The Watch – Episode Summary

Podcast: The Watch (The Ringer)
Episode: ‘Alien: Earth’ Failed Itself. Plus, Ethan Hawke and Sterlin Harjo on ‘The Lowdown,’ and ‘Slow Horses’ Is Back!
Date: September 25, 2025
Hosts: Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald
Special Guests (Live Segment): Ethan Hawke, Sterlin Harjo

Episode Overview

This episode of The Watch tackles three main pop culture touchpoints: the divisive finale of FX’s “Alien: Earth,” a spirited interview with Ethan Hawke and Sterlin Harjo about their new series “The Lowdown,” and the return of fan-favorite spy dramedy “Slow Horses” for season five. Andy and Chris deliver their trademark blend of incisive critique, TV nerd detail, and banter, moving from granular scene analysis to broader reflections on genre and contemporary television’s evolving standards. The live “Lowdown” interview, meanwhile, exposes the creative energy and camaraderie behind the show, surfacing stories about collaboration, the Tulsa setting, and actor-director process.

Segment 1: Alien: Earth Finale – Postmortem

Main Points & Discussion (03:16–39:19)

Disappointment and Diagnosis

• Chris opens with his provocative thesis: “Alien Earth didn’t fail me, and it didn’t fail the Alien franchise. I think it failed itself.” (03:16)
  • He’d been an early season supporter, but felt the finale moved from promise to letdown.
• Andy compares the finale’s ending to “moving all of the pieces to the middle of the game board and then call[ing] game.” (06:14)
  • He questions the wisdom of ending on a setup with no guaranteed season two: “It was an enormous letdown, frankly.” (07:17)

Plot and Character Frustrations

• Chris: The show’s high-concept worldbuilding can’t mask problems in payoffs and logic.
  • The climactic moment: “Wendy now controls two xenomorphs with her voice and all of networked digital equipment with her brain” (05:01)
  • “What distance have we covered over... eight and a half hours?” (05:20)
• Both hosts bemoan the lack of meaningful stakes:
  • “The only people who really get it are red shirts.” – Chris (07:22)
  • Perplexing character motivations, especially Kirsch’s shifting allegiances and Hermit’s arc.

The Alien Problem

• Andy: “The alien, ultimately, are the least interesting thing... in how they are deployed.” (30:43)
• Chris: “If you just were like, it's about AI and synthetic people and immortality and Peter Pan, I would just be like, I'm not that interested in that.” (30:58)
  • They note a lack of “consequences and stakes” compared to traditional Alien stories.

Writing, Structure, and Craft

• Reference the standards set by shows like Andor; discuss how careful narrative architecture (e.g., “prison logic”) raises the bar for sci-fi TV. (24:32–28:51)
  • “The standard has been raised,” Andy observes, and Alien: Earth falls short in detail and completeness.

Notable Quotes

• “You don’t want an ending of a season... to be described as 'shocking' for the reasons that I found this ending to be shocking.” – Andy (05:27)
• “This is just such a punt. This is not really saying anything other than what is a human.” – Chris (08:16)
• “At a certain point, the characters on the show are not serious people about what they are messing with and... it’s hard for me to take it seriously.” – Andy (33:00)
• “The last thing I’ll just leave us with is... still these aliens have not gotten off that island.” – Chris (33:27)

Segment 2: Slow Horses Season 5 Premiere (40:42–50:13)

Main Points & Discussion

The “Thriller” Returns

• Chris and Andy celebrate the restoration of urgency and teamwork to the Slow Horses ensemble.
  • “I love this season because it puts the thriller back in spy thriller.” – Chris (41:06)
  • The new season is based on Mick Herron’s novel London Rules and is “a Roddy-centric season.”
• Praise for the ensemble dynamic:
  • “It just feels like the propulsion is back in this show... exploring the studio space, finding out what they sound like live.” – Chris (41:49)
  • Andy notes the “beauty and the brilliance and the stability of the show is that it has these books.”

Craft, Direction, and Character

• Directed by Saul Metstein, with showrunner Will Smith’s swan song; strong character-focused writing likened to “the best sitcoms” and “classical music composer[s].”
  • “The ball movement is elite,” Andy observes of the going-away party scene (49:18)
• Andy lauds the silent, tense opening mass shooting as “brilliantly pulled off.” (45:13)
• They appreciate how new character pairings “shuffle the deck” in S5. (49:44)

Notable Quotes

• “Louisa leaves Slough House and River is obviously like, I’m kind of the last, I’m holding the bag here.” – Chris (46:32)
• “London rules. Yes... the risk you run is that if there’s a book that is [less strong, you’re stuck].” – Andy (42:01)
• “It’s a masterclass on how to manage a large ensemble.” – Andy (49:36)

Segment 3: The Lowdown – Ethan Hawke & Sterlin Harjo Interview (Live, 52:24–90:19)

Main Points & Insights

Creative Genesis and Collaboration (53:01–56:02)

• Harjo and Hawke met pre-Reservation Dogs, first collaborating on that show before realizing they wanted to work together on something more.
• Inspiration: Character “Lee” is loosely based on Harjo’s real-life journalist friend Leroy Chapman.
  • “He was a journalist and sort of a thorn in the side to the establishment... he had a lot to do with helping the Tulsa race massacre... come out.” – Harjo (54:06)
• Harjo wrote the lead with Hawke in mind (“a sort of Ethan Hawke pass”). Hawke was tricked into notes: “Script’s fun, but I should be in this.” (55:51)

How They Work: Vibe, Blocking, Trust (56:22–63:15)

• “It almost feels like being in a band together,” says Hawke on the creative partnership. (56:33)
• Both emphasize a fluid, improvisational, and trusting working style:
  • Hawke: “We would do that a lot. Let’s just see what happens, you know... It was kind of like jazz in a way.” (61:13)
  • Harjo: “We’re also not precious. Once I write it, once it’s down, it’s like, let’s do whatever we can do to make this better.” (59:26)

Place and Energy: Tulsa as Co-star (69:08–73:53)

• Tulsa is described as an “incredible co-star” – a noir not seen in typical US cities.
  • Hawke: “All the crimes of America are on the surface in Oklahoma... It’s alive and it’s present... a perfect place for a noir.” (70:52)
• The show's core community energy comes from a “mixture of immense gratitude for the privilege of getting to be a creative person” and “irreverence... fuck it, I’m doing something with it.” (69:26–70:19)

Character Construction & Thematic Depth (75:17–80:32)

• Lee embodies a familiar but complex PI archetype—idealistic to a fault, inspiring but with “blind spots.”
  • Hawke: “What Leroy Chapman was... obviously somebody to be admired... it creates blind spots. You know, they don’t see the glasses of wine their tail is breaking over, you know, because they’re so hell bent to do this thing... that contradiction of it being both noble and destructive seemed real to me.” (77:12–78:45)

Making a Mystery (86:14–88:26)

• Plot construction (“plot is four letters hard for you: P-L-O-T”) is not Harjo’s default, but the challenge revealed genre’s power for making deeper points.
  • “You can actually say more with genre than you can just out there freeballing.” – Harjo (87:14)

Influence & Discovery (88:26–90:19)

• Both reflect on the importance of infusing character and world with real culture. Hawke credits Harjo for continually introducing new music, writers, and artists into the work.

Standout Moments & Quotes

• “He literally said... is this ready to go out? You got any notes?... I’m like, script’s fun, but I should be in this. And Stone just went back, yeah, I can fix that.” – Hawke (55:40–56:01)
• “[Directing] is kind of like jazz... we’re improvising as we go, but it always meant something.” – Harjo (61:13)
• “The way he talks to himself and mumbles and you can just hear the studio executive saying, ‘I can’t understand what he’s saying.’ And I’m like, it’s okay, neither can I. It’s cool.” – Hawke, on The Long Goodbye and pulling art away from blandness (84:56)
• “They bought those scenes, somebody wrote those words. They weren’t superhuman, they were humans, just like us.” – Harjo (83:50)

Episode Highlights: Quotes and Timestamps

• “Alien Earth didn’t fail me, and it didn’t fail the Alien franchise. I think it failed itself.” – Chris Ryan (03:16)
• “This is just such a punt. This is not really like saying anything other than what is a human?” – Chris Ryan (08:16)
• “If you just singled out [Kirsch’s] scenes, it would be incomprehensible to me what his motivations are. Do you share that?” – Andy Greenwald (09:42)
• “The standard has been raised. And I think that what we are bumping on is the difference between a show that is dedicated to giving us a complete thought... and a show that is maybe an imperfect vessel for what motivates the creator.” – Andy Greenwald (28:50)
• “If you just were like, it’s about AI and synthetic people and immortality and Peter Pan, I would just be like, I’m not interested.” – Chris Ryan (30:58)
• “It’s a masterclass on, on how to manage a large ensemble.” – Andy Greenwald on Slow Horses (49:36)
• “All of the crimes of America are on the surface in Oklahoma... It’s alive and it’s present, and so it’s a perfect place for a noir.” – Ethan Hawke (70:52)
• “There’s a rebellious spirit to Sterling. There’s a rebellious spirit to try to make a show like this.” – Ethan Hawke (82:56)

Conclusion

This episode of The Watch sharply dissects the pitfalls and hopes of three major TV offerings, blending granular TV storytelling critique with infectious enthusiasm and soulfulness during the live interview segment. Andy and Chris remain skeptical but generous about “Alien: Earth,” delighted about "Slow Horses," and genuinely moved by the creative energy and sincerity behind “The Lowdown.” Listeners come away with both big-picture reflections on streaming TV and a close-up on how great shows get made.

For specific segments, see:

• Alien: Earth discussion: 03:16–39:19
• Slow Horses S5: 40:42–50:13
• The Lowdown live interview: 52:24–90:19