Oscar Nominations, ‘Sentimental Value’ Is Sensational, and Screenwriting in the Double-Screen Era. Plus, ‘The Pitt’ S2E3.

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Watch (The Ringer)

Episode: Oscar Nominations, ‘Sentimental Value’ Is Sensational, and Screenwriting in the Double-Screen Era. Plus, ‘The Pitt’ S2E3

Date: January 23, 2026
Hosts: Chris Ryan & Andy Greenwald

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Episode Overview

In this episode, longtime friends and pop culture obsessives Chris Ryan and Andy Greenwald dive deep into the 2026 Oscar nominations, with special focus on the acclaimed film Sentimental Value. They also discuss the evolving craft of screenwriting in the streaming (and double-screen) era, riff on recent industry news and sports, and break down the latest episode of the medical drama The Pitt (Season 2, Episode 3). The conversation is lively, self-aware, and peppered with banter, cultural references, and inside jokes.

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Major Discussion Points & Insights

1. Oscar Nominations 2026: Reactions & Snubs

• A Strong Year for Film
  Both hosts agree that this year's nominations reflect a high-quality crop across categories, with Chris noting “It was a good year for movies. And it's an exciting movie. Oscars.” (08:24).
• Best Picture Nominees
  Discussed films include Sinners (16 nominations), One Battle After Another, Hamnet, F1, Marty Supreme, Begonia, Frankenstein, Train Dreams, Secret Agent, and Sentimental Value.
• Sentimental Value receives particular praise for its artistic achievement and breadth of nominations.
• Surprising Snubs
  They mention Miles Catton not being nominated for Sinners despite a strong child actor performance (26:52), and some category surprises including Chase Infinity's lead submission in One Battle After Another (27:07).

2. Deep Dive: Sentimental Value

• A “Total Masterpiece” (12:49)
  Andy is effusive: “My main takeaway… Sentimental Value is in my mind, a total masterpiece.”
  • Both hosts discuss director Joachim Trier’s style (“Yokim” vs. “Joachim”), his interest in faces and emotional realism, and his evolution as a filmmaker following fatherhood.
  • Chris notes the film’s European flavor and how it contrasts with blockbuster storytelling: “When I watch something that is a 2 hour and 15 minute study of a family coming to terms with old wounds… I'm like, oh, yeah, like that's real life.” (15:14)
  • Andy: “I loved the experience of watching both [big American movies]… then I watched this and I was alive, like to see a movie that is about people, the fullness of people.” (16:18)
• Themes and Endings
  • Discussion about the “meeting point” at the end of Sentimental Value—an ambiguous, hopeful reconciliation between sisters.
  • Chris: “I kind of long for a movie to be like. That's not how it works.” (19:10), pushing against neat resolution.
• Performance Shout-Outs
  Andy celebrates the nominations for Renate Reinsve, Stellan Skarsgård, and Rose Byrne, (“I've been there. Yeah, I've done. You know, I watch Physical. You know, we didn't even talk about it always, but I watched it.” 20:05).

3. Inside Awards Season: The Industry & The Campaign

• Oscars Machinery
  Discussion of “guilds,” industry screenings, and the politics behind landing nominations (20:33–22:26).
• Best Original Screenplay
  Andy and Chris debate how the “tip of the cap” screenplay Oscar tends to go to the boldest or most original work (Blue Moon, Sentimental Value, Sinners are top contenders—24:43).
• Predictions
  Andy’s predictions:
  • Best Adapted: One Battle After Another
  • Best Original Screenplay: Sentimental Value
  • Director: Paul Thomas Anderson
  • Picture: Sinners (28:39)

4. Modern Screenwriting in the Double-Screen Era

• Matt Damon on Netflix & Screenwriting
  Chris summarizes a Damon interview, highlighting how streaming platforms now shape writing:
  • “They want you to have something grabby in the first opening moments… so that people don't click out of it.” (38:03)
  • Frequent reiteration of plot because of “phone distraction” culture.
• Andy’s Perspective as a Writer
  Andy expands: “Number one most annoying trend… start with something incredibly exciting and then, say, five, six months earlier.” (40:14)
  • He notes how this alters narrative structure, pacing, and even the intent of pilot episodes.
  • “They are hyper, hyper focused on the first three minutes more than anything else.” (41:52)
• Natural vs. Engineered Openings
  Chris: “There are plenty of things that movies and television shows that open with something big… but has some of that, like, why is this show opening with what should be the highlight?” (42:26)

5. The Pitt S2E3 Recap & Review (56:39–68:43)

• Praise for Narrative Construction
  Andy: "I am so in awe of the maestro level Lydia Tár-esque conducting that they are doing… just in terms of building” (57:21)
• Character, Structure & Realism
  • The balance of case-of-the-week stories and longer arcs.
  • Highlighted cases: misjudged child abuse (autoimmune disease), the Tree of Life shooting survivor’s scene with Perla, the ongoing storyline of Robbie and his evolution.
  • Chris: “I thought that this was just a lovely character moment. I think they are doing a really good job with Robbie…” (60:47)
  • Noted: Noah Wylie both stars and writes certain episodes which brings an “earnestness” (62:24)
• Show’s Social Commentary
  • Not overtly political, but subtly critical of healthcare system logistics (insurance-induced patient transfers, staffing, etc.)
  • “Sad to say anything about good people trying to help in an overloaded system is by definition political.” (67:13)

6. TV Sampling & International Recommendations

• Drops of God Season 2
  Andy recommends this international wine drama for its “pleasant international cooperation vibe,” specificity, and unique stakes (49:43–54:21).

7. Sports Banter & Pop Culture

• Ongoing bits about sports obsessions (Eagles OC talk, Phillies, Mets, Dodgers, etc.), the meaning of “sentimental trade value,” and fleeting passions in both sports and pop culture (69:01–72:42).
• Meta-commentary on texting styles and relationships vs. “public personas” (33:12–36:46).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Sentimental Value’s impact
  Andy: "There wasn't a single moment in watching this movie that I wasn't riveted and thrilled and delighted and laughing. Like it's, it's funny, it's human, it's emotional and it's just a great film." (17:23)
• On Streaming & Screenwriting Pressure
  Andy: “We have created a generation of helicopter executives who do their job the way parents behave on the playgrounds of Highland park, you know, like, the children cannot be left out of your sight for one second unless they do something dangerous.” (40:14)
• On Cultural Tastes
  Chris: “I have to like, reset my brain that there's not like a transactional thing happening or a, like an end point to this or something like that, you know?” (15:14)
• Meta Self-Deprecation
  Chris, on old blogs: “I would have called an entire blog post that and 17 people would have read it.” (01:31)
• On Double-Screening
  Chris: “I actually can't look at the Athletic to see if we've hired an OC because, like, I'll miss the entire point of the scene.” (39:28)
• On the Joy of Watching Sports
  Andy: “It's pretty fun watching sports when you don't care. I know you always like to pick someone to root for and I probably inevitably.” (72:02)

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Key Timestamps

| Time | Segment / Topic | |------------|---------------------------------------------------------| | 01:12 | Main show intro/banter begins | | 07:22 | Andy’s late-night film catch-up and Oscar goals | | 08:24 | 2026 Oscar nominations discussion starts | | 12:49 | Sentimental Value named a “total masterpiece” | | 17:03 | Andy on emotional resonance of the film | | 24:43 | Best Original Screenplay Oscar race discussion | | 38:03 | Matt Damon on streaming and "grabby" openings | | 40:14 | Andy on pilot structure and industry notes | | 56:39 | The Pitt S2E3 recap/review starts | | 57:21 | Praise for show’s narrative construction | | 60:47 | Robbie character arc discussion | | 67:13 | Healthcare system/insurance as subtle social commentary | | 72:19 | Outro: sports obsessions, closing banter |

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Overall Vibe & Final Thoughts

This episode is a dense, playful, and thoughtful exploration of how movies and TV are made and watched in 2026, filtered through the warm, reflexively self-aware lens of two careers’ worth of pop culture chatter. The hosts move deftly from nerd-out territory (Oscar stats, screenwriting technique) to heartfelt observations about art, storytelling, and everyday life—on and off the double screen.

Transcript

[Chris Ryan]

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[Chris Ryan]

Pain sports to have to clear the room.

[Andy Greenwald]

Stand up and walk now.

[Chris Ryan]

Hello and welcome to the Watch. My name is Chris Ryan. I am an [e-mail] and joining me in the studio Studio. He has sentimental trade value. It's Andy Greenwald. That's really good. That's an old like. I feel like that's back in my Grantlin bag.

[Andy Greenwald]

That is so good.

[Chris Ryan]

I would have called an entire blog post that and 17 people would have read it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, but those 17 people would have all gone on to form blogs.

[Chris Ryan]

It would have been like Velvet Underground.

[Andy Greenwald]

Velvet Underground and Nico Harrison.

[Chris Ryan]

Come on, we still could do this.

[Andy Greenwald]

Just right there.

[Chris Ryan]

It's all gone, man.

[Andy Greenwald]

God, sports, pop culture.

[Chris Ryan]

Why don't we just. Should we start like a place on the Internet where we can publish these opinions? Andy, it's great to see you today on the pod. Oscar nominations reactions. A reaction to some stuff Matt Damon said Jon Joe Rogan Pod. Not.

[Andy Greenwald]

Not that.

[Chris Ryan]

It's not that. No. He had some interesting thoughts on screenwriting in the era of Netflix that I wanted to bounce off my resident screenwriter.

[Andy Greenwald]

What better place to share those thoughts?

[Chris Ryan]

We will do Pit episode 3 season 2. We are going to talk about sentimental.

[Andy Greenwald]

Value.

[Chris Ryan]

Of G. Oh yeah, I didn't watch but you can do your show and tell. Let me just do a little housekeeping.

[Andy Greenwald]

All right.

[Chris Ryan]

As usual, you can write [e-mail] youm can follow us on Instagram thewatchpodkai doing great work making sure Andy is seen in the best possible light.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, you're allowed to talk about it. I. I've been muzzled.

[Chris Ryan]

I just want you constantly referencing it. You know what I mean? I want you to be free.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm fine. But just for the record, I didn't say Kathy Kennedy did a good job.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, I mean, history will tell us what I did. No, whether she did. And you can watch us on YouTube, Ringer Dash TV. You can also watch us on Spotify, where I hope you are listening to us. And then I just want to mention next week, next Friday, Yassi and I in Boston at the Sinclair, 8pm we're doing a live podcast with Pat Flynn from Fiddlehead. And there's still some tickets available.

[Andy Greenwald]

Nice.

[Chris Ryan]

So cop those. And then Yossi and I the next night at the Coolidge Corner Theater doing a special presentation of Repo man at the Coolidge, which is one of my favorite movie theaters in the country. So please come out. Tickets are still available, I think some. By the time you'll be listening to this. So try, try, try and make it out. Try and say, what up? It's going to be cold.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can I ask you a question just for, like, setting the mood for what you'd prefer in Boston?

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you want the. Do you want the Pats headed to the super bowl, or do you want that off the. Off the docket for the region? Tread lightly.

[Chris Ryan]

I wonder what the crossover is of people who care about the Pats a lot and people who are coming to see Repo man at like 9:30pm on a Saturday night.

[Andy Greenwald]

So you're saying, like, is there a Boston sports guy or gal? Yeah, but I don't like movies. I don't know.

[Chris Ryan]

Bill likes Repo Man.

[Andy Greenwald]

I just feel like there's an archetype here for someone from that region who likes both.

[Chris Ryan]

It's true.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it's possible you've been up there at times when the Pats have been good and times when they've been bad. So I didn't know if you liked it as a vibe merchant.

[Chris Ryan]

I remember what they were when I was. I think they were still. It was pre Brady when I was up there, so I was never up there when they were.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, we were up there in the parcels era.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, they got good in 01. I was in New York.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, you were in New York raging about the Tuck rule. Sorry. Sorry to blow your cover. You've kept that quiet around.

[Chris Ryan]

That's right.

[Andy Greenwald]

The offices for a long time. How are You.

[Chris Ryan]

How are you doing?

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm good.

[Chris Ryan]

I have my announcements. What are your announcements?

[Andy Greenwald]

No, I'm just. Sorry, my head's not fully in the game because I just had a long conversation about how I can assist my aging father in renewing his subscription to gramophone.

[Chris Ryan]

My dad had a gramophone? Oh, yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is beautiful.

[Chris Ryan]

No wonder you like sentimental value.

[Andy Greenwald]

I know Gramophone for those people who don't realize, at least in my knowledge of it from 30 years ago is like a brick.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Not in the Stringer Bell sense, but like this thick book. It's basically like. No, but it's basically like. Isn't it like, capsule reviews of, like.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Review for classical CDs and my dad used to. It was like, my dad's most beloved.

[Andy Greenwald]

Periodical when it showed up.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, my dad also, like, Baseball America. That was his other big periodical.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. You got to keep your eye on some of those guys because you want to know who the Dodgers are going to sign in eight years.

[Andy Greenwald]

You got to track the moves. You see the old game.

[Chris Ryan]

I actually have some Watch After Dark slash sportscenter stuff for you at the end.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I actually wondered, maybe. This is.

[Chris Ryan]

Fuckers.

[Andy Greenwald]

You wanna talk Hot Stove? How we're actually gonna. Are you gonna zag and say we're gonna be good?

[Chris Ryan]

I didn't say that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay, okay. I appreciate that. I do think there is value. And again, I don't wanna step on shield's corner, but, like, could we do a daily OC hunt? We do a podcast called the oc and it's not about the kid from Chino in the pool house. It's about how we're going to. How the Eagles are inevitably going to have to hire a kid from Chino.

[Chris Ryan]

To be their offensive coordinator who doesn't have a job.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's what I really want to pop out.

[Chris Ryan]

I would like to figure out a way to, like, upstream it to the Ringers Philly special feed.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay.

[Chris Ryan]

You know what I mean?

[Andy Greenwald]

I just want to go on the record as saying I am now all in on Declan Doyle.

[Chris Ryan]

I told you we would have SportsCenter at the end of the podcast.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. Do you know why? Because I'm going to forget to say this because I'm old now. I just read Gramophone all day.

[Chris Ryan]

So now this is. I've kind of noticed this about you, where you're like. I'm worried that I'm going to forget later. So at the expense of, like, normal conversation, I'm just going to put my take up front wherever, when it Hits your head.

[Andy Greenwald]

Bill said this is the best part of the pod.

[Chris Ryan]

Bill. Oh, yeah. I thought you were going to like. Bill also just says whatever comes into his brain.

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't say that. I'm a big fan. The. I just wanted to say that Declan Doyle, the current offensive coordinator of the Bears, is the same age as our friendship.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, but Declan Doyle, bring it up. Fine. We can do this now. Declan Doyle.

[Andy Greenwald]

We don't have to do it now. I just thought that would be value.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you know what? Declan Doyle does it the bears. He says, Mr. Johnson, would you like three shots of espresso or two?

[Andy Greenwald]

If he only wants two, that's a problem. That's the third coffee run of the day, I'd imagine. Mr. Johnson, would you like shirts on or off?

[Chris Ryan]

A little. You know, people who've been listening to this podcast for the last couple of weeks probably have noticed that we're sundowning.

[Andy Greenwald]

What?

[Chris Ryan]

That Greenwald is just on a tear with film, with cinema I'm trying to catch and that he's catching up. And I would say I doubted you, and I now I don't doubt you anymore. You every. Every other a couple of days, you're like, watch this, watch that. Do you feel like by the time in a month when these Oscars happen, you will have seen the 10bps?

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, we've discussed my relationship to Hamnet. Okay. But I'll give you that.

[Chris Ryan]

Mulligan.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm actually feeling fairly confident, especially because, you know, F1, which I still haven't seen. I thought that was being pushed down the docket. Cause I'm like, well, that's one for me. That's not one now.

[Chris Ryan]

It's professional obligation.

[Andy Greenwald]

It is. I have to watch this.

[Chris Ryan]

I was hoping F1 would come back into IMAX.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes. I don't want to watch it at home, is the truth. I do feel pretty confident about my ability to get in front of all these nominees. And I feel semi confident, echoing a bunch of people who I like, trust and respect. And this was a good year for movies.

[Chris Ryan]

It was a good year for movies. And it's an exciting movie. Oscars. Sinners got 16 nominations. It broke the record. I believe one battle got 11. The best picture nominees are as follows. One battle after another. Sinners, Hamnet, F1, Marty, Supreme Begonia, Frankenstein, Train Dreams, Secret Agent, and Sentimental Value, which I think people are surprised that it was just an accident or no other choice. Didn't make it into that list somewhere. F1 kind of.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's pretty cool. Vroom.

[Chris Ryan]

Vroomed. Into it off the back of the PGA nominations, I believe. You should really listen to Sean and Amanda. They've been tracking this stuff for months.

[Andy Greenwald]

Just saw them. They've been podcasting all day. Today live. Yeah, they look great.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, they, they have a tendency to do that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I, I, I was really happy to finally be able to connect to Sean. Be like, Sean. Sentimental value is like the, the andor of movies.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you want to explain that for.

[Andy Greenwald]

People who aren't on x.com the everything app. Do you think they've given up? Just that. It was very sweet. Sean is very, very committed to that social media platform and said that, you know, he caught up on andor season two, and he was like, this is better than most movies.

[Chris Ryan]

And it went viral.

[Andy Greenwald]

It went viral. It went viral. So that when I did my Eagles OC check, Sorry to bring it back again. I do get most of my news. Well, first I scan Facebook, you know, and then Facebook Marketplace.

[Chris Ryan]

I really want to do your media dial.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then I did look on you.

[Chris Ryan]

Wake up, you make yourself a nice cup of espresso, right? What?

[Andy Greenwald]

Nope. But go on. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

What do you do?

[Andy Greenwald]

I send Declan Doyle out to the corner store. Give me a pack of cigs in a fucking Celsius. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And think of some ways to get Devontae Smith in space.

[Andy Greenwald]

And then I go to my Facebook groups just to see what kind of action there is.

[Chris Ryan]

How often are you checking Facebook?

[Andy Greenwald]

Facebook is like a last resort thing. Like, Facebook is a. I have looked at things that are giving me value or entertainment, which it would be.

[Chris Ryan]

Give me an example of something, like, on the Internet that does that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you remember Peach? That was a fun, fun app.

[Chris Ryan]

That was dope.

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like I got on a plane and was like, it was a group text with, like, you and Sean. And I feel like Amanda was involved. And Zach, everyone's like, yo, sign up for this. And I was like, I don't know if I'm falling for it again. Okay. Signed up, got on the plane, got off, and you were like, yo, that's over.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I was, I was the lord of Peach. I was so good at Peach. I really was. Like, all of my shit on Peach.

[Andy Greenwald]

Was, Was like, what were you dropping on Peach?

[Chris Ryan]

It was like GIFs. It was basically like a meme generator, wasn't it?

[Andy Greenwald]

I didn't even engage.

[Chris Ryan]

In any case, it was a Peach was great. We got to go back. Peach, vine, all those, all those. Like, that era of social media was my favorite.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, Like, I will. I Will wake up. I will look at my feel good app, the New York Times, which had a great profile of our buddy Jason Manzukis yesterday. That was really good. And then I will look at Instagram, you know, which is mostly like, like painters and ramen shops and fascism. And then I will look at.

[Chris Ryan]

You are truly one of one.

[Andy Greenwald]

I will look at my James Dimitri Reels because he's doing a great run of the best breakfasts in the world.

[Chris Ryan]

Big rewatchables fan, right?

[Andy Greenwald]

Big Rewatchables fan. Great content. Always. And then I will do my deep dive of 11 newspapers related to the Philadelphia sports.

[Chris Ryan]

Good.

[Andy Greenwald]

Then later in the day, if I have work to do, which I've had a lot of these past few weeks, that's really prime Facebook time. When I've run out of anything else to look at, that's when I'll do that.

[Chris Ryan]

And that's when you start screenshotting Facebook papers.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Sending to me. Why did we get off on this? Seanandorx.com Right. I was actually. Sean should come on and talk about.

[Andy Greenwald]

Andor I would love that.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can I. Can I go on and talk about sentimental value?

[Chris Ryan]

We can talk about something. You can do whatever you want.

[Andy Greenwald]

All right. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

You're the one who has like a pay for play situation. You know, it's hard to keep you.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do keep you top except for Philly special.

[Chris Ryan]

That's.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's for you. That's for me.

[Chris Ryan]

Did anything jump out at you?

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, I mean, mainly the number one was this was a very high quality year across the board. I, again, we are not Sean and Amanda. I've not been tracking this. I'm sure there are snubs that even maybe you've noticed on a cursory pass or two. But I was looking at this feeling very good about basically every category. And my main takeaway though, which we alluded to the other day was Sentimental Value is in my mind, a total masterpiece.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay. Do you want to. Let's talk about sentimental value out of this conversation. We can save the pit for later.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, the segue is. I was thrilled how many nominations it got. I think it is. It was just really, really exciting to me to see that Renata Ryan's Fate got nominated for best Actress and Stellan Skarsgrd maybe is the favorite for supporting actor, got nominated for Joaquim Trier got nominated for best Director. This isn't like a. I don't get the sense that this is like a. This is the 10th out of 10 nominations.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you go Joachim. I go Joachim.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, do you think it's Joachim? You know, I don't know. Yeah, I mean, it's Joaquin Phoenix. Unrelated.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, but he's American.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's American.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. When you get to the Jays over there, I guess. Yeah. You get Fjord.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I think it's Yokim.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yokim.

[Chris Ryan]

Yokim. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Joachim.

[Chris Ryan]

Yo.

[Andy Greenwald]

All right, I'll go with Joakim Trier regardless. It's his winter, spring and summer. Did you watch the movie?

[Chris Ryan]

I did, yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

You've been a big trigger guy from the beginning.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Reprise and Oslo were, are big ones for me. Oslo especially is a really huge movie for me and I liked Worst Person in the World a fair amount and I thought this was lovely. I mean, I thought there were moments of like, there were flourishes in sentimental value that I thought were didn't quite land for me.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, like some of the almost Wes Andersonian, like the history of the house.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, no, I mean, the house thing was. Hit me pretty hard. But like, I think that some of the flashbacks and some, like the, some of the, I mean, I guess. Do you want to get into kind of like spoiling sentimental value here?

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't know if you can, but.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I mean, there's, there's moments that I thought, you know, like, people have compared it to like, Bergman's Persona and you know, some other, like, I know that he drew from Olivier Esayas and stuff like that. And like, it's, it's a, it's a wonderful movie, you know, and I just actually, you know, I, the thing I wanted to talk to you about with it was about how when you've watched like, I mean, for lack of a better term, a bunch of like, American blockbuster.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

This is engineered stuff. It's, it actually now I think I've watched so much of, of the, of that that when I watch something that is a 2 hour and 15 minute study of a family coming to terms with like, old wounds.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm like, oh, yeah, like that's, that's real life and I have to like, reset my brain that there's not like a transactional thing happening or a, like an end point to this or something like that, you know?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. I watched this and I was like, oh, my God, I have to get out of this country.

[Chris Ryan]

That is, I gotta talk to you about they, they. I know his version of Oslo.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm just like, it's always summer.

[Chris Ryan]

Why is everybody beautiful? It's always summer.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, we had a good. In Norway.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I know.

[Andy Greenwald]

I, I, I think Like I loved Marty supreme and I loved one battle after another. And I'm not trying to play a one's better than the other game, but there is something, and maybe in a different mindset or in a different geopolitical era, we could take pride in the specificity of tone and expansion, expansionist Americanisms that these movies still represent, even though they are, you know, thoughtful. And I, I mean, I don't want to politicize them, but I don't think that these are exactly like right wing movies, but like they are still imperialist, I would say, in their volume setting and in their ambition.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I loved the experience of watching both those movies in the theater. And then I watched this and I was like, alive, like to see a movie that is about people, the fullness of people. There's a great profile of Trier in the New Yorker from a few months ago that just talks about it talks about his filmmaking in a way that I kind of overlook because I'm just vibing with it about how interested he is in faces and how close he gets and his cinematographer gets and his super emo cinematographer who has to have a special heat shield so that his tears don't affect the lens, apparently. Yes, it, it woke me up and like, I'm going to be generous. This morning a trailer dropped for the He Man, Masters of the Universe film.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I watched it and I was like, basically gonna be like, you fucking dorks. Like I was gonna do the William Shatner SNL monologue about this. And then I was like, well, there probably are a subsection of people, maybe in our age cohort who are responding to this movie with the same electricity that I felt.

[Chris Ryan]

Is it a movie or is it a series?

[Andy Greenwald]

It's a movie that I felt jolt through my body as soon as Sentimental value began. Like there wasn't a single moment in watching this movie that I wasn't riveted and thrilled and delighted and laughing. Like it's, it's funny, it's human, it's emotional and it's just a great film. And it's like to your point, he is the distillation of a lot of classic filmmakers that I love, whether it's Bergman or Ozu or Asa, like summer hours, family vibes. I mean, it, it, it is a healthy, I think, descendant of Woody Allen in the sense that Stellan Skarsgrd and EL Fanning are not a couple in the film, which is really good. I love movies like this and I think he is a low key master of something that I wish. That is very hard to do. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

It's funny. It's like he's. I found those first two films to be so comfortably dark for me. Like, I. I've been thinking a lot about this in terms of, like, the ending of films like Marty Supreme, One Battle After Another, and whether or not, you know, and Sean's talked to those filmmakers, and I think I understand where they are in their personal lives and why they made the movies that they. And why those films specifically end the way they do.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Which is on, I think, without spoiling anything, a moment of hopefulness or a note of, you know, perhaps better days are to come. And I guess I feel like that happens in sentimental value. You know, I mean, there's some ambiguity to the end of the film, but there's, I think, ultimately like a kind of meeting of meeting at the. In the sort of midway point of.

[Andy Greenwald]

Between these two characters and a note of communication.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes. And I kind of. I kind of long for a movie to be like. That's not how it works.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, you have, I think, homed in on something important, which is this is a trilogy of Girl dad films for the ages. And Trier has said that this is the first movie he has made since becoming the father to two daughters. Yep. And this is a beautiful movie about sisters and that relationship. So I'm locked in, obviously. But I think that you're onto something that is very intentional and I'm there for it as someone who has to find a shred of hope every day, which is why I frequent Facebook, so I could not recommend that movie more highly. Oh, I also want to say I didn't even report on this to you as part of my, you know, decades long campaign of quiet support for Rose Byrne. Thrilled that she was nominated. I did. Quiet support. Some people are noisy. I've been there. Yeah, I've done. You know, I watch Physical. You know, we didn't even talk about it always, but I watched it. Yeah, I did give. If I had legs, I'd kick you a spin.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you? Yeah, you gotta get a letterbox. I'm behind on what you're up on.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's a tough one. Yeah, it's real tough. Not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a real tough watch. She's amazing and I'm thrilled for her nomination.

[Chris Ryan]

Very deserving of a nomination.

[Andy Greenwald]

Would you like to do a similar statement of public support for Kate Hudson in Song Sung Blue?

[Chris Ryan]

You know, it's on my to do list. Is both to see that film and then to vocally support her. I noticed with interest that there are. There's this like, very fascinating matrix that I don't quite understand that I think Shawn and Amanda are very keyed into about what's getting supported within guilds or then within the town or within a. You know, because you have to understand, like, when you read those anonymous Oscar ballots, I think some of them are a little bit like they're outliers.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, it's like almost like they harvest the most extreme. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

I'm almost just like, is this person. I. I sure that they're real, but it seems like somehow they find the five people who are like, I lost my password, so I'm voting for F1. You know.

[Andy Greenwald]

Luckily I still have my subscription to Gramophone. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

But I did notice that like, you know, song Song Blue had been presented as like the feel good movie of the year or whatever. And we're actually more just like kind of like a. A jukebox musical of Neil diamond songs sung by these two people. And I. Apparently it's much darker, you know, than that. And I think that they have now kind of like at least on Billboards and in some of the. The press I've read gotten on top of that narrative of like, it's actually like a se. You know, dramedy and a return to form for Kate Hudson, you know, so I knew that that movie seemed to have some momentum. And it's always interesting when you see, like, who's hosting guild screenings, you know what I mean? And like, like, I think Frankenstein's a good example of a movie that I don't believe had a ton of critical adoration, but seems to be almost universally, universally beloved within the industry.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sort of like the Denver Broncos this year. Like, like, we keep thinking it's. They're fraudulent, but they keep winning.

[Chris Ryan]

I would almost say that the Broncos are like more of like a media darling. So the.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's the reverse.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. Like, I think as Sean Payton does a lot of work of. Of like working on his reputation.

[Andy Greenwald]

I want to be a Grantland podcast so badly today. I'm really digging it.

[Chris Ryan]

We should do best picture nominations as NFL teams.

[Andy Greenwald]

Great.

[Chris Ryan]

Who are the birds?

[Andy Greenwald]

Name the three that didn't get nominated. Sorry, I didn't. I think you were the biggest fan.

[Chris Ryan]

No other choice.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, no, I think it was just an accident. Is Kevin Petullo's first line in a lot of his upcoming interviews.

[Chris Ryan]

What went wrong? Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay. I think that's interesting. I have to say that I definitely didn't get the feel good vibes from Song Song Blue because one experience, I don't have many theatrical experience.

[Chris Ryan]

If you saw the trailer, it makes it seem like these two people just like become superstars.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, I feel like I saw a different trailer because the one theatrical experience that I have that maybe I share that you don't that maybe I share with Paul Thomas Anderson, Josh Safdie and Joachim Trier is that when I go to these matinees of like Zootopia 2, the only trailers that they can show for kids are kids movies and. And an unending fountain of movies, mostly starring Zachary Levy about like a guy who is in a Christian rock band and then fell on hard times and the band gets back together to save the quadriplegic son of one of the. Like the bassist. And that's the vibe of Song Song.

[Chris Ryan]

Blue Eyes, Kevin Petulo story right there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Truly, I thought it was one of those movies, you know, like, it's just like a little bit.

[Chris Ryan]

I think it has that vibe, from what I understand.

[Andy Greenwald]

So. All right, well, Ethan Hawke nominated.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I was. You know, you bring up Ethan Hawke who got nominated for Blue Moon. He is fucking extraordinary in that movie.

[Andy Greenwald]

You've seen it?

[Chris Ryan]

Oh my God. Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Blue Moon. Yeah, I want to see it.

[Chris Ryan]

My boy Rick just double barreled this year.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's your hit.

[Chris Ryan]

I know Nouvelle Vogue is great and Blue Moon is. You will love Blue Moon.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I know. My dad had a gramophone subscription. Like, this is clearly a movie I can get behind.

[Chris Ryan]

My favorite Oscar category is always Best Original Screenplay.

[Andy Greenwald]

Okay.

[Chris Ryan]

I always really enjoy like both how they divvy up. Like obviously I think Anora won last year. So it was like kind of like a Sean Baker sweep.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh. But usually you're right. Usually screenplay is for the real.

[Chris Ryan]

It's like, hey, here's Pulp Fiction. You know what I mean? You get this Best Original Screenplay. So Best Original Screenplay is. Here is. Goes to Blue Moon. It was just an accident, Marty. Supreme Sentimental Value and Sinners.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

And I don't know what would be the. Like, here's a tip of the cap to this. I. I don't know. I wonder if Blue Moon.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think my sense is you think.

[Chris Ryan]

Sinners wins this and then one battle wins.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think Sentimental Value wins this and then I think Coogler and PTA are in a knockout fight for the other two categories.

[Chris Ryan]

I see.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's my. That's my guess. The other thing, just to mention one battle after another isn't adapted because it was inspired by Thomas Pynchon's. Apparently that is how you say it.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't. I stand with you.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I just. I was just shocked. I mean, I guess I have not yet worked up the courage to go into a bookstore and said, say, pardon me, sir, do you have the new novel from Thomas Pynchon?

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like of all the places you could try that out, fucking skylight will be the safest room for you. What are you worried about?

[Chris Ryan]

They would just be like. You mean Thomas Pynchon?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, but then you could be like, aha. Sir, let me show you some Internet comments.

[Chris Ryan]

Hold on, I'm gonna pull up a clip.

[Andy Greenwald]

Scroll through this. I also think, no, these are just.

[Chris Ryan]

An Instagram reel of Brian Dawkins. Biggest tacticals ever.

[Andy Greenwald]

Let me make a really relatable analogy here, if you don't mind. I think it's okay to just roll with the popularly adopted pronunciation of things. Like, in America, we say Adidas.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

If you leave this country, something I am clearly humble bragging about, the man's name was Adidas.

[Chris Ryan]

The Brits say Nike. They still say Nike.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, they don't.

[Chris Ryan]

A lot of them do.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which ones name names? James, Dimitri, come on here and say the names of sneaker companies. Challenge. I dare you. Uh, all right. The only other thing. Is this a snub, like, Sinner's cleaned up. But I thought Miles Catton, who was the kid in the movie. Supporting actor. Yeah, he was very good. And I was surprised that he wasn't nominated.

[Chris Ryan]

I was surprised that he wasn't nominated as well. Paul Mescal did not get nominated for Hamnet. Uh, Chase Infinity did not get nominated for One Battle after Another.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's a tricky one, though, because she, I think.

[Chris Ryan]

Is that the elf Fanning? Is that.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, she. Chase Infinity submitted as lead.

[Chris Ryan]

I did not know that.

[Andy Greenwald]

That was a big. That's the kind of thing that, like, gets a headline six months ago that that's what she would be angling for. And maybe some of the thinking was Teyana Taylor had supporting in the bag, so they didn't want to compete against each other directly, but she did go for best Actress. So in a way, Kate Hudson and Rose Byrne stole that. Stole that slot to you. I'm not gonna hold you to it. We have a month to consider. Do you have a head, heart? Best picture pick here. Like, what you would want to do.

[Chris Ryan]

I think One Battle after Another is probably both. I think One Battle after Another certainly has. I wonder, precursor events like Sean and Amanda have talked about. Talked about a little bit A lot of the, like, I, I don't know whether or not the Oscars are going to hugely differentiate from the way things have been going so far in with the awards.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Typically, what would happen, I think because the, the, the voting base has become so diversified internationally and, you know, like, they've done a huge effort, made a huge effort to make it a more of an international voting block. Typically, like, I think that would indicate that maybe something like sentimental value, but like, it almost surprised. I wonder whether or not the absence of it was just an accident and no other choice and Best Picture suggests like a course correction or some sort of, like, I, I don't know that that was interesting to me.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can I give you. I have no skin in this game. I do not. I'm not involved in a popular film podcast, so can I just. I'm gonna give you my day of nominations, I'm gonna give you my predictions, and if I win, you can start.

[Chris Ryan]

Hosting the big picture.

[Andy Greenwald]

You'll watch a Miyazaki movie. Okay. Best Adapted. I think it's gonna be one battle for Best Adapted. I think it's gonna be sentimental value. For screenplay, I think Teyana Taylor. I think Stellan Skarsgrd, Jesse Buckley Chalamet Director, PTA Picture Sinners.

[Chris Ryan]

So Sinners winning Best Picture with no other awards. I wonder what the precedent would be for that.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, I think it'll be, oh, yeah. What other awards would it win?

[Chris Ryan]

Well, I mean, it's up for 16. I think there's a lot of technical awards and other.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it would win those. I, I actually, as I'm saying, I.

[Chris Ryan]

Wonder if Sinners, like, I don't, I can't remember the last time a Best Picture also got no other.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, I think, you know, director and picture usually are in tandem. So I actually, I'm going to revise. I'm going to go on the record as Coogler. I think PTA gets writing, so you.

[Chris Ryan]

And does one battle after another win Best Picture or you think Sinners wins Best Director and Best Picture?

[Andy Greenwald]

I think so.

[Chris Ryan]

Interesting.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do not agree with this. I'm, I will go on the record with that as well, but I think that's my prediction.

[Chris Ryan]

Okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

I, I, I think that because again, I'm not, I'm, I'm not in the guilds. Actually, I am in one of the guilds, but I'm not like, following the, the trends of the guilds.

[Chris Ryan]

But you don't, do you vote in.

[Andy Greenwald]

The Writer's Guild Awards for the Writers Guild Awards? Yeah. I can vote.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you.

[Andy Greenwald]

I can't comment on that.

[Chris Ryan]

Because they don't let you comment.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, I'm just deep in the poly market for it as well, so I don't want to, like, tip anything.

[Chris Ryan]

I was going to make a joke about how why would they have polymarket for the Writers Guild Awards, but they really do have Polymarket.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like the number of times I mentioned effingers on this podcast and we just hit the over. Big win for me. I would say that these. These. These voting blocs are not monoliths, and they aren't. They don't necessarily vote with a personality or a point of view or an agenda. That said, I think the opportunity to crown sinners is tough to pass up because it is original IP from a young filmmaker and it sort of ticks the box of. This is a popular movie. This movie did very well at the box office. It is also critically adored. And, you know, you certainly can't. You can't argue with the technical genius of the film. So I have a. I feel like there. And with a number of nominations today, I just feel like momentum is trending in that direction.

[Chris Ryan]

Interesting. We'll have to listen to Sean and Amanda, see what their take is.

[Andy Greenwald]

I would listen to my take go and then actually listen to the episode.

[Chris Ryan]

That's what I just did. That was interesting.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do what, Kristen? Tolerate me.

[Chris Ryan]

Not tolerate. You know, I brought up the. The screenplay nom.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And screenwriting has been on my mind this week, probably because I don't have to do any. So I'm sure you get done screenwriting and you're like, the last thing I want to talk about or do is write for screen. But Matt Damon and Ben Affleck have been on the promo tour for the rip.

[Andy Greenwald]

Have you seen it yet? I did.

[Chris Ryan]

I loved it. I did the Big Picture on it. I loved it. Loved. I liked it a lot. I thought it was. It was quite entertaining.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm very excited to see it. Looks like a lot of fun.

[Chris Ryan]

Our producer, Kaya, not as big of a fan.

[Andy Greenwald]

Kai, you didn't like it?

[Chris Ryan]

I. I liked it. They're not gonna get mad at you. Who's they? Matt Damon? No, I liked it. I just thought some of the dialogue was corny. And I thought. I said to Chris before we started recording, it really showed me the power of directing because I thought Teyana Taylor, who was quite good in one battle after another and quite bad in this movie.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Interesting. I thought maybe you were worried it was a sequel to R.I.P.D.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I did not. Worry about that. I think that one's been buried. Or maybe there's. It would be funny if in the Blake Lively Taylor Swift text trove, there was like, Ryan's hard at work on Ripped to did that. We got to get it in while Jeff Bridges is still with us.

[Andy Greenwald]

Did that leak give you any pause about the free flowing exchange of ideas that we have with. I do not want to be deposed about anything. No, no FOIAs for you.

[Chris Ryan]

It's not even like that I'm that ashamed about it. I just would just to see text messages in that context. The other thing that was shocking to me.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

If we're really talking about it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Sure.

[Chris Ryan]

Is when Blake Lively is like, hey, so this is like, if you haven't been following along with this, this is the sort of lawsuits that have been going back and forth between Blake Lively and Justin Baldoni over the It Ends with Us movie and the debacle that came out of that. Although it was quite successful, they've now somehow, for whatever reason, it's been like, well, you need to turn over all of your text messages. I don't.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is a.

[Chris Ryan]

This is like a part of the American legal system where I'm like, really.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can'T imagine that ever.

[Chris Ryan]

And also what's weird is that like, yeah, they got the January 6th texts, but they're like, never mind. You can just be president.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes. I'm glad you've reached this point. Were you doing sober, like Jack Smith consideration of these issues until just today? Did you just break your silence?

[Chris Ryan]

I'm just saying. So Blake Lively had sort of brought Taylor Swift into this whole process because there was going to be like Taylor Swift music in the movie.

[Andy Greenwald]

And. And their pals.

[Chris Ryan]

They're pals. And so at one point they're like going back and forth. But Blake Lively is like mad at Justin Baldoni and is like, sort of like employed Taylor Swift to like be on her side and to kind of like do this and do that and have a meeting with him and tell him he's nothing and whatever. Then like, you know, months pass or whatever and things have been going poorly for Blake Lively and Taylor Swift. We're just off and Blake Lively's like, hey, love you. Seems like you're like, maybe mad at me, but maybe that's just in my head. And like, Taylor Swift's like, no, it's not. I was like, oh, shit.

[Andy Greenwald]

I would hate that if someone was like. If someone broke the Social contract and told the truth.

[Chris Ryan]

No, only Taylor Swift. No. Yeah, that's the thing is that like that decision where it's just like, I think, I don't think guys really do this very much, where it's like, hey, is something wrong? And they're like, yeah, you, you know.

[Andy Greenwald]

I don't, I mean generally like our texts are we're really going to interview Jim Bob Cooter. And that's not like, like, that's not like a metaphor.

[Chris Ryan]

It's not code for. No, that's like shoot arrow indicator.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, that's actually a football coach's name. Yeah, that's true. We're kind of surface in that. Like. Kai, do you want to weigh in on this?

[Chris Ryan]

Were you surprised that when Blake Lively was like, hey, something wrong? Taylor was like, yeah, there is something wrong. You sound weird. You're, you're weird. I mean I got to respect it because like I've come. I'm a non confrontational person. Yeah, me too. Also, Taylor Swift says she's never been to therapy, but she speaks like someone who's done a lot of. Well, I feel like now because of the over therapy of like a lot of like movies and TV shows and everything, it's like you can kind of like talk and that talk without actually doing the work.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, it's like that's my plan.

[Chris Ryan]

She's like, I don't have to go to therapy. I saw sentimental value.

[Andy Greenwald]

You're not wrong. I guess I respect the directness. I feel that there is something, there's something vulnerable here, but also kind of affirming that all of these people who work so hard and pay so many people to create their public facing Personas really just are who they are. Like Ryan Reynolds tech Ryan Reynolds texts like Deadpool. Like did you see the text he sent Colleen Hoover where he was like, I'm sorry I couldn't speak to you at the party. I was so deep inside the mouth of that marketing exec. I'm still trapped here. Help get me out. And he's like, you and Bea created something so powerful and beautiful. You can dial it down a little bit, it's fine. I also say this as someone who would never ever want to be exposed in this way. And yet there is a part of me that does think that of all the body of work, the great body of work that I've left in the public domain these last 25 years, I do think the very best of it is like a one off text to Tim Symonds where I send the right gif at 4pm, you know what I mean? Or if I just come in.

[Chris Ryan]

That's where you do your. That's. That's like. That's your legacy.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. And so I do.

[Chris Ryan]

It's a shame. It's like, I wish, you know, people used to leave their letters to universities.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes, yes.

[Chris Ryan]

It'd be great if you had a terminal illness and you were just like.

[Andy Greenwald]

Went up to the University of Phoenix donation.

[Chris Ryan]

No, you went back to Brown. You went up to the library and you're like, here you go. Just gave the iPhone. It's like, I turned face ID off.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's unlocked.

[Chris Ryan]

All yours.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, this guy really cared about the offensive schemes.

[Chris Ryan]

This guy fucking loved pints.

[Andy Greenwald]

This guy visited Facebook a lot. All right. All this was because of Matt Damon's comments. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

I just wanted to bring this up because I thought Damon and Affleck have done. This is one of those, like, I think they've gotten more press for their press tour than for the movie kind.

[Andy Greenwald]

Of thing, where, I mean, they are more famous than this movie is.

[Chris Ryan]

But they were on Rogan and Damon started talking a little bit about the notes process and, like, the kind of desires of Netflix when it comes to, like, what they're looking for when it. With their film and television. And he said that, you know, things have changed that back in the day when they would make action movies, you would basically do a big set piece. You do a set piece per act in ascending order of scale, craziness and craziness and tension and consequences. And he's like, now they want you to have something grabby in the first opening moments of a movie so that people don't click out of it.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes.

[Chris Ryan]

Which is something I don't really do. Like, I don't really like. I personally am certainly not watching a movie and be like, well, nothing as grabby has happened yet. It's like, I'm fine watching the credits and 10 minutes or 20 minutes of. You're old school. I am old school. I am. But. And so he was like, now we're kind of inverting it where something huge has to happen in the first minutes or they're convinced people are going to click out of it. And then furthermore, and this is something that he articulated what I felt about the last season of Stranger Things that I just couldn't put my finger on, which is the. The. The consistent, like, reiteration of plot and reiteration of what this, like, sort of stakes are and the setup and, like, narrating what is pretty obvious on screen and sort of being like, we have to go over there. And then they Go over there. It's like, well, you could just show me them walking over there and I would be able to piece that together. But at least according to Damon, this is like the idea that people are constantly looking at their phones while they're watching these movies and shows and that they might forget. And I have to admit that when I watch either, say, Pluribus or Sentimental Value, and either there's not dialogue or there's no dialogue in a language that I know I am like, oh, fuck. I actually can't look at the. At the Athletic to see if we've hired an OC because, like, I'll miss the entire point of the scene.

[Andy Greenwald]

Right.

[Chris Ryan]

Anyway, I just was wondering whether or not, I guess not explicitly. Have you ever gotten notes that suggest as much? Not from Netflix, per se, because I don't think it's exclusively Netflix. I think when I see other shows. Right, but have you noticed a post streaming? And perhaps to put it at a point, I think I would identify this as a post Covid thing because I do think that people have kind of developed a now debilitating need to have their phone in their hand all the time. Probably because we had it in our hands a lot during. During lockdown and stuff like that. Like, have you noticed that, like, there is, like a change in the way that you're being asked to write screens, scripts, or how you write scripts anyway, just because you're seeing so much of this.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is why we've made fun of it without ever really saying why it exists, but why the number one most annoying trend in pilots, especially over the last three years, is start with something incredibly exciting and then, say, five, six months earlier. Yes. Let's go back to the more natural starting point for the story that's not as interesting. We have created a generation of helicopter executives who do their job. The way parents behave on the playgrounds of Highland park, you know, like, the children cannot be left out of your sight for one second unless they do something dangerous. Or in the case of the executives, lest the audience just.

[Chris Ryan]

Or lest they get hired to be the OC of the Eagles.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think we should start young and raise them right. It's the prince who was promised just this young boy. It's like, higher egg is our new offensive.

[Chris Ryan]

Kid in a fucking matrix is like bending spoons, except he's getting guys open.

[Andy Greenwald]

For you to get. But it's the cowboys in November.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, I hope people are enjoying.

[Andy Greenwald]

These are really good ideas. And they're free. Yeah. So, you know, because they're. I Mean, we, we keep, we. We keep distracting ourselves. We're digressing on this podcast, talking about reels and other things. And that is the experience of audiences. I will say that I've not come up against the restatement of plot, but the absolute surefire note, particularly from streaming services like, I guess everyone is a streaming service these days, but particularly when you are developing for a Netflix or an Amazon that comes from the tech world, they are hyper, hyper focused on the first three minutes more than anything else.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

That they have very, very concrete evidence that there is a time, there's a window, a clock starts when someone presses play, where they either are going to commit or they are not going to commit. And that those have to be the stickiest moments possible. And I think that's interesting from the perspective of people who've been making movies for a while, how that has just upended or rearranged in a more charitable way. Just. Yeah. Re. Recalibrated what a movie is.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

And how it is supposed to feel that it's not ascending, that it's actually in some ways descending from the first moment and settling in.

[Chris Ryan]

Now look like there are, There are plenty of examples. Heat opens with an action scene. You know what I mean? Like, there are plenty of things that movies and television shows that open with something big. But I think you can see it to your point, a show like Black Rabbit, which I, I did actually like quite a bit, but has some of that. Like, why is this show opening with what should be the highlight of the first couple of episodes, which is building up to this robbery, you know what I mean? Instead, we're going to go backwards now, knowing that this is going to go wrong for these two guys. But we're not exactly sure who all the players are. And I don't know whether that was a note or whether that was them saying, like, well, we can't just open this and have an hour of these guys trying to set a restaurant up.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's not just that. It's that, like the analogy that I would use that is hyper specific to me. And again, the other girl dads who have made films this year is when I'm making the kids lunches and I open the drawer to find containers to put aspects of their lunch in. And I have all the wrong sizes, so I have a small thing made for like a side of sauce and I'm trying to put like fucking takeout chicken satay in there with the stick coming out of it. That was just this morning. But the point being Black Rabbit has to exist in an ecosystem where the sizes are all wrong. I think that the filmmakers were rightfully. I mean, they cared about the action sequence and the crescendo of their story, for sure. But what they also were excited about was a story of mismatch brothers coming together and starting a restaurant and the community of people that would be in the restaurant who would become people you would get to know, care about, so that when this crescendo happened, you would be invested in it. Right then they're trying to cram that in to a Tupperware that is made by Netflix, which means it has to be a certain way at the beginning. And they're trying to do it in an ecosystem where they want. They went for I don't know if they wanted, but they ended up with Jason Bateman and Jude Law, stars who are not committing to five years of slow build.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

So the whole thing ends up being slightly misshapen from maybe what they originally thought. And to our critical eyes was like, oh, that's not. That wouldn't have been my preferred way to enter into a story. The fact that you got to a place where you liked the story and you still engage with it is a triumph.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

The notes are weird, and they are changing our filmmaking experience. And it goes back to what I was saying about sentimental value, which is your mileage may vary from mine, but the way that movie opened with the voiceover and the house I loved into the main character's backstage freakout, which honestly mimicked how I felt before our FYC Atlanta panel eight years ago. I found that so hysterical in all senses, and I was so riveted. But that's my version, I guess, of a massive car chase or something. Like, I was in that. And 100%, that would be noted. Yes, if it was. If. And there's a lot of Netflix jokes in that movie.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, it's an interesting experience because, you know, when sentimental value begins, there's three full screens of financier like no cards.

[Andy Greenwald]

And also, every country in Europe's film.

[Chris Ryan]

Commission has kicked in 10 grand thinking about this too. And, you know, it's. The movie itself is about Stalin, Skarsgard's character, who's a sort of lionized, critically beloved filmmaker who's gonna make one last movie, and he initially is gonna make it with his daughter, played by Renata Runzva, and then he chooses, after she rejects him, to make it with an American movie star played by Elle Fanning. And it's. It's. There's this, there's this kind of like art imitating life imitating art thing going on in the movie. But I did note with interest that when he gets, you know, Elle Fanning to sign onto the movie, Netflix just signs on to produce the film. When he, before that, he's like, we'll scrape together the necessary funds from all of these nation's film boards and do whatever is necessary to do that. Maybe you hire one. I don't know why like the Film Society of Ireland kicks in money to like a Yoakim Trier movie. But it's just fascinating like what you have to do to patch together funding to make anything if you're not making it for one of these major things.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can I give give away an idea here? I think the way to, to, to bring all of this together in a way that is both creatively satisfying and maybe illuminating to the larger world is for the Safdie brothers, or at least one of them, pick them to make a movie called the, the, the Financier. Not about Jeff Epstein, but about the guy whose job it is to go hat in hand to every liberal western democracy and ask for a few, you know, thousand euros or whatever to make a movie. You get Lars Eidinger to play the lead.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like this would, I feel like it would be quite stressful.

[Chris Ryan]

I can't imagine it. I mean, I also don't know how much longer that will, that will be the case, you know.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, you know, I think it all depends on Greenland.

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[Chris Ryan]

This is pro linebacker TJ Watt and I'm back with YPB by Abercrombie for another activewear drop. My second co design collection has new shorts and tanks that keep up with.

[Andy Greenwald]

All my in season workouts and their.

[Chris Ryan]

New Restore collection is a game changer.

[Andy Greenwald]

Changer off the field too because even.

[Chris Ryan]

Pro athletes like me need rest days. Shop YPB by Abercrombie in the app, online and in stores because your personal best is greater than anything.

[Andy Greenwald]

Before we get into the pit.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can I just make the small Speaking of small projects that are multilingual with lots of subtitles so you can't look at a second screen, I would like to make the case for Drops of God season two.

[Chris Ryan]

Please do.

[Andy Greenwald]

This is a very very hyper specific, very charming series that premiered two plus years ago on Apple tv. It is a massive international co production. The first season is about essentially a wine tasting competition in which a Robert Parker esque, but one who is respected around the world, not just America, wine expert dies and he leaves his legacy, his guide, his cellar to the winner of a competition that is between his daughter who's a French one played by Fleur Jeffrier.

[Chris Ryan]

Can you just say that name one more time?

[Andy Greenwald]

I believe it's. It's Fleur.

[Chris Ryan]

Uh huh.

[Andy Greenwald]

And I believe it's Jeffrier. Okay, I actually did listen to an Instagram beforehand. It was interview between her and Joachim Trier and I was only listening to what she was saying.

[Chris Ryan]

Well you're an ally always above all else.

[Andy Greenwald]

And the second, the second competitor in the wine tasting competition is by the dead legend's disciple who, spoiler alert might be more than his disciple who lives in Japan played by Tomohisa Yamashita that I do. And anyway it was a really really entertaining series and I think there's a bunch of ways into it. It is sort of melodramatic and over the top but it is also beautifully international in films in France and Japan and all over Europe. And it got renewed That's.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. And now it's back for season two, and it continues to be very, very escapist and charming this season. In the first episode already, they go to Spain. They go to Marseilles. The stakes are now to hunt down the origin of a mysterious, unlabeled bottle of wine.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you think that they're really going to those places or are they just shooting in Budapest? They're like, ah, Spain.

[Andy Greenwald]

This could be a subplot of the Safdie Brothers, the financier movie. Because a lot. Like, there are a lot of international names in this cast and a lot of production companies, and I don't quite get how it works, but it works. The only thing that I will say about. Because some people might turn to me and say, how do you find stakes in a show about two people decanting? And I will say that this season introduces Issei's new obsession with free diving.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh, yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which definitely is a lot more dangerous than swirling and sniffing.

[Chris Ryan]

I watched a whole documentary about that.

[Andy Greenwald]

The other thing that the first episode does, and I loved it. I want to be clear about that, was that there's a moment when you say tastes. HE SNIFFS and he tastes this wine, this mysterious wine, and he has a vision when he has the. And the vision is of the fucking Sea of Tranquility on the moon. And I'm telling you, I was like, are they saying this wine's from space? For a moment, I was like, apple's notes were so crazy that they were.

[Chris Ryan]

Like, can we get some for all mankind?

[Andy Greenwald]

They were like, for all mankind. Works for us. Foundation works for us. Can we spice this up? Can we space this up? I don't think that.

[Chris Ryan]

No, it was probably just his sort of. That was his poetic mind traveling all the way out there.

[Andy Greenwald]

But the fact that even for a second, I was like, oh, shit, dog. Yeah. They terraformed Mars terroir. Kwatu was like, the minerality of the red soil is so unique. And he's sniffing. He's sniffing it. Like, all the face inside of him is sniffing it and tasting it. That's not true, but did I make it sound more interesting?

[Chris Ryan]

I'm interested. I liked the couple of episodes that I watched last year. It just didn't really grab me that much.

[Andy Greenwald]

It is a very gentle watch, and I'm happy that it's back. And for people who like it, you will not be disappointed. It's back.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you feel like when they finished the first season, it was like, you guys said what you needed to Say, or was there obviously a lot more in this world to explore?

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, it's based on a longer running manga series and I think it was quite freely adapted. So I don't actually know how close to any original text it is. I think that the genius of it is, yes, they seem to have found a second quest worthy of the first, which I think would be a challenging assignment for the writers room. But more than that, the show just has a very, very pleasant international cooperation vibe, which is a little bit out of step with the times. And it does have a seriousness and specificity when it comes to wine and winemaking. And, like, there's a whole digression in this episode about how they are, like, defending this vineyard against climate change in ways that are non.

[Chris Ryan]

What's climate change?

[Andy Greenwald]

Exactly. Exactly. One thing I'm realizing as my kids get older is I can't. I'm not on a podcast with them. So, like, my younger daughter was like, we watched a film in science class today. I was like, oh, that's interesting. What was it about? And she goes, climate change. And I said, well, that's a myth. And she's like, what do you mean? And I was like, okay, don't tell Mom. I'm gonna walk that back.

[Chris Ryan]

Did you also. What was the nicotine thing?

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, yeah. My older daughter was in science class. They were talking about the addictive effects of nicotine and how.

[Chris Ryan]

Where's my camera?

[Andy Greenwald]

Vapes are really easy to get. Not true. And vapes are really easy to get, but, like, it's kind of gross. And I was like, well, if you ever want to, you know, talk to Uncle Chris, I'm sure he could come in and address your class. I was like, he hasn't smoked in. You know. You used to have a cigarette smoking habit.

[Chris Ryan]

I did.

[Andy Greenwald]

You haven't had that habit in quite some time.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I didn't.

[Andy Greenwald]

But nicotine still plays a role.

[Chris Ryan]

I will tell you that. The cigarette that Stellan Skarsgrd and Renata rhymes with share, I was like, I gotta get back to one.

[Andy Greenwald]

Can you be a chipper like Malcolm Gladwell?

[Chris Ryan]

Well, you know, the thing is, when you take a long time off and you hit that one, it's like, oh, you know what I mean? Like, it doesn't. I like the feeling of it being part of my bloodstream. You know what I mean? It's not like I like nicotine. I don't know if I really want to go back to smoking cigarettes, even though they are my best friend.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think you just answered that question. This is the most emotional I've ever seen you be on this podcast.

[Chris Ryan]

Well, I'm also coming. Coming off a week of watching Zodiac three times. And like, the smoking in Zodiac definitely makes you kind of want to eat an entire pack.

[Andy Greenwald]

Should we comment on my erasure from the Zodiac rewatchables history? Or should we say it's not the.

[Chris Ryan]

First time we've redone a podcast, though.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it's the first one that I've been edged out of history. Sorry.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, it's tough. Well, it's tough.

[Andy Greenwald]

The game changes bring your rate down. You know what I mean? It's. It's not that. It's just that the Declan Doyles are on my heels.

[Chris Ryan]

It's just me about Bill and Sean.

[Andy Greenwald]

As it really should have been. I think the previous one was me, you and Sean. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

And weren't you, like, this is a pretty good movie.

[Andy Greenwald]

It was early in the run of.

[Chris Ryan]

Rewatch, so you weren't sure that you were supposed to be, you know, full.

[Andy Greenwald]

Throated, in my experience.

[Chris Ryan]

Let's talk a little bit about the Pit. I didn't intentionally say let's put the Pit an hour into this podcast, but I will say a very good episode of the Pit that I don't have a ton of comments on.

[Andy Greenwald]

Was that what you were asking me? Because you. It was interesting. You texted me asking if I had watched it yet and I hadn't. And then when I reported that I had, I thought you had a leading question.

[Chris Ryan]

No, I thought, you know, what it was is I was trying to remember when the Pit last season went into, like, holy shit, overdrive. This is just like every week I'm like, that was awesome. I enjoyed that a lot. I can go through all of our patients that we've got if you want, and you can just sort of like, give me some comments.

[Andy Greenwald]

We have comments. I do want to say I loved this episode.

[Chris Ryan]

It was a very good episode.

[Andy Greenwald]

But I think that what I loved about it may have been the Tree of Life stuff. I did love that, but I also just loved the. We could probably just replay our comments from episode 3 a year ago. But I am so in awe of the maestro level Lydia Tar esque conducting that they are doing. Like, just in terms of building.

[Chris Ryan]

That's a good point. I mean, I don't mean.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, you take it for granted because we used to have things in this country and we used to have TV like this and the way that they bring people on and off the field and the way that the stories Dovetail and interact, but constantly leave these little pockets of air for the characters to share a look or share a moment. The way that it's coming up with. Continually creative and, you know, we've grown up with medical dramas our entire life. And how many different. How many different styles of problem can you present to us, but finding a different way into the problem, Whether it's a couple showing up in one set of circumstances and the set of circumstances then reversing.

[Chris Ryan]

Or we think that this guy's beating his kid, but it turns out she has an autoimmune disease.

[Andy Greenwald]

Or to speak to the tree of life survivor woman patient in this episode who turns to Perla and is like, are you Muslim? And you're like. And you have the same tension in your body as when Langdon goes in with the thing to the kid nose. The kid who can't sit still. And you're like, is this. Which way is this gonna go? And you truly don't know. This was the week this season for me where I was like, man, I am just. I'm at Dorney park and I'm on the river.

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

I am having a great time being caught up in it.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah. I mean, we had a tweaker student. We had the security guard who claims to be. Who have been to have been assaulted by the aforementioned student.

[Andy Greenwald]

And did he tase him? The security guard tase the kid?

[Chris Ryan]

I think we're gonna find out that that guy. That. That kid has whatever issue is gonna. I. I wonder if it's not.

[Andy Greenwald]

He was clean from drugs.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes. And so then the security guard. What's his problem? What did he do?

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

We have the unhoused gentleman who's been getting washed down. That's Charles Baker from Breaking Bad.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

Skinny pete. We got Mr. And Mrs. Yee, who you mentioned, who had the kind of. The rope. A dope where we think Mr. Yee is gonna be quadriplegic. Then he's fine. Potassium. But then Ms. Yee goes down. They got an accident with a motorcyclist. He's dead.

[Andy Greenwald]

He was. He was real dead. And Robbie said that he always wears helmets, but he doesn't. That's not true. I know.

[Chris Ryan]

Unreliable narrator. Who else? Michael Nuri is walking around the ER greeting people, really flirting, too. The guy from Derek Cecil from house cards plays Mr. Williams.

[Andy Greenwald]

He's down bad.

[Chris Ryan]

He is down bad. But there was like a nice. That note of the. The woman who. He was at. His ex girlfriend?

[Andy Greenwald]

No, it was his ex wife.

[Chris Ryan]

Ex wife. They broke up because he started Losing his temper all the time. It turns out that might be a tumor. And she got to look back and say, shit, if I could have had. If I could have known that.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah, what would she have done? You want to weigh in on that? I feel like this is a real sliding doors moment for you.

[Chris Ryan]

This is my thing is like, that was a great scene. I don't know. I don't know what to say. The young girl with bruises has a dad who is a giant asshole, but it turns out the girl is suffering from an autoimmune thing. So we get the depiction of the guy as a prick, but perhaps not a child abuser.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think definitively not. Although you never know with the show.

[Chris Ryan]

The Tree of Life thing, I thought, was handled beautifully, and it is an example of the moments and the space the show is taking and these quiet hours before this code black kicks in. That I think is going to be the beginning of the dominoes of the rest of the day of the show, of the season. I thought that this was just a lovely character moment. I think they are doing a really good job with Robbie, perhaps last season with some of the flashbacks and the longing looks at his mentor's memorial and it being the anniversary of his death and all this stuff this season, I feel like they're doing a little bit more show don't tell with him. And like you said, riding to work without a helmet, which Noah Wiley has since commented on, saying, like, that is important. And the interaction with the Tree of Life survivor, talking about faith, talking about their religion and not. I don't. I don't think they.

[Andy Greenwald]

In his midlife crisis.

[Chris Ryan]

And his midlife crisis.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it's just. It's just more interesting TV to make the season about a character's current life pitched forward as opposed to the character in his current life, you know, obsessed with the trauma of the past. Like, it is just much more. And much more in keeping with, I think, the spirit of the Pit, which is a show about immediacy and is in real time.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

So it's just a more interesting characterization for the lead. I noted with interest that this was the episode of the season. I assume there's only one per season due to workload that Noah Wylie is also the credited screenwriter of. And so now we know that was.

[Chris Ryan]

The Hawaiian Prayer episode last year.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yes. And this is the. Langdon just has long quotes about fatherhood available to him due to his long time on the bench. You know, I think there's a moment where you could look at that scene and be like, well, this is a little bit declarative. This is a little bit tell. Don't show. It's even bordering on corny. But there is an earnestness that's baked into the show that. That I don't bump on. And genuinely the vibe that the show creates. And harvest like that scene. And that's the scene between the father of the young kid who has beads up his nose and can't sit still. Langdon. And the nurse who's had. I'm really struggling with names of the tertiary characters on the show, but he's a new father or about to be a father. And that's been a rare.

[Chris Ryan]

He's a new father. They're doing, like, he's just dealing with the sleep schedule stuff.

[Andy Greenwald]

And speaking of texts, we don't send each other, but Taylor Swift does. I was like, I don't know if I've ever had a more. More satisfying interaction with other men than the 45 seconds they spent taking beads out of that child's nose. Like, these three guys are all gathered together, raising this boy, freeing his nose of colorful baubles. They quote something, and then they all look at each other. They get the job done, and they fucking fist bump. Why can't it ever be that easy? We have to do 15 years of a podcast just to be honest with each other. You know what I mean? That was so efficient. Yeah, I thought that was lovely.

[Chris Ryan]

How do you feel about the fact that they have now kind of, like, zeroed in on, like, the kind of power radiating off of Katherine Lanassa and she gets a lot more, like, kind of cutaway and stuff, and she's in there a lot more. And, you know, it's an interesting remix of, I think, the characters.

[Andy Greenwald]

I think it's good. Again, thinking about the show as if you're just thinking about the execution of X's and O's to bring you back to offensive game planning? It really works for me, hour by hour, to understand that is a heliocentric show in the sense that she is. Dana is at the center and everyone else is orbiting around her and they can touch back. We know what's at the heart of it all. Just geographically. Having her charisma there works for me. And then you think about the orbit because finally Altashimi and Robbie split up and they had a cute little interaction about, like, seeing other people and going in reverse orbit of each other.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which I was glad for, because the benefit of the show moving this quickly is you don't have a lot of time to get annoyed or get annoyed. Well, it's also just like they first meet.

[Chris Ryan]

He's put off by it, but then over the course of a couple of patients and maybe a couple of hours, he's like, I'll make a joke. She makes me jump back. We're starting to loosen up a little bit. It's okay.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's reasonable. But also the dynamic, that initial dynamic was starting to wear thin and I think we're headed towards more of it as there seems to be some sort of Code Black. Like hospitals are going offline and that seems to be.

[Chris Ryan]

That's in the trailer? I don't know.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean. No, no. The end of the episode, they get the call saying they're about to get hit with everything from another hospital because of a Code Black there.

[Chris Ryan]

Right.

[Andy Greenwald]

And so it's suggestion that there's some.

[Chris Ryan]

Tech, but he's like, that could be anything. Right. That's in the trailer that they're.

[Andy Greenwald]

You've told me that.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. We have not watched. You haven't watched ahead?

[Chris Ryan]

No, I haven't watched ahead. But in the season trailer it's like, we gotta go analog.

[Andy Greenwald]

I just found the. The character who exists at least in the opening hours only to be slightly different than Robbie, but is just following him everywhere. I'm glad that they split up.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

Like, that was a smart use of that. Are you. Can I just. Can I treat this a little bit like school? Like, can I pop quiz you on something?

[Chris Ryan]

Sure.

[Andy Greenwald]

What exactly are they extracting from Louis body?

[Chris Ryan]

I think he has some sort of like. I don't know.

[Andy Greenwald]

What are they gonna do with that?

[Chris Ryan]

I was gonna give you like a kind of a half hearted. Like, I sort of understand that. He's obviously retaining a lot of fluids.

[Andy Greenwald]

I would say so. Five. Five jugs worth.

[Chris Ryan]

So it's a liver problem, I bet.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Because of his alcoholism.

[Andy Greenwald]

He does have alcoholism and I don't.

[Chris Ryan]

Know why they can drain that much. But yes. Like, there's probably some organ failure going on there.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you watch those scenes with increasing dread that something else is going to come out of him? That there's some like that. That is a misdirect. I don't know.

[Chris Ryan]

Louis's been there for a while now. I mean, he was there in the first season and I don't know what's gonna come out at him or how one of these new kids are gonna fuck this up or what.

[Andy Greenwald]

Anecdotes, including Pittsburgh's connection to the history of fireworks.

[Chris Ryan]

It's true.

[Andy Greenwald]

I do Enjoy that. The only other notes I had from this episode were I could take or leave the racing crew. They don't quite.

[Chris Ryan]

I mean, it's western Pennsylvania.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yeah. But they're from Georgia.

[Chris Ryan]

Oh.

[Andy Greenwald]

They're there for some reunion. And then all of them seem to have a succession of problems. And they all share pills.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Which, I mean, look, who among us didn't live in New York city in their 20s? I'm just saying you grow out of that. I like the ways for a show that we sometimes ding. Or at least we point out the ways in which it is overtly. I mean, sad to say anything about good people trying to help in an overloaded system is by definition political. And we point out when the nurses, like, gather together, like the course of a musical the first season, the subtle ways that the show does it as well. Like the fact that Robbie has a lot of experience removing tasers from people and how you treat that.

[Chris Ryan]

Or the fact that they have to send. They have to. Like the insurance is having them move a surgical patient to another hospital because it frees up a bed.

[Andy Greenwald]

Yep.

[Chris Ryan]

And it's. I thought it was good that they had some sort of a mixed variety of reactions to that rather than just like, this is unacceptable, that insurance does this. It was kind of like, well, it frees up a bed and it does this. And it's like, this is how the system works.

[Andy Greenwald]

Are you happy that. That the. That the security guard guy can get the bet pool running again? Like the, like the fanduel of the pit?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

Is back up and running.

[Chris Ryan]

I. I'm excited for next week's episode. I haven't watched ahead, but I am excited for next week's episode in that regard.

[Andy Greenwald]

You think something big's coming?

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, I think usually at around 4, they start to. And for people who are just listening, I just changed gears.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, I wonder what the other option was. If you were audio only, what they thought was happening with you.

[Chris Ryan]

Do you want to do a few minutes of sports talk or are you tapped out?

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm curious. Where do you want to go with it? You had a Phillies take you wanted to jump into.

[Chris Ryan]

It's interesting how many things in my life that I like are under full.

[Andy Greenwald]

On assault, like democracy. What.

[Chris Ryan]

To being like. To collapsing. And I, I don't know if that's extreme, but.

[Andy Greenwald]

All right.

[Chris Ryan]

And I'm, I'm happy. I, I am honestly happy for Sean and the Mets. Like, I'm glad that those guys.

[Andy Greenwald]

I feel like you, you. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

But the Dodgers thing has been getting to me a little bit this week. And I'm so glad the Mets got Peralta instead of the Dodgers, because if the Dodgers got Peralta, I do think, like, people would be like, we're not going to fucking spring training. This is ridiculous. And, you know, I've been very similarly.

[Andy Greenwald]

If the Ellisons get Warner Brothers, like, I just want to know where.

[Chris Ryan]

No, it's college football that I've been thinking about a lot because of the. Because. Not because of the portal. Because I think the kids should be able to transfer.

[Andy Greenwald]

But wait till I tell you about what Amazon's done to wages. It's gonna blow your mind. But we'll get there. We'll get there.

[Chris Ryan]

No, but I did breathe a sigh of relief that somebody besides the Dodgers got Peralta from the Brewers.

[Andy Greenwald]

Do you feel, though, economic inequality aside, how does it make you feel knowing that the Phillies have essentially done nothing? They've lost depth, lost players, still have nikestijanos on the books.

[Chris Ryan]

Yes.

[Andy Greenwald]

And yet still somehow have the fourth highest payroll in Major League Baseball?

[Chris Ryan]

Well, they take care of their guys.

[Andy Greenwald]

You know, it's a union town. Yeah. I'm annoyed at the running it back thing, but at the same time, like, it would. Baseball is so weird and fluky that all these.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah, they could be healthy and hot and they could win it, you know, I mean, probably not with the Dodgers, but they could.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, no, it's a race for second place. No. No shame in that.

[Chris Ryan]

I was excited by, like, I can't remember who I saw talking about the Dodgers were scared of the Phillies. That was, like, who they thought the basically the World Series was with. It didn't feel that way during that Series, but.

[Andy Greenwald]

No, it did not. Because, you know, and I can relate. Like, when you reach a certain age, like, your highs are still pretty high, but you get. You don't get to them as much. You know, you can go real cold for a couple of weeks. Yeah, I. I believe in Justin Crawford. I do not necessarily share the same optimism about Andrew Painter and whoever else we've got coming up to pitch, but you. But. But you made a very. And this is interesting. I thought you were. You. You threw on the burgundy P within minutes of the 49ers game. Like you were ready to.

[Chris Ryan]

Yeah.

[Andy Greenwald]

I mean, on to baseball, bro.

[Chris Ryan]

I was watching Flyers Mammoth last night.

[Andy Greenwald]

That's crazy. Yeah. How's that feel?

[Chris Ryan]

I just. This always happens, like, the football dwindles, and it is the thing that unlocks my true fucking sports obsession. It's just like Watching the Rams Bears game, I was like, that was an absolutely amazing reward for watching an amazing thing. Yeah, I just want to watch sports all the time.

[Andy Greenwald]

I'm with you on that. I just want to watch sports all the time.

[Chris Ryan]

Football goes away and you're like, fuck, it's the all star game for NBA. You know what I mean? So I'm just kind of like, I'm scraping around for stuff.

[Andy Greenwald]

It's pretty fun watching sports when you don't care. I know you always like to pick someone to root for and I probably inevitably.

[Chris Ryan]

You care too much though.

[Andy Greenwald]

But I care too much. It's just not healthy.

[Chris Ryan]

Amanda Anisimova I'm like, one night I'm just like, go get him, girl. And then I'm done. You know, I have no idea whether she's still playing tennis.

[Andy Greenwald]

You have never ever supported anyone the way you supported that woman for three and a half hours last year. I've never seen passion.

[Chris Ryan]

That was during the, the lightning storm of the Cowboys game.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, right, right. When we had some. We had to look at something else briefly and you just took all your chips and you went all in on your girl. Passion is good. Yeah, passion is good.

[Chris Ryan]

We'll be back on Monday. We're going to talk about Knight of the Seven kingdoms and industry and I'm sure we'll have other news and notes to go over and keep kai here for 90 plus minutes as we discuss the Phillies off season and institutional under institutions under assault.

[Andy Greenwald]

Just wealth.

[Chris Ryan]

I think that we did a good job today of being a little bit flighty but keeping it, keeping the main thing. The main thing.

[Andy Greenwald]

Oh, I also like the backdoor Jalen shout out. That's good. Yeah.

[Chris Ryan]

Kaia McMullen is our producer and Kai Grady makes us look good. And we'll be back on Monday. I hope everybody has a great weekend.

[Andy Greenwald]

Well, the holidays have come and gone.

[Chris Ryan]

Once again, but if you've forgotten to get that special someone in your life a gift. Well, Mint Mobile is extending their holiday offer of half off unlimited wireless. So here's the idea. You get it now. Now you call it an early present for next year.

[Andy Greenwald]

What do you have to lose?

[Chris Ryan]

Give it a try at mintmobile. Com Switch Limited time, 50% off regular price for new customers. Upfront payment required.

[Andy Greenwald]

$45 for three months, $90 for six.

[Chris Ryan]

Month or $180 for 12 month plan taxes and fees.

[Andy Greenwald]

Extra speeds may slow after 50 gigabytes.

[Chris Ryan]

Per month when network is busy see terms.