Danny McBride on the Premiere of ‘The Righteous Gemstones’ S4. Plus, ‘The White Lotus’ E4 and ‘Severance’ E8.

Summary

The Watch – Episode Summary

Episode Title: Danny McBride on the Premiere of ‘The Righteous Gemstones’ S4.
Host(s): Chris Ryan & Andy Greenwald
Guest: Danny McBride
Date: March 10, 2025
Episode Focus:

• The surprising Civil War-themed premiere of ‘The Righteous Gemstones’ Season 4
• In-depth TV talk: ‘The White Lotus’ S3E4 & ‘Severance’ S2E8
• Interview with Danny McBride on creating Gemstones’ final season

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Overview

This lively episode of The Watch covers the surprise Civil War opener of The Righteous Gemstones S4 (with Bradley Cooper), deep-dives into the tricky arcs of The White Lotus S3, and reckons with the divisive “Harmony” episode of Severance. Hosts Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald unpack what makes these shows tick (or stall) and engage Danny McBride for a fascinating interview about artistic risk, Southern filmmaking, and finishing strong in TV.

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1. The Righteous Gemstones S4 Premiere: The Civil War Flashback

Segment Start: [54:48]
Key Points:

• The season opens with a bold, unexpected Civil War flashback episode focused on the Gemstone family’s origins.
• Bradley Cooper stars as Elijah Gemstone—a con man who finds faith in the most unlikely circumstances.
• The episode is tonally and visually distinct, shot in 10 days, with a “Gettysburg” epic quality.
• McBride’s creative impulse: To explore the distant roots of the Gemstones, showing how a con man’s accidental ministry birthed a dynasty.
• HBO was surprisingly receptive, greenlighting this unconventional opener.
• The cast, crew, and especially production and costume designers, took on the challenge of creating 19th-century authenticity amid South Carolina’s unpredictable weather.

Notable Quote:

“I submitted that script in, and I thought for sure HBO would be like, yeah, we’re good with it... But they responded positively... I think they appreciated the ambition."
— Danny McBride [68:18]

Bradley Cooper’s Involvement:

• Approached somewhat on a lark—he hadn’t seen Gemstones before, but agreed quickly.
• Chose not to watch the show until after filming to avoid mimicry, bringing his own dramatic tone.
• Cooper brought impressive professionalism, never complaining about conditions, costuming, or lack of trailer/pay.

Meta Reflection:

• Danny McBride sees his team's TV work as a chance to iterate on vibe and genre:

“There’s the humor you’re going for and the story you’re going for, but you and your team...have such a keen aesthetic sensibility, too.”
— Andy Greenwald [72:52]

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2. The White Lotus S3E4: Secrets, Shadow, and Slow Burn

Segment Start: [13:54]
Discussion Themes:

• Chris and Andy question the season’s heavy reliance on mystery and secret-keeping; most characters only reveal about “65%” of themselves.
• Past seasons provided more up-front fault lines and interpersonal tension; here, much is left deliberately obscured, including key character motivations.
• Parker Posey’s performance as Victoria stands out in both subtlety and comedic moments.
• The show’s structure, with more episodes this season, is possibly contributing to the "slow burn" feel—events and reveals (gun in the wild, simmering revenge plots, and intersecting storylines) are teased rather than delivered.

Memorable Quote:

“There’s a lot of shadow four hours in... Why is Victoria willfully ignoring the obvious, open, robed, drug-like addled husband in front of her?”
— Chris Ryan [16:13]

• They compare this patience-testing, set-up-heavy vibe to Black Mirror: You trust a payoff is coming, but it's unclear if or when the bomb really drops.

Social Commentary:

• The yacht sequence pushes the show into fresh satirical territory, offering “the funniest social commentary” of the season so far.

On Parker Posey:

“...talking to everybody and reacting to everybody. And I love, by the way, the scene...when Goggins was talking to, like, Neil and Mitch about hiding his...money. I loved every second of it.”
— Andy Greenwald [24:40]

Audience Trust:

• Andy notes: watchers rely on “accrued equity” from White Lotus’ earlier seasons to trust there will be a satisfying payoff.

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3. Severance S2E8 (“The Harmony Episode”): Dividing the Audience

Segment Start: [40:15]
The Episode:

• S2E8 pivots, focusing almost exclusively on Harmony Cobel’s (Patricia Arquette) backstory and her twisted history with Lumen Industries.
• The episode is visually striking, with production spanning years and locations—from Newfoundland for exteriors to Bronx interiors.
• Harmony is revealed to be the inventor of the “severance” procedure, having survived a Dickensian upbringing in a Lumen-owned child labor sweatshop.

Audience & Host Responses:

• Chris and Andy find the episode to be “an absolute slog” despite the immense craft on display.
• Andy: “There is a...reflexive fandom defense of like, oh, not everything needs to be spoon fed to you. And this is world-building. ...This is a fucking entertainment process.” [45:05]

Storytelling Critique:

• The aesthetics and commitment to “making a beautiful chair” (production, visuals) outweigh the basics of dramatic engagement.
• For Andy, the show feels “smug” and “unwelcoming” in this mode; the triumphal music and climactic tone at the end ring false, especially as Harmony is “bad... the whole thing’s kind of an evil endeavor.” [50:53]
• Chris is more forgiving, appreciating new context for Harmony but agrees a lot of the run time rehashes known information.

Bigger Picture:

• They speculate S2 is perhaps a "table-setting" year, prepping for a blockbuster S3:

“There is a world where the third season rips...all of this labor...could be in the service of a third season that has communicated clearly what the stakes are and where it’s going.”
— Andy Greenwald [51:06]

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4. Interview: Danny McBride on Wrestling with TV Endings and Southern Creativity

Segment Start: [67:49]
Highlights:

• Deciding to end Righteous Gemstones with S4 was an organic process as ideas gravitated around closure.
• The writing team always constructed seasons as if they could be the last—McBride wanted each to “matter,” with no “sleepwalking.”

Quote:

“I wanted to never get to that point where anybody was, like, sleepwalking through it. I wanted every season of it to matter, and I wanted to complete the story...”
— Danny McBride [81:42]

• TV as a better fit than movies for McBride’s unpredictable, character-rich storytelling. He recalls the frustration of trying to market Foot Fist Way and realized TV allowed for more freedom and surprise.
• Working in the South (Charleston, SC) keeps the creative team out of the LA “distraction” loop and connected to the types of stories they want to tell.
• McBride, despite hundreds of hours of TV writing, rarely watches current prestige TV while in production—his brain needs mindless reality comfort when working.

Final Season Focus:

• The “original sin” of the Gemstones—coping with loss, family legacy, and the search for meaning amid ridiculous excess—anchors the show’s heart beneath the comedy.

“As despicable as these characters are, how do you make them relatable?... In that first season, it was like the death of their mother... For all the hanging dong and all the other crazy, that is sort of the thing... at the center.”
— Danny McBride [95:40]

• Cooper’s commitment and the show’s collaborative spirit—from Jim Cummings’ casting to rely-on-collaborators approach—is highlighted as the secret sauce for memorable TV.

On the Ashley Schaefer Bloopers Phenomenon:

• Even Danny gets served the notorious Ashley Schaefer BMW outtakes on YouTube.
• The infamous “plums” bit from Eastbound & Down was unscripted, with McBride’s longtime editor Jeff Siebenk assembling the classic reel.

“There was zero plums in that original script.” — Danny McBride [98:04]

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5. Notable Quotes

• “There’s a lot of shadow four hours in.” — Chris Ryan (on The White Lotus, [16:13])
• “I do not think that there is virtue in this episode being an absolute slog to watch.” — Andy Greenwald (Severance, [45:04])
• “When you’re subscribing to a service, every single thing doesn’t have to, like, deliver millions of viewers...you’re given a little more latitude.” — Danny McBride (on TV vs. film, [86:53])
• “How do people move forward and change, when they’d rather hold onto what has been?” — Danny McBride (on Gemstones’ final season, [96:59])

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6. Episode Structure & Key Timestamps

| Segment | Start Time | |------------------------------------------|------------| | Podcast nonsense & banter | 01:06 | | Gemstones S4 Civil War premiere intro | 14:11 | | The White Lotus S3E4 in-depth | 13:54 | | Severance S2E8 discussion | 40:15 | | Interview: Danny McBride | 67:49 |

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7. Tone & Style

The episode is characteristically conversational, irreverent, and self-aware. Chris and Andy riff on pop culture references, admit to (and joke about) forgetting major plot points in big shows, and are refreshingly open about their mixed reactions (especially on Severance’s divisive direction).

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8. For New Listeners

This summary offers a roadmap through three of today’s most-discussed prestige shows, with a detailed interview portion full of insider wit, creative wisdom, and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you’re a die-hard TV nerd, comedy fan, or just want to know what the talk is about, this episode delivers the goods—sincere, funny, and always in on the joke.

Transcript

[Chris Ryan]

This episode of the Watch is brought to you by Coffee Mate. Coffee Mate has been searching the globe for flavors that pair perfectly with coffee. So when they heard the new season of HBO's original series the White Lotus was set in Thailand, they were inspired to brew up two new flavored creamers. Thai iced coffee and Pina colada flavored creamers. They're available for a short time only, so for the love of coffee, go try them now. This episode is brought to you by Universal Pictures. Would you sell your soul for greatness? What would you be willing to sacrifice? Find out on September 19th in the new Jordan Peele produced horror film Him Only in theaters. Starring Marlon Wayans as the greatest football player of all time and Tyreek Withers as his up and coming protege. Directed by Justin Tipping and produced by Monkeypaw Productions, Never Meet yout Idols. Him hits theaters September 19th. This episode is brought to you by Diet Coke. You know that moment when you just.

[Danny McBride]

Need to hit pause and refresh.

[Chris Ryan]

An ice cold Diet Coke isn't just a break.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's your chance to catch your breath.

[Chris Ryan]

And savor a moment that's all about you.

[Danny McBride]

Always refreshing. Still the same great taste Diet Coke. Make time for Utah time.

[Chris Ryan]

Pain sports to have to clear the room.

[Andy Greenwald]

Stand up and walk now.

[Chris Ryan]

Hello and welcome to the Watch. My name is Chris Ryan. I am an [e-mail] and joining me in the studio when he found out the latest episode of Severance was a harmony episode, he said, piper. No, it's Andy Greenwald.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, yeah, look at that.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, cross, cross the streams there on White Lotus and Severance.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was like SEO intro.

[Chris Ryan]

And I also tipped the cap to some viral content, you know, because you know Parker Posey on Good Morning America is just going nuts right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

Parker Posey on Good Morning America.

[Chris Ryan]

She went on Good Morning America and did her, did her Victoria Ralph voice and people were falling out of their chairs.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean that's great for her.

[Chris Ryan]

Honestly. She's one of my faves.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

I got some great Parker Posey stories from the city of New York City.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Oh, seeing her out.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is that time you went on an all night date with her and you went to Russ and daughter's Nate Fish. Oh, that was an episode of Louis. Sorry, we're getting hard to remember Andy.

[Chris Ryan]

Greenwald today on the Watch podcast.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is a good one.

[Chris Ryan]

Why are we Special guest Danny McBride talking about last night's extraordinary.

[Andy Greenwald]

Last night's Danny McBride free episode of Righteous Gemstones.

[Chris Ryan]

We'll talk a little bit more about that with spoilers. Once we get to that part of the episode, obviously that conversation with Danny is full spoilers. We put that up on our YouTube page.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is it up already?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, you can. That went up last night after the episode of Righteous Gemstones aired. You can watch that Ringer Dash TV is the channel. You can also watch us on Spotify on the Watch page. You can listen to us on Spotify. And wherever you get your podcasts, hit us up. The watchpotify.com is the email.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay.

[Chris Ryan]

And the WatchPod underscore on Instagram. We'll be doing a mailbag soon, I think. A very pit centric mailbag. If. If. If my calculations are correct, and from.

[Andy Greenwald]

What I understand, you are the. All the information coming towards our podcast flows through you.

[Chris Ryan]

Kaya is in charge of our DMS on the watchpod underscore, I think, and.

[Andy Greenwald]

In your personal accounts as well.

[Chris Ryan]

So when people are like, I find Chris Ryan undeniably attractive. I would love to give him $10 million to be my house husband. She's just like, pass.

[Andy Greenwald]

Wow. Did you have to talk to her about that?

[Chris Ryan]

No. She doesn't even tell me. It's like, that's this mystery.

[Andy Greenwald]

Got it.

[Chris Ryan]

Got it. Grimo, great to see you, man.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was awesome that Danny McBride came through.

[Chris Ryan]

He was the best, man.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's the best. He's such a nice guy. I think we can talk about it more when we get to the interview. I just want to say that of the many guests that we've had to this campus where we record the podcast, including myself, because technically, every time I'm kind of a guest, you're America's guest. This overstayed his welcome. Danny McBride is the only person who's actually taken his Spotify guest sticker and put it on his person.

[Chris Ryan]

He was also like, cool office you guys have here.

[Andy Greenwald]

He liked it. He was into it. What a good guy.

[Chris Ryan]

How you doing with the time change? You good? This sucks.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is. This one's tough.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. I think a lot of podcasts in America are starting with a little time change talk.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

But I thought I would do it, you know.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. You want to talk me through your experience? The time change. You were. You were away for the weekend, so maybe you just lingered a little bit longer.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, it was. You know what it is? It's a fun Saturday night because you're like, look at me.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Johnny dangerous up at 2 in the morning again. And. And then it's a pretty tough Monday morning when you're like, it is it is not 8:15. No, it is 7:15. I know. You have not seen 8:15 asleep in a long time.

[Andy Greenwald]

No. What's it like? No. My experience was even weirder because I was going to dinner on Saturday night, and for whatever reason, my car, which I don't know if I've mentioned is an electric vehicle. You're welcome. Changed its clock early. And I. I assume that's actually tariffs.

[Chris Ryan]

That's just.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was the tariffs cost kicking me an hour. So I was going to dinner and I was like, oh, no, is it seven? Forget it. Because I was so upset at the thought of eating dinner at seven instead of six. That's my life. Meanwhile, Kai is telling US she has 8:45 dinner reservations.

[Chris Ryan]

We have a bunch of stuff to talk about today. We're going to talk a little bit about that most recent episode of Severance, as I mentioned. Obviously, the white lynch.

[Andy Greenwald]

Controversial. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And we'll talk a little bit about Gemstone's premiere. I wanted to ask you, Andy, if you had had a chance to see the Last of Us season two trailer.

[Andy Greenwald]

I did. And. And they showed it before Lotus as well. But the shorter version. But I did see the full.

[Chris Ryan]

The full. The full. Any reaction? This is. I realized that this might be in the severance zone of. I don't remember how this ended. I mean, obviously I know that they're in a town and like, et cetera, but like, I can't really. There was. The only thing I was looking for in this trailer was the Caitlyn Deaver character. Abby.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is that because you're a big fan of the video game character or what are you like her? I know.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm aware of the discourse surrounding this character.

[Andy Greenwald]

Are you.

[Chris Ryan]

Quite a weekend for discourse surrounding fictional characters.

[Andy Greenwald]

Go on. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

So, I mean, but Abby is apparently a controversial figure in the Last of Us universe and is. Is not people's favorite. And. And Caitlyn Deaver has been like. This has already been unpleasant, you know, so we'll see how this works out.

[Andy Greenwald]

Are you so.

[Chris Ryan]

Wait a second. It's hardly like. It's hardly the most important thing.

[Andy Greenwald]

Are you suggesting that people on the Internet have strong reactions when beloved characters from other mediums are. Are cast and put on screen?

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, you should see the boards about Evel Knievel and Adrien Birdie right now.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's what I knew you were talking about. Thank you. Glad to have that one across my transom. Yeah, I. Well, I remember the end. I remember that basically. And we won't spoil it for People who haven't watched Last of Us, let's grow up.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's, let's.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, I agree, but basically, what. What's her name? Little gal is. She's the cure. But they got to. Oh yeah, extract a cost. And then he's like, nope. And he. He does a little bit of a Shoot em up.

[Chris Ryan]

That's right.

[Andy Greenwald]

And rescues her.

[Chris Ryan]

That's right.

[Andy Greenwald]

And that's.

[Chris Ryan]

I wonder how Dr. Robbie would approach.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's your season one.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Don't even put my beautiful Dr. Robbie in imaginary harm's way. How dare you, sir?

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, with Goggins on two different Sunday night shows right now, I just think that the hbo. The doors need to come down, you know, the walls need to come down and characters need to be floating.

[Andy Greenwald]

You think HBO should be more like a repertory company.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which, by the way, that was the first story I ever wrote for Grantland in June of 2011 was the HBO recycling program about how they always used the same actors. Maybe it's time to bring that full circle.

[Chris Ryan]

I think so.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do think that that would be. I mean, we are joking, but at the same time, one of the decisions that creators have to make is how to play with the empathy meter. And so when you introduce doctors who are doing their best to save the world from a mushroom apocalypse, and then our man is like, nope, I want to save this kid. If it was Dr. Robbie and Dana doing the surgery, that is a bold character choice.

[Chris Ryan]

So when you were making briar patch, did you have like a special briefcase for the empathy meter?

[Andy Greenwald]

We called it the football. I carried it around at all times.

[Danny McBride]

Wildcat cow.

[Andy Greenwald]

It was like James Marsden in paradise. They were like, chief, Chief, I need a little more juice. I need people to care about me more.

[Chris Ryan]

Wildcat is moving. He's got the empathy with him.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sorry. Sor for you and none for me.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm sorry. So this looks cool. I think I'm, I, I've. I've learned not to doubt Craig Mason.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. You were higher on the first season than I was, if I correctly.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I think I'm having a little bit of. It's. It's a little bit of a challenge. I, I don't know whether this is just age or whether this is sheer volume of content on top of a fairly healthy sports intake. And also just, you know, reading about, about the world where I'm, I'm just not remembering entirely what happens on TV shows all the time.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you think that will affect your role as a cultural podcaster?

[Chris Ryan]

No. Not. I mean, I. What I mean is like, I just don't quite remember. I remember the beginning of the Last of Us. I remember Horse. I remember big beats of it.

[Andy Greenwald]

You remember Horse?

[Chris Ryan]

A horse? Wasn't there a horse involved?

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure, yeah. I thought. I didn't. You're like my man horse. Like for Twin Peaks, like.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I remember the beginning getting out of Boston. Because I too got out of Boston and I. And I remember the move west. I remember Melanie Lynskey. I remember Horse.

[Andy Greenwald]

What about Nick Offerman? Oh, yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

This. The Bottle episode. See, I recall a lot of it. I recall a lot of it. Do you think, I wonder, there'd be a. Do they go back to the well.

[Andy Greenwald]

In S2 with a little bit more from their life together?

[Chris Ryan]

No, like a different set of characters.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I mean, I. I think that like a.

[Chris Ryan]

Like a righteous gemstones interlude episode style with Bradley Cooper.

[Andy Greenwald]

I. My. My feeling about this is I. I do remember it. And I was relatively dispassionate about the show. I thought it was beautifully made and creatively and surprisingly made. And in many cases, like the best, maybe the best case scenario for prestige IP storytelling. But if. When the first season was on, I probably said something about maybe having a slight allergic reaction to another dystopic end of the world tale. And I feel increasingly that allergy has only worsened over time.

[Chris Ryan]

You want counter programming?

[Andy Greenwald]

I wouldn't mind. Or just like. Guys, I think we have a pretty good roadmap that it's not going to be fungus. Do you know what I mean? Like, I think there are a lot of like. Like, you know, like Law and Order ripped from the headlines, culprits.

[Chris Ryan]

It's measles.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right. Like it's something really stupid. Yeah. And avoidable. So we'll see. I. It's. I'm sure it will be beautifully made and carefully constructed. And that's not a small thing.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you have an end of the world scenario that you're particularly afraid of?

[Andy Greenwald]

You mean other than the one we're experiencing? Do you mean like. Oh, of like. Of the Big Five. Of like zombies?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, of like Paradise Last of Us.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, okay. Name. Give me some choices.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, those are. Those are two of the biggest Walking dead. Well, those are zombies too. I mean like the. I look at the mushroom. I look at the fungus as, as, like zombies, basically.

[Andy Greenwald]

Wow. Okay. Of those, like, do I have a favorite or one that I'm afraid of?

[Chris Ryan]

One that you're particularly afraid of? One that you're like, it can't be.

[Andy Greenwald]

That I'm not afraid of zombies.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, I don't think that's where we're headed.

[Chris Ryan]

No, me neither. Although World War Z painted a very convincing picture of it. Not the film, the book.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah, that is a high key dick move. I actually didn't see the film. I'm talking about Max Brooks's novel that was actually.

[Chris Ryan]

It's actually a fictional oral history and I highly recommend it. The film is also quite good, but there are two distinct pieces, you know?

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you find. I feel like we've talked about versions of this in the past. Like, particularly when we were watching. Well, there was a rise in, like when people were watching Contagion during the pandemic.

[Chris Ryan]

I was people.

[Andy Greenwald]

So you. You seek solace in fictional representations of real world fears.

[Chris Ryan]

That particular one was Bill asking to do rewatchables about Contagion about a week into it, if I remember correctly. Yeah, I don't know that I necessarily would have fired that up, but I often find myself looking for, like, stuff that represents. That reflects the moment that I'm in somehow. So, yes, I would have watched Contagion either way.

[Andy Greenwald]

I just think that generally, I just think we're wrong about most things. And I think that there is a kind of perverse comfort in turning towards apocalyptic storytelling when the world feels apocalyptic, because even though it's bleak, it's certain.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And it's controllable and knowable. And you can get all the messy stuff out of the way and be like, these good people in dungarees are committed to saving what's left, you know? And it's like, I don't think it's gonna go. I just don't think it's gonna go like that. I actually don't think the world is ending writ large, but I also just feel like I'd like a different type of.

[Chris Ryan]

No, we're in great shape.

[Andy Greenwald]

You haven't given me my Daily News dump yet. My Daily News Digest.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. I mean, let me just check here, see what's going on in the New York Times.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just watching your face on video now. We could actually see it happen in real time. We good?

[Chris Ryan]

You know, the New York Times, it's like a lot of. A lot of, like. Not puff pieces, but it's a lot of, like, color. A lot of fluff today. Stock market's crashing, so.

[Andy Greenwald]

Nice.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's talk a little bit about severance. Want to do that first or you want to do White Lotus first?

[Andy Greenwald]

I think we should do White Lotus first.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's more. More front of mind.

[Chris Ryan]

I have a question about whether or not. And I think I've. I've rung this bill a couple of times. And I am saying this as somebody coming from a position of incredible enjoyment.

[Andy Greenwald]

I thought you were gonna say wealth until 10 minutes ago when the stock market crashed.

[Chris Ryan]

Four episodes in a lot of secret keeping. More so than I feel like I remember from earlier seasons of this show where multiple characters and sets of characters within these little pods are obscuring something either from partner loves, one family member, especially from the audience.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

So that. With the exception of Belinda Guy talk, I mean, I would even. I put Chelsea in the other group. I put all these people in these other groups. We're watching 65% of a character. We're watching 65. They're not telling us, like, don't know why Rick is. I mean, we can guess that. That he's being honest about his father or whatever.

[Andy Greenwald]

But, yeah, I think we were guessing.

[Chris Ryan]

That a week ago, but I don't necessarily know. Does it matter to you that we don't have a really awesome sense of what brings Rick and Chelsea together? And was he, like a fun guy six months ago?

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I think what you're speaking to there, and I think I agree with your larger point, is that up to now we're four episodes in. We're almost halfway through. Do we have nine this season? Ten?

[Chris Ryan]

I think so. I think it's nine.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it's longer. It's maybe a bit longer than past season. So maybe the middle.

[Chris Ryan]

It's been eight in the past, and I think it's nine this season.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's not just that we've had 65% of Rick in terms of his truth telling, it's that Chelsea has had 65% of Rick because he's hiding things from her as well. And Chelsea's character to this point is pretty much just reactive to Rick. Now, I don't mean that as any kind of criticism of Amylou Wood. Is that her name? I think she's great and delightful and fully present in every scene. And I get her and I like the character, but we don't know anything about her past or why she feels so close to Rick or why she's choosing to be with him and supporting him and loving him despite the way he's behaving. So there is a lot of shadow that we're existing.

[Chris Ryan]

That's what I think. I'm. That's a perfect way of putting it. There's a lot of shadow Four hours in. Why is Victoria. Victoria seems to be, like, willfully ignoring the obvious, open, robed, drug like, addled husband in front of her who's going through crisis.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

Um, you know, I. I think that the Greg and Chloe relationship is a little bit more clear where it's like we met on a matchmaking service, but at the same time, like, Greg going from monosyllabic bald beta to like, perhaps like psycho killing. Yeah, is. Is like a. Not a stretch, but it is a. It's an interesting turn to go midway through in conjunction with Belinda interrogating him. I'm not really sure if I'm making, like, a coherent point. I think there's just something interesting where a lot of the first two seasons, I think we learn about characters over the course of the season and they change, but who they are is not as much of a mystery. Or who they are to each other is not as much of a mystery.

[Andy Greenwald]

Or the revelations aren't as slow to come. I mean, I think there's a bunch of different ways to talk about the season, and I think that they will, at least for the purposes of this podcast today, midway through might sound overly critical. I don't mean to be critical because I'm still enjoying the show very, very much, but I do think it is noticeable how little development the individual storylines have experienced over this time. The. Oh, my God, what's. Why am I blanking out? There's too many names. Or maybe it's the time change. Jason Isaacs, Tim Ratliff, Tim. Tim's misery and the development of his circumstance so far is entirely siloed because as you said, no one else is. I mean, they're starting to notice, but they're not really. So it is completely a performance in past seasons at this point. Specifically, I'm thinking about the second season. The fault lines within the groups were not only more evident. Like, if you think about the Michael Imperioli F, Marie Abraham and the kid thing, like, they were behaving in three distinct ways that were already in conflict from the beginning. And then the subsequent fault lines of, like, how they would treat women that were then brought in front of them. And then the upstairs downstairs storyline with the call girl who was then taking advantage of the. So, like, we were starting to see the way the tendrils were overlapping with the behaviors that were introduced in the first two episodes. To this point, I feel like this season is the most. In a way, the characters. The trust that we have in the characters is based solely on the fact that all the Characters are on the White Lotus, meaning the accrued equity of watching two seasons of the show is giving us the patience to be like, well, they're gonna get White Lotus Y sooner or later. It seems like it's all set up to do that.

[Chris Ryan]

It's kind of like watching Black Mirror where you're like. If you're watching a kind of flat setup for a Black Mirror episode, you're like, but something fucking great is gonna happen.

[Andy Greenwald]

What's interesting, though, is again, if you look like. Think about those groups in season two. So there was the family guys trip, and then there was the two couples. And there were so many distinct personalities, but also very, very, very palpable fault lines within it. So with the Aubrey Plaza, Will Sharp, Theo James, my airline buddy, Theo James. Like that.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you wanna explain what you're talking about?

[Andy Greenwald]

Haven't I said that he's just on every flight?

[Chris Ryan]

I think you told me that.

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't say this on the podcast.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't think so.

[Andy Greenwald]

Every time I do a triple take. Because he's very handsome, but he's not like super tall, sculpted Adonis. He just looks like a normal guy.

[Chris Ryan]

Wearing nice clothes who are in the movies and TV actually like that.

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't hobnob with him the way you do.

[Chris Ryan]

No, but, like, aren't they all like five' five and.

[Andy Greenwald]

But they're all wearing just the right distress cords. I mean. Anyway, it doesn't matter. I didn't get to see what he was watching on the last flight, but I promise it wasn't anora. Because he respects his. He respects his.

[Chris Ryan]

You still haven't watched it, right?

[Andy Greenwald]

Flight mates. No, because now for me, if I turn it on.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, you're gonna be like sheeple.

[Andy Greenwald]

You're gonna be like, no, I just kind of. Now I'm like, kind of an exhibitionist with anora. Oh, yeah. Like, now I kind of want to open all the windows in my house and turn it on on the big screen. Neighbors are coming by, stand with sex workers. I want people to know what kind of house this is. Anyway, what I'm trying to say about season two is that the fault lines were very evident and very compelling. And then what was exciting was how were they going to explode across the canvas of a show in which all the characters and plot lines converge this season? Like, if you look at the girls trip.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I got no notes on that.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's totally enjoyable. It's comedic, it's fun. They're all playing the hell out of it. They are also distinguishing the characters so artfully from scene to scene. Leslie Bibb is really, really putting on the afterburners.

[Chris Ryan]

I would like to just also mention one quick thing as we're talking about the. The. The three ladies, Kate, Jacqueline, and Lori.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

What Coon is doing with food acting right now. Elite should be studied.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Watch these last two episodes. She almost is never not stuffing her face with fruit or drinking a beverage.

[Andy Greenwald]

A lot of watermelon and a lot.

[Chris Ryan]

Of, like, she's eating when, like, it gets thrown back to her. Like, the conversation is kind of like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Valentine's looking at her and she's like, yeah, she.

[Chris Ryan]

But it is like, the fact that you get to see her do that and then also, like the sort of rigidity of gilded age is fantastic. It's a great spectrum of performing.

[Andy Greenwald]

She's great. But the stakes of that storyline are still very unclear to me. Sure.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, I think across the board now we have a stolen gun. We have a man on a mission for revenge. Like some actually pretty traditional pulpy plotlines have been kicked into.

[Andy Greenwald]

This was the first episode that tugged on that lever of the, like, oh, we're being pulled inexorably towards some sort of conflict or unpleasantness or anguish for the characters. Yeah, that's absolutely starting to emerge. But the thing that I'm surprised at in this episode, before I turn it back to you, episode one, I got on mic with you and I was like, you know what I'm excited about? I'm excited about a white lotus. All due respect to the multiple Emmy winner, but without Jennifer Coolidge, just because I was like, her tonal variance was. I don't know if it was a drag, but I was like, this was the right time to jettison that character and that storyline because it was so much her show and then the show everyone else was on. What I didn't appreciate was having Tanya from season one to season two gave a character who was always in a sort of disarray and distress, who really was in search of something, and her need to find that thing provided a lot of more traditional episodic week to week and then season to season narrative. She's not there anymore, and yet the show is still in her wake. In that the biggest episode to episode mystery now seems to be Belinda gonna realize who this guy is.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, you know, I hadn't really thought of that until you mentioned it. And I think that for as much as I love her as a public Persona and as a performer, my, like, kind of, I had a Tanya meter that went up and down over the course of two seasons. But I didn't really think about. Maybe it's. The Tanya piece is missing. And that. That is like, actually like this consistent zany, absurdist comic part that maybe it's missing now, but not in a missing way. Like, I miss it. It's just. It's not there.

[Andy Greenwald]

But you could miss the comedy or you could miss the fact that her and her relationship. Was it Portia who was her assistant in season two?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, Portia. It's Haley Lou Richardson.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, she was great. It was Tanya's presence and her questing that pushed the show out of the resort and onto the yachts and into the Tom Hollander character and the crew of gays who were trying to kill him and Portia into Leo Woodall. And it pushed, pushed, pushed outside of it. Now, the equivalent in this episode was, oh, Greg, Gary has a mega yacht that Tanya's money paid for. Right. And so now we're. Now we're pushing out again. And, you know, who cares about the plot hijinks to conspire to get everyone onto this boat?

[Chris Ryan]

There's also but multiple characters who don't want to be doing anything. Like Tim.

[Andy Greenwald]

They don't want to.

[Chris Ryan]

Greg and Rick don't want to be there.

[Andy Greenwald]

So. So the boat ended up being so far the season's best and funniest social commentary with, like, the types of guys that were on there and they're women. And then Parker. Parker Posey talking to everybody and reacting to everybody. And I love, by the way, the scene of just like, when. When Goggins was talking to, like, Neil and Mitch about, like, hiding his. If he ever needs to hide his money. And he goes, sawadi never. Like, I loved every second of it. But in terms of getting characters that I'm interested in fault lines to line up with each other. Not really, because Tim is just totally gacked on Lorazepams and whiskey and doesn't want to be a part of anything.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And is just shutting off. And then everybody's sort of shutting off and siloing themselves. So there wasn't much overlap. Now the boat's continuing and who knows what trouble a Schwarzenegger can get into under a full moon. But yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

So this is. We should note, most White Lotus episodes are a day of the hotel stay.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

This seems like, given the scenes from next week.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh. Which I didn't watch.

[Chris Ryan]

That will be essentially the first part of two, like, one big episode that stretches across two episodes.

[Andy Greenwald]

How are you? So this is a side question, but I was curious about your feelings in light of this episode. One thing that I've noticed about myself, not just when I lose an hour and don't get to have dinner, you know, while the sun's up.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm really selling myself on this pod. My relationship to watching characters get super fucked up has changed a lot. Like, there was a time when I would see characters getting after and I'd be like, yeah, that's what you do on a boat, brother. Like, there but for the grace of some, you know, some Thai cash go. I. Now I'm watching Isaac's just neck pills and then also just consistently drink brown liquor throughout an entire day on a. On the ocean. I'm like, that just seems like barf city, man. That seems unpleasant.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, he tries to heave outside of. Guy talks a little. Stand there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right. I know. You try. I feel like the events catch up to him.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And give him some feelings.

[Chris Ryan]

My read on that is also, like, I understand the. The idea that, you know, everybody is kind of living in their own cloud of pharmacology and denial, but you don't need to be Philip Marlo to figure out where the Lorazepam went. She seems this guy was super uptight, alpha, like, for two days, and now he's, like, hanging dong with the robe open and is fucking in a sarcophagus everywhere he goes. So I think that's where the Larazepam went.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you think you've tracked it down similarly? So what you're saying is this show lacks two crucial occupations.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

A legitimate private detective and a legitimate security guard.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes. Let's talk a little bit about guy talk.

[Andy Greenwald]

Guy talk, man. Blinded by love. And she did look great in her.

[Chris Ryan]

But maybe security guard's not the job.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's not cut out for it.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, he seems like he would be a great. I mean, pick a. Pick a gig. He could work at the snake farm. He could be. There's like, apparently a big boat culture in.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's very calm. Yeah. Which I appreciate.

[Chris Ryan]

And has a sunny disposition.

[Andy Greenwald]

Very positive. Guy thought maybe he was getting a promotion despite allowing an armed robbery to take place under his watch. It is peak. You had one job. I think it is also peak signposting where the guy's like, I am putting a gun in this cabinet. I am locking the cabinets.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm handing you a key.

[Chris Ryan]

We are holding on the cabinet, just to be clear. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Gun in the cabinet.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

So this is. This is Mike White's Chekhov's gun. It has Been pocketed by Tim.

[Chris Ryan]

Yep.

[Andy Greenwald]

Guy talk at least. Does seem aware of the pickle. He's.

[Chris Ryan]

I will call this now as a red herring. I think the gun gets into the wild.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Not to be morbid, but the sound of the weapon going off in the first episode, flash forward or whatever.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Is.

[Chris Ryan]

It sounds like an automatic weapon.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. And there's also. There was a lot of heavy, heavy camera lingering on Greg. Garry looking at Zion, looking at Melinda's son now as a pressure point now that he's coming. Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And he's the focus of that first opening moment in the pilot. Sorry.

[Chris Ryan]

That crime still looms pretty large over this because in the past, it's been a body bag and this is a.

[Andy Greenwald]

A mass murder or a shooting event. And regardless, the other thing that I think is in play that might be interesting is there's nothing to suggest that that event is the finale. That event could happen next week or could happen the week after. Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just saying, like, that might be a fun way to play with audience expectations and to differentiate the seasons.

[Chris Ryan]

You should eat dinner at seven o' clock every night.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do feel full. I do feel satiated. Thank you.

[Chris Ryan]

What else did I want to talk to you about? Rick. Let's talk a little bit about Rick.

[Andy Greenwald]

For a man that is as detached and emotionally dead, he packed a delightful wardrobe of shirts. He looks great.

[Chris Ryan]

The wardrobes across the board are excellent.

[Andy Greenwald]

I was watching, paying attention to the way that they dressed Chelsea every episode, which is just.

[Chris Ryan]

She's wearing, like, a blondie T shirt.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's just insane and, like, not flattering, but also perfect.

[Chris Ryan]

Goggins is a actor who I obviously have a tremendous amount of affection for.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And has spent most of his career, even after Justified, as I think a character actor as. As a. As a supporting all star boy, Crowder Unjustified was initially one of those, like, great Pinkman Omar kind of roles. That was initially supposed to go.

[Andy Greenwald]

He was just supposed to be in the pilot, I believe. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And became the second most important character on that show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

He is definitely passed into a new realm now, not only in his public Persona, which I think is definitely playing up the. The quote unquote, Walton Goggins element. Like, just the cool, you know, iconoclastic dude. He's got an Instagram video up of him driving through the desert listening to Hotel California today. He did, like, a Super bowl ad. I got a chance to do a Righteous Gemstones premiere panel talk last week.

[Andy Greenwald]

You were great.

[Chris Ryan]

Thank you. But he was. He Definitely had, like, a lot of aura up on that stage and was talking about how coming on to Righteous Gemstones, I would assume from White Lotus, straight from, like, the tank was empty. And it was. It was difficult. But as soon as I put the Baby Billy stuff on, like, I got revived. But watching him do Rick, this Rick part is like, oh, you're. You're moving into, like a kind of like a almost leading man realm in a way.

[Andy Greenwald]

Without question.

[Chris Ryan]

He's.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's like Dixie Nicholson at this point. And I think I've also been thinking about him a lot because he's on all of our TV shows right now. But I was thinking about him and Jesse Plemons, who I just. We saw on Zero Day. But also, you did see him on Zero Day. I watched Civil War, and I thought. I think a lot of people said this, that his scene was the best thing in the movie. And I was thinking, I mean, these kind of conversations are cul de sacs. But at the same time, it is hard not to imagine the careers that those guys would have had in a different decade. Like that. Like in the 70s. Those guys are movie stars in a different way. And then we do still have people like that, but they're just making the best of the opportunities that come to them. They have an unexpected charisma. They are good in everything. They're incredibly versatile. But they've had to kind of just swim against the tide and emerge. Right. And like I said, like, make the most of their opportunities, which are never going to be. Unless there's an incredibly rare occurrence. Like, they're never gonna be like monocultural thunderclaps. You could do the reverse and be like, John Cazale would have been incredible on season three of the White Loser, you know what I mean? But he actually got to be, briefly, a movie star.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

So I think the specific thing that I wanted to say about him and that aura that he has in relation to this episode is that there is a. I think I'm probably not alone in saying this, that there's a segment of the audience that's watching the season, and it's like, he's the star of this show, that Rick is the main character of this season.

[Chris Ryan]

I saw an interview with Jason Isaacs where he was talking about how they basically had the run of that hotel, as these productions do, and that he had a villa. I think that he was basically sharing an area of the hotel with Goggins, and he's like, yeah. And like, you know, he said he.

[Andy Greenwald]

Got very close with his kids.

[Chris Ryan]

His kids. But that Walton mostly kept to himself and smoked and stared out off the veranda, which is essentially like what he's doing in the show.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's what the CR Heads don't realize. Working with you at the ringer is like. Like everybody wants a piece of the aura.

[Chris Ryan]

Right.

[Andy Greenwald]

But you're just sitting in the parking lot chomping on zins. Do you chew on them or do they just dissolve?

[Chris Ryan]

You put them up in your upper lip.

[Andy Greenwald]

What happens if you chew?

[Chris Ryan]

I don't know. I've never tried.

[Andy Greenwald]

You want to light this candle live on air? I want to see what happens.

[Chris Ryan]

We'll do bonus. I should save that for. For when we have to do Patreon.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay, fair.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Or when I have to talk about Last of Us, episode six because the.

[Chris Ryan]

Stock market is cratered. So fair that I'm like, watch me choose in.

[Andy Greenwald]

So much money. The other big revelation this episode is that it turns out we were wrong to judge Piper for her reluctance to, quote, meet and interview a monk, because that was never the plan.

[Chris Ryan]

I. What do you mean?

[Andy Greenwald]

She just wants to. She wants to live there.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

She didn't want to do an interview for whatever she was doing her thesis, she's graduating, and then she's gonna live there.

[Chris Ryan]

So far, that's her plan.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's what she wants to do.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Okay. You don't have to get too mad at me about this.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just supporting her. I feel like that's a good plan for her.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And she'll be near her dad, who will be fugitive. Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Or in a Thai prison. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I feel like he's. I think he's interested in the Gary way of life. Unfortunately, the assets are frozen. Yeah, unfortunately. Is that.

[Chris Ryan]

But we did have that guy on the boat talking about how to, like, avoid taxation and.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, but he was saying that to the wrong guy.

[Chris Ryan]

I know, but maybe Rick can be like, I know a guy who knows a guy.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, but Rick and Tim aren't on speaking terms.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, maybe. You know when Tim shows up with a gun and is like, give me your accountant's name.

[Andy Greenwald]

Wow, you are really caping up for Tim Radler.

[Chris Ryan]

Are you sure you don't want a writer's room?

[Andy Greenwald]

The real hero of the show comes.

[Chris Ryan]

In, and he's like, mother, I got you.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right?

[Chris Ryan]

Accountant Mike's like, God, you guys saved the whole show.

[Andy Greenwald]

And the accountant is Jon Bernthal from the Accountant, too. I mean, I do think. Speaking of our Patreon account, I think a version where Cr Spins the hits.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And you just do your version of stuff. Speaking of spinning the hits, you are remarkably silent about John Bernthal's shaves his head. His quotes about his new Punisher.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, that is writing where he's just.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, no more of this candy ass punisher that you've seen. We're gonna deliver the real for the real heads.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't want to see him get.

[Andy Greenwald]

Hurt emotionally or as I don't know.

[Chris Ryan]

How the Punisher exists on Disney plus.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I mean, say nothing is on Disney. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, the walls are down, brother.

[Chris Ryan]

That's true.

[Andy Greenwald]

Let it. Let the river flow.

[Chris Ryan]

That's true.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's fine.

[Chris Ryan]

It's a marketplace of ideas.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna. I'm not watching Anora until I can watch it on Disney plus the way I was intended to watch it.

[Chris Ryan]

Can you?

[Andy Greenwald]

No, but I just.

[Chris Ryan]

Because you can watch it on Hulu, can you? For free?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Well, then I can watch it on Disney plus.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm just going to look it up right now. This is incredible content. Disney plus home.

[Andy Greenwald]

Google this. And then. Oh, then you know, you should do.

[Chris Ryan]

It's loading.

[Andy Greenwald]

Chris.

[Chris Ryan]

Search. Hold up. They raised the prices. Search.

[Andy Greenwald]

Are you going to pay?

[Chris Ryan]

Pay Anora.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is the video team getting this?

[Chris Ryan]

It's not there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Not there yet. Yeah, I think that you should write to your friend Nelson Peltz and say Ike Perlmutter. Ike Perlmutter. Dear Mr. Perlmutter, here is another bullet for your arsenal.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, it's not on Hulu either. That's cool.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, you're just. You're just spreading misinfo.

[Chris Ryan]

It's there. Like it'll be there at some point, but it's not there now. Sorry.

[Andy Greenwald]

Remember Minya was misinfo. Yeah, you're misinfo, Mr. Info. No, you're just spreading misinfo.

[Chris Ryan]

Misinfo. M I S Info.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

Minion's the best. Honestly, Ms. Info. One of the. One of the greatest to ever do it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Truly.

[Chris Ryan]

Let me tell you a little bit about what we're gonna do next.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. Are we done with White Lotus? Or like, are you. Can I. Can I check your. Before we go, can I just check your Larazepam meter? Like there is an element of continued enjoyment in the show because I do think that there is some not critical rumbling, but like audience rumbling that like, not much is happening. This is the weakest season. That kind of talk. I feel like when you check into a White Lotus resort, you are guaranteed a baseline of service. And I Feel like I'm being serviced.

[Chris Ryan]

Me too. I also can tell to your point about. I wouldn't. You were talking about the history of White Lotus informing how you watch and the amount of. I think Mike White has a lot of credit in the bank.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And I think what he's trying to do this season I would imagine is backload with some shit.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Because we still have this crime. Those kids are. Saxon's only getting fucking creepier. You know like Lachlan is apparently a close up artist. Like everybody is spinning out a little bit and it's getting more violent. Things happen in threes. Like true. You can just feel like this, this thing is happening. I don't trust these Russians.

[Andy Greenwald]

Just frankly, the ladies are having an enormous moment. I guess I'm just guessing my wrong though. See, I just kind of sketch on the back of culture. I don't need to engage. It's like me with the NBA. I get it. I know, I know the storylines of the season. You know what I mean? I don't have to watch the game. It's fine. Give me a storyline from the season.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sga. An all time guard season.

[Chris Ryan]

So you listen to Bill.

[Andy Greenwald]

Probably the minutes. No, I saw it on Instagram. I didn't even listen. I don't even listen anymore. But I'm aware.

[Chris Ryan]

We're so fucked.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm good. I'm fine. I got a lot going on. Okay. I'm pretty busy right now.

[Chris Ryan]

We had talked a little bit about skipping. Oh. Do you want to say anything else about White Lotus?

[Andy Greenwald]

So you feel you have. There's, there's. There's something banked. You feel good about that?

[Chris Ryan]

There's a gun in the wild. Rick is looking for revenge. These girls are going out with some Russians. I mean it's pulpy. It's about to happen.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, here's the only other thing I want to say.

[Chris Ryan]

And I have not watched it head.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just saying I have lived the number of years I've lived on this earth waiting for someone like Amrita to just stop me in the lobby and be like, you are not your pain. Like what a win for Rick. And Rick can't even say thank you.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you ever not want to talk about feelings?

[Andy Greenwald]

No.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean I guess only when I'm on this podcast with you being like, oh, NBA jokes. Like. But that's covering.

[Chris Ryan]

Why don't you choose them Zinn yo. Like yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

The other 23 hours of the day. Yes. That's all I want to talk about.

[Chris Ryan]

Then let's Talk about severance.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. There's some strong, strong feelings.

[Chris Ryan]

What you're talking about that is like when you come into this room. Audi. Andy.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

He's out there. Well, I know, I know. I just kind of want to turn the floor over to you because I. I think I watched this before.

[Andy Greenwald]

You coward.

[Chris Ryan]

You know, as I watched Harmony drive toward Salt Neck, I was like, here we go.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

I don't think we're gonna get a lot of cross cutting to the other folks in this one 36 minute episode directed by Ben Stiller. And it's essentially like what Harmony Cobalt has been up to the season while all this other stuff has been happening. And we get a very severance, like, backstory to her, which is about 68% clear. We find out spoilers going ahead now. We find out that Harmony is the actual inventor of the severance procedure. We find out that Lumen or the Egans used to run basically a child sweatshop powered by Ether, where Harmony and her sister and this guy Hampton, played by James Legro, which was great to see him.

[Andy Greenwald]

I thought that was her aunt.

[Chris Ryan]

No, that was Celestine. That was her sister. That was her older sister, wasn't it?

[Andy Greenwald]

Look at us, we're already disagreeing.

[Chris Ryan]

How'd you feel about this episode? Hold on, I'm gonna get a Zinn.

[Andy Greenwald]

I saw. I saw, like, a restaurant. Did, like, a promotional thing on Instagram using. There's probably a name for this. Kaya. Kaya is our youth correspondent. Can probably tell me what this is. When you take, like a. Like a meme or a video that's gone viral, and then you turn it into your promotional thing. Like a thing about an animal. Okay, sure.

[Chris Ryan]

Is that what you're talking about?

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure. I saw one of, like, someone doing slow pitch for someone smacking balls and baseballs in, like a. In a.

[Chris Ryan]

In high heels.

[Andy Greenwald]

No. What are you watching? What's your algo all about?

[Chris Ryan]

You didn't see that there was a woman in high heels, like, just like, crushing fast pitch baseball.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, in this, she was. Someone was pitching at a batting game and then didn't.

[Chris Ryan]

And she was. She was.

[Andy Greenwald]

She didn't get her hand away fast enough because the person tagged her with the. With a ball that she hit. She got hit and, like, let out this wail. And I feel like that's what you just did when you said, what did you think about this episode? Then you got back behind the netting.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, this is a very divisive episode online, and I know that a lot of people did not care for it.

[Andy Greenwald]

I. I found this an awful viewing experience. But I am very, very interested in what the. No, I genuinely like what the decision making behind this episode say about being genuine about the first part, about what the show is and why it is. And it is difficult. I think there's two difficult things to express here. One is the. As is often the case with Severance, the craft on display is God tier and undeniable. Like in Almost. Almost Maniacal. Right. Interviews have come out from like, the great James Legroz, great character actor, has been around for a lot of our movie and TV going Lives plays Hampton. He was saying that there was almost two years between the exteriors of this episode and the interiors because they moved the entire production to Newfoundland to get those absolutely stunning and striking visuals.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, the vistas.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then they decided, well, we don't want to actually shoot inside a house here. We're going to build this as a set in the Bronx. And then he went off and did other things for almost two years and then filmed them. I mean, that is a commitment to production that most people do not get. And it was staggering. Like, again, if you watch this episode on mute, I think I would probably feel the same way about it, or maybe I'd even like it more. But there's no denying not much dialogue in it, how beautifully it was shot. I think that there is a issue for me as a viewer when the craft and the aesthetics outweigh the more humanist concerns of storytelling, emotion and things like that. This, to me was like watching a master builder in a workshop, completely lost in his craft. Building a chair out of fine wood and picking the wood grain and doing other things that involve carpentry that I don't know about, and feeling so good about the process and having a wonderful experience making a chair and then moving on to the next chair before realizing that the chair is incredibly uncomfortable to sit in. I do not think that there is virtue in this episode being an absolute slog to watch. I do see that there's sort of like a reflexive fandom defense of like, oh, not everything needs to be spoon fed to you. And this is world building. You know, I'm like, world building.

[Chris Ryan]

Where did you see this?

[Andy Greenwald]

This is not piece of discourse all over the Internet, okay? This is not Settlers of Catan. This is. Do you know what I mean? Like, we world building. This is a fucking entertainment process.

[Chris Ryan]

A world building. A lot, though.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is a television show. And if you decide to spend the invested capital of your audience to Expand the world or, you know, zag. Tell a different sort of story. I do think you owe it to your audience to make it the most exciting and compelling and surprising thing possible. Not a 37 minute icy ether drench slog which culminates in a woman sucking on her dead mother's oxygen tube before being revealed as, oh, guess what? She's the inventor of all this shit. Which I don't even think a super fan feels is necessarily consistent with the show they had been watching. Because again, I think the best version of this show is a show about people making a choice for their own lives as opposed to a large culty corporation inventing things in secret. That's not as compelling to me, but I may be in the minority regardless. This was rough. This was a rough watch.

[Chris Ryan]

The redeeming characteristic of this episode for me was some explanation as to the strange relationship between Harmony and literally every other character is she had been this person within Lumen who obviously wielded some power, but not too much power. You know, she was essentially or looked to be a middle manager.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right, right.

[Chris Ryan]

But all throughout these series we have gotten this suggestion or this picture of her as somebody who was very like a true believer and what was going on and had shrines and had obviously been a part of this since she was a child. There had been these suggestions about her and her upbringing and her schooling. So I was satisfied with and not surprised by the revelation that she was an integral part of this is world changing brain surgery. Something you can sketch out on a notebook. I don't know. But I got it. I got that she. She probably was someone that Lumen needs to have close but not let to get too high. Because ultimately what this is, is a dynastic family, like a mafia, you know, like, it's about passing power down through the Egans, not about being like, well, this person technically did come up with the procedure, so they should get a seat at the table.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

The other favorite part of it was Legro, you know, and. And just the idea.

[Andy Greenwald]

I wasn't saying it right.

[Chris Ryan]

I think it's legro or la gross. I'm not sure. I'm. I apologize to him if he's.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think I got it wrong.

[Chris Ryan]

If he's listening, he's like, God, you guys are the best.

[Andy Greenwald]

It'll be so nice of you. He was really. He was really good.

[Chris Ryan]

He was really good. And you and I have talked a lot about our.

[Andy Greenwald]

Our.

[Chris Ryan]

Our interest in what the world outside of like these six people is like, you know, is. Is There a Home Depot over there that we're not seeing? Is there a Kathy Hochul who's just allowing this to happen in upstate New York or something or whatever. And getting somebody who obviously had this experience in their childhood, never got over it. Is addicted to a pretty deleterious industrial solvent. Yeah. And. And is living in a ghost world is, is pretty, like, striking. I just, I just felt like that was like literally like nine minutes of information stretched out to 36 and that it was essentially like more mystery placed on top of like, as soon as they like, kind of talked about something, they were like, you know, like there was, there was like the, the feeding tube thing, which I guess we do get cleared up for us when she pulled it out of her own mouth and it's like, yeah, I mean, I guess I get it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Go ahead.

[Chris Ryan]

No, you go ahead.

[Andy Greenwald]

The show's doing bits. It's just bits on top of bits, you know, and as much as you and I love Wes Anderson and love his movies, I think a multi season 8 to 10 episode, 8 to 10 hour series in Westworld might be asking a lot. It would certainly be asking a lot of him and his production team. But I'd say that to try to be fair minded, like, there are some things that work in different. There are things that work in different mediums and in different doses. Ultimately, I guess I remain, and maybe people hear this sometimes in my commentary. What I remain perplexed by is the seeming passion and popularity of the show because it is such a closed circuit to me. It is so unwelcoming. It is so ultimately an episode like this felt smug to me in a way that, like, look, we can do whatever we want and it doesn't have to make sense to you. And everything is stylized and everything is inhuman. Honestly, the way that people talk to each other and relate to each other, there's a spark of something in James performance. Not gonna wade into the danger zone of his last name, I think.

[Chris Ryan]

You know, honestly, like, I didn't really enjoy watching this episode. The thing that really felt off to me was the triumphalism of the last moment was that it was like, cool that Devin was calling her and that she was like, tell me everything.

[Andy Greenwald]

And now she's gonna be.

[Chris Ryan]

Music kicks in.

[Andy Greenwald]

A good guy, I guess.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, we'll see. But I, I, I was just like, she's bad. This whole thing's kind of an evil endeavor.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's it, it one thing that I think might.

[Chris Ryan]

And she must know that Gemma's down there.

[Andy Greenwald]

So let me Let me throw something out here. I'm just gonna put a plant. A little. A little flag.

[Chris Ryan]

You're gonna stick your neck out on severance here.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I'll say. There is a world where the third season rips. Where the third season. I love it. I'm being sincere here because we have not seen any more of this.

[Chris Ryan]

Is this the same world where SGA is having a historic guard season?

[Andy Greenwald]

I heard he's great. By the way. Tough break for Knicks fans. Jalen Brunson hurt his ankle, and the Dallas Mavericks only had seven players able to play the other day. And they can't sign people because they're so close to the first apron.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, the apron will get you.

[Andy Greenwald]

You impressed?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Come on. I can still. I can hum a few bars. This is based on nothing but my own experience, having watched this many episodes. There is a world where this season, the work of this season is not macro data refining Cold Harbor. It is yanking the ideas and promise of season one into shape for the starting gun of what the show is going to actually be, to get it to the point where the show where everything is in, no pun intended, in Harmony, where these characters are seeking to bring down Lumen and these characters are seeking to keep it, to prop it up. And this group is the hinge point for that seismic battle for the state of the world, both Audi and Innie. And all of this labor of. I mean, it's not just retconning, it's just conning of this Harmony character into something that could make. Not make sense, but be a productive cog in the show's machine going forward. So now we have some backstory. Now we've taken her away so we can bring her back into. In on the side of the angels, at least, or, like, on the side of characters we know. So she's not siloed off on an island somewhere. Like, all of this kind of labor all could be in the service of a third season of the show that has communicated clearly what the stakes are and where it's going. That won't be off the air for three years, that has Beau Willimon apparently, like, on the writing staff or on the creative team throughout, because I think, you know, it's been reported that he joined the creative team at some point in season two. And I say that not just because we're a fan of work that he's done or that he's on andor. It's just more like, okay, a steady creative partner toward Dan Erickson and Ben Stiller, which has not been the case. So it comes roaring back as the show that it ultimately wants to be. And that's fine. I think that's very possible.

[Chris Ryan]

That is a. A very interesting way of characterizing and putting a nar. Contextualizing the like, as if this is a down season. It is to you and me.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

But for I think a lot of people, it is fulfilled the promise of the show entirely and has become. When you talk about it as a closed circuit, you use that as a pejorative. I completely understand that, and I pretty much agree with you. For a lot of people, I think the closed circuitry of the show is the future of the appeal. It is the. I am so invested in this. Every frame has something of value in it. So, yeah, I think that it'll be interesting to see whether the third season deviates from any of that or becomes a little bit more traditional in its storytelling, which I think Joe and Rob have talked about. This episode, specifically, half this season is very special episodes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. The actual characters that we came to know in the first season have had relatively little screen time.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. I mean, we haven't seen Dylan in three episodes, right? Yep, pretty much.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Well, we didn't see Heli either, or Irving last week.

[Chris Ryan]

We haven't seen Patricia Arquette for the entire season since the first episode. First two episodes.

[Andy Greenwald]

No disrespect to her.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's talk a little bit about a show we adore before we get out of here, because we have Danny McBride coming on to talk about the first episode of the Righteous Gemstones, final season, the fourth season. Lights go down and spoilers for this episode of Gemstones, which is kind of funny to say, because typically I would not think of Righteous Gemstones as a spoilery kind of show. And within the first three minutes, you realize you're watching a interlude episode. They do about 12 of these, usually one per season. A flashback of different points in the Gemstone family history.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I feel like Danny said the other night, not with us, but at the event that you moderated, that like, the kids who played the young versions of them were just so great that he's been writing to them.

[Chris Ryan]

This was a different kind of flashback. It goes back to the Civil War and talks about essentially the origins of the Gemstone family coming to God in a roundabout way, but in a way that very much fits with the complicated relationship this family has with ministerial services. And Bradley Cooper plays Elijah Gemstone, who eventually masquerading as a preacher who he has murdered, named Abel Greaves. And is drafted into. He's conscripted into serving the Confederate army as chaplain. And most of the episode is about his slow crawl to actually being a man of God, from a con man and a murderer and a thief and a gambler and a drunkard to actually seeing the value in preaching the gospel. And Dana McBride directed it. Bradley Cooper is in basically every shot after the first opening two minutes. Jim Cummings, who I love, is basically the other actor of note in this episode, Although Paul Schneider makes a quick.

[Andy Greenwald]

Cameo and Jim Cummings plays which part.

[Chris Ryan]

He's the major who kind of at first accuses Elijah of being a.

[Andy Greenwald]

And he tells him he's gonna go to hell.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. And then he's like, you're going to hell. And he's like, wait a second. What'd you think of the episode?

[Andy Greenwald]

That was real surprising. I'm sure many people were shocked that after the opening. Not credit, but the opening logo and music, that we were still very much in the 19th century.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

That it wasn't just like a quick bit.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, we talked to Danny about this a little bit, but I thought. Well, I thought two things. One, one of the meta reasons to love this show and to love Danny McBride's career and the Roughhouse Boys career in general, is the chance to see people who just love certain things, certain vibes, music, movies, TV shows, styles of filmmaking get to play. And so to see him be like, yeah, I have enough chops now and enough credit banked with the Warner Brothers Discovery Corporation that I will just make my Civil War epic. I thought that was incredible and that the filmmaking is really good. And I think he told us that they had 10 days to shoot this, which is just wild, considering the rest of the time, we won't spoil it, but they're very much in the present day. I thought it. One of the things that I have enjoyed with this show that differentiates it to a degree from vice principals or our beloved Easttown, is that, like Elijah Gemstone, the show kind of pulls itself up and scrabbles against the rocks towards some sort of deeper meaning and significance. It's not just telling jokes. I mean, it's telling jokes, but it is initially casually, but I think increasingly actually interested in that idea of what makes a good person. Sure. And I loved the way. And because I went to that event that you did, and I'm gonna say it again, you were awesome.

[Chris Ryan]

Thanks.

[Andy Greenwald]

That is real hard to juggle nine people on a panel, especially when they're those big personalities watching it again. I did appreciate the way and also the way Bradley Cooper played it. But it's not just funny the way he won't pray with people until they die. But then when he does have his kind of moment, is his moment in service to those who died or is it just ego where he's like, I was saved, sure. So I have a purpose which underwrites the whole series. So I thought it was pretty fun and pretty dazzling. And I also, though, have the knowledge that we get real back to a lot of dirty jokes on boats next week.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Your point about Gemstones on a scene to scene basis is as funny as it gets. And you get to watch Edie Patterson and Tim Boltz act together and do these incredible lines as, as, as BJ and Judy. But the larger point of the show might be exactly what you're saying, which is like, how do you cast off all this that you've festooned yourself with and sort of aspire to be like Amy Lee. Right. Like to the people that you actually like that you lionize. And I have to admit, I'm kind of mesmerized by Cooper. I don't know. I don't know. It's been a long journey with him. He is a very vulnerable actor and public Persona, I think, and has chosen to do something that is like. The only real, like comparison you could make is basically Warren Beatty in my mind. You know, there are plenty of actor directors, but his sort of project, which is like, I'm very interested in the act of creation, the act of the act of celebrity and you know, a lot of the, the themes that he comes back to and the fact that he has sort of willed himself into being this director, writer, auteur is fascinating to me. But the, you know, him taking time out to come down to South Carolina and do this series that he had apparently never watched before. Yeah. And was just like, I'm in, let's do it. And then the crazy thing is, is that I've had a chance to watch this episode a couple of times in preparation for this pod and also for that talk is you can kind of see weird shadows of Danny McBride's Jesse Gemstone performance in Bradley Cooper's performance as Elijah Gemstone. So it's just a really cool thing that they got to do. And obviously we're kind of in a age where maybe there are too many, guess what, we did kind of episodes. And sometimes they really work like episode seven of paradise or episode one of Gemstones. And sometimes they feel like they're a miss for us in some regards. Like the episode of Severance we were just talking about. But it is kind of neat to see TV detaching from sort of like the rules a little bit on such a mass level. Now sometimes that can be disorienting, but I think in this case it was a huge success.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think that what Danny and his crew do is low key, very important, and you'll, you guys will hear in the interview it sticking to his guns. And like, these are my friends. We get each other's secret language. We have the same taste. We make. We know how to make stuff and we're going to decamp to an island in South Carolina and just do it ourselves. Has really borne out with some great work. But also there is, for as silly as his work can be, there is a very, very, very smart observational awareness of industry trends and where things are going. And as he talks about, like, why he went to TV as opposed to making movies and the benefits of that. And all that being said, like, Bradley Cooper's a really funny actor and he first came to our attention genuinely by being pretty funny in Wedding Crashers and the Hangover movies. And, you know, the nature of the business and of stardom and of auteurdom has pretty much taken funny Bradley Cooper from us.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

He does play this dramatically, but he's very funny. He's so good at being funny and charming and that's not a bad thing for a leading man. That's not. I mean, Warren Beatty knew that, you know, and he didn't really bring the lulz to reds, but he could turn it on when he needed to. I think that's a really smart comparison. So I am just generally really, really here for a project that kind of plays, aw, shucks, we're just having jokes here. But is pushing and not just pushing in terms of like, you know, character development, but also pushing in terms of filmmaking and like what we can get away with here within this number, within this group of creatives in this other side of the country.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, there's a world. I mean, I'm sure this was discussed, but should they, you know, should we put up two episodes of this? Like, I'm sure HBO and Danny talked about, like, but do you want to have like then the family in the second episode and have that go up on the same night? But I think it's really cool that they were like, no, you guys sit on this, this 50 minute episode about.

[Andy Greenwald]

The Civil War, we should say. And I think this is the good kind of soft spoiler when the gemstones Modern day return at 10pm next week. They come in hard like no beats are skipped. It's everything that you want and it's joyful. And what we've seen this season is awesome.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's get into our interview with Danny McBride. We'll be back on Thursday talking about the Pit. Maybe some daredevil. We got John Mulaney's live show on Wednesday, Nightflix. I know you're excited.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think the people number two next.

[Chris Ryan]

To Bargazi for you in terms of guys who make you laugh.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, we'll see. They're jockeying for pole position and I think that it'll be interesting. Your hunger strike to avoid Daredevil will finally come to an end.

[Chris Ryan]

It's not hunger strike. I just. He's never been like my favorite Marvel character.

[Andy Greenwald]

Who is your favorite Marvel character?

[Chris Ryan]

All the members of the Thunderbolts because they're the most independent, cinema minded.

[Andy Greenwald]

Did you see that? Was that Florence Pugh being like, we made an A24 movie?

[Chris Ryan]

Yes, I did. Okay guys.

[Andy Greenwald]

Nice. That must be fun.

[Chris Ryan]

Thanks to Kaia. Thanks to ct. We'll be back on Thursday. Enjoy our interview with Danny McBride. Thank you to him for joining the Watch and we'll talk to you soon. This episode is brought to you by Pretty Litter. Living with more than one cat means you've got double the cuddles and double the litter duty. But Pretty Litter makes things so much easier. Not only does it control odors and last longer than other litter and it also keeps you ahead of health issues. The color changing crystals actually flag fluctuations in your cat's urine. How about that? Plus Pretty Litter ships free right to your door. So no heavy bags to carry and no last minute pet store runs right now. Save 20% on your first order and get a free cat toy at PrettyLitter.com watch. That's PrettyLitter.com watch to save 20% on your first order, get a free cat toy. Preluder.com watch Pretty Litter cannot detect every feline health issue or prevent or diagnose diseases. A diagnosis can only come from a licensed veterinarian. Terms and conditions apply. See site for details. This episode is brought to you by Universal Pictures. Would you sell your soul for greatness? What would you be willing to sacrifice? This September? Experience the horror event of the season. Him the new Jordan Peele produced horror film. It stars Marlon Wayans in a role of a lifetime as Isaiah White, the greatest football player of all time, AKA the goat. Tyreek Withers plays Cameron Cade, a rising star quarterback who Isaiah takes on as his protege. As Cam's training accelerates, Isaiah's charisma shifts into something darker, sending Cam down a disorienting rabbit hole that may cost him more than he ever bargained for. Directed by Justin Tipping and produced by Monkeypaw Productions, Never Meet yout Idols, him hits theaters September 19th.

[Andy Greenwald]

Mutine adjective used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained, one who navigates life on their own terms, effortlessly. They do not always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions. They know the rules, but behave as if they do not exist. The new fragrance by Miu Miu defined by you.

[Chris Ryan]

This podcast is brought to you by Carvana. Got a car to sell, but no time to waste? Hop onto Carvana.com to get a real offer for your car in seconds. All you have to do is enter your license plate, answer a few quick questions, and if you accept the offer, Carvana will pay you as soon as you hand the keys over. They even offer same day pickup in many cities. Save your time, score some cash, and sell your car. The convenient way to Carvana. Pickup times vary. Please may apply we are so honored to be joined once again on the Watch podcast by Danny McBride. Danny, what's going on, man?

[Danny McBride]

Not too much. I'm in this fancy office with y'.

[Andy Greenwald]

All.

[Danny McBride]

This is fun.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, man. So season four, we're releasing this on Monday, so it dropped last night and I think people are going to be delighted and surprised by what they get in the premiere episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

We should be clear we were going to drop this before the premiere. And then we watched the premiere and then we realized we needed to talk to you about your. You directed a 50 minute civil war epic starring Bradley Cooper.

[Danny McBride]

Yes, yes. So I'm sorry, check that off the list. Yep.

[Andy Greenwald]

So we needed to be able to say this because otherwise it would have been real elliptical.

[Chris Ryan]

You're going to tell this story probably a bunch of times to people, but I just got to know, like, how did this come about?

[Danny McBride]

You know, when we embarked on this, since it was the final season, I felt like it was only, you know, it seemed like it was a good idea to sort of like go back to the beginning and kind of show a glimpse of how this family began this journey. And so I had that idea about their distant relative sort of being a conman card player, you know, in the Civil War. And I didn't know whether that was just going to be like a cold open or if it would be a Full episode. And as I started writing it, it just felt fun. It felt like it would be something challenging to try to pull off. And so, yeah, I submitted that script in, and I thought for sure HBO would be like, yeah, we're good with it. We'd like to see the cast that we're paying for in the episode. Yeah, but they. They responded positively to it. They. I think they. They appreciate the ambition of it and what we were trying to do. And so then it became the idea of, like, trying to cast that, you know, which I had not thought about that, but it was like, you know, this needs to be a certain type of actor. It's like, you're. You're going to have people tuning into the show expecting to see the actors that are actually in. And, you know, the show's an ensemble. The show never relies on just, like, one person carrying everything. So also, you know, this show hadn't done that before, so I just knew it was a steep bill. And so we had to find somebody who I felt like would have enough charisma, enough charm, and enough appeal that people wouldn't be turned off but be intrigued when it showed up. And I think me and my producing partners, I was just talking with them, and we were trying to, like, brainstorm, like, who could that be? And I kind of just threw off the cuff like, you know, somebody like Bradley Cooper, but never kind of assuming that that would be something he'd be interested in. But, yeah, my. My buddies were like, well, we should just submit it to him and see. I mean, why not? And so we sent it to him, and he responded pretty quickly and said he dug the material and wanted to do it. And it was interesting because he had never seen gemstones before. And then he said he didn't want to watch it until we were done. He didn't want to have it influence his performance or anything.

[Andy Greenwald]

Come on.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah. Yeah. And so then I was like, well, I haven't seen Maestro, so. No. But I thought it was amazing that he did that, and I appreciate it because, you know, when you're on a show that's established, sometimes what you find is when you cast guest stars, they've seen the show and they want to, like, try to score laughs the way that. That the cast scores laughs, and sometimes it turns into just an impression of, like, you know, people. And so I thought it was. It was cool that he identified that as, like, a hazard to avoid and that he brought his own spin to it.

[Andy Greenwald]

What scene did you show him immediately after he raps? Just to really educate him. Was it Walton Goggins with his pants off? Was it all of you yelling the word at John Goodman? Like, yeah, he.

[Chris Ryan]

You know, Tom Hanks's filmography.

[Danny McBride]

It was. It was pro. I'm not sure which one. He didn't see anything from this season. I think it was. He went back to the beginning and watched it all back to back and.

[Andy Greenwald]

Then do the work.

[Danny McBride]

And then he went back and watched Vice Principals. He went, oh, wow. He did that. He did the detail.

[Chris Ryan]

He seen Eastbound.

[Andy Greenwald]

He.

[Danny McBride]

I assume he had seen it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it would have been disqualifying if he hadn't seen just like, as a creative, I would have.

[Danny McBride]

It would have been a disclaimer that I let him know what he was getting into.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you have like a Civil War itch you were looking to scratch at all? Like, is that something that, like, you're historically interested in, like, as like a text? Because, like, I was like, this is actually like, if you had just made like a three hour Civil War movie, I would be pretty into that. Like, it definitely had like the Martin Sheen, Jeff Daniels Gettysburg vibes going for it.

[Danny McBride]

You know, I grew up in this small town of Virginia, Spotsylvania, Virginia. There was like ton of Civil War battlefields around there. A bunch of history happened there. I mean, we moved there in the 80s and they were, you know, clearing out these, like, forests, you know, for these little, you know, these neighborhoods. And so, you know, my neighborhood was a brand new neighborhood. So I, you know, when I was a kid, I'd like walk my backyard and I could find like Civil War bullets. I found a belt buckle back there. And so I always was sort of fascinated by that. The idea that, like, you're hearing about these stories and school or wherever, and then I'm walking in a place where like, it actually happened. So I think being exposed to that as a kid, it always kind of held this place in my brain. So I just like, love history stuff too. I find myself, like always like reading about history and I don't know, I just kind of find it interesting. So that story, to me, I kind of was like wanting to do a period piece. It's just creatively, it was something I wanted to try and. And that story just kind of felt ripe for it.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's the thing that I'm always curious about when we get the chance to talk to you is like, there's the. There's the humor that you're going for and the story that you're going for, but you and your team and your pals, like, have such a keen aesthetic sensibility too. You're like, we're gonna make this kind of story now. We're gonna make a sports movie. We're gonna make a drag racing action comedy. In this case, we were like, I can make a war movie. So as the filmmaker of this episode, what did you do to prep for that side of the ball?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I was just trying to figure out, you know, how not to make it seem too modern, you know, like, that. I feel like sometimes when you see period stuff, it feels too modern. Sometimes it pushes you out of it. I mean, obvious, like, you know, so I just tried to embrace a style that was, like, not too flashy. I mean, there's some things in there, but you know that. And, you know, honestly, it's a lot to do with our, like, crew, you know, the production designer, Richard, and our costume designer, Christina. You know, a lot of times when we create these seasons, I just enjoy collaborating with these people. I really trust their. I trust their instincts and their creativity. So I always, like, kind of try to push myself when we write these scripts to like, drop things into their lap that they haven't done before and to kind of like, just push everybody to kind of like, try to achieve something that we really didn't think would be possible. And with that, that was a big part of it. I knew that they could make that world feel real, and it was just a matter of if we had the resources to do it. I think we had, like, just a little under 10 days to shoot that whole thing.

[Chris Ryan]

Get out of here.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, all of it was like, most of it was daylight dependent, except for just like, literally like two or three scenes. And so it also was this kind of crazy thing where, you know, you had to take advantage of the daylight, so you had to, like, wrap every day by like, you know, six o'. Clock. You could make turnaround the next day. So, like, you kind of ended up there with like, you know, less than, like, 10 hours to shoot. And we're shooting in South Carolina too, which is like rains like every other day. And. And so it was. It was a lot to sort of, like, navigate. It was a leap of faith, but, you know, it was. It was fun to drop that script. And, like, my production designers laugh and it's like he's like, prepping for a modern day megachurch comedy, and now he's got to figure out how to build a fort.

[Andy Greenwald]

And that's the thing. There's, like, no complacency allowed they have like a lot of neon in case you need it, but an oil skin tent, suspenders.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, it was crazy and you know, it was, it was so much fun and it was like how we started the season off like shooting wise too, so, you know, didn't feel like we were making gemstones.

[Chris Ryan]

That's cool. Yeah, I mean it's nice if it's going to be the last one you get to try like to get work. A different muscle in the beginning was Cooper. Did he ever come up to you and say like, hey man, like, what about like, like did he have any filmmaking ideas?

[Danny McBride]

That's obviously totally did. You know, I, I love, loved working with him on this. You know, I admit we worked together on Aloha.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh yeah.

[Danny McBride]

And so I knew him a little bit from that. But yeah, when he, you know, when he came on this, I mean he's someone who's been on a million sets. He's a great director himself and yeah, I just really appreciated his energy on the whole thing. I mean, honestly, we really couldn't have pulled it off if without him. I mean, because when you're kind of like running that like there's such a small margin for error. The fact that he was just down and came like with every take, he was fine. You didn't ever, you never had to find a scene. It was always just sort of like very ambitious days and we were never slowing down to like get it right. It was always just like, we got it, let's go, you know, and he was down. I mean, he didn't, he didn't want a trailer, he didn't want a chair, he didn't get paid anything, you know, and he's coming there to South Carolina, 90 degree weather, wearing a period, an authentic wool period costume, you know, and just sort was just game and never wasn't smiling and having fun. And it was, it was awesome. I think it was cool.

[Andy Greenwald]

That is awesome. I love the fact that he also found a way to differentiate every, every time that he was asked to pray, but didn't want to pray out loud with his talking voice. Like there's growth there across it.

[Danny McBride]

Exactly.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you. The other person who's got like a sort of major role in the episode is Jim Cummings, who I'm a huge fan of his movies and obviously has, I think some parallels from the way he started out his career and how he's making his stuff to what you and Jody and David have done. Did you, were you just kind of a fan of his or did you know him? Personally, like, on the side, I didn't know him personally.

[Danny McBride]

David Green knew him a little bit better than me. But I like Thunder Road. Like, I liked. I responded to what he had been doing, and I always, like, have. Like, I've liked him. I liked his vibe, and so he. He read for it and, yeah, he just. To me, it felt like instantly it was. It felt right.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, he's awesome. It was cool. I was just. So let's talk a little bit about this being the final season. We speculate a lot about this when shows are wrapping up. Andy actually did a whole podcast about final episodes of shows called Stick the Landing. And it's always curious because I'm sure there's a little bit of, like, uncertainty even in the decision. Right. Like, so how much of this season was like, this is it? Like, I'm writing this and I know I want to land it, because I know that a lot of your shows, you end seasons just in case it doesn't come back. Like, this will be a complete statement.

[Danny McBride]

You know, it was. It's like a testament to HBO that I just, you know, I've worked with them for so long and. And they've always been very supportive of anything creatively I want to do there, and that's been awesome. And, you know, like you said, every season we kind of prepare that it could be the end. And this season, as soon as I started writing it, I could kind of tell it was the end. It was like, all the ideas I was having about the season had to deal with closure and sort of, like, taking people to their, like, logical conclusions. So, you know, but I didn't make that announcement, like, at the beginning to see, like, this is it, you know, because I was still keeping my brain open to, like, well, who knows? Maybe we'll start getting in here and we'll find something and I'll want to keep doing more or. But at the closer we kind of, like, got to nailing the season, the more it just was, like, apparent. It was obvious that, like, we were completing it. And I think it was helpful, too, because I didn't. You know, sometimes I feel like when you see finales, like, I see it all the time. Like, it can veer into, like, seeing through the performances, and you can see the actors, especially if it's roles they've done for a long time, it's like you can see them saying goodbye to those characters, and it's kind of like, you know, I don't know, sometimes it might be. It might jump the tone a little. Bit of things. And so I thought there was something that was cool about, like, everyone. All those actors not entering the season, like, just knowing definitively that it was over with, you know. But as we got closer to the end of the filming, it was apparent that it will. Was. And so then those. Those emotions, those feelings. It was hard for that stuff not to come up. But I saw, like, there were scenes, like, in the last episode that, like, I cut out because I could see it. I could see myself just like, oh, I'm sitting here. I'm saying goodbye to this character on screen.

[Chris Ryan]

Last time with the sideburns.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah. But it was. It was. You know, it was. It was. It was fun. It was. It was a good experience, like making the show. And so I think that's also why it. I didn't want this last season to be, like, a downer the whole time, where everyone's just, like, really taking stock of it being the end. I wanted us to enjoy it and to approach it with the same energy we approached every other season and not make it so obvious out of the gate that it's a swan song. Just do what we've been doing and try to stick that landing.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

As the person not only who's playing the character, but kind of the creative wellspring for the show. How do you navigate that line? Because as fun as it is for audiences to see the Gemstone siblings just going for it every time they're on screen and how much fun that must be to play, how much of that do you just like to be present and enjoy? Like, we could be doing this for years, honestly. Versus I wanna tell a story. I wanna finish this story. I wanna answer the questions I had and then get out. How do you navigate that during the process?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I just, like, look to filmmakers I admire. I mean, I think that's the thing with television, is that, like, you know, a lot of people jump from movies into tv. And there are limitations with television that I think, like, sometimes make it an inf. Interior art form to movies. And I think that it's. You know, with a movie, you show up, you tell a story, and everyone's there to complete something, you know, and then the marker for success is if it, you know, people saw it, you know, and that's what it is. And the marker for success with television is that the show goes on and on and on. And that doesn't necessarily ensure that, like, the story you're telling is. Is the best, you know, it doesn't. That's not those things don't go hand in hand necessarily. So for me, it's a matter of, like, it would be very easy to stay in that show. It'd be very easy to just start sleepwalking through these seasons. I love all the people involved. We shoot it in my backyard. There couldn't be anything easier than like, staying involved in this show. But I think that's part of the reason why I wanted to push myself to finish it, is that I wanted to never get to that point where anybody was like, sleepwalking through it. I wanted every season of it to matter, and I wanted to complete the story we were telling without there being, like, seasons that could be completely skipped or, you know, things that happen sometimes when a show overstays its welcome.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I was wondering, because there's like a different version of your career where you're still playing Kenny Powers.

[Danny McBride]

Totally. You know, and we felt that in the day when we were doing it, it's like, you know, TV was sort of still that thing where everybody wasn't like, jumping in to do tv. I remember when we pitched Eastbound and Down to. To Will Ferrell and Adam McKay, they were surprised that we wanted to follow Foot Fist way up with the television show. At that point, people were making TV shows to get movies, you know, but there was.

[Andy Greenwald]

I was visionary.

[Danny McBride]

We started something. But, you know, honestly, it was an answer to like, the experience we had with Footfish Way, like when that got bought by Paramount Vantage and we start doing test screenings and stuff, and they're asking people, recruiting people to come in to watch Footfish Way and based on whether they like dodgeball. And to. Jody and I were like, this is the wrong audience. It's not. That's not what we're doing. But you could see how they were instantly trying to fit it into what something else was. And then we would have these abysmal, you know, these abysmal testing results, you know, that were just. That were just terrible because people had been misled about what the. What they were coming in for. And so I kind of identified pretty quickly where I'm like, I don't think the type of stories we want to tell are going to survive this process. And I think with television, you know, and not having to like, jam a story into 90 minutes and we can do it longer. I think we can, like, we can be more unexpected and we can kind of. We can do more than what we would be allowed to do in 90 minutes. And so that was sort of. The idea of going into Eastbound was like, I think Eastbound as a 90 minute movie would have been a piece of shit. It would have just been like, you would have. You would have seen every twist and turn coming. It'd be like, he's up here, he's down here, he comes back here.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. There's never. There's no way, unless you made a sequel to, like, replicate the sensation people had when he goes to Mexico.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

You're just like, holy fucking shit. I can't believe this is happening.

[Andy Greenwald]

There's also an opportunity, and I'd love you to speak about this more than what I'm saying potentially gonna throw at you. But, like, we know about the kind of like, Apatow way of making movies. Maybe you guys did some of this as well. Or McKay does this too, where you're shouting alts and you're finding stuff on the day and the ad lib becomes the funniest line in the movie that's still contained ultimately, in a 90 minute sealed thing. Your experience being like, oh, my God, Walton Goggins isn't just a guest star. Like, this is a part of this show now, and it's gonna send us rocketing in a completely different direction. Allows the improv to become part of the larger.

[Danny McBride]

It does. It's like, you know, that's one thing I really have enjoyed about writing for television is that, you know, having that looseness where you can, you know, we like to have it all planned out before we go in, but then being open that, like when something starts to pop that you suddenly you're rewriting the back half of the season. You know, that happened with. That happened on Vice principals. The first time Edie Patterson showed up, like the very first scene I did with her, I think it was in the third episode of that. I was. She was just making me laugh so much and I. And I just. I felt it. I was like, she has more to do with the story than what we've initially arced out. And so I went back and even though we had both seasons written, I went in and changed the entire ending of the show and kind of like altered the entire back half of that story because I just saw that she.

[Chris Ryan]

Should be on it more.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you end up feeling more. This is a weird way to phrase it, but, like, when you see the end result, like, we can use this season of Gemstones as an example, do you feel more proud to see that you were able to execute the biggest plans that you had laid, like a giant Civil War episode? Or are you more proud about a line that Edie Threw out on the day, being the hammer in the trailer. You know what I mean?

[Danny McBride]

Like, is it, you know, it's a combination of all of it. I think, you know, like, I'm proud of what we're able to accomplish, but I also just feel like, you know, we cast these people that are genuinely good at what they do. And anytime anybody comes and crushes and delivers, it just makes me feel happy. It makes me feel happy that they got to do it. It makes me feel happy that they understand what we're doing enough that they know how to throw things in that act that elevate it. It's. I think it's the funnest part about making anything that's film or television is the idea that it is so collaborative that you have all these people you work with and that, you know, there's so many other art forms that are just rely on the individual. But with film and tv, it's sort of like you just, you get to work with musicians, you work with with artists, you work with costume designers, you work with performers. There's something so fun about when, when all of those things line up and everybody is sort of like their eyes on the prize and everybody's contributions are just making it something that you could never have made on your own.

[Chris Ryan]

I can't remember the last time, maybe it wasn't the last time I talked to you, but you guys came in and you'd been in Covenant and were maybe getting started on Halloween, and I was wondering whether or not, like, do you feel like right now in the film business versus the TV business, is it just there's just more opportunities to do the IP stuff or to kind of reimagine a pre existing property. Whereas in TV you can still tell a kind of original story. Because at this point now you've created a gallery of characters that could at any point now be rebooted or reimagined or revisited. You've got your own mythology and the stories you've told on television. How is the experience coming out of Halloween? And like, how do you view kind of like what you're asked to do or what you can do in films versus television in that regard?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I don't know about all the inner workings of like, how the industry works, but just from what I see, I mean, it seems like, you know, with television, sort of like everything's not riding on whether the show, like everyone sees or not. Like when you're subscribing to a service, you know, every single thing doesn't have to, like, deliver millions of viewers, and. And so you're given a little bit more latitude. And I think movies are just such an expensive endeavor, and it's such a crapshoot that I think that it. To me, it just feels like they. They have to bet on something they have to like. It either has to be something that they can prove worked before and that's why they're doing it now, or it has to be an actor. That's, you know, when people normally show up for their movies. And so I think the parameters for something getting approved, it just has other obligations that I feel like TV at this point doesn't necessarily have.

[Andy Greenwald]

How many years ago or how many years has it been now since you all kind of decamped from here to South Carolina?

[Danny McBride]

Well, you know, we shot. I had never even been to Charleston, South Carolina before, and we shot vice principals there, and that was in 2015, and then came back to Los Angeles in 2016. And we're kind of like, you know, we all had, like, kids and everything, and we kind of just had this incredible time there. And it was. I don't know, it was really. It was refreshing. We always had to come to the south to shoot our shows. Usually. We never. We never had shot anything out in California.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you shoot Righteous in or, sorry, Eastbound in Georgia?

[Danny McBride]

We shot in. In Wilmington, North Carolina, Myrtle beach and in. In Puerto Rico.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah. And so, yeah, so we. We made the full move in 2017, and everybody kind of like, you know, took their families and we all went down there and, you know, even writers and, you know, everybody that we worked with kind of like, took that leap of faith.

[Andy Greenwald]

It and kind of was, you're visionary again, in a way, because, first of all, you really foresaw work from Homecoming, so I respect that.

[Danny McBride]

Such a relief.

[Andy Greenwald]

Any other stock tips you got? I really appreciate it. But more broadly, like, there is something, especially from this vantage point, it's, like, pretty inspiring that as the industry has been roiled by all these massive changes and upheaval, that you guys are, like, to the side doing your own thing, generating your own thing in the ecosystem that you want to create. So what perspective has that given you now, especially considering what's been going on in the last few years with strikes and consolidation and budgets and priorities changing. How do you see it all from where you guys are now?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I see the reality of it. It's just like, you know, I keep up with all my friends that are still in Los Angeles and stuff, and they're doing great Everybody feels super blown, very busy. But you know, I think if you're, if you're tasked with creating and you're tasked with writing, like sometimes it's good to not have the distractions of the real world and to be able to just focus on what you're trying to do. I think you can get paralyzed by, by the state of affairs when it comes to like looking at what's happening in the entertainment industry.

[Andy Greenwald]

You're being reactive to.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, yeah. And I even felt that when I was living here, I felt that. I felt that I would. When I was like looking for ideas or new things, I just felt like everywhere I turned was, I don't know.

[Chris Ryan]

We'Re just somebody has final draft open totally.

[Danny McBride]

And then I would find when I would go home, visit my family or, you know, when I'd go back to the south, I just felt like instantly I would have all these different ideas and it was just something I was just noticing thing would happen every time I went home. I just felt more inspired. And so it was a little bit of. Was just like following that. But, you know, maybe it's like we're living in an illusion when we're down there about the real state of affairs. But I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing. When you're tasked with trying to create something you might not. It might not be helpful to know how fucked up everything is.

[Chris Ryan]

When you guys do, when you come to the end. So this is the third time you've ended one of these series. Is are you already thinking about something that will go into this kind of box, like where it's like maybe another multi season show or are you starting to play? Like, is it more vague than that? Do you have characters in mind that you're like, maybe this could be something, maybe that could be something. Have you thought about that?

[Andy Greenwald]

Was Jesse Gemstone in your mind when you were rapping vice principals? Or is it not working like that?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I would have ideas of kind of what I want to talk with, but I think ultimately like what you have to do is you or me personally is like you have to kind of completely like let go. I think you have to like shut the brain off and you have to like not be so desperate to be like, I quickly have to do something else, you know, And I think it's good to just, for me at least it's been good to just completely let go and to kind of be okay with whatever is going to happen, is going to happen. And then I find you kind of can find inspiration in that. And that's what, you know, I wasn't sure what we're going to do with television after Vice President. I wasn't sure if I was going to even make another TV show or if that was just going to kind of be the end of that.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Danny McBride]

And it took me, you know, we finished shooting vice principals in 2015. I didn't start writing the pilot of Gemstones until like near the end of 2017. So yeah, I stepped away and helped David write that first Halloween and kind of got my brain on that. And it was fun. And then it was fun to sit down and kind of have no preconceived ideas. And I was able just to be kind of clean of like, what do I want to get into next? And yeah, it was, that was fun. So I'm sure it'll be the same way. I mean, I have a bunch of ideas of what I would want to do, but I am like going to commit to just like not doing nothing. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

You don't want to list them right now just so we have them on record.

[Danny McBride]

See what you guys think. Let's go, let's workshop them a little bit.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you find that. Oh, go ahead.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, no, no.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you find that when I'm always curious about. Obviously you love film. Film and TV and stuff. Like how it ebbs and flows with what you're watching when you're in production versus when you're out of production. Like if you're in production, are you just watching at the end of the night to kind of turn your brain off?

[Danny McBride]

I'm like the worst. Like, honestly, I haven't, I don't watch anything. It's like I, when we're cracking these scripts and stuff, I just don't find any enjoyment in watching like anything. Like I'll just like we'll, I'll watch like a episode of Below Deck that I've seen 10 times as opposed to like episode of whatever show everyone's talking about. But it's really because my brain just can't enjoy it. It's like I, you know, the hardest part about writing television is that consumes you completely. You know, when you're running the, running the room. So it's like I'll sit in that room for 8 hours, 10 hours with these guys, then I'll come home and my wife will be talking to me and I'll be just like giving her that thousand yard stare of like, you know, anytime, anything said, like dinner, what's for dinner? What could they Eat for dinner and church lunch next week. It's like I just can't be present, you know? And so it really happens when I watch things. I'll just sit there and I'll see something, and I won't take the ride because I'm just instantly thinking about problems in the room or knots in the story that I have to untie. And so I kind of find that the brainless stuff, the reality TV show, there's just something in there that I can kind of just like, half tune out and kind of numb myself.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do think next time we have you on for whatever the project is next, we should. We'll greet you, we can catch up, we'll sit down, and then we'll be like, Severance, Season two, Episode six. And like, get Real in the Weeds.

[Chris Ryan]

Think or Swim, Danny McBride's five years late TV podcast.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh. Oh, no, I meant we were just blindsided with current events, but. Or five years later. Yeah. I've really been thinking about what you guys asked me in 2025.

[Danny McBride]

That will be what I'll do, though, honestly, like, now that this. When this show's done. I think I. I sound mixed. The last episode Friday. So I'll be officially unemployed at the end of this week.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Danny McBride]

But that is what will happen, is all this will be the time now that I'll just start watching everything.

[Andy Greenwald]

You're gonna get really opinionated for your kids. Last year.

[Danny McBride]

Yes, exactly.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was too many chicken nuggets.

[Danny McBride]

What's going on here? Hey, hey, hey.

[Andy Greenwald]

Dad's home.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah. Acclimate slowly.

[Andy Greenwald]

Settle down, everyone.

[Chris Ryan]

Is there something that you're like, goddamn, I can't wait to watch this. I just haven't had the brain.

[Danny McBride]

Severance. I haven't seen Severance. You know, I've never seen one episode of Succession. I like. There's big shows that was pretty big cultural moments that I like, feel like I've totally missed out.

[Andy Greenwald]

Your team at HBO hook you up?

[Chris Ryan]

Probably well, because also there was a lot of gems Stone's like discourse, where it's like, this is also like Succession.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, that was a great take. I think we tried. We tried that take out. We tested. Which is the more profound family drama that makes you laugh. Yeah. A little more comedy in it a.

[Chris Ryan]

Few blocks from the lot.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, but you were being respectful. You were like, let's let them do their thing. We don't want to cross Polish. Speaking of, since we've. We're talking, we're airing this after the Civil War episode, and you said that you had some questions you wanted to answer. This is the part where we just sort of give you the layup of, like, what can we expect in this riotous final season of gemstones? Like, when you sat down to do this and you were like, this feels like the final season. How would you characterize the questions that you wanted to answer? No spoilers on whether you did, but, like, how do you want to set this up for the viewers?

[Danny McBride]

You know, I feel like, God, how do I say this without giving anything away?

[Andy Greenwald]

We have HBO PR here.

[Chris Ryan]

I can reverse engineer this.

[Danny McBride]

Okay, give it to me.

[Chris Ryan]

What, from the first episode and the sort of original sin of this family should we be paying attention to?

[Andy Greenwald]

I guess. Look at this disruptor over here.

[Danny McBride]

I love it. You know, at the end of the day, it's like, you know, you want to make this show. Making a church show, it would be easy for people to just like, lay that out there and then to not identify with these characters, really, because, like, who really knows what it's like to be a corrupt megachurch pastor, you know? And so the trick with the show is always, like, trying to figure out how to. As despicable as these characters are, how do you make them relatable? And for me, in that first season, it was like the death of their mother. You know, like, that's something that people can relate to and how people deal with grief and how people deal with the hard truths of life, you know, that you lose people and things move on. And it's a big factor, I think, of why even people gravitate towards religion is that it's a way to sort of try to find meaning in things that are upsetting, that happen to all of us, and how to find solace or peace in it. So that has kind of been with all the hanging dong and all the other crazy. That is sort of the thing I feel like that's like kind of at this. The beating heart that's at the center of it, so that. So that you can still sort of like land empathy or. Or land, you know, truths that might resonate with people. And so I think that is definitely something we're exploring in this, like, final season is, you know, how do. How do people move forward and change, you know, when they'd rather hold on to what has been.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I gotta ask you this because every time we get the chance to talk to you, I want to find a way to talk about Ashley Schaefer BMW. And the way I wanted to phrase it was this. It's like to live life in 2025 can be stressful for all of us, you know, and, you know, sometimes one fires up the YouTube machine maybe to check something or maybe it's just open on your computer. And one thing that I can count on just sure. Is the changing of the seasons, is that The Ashley Schaefer BMW Bloopers reel.

[Chris Ryan]

7 minutes will be suggested for you.

[Andy Greenwald]

You might like this. You last watched this. So that was my question. Do you ever encounter stuff that way? Like you open YouTube and somehow the algorithm is saying you might find this funny?

[Danny McBride]

Yes, I do. That comes up all the time, too. It does, all the time.

[Andy Greenwald]

And do you watch it?

[Danny McBride]

I skip it. No, I'll see it every now and then. It was like that. It's funny that that still floats around because it was a memorable moment, even on set, and the idea still makes people laugh. It's. Yeah, it's kind of awesome.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, because that's also. That was like one of those moments that just came out of the ether. Right. Like, there was. I assume the script did not suggest they didn't have as much plum content.

[Danny McBride]

There was zero plums in that original script.

[Andy Greenwald]

Nothing about Farmer's Markets?

[Danny McBride]

Nothing about Farmer's Market.

[Chris Ryan]

Nothing about Donna or Beverly? Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, it could be either.

[Danny McBride]

Yep.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. Well, that makes us. It's like stars. They're just like us.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

You're getting served the same.

[Danny McBride]

The same algorithm.

[Chris Ryan]

Is there a lot? Because that was part of. Was it on, like a DVD of the first season?

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, you know, we. Our. Our editor, Jeff Siebenk, he was on Eastbound. He was. He was another classmate of mine from School of the Arts. And, yeah, he cut that together. I mean, it was something that, like, we had to, like. You know, it was very difficult to put that into the show because everyone was just laughing the whole time. But he. It was his brilliant idea to sort of like, capture that and put in a format that people could, like, watch. While what didn't make it into the.

[Andy Greenwald]

Show, there are a not insubstantial number of Americans who like when and if they get the chance to meet Craig Robinson, they won't ask him about the office. They won't ask him about music. They will just ask him about the.

[Danny McBride]

Moment his lip quivers when he almost strokes out. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, my God, it's beautiful.

[Chris Ryan]

Danny, man, thank you so much for coming by.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, of course.

[Chris Ryan]

Good luck with the sound mixing and everything and thank you for the show.

[Andy Greenwald]

Good luck with unemployment. We hope it's not too long because we'd love to have you back.

[Danny McBride]

Yeah, I'll help you all out. Out. What? What do you need? You need coffee served?

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm here. I mean, maybe just help us with these.

[Chris Ryan]

Finding Colbert. So maybe we'll do that.

[Danny McBride]

Look at that.

[Chris Ryan]

Thanks so much, dude.

[Danny McBride]

Thank you, guys.

[Chris Ryan]

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[Andy Greenwald]

Level up.

[Chris Ryan]

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