turned on the fans. Like, they all started flying out. Very obvious. But the hair was, like, hitting the other cheerleaders in the face. Like, just the image of, like, just people getting snaps of hair was very fun. But all that technical stuff and the effects and the fans and the different angles, like, it never quite made sense. And, like, where I was, my mark was. And where the hair was actually blowing, you rewatch the sketch, it's like, thank God. This sketch. It didn't make sense, but we tried really hard. It was very fun.

[Nick]

You work in a salon for nine. Nine years?

[Heidi Gardner]

I did, yeah.

[Nick]

Were you doing hair or were you like, yeah, you were. Wow.

[Heidi Gardner]

I was doing hair. I was doing extensions. It was, like, early to mid 2000s, where I was like. Or a. When, like, the LA extensions were real big.

[Natalie]

So have any of your old clients been like, hey, girl, member?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah, I'll have them. I mean, it's funny, when I first told the first client I ever told that I was leaving the salon, not even for Austin L, I just was gonna start pursuing sketch comedy more seriously. I, you know, I said, I'm leaving the salon. And she was like, oh, like, where? If it's like, less than 10 miles, I'll come to that salon? And I was like, oh, no, I'm leaving the. The industry. And she was like, to do what? And I said. I didn't even know how to say it, because I was like, I'm not an actor. I've just been taking improv class. I didn't know how to say it. That is an Oscar. But I was like, oh, to pursue comedy. And she was like, are you funny? Perfect. And actually, she. I haven't heard from her, but I've heard from a lot of other ones that are just like, it is. And actually, one of what's so weird is when I was auditioning for snl, a young woman whose hair I had done in la, like, who was in college at the time, and she would come see me on her breaks. She ended up being one of the people in the talent department at snl. So, like, she text me when I was about to fly to New York for my SNL audition, and I saw her name pop up, Rebecca. And I was like, oh, my gosh. I never told Rebecca that I had left the salon. You know, she's probably asking for her color this weekend. And I opened the text, and she was like, hey, I work at SNL now. I saw your showcase. I'm going to be at your office auditions. What is going on? And I was like, well, what's going on with you? Like, you were. You work at SNL now. So we're both there now, and we're just like, oh, my God, like, I cut her parents hair. Like, it's just a bar in her parents.

[Nick]

Yeah, that's a. That's a great story. And like, what a cool moment to like, reflect back and think about. Because like you said, it's just like when you told that whoever that customer was, like, what you were doing, you know, there's probably a level, level of like, am I really doing this? When you say it out loud, it almost. It's like, it's crazier when you sit in your head. You're like, I'm gonna take a shot on myself. I'm gonna bet on me. But you did it. Like, you. You did it and now you're where you're at. And it's such, like, a cool story for all the people out there who have, like, a dream or want to better themselves. And like, everyone tells them, you know, Right? Because you tell. You tell your friends, and everyone's like, yeah, sure, great. Like, you know, it's so scary to follow your dreams, and it's so scary to, like, take a risk. And I think a lot of people, you know, tell you, you it's to not try because they don't have the guts to try themselves. So for you to be able to do that and look back is. Is a really. Is a really cool, really cool story.

[Heidi Gardner]

I have to say, for as many people as were the ones who were like, are you funny? There were also, you know, like, my big brother or some of my best friends that were like, hey, I've been waiting for you to do this your whole life. Like, please, like, you know, my brother paid for my first improv class classes or. And that was such a help to me because I think I was definitely like, I know I'm funny. Like, I'm going to prank calls or, you know, I'm funny at a party. But, like, I didn't know how to. And I can quote movies, but I didn't know how to equate that to so to just have those people that were like, just take the class. Or, you know, my boss, Deanna at the salon, she didn't necessarily fire me, but she did take me out to lunch and was like, stop doing hair. And I was like, but, you know, I rent the space. And like, you know, I know that, you know, you and the owner of the salon, like, you depend on that rent. They're like, she was like, we'll be fine. You do not belong here anymore. Like, I needed that.

[Nick]

That's awesome. Do you remember your first night on Saturday Night Live that you were performing and what that was, that what that experience was like?

[Heidi Gardner]

I do kind of. I remember the first sketch that I went out on. I was in two live sketches. I did the first one and I mean, I just. I had a line like, you know, they served me like, some spaghetti. And I think I was like, looks wonderful. And like, I got through it. Yes. And then the second one seemed a little more challenging. And I think I was like watching, like, it was me and my husband out at like some sort of performance or like a cabaret or something. And I. Whatever was happening on the stage, I think I was supposed to be like, what are they doing? And just a very simple line. And the thing at FNL is we have cue cards. And that's awesome. And all you have to do is look at the cue cards. But I came from performing at the Groundlings where we memorized everything and it was just like, it's not that hard to memorize what are you doing? Or what are they doing? But I had probably said it 2,000 times that just, what are they doing? And so many different ways. And then I did kind of flub that line. And so. Because I just, I tried too hard, you know, I just could have left it hard.

[Nick]

Any big plans for the holidays? What. What do you. What does Heidi do during the holiday season?

[Heidi Gardner]

I am going to go back to Kansas City. I'll do family stuff. And then I'm also. I'm going to throw a holiday party. Flash white elephant with my friends. Friends. And I'm really excited about the white elephant because I. Any white elephant I've done before has had so many rules around it. So, like, when I send everyone the invite, like white elephant at my place, everyone's like, okay, well, what's the limit? What's the this that I'm like, no rules. Like, my dream would be that there's like, cool stuff, that there's a dollar that's like worth a dollar. And then that also someone like throws like a twenty thousand dollar gift and I get to watch people go, like, betray each other.

[E]

The tension is what makes white elephant the best, I think.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

I want to see what gets people.

[Natalie]

Yeah. No one's stealing the phone case from the, like, clip on selfie light ring, you know?

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah, yeah. Unless it's some random nostalgic case that has a quote on it that, like, that two People are gonna fight like a Jeff. I want people to bring it.

[Natalie]

What are you gonna bring?

[Heidi Gardner]

My friend last night, Michelle, who's gonna be there? She's my friend since second grade. She was showing me some. First of all, I was. She was like, let me show you what I'm getting for the white elephant. And I was like, well, I'm playing too. I don't wanna see it, you know? And she was like, oh, well, it's a camp. And I was like, all right, fine, Let me see the candle. And she was like, so I was thinking about doing this candle. And then she was like, I was gonna throw in, like, you know, toilet paper and toothpaste. And I was like, no. And she was like, why not? And it was like, toilet paper and toothpaste, but no one's going to fight over it. She was like, that could be something at home that someone doesn't have right now that then they don't have to go out to the store and get. And like, we finally came to a compromise. So I was like, it can't just be toilet paper. And if it's an accompanying.

[Natalie]

Yeah, something out there's got to be a diptyque candle.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Nick]

I mean, at least make it flushable. Wipes, you know, if you're going to.

[E]

So I feel like the rule with a gag gift is, like, you get, like, one nice thing and then the dumbest thing you can possibly think of and pair it with each other. And like, so. So then you have to fight over the stupid thing for the nice thing.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yes.

[E]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

100.

[Nick]

You have here feeling feminine when work makes you feel masculine. What do you mean by that, Heidi? I'm curious.

[Heidi Gardner]

Well, I just feel like. I don't know. At this point in my life, actually, all I want in life, I think I have decision fatigue in general, whether it be getting food. At the end of the day, there's too many options. I just want to be told what to do. Because I work in a place where oftentimes me and other people are generating our own content, thinking of ideas every single week, thinking of what's funny, what character, how to fix it, how to produce it, what wig I'm going to wear, what wardrobe, making decisions, decisions, decisions. My dream would just be that, like, I'm just being told what? Like, actually that I have a coach. Like, that's just like, here's what you eat, here's what you watch, here's what's going to make you feel good. All of these things, which then it. But is really hard to do because I've created this life for myself where it's like, I know what I want. I know how to get it. I know this contact. I know that, you know.

[Nick]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

But I. When I can fully surrender and when I just feel like other people are doing that, I think it feels the best. And there's other ways to feel feminine, but that the surrender feels great.

[Nick]

Any holiday, like, tips or tricks that you swear by that, like, you feel like you. You. Everyone else is doing it wrong, but, you know, it's like a. A holiday life hack.

[Heidi Gardner]

I do think as you get older, maybe adults get over gifts a little bit. Like, they're just kind of like, well, I can get what I want, or, yeah, everyone can get what they want, and no one really needs anything anymore. But I do think there's still something about special about Christmas. I think a good gift is really special. Like, I think if you're, like, forcing it and trying to get something for everyone. But, like, this is all to say gifts, I think, are still important and special. Other, like, little things that, though, are. And, like, things I'm gonna do. I just recently I had this when I was out, and then I did it at a party. I had caviar, and I got the caviar and the creme fraiche, but instead of serving it on, like, Bellinis or whatever people typically do, I just got it Ritz. And that was a big hit. Really good caviar and rip. Oh, I just had a woman who's, like. She was the interior designer at my house, and she's, like, so Chicago chic and, you know, just creates amazing spaces. And she said, whenever you're putting flowers in a vase, instead of trying, she said, do the same stem in each vase. A flower. Don't try to be a florist. And, like, make your own arrangement with multiple flowers. That'll look better. And chicer with holiday hostess tip.

[Nick]

We love that.

[Natalie]

That is good. I do feel like I'm always like, oh, well, if I mix the hydrangeas with the roses, it'll give. And then I'm like, well, that looks like.

[Heidi Gardner]

Looks like. And we don't have all the things to put in the bottom of the base where you can, like, thicken it.

[E]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

Like, we don't. We're not florists.

[Natalie]

We're not florists. We're just girls.

[Heidi Gardner]

Not. Yeah, girls don't want to be girls.

[Nick]

Do you have a dream house that you've pitched that you just are hoping to get on? Not reality TV related Just anyone in general that you're just really hoping eventually can host so that you can work with them or whether maybe it's because you like them or don't like them, but whatever the reason. Do you have a dream guest?

[Heidi Gardner]

Oh, yeah, Well, I have a couple. I mean, not to be greedy because I already got Travis Kelsey, so I've already gotten a chief. But I like when athletes host because I think it's very unpredictable and typically no one's expecting them to do a great job. So if they do, it's like it's kind of a win win. And if it's a lose lose, it's fine because that's not your job. Like it's. And you were still cute to do this. But I would like Patrick Mahomes too, because I just think he's a chief too. And I would. I love LeBron James and I would love him too. But Catherine O'Hara is.

[Nick]

Yes, I would love.

[E]

She has. That seems crazy that she hasn't hosted before.

[Heidi Gardner]

I know.

[E]

And Martin Shorts. How many times is Martin short hosted? Maybe like multiple.

[Heidi Gardner]

More than five, I think. I think he's more than five times.

[Nick]

Yeah, he's one of those. Yeah.

[E]

They need to get. They need to get all the SCTP people. Yeah, yeah. For 50.

[Justin]

She hosted in 1992. The last time she hosted was 1991 and 1992.

[E]

Okay, well, they need to get her back home alone.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yeah.

[Justin]

What about.

[Nick]

She's due.

[Natalie]

Yeah, yeah.

[Justin]

Schitt's Creek. Like that's wild.

[E]

Yeah.

[Natalie]

Beetlejuice.

[Justin]

Beetlejuice.

[Nick]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. She'd be great. Absolutely.

[E]

If you had to put together like an all time SNL starting 5 of cash cast members who would be okay.

[Heidi Gardner]

Eddie Murphy, Harry Terry, Maya Rudolph, Kyle Mooney and Dana Carvey.

[E]

Incredible.

[Natalie]

That is good.

[E]

Is Dana Carvey, like he's on. Is he just working there now? Again, he's on so much.

[Heidi Gardner]

I have no idea what. Yeah. Contract is at all. But I will say, you know, he, him and Eddie Murphy were the first two people I ever saw in snl. That and all and just like two of my comedic heroes. And having Dana be a part of the show this season, not only was it just cool for that reason, but he is so funny. He's so nice. I've learned so much just watching him about just continuing to just remain like silly and I don't know, sometimes we get up our own asses even though it's like sketch comedy and it's all supposed to be funny. Like you'll find yourself in these periods where you're taking it so seriously and you're holding on so tight to your sketch and these characters. And, like, I'll watch Dana in rehearsals, and he is. He is just making funny faces, which just seems so stupid, but it's effective. You know, he's like, just kind of opening his eyes a little wider, like, people are laughing. It just reminds me that it's like, oh, yeah. I don't just have. Have to be, like, so in character and have this perfect character voice and point of view. Like, I can make a face and get a laugh.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

So, b, that's, like, kind of the first thing that makes you laugh in life is when you're a baby and someone, like, makes. Makes a funny face. It's like, yeah, it's funny.

[E]

His Jennifer Coolidge made me laugh.

[Heidi Gardner]

I know.

[E]

So hard.

[Nick]

It was.

[Heidi Gardner]

And he. He's just being dumb.

[Natalie]

Yeah.

[Heidi Gardner]

He's just stupid.

[Nick]

Stupid.

[E]

But it's like, the smartest stupid thing in the world.

[Justin]

It's.

[E]

It's incredible.

[Heidi Gardner]

Yes. And. And also knowing, like, sometimes also when you're asked to do an impression, you become more of a perfectionist, and you're like, I have to get this so right. And it's like, Dana knows, first off, he's a man. He's not a woman. He's doing Jennifer Coolidge. He doesn't look anything like her. So when he puts on this wig and all this pink, he's gonna look awful, you know, like. And he's just leaning into all of it, like, everything that we see. He's not insecure about it. He's just like, I am to be on 11 with this.

[Nick]

Yeah. Speaking of Jennifer Coolidge, they. I'm assuming she won't be in season three, but they just.

[E]

The White Lotus season three trailer.

[Nick]

White Lotus season three. Are you. Did you watch the first two seasons?

[Heidi Gardner]

So I watched the first season. Loved it. I started the second season, but it was, like, just a busy time in life, so I need to go back. But I'm excited, and I'm excited. I just saw, like. I didn't see the trailer, but I saw some memes of just, like, Parker Posey. Yeah.

[E]

I'm so excited to see Parker Posey in the show.

[Nick]

She's like, kill it, Heidi. This has been so much fun. Thank you so much for taking the time on your very busy schedule. Happy holidays. Enjoy Kansas City. I hope the packers meet the Chiefs in the. In the Super Bowl. That would be great, too.

[H]

Yeah, that.

[Nick]

Be fun, you know, like a Super bowl one rematch or something like that. You know, it be great. Super fun for us. Thank you for taking the time. We really appreciate it.

[Heidi Gardner]

Thank you, guys.

[Nick]

Thank you. Byebye. Take care.

[Heidi Gardner]

Bye.

[Nick]

So fun.

[E]

It's great.

[H]

So fun.

[Heidi Gardner]

Love.

[Nick]

It's just our SNL street cred. Just.

[E]

Yeah.

[Nick]

Going up.

[E]

Oh, this is my dream. This is incredible. To geek out with Heidi Gardner about Dana Carvey.

[Justin]

Also just found out a little fact that Catherine O'Hara was casted in season six of Saturday Night Live, but never filmed an episode because she left to be on a Canadian Sketch Show.

[E]

SCTV. Second City Television with Catherine O'Hara. Eugene Levy, Martin Short was on it. Rick Martin Moranis. Incredible, incredible TV show.

[Nick]

That's a star studded. It is.

[E]

If you're ever, if you're ever like feeling down, just pull up some YouTube.

[Nick]

Watch that Daniel Carvey. It's Jennifer Coolidge impression.

[E]

It's Ariana. Ariana Grande, Chloe Feynman and Dana Carvey all are doing Jennifer Coolidge impressions. It's the dumbest thing in the world.

[Natalie]

It's incredible.

[E]

He also did Church lady again as a co. That's my dad's favorite sketch. Shocker.

[Nick]

Yeah, it's iconic. All right, well, that'll do it for us today. Meredith Marks is with us tomorrow for going deeper. Hold on to your butts. See you tomorrow. Bye now. AT T Mobile get four 5G phones on us and four lines for $25 a line per month when you switch with eligible trade ins. All on America's largest 5G network. Minimum of 4 lines for $25 per line per month with auto pay discount using debit or bank account. $5 more per line without autopay plus taxes and fees and $10 device connection charge phones via 24 monthly bill credits for well qualified customers. Contact us before canceling entire account to continue bill credits or credit stop and balance on a required finance agreement due bill credits end if you pay off devices early. CT mobile dot com.