#3497 The Valley S3E20 Part One: Short Tempered

Summary

Watch What Crappens Episode #3497 Summary

The Valley S3E20 Part One: Short Tempered
Released August 13, 2026
Hosts: Ben Mandelker & Ronnie Karam

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Ben Mandelker and Ronnie Karam recap Part One of The Valley Season 3 Reunion, focusing on the cast’s messy dynamics, emotionally charged confrontations, and financial scandals. With their signature mix of wit, mockery, and sharp insights, Ben and Ronnie dissect the reunion’s standout moments, reflect on the unhealthy relationships on display, and poke fun at Bravo tropes, all while offering their unfiltered opinions on the cast—many of whom, they admit, they don’t even like.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening Banter, Live Events & NPR Shoutouts

• Ben and Ronnie open with casual banter, discussing upcoming live events: Ronnie’s cruise panel with Below Deck’s Hannah and Daisy (02:23), and Ben’s panel with cookbook author Martin Sorge (02:55).
• Ben thanks Madeline Brand for featuring him on NPR’s Press Play, marking a milestone for the podcast (04:05).
• Quick mention of ways to support or interact with Watch What Crappens, including Patreon and in-person events (04:20).

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2. Host Positions: “I Don’t Like Any of These People”

• Ronnie lays out his cards: “Before I say this person’s wrong or that person’s wrong, I literally don’t like anybody. Zach, I like Zach. Jasmine’s fine. Everyone else can go f*** themselves... All these people are monsters, and boring monsters in rayon.” (06:29)
• Ben jokes about being easily bribed with baked goods, referencing Janet’s coffee cake (07:32).

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3. Parenting as a Shield & Danny’s Emotional Abuse

• The hosts are critical of Danny using parenthood as an excuse for bad behavior:
  • “These guys are just really leaning into [parenting]... You were like this before these kids came around. The kids have just exacerbated it for you.” — Ben (11:21)
  • Ronnie: “Your baby coming out of your dick doesn’t give you the right to be a dick.” (12:07)
• Discussion on using children as “human shields” to deflect criticism, and the broader issue of emotional abuse in relationships (09:43–12:13).

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4. Michelle, Jesse & The $300,000 Loan Saga

• Michelle and Jesse spar over finances, specifically her alleged repayment of a $300,000 loan (13:59+):
  • Jesse dodges questions and deflects (“Sir, this is not answering the question...” – Ben, 14:09)
  • Lala keeps interjecting as a “Lisa Vanderpump” stand-in, drawing both frustration and approval from the hosts (15:37, 15:58)
  • Michelle asserts she has receipts (“By the way, I have the text where you’re like, I can’t pay this month. Give me your credit card info...”— Michelle, 23:34)
  • Hosts mock the pettiness around paying for kids’ activities: “Had to pull her out of Suzuki class. How was she supposed to play violin by ear, Jesse, how?” — Ronnie (24:29)

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5. Lacy’s Place in the Group, Misogyny Arguments & Reality Show Tactics

• Lacy, dating Jesse, defends herself against claims she’s paying her way onto the show—calling criticism “misogynistic”:
  • Ronnie: “If you were a man, everybody would make that assumption. It’s weird.” (30:47)
  • Ben: “Ma’am, you’re not really [valid on your own]... You’re only on this show because you’re dating Jesse.”
• The hosts agree Lacy is surprisedly entertaining on the show despite her dubious reasoning (34:50).

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6. The TomTom Bar Sale & Bar Economy of Bravo

• Tom Schwartz discusses the TomTom bar being up for sale and his “symbolic” ownership:
  • “Honestly, if I were Tom Schwartz, I’d be f***ing pissed. TomTom used to be the jam...” — Ben (40:53)
  • Ronnie: “The only right [at TomTom] is to not have an intellect.” (42:04)
  • The hosts joke about Bravo’s cursed businesses post–Scandoval (40:53–42:04).

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7. Zach & Benji’s Relationship: Kids or No Kids?

• Zach reflects on gratitude for his friends; Benji wants kids, but Zach doesn’t—leading to speculation on their future:
  • “They have to, with regrets, move on from each other.” — Ben (46:51)
  • “Neither one of them’s wrong, and they’re a cute couple, but... this is a big one.” — Ronnie (46:51)
• The conversation highlights honest differences about long-term life choices (45:17–47:16).

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8. Lala on Co-Parenting With Randall

• Lala discusses the difficulties of co-parenting with Randall, seeing him only for brief visits. “He loves that double chicken breast”—Ronnie (47:48).
• The hosts mockingly frame Lala and Kristen as future commune partners raising their kids together (61:16).

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9. Kristen and Luke: Postpartum & Relationship Breakdown

• Kristen attempts to present her relationship with Luke in the best light, but Luke’s dismissive attitude and “man-spreading” undermine her:
  • Ben: “What are you doing with Luke? He’s awful... Those knees were at, like, 9pm–3pm.” (51:07)
• The postpartum sex timeline becomes contentious, with Luke showing little empathy and Kristen making excuses for his behavior (54:30–56:17).
• Discussion of avoidance tactics: Luke sleeping on the couch is about not helping, not just being tired or watching TV (60:02).
• Ronnie notes: “She’s falling all over herself making excuses for him, which is not great because that’s usually signs of something much worse.” (60:02)

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10. Therapy Resistance & Commitment Issues

• Therapy for Kristen and Luke is “on and off”; hosts suspect Luke refuses to engage, making honest progress impossible (63:23–65:12).
• The most telling moment: Andy asks if Luke would still have proposed if they’d waited until after the pregnancy. He dodges, refusing an unequivocal “yes,” deeply embarrassing Kristen (65:18):
  • “She is hitching her wagon to a donkey that’s gonna drown in the river.” — Ben (66:15)
  • Ronnie: “He’s staying here for the television show, period.” (66:44)

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11. Colorado vs. LA – Geographic and Lifestyle Tensions

• The pair’s argument over moving to Colorado becomes symbolic of larger incompatibilities, with Kristen rejecting Luke’s fantasy and Luke visibly seething (69:03–70:38):
  • Ronnie: “This couple should not be together, break up.” (70:06)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Ronnie Karam (06:29):

  “All these people are monsters, and boring monsters in rayon, and that’s it. That’s what you’re getting today.”

• Ben Mandelker (07:39):

  “I invite anyone who I talk about to make me a lovely cake... My affections are for sale. Just kidding. I stay true to myself regardless. Like, irregardless of coffee cake that comes my way.”

• Ronnie Karam (12:07):

  “Yeah, your baby coming out of your dick doesn’t give you the right to be a dick.”

• Ben Mandelker (11:21):

  “You were like this before these kids came around. The kids have just exacerbated it for you.”

• Ben Mandelker (40:53):

  “Honestly, if I were Tom Schwartz, I’d be f***ing pissed. TomTom used to be the jam.”

• Ronnie Karam (60:02):

  “It’s not easy because it’s avoidance. He’s avoiding it. He doesn’t want to be in there because then Kristen’s, he’s at Kristen’s beck and call... It’s pure avoidance. And she knows it.”

• Ben Mandelker (66:15):

  “This is a guy who is not emotionally mature enough to be in a wedding, in a marriage. She is hitching her wagon to a donkey that's gonna drown in the river.”

• Ronnie Karam (70:06):

  “This couple should not be together, break up.”

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Key Timestamps

• Ronnie’s cruise panel announcement: 02:23
• Ben’s LA event and NPR appearance: 02:55–04:05
• Ronnie’s “I don’t like anybody” rant: 06:29
• Parenting as a shield/Danny’s behavior: 09:43–12:13
• Michelle & Jesse’s loan drama: 13:59–26:32
• Lala’s omnipresence issue at the reunion: 15:58–17:18
• Lacy’s “misogyny” arguments: 29:46–32:38
• TomTom bar sale and business fallout: 40:53–43:40
• Zach & Benji’s future, kids or no: 45:17–47:16
• Lala co-parenting update: 47:25
• Kristen & Luke: Postpartum, avoidance, therapy: 51:07–65:18
• Luke’s shaky commitment answer: 65:18–67:52
• Colorado vs LA fight: 69:03–70:38

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Final Thoughts

This episode of Watch What Crappens is a razor-sharp, sarcastic, and often scathing breakdown of The Valley’s reunion episode. Ben and Ronnie cast a critical (and comedic) eye on the cast’s interpersonal failures, the Bravo reality machine, and the delusions of “reality” relationships. Their take: almost everyone here is a “monster,” most relationships are doomed, and the only things you can trust are coffee cake, chaos, and a reunion segment packed with fights about $300k loans and child ballet classes.

Stay tuned for Part Two of this reunion recap!

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Transcript

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

There is such a better way to spend your time than doom scrolling or watching terrible tv. Get some stories in your life. Okay. Audible is perfect for that. I use it while I'm cleaning the house, while I'm running errands. I listen to books all day every day with Audible.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, they have a massive library of audiobooks and ad free podcasts and it is really the perfect thing to turn on when you're taking a long drive, washing some dishes like enrich yourself.

[Ronnie Karam]

New members can start listening with a 30 day free trial at audible.com WWC.

[Ben Mandelker]

Watch what crap. Watch what happens. Who cares what happens when there's so much crapp? Watch what happens. Who cares what happens when there's so much that happens? Hello and welcome to Watch what crap Ends podcast about all that crap on Bravo that we just love to watch. I'm Ben Mandelker. Joining me today on this fair episode is the one and only, the lovely, the glorious, the beautiful Ronnie Karam. Hi, Ronnie, how are you?

[Ronnie Karam]

Hi, how are you?

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm doing just great. I'm doing just great. I'm so glad that you made that little Sheena voice. Before we dive into our recap, I'm sure it'll be a doozy. You, Ronnie, are going up to San Francisco in about a week and a half to go on a cruise, right, with Hannah, our lovely and wonderful Hannah Ferrier and Daisy from below deck. And is there anyone else that's going to be on on that? It's just the two of them, right?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, the two of them. I'm going to interview them, do a little panel with them on a dinner cruise for City Cruises Aug. 23 in San Francisco. You can get ticket links at their links and bios. Either Daisy Kelleher or Anna Farrier. Okay. It's gonna be so fun. It's like a dinner.

[Ben Mandelker]

Fabulous.

[Ronnie Karam]

We cruise around, we laugh, we spill some tea together. Yeah, you're gonna do a thing as well. You're doing a panel the same day. It's a double panel day.

[Ben Mandelker]

Double panel day.

[Andy Cohen]

While.

[Ben Mandelker]

While Ronnie's up in the Bay Area on a boat. I will be here in LA at the esteemed Friends and Family Bakery, well, coffee shop, Bakery, etc, because I'm going to be in conversation with Martin Sorge, who has a new cookbook out called Great Bakes. And so the wonderful, wonderful, amazing cookbook shop Now Serving here in Los Angeles, it's called the sh. The shop is called Now Serving, puts on these talks where they will invite a cookbook author and then someone to kind of interview them. And so I was selected. I was invited to do this, and I'm so excited. So come join us at Friends and Family the Same Night, Sunday, August 23rd to 5pm and go to Now Servings Instagram, Now Serving LA. I forget their handle, but just look up Now Serving and you can get your tickets for that. So, really excited about that. And also thank you to the one and only esteemed Madeline Brand for having me on her show, Press Play with Madeline Brand on npr. It finally happened. Broke through into npr. Watch what crap. It's made it onto npr, everyone.

[Ronnie Karam]

I half did, and that's the half that belongs on npr. Well, you know, for me it's like, no, please, Ronnie, no, no, no, no, no, no, please, Ronnie. No, no, no.

[Ben Mandelker]

I just. Anytime you're out of pocket, I'll be like, npr, npr. But yeah, no, local radio station KCRW here in LA has a show about the entertainment industry called Press Play. And so I was on there to talk about the Real Housewives. So you can actually listen to that. That interview by going to kcrw.com so that's all the fun stuff. And of course, our Patreon. Patreon happens. But yeah, so cool things to either listen to or go to for all of you guys.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, there you go. Okay, let's get into it. The Valley Season 3 Episode 20 Reunion Part 2 O To celebrate Reunion Part 2 of the Valley, I am wearing a rayon shirt. Oh, so there you go. Decided to kind of match the cast today as much as possible. Let me just say it hurts.

[Ben Mandelker]

Okay, that's fair. Here, wait. To celebrate episode two of the Valley. Let me try to make myself more in Danny's likeness. Let me just adjust this camera and. Okay, now celebrating Danny. That's so rude. Celebrating Danny on the Valley. Sorry.

[Ronnie Karam]

He hasn't been bullied and he has tried.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's not his. Sorry. For those who are really listening, this is a visual moment that's happening.

[Andy Cohen]

How dare you make fun of my height.

[Ben Mandelker]

I love going back down to regulars out there. I Know, I actually love my short.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well knocked.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's just. It's just. I think with Danny, it's. He's so frustrating that I resort to doing the most immature thing, which is just to hit him where it hurts, because that's my only recourse. And it's not. I'm not proud of it. I'm not proud of that instinct. I try not to make fun of people's physical appearances. Well, it does.

[Ronnie Karam]

And I'm a father. A father with children. I have cried. I've shed a tear.

[Ben Mandelker]

But if Danny. Danny shouldn't be listening to this. So that's fine.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. This is not for you. So backstage, you know, they're on their first break. They're in Britney, Janet Jackson's room. And before we even get started with this, before I say this person's wrong or that person's wrong, I literally don't like anybody. Zach. I like Zach. Jasmine's fine. I guess everyone else can go fuck themselves. So before you think, wow, you're really sticking up for so and so by going against so and so. Don't even play that bullshit with me today. All these people are monsters, and they're boring monsters in rayon, and that's it. And that's what you're getting. That's what you're getting today. So don't start your. Wow, you're being so nice to so and so because you're. You don't like Janet or whatever. No, I'm not standing up for literally anybody on this show. Not a one.

[Ben Mandelker]

You know, now I can never. Anytime I say anything nice about Janet, I get messages being like, I hope

[Andy Cohen]

that coffee cake she made you was good, because ever since the coffee cake, you're all bro.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, to her credit, she does know how to get you. A coffee cake is the way to your heart.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. By the way, I'm easily bribed. I invite anyone who I talk about to make me a lovely cake. And I listen. My. My affections are for sale. Just kidding. I am not. I stay true to myself regardless. Like, irregardless of coffee cake that comes my way. But it was. It was really good coffee cake.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm true to me and me loved me Janice. Coffee cake. And that's it. That's the end.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, yeah, we're backstage, and, you know, Jason is saying that Janet's gonna have some. Probably the easiest luck with making amends with Zach, but everyone else is gonna be hard to get through. I'm like, but why do you want to get through to anyone else? Why do you want to make amends with Danny and the maybe I can see Nia? Because at, like, girls events, it's awkward if there's someone who hates you. Right. But, like, yeah, who cares about Danny?

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, that's kind of where I am with the whole cast. And I've said it a million times during the season, like, you just don't like each other, and that's okay. But these shows are built on kind of friend groups, so they need to get. They need to pick a side or whatever and rebuild because it's just. They're just all gross, and none of them can truly make up because they just hate each other's guts. So they can come with all the flowery language they want. And, like, I really understand about your feelings about this, and I'm sorry, but none of them mean it. Dani can't give one solid apology the whole time. It does always revert to. But they have kids. Jasmine was right. I don't care what any parents are like. You can't say that when you don't have a child. Yes, she. She didn't say it very well, but you guys use your kids as human shields. Every time you do something wrong, you hold up a baby in front of you. Now, having a baby doesn't mean you're not a shitty person. And that's it. And that's what she was trying to say, and I completely agree with her. And we got a lot of it this episode. Every time something someone is called out, it's like a baby.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. I think Jasmine was 100% right. I 100% also am aware that having it. Having kids is enormously taxing. It drains you and exhausts you. But guess what? I know a lot of people who have. Have kids. A lot of people who have kids who do not act the way that Danny acts and do not act the way that Luke acts. Okay? And so, like, I'm sorry. I know it's a stressor, but the stressor is only bringing out parts of your personality that are already there. And that's the issue. Okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

Right.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, yeah. Yeah.

[Andy Cohen]

Like.

[Ben Mandelker]

Like, I'm sympathetic to being, like, to grumpiness, but, like, the thing is that the way that Danny acted was not. Like, on that trip, was not, like, one evening. It was like, the whole trip, he was like that, and then he was like that again elsewhere. It's like, it's. It's not. This is not an isolated, like, I'm in a mood. This is a oh, you are unmasked moment.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. And I get that it's. I, I too get that it's hard. And I'm not taking that away and saying, oh, shut up, parents, stop bitching. I'm not saying that. But that's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about men who are called out for basically being emotionally abusive. I mean, Danny has been clearly emotionally abusive on this whole season. And he's like, but I have kids. If your response to stress is treating your wife like garbage, then you're garbage, period. It doesn't matter what's going on. I mean, it's super important that you know how to treat your, your family and your friends in a way that's not abusive even when you're not in a good mood. Dumb.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. I mean, quite frankly, Janet, Lala and, and Britney all have kids too. They all have like little kids. Lala has two little little kids. Britney has a child with special needs and she has a child who she's divorced from who's making her life hell. You know, it's. There are a lot of people on this stage who have the pressures of children. And again, it's not, we're not dismissing it. It's just like they, these guys are just really leaning into it and, and they, in their mind they're saying, I'm just explaining why I was like that. But it's like, no, no, you were like, you were like this before these kids came. Came around. The kids have just exacer. Exasperate. Exacerbated it for you.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, your baby coming out of your dick doesn't give you the right to be a dick. Do you understand? Okay, good. Now that we've got that cleared up, let's get into a bunch of whiny baby men making excuses because they're tired. So Britney's like, oh, they're gonna be

[Ben Mandelker]

a lot talk about today.

[Ronnie Karam]

I can tell you that. There's a lot more coming down this pck. And Michelle's like, well, I, you know, I am mad at lazy. She keeps calling me a liar and saying I am fake. I am not vague. I, I do not know what lazy I'm gonna get. Like what, what am I going to get? And Lala's just looking at her like, I'm on your side, but I'm really bored. Yeah, so you're like, wrap this up.

[Ben Mandelker]

That was last episodes. So we're going to have to sunset this discussion. So everyone comes back on stage and Andy is like, we're back.

[Andy Cohen]

Well, before Michelle was linked to Aaron or Dr. Dre. She was famously married to our very own Jesse Ly. This season we finally reached the end of Jesse Michelle's divorce, which felt like it was dragging on, like, sad, certain someone's droopy drawers. So, Michelle, you and Jesse are finally divorced. How does it feel?

[Ronnie Karam]

Jesse's like, droopy. Can she answer her question? Spray tan.

[Ben Mandelker]

I think he was responding to his.

[Ronnie Karam]

I know it's not you. It's not you. You be quiet. It's not even your turn. So Michelle's like, it is incredible. Do say I am. Oh, visually Zingle like. And so he asked Jesse how things have been with Michelle and he's like, well, we only really communicate about Isabella and that's been good. I guess it's like, like 90%. And he's like,

[Andy Cohen]

okay, cool.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, still 10. Not cool.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know. He's just, he's, he's just absolutely aghast at everything Michelle says.

[Andy Cohen]

Hey, Jesse, what did you use the $300,000 SBA loan for?

[Ben Mandelker]

He's like, I love the fact that in season two, there was a runyon canyon hike with Sheena to complain about me. And then season three, another little Runyon canyon hike with somebody who doesn't hike. I'm like, sir, this is not answering the question. And who cares? He's like, he's like, I mean, if she had gone on a hike with someone who does hike, that's one thing, but to go on a hike with someone who doesn't hike, it's.

[Ronnie Karam]

You're going to talk shit about me, at least do it with someone who hikes naturally.

[Ben Mandelker]

I was like, what is this doll tactic? So he's like, the entire conversation, start to finish, was a lie. And Michelle's like, yeah, he is just really embarrassed by it. It was one of those things from the beginning. It's like, do I look embarrassed? Like, quite frankly, you do.

[Ronnie Karam]

You look embarrassingly embarrassed and you look shamed. But yeah, I don't know if he has enough good in him to even feel shame at this point. But you look embarrassing. And so she's like, well, he did not want to talk about it. And he's like, well, you're a cheater and a liar. So, okay, so did you get the $300,000 loan and spend it all on a fucking vacation or not? Jesse, you're looking more guilty than ever when you say things like, but you're mean, you have black hair and it's really straight. So

[Ben Mandelker]

Lala's like, hello, you've got to stop calling her A liar, Jesse. Like, you call her a liar a lot. You've got to stop doing that. Lala is acting like she is Lisa Vanderpump sitting next to Andy during the Vanderpool rules. The entire hour. She keeps jumping in to be like, Andy.

[Ronnie Karam]

This could all be solved with a chandelier from Nicolain. Yeah, she really is trying to take over this whole reunion, and it's obnoxious. Like, lala, you didn't do shit. I mean, what Lala did this season was yell at other people in their other drama that she wasn't really involved in. And I'll give her this. She was correct about. And in this reunion, I feel like she's correct about everything she says. So it's not that I'm not on her team with what she's saying. It's just like, it's. It just feels like it's none of your business and you're not involved in any of this. And she keeps in every single conversation sick. Oh, yes. Well, let me tell you, it's like, girl, you don't even do anything on this show.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, what I just don't like is that she keeps. I. I'm with you. I actually am. Everything she said, I'm like, absolutely. And in some ways, I'm glad when she pipes up, because sometimes someone needs to pipe up about this. But, like, what I hate is on a reunion, when someone's trying to, like, state their case, even if it's full of. I hate when they get interrupted and then the argument becomes about being interrupted. Like, let me finish. You're not letting me finish. This is what she always does. This is what you always do. It's like that time in Mexico when you did this.

[Andy Cohen]

I didn't do this.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then you, like, lose the thread. So I just don't like the. I don't like the constant interruptions for that.

[Ronnie Karam]

And it's bad in this one with Lala. Lala's the main offender, but Michelle is a very close second. Michelle's really not making herself look good in this. Like, Michelle, you've got jet. You're against Jesse. Jesse's a piece of. This should be. This should be a slam dunk with everything that Jesse's done, but she just cannot stop herself. And every time Lacy tries to talk, she's like. And Lacy does that thing where she stays infuriatingly calm through every single thing. And it's like, well, if you feel that way, then you're allowed to feel that way, and that's fine. I'm not finished. I'm not finished though.

[Andy Cohen]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

And so then finally when she does get to talk, it's like 30 minutes of her just trying to string words together. And this part I did love Lala

[Ben Mandelker]

because she interrupts her.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, stop interrupting me. She's like it's been three hours. Finish a sentence please. It's time for a commercial.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's time for a August is the perfect time to hit reset before the autumn rush begins. And honestly, I can't think of a better place to start than my closet. That's why I love shopping at Quince.

[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

Set in 1980s Los Angeles, the series follows a group of glamorous, deeply entangled high school seniors drawn into a life of wealth, beauty, parties and excess. At its center is Brett, whose Reality begins to unravel when the arrival of a new student coincides with a series of mysterious murders.

[Ronnie Karam]

FX's the Shards now streaming on Hulu. The Grappens commercial.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Jesse is denying that he took out a loan. And Michelle's like, it's a lie. Please show me. Please, for the love of God, show Everybody where the $300,000 is. Which, by the way, you know that he's. What he's thinking is, well, it's. That's a lie. It wasn't an SBA loan. It was a. This loan instead.

[Ronnie Karam]

Right.

[Ben Mandelker]

You know that he's just saying it's a lie based off of some semantics. I guarantee there's a $300,000 loan out there, because why would Michelle be willingly just paying $300,000 to Jesse as part of their divorce settlement just for the fun of it?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, they talked about it on screen where she was going to pay that $150,000 just to get out of it. Didn't she talk about that with him?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, she was like, yeah, they were in that. Like, that pink coffee shop. And she's like, I am willing to pay this. I am paying you to end this. And he didn't say, like, what are you talking about? Stop lying to America. Making it seem like important.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. So he's clearly lying. But she's also terrible with evidence. Because if there's a 3. A $300,000 loan that you had to pay back, there's paperwork. Where's the paperwork at? You have to have that in an email somewhere. Bring the evidence. This is.

[Andy Cohen]

Come on.

[Ben Mandelker]

You're on a reunion.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Andy's like, prop. You know, to a. Glue to a spinning wheel or something, where you can be like, oh, yeah, look at this spinning wheel. It's going to stop on. He did it. Guilty.

[Andy Cohen]

Guilty.

[Ronnie Karam]

Here's the bank loan or whatever it is. Do something.

[Ben Mandelker]

Wheel of fortune. Bankrupt. All the. All the slices. Hey, Bankruptcy. Andy is like, yeah, well, she also

[Andy Cohen]

said that you couldn't afford to pay $200 for Isabella's health insurance.

[Ben Mandelker]

So Lacy goes, awkward.

[Ronnie Karam]

Don't call me a liar about that. Do not call me a liar about that.

[Ben Mandelker]

She's like, I just said awkward. That's it.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, I thought you said liar. Sorry.

[Andy Cohen]

Okay. Michelle was just on Watch what Happens Live and really intimated that she was paying most of the household expenses.

[Ben Mandelker]

Lacy, care to answer for that?

[Ronnie Karam]

But I don't believe that because she's also saying. Which I find to be infuriating. You're also insinuating every Single episode, except for two, because I finally watched them. That I'm paying for him. And I would rather light myself on fire than pay for a man. That's not my vibe. So, like, that's fine for you to pay for a man because you did that, but you're lying about that.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm not saying that Lacy is a Targaryen, but the fact that she is now offered up that she would light herself on fire, I'm like, she's kind of a Targaryen. Let's be honest. She's a.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's a prestige free Targaryen. Like, there's no prestige night for her to be on tv.

[Ben Mandelker]

A prestige free Targaryen.

[Ronnie Karam]

Because that's like prestige tv. So I wouldn't give her that much. But, I mean, there are things adding up.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So Michelle is like, by the way, I have the text where you're like, I can't pay this month. Give me your credit card information. And I gave it to you right then and there. And I have all the text messages. That's why we have ballet that emails us all the time that your card got declined. It's a very sad ballet. It's called the. They tried to do the Nutcracker, but it's more like the Jesse Cracker, because they have to crack your balls to get your paid, if you know what I'm saying. Anyone like this ballet content I'm throwing out here? Anyone? Any laughter, please would. I appreciate it.

[Ronnie Karam]

We will be doing the Daddy's Broker ballet. But she's like, yes, we do not have money for gymnastics or ballet or Zay's camp or we want to put

[Ben Mandelker]

her on a lot of things Child sommelier path. And we cannot afford those classes anymore.

[Ronnie Karam]

We had to pull her out of Suzuki class. How was she supposed to play violin by ear, Jesse, how?

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I guess that means no more breath work for Isabella.

[Ronnie Karam]

I guess the trapeze arts are off the table.

[Ben Mandelker]

I suppose there will be no more Wednesday night sound beds for Isabella.

[Ronnie Karam]

Isabella was supposed to be doing first grade abroad, but she is not now because of Jesse. Like, damn, you should have just stuck with the child insurance part. Because that's like, holy crap, Jesse. You're not even paying for your child's insurance. But she's like. And then we had to ask for an extension payment on the whores.

[Ben Mandelker]

Unfortunately, Maria Callis impersonation camp is off the books for this summer.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Andy's like, yeah, your car even got declined on camera. Mexico. That was hilarious. He's like, yeah, guess what. Guys, I've never had a chase fraud alert. You know, when I was in another country. Forgive me for not knowing. Babe, didn't you spend the $300,000 traveling all over Europe with your family?

[Ben Mandelker]

I think he's been facetious here.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

I think he's being like, guys, this happens be factious.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm sorry.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know it was not good fism. It was not good planter fiscist. Yeah, he. I think he was trying to and he failed. And so Lacey's like, my card gets declined all the time, and allegedly I'm a baller. So look, I'm like, wow, this is the first time people are bragging about being poor on Bravo.

[Ronnie Karam]

Michelle's like, I am not making it up. Will, are you financially solvent now? He's like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I moved to a new house and sadly just had a 30 million dollar. That deal that kind of fell through. Like, oh, it is always falling through. It always falls apart. That is how deals go with Jesse.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, I'm still doing what I've always been doing.

[Andy Cohen]

Okay, Lacy, how do you feel about dating Jesse if he's not doing well financially?

[Ronnie Karam]

Because she does not care. She does not care.

[Ben Mandelker]

I've never experienced that. It's hard for me because it just feels so intentional.

[Ronnie Karam]

It is not intentional. It is not. And I mean, there are moments where he's grudging to me that he could not favor certain things. And I said, get a disu. And he said, I cannot afford disu. I said, maria Gallez and Imadishu and Isabella said,

[Ben Mandelker]

I couldn't imagine how much better that impersonation would have been if she could have gone to that camp. So Lacey's like, she went to Marie

[Ronnie Karam]

Gallas Gap Maria Gallas camp and did not finish, and now she sounds like Bruce Vilange.

[Ben Mandelker]

Unfortunately, we had to send her to Marie Callender camp instead,

[Ronnie Karam]

but she couldn't afford a buy.

[Ben Mandelker]

She just came back with whipped cream. So. So Lacy is like. She's like, I'm just explaining what my experience is with Jesse.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay, well, my experience is he tells me the truth because I know it. Okay, but I'm telling you my experience, and you can BS me and say I'm crazy all you want to, but I know my experience, so you're not going to talk me out of it. Oh, my God, Lacy. Someone needs to work with Lacy on inflection and brevity.

[Ben Mandelker]

I know my experience as well. Well, that's lovely for you. I've never experienced that with him. He asked Me for money. And it's very frustrating to have a group of women continuously saying that somebody is using me money in an. For an array of reasons. First and foremost, I do think it's completely misogynistic. I think if I was a man, no one would ever make that assumption. And I think it's rude. And Andy's like. But I think what's actually funny here is that it would have been one thing if. Well, I guess I see the point she's trying to make here that, like, hey, when like a. A girl is with some. Some guy, people aren't like, oh, she's using him for money. Which, by the way, they often do. But the truth is that, like, Jesse is due. Jesse is poor, he has no money left, and he is with a wealthy lady in Orange County. And I do believe that he likes her. But. But we also believe that what drew him to her and had him go very committed to her was because she is paying for things. And I don't think that's misogynistic. I think it's.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, he spent episode being like, I'm gonna move into your house. Right? Like, you've got a big enough house. You've got a huge mansion in Orange County. It's like, I mean, no, you are never moving into my house. So we've seen him trying to kind of worm his way in there. It's not like this is coming out of nowhere.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And you know, I love. I love calling out what I feel like is misogyny, which of course is a man's role. And I think that, like, I normally love to. Yes. And these moments. But this time I was like, ah, this one feels a stretch even for me. And Lacy then is like. But she.

[Andy Cohen]

Her.

[Ben Mandelker]

One of her. One of the columns of her pillars of her argument is she says, well, be. You know, last year Aaron filmed and that was her boyfriend. And you know, Lala's like, can we clarify? Because I don't understand what's going on here right now. She's like, I'm trying to clarify, but you're interrupting.

[Ronnie Karam]

We can clarify, but you're interrupting me though.

[Andy Cohen]

Yeah, but you've.

[Ben Mandelker]

You've been talking all day long and interrupting me. I mean, you've been a jabber Josk.

[Ronnie Karam]

But that's misogynistic. Also. This misogynistic thing I think is weird because she's saying, I think it's completely misogynistic. If I was a man, no one would ever make that assumption. If you were a man, everybody would make that assumption. Like, I don't. It's weird.

[Andy Cohen]

Her.

[Ronnie Karam]

Her logic isn't just. Her logic just isn't making sense. When there's one really rich person and there's one not rich person, and especially when the not rich person has a terrible, terrible reputation, there's not much going for that there. Of course they're going to say the poorer person is using the richer person. It happens in every relationship, and it's every relationship like that. I don't know of one that's not like that.

[Andy Cohen]

She.

[Ben Mandelker]

She then. She then revises it to where it makes a bit more sense, where she's basically saying, people think I'm paying for Jesse so that way I can be on the show. Like, I'm paying my way to be on this show. And it's like, okay. I mean, I don't think anyone. I actually don't think anyone said that or felt that way about.

[Ronnie Karam]

About her. No. But people do feel like she's using Jesse to be on the show. Maybe not that she's paying for it, but her being like, oh, suggesting that I'm paying to be on this show is terrible because that's insinuating that I'm not good enough to be on this show. Ma', am, you're not really. And you're only on this show because you're dating Jesse. Why are we pretending that you were cast? Because of your sparkling personality. You didn't make it on Orange county three times, and now you found somebody to date that's on a show. There's actually no shame in it. And a lot of people on this stage got to the stage that way. Kristin got James on. He's not on this show, but James got on via Kristen. Then we've got Janet, who got on Janet and Zach. By hanging on to the group and being around the group.

[Ben Mandelker]

Brittany. Brittany is only here because she was actually in Lacy's place at one point, so.

[Ronnie Karam]

So there's not even that much shame in the game. But to pretend like, oh, everyone's acting like, I'm not valid on my own. You're not. You're here because you have mess and you're gonna trigger Michelle. It's not like you did an audition song. You didn't give 30 bars to get here or 32 bars to get in here. Come on.

[Ben Mandelker]

What? Watch. Recrapants is here to remind people that sometimes you are not valid on your own, and that's okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

Exactly. I would never walk into a bank and be like, oh, my God. It's like, you're like taking my deposit or like you, you denying my deposit. It's like, it's like you're acting like I'm not valid. Sir, you don't, you don't have an account here. You're like literally not valid.

[Ben Mandelker]

But. And so like one of the things that she's trying to get to here is the fact that like, well, when Aaron came show, she goes, you know, Aaron filmed the show. And you know, I think it's crazy. Not one person on the stage, at least from what I saw, was like, he must be using her. She must be using him. I'm like, what part about this bug eyed, probably failed actor trying to sell honey on the Internet says he's not using Michelle Lolly to be on camera? Yeah, we all pretty much thought that

[Ronnie Karam]

who watched the show said, this guy is clearly using Michelle to sell his coke honey on tv. Oh, also, they weren't saying that about Michelle to her face in the cast because they're friends with Michelle. They like Michelle. They don't know you. And Jesse's an. So you're not going to automatically get the same level of friendship of a bunch of people who aren't your friends.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

And I don't even hate Lacy. I actually like Lacy. I just think her argument here is a little. Yikes. But then Michelle's also being so obnoxious in this argument because she won't stop jumping on every little thing. Lacy gets out two words and Michelle jumps in and is just giving her those laser eyes the whole time. So she kind of sucks too. I genuinely like Lacy on the show and I think she's been okay, but she's wrong on this one.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I, I think Lacy has been a, been a big surprise. I think she's actually as much as we've been like, you're not valid on your own to be here. But that being said, now that she's here, she has been entertaining, way more entertaining than I thought she would be. And I'm happy for her to be on the show going forward. But. But yeah, like, I don't know. I didn't actually have as much of a negative experience as you did to her on this, on this reunion. I just am more like, I just at this point I was like over it. I didn't want to talk about this anymore. Like, I didn't.

[Ronnie Karam]

I don't guess what? I'm gonna make you. And it's. I could just. Because I want to say, I should say, like, I didn't want to entirely negative experience. I Wasn't. I didn't come out of this a Lacy hater. Just this whole, like, what am I not? Am I not good enough? You guys are suggesting I'm not good enough to be here on my own. It just sounds crazy, like, you need to stop being a victim. You are dating Jesse Lally, who had a horrible divorce with Michelle. We know that she paid the $300,000 or half of that to get out of the divorce at the minimum. We know all that stuff is true. And you're still supporting this guy, whether it's financially or not. You're standing by and acting like a lot of these behaviors are okay. And so you're wrong. Like, what do you want me to say?

[Andy Cohen]

And.

[Ben Mandelker]

And basically, so then she has another little spat with. With Lala, who's like, you've been talking for like 12 hours.

[Andy Cohen]

So Andy's like, okay, Lacey, do you love Jesse?

[Ben Mandelker]

She goes, I love Jesse. It's just like our dynamic. And that's how I treat men.

[Andy Cohen]

And.

[Ben Mandelker]

And I like that about me. And that's me. Because there. There people are saying, we don't know where you stand because it seems like you guys hate each other. And so Andy goes, jesse, tell her

[Andy Cohen]

you love her right now. I want to see how she responds. Okay?

[Ben Mandelker]

She's like, I love you.

[Ronnie Karam]

She's like, I love you too. It's just like, so performative, though. Like, usually I'd just be like, thank you. Do it again. Do it again. I'll do it better. I'm valid. I'm valid. That was funny, though. When they're like, it seems like you really hate Jesse. She's like, that's how I am with men. That's my love. Language, Schwartz. Wow. Why are you here? Yeah, we got to meet your TikTok girlfriend, Kiana, with the sunglasses at the tip of her nose. Wow. I'm imagining things are going well with her. That's gonna work. Wow. Was she 20 years younger than you? And on TikTok.

[Andy Cohen]

Great. How's that?

[Ronnie Karam]

He's like, I'm just so happy. Like, you know, it's like our nine month anniversary, man. It's like, I just feel like. I just feel like I just, you know, it's. I've just. I've just like, wow. Like, lucky. Wow.

[Andy Cohen]

Look great. Yes. I'm glad to hear that you have as many fascinating things to say today as you've had all season. So what are the chances that we'll see you getting married again? Please say zero, because I can't believe it. If the producers bring you back.

[Ben Mandelker]

He's like, oh, well, that's on her. I would love to get on the new one more time. And if I ever do, he would definitely be for her. God. Have you ever seen her sunglasses? When you're down on one knee, they look more magnificent than you could ever imagine.

[Ronnie Karam]

So Jesse goes, well, I've hung out with you guys and you bend the knee a lot. Get it, guys? He's like, I just got it. I've got it so bad, you know, and I want kids, but I don't know if she wants them with me. But you know, we have a great communication, like we're aligned with what we want. You know, except for the fact that like, I want kids and I don't know if she wants kids or like, I want to get married. I don't know if she wants to get married. I don't know. I've called her, she hasn't really called me back. But I'll tell you this much, our communication is great.

[Andy Cohen]

And how old are you again? I'm 43. And what is this spread? 16. Okay, well, I'm in a 16 year spread myself, so I think it works. I think it works.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm like, no, it's one thing to be like in a, like a Silver Fox 16 era spread. 16 year spread. It's I think, very different to be in a 43, 27 year old spread. I'm sorry, it's different. It's different. It's going. That relationship is going absolutely nowhere. I'm gonna say it right now. Even if they get married, I'm still telling you it's going nowhere.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. And Andy is 58, so if there's a 16 spread, 16 year spread, then that's still. The guy's 42, so. Yeah, that's pretty old. And also the guy is not a fame whore, apparently. He's like a financial guy. So he's not in the same, you know. Yeah, we're different when they're like reality people and influencers.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, that's the thing.

[Ronnie Karam]

I don't think, I don't think this is gonna last.

[Ben Mandelker]

Model.

[Ronnie Karam]

But not only, not because of her, because of him as well. In equal. As well. In equal bards.

[Ben Mandelker]

Also, when you get two people together who are just so well spoken and intelligent, it's just hard for that to really work out. Just one person needs to shine. So I don't know, I don't think it's gonna happen.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's rough because it's a spread. We're doing spread between ages. But it's not really fair because Tom's 43 and his liver's like 96, so it's really hard to figure out how that factors into long term plans.

[Ben Mandelker]

Also, she works in high fashion and he's segueing into bowling shirts. Like, that's the next. That's the next evolution for Tom style. So it's just. Yeah, it just can't work out.

[Ronnie Karam]

Bowling shirts and Elton John glasses. So I don't know. Time will tell. It's gonna tell us something. So, guys, Tom, Tom, let's talk about. It's being sold off. Can you believe it? He's like, yeah, well, we had an amazing pride. So thank you to everybody. Thanks to all the straight people who came. That was really fun. And you know, TomTom's for sale, all the intellectual rights. LOL. I can't. The intellectual rights to Tom.

[Ben Mandelker]

Oh, good.

[Ronnie Karam]

Fucking kidding me.

[Ben Mandelker]

Excuse me, Ronnie. I have to call our agent so we can option TomTom for that script we've been meaning to write.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm gonna write a spin off on TomTom.

[Ben Mandelker]

Honestly, if I. If I were Tom Schwartz, I would be fucking pissed. Because TomTom used to be like the Jam. It was, it was a active bar. It was part of like the whole, you know, Vanderpumperverse, and. But it was also like a legitimately good bar. I mean, yes, the stools were way too low and I'm glad that that was called out on the latest season of Vanderpump Rules. Or maybe it was this season. It was this season. I don't remember. It was this season the Valley, actually, because Kiana came over. But it was like a legitimately, really fun bar to go to. And truly, Tom Sandoval just destroyed all the properties. He actually destroyed. I think he actually destroyed every single Vanderpump entity. Right. Because it killed Shorts and Sandy's with the Scandal pump was next to go. TomTom, sir, is struggling too. I mean, we ho. I guess is apparently having issues, but like, you know, because obviously Vanderpump Rules kind of ended and that, that ended curiosity and sir, so, I mean, Tom Sandoval really dropped a bomb on these businesses.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, don't come for my tiny penis. Latest thing. So we talk about Tom Tom. The intellectual rights really made me laugh. Like, Tom Tom. The only right is to not have an intellect, you know, like, so for them to be like, wow, the intellectual rights of Tom Tom. Oh, the ip, the Instagram, everything. Yeah, good luck with that. So Andy asks and he's like, but we've been open since 2018. That's a good run, right? You know, which. That is crazy that it is a good run years. And Andy says, you put 50,000. Did you ever get that back? And he's like, well, I mean, yeah, you know, I made. I made my money back in eight years. I would hope so. $50,000 over the course of eight years. God. Were you just going in there for autographs? Like, they had to be making some. Or he had to be making some money from there, right? Do you think it's just.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I think he was. I think he was, but he was like, you know, I. You know, I still have a meager 2.5%, but symbolically, it's so much more than that. To me, it's all the way up to 3%. And that place is an extension of my heart and my soul. I'm like, you mean decrepit, empty. And having to be sold off. That place isn't the only light that

[Ronnie Karam]

is a colored Philip Hube Hue bulb.

[Ben Mandelker]

Does that mean that somewhere in your heart and soul there is a disturbed DJ sitting on a pile of toilet paper spinning records? So he's like, I've had so many of my best moments of my life in there, and honestly, it helped me make. Helped make me so much less of a pussy. I was like, okay, please let me know when that will be demonstrated for us.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, when's that season,

[Andy Cohen]

Zach?

[Ronnie Karam]

We saw you take big steps with your little boyfriend. What the hell?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, what was that about?

[Ronnie Karam]

About?

[Ben Mandelker]

I feel like, you know, what you could see as Andy read it off his Q cards. He had not read it ahead of time. And he. You could see in his.

[Andy Cohen]

He was like, oh, okay.

[Ben Mandelker]

I guess that's what we're writing on here. He had that look on his face, like, I guess I just said that.

[Andy Cohen]

Okay.

[Ronnie Karam]

I just walked into that short person burn as a short person.

[Andy Cohen]

Great.

[Ronnie Karam]

Felt great. Thanks, producers.

[Ben Mandelker]

Such a random stray for Benji to catch. And Benji is the most of this entire group.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, we've been, like, living on and off with each other because even though I stay, like, living with him or living here, like, going to Canada for some time and then he comes here. But, like, sometimes we'll go there. Like, sometimes we'll go out of town. But, like, like, you know, sometimes we'll be on a road trip and we're like, where are we right now? What do we even need a visa for right now? Like, do you need that in Arkansas? I don't even know. Why are we even in Arkansas? I just pooped.

[Andy Cohen]

Is there any furniture yet? And a monster fridge does not count.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah.

[Ronnie Karam]

So no.

[Ben Mandelker]

Basically no.

[Ronnie Karam]

The answer is no. Right? We talk about Zach's shitty apartment and then how he threw a party to thank Kristen for loaning him money. And then he gives a big monologue. He is really good at using a lot of words to say very, very, very little. But just broken down. He's very thankful to have friends in. I came here, I came here with nothing.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then I had friends. And then my friends gave me things

[Ronnie Karam]

and is my spray T coming off? And it was, it was beautiful. So I would like to thank my friend so much.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I, I, I love Zach at the reunions because he just spends almost all the time in the corner just smirking and rolling his eyes at people, and it's just so funny. And then when they actually ask him a question, he always has a big, dramatic monologue. It's like, like, it's just, it's really hard when you move here from Kentucky and you don't know anyone, and then, like, all of a sudden, you walk into a store and you're like, I just want a coffee, medium sized. They say it's a grande. And I'm like, I don't understand. And then Kristen walks in and explains Starbucks language to me. It just, like, meant a lot to me. It meant a lot to understand Starbucks from Kristen.

[Ronnie Karam]

My life changed the day that Kristen told me about a pop cup. To make so many dogs happy. To make so many dogs happy. I would just want to thank my friends. So basically the conversation is, benji wants kids, you don't want kids. Are you getting married? Like, what's happening? And the answer is still the same. He's basically like, I love him, but I don't want kids. And my parents were such good parents that I want to be parents. Like, they were really good parents. And I can't afford that lifestyle. Like, I can't afford kids. You guys have to break up at this point because they're both, they're both right to want what they want. You know, neither one of them's wrong, and they're a cute couple, but, yeah, this is a big one.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, I actually feel really bad in agreeing with that. I think Benji is adorable. And he's also. I. What I like about Benji is he does have an edge, which I really love. And they're cute together, but they do want drastically different things. And, like, I think they have to, with regrets, move on from each other. So then Andy is like, all right, well, welcome Back.

[Andy Cohen]

I'm someone who did figure out that I want to have kids. Sorry, Zach. Anyway, Lala, how is co parenting with Randall going?

[Ben Mandelker]

And she's like, it's impossible. So we can't communicate unless it's through that app. And he primarily lives in Miami now, so he pops in when he wants to see ocean. She thinks he's just, like, wonderful and amazing, and that's. That's all I could ask for. And so I would just say it's going great because she's thriving. Plus, every. Every other week, he sends a fried chicken breast her way. So that's lovely as well.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm like, one day when you're over 12, he'll start sending you doubles because he, you know, he loves a double chicken breast.

[Ben Mandelker]

He loves that.

[Ronnie Karam]

So a double fried chicken breast. Double fried chicken sand sandwich. Yeah, he still sucks, basically. So then we move on to Kristen and Luke, which, yikes, this was worse than I thought because Kristen, you know, has come to this reunion being very much like, the audience is really mad at Dani. So I have to admonish Dani, and I'm gonna do it because I don't want the Internet to hate me again. So she's very. She's really trying. And her whole situation with Luke, we need to handle shit off camera just like Danny and Nia and be that kind of a couple. Girl, you see all my nieces and my sister leaving behind me trudging down the stairs. My girls, there they go. Have fun. They're going to the Beechwood Cafe because Harry has a song about it that Harry Styles. He's given that Beechwood Cafe so much business. That, man, they're just little girls lined up like, yes, Harry eats here. Harry loves the egg spinny.

[Ben Mandelker]

You know what's so funny is that I was literally in Beechwood Canyon yesterday and I had parked like a block away from that cafe, and I thought to myself, are people still, like, flocking to this cafe or is that moment ended and now I have the answer?

[Ronnie Karam]

It's busy all the time. Do we go every. Every time they're here. And my dad hasn't gone with him yet. He just got in town, so he's going. They're all going, and then we're all going to Disneyland. Wow. Everyone grieves. So

[Ben Mandelker]

sounds great, no?

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah. So wish me luck. Commercials.

[Andy Cohen]

Here comes one right now.

[Ronnie Karam]

There is such a better way to spend your time than doom scrolling or watching terrible tv. Get some stories in your life. Okay. Audible is perfect for that. I use it while I'm Cleaning the house while I'm running errands. I listen to books all day, every day with Audible.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah, they have a massive library of audiobooks and ad free podcasts and it is really the perfect thing to turn on when you're taking a long drive washing some dishes like enrich yourself.

[Ronnie Karam]

New members can start listening with a 30 day free trial at audible.com WWC

[Monica Reinagle]

hello, I'm Monica Reinagle, host of the Nutrition Diva podcast. Summer is here and with it, the hot and sticky weather. A morning working in the garden or maybe on the golf course can leave you more depleted than you realize. And plain water isn't always the most efficient way to restore the balance. That's where Liquid IV comes in. Its science backed formula is clinically proven to hydrate faster than water alone. Whether you're exercising, playing outside, or simply surviving a summer heat wave, it's an easy way to stay hydrated. Shop [e-mail] Liquid IV hydration that goes wherever life takes you.

[Ronnie Karam]

Okay, so anyway, the point is Kristen has come here very much. Like, we're gonna look good. We're not gonna get in fights. We're gonna look like a good strong couple and I'm gonna do everything right. And man, Luke just blows it out of the water in the first two seconds. God, Luke is terrible.

[Ben Mandelker]

What are you doing with Luke? He's awful. Also, Luke sucks. Before we even get into the Luke of it all, or I should say before we get into the things that he says, we also have to talk about just the way he man spreads right there on that, on that sofa. I mean, he took a two seats. Those knees were like. That was at like 9pm, 3pm okay. Like it was, it was just, they were just fully just out and just taking up space. And I was like, oh, God, this guy sucks. He sucks.

[Ronnie Karam]

A new documentary from the Lion King guys. It's like God's monster is this. What'd I say?

[Ben Mandelker]

Lion King.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, sorry, Rob. It's like, I got a new musical. This one's about lizards. Rob Meekoff. No, this is, yeah, you're right. The Tiger King people. It's called. I think it's called God's Monsters or something. And I heard, oh, it's crazy. You guys need to check it out and talk about it. So I just looked at the preview of it and one of the guys in it who's being interviewed, they're interviewing him from below. Like probably his ankles. I don't know why the camera is so low. And he's man, spreading and he's an older guy and it's just old man balls. That's all you see. And I'm like, this is going to take up the whole movie is old man nuts right in my face. I'm not watching it. You guys keep the camera up.

[Ben Mandelker]

That Tiger King director. I'm sorry, I'm over it. Like we watched Chimp Crazy, which, you know, was. Which was interesting and amusing, but like, I got so annoyed that like they spent so much time just with the director and like the director was. Was this where there was like scenes dedicated to the director speaking to like other directors about like, how involved should I be? Or something like that. I don't know. He just like centers himself so much that I'm like. I'm like, no, I'm not. We're not doing this anymore. I can't watch it anymore.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, well, I loved. I loved. I'm crazy. Oh my God, monkey. I don't know what the people are talking. I loved her. I still have her. I send her sticker to people that I made years ago when she was

[Ben Mandelker]

great to watch all her laser done. He was just insufferable. And he just kept on inserting himself in and like it probably could have been a three episode, tight, amazing documentary. But for me it was like constant scenes of just him. I'm like, why are you in this so much?

[Ronnie Karam]

I think that's a valid. A valid criticism of that show for sure. And I would watch this one. It's just the big old man nuts in my face. I just don't need it, you know? And the point is, Luke, close your legs. Married men. Okay, just cut out a little bit of Nene's line.

[Ben Mandelker]

But it still works. Legs.

[Ronnie Karam]

So then they're talking about their sex life. They are having more still. Probably not a ton. And Andy was like, well, him pressuring you for sex, that really came out. Came off selfish on your part, Luke. And he's like, like, yeah, I see that. But like, that's exactly how it read on tv. No, it's not how it read. Okay? It was not an edit. You were a. So you just need to say that. But he won't. It's all someone else's fault. He's like, yeah, that's how it read. And I genuinely thought Kristen would agree. Like, I didn't start going for it when the doctor said six weeks. You're good. And so I thought it was a proper buffer. Six weeks, you know, I guess I wasn't the best version of myself.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's you don't have, like, this is not like a ticket you've purchased for a flight that's gonna be happening in November, whether it's six weeks, whether it's eight weeks. It's not like, well, I gave it two extra weeks and, well, my. The ETA is that the flight is tomorrow. So we'll have. Tomorrow we start having sex again. And I'm gonna ask you every day for multi sex multiple times. It's like, no, it's just. You just have to. You just listen to the other person and their needs. And then of course, Danny chimes.

[Andy Cohen]

He's like, whoever, Whoever came up with that six week rule should just be fired, right? Because it's so unrealistic. But for a man, you know, like, you think, all right, like six weeks, they got it. You gotta hold out. But it's okay. Six weeks. And then it's like, back on the clock, ladies. But like, they don't like that at all. Am I right, guys? Am I right? Anyone? Anyone? Laugh my jokes.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's just so unrealistic, you know? But for a man, you. You think like, all right, six weeks and I gotta just hold that. And then I'm swimming forth. They're gonna be swimming forth. And Andy's like, so a lot of female viewers were coming after Luke for expecting sex from you so soon. Kristen, what was your reaction to the criticism? I mean, like, it's hard because, like, I'm allowed to come after him, but, like, I don't want other people to. And, you know, I did explain to him. I was like, these are moms. These are pregnant women. These are mariposas going through, like, there. Or they've gone through things, so they're going to be pissed. Okay, it's maternal passion.

[Andy Cohen]

Go, go.

[Ronnie Karam]

And then it almost made me, like, take aside a little bit more because, you know, I was coming out of tough. She starts doing this excuses, these excuses for him, like, I was coming out of really tough postpartum and, you know, remembering that he was new at this too. And she keeps trying to smooth it over for Luke, but then, yeah, he just keeps making it worse every time he opens his mouth. So why even bother at this point?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. Andy asks Nia, how soon after they had kids was she able to go back to having sex?

[Andy Cohen]

And she's like, well, it's different after every pregnancy. So I feel like that's also something to take into account. And it could be totally different next time for you guys, too. But after Asher, I was like, I, you know, I was torn a Little bit. And it was more like six months until I was comfortable. And we tried, but it was, it wasn't working. And, you know, then we had twins and I don't know, it's just been like a slow rise. Like, okay, cool. So Kristen, Luke expressed that he wasn't able to take time for himself. And then when he did do that, you guilted him for it. So what's your take on it?

[Ben Mandelker]

She's like, well, I know there are a couple of specific instances he's referring to like going fishing one day. And I was like, yeah, absolutely. But then he has to come home and like, do all this other stuff and finish up the day. And essentially where I'm thinking like, okay, now you're home, now I need you. And then he mutters under his breath something like, gotta go home and deal with the crazy. It's like, bro, like, the way he's so dismissive and condescending about like her postpartum mental health struggles. It's just, it's awful. And you know, again, it's not like Kristen is. She is a handful regardless. Okay? So it's not like, oh, everyone automatically gets like a pass. But he is just. I hate the way he treats her. Like, oh, she's cuckoo caca now.

[Ronnie Karam]

Like, I hate it too. And she's saying. And we know what she's saying because she said it a million times. It's not that he goes out, it's that he goes out and he gets shit faced and then he comes back and he's useless and then he goes to sleep and then he doesn't help with anything. So it's not him just going out for a couple hours. It's him being completely out of service and not helping for days while he like lies around and she has to take care of him and the baby and it's frustrating. And then he's like, oh, God forbid I ever go and do anything. Like, it's not new for me too. I know, it's just, it's new to you too. But you're not like attached to the baby. The baby is not attached to you needing things. Your body didn't change. You're just some guy living off the fat of the land.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's right. So Kristen's like, and he asks why, why is Luke sleeping on the couch such a trigger? Which is hilarious because, like, how could it not be? Like, the person that you have, you're. You're supposed to get engaged, that you're supposed to get married to doesn't even Want to sleep in the same bed with you. And so she's like, well, we've had times where we weren't doing well or times when he was, like, drinking and I was pregnant. I couldn't partake in anything, and it was like, late nights and, like, whether it's because he didn't want to wake me up or whatever, but I still want you in bed with me. And, like, I'm like, I'm very clingy. Like, I need you right now, but I wasn't expressing it that way, and I was just super defensive. And. And what I learned later, too, is that, like, there was a lot of postpartum depression and rage. And rage is something that I was not familiar with. And he's like, you weren't familiar with rage? Well, postpartum rage, it's different type of rage. It's different. But again, she part of Mary Jandy. She shouldn't have to throw herself on the sword for this one. I understand she's trying to take accountability and say, you know, she's trying to sort of be evolved and say, look, it takes two people to contribute to attention in a situation. But, like, I think it's reasonable to say, hey, I want you to be in bed with me. It makes me feel a certain sort of way. I feel rejected or whatever, and I'm really insecure right now. And, like, you're not going to bother me. Just get into, like, just be in bed with me. And I feel like she has said that. I feel like we have seen her say that. Say that it bothers her that he winds up on the sofa. We saw him. Her say that to him, and then he still went out and got drunk and wound up on the sofa. And it's like. It's like the easiest thing to fulfill is just to go the extra five feet over to the bed.

[Ronnie Karam]

Well, he's. It's not easy because it's avoidance. He's avoiding it. He doesn't want to be in there because then Kristen's. He's at Kristen's beck and call in his mind. And she can say, go get the baby. Or if the baby cries, he can pretend he didn't hear it. You know, it's a. It's pure avoidance. And she knows it. And she's falling all over herself making excuses for him, which is not great because that's usually signs of something much worse. Right? When you see people like, no, no, no, no, no, they're great. They're great. You know, you see Mia doing it and.

[Andy Cohen]

And It's.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's just horrible to watch all these couples going through the same thing. But there's another element to it with Kristen because, like, she just said she. It's one thing for her to be pissed at her husband when you. But when you have the whole country, like, your husband sucks, leave that guy. It makes her life a lot harder, too, because she can't just be. She can't just be. You know, it's like you've got all these people saying how much your husband sucks. And now she's coming and trying to smooth it over and being like, look, America is nice.

[Andy Cohen]

It's me.

[Ronnie Karam]

I'm sure I'm crazy, Kristen. I have problems. We all know that. I have rage and. But, sorry, babe, this is not. Yeah, this is not it. And I know that you had a baby with this. This guy. And you're never supposed to tell somebody who's had a baby with somebody to leave. You need to leave this man. You're gonna leave this man anyway.

[Ben Mandelker]

So, yes, start a commune with Lala and you guys can both raise each other, like, all the. All the kids together.

[Ronnie Karam]

But Luke is like, 100, not gonna last. So it may as well end sooner than later. It's gonna get. Don't forget later.

[Ben Mandelker]

Don't forget, like during the season when he said something along the lines of, like, what? I only got wasted once over the last two weeks, which is so wild. So then he says, well, he's like, well, once in the last month or something like that. Like. Like, you know, literally, like, you know, if she goes to bed early and I'm watching a movie, sometimes I'd fall asleep on the couch. And it wasn't spider thing to sleep on the couch. It's okay to fall asleep on the couch by accident, but then you inevitably wake up and you move into the bedroom. Like. Like, it's crazy to think that he just spent the entire night on the couch. And that's the implication of avoiding every

[Ronnie Karam]

part of being a father is what he's doing. It's not about your movies, dude. So then Kristen says it makes her, you know, more lonely. And he says it makes her more alone. No, no, he's talking about himself, of course. So he's like, like, yeah, you know, like I was continuing to give up things I traditionally was going to for years. Like the fishing trip with my dad I do annually, or the golf trip with my brother and these things. And it's like, she didn't make me give up those things. I just thought it would make things better for our relationship by not doing those things. And ultimately it made me feel more lonely and more estranged.

[Ben Mandelker]

God. But then really fault is that it's

[Ronnie Karam]

crazy having a newborn baby might make you change your plans one time in the first year. You selfish. What do you you think medal for not going on a golf trip once?

[Ben Mandelker]

I know. Well, isn't he just saying. Didn't you say here that this was happening even before the baby came around? Like he was doing this because he felt like this is the right thing to do. I mean that's on you. That's really on you. But either way it's like even if he, even if it is just like I had to sacrifice going on a golf trip because I have a newborn. It's like, like yes, that's exactly right. And you will deal with it. The golf trip. You can, you'll have other golf trips. And if there are not other golf trips, then you had plenty of really good ones.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, he's resentful cuz he gave up a couple of trips and she. It didn't make things better in their relationship cuz you're still an. When you're home, what are you not getting? So then Andy asks about couples therapy and he's like, it's on and off. And she goes, yeah, well, as someone who's like a big therapy advocate like me, Kristen. Therapy. Kristen, Everybody knows I love therapy. Well, yeah, you know, it's really hard because like when, when you're so combative, the therapist is like, don't come here until you guys are better. So that's how therapy works. So we'll go to therapy when we're ready. And they're all. Even Zach's. Zach just looks straight at the camera like what? And Andy. Yeah, I don't. That's. I've never heard that, that you wait until you're fighting less and less volatile to go to therapy. She's like, yup, that's.

[Ben Mandelker]

That's how it works. It means one of two things. Either the therapist was like they're a lost cause and I don't know how to tell them this. So I'll just tell them that they can't come to therapy anymore because they have to do other therapy first or what I really suspect what it is is that she is open to therapy and he is not open to therapy. And so he is not being open to the process and he is not sharing and he's not taking anything in and he's not listening to what the therapist is saying. So there's no point in going to therapy until he is mentally receptive to it. And they're not there yet. I think that's actually reading between the lines, what she's really saying here.

[Ronnie Karam]

We don't even have to read into that much because we saw in the season they went to therapy and the second to that he was called out on something. He was like, I don't want to go back there. I didn't like her. She's like, judgements, love me. So that was. That was why he won't go to therapy. He doesn't want someone. He feels like the women were teaming up on him.

[Ben Mandelker]

And then the big question that Andy has is, well, if you would have waited until after the pregnancy, do you

[Andy Cohen]

think you still would have proposed?

[Ben Mandelker]

And he's like, oh, that's a hard thing to try to make a up my mind. Everyone's like, bro, just say yes. And Michelle's like, that's not good.

[Andy Cohen]

Like, say yes.

[Ben Mandelker]

Come on, just say yes. Say yes. Say like, I don't know. The last two years feel kind of like a blur. I don't know. But I still want to spend the rest of my life with this crazy demon woman. I don't know. Like, say yes, bro. Oh, God.

[Ronnie Karam]

So embarrassing for Kristen, this guy. And he's like, well, I wouldn't break up with her. And Jasmine's like, oh, my God, look at Kristen's face. Kristen looks like she wants to cry but also murder him. It's like where he practiced this in the whole. On the whole plane right here, you idiot. So he asked Christian, Christian, Kristen, her reaction. And she's like, well, obviously it's not super fun to hear, but I want him to be honest and he's honest.

[Ben Mandelker]

I. I know that she's putting a good spin on it, but yeah, my heart breaks for her on this one. This is a guy who is not emotionally mature enough to be in a wedding, in a. In a marriage. Like, she is hitching her wagon to a donkey that's gonna drown in the river. Okay, like, this is. Yeah, this is no. This is no good. Like, the answer is. The answer is an unequivocal yes. Unhesitant yes. I'm sorry. That's what a show is.

[Ronnie Karam]

Even if you're lying and faking it. Like, yes, like, fake it till you make it or something, you know? But this whole, like, yeah, he's being so honest, and that's really all I want. He honestly doesn't like you, and you should not be with this person. You're lucky in a way that he's being honest, but you should not be in this situation. He's staying here for the television show, period. In my mind, there's no other reason. This guy is terrible. I just, honestly, I just rather him be honest.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. So then Andy goes, luke, you told

[Andy Cohen]

Jesse and Danny this season that if things continue this way they are with Kristen, there won't be a wedding. So what is the status the wedding right now?

[Ben Mandelker]

He's like, like, well, huh. Things have not continued the way that they were. Things have improved. I'm just asking if you still want to marry me. Well, I'm not breaking out the engagement. I think. I think it's a slow burn right now. I'm like, oh, no, don't. Don't say, I'm not breaking up the engagement. Like, like, oh. So he's bas. He's entry level commitment into this situation at this point. Like, it's just so. It's just so ins.

[Ronnie Karam]

Holding it over her head like a carrot st. He's dangling it like, oh, look, you could marry me if you behave. It's just gross. Get rid of him. She said when she started with him on the show, like, well, you know, I don't know if he's the right one forever, but I. It's the time that I need to have a baby. If I'm gonna have a baby, I need to do it now. And he would be a good partner to have a baby with. So I'm just gonna have a baby with him. And if it works out, it works out. You know, and now I think it's clear that the guy you behind the tent at the wedding. It's not the guy. Just we all know. Any of us who have a guy behind the tent at a wedding? No. That's generally not the person you're gonna marry, you know?

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. Also he's like, knows 11 or 12 years.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah.

[Ben Mandelker]

Yeah. And like, he's just not. He's just not. He's not mature enough for this. So Andy asked if they want to have another baby, and she says she doesn't know what her chances are fertility wise. And they would, like, do they go to the same doctor? But what if we like, we want to go to the same doctor, but like, what if we don't live here by the time that happens? So then what about, do we have to go to see a different fertility doctor? So Andy's like, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Andy Cohen]

If you don't live here, does that mean you might go to Colorado?

[Ben Mandelker]

She's like, oh, no. God, no. Not Colorado. Ew. Disgusting. And Luke, he gets this nasty look on his face. He does that sort of like passive aggressive laugh. He's like, that's an aggressive way to rescue, respond to Colorado. Only the best state in America. Quite frankly, there shouldn't be any other state. It should just all be Colorado. United State of Colorado, thank you very much.

[Ronnie Karam]

One day it's going to be its own country. So judge not, not, not. Sorry, I forgot to say the saying. And Kristen's like, well, I love the ranch. I mean, it's amazing. But we're not going to live there. I mean, it's, it's in the middle of nowhere and this really pisses him off. And anyone who's watched his show for so long knows why, because that has been his plan the whole time is to move to his ranch in Colorado. And Kristin has kind of resisted it, but kind of said, okay, at some point when we're done with la, we're gonna go back and live his dream life in Colorado. So now she's like, hell no, we're not going back there. And he's pissed. This couple should not be together, break up.

[Ben Mandelker]

Well, also the way he shits on LA all the time and then all the time, which is fine, I think. You know, LA is, LA is always a great city to dunk on. I mean, even us who I love la, but even here it's fun to dunk on la. But. But then the moment she says something about Colorado, he is so bothered and he said so many things that are so much more insulting to her about her. And then she says something about his state and he is pissed and you can see he's really pissed. You know that they had an argument later on about it too. This guy sucks.

[Ronnie Karam]

Oh, yeah. Congratulations, you've reached the end of part one of a two part recap for part two. Go look for the recap that says part two. See you over there, suckers.

[Ben Mandelker]

Watch what Crappens would like to thank its premium sponsors. Ain't no thing like Alison King.

[Ronnie Karam]

Our way is the Amber way.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's the Foster and the Furious. It's Amanda Foster. It's always automatic with Ashley Auto. Put your hands together for Carly Clapp.

[Ronnie Karam]

Get on the right foot with Chrissy Offutt. We never miss her call. It's Diane Call Big Yay. It's Emily Gaultier.

[Ben Mandelker]

Aaron McNicholas. She don't miss no Tricolus Hava Nagila Weber. You'll never hide from Heidi. Eleanor Jones.

[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

our favorite streamer Caroline Peacock, Kristen the Piston Anderson.

[Ronnie Karam]

Let's give a kisserino to Lisa Lino Fresh as a daisy. It's Maisie McHenry come again? We're obsessed with Margaret O' Halloran. Megan Berg. You can't have a burger without the Berg.

[Ben Mandelker]

This is living with Michelle Vivian I

[Ronnie Karam]

love a YA Olivia Williamson she's the lady of the house It's Rachel Sharous

[Ben Mandelker]

she sure is swell.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's Raquel, yes we can.

[Ben Mandelker]

It's Savannah Cast a spell with Shannon Spellman let's share with Sharon Eldridge.

[Ronnie Karam]

Darn skippy, it's Tippy. And our super Premium sponsors she's VVIP it's Amanda V. Somebody get us 10

[Ben Mandelker]

cc's of Betsy MD we're taking the gold with Brenda Silva. Let's get real with Caitlin Onit meal.

[Ronnie Karam]

Put us on a stretcher. It's Charlotte Fletcher. Don't get salty with Christine Pepper can't have a meal without the Emily sides.

[Ben Mandelker]

Who, what, why, where? And Gwen Pentland. Nobody holds a candle to Jamie Kendall. We got our wish. It's Jen Plish, My Favorite Murdo Karen McMurdo let's get savage With Laura Wildman in the study with a candlestick It's Leslie Peacock. We're ride or die for Lisa. Ride or Baron? She's a whiz. It's Liz Sarthy, Always killing it. It's Lola Al Kalani. Roger that. It's Marlis Rogers, the incredible edible Matthew sisters.

[Ronnie Karam]

She eases our woes. It's Melissa St. Rose. There's a chance of meatballs. It's Rebecca Cloud. She's our princess. It's Rebecca Prince.

[Ben Mandelker]

She's the queen bee. It's Sarah Lemke.

[Ronnie Karam]

We cannot tell a lie. It's Sarah.

[Ben Mandelker]

Tell of son Shannon out of a can.

[Andy Cohen]

And Anthony.

[Ben Mandelker]

Please don't stop. It's solely and pop. Let's take off with Tamla playing Strike a pose.

[Ronnie Karam]

It's Tori Rose. She ain't no shrinking violet Coutar. We love you guys. This episode is sponsored by Nature Raised Farms.

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

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[Ben Mandelker]

Keep your life simple with your new favorite chicken.

[Ronnie Karam]

Nature Raised farms chicken because chicken shouldn't be complicated. It this episode is sponsored by McDonald's.

[Ben Mandelker]

I'm having my hot Caesar Summer Ronnie yes, Caesar sauce. I feel like we don't talk about Caesar sauce enough cuz it's so so good. I love to dip everything into it. Have you ever dipped fries in in Caesar sauce before?

[Ronnie Karam]

I mean I just have. It is delicious. Caesar sauce is like a Parmesan garlicky blend with some lemon in it and you can dip anything in there.

[Ben Mandelker]

One thing I have been known to do is to stop over at McDonald's and go through the drive through and get myself a Caesar snack wrap and just dip some fries in the caesar sauce. Also McCrispy strips in the Caesar sauce. Honestly, try it. It's really good.

[Ronnie Karam]

Listen, I say if you put Caesar sauce on something that automatically makes it better than yes. That's really all you need is the Caesar sauce.

[Ben Mandelker]

I think I just want to have just a constant supply of Caesar sauce and put it on things at all times.

[Ronnie Karam]

Yeah, I'm a straight up French fry and Caesar sauce kind of a boy. That's what I love and that's how I'm gonna go down right now at

[Ben Mandelker]

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[Ronnie Karam]

order Caesar sauce at participating McDonald's for a limited time.

[Monica Reinagle]

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