Podcast Summary: The Watch – "How Much Higher Can ‘Slow Horses’ Climb? Plus, ‘Landman’ S2 and ‘Jay Kelly’ Trailers."

Hosts: Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald
Date: October 2, 2025
Podcast: The Watch (The Ringer)

Episode Overview

This episode is a lively conversation between Chris and Andy that digs into season five of Slow Horses, examines new and upcoming TV trailers (notably Landman S2 and the Jay Kelly movie directed by Noah Baumbach), and expands into the current state of streaming, book recommendations, and general pop culture musings. The duo blend critique with their signature banter, weaving thoughts on TV structure, industry shifts, and their own personal travel and viewing plans.

Key Topics and Discussion Points

Slow Horses Season 5: Longevity and Limitations

[04:44–16:02]

• Praise for Direction and Aesthetics:
  Andy highlights director Saul Metztein’s ability to make London both beautiful and gritty.

  “What he's really, really talented at is making the mundane look beautiful... beautifully composed.” [04:49] (Andy)

• The Peril of the Show’s “Shtick”:
  Chris notes the repetitive rhythms, especially Jackson Lamb’s dynamic with the crew.

  “There's a scene when the whole gang is gathered... and everyone gets their turn getting dunked on by Jackson and the fact that River is still sitting there getting shit on in the exact same way five seasons in... I would be ready for... a moment when Jackson isn't ten steps ahead.” [06:07] (Chris)

• Sitcom Comfort vs. Spy Thriller Stakes:
  Both recognize Slow Horses expertly mirrors the group dynamic of long-running sitcoms, with established character rhythms providing comfort and cohesion.

• Potential Limits of Character:
  The conversation digs into how the reliable presence of Gary Oldman as Jackson Lamb powers the series, but also prevents meaningful stakes or evolution.

  “What do you do when the things that make your show so reliably entertaining also start to make it feel a little bit unrealistic?” [08:15] (Andy)

• Comparisons to Other TV Evolutions:
  Examples like Grey’s Anatomy and The Office are invoked to ponder how long a show can run without shaking up dynamics.

• Showrunner Transitions and Future:
  Chris notes Will Smith’s departure and the rare success stories of showrunner swaps (e.g., Veep, West Wing).

  “I have full confidence that Slow Horses will be on the list of shows that had a successful showrunner transition.” [15:33] (Chris)

Landman Season 2 Trailer: American Oil Epic Returns

[16:02–21:36]

• Taylor Sheridan Expanded Universe:
  Andy and Chris react to the Landman S2 trailer, focusing on its sharpened stakes and the addition of Sam Elliott (“Legend”/Pops).

  “In 2 minutes and 30 seconds, they have made Landman look like an extremely plausible ongoing television drama. This trailer contains much of what the season that we've seen lacks. It seems to have stakes, structure, momentum.” [18:41] (Andy)

• Sheridan’s Storytelling Style:
  The hosts joke about the "Cheesecake Factory" narrative of Landman, taking aim at the kitchen sink, buffet sensibility of Taylor Sheridan’s storytelling.

  “The Taylor Sheridan experience is the opposite of a trailer. It's just like, here's something I like and here's also something I like. Seven minutes and we're serving it all to you buffet style.” [20:06] (Andy)

• Notable Cast and Plot Shifts:
  New roles for Sam Elliott and Demi Moore are discussed, as is the pivot to a post–Jon Hamm story world.

Jay Kelly Trailer & Noah Baumbach’s Hollywood

[22:14–24:00]

• Chris’s Movie Pick:
  Chris expresses excitement for Baumbach’s Jay Kelly, emphasizing his love for movies about show business and Baumbach’s and Clooney’s particular appeal.

  “I love movies about aura. This entire movie seems to be about George Clooney's charisma.” [23:06] (Chris)

• Clooney’s Roles:
  Discussion on Clooney’s best characters: “movies where he plays slightly bruised versions of himself” (Michael Clayton, Descendants).

Industry Shakeups: Amazon, Netflix, Paramount, and Apple TV+

[24:39–42:47]

• Streaming Strategy Shifts:
  The hosts analyze Peter Friedlander’s move from Netflix to Amazon, considering the ways Amazon’s Prime Video has shifted from experimental, high-art programming towards genre (“dad TV”, Reacher, Terminal List).

• Neo-Procedural TV:
  Insight into the current era’s embrace of “comfort TV” and genre steady hands, with Amazon’s shift to clear, mainstream genre brands.

  “It took a long time and took a lot of money... to reach something that most channels in the old days... struggle to find. Which is clarity.” [27:28] (Andy)

• Netflix’s “Multi-Algorithm” Feeding:
  A discussion of Netflix's strategy to cater to every niche at once, as opposed to Amazon's new concentrated approach.

• Impacts of Studio Reshuffling:
  Paramount, Apple, and others’ moves and talent deals—how they reflect and shape programming.

• The Apple TV+ Effect:
  Apple emerges as providing “reliable television," with high production values but rarely aiming too high or low.

  “They have almost now, like, bankrolled reliable television... it just is what it is.” [39:59] (Chris)

• Celebrity Drift into TV:
  Musings on why and how major film stars (Reese Witherspoon, Nicole Kidman, Jessica Chastain, Matthew McConaughey) increasingly devote themselves to prestige TV and production empires.

  “One of the most influential careers of the last few years is Reese Witherspoon... picking projects, producing the projects, starting a production company, selling the production company...” [36:07] (Andy)

Books, Music, and Personal Recommendations

[43:55–55:52]

• Travel, Entertainment, and Reading Habits:
  Chris and Andy trade personal tips and reading lists for international travel, including spy fiction, art-house films, and music.

• Book Recommendations:
  Highlights include Oliver Harris’s Shadow Intelligence (compared to Le Carré and Murakami), Richard Rohr’s Falling Upward, Thomas Pynchon’s Vineland, new Ian McEwan ("what we can know"), Danzy Senna’s Colored Television, Rachel Kushner’s Creation Lake, Michael Cecchi Azzolina’s Your Table Is Ready.

• Music Talk:
  Discussion of the band Geese and other recent indie releases, with observations about the contemporary glut of music and how focus (or lack thereof) shapes listening habits.

  “When I come across something... that's the TR truth, where I'm just like, this is all I want to think about. And so Geese has been on constant repeat.” [48:18] (Chris)

Pop Culture, Nostalgia, and Banter

Scattered Throughout (esp. 01:01–03:38, 53:42–56:16)

• Sports Fandom Across the Pond:
  Andy contemplates missing Phillies playoff games while in the UK and the VPN-related struggles of following American sports abroad.

• Nostalgia for Old New York & Bookstores:
  The pleasures of London bookshops and the nostalgic draw of New York restaurant culture.

• General Pop Culture Chatter:
  The episode closes with Andy and Chris reflecting on the pleasures of non-fiction “devourable” books for long flights, and the enduring comfort of well-made, consumable TV.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Slow Horses’ Enduring Appeal and Stagnation:

  “I'm never going to stop watching it... But the larger thing about the larger conversation about long running, ongoing shows... not everything has an endless road. Not everything is Grey's Anatomy...” [09:40 & 10:50] (Chris & Andy)

• On Taylor Sheridan's Approach:

  “The Taylor Sheridan experience is the opposite of a trailer. It's just like, here's something I like and here's also something I like. Seven minutes and we're serving it all to you buffet style.” [20:06] (Andy)

• On Peak TV Pacing:

  “Apple is like one of the only places it's like keep making seasons. You know, they could keep making platonic for four or five years.” [41:37] (Chris)

• On Celebrity Career Arcs:

  “The Reese Witherspoon arc is so fascinating... now I want to build an empire... and then like hard pivoting into just whatever tech is coming next.” [36:19] (Andy)

• On the Changing Industry:

  “There is an attitude of excitement and optimism that I haven't seen in a while. Mainly because, once someone, once a whale comes back to the table, all the starting bets go up.” [34:21] (Andy)

Topic Timestamps

| Segment | Topic | Timestamp | |---|---|---| | Opening Banter & Travel Plans | UK, sports streaming, sobriety | 00:32–04:44 | | Slow Horses S5 Deep Dive | Structure, longevity, limitations | 04:44–16:02 | | Landman S2 Trailer | Cast, Taylor Sheridan, genre TV | 16:02–21:36 | | Jay Kelly Trailer | Baumbach, Clooney, star personas | 22:14–24:00 | | Streaming Industry Discussion | Amazon, Netflix, Paramount, Apple | 24:39–42:47 | | Apple TV+ Model & Celebrities in TV | Reese Witherspoon, Kidman, Chastain | 36:07–42:47 | | Viewing & Reading on Travels | Personal picks, Geese, book talk | 43:55–55:52 | | Closing Banter | Bookstore nostalgia, New York memoirs | 53:42–56:16 |

Closing Thoughts

This episode blends incisive TV analysis with personal tastes, industry context, and authentic rapport between the hosts. Chris and Andy explore not only what makes specific shows click (or stall), but also how broader trends—from casting to executive shakeups—shape what we all get to watch. Listeners are treated to insider recommendations, pop culture debate, and the relaxed charm that has long defined The Watch.