The Watch — March 27, 2025

Episode: “‘The Studio’ Makes Hollywood Look Cool Again. Plus, ‘Dope Thief.’”
Hosts: Andy Greenwald & Chris Ryan
Podcast: The Watch / The Ringer

Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Andy Greenwald and Chris Ryan explore two new Apple TV+ series: The Studio, Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg’s satirical ode to old-school Hollywood, and Dope Thief, a gritty, character-driven Philadelphia crime drama. The conversation also covers recent Hollywood industry news, particularly Apple TV+'s strategy, the changing business of streaming, and major shifts in how tentpole franchises like James Bond are managed in the post-family-steward era.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. James Bond’s Future & Hollywood’s Changing Guard

[03:41-15:37]

• Amazon Buys Out the Broccoli/Wilson Family:
  Barbara Broccoli and Michael Wilson, long-time custodians of the Bond franchise, were bought out by Amazon, marking a clear end to an era of family-run Hollywood intellectual property.

• Old-School Meets New Tech:
  Amazon’s choice to hand Bond to Amy Pascal (Sony’s Spider-Verse) and David Heyman (Harry Potter, Gravity, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood) is seen as a bid to uphold the franchise’s legacy and prestige rather than spinning it out wildly for streaming content.

  • Andy: “They are people who are, I think, among the very few remaining avatars of…a relationships business.” [07:43]

• Concerns About Franchise Stewardship:
  The hosts ponder if Amy Pascal and Heyman are being split between spin-off opportunities (universe expansion) and the flagship Bond movies.

• Bond as Cultural Touchstone:
  Chris remarks on the unique British and global resonance of Bond, noting the property’s “crown jewel” status.

  Notable Exchange:

  Andy: “This is the first move in the new streaming tech version of Hollywood…that it seemed like someone was trying to reach backwards to maintain some continuity. And Bond itself is maybe the right property for this because Bond is a classy, old-school figure.” [08:54]

2. Apple TV+: Asymmetrical Spending, Industry Influence, and Brand Strategy

[16:41-27:19]

• Apple’s Content Spending:
  Reported to lose $1B/yr on Apple TV+, with annual content spending once $5B but now scaled back.
  • Chris: "Apple obviously makes iPhones…so they print money, essentially.” [17:47]
  • “I don’t think Tim Cook thinks of that billion dollars as a loss. I think he thinks of it as a spend.” – Andy [18:09]
• Critical Hits vs. Commercial Value:
  Shows like Severance, Shrinking, and the soon-to-premiere Your Friends and Neighbors reflect Apple's play for prestige, star power, and consistent new content, even if those titles’ buzz and audience size are difficult to measure.
• Star-Driven Content:
  Apple continues landing massive talent (Chastain, Driver, Brie Larson, etc.) for buzzy, high-concept projects.
• Comparison to Netflix:
  Unlike Netflix’s subterranean ecosystem of international and surprise-hit programming, Apple’s strategy is to line up the “shiny new boxes with new famous people on it pretty reliably.” [24:33]

3. The Studio (Apple TV+) — A Love Letter and Eulogy for Hollywood

[27:19-44:49]

Premise and Main Characters

• Seth Rogen and Evan Goldberg’s Series:
  The Studio is a comedic, energetic show about Matt (Seth Rogen), an everyman suddenly elevated to head of Continental Studios, as he tries to save his position and legacy projects—with both madcap comedy and melancholy undertones.
• Surrounding Cast:
  Catherine O'Hara (Amy Pascal stand-in), Bryan Cranston (corporate boss), Greta Lee, Sarah Polley (as herself), Ike Barinholtz, Katherine Hahn, and Chase Sui Wonders—all populate a high-energy, cameo-filled ensemble.
• Hollywood Insight:
  The show deftly mixes parody, self-awareness, and genuine affection for the art (and chaos) of filmmaking, tackling both the absurdities and joys of creative collaboration.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• “It loves movies, it loves Hollywood, it loves Los Angeles, it loves actors, directors, writers, performers…It’s also…just a masterclass in style and aesthetics.” — Andy [29:41]
• “I was really taken by it...most TV shows...just can’t sustain that level of verve and virtuosity and also manic nature of the performances.” — Chris [31:00]
• “The second episode is called ‘The Oner’, and it’s Matt’s hapless inability to get out of the way when visiting the set of Sarah Polley…which is going to end with a beautiful oner at sunset, very winking, very knowing.” — Andy [33:11]
• On melancholy and nostalgia:
  • “It’s deeply melancholy about a lost time and a lost industry, but it is at once so celebratory about what once was.” — Andy [29:41]
  • “Is it melancholy cause it’s melancholy, or is it melancholy because we know what’s really going?” — Chris [36:24]

Industry Reflections

• The hosts reflect on how the show’s romanticization of “how things used to work” in Hollywood feels resonant, especially as the real business is being upended by streaming and tech companies.
• They discuss the growing sense of loss in the industry—fewer shows being shot in LA, runaway production, and an eroding infrastructure for steady crew and creative work in Hollywood.
  • “Something is deeply amiss here…It is like termites eating through the foundational structure of what once was a problematic always, but at least life sustaning for many people who work here.” — Andy [39:04]

4. Dope Thief (Apple TV+) — Gritty, Lively Crime in Philadelphia

[47:46-64:09]

Premise and Main Characters

• Adapted by Peter Craig (The Town, The Batman) from Dennis Tafoya’s novel.
• Focus:
  Two small-time Philly crooks—Ray (Brian Tyree Henry) and Manny (Wagner Moura)—run a DEA-impersonation scam that spirals into a dangerous war with real criminals and federal agents.
• Supporting Cast:
  Marin Ireland as a DEA agent, Ving Rhames as Ray’s imprisoned father.

Performance Highlights

• Brian Tyree Henry’s Star Power:

  • Andy: “Brian Tyree Henry is the best actor working. He’s my favorite actor. I would watch him do anything. And this show…allows him to fully cook, to be completely alive.” [49:41]

• Chemistry & Physicality:
  Henry’s and Moura’s dynamic is electric, with scenes full of anxious maneuvering, built-in tensions, and improvisational energy.

  Memorable Scene:
  At the end of Ep. 2, Ray sobs in a lawyer’s office, only for a ringtone mystery to be solved in a moment of comic relief.

  Andy: “His eyes are always pinballing around and taking in absolutely everything....He makes a meal out of every crumb, it is the opposite of...a big, hammy scene stealing actor. I am never able to take my eyes off him.” [50:11]

Style, Tone, and Critique

• Comparison to Classic TV Crime:
  Cites everything from Elmore Leonard to Terriers and The Shield as spiritual peers.
• Setting Authenticity:
  The show is vibrant and energetic but isn’t always strictly “Philly” in its details—accents are inconsistent, and locations are sometimes generic.
  • Chris: “My attitude about it is that I just love to see Philly shine, even as a rough diamond like this. And I almost prefer it this way where no one’s really going full mayor of Easttown.” [64:22]
• Flashbacks & Structure:
  Some quibbles about black-and-white flashbacks explaining Ray’s backstory—Chris and Andy both prefer trusting actors to convey depth without explicit exposition.

5. Apple TV+ Programming Philosophy — Two Paths Forward

[65:05-68:07]

• Chris's “Two Models”:
  Apple’s best shows fall into either:
  1. Dream projects by proven, empowered creatives (The Studio)
  2. High-quality, “workmanlike” genre fare (Dope Thief) that could have fit on a dozen networks a decade ago, elevated by Apple’s budget/star power.
• Reliability vs. Exceptionalism:
  Most successful Apple shows are either star vehicles or genre pieces with top-tier talent—both routes much rarer outside the streamer’s deep-pocketed model.

Notable Quotes & Moments: Speaker, Timestamp

• On industry transformation:

  Andy: “It is a fundamentally different business than it was two years ago, four years ago, certainly 10 years ago.” [14:54]

• The Studio’s vitality:

  Andy: “It's so fun to watch....It is deeply melancholy about a lost time and a lost industry, but it is at once so celebratory about what once was.” [29:41]

• Dope Thief’s authenticity:

  Chris: “Two crooks on the run from bigger crooks and on the run from the law is good shit.” [53:08]

• On Brian Tyree Henry:

  Andy: “I think Brian Tyree Henry is the best actor working. He's my favorite actor. I would watch him do anything. And this show, more than anything so far, on screen—yes, even more than the Eternals—allows him to fully cook, to be completely alive.” [49:41]

• Apple as a home for unique TV:

  Chris: “It’s starting to feel a little bit more like this is one of the only games in town.” [66:06] Andy: “They sort of a-listed themselves into a corner, and it worked out.” [67:27]

Important Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |-------------------------------------------------|---------------------| | Cold Open / Banter | 00:50–03:23 | | James Bond/Amazon/New Hollywood | 03:41–15:37 | | Apple TV+ Industry Talk | 16:41–27:19 | | Conversation about ‘The Studio’ | 27:19–44:49 | | Ad Breaks | [44:49 / 46:26] | | Conversation about ‘Dope Thief’ | 47:46–64:09 | | Apple’s Programming Model (Two Paths) | 65:05–68:07 | | Playful End Segment / Show Wrap | 68:07–end |

Episode Tone & Language

• Reflective, Analytical, Playful:
  Both hosts oscillate between sharp industry analysis, comedic asides, and genuine admiration for the artistry they see in the featured shows.
• Insider Yet Accessible:
  The episode serves both fans who track TV/film on a granular business level, and listeners just interested in great new series.
• Authentic, Affectionate, Sometimes Melancholy:
  Especially when discussing the changing ecosystem of Hollywood and the lived experience of working in--or loving—movies and TV.

Summary for Non-Listeners

This episode of The Watch offers a brisk, insightful survey of two Apple TV+ originals, The Studio (a whip-smart, zestful comedy about movie-making’s golden age) and Dope Thief (a sharply-acted, energetic Philadelphia crime drama). The hosts intertwine review and bigger-picture Hollywood commentary—spotlighting the tectonic business shifts in how movies and TV are funded, produced, and experienced today. Both shows depict (in very different registers) the romance and chaos of old-school Hollywood—whether in boardrooms and backlots, or on the streets of Philly—and stand as examples of how Apple aims to set itself apart in the streaming arms race: by betting big on talent and banking on style, even if the business case is inscrutable.