The Way to Burn Your Enemies

Summary

The Wake-Up Call – “The Way to Burn Your Enemies”

Host: John David Walt (and guests)
Air Date: January 25, 2026
Podcast: The Wake-Up Call by Seedbed

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Main Theme

This episode explores the challenging biblical wisdom of responding to enemies with kindness, based on Proverbs 25:21–22 (“heap burning coals on his head”). John David Walt reflects on how radical love toward adversaries is both counterintuitive and Christlike, and invites listeners to reconsider their instinctual approaches to conflict—and their enemies—in light of Jesus' teaching.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Sunday “Practice”—Setting the Spiritual Tone

• John David Walt opens by reframing Sunday as “practice”—preparation for living out faith during the week (00:20).
• He leads a brief prayer and consecration, focusing attention on Christ (01:35).

2. Scripture Focus: Proverbs 25:21–22

• Walt reads and focuses on:

  “If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat. If he is thirsty, give him water to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head and the Lord will reward you.” (02:30)

• He notes how this challenges common instincts:

  “A hungry and thirsty enemy sounds like a vulnerable enemy. It may provide an opportunity to defeat my enemy. That would be good, right?... But wisdom teaches us to care for our enemies.” (03:15)

3. Expanding with Paul’s Letter to the Romans (Romans 12:17–21)

• The episode draws parallels to Paul’s instructions:

  "Do not repay anyone evil for evil. ...If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head. ...Overcome evil with good." (04:40)

4. The Double Outcomes: Evil for Evil vs. Good for Evil

• Walt highlights the dangers of fighting “fire with fire”:

  “When I give my enemy a taste of his own medicine, I am the one who gets sick.” (05:10)
  “When I repay bad for bad, I escalate the conflict.” (05:22)
  “When I retaliate...I do irreversible damage.” (05:40)

• In contrast, he shares the fruit of returning good for evil:

  “When I return good for evil, I avoid the infection brought on by the toxicity of evil.” (06:10)
  “Responding to evil with good is actually a subversive form of retaliation...heaping burning coals on their head.” (06:35)

5. Understanding “Heaping Burning Coals”

• Acting kindly toward enemies isn’t passive—it confronts their behavior and can lead to their transformation:

  “When you respond to bad with good, it actually has the effect of shaming your enemy...causing them to reevaluate their decision and changing the outcome altogether.” (07:15)
  "Evil cannot be overcome by evil. Darkness cannot drive out darkness. ...You don't destroy a monster by becoming a monster. Hate cannot defeat hate. Because if hate defeats hate, ...hate won and hate never wins." (08:00)

6. Wisdom is “the Imagination of Heaven”

• Walt coins a memorable phrase:

  "Wisdom is the imagination of heaven." (11:00)

• He references James 3:17 on heaven’s wisdom:

  “…the wisdom from heaven ...is first of all pure. Then peace-loving, considerate, submissive, full of mercy and good fruit.” (11:20)

7. Practical Reflection and Journal Prompts

• Listeners are invited to recall times when good was returned for evil, and to consider their current adversaries.
• Prompts:
  1. “Can you recall a situation where someone responded to evil with good? What happened?”
  2. “What do you make of this notion of the counterintuitive war of love?”
  3. “Do you have an enemy right now in your life whom you could treat with generosity by helping meet their needs? Would you dare?” (10:00)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the paradox of loving enemies:

• “The wisdom of repaying evil with good is that it creates the only possibility for evil to be truly overcome.” (07:50)

On the transformational potential of kindness:

• John David Walt & Dad, on ‘killing with kindness’:
  • “That means to just be so good to them and nice to them that they're not going to turn to be ugly...” (13:48)
  • “If you act ugly to your enemy, they'll think, well, I was right about him.” (14:09)
  • “Jesus is the ultimate story of that. ...God didn't give up on us. He went all the way to the cross for us.” (14:34)

On prayer as a first step:

• “I think it may start with praying for our enemies, just beginning to…say their name before God. That's a move. God will respond to that.” (12:30)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:20 — Sunday as “practice”; spiritual preparation
• 02:30 — Reading of Proverbs 25:21–22
• 04:40 — Romans 12:17–21 tie-in
• 05:10–06:35 — Effects of returning evil vs. good
• 07:15 — What “heaping burning coals” really means
• 08:00 — “Hate never wins,” darkness and monsters
• 10:00 — Reflection prompts and journaling
• 11:00 — “Wisdom is the imagination of heaven”
• 13:38–14:41 — Conversational unpacking, “kill them with kindness”; link to Christ’s example
• 15:07–18:31 — Hymn: “Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing” and reflection on God’s faithfulness
• 18:31 — Closing encouragement to attend church and free resources

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Original Tone and Language

• Friendly, reflective, slightly humorous, and deeply encouraging.
• Biblical wisdom is conveyed in storytelling and conversational style, with humility and seriousness for the challenge.
• Invites self-examination and action, with a blend of anecdote and practical spirituality.

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Summary for New Listeners

This episode centers on the biblical wisdom of returning kindness for injury—the “counterintuitive war of love.” Walt breaks down the personal, spiritual, and relational costs of vengeance, and the uniquely transformative power of responding to enemies with grace. Drawing from Proverbs, Romans, and the teachings of Jesus, the conversation encourages listeners to move beyond instinct and reflect heaven’s wisdom, even to those who oppose them. Thoughtful prompts and a gentle spirit make the episode an invitation to growth and genuine practice of Christlike love, finished with a hymn celebrating God’s sustaining mercy.

Transcript

[A]

Foreign. Sowers for a great awakening. And Happy Sunday it's called, they call Sunday down through history the Lord's Day. And I'm like, well, I thought Saturday was the Lord's day and Monday, they're all the Lord's day. You know what I call Sunday? Practice. We're going to the field house to practice. That's church. And then we're going to be in the fields for the week, doing the sowing, playing the game, the big game. So today we're going to church and I'm looking forward to is January 25th in the year of our Lord 2026. And I'm John David Walt and this is your wake up call. So I'll cut to the chase today. Let's dive straight in. Consecration. Wake up, sleeper. Rise from the dead and Christ will shine on you. Jesus, I belong to you. I lift up my heart to you. I set my mind on you. I fix my eyes on you. I offer my body to you as a living sacrifice. Jesus, we belong to you. And we're praying in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. Amen. Well, today's entry is entitled. This is. This is going to hit harsh. The way to burn your enemies. Oh my gosh. Our text all day long. Chapter 25 of Proverbs. We are going to focus in on two verses, verses 21 and 22. I want you to read the whole chapter. Hear now the word of the Lord. If your enemy is hungry, give him food to eat. If he is thirsty, give him water to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head and the Lord will reward you. The word of the Lord. How about that? How to burn your enemies. Now consider this. What's wise about treating your enemies well? My enemy does not have my best interest in mind. In fact, my enemies want me to fail. A hungry and thirsty enemy sounds like a vulnerable enemy. It sounds like a scenario in which I might have the upper hand. It may provide an opportunity to defeat my enemy. That would be good, right? Neutralizing an enemy makes sense, doesn't it? Wouldn't everyone expect this? Don't we want to overcome and even do away with our enemies? Despite all this, wisdom teaches us to care for our enemies, to give them food and drink in response to their needs. We get some clues from Paul's use of this very text in his letter to the Romans. This is chapter 12. Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everyone. If it is possible, as Far as it depends on you. Live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God's wrath. For it is written, it is mine to avenge, I will repay, says the Lord. On the contrary, if your enemy is hungry, give him something. Feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals on his head. Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. That's chapter 12 of Romans 17:21. When I try to overcome evil with evil, here's the outcome. Number one, when I give my enemy a taste of his own medicine, I am the one who gets sick. Number two, When I repay bad for bad, I escalate the conflict. Number three, when I retaliate against my enemy by fighting fire with fire, I do irreversible damage and diminish the chances of any productive outcome. Now, when I try to overcome evil with good, it leads to a different outcome. Here's three more. Number one, When I return good for evil, I avoid the infection brought on by the toxicity of evil. Number two, When I repay bad with good, I create the possibility of de. Escalating the conflict. And number three, responding to evil with good is actually a subversive form of retaliation. It is an offensive tactic that has the effect of heaping burning coals on their head. When your enemy wrongs you and you retaliate, it justifies your enemy by reaffirming their decision. When you respond to bad with good, it actually has the effect of shaming your enemy. This is what the reference about burning coals means. It can have the effect of causing them to reevaluate their decision and changing the outcome altogether. The wisdom of repaying evil with good is that it creates the only possibility for evil to be truly overcome. Evil cannot be overcome by evil. Darkness cannot drive out darkness. Right? You don't destroy a monster by becoming a monster. Hate cannot defeat hate. Because if hate defeats hate, you realize what just happened? Hate won and hate never wins. It's why wisdom wages the counterintuitive war of love. Right? We're bringing back Pat Benatar. Maybe it was Love is a battlefield. And is this not our whole story? Friends? The divine response of good in the face of evil. The story of the cross. State risk. No further witnesses, your honor. Let's pray. Abba. Father. In response to and in the face of the unmitigated evildoing of the human race, you sent the perfect gift of goodness, your son. Bring that kind of Holy Spirit inspired imagination into our lives. That we could see a new way, a better way, the way of the cross. We pray in that way now. In the name of Jesus, Amen. Our journal prompts today. Can you recall a situation where someone responded to evil with good? What happened? What do you make of this notion of the counterintuitive war of love? Do you have an enemy right now in your life whom you could treat with generosity by helping meet their needs? Would you dare? This is deep stuff. This is, this is Jesus. I mean, Jesus is the wisdom of God. And what does he say? Love your, your enemies and pray for those who persecute you. You know, I don't think he's saying you gotta like your enemies. Love's deeper than like, in a way he's, he's trying to overcome evil and he's just, he's telling us the only way you're gonna overcome evil is with good, which does feel counterintuitive. And it's certainly. I don't know, this is, this is a good one to, to wrestle with today on this Sunday, as we get ready to head into the house of the Lord. I'm just going to let you ponder with it a bit. And I think it may start with praying for our enemies, just beginning to just, just say their name before God. That's a move. God will respond to that. Keep saying their name before God. God will respond. Let it get out of your hands and into God's hands. Let the imagination of heaven. That's wisdom. Okay, wisdom. I never thought it before, but wisdom is the imagination of heaven. That's what I love about my word, my new word for the new year, James 3:17. But the wisdom from heaven, it says, is first of all pure. Then peace. Loving says considerate, submissive, full of mercy and good fruit. A couple more. I can't remember yet, but I'm learning it. Like that's the test of, of a plan, isn't it? Of a, an approach. Is it those things? Because that's the wisdom from heaven. Wisdom of heaven's coming from another place than just the sort of vindictive, retaliatory, angry, often hate filled way of earth. Okay, we're going to sing here. Dad's with me. Get ready. All right everybody, as we're getting ready to go to church today, we've got our favorite worship leader here helping us to, to sing the hymn today. And dad, in the day's wake up call, we talked about loving your enemies like it's. The Bible teaches, you know, if your enemy's hungry, give him something to eat. If he's thirsty, give him something to drink. It says, by this you'll heap burning coals on their head.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You've. You've heard the phrase, kill them with love. Kindness. Yes, Kill them with kindness. What does that mean?

[B]

That means to just be so good to them and nice to them that they're not going to turn to be.

[A]

Ugly that they'll wonder why they were your enemy.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

Yeah. And that.

[B]

Start with.

[A]

That kind of burns them up.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. But it changes them.

[A]

It. That's the only way people change.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

Because guess what? If you act ugly to your enemy, they'll think, well, I was right about him.

[C]

Right.

[B]

And I can act uglier than that.

[A]

I can do even worse than that. So that's so good. And of course, Jesus is the ultimate story of that. God. We turned against God and God didn't give up on us. He went all the way to the cross for us.

[B]

And it happens every day now.

[A]

Well, what are we singing today?

[B]

Come Thy fount of every blessing.

[A]

What's Our number?

[B]

Page 37 in this hymn book that we're looking at. Our Great Redeemer's Praise.

[A]

Our Great Redeemer's Praise. This is number 37 we're going to sing. There's only three verses. We'll sing them all. This is a classic hymn. It's a good one to wake up and get going on Sunday with.

[B]

It is.

[A]

Here we go.

[C]

Come thou fount of every blessing Tune my heart to sing thy grace Streams of mercy never ceasing Gr Calling songs of loudest praise Teach me some Melodus sonnet Sung by saving tongues above Praise the mount I'm fixed upon it Mount of thy redeeming love Here I raise my Ebl Hitherto I thy help uncom and I help by thy good pleasure Safely to arrive at home Jesus sung me when a stranger wandering from the fold of God he to rescue me from danger Interpose his precious blood Last verse. O to grace how great a debtor daily I'm constrained to be Let thy goodness like a fetter and my hun' ring heart to thee Prone to wonder Lord, I lay lit Prone to leave the God I love Hear thy heart oh, take and seal it. Seal it where thy courts above that's Amen.

[A]

Another great one right there.

[C]

That is.

[B]

That'll. That'll bring you to your knees.

[A]

Well, you know that word in there. Here I raise my Ebenezer, which is in the Old Testament. It was the practice of stacking up stones to remind you. You made an altar, essentially. And Ebenezer, you raised it up. Which says what it means, Ebenezer, means the Lord has brought us safe thus far. And you just want to keep remembering. Sometimes in life you can focus on how far you got to go. And I think the Lord wants us to realize how far we've come.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And how far he's brought us. Because when you think you can't make it forward, he wants us to remember he's the one that got us this far.

[B]

That's right. And he'll keep going if you'll give him a chance.

[A]

And that's what he says. And I hope by thy good pleasure, safely to arrive at home.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

At home. And you know what? That's where we're all headed. We. This world is not really our home, is it?

[B]

No, it's a, it's just a thing in our life.

[A]

We're just passing through. Yeah, we're just, we're helping. We're walking each other home. That's what I like to say.

[B]

And that's exactly what it is.

[A]

We're walking each other home. So let's enjoy church today. We're going to get to be with the people of God and, and our friends and neighbors.

[B]

We're all together.

[A]

Just encourage you to go to church today. If you can't make it to a, to a church, join your church online. If you don't have a church online, come to Gillette.

[B]

We got one.

[A]

Because we're going to be broadcasting worldwide today.

[C]

Amen.

[A]

We are throwing our nets into the deep water and we're going to see what we can catch. So we'd love for you to come to our church. Just go to Gillette Methodist church, Facebook or YouTube. We get started at 10:30. We'll be there live. It'll be there later for you at your leisure. And it's going to be a good Sunday. So guys, we're getting geared up, we're getting ready for, for Lent coming up starts Ash Wednesday. I've written a book already for it. It's. I'm excited about it.

[C]

Is it this?

[A]

It's this, not this Wednesday. It's up in February. But we're trying to give people notice so they. Have you ordered a book yet?

[B]

I don't think I have.

[A]

Well, dad, we got to get you a book.

[B]

Give me a book.

[A]

And of course we'll be doing it on the wake up call. You don't have to have a book. But I'd love for you to have one. So you can.

[B]

We might have one.

[A]

You can take notes, and you can just kind of make underlines and note down what you're hearing from the Lord. It's going to be a good journey. I call it Jesus asking the three Transformational questions of Lent. And you can see the link in today's email. So we better let you go. We got to get going. Obviously, I'm not wearing this to just. So I got to get cleaned up and ready to roll.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

So for The Awakening, I'm J.D. walt.

[B]

And I'm David.

[C]

Walt.

[A]

And today, we won't see you on the field. We'll see you at the.