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- [00:00]
A
Bitcoin had a nice bounce off the 107,108k region, temporarily trading back over 110, leading all the pundits and analysts to say Bitcoin reclaimed 110k. Let's go. By the time we did the show we were back under 109, reminding us that it is still the end of summer here, I guess the beginning of fall officially today and we are in the doldrums and the chop. But will we rebound hard from here? What's coming and what else is going on in the market and the news. I just don't even think about doing research on Tuesdays. I just show up and pray that Andrew and Tillman are going to break it down for me. And here they come. Guys, you better look at the news. Let's go, let's go.
- [00:56]
B
Let's dope.
- [00:59]
A
Do you guys hate that song enough yet? You know I'm gonna put words in there that go like and subscribe so I don't have to say it on the show. Like and subscribe. That is a nice ring to it. I'm gonna get Andrew and Tillman to remix that for me. What's up guys? I woke up in a different kind of mood today, as you can see. So sorry.
- [01:15]
C
Dude. I love that music. I hear it in my sleep off maybe three times a week. I hear it in my sleep.
- [01:21]
B
Me too.
- [01:21]
A
I even hear Tillman sideways. So we're going.
- [01:23]
C
Yeah, right. That's the right way right there.
- [01:26]
A
First thing we Tillman this morning drinking a water bottle. It's like this long and has glass on the bottom. And it was like we could just stare like it showed up staring into his stomach.
- [01:39]
B
Listen, you've got to get your liquids in. I'm dehydrated.
- [01:42]
A
I've been working 6am where you are, right?
- [01:45]
B
Yeah, but I get my water in.
- [01:48]
A
By 6am this morning I was, I was a bottle deep of hydration and a 30 minute sauna. It was pretty great this morning. It was really wonderful. But anyways, nobody, literally nobody wants to know about any of this.
- [02:00]
C
Nobody wants to. Nobody wants to think about you naked in a sauna. 30 for 30 minutes. Okay.
- [02:08]
A
Yeah, no, I'm train. I'm training for my naked.
- [02:12]
B
He never brought.
- [02:16]
A
I'm training for my next stadium fight. So I was actually in there in full boxing gear, you know, head to toe, just trying to sweat it out, lose a little more weight.
- [02:24]
B
Who are you fighting? I need to start making bets.
- [02:28]
A
I don't know but he's going to beat my Ass if it's a real fight. Anyways, guys, Bitcoin reclaims 110k. There it is in the news. Let's check the Bitcoin chart. 109. It took like all of 40 minutes this morning to force everybody to change their titles and topics. Right. But bitcoin's kind of chopping around.
- [02:48]
C
I'd like to posit the idea that we've gotten to a point here at bitcoin and in crypto overall that instead of, you know, bit boy and the wolf of all streets fighting in the, in the next fight that it, that it really should be Larry Fink and Jamie Dimon in the fifth. Like, like that's what we need to see. Like, like they're the new influencers. Right? They're the new influencers.
- [03:14]
A
Winner has a loser has to withdraw their company from public markets.
- [03:22]
C
That would be awesome.
- [03:24]
A
Fight to the death of bitcoin and ether.
- [03:27]
B
It's like racing for your title. You have to give up the car at the end of the race.
- [03:33]
A
Yeah. But let's talk about the bitcoin price action. Obviously if you take a quick gander at the daily chart there that I brought up for those who care, you got the 50 ma kind of rolling over, obviously struggling down here. I see this as deep hope that my algorithm and myself will be buying Bitcoin at 100k before it goes all the way back up.
- [03:58]
B
I think volatility is the feature I think that we have. We say that but we really don't mean it. And so when I get bored and price isn't doing what I want it to do, I, I remind myself that volatility is a feature. There's buying opportunities just like you said. So if you're, if you're a hundred percent committed to bitcoin right now and you have no cash on the side, I can see why dips would be troublesome to you. But if you, if you're, if you have a proper allocation strategy and you have proper cash reserves on hand, then these dips may be the last time you get it anywhere close to here. You don't know where the market's going. You can't predict that. That is the age old fallacy that gets everyone in trouble. There is no one that knows which direction and when and why. That's what makes it a free market. So, you know, we can say there's being, it's being manipulated. Bubble, it's above 110,000, you know, plus or minus less than 2%. So who cares is the point it's like the fluctuations in percentage swings have become much smaller. Remember when we were at 75 and we could go to 50, well, that's 25,000 points off of 75. Like we're not even talking about going 25, 000 points down from here. But even if we did, that would be a relative move that's even smaller than what we've been accustomed to in the past. So I just don't, it's, it's really all, all noise.
- [05:31]
A
I like to remind people that in the greatest year for crypto, 2021, that summer, we went from 65 to under 30 in like 16 days.
- [05:42]
C
Yeah.
- [05:42]
A
And all the way back up to 69.
- [05:45]
C
Yeah.
- [05:46]
A
So. Well, I looked, that was a, that was, last I checked, that's over 50 drop. We've seen nothing like that on this move. Even if we went back to 75k from 125k, it wouldn't even be close to what that move was.
- [05:59]
B
No, it wouldn't. That's exactly my point.
- [06:02]
C
Yeah, there is a, the, the, the scale of opportunity in Bitcoin to your point about that time frame dramatically changed. Now we have options, you know, we have swaps, we have ETFs, we, we have so many other entities available for trading to generate alpha, to do all sorts of stuff. I've been playing around with some options, type of, of strategies and it kind of blows my mind. And what's interesting is if you don't know enough about options there, you know, there was a world 10 years ago where if you weren't an options guy, you know, you just didn't know how to even start. Right. Well, now we have, you know, the type of, of tools, AI tools at our disposal where we don't have to know much about options. You just plug something in, say, hey, give me an option strategy for if I think bitcoin's going to 130 to 135k in the next 30, 60, 90 days. What should I do? It'll give you like four different things. You want to be aggressive, a little less aggressive, generate, yield, all that stuff. And it is, it is, you know, even the ability to generate, you know, 6, 7, 8x returns on Bitcoin, you know, in the next 60 to 90 days if there's a move higher versus just spot following the price and you know, getting a 15 or 20% move is really, really something. And again it goes to the floor associated with where we're at with price there. These strategies are being played across the board in you Know, hedge fund offices, family offices, just trading offices. Right. It's the reason why Coinbase bought the likes of Deribit. It's the reason why the likes of options associated with this stuff has grown exponentially. So and it's also the reason why you're going to see smart Bitcoin balance sheet and Bitcoin treasury companies use these strategies as the ability to generate additional alpha beyond just holding, you know, Bitcoin on their, on their, their balance sheet or in their Treasury. There, there is exponential opportunity as the quote unquote sort of economy grows, financialization grows around Bitcoin. And it's fascinating to watch, it's fascinating to do the research. Right? And it doesn't take long to do the research. Plug in a couple of ideas to chat GPT or GROK or whatever it is and you'll be like, whoa. They'll even, you know, they'll give you charts, they'll give you all sorts of stuff. It's interesting to see what can happen and what will happen over time with Bitcoin and all these additional financialization products. It's really fascinating.
- [08:45]
B
Well, I think what you just discussed is, is where the battle lies, right? It's best dad by far. Like that cup. Yeah. It's one of those things where the M Nav battle is going to be where these treasury companies either gain tremendous market share or they, they fall on their sword and they die. And it's going to be based upon how aggressive they are and the, the amount of the percentage right. Wins they have. And I just, I think that this chasing of the M Nav and all of the financial playgrounds that are being built to chase, that are, are interesting. I just don't think that they're for the, for the most part they're not for the normal person, they're pretty complicated. And if you don't know what you're doing, you, you, there are things that can surprise you. Just like you said, as you learn about options trading, there's, it's no different than somebody who's only played the long side of a trade starting to short. There's, there's intrinsic risks to shorting stocks.
- [09:52]
A
A lot of people. No, no, he was actually, he was just gigalonging into the like slowest retracement in history.
- [09:58]
B
Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, it's, I, I do think that that is where we're headed but for. That's why I think a lot of retail gets frustrated because they don't look at volatility as a positive. When you're looking at options, you're looking at it as an extraordinary positive because what you're doing is you're taking high leverage positions at bottoms, right. Or at tops. You're trying to pick the bottom in those instances. And that's a very difficult thing to do. And so when bottoms become exhausted or what they look to be exhausted, people take sizable bets on it. And that restructures the risk dynamic of the market and it restructures the liquidity pools of the market when you have a lot of people doing that in unison. You know, if, for example, if we came down to 100, 000 retested and bounced back up to 111, how many long, you know, 5x longs, 10x longs, do you think they would be? I think that would be a lot because they would be going, you know what, we've retested that hundred thousand mark. It's only up from here. And so that would become a new structure that we haven't seen before. So this price, you know, volatility is where really the magic happens if you're playing with leverage. And it's no different than like if you look at, you know, a price chart and you know it's going up at a 45 degree angle, but there's all this volatility and chop on the way. Well, if you took that as a string and you stretched it out, the opportunity of the chop is well beyond just the opportunity of the rise of the, of of the stock price. So, you know, there's a lot of money to be made. And when there's a lot of money to be made, there's people come to the table and start playing the games.
- [11:42]
A
Yeah, this is interesting, by the way. I hate these tweets, so I will give it with a grain of salt. I really like Kyle. I know someone else tweets for him though. But like, you know, if Bitcoin only needs a 1.5k pump from here to wipe out 1 billion worth of shorts, I mean, this kind of speaks to what you're saying, is that people are stacking in with leverage now in these areas because they're bored. But to the tone of these tweets, so people know, like, these are dumb because they imply that nobody would close a position that everybody who's in the market would get liquidated. So when you look at a liquidation map, yes, people have points of liquidation, but 99 of their people, those people, if they have a brain, have a stop loss before that liquidation. So when you see these Tweets, you're like, the market's gonna short squeeze all these. No. And they probably have a. And if these are good traders, they probably have a position on the other side as well. So that's kind of nonsensical. That said, this does show you that there's a lot of interest still in a tight spread around these ranges where nobody should be doing anything manually at all.
- [12:43]
B
Could not agree more. Yeah, I think you're spot on with that.
- [12:47]
C
I think we should talk to pivot here. We should talk about Ethereum inflows into the ETFs over the past 45 days. Just absolutely massive and outstripping the Bitcoin ETFs in a significant way. You know, let's just call it what it is. Wall street is, has kind of decided that Ethereum is, is the chain that they think is going to be the innovation chain. You know, whatever we think of it in, you know, the crypto bubble that we live in, Wall street has decided that this is, you know, this is what they're going to bet on. And I think that's something, you know, that's a, that's a meaningful narrative and, and there's action behind that narrative. So Wall street has figured out what the story is and they're telling that story to clients, and clients are choosing to allocate capital to Ethereum and the Ethereum products that exist out there. So, you know, we have, we have, we have two horses now at this point which are, you know, deeper and deeper embedded into Wall street narratives. And with Wall street narratives comes significant amounts of capital that just lift, lift the price floors again and again and again. And, you know, do you think.
- [14:05]
B
I have a question for you. Do you think in those meetings with the financial advisors or where that option is being presented to them, do you think it's really about the technology or do you think it's about the upside in the trade? Like, I would tend to think it's more about like, hey, listen, Bitcoins, I can. Had a good run. Ethereum hasn't had the run yet. Put it in there. Because I cannot get my mind around a universe where everyone's believing Ethereum is the greatest technology.
- [14:36]
A
I can break that down, but not from my own perspective, from that of Matt Hogan, who I had on Thursday. Who's the guy in the room having the conversations for me, obviously. And I asked him the exact same question. And it's funny because for months and months and months, if not years, he would say, listen, we're going to try to push the Ethereum narrative, explain to people the difference from Bitcoin. They should get it. It's a tech play. They understand buying in video, they understand buying Apple, they understand that all of those have performed exceptionally well. So they should understand eth. They're just not getting it. Even after the Ethereum spot ETF were approved, nobody cared. Nobody wanted to hear it. I think when Tom Lee came out, even though his narrative was not necessarily the accurate one, that gave everybody just that little push. They needed to start being more open to other things in crypto. And he said now in his meetings, he's getting a lot of people saying, let's skip bitcoin and go straight to eth. I get that. Not that they get the network, not that they understand the tech, not that they even understand what's going to be built on it. But you can say to a Wall street guy, this is the tech play, you know, the Mag 7. This is the Mag 7 play. And buying bitcoin, you're buying gold. If you're buying this, you're buying the Mag 7. Which one are you more comfortable investing in? And he said, that's become a thing. He had multi billion dollar guys say, let's skip bitcoin. The Ethereum thing makes sense to me, which I would have never thought.
- [15:57]
C
That's the, you know, storytelling is the thing on Wall Street. If you don't have a story, you don't have anything to sell. And so the Tom Lee thing, people don't realize how influential Tom Lee is across Wall Street. I mean, you know, again, in. In our crypto bubble, we're like, well, you know, he says bitcoin's going to this, or he's been wrong so many times. First, depending on time frame, he's not been wrong so many times. Eventually, price targets get there, and then two across Wall street, his, you know, his analytics firm and the research that they do is highly, highly, highly respected, right? To some degree, without the negative of Jim Cramer, what Jim Cramer was, let's call it, you know, 15 to 20 years ago. Tom Lee is kind of that guy. He shows up on shows almost every day. He shows up on shows almost every day. And he makes sense. He's smart. He has a great firm that is institutional in nature, you know, on its own.
- [16:59]
A
And most importantly, he's already trusted.
- [17:02]
B
That was the difference.
- [17:02]
A
Like, even Sailor had to, like, spend years gaining the trust of people to explain Bitcoin. Tom Lee is the guy who sends you your research on your trades, and he's sending you Research saying buy eth.
- [17:14]
C
Yeah.
- [17:14]
B
I can't tell you how many people I run into that say, oh, Tom Lee is my favorite. Like he, I don't know what he's done because I, I haven't followed these Wall street guys.
- [17:21]
A
Like they buy his, like his business is selling them information, supposedly like information that is pretty impartial. So when he comes out and says it and he's had, I'm sure he's had bad calls, but he nailed enough huge calls like I think Great Recession and all these things that he can go back and say I was, you know, it's like the big short guy. You know, I said this was going to go bad. But he's been bullish at all the moments when everybody was bearish. And that's played very well in his favor because he's smart enough to know that bears need incredible timing. If you just stay bullish, he'll be eventually.
- [17:53]
C
Right, yeah, if, if, you know, if you need a, a mind picture of Tom Lee and his operation, just think of a couple of Wall street movies. You know, I've been in their offices at Fun Strat. It looks the way it's supposed to. They've been there a long time. They're constantly welcoming, you know, big Wall street names and firms, family offices in there. They sell, listen, they, they were running a huge business way before crypto became the thing that it's become across Wall Street. And they do research that's not just crypto research. They do trad 5 based research and have for years and years and years. And you know, again, I've been there, I've seen the operation, I know what they do. And then to have a face and a name that pulls it all together, that's highly respected. You know, Tom is that guy.
- [18:47]
B
And Tom may be all that guy. But it kind of just hit me as we were talking about it. It may be more simple than that in the fact that World Liberty Financial good pivot. I don't know if you guys saw the governance token that was launched, but, you know, it doesn't hurt that the President's family built their decks on Ethereum. There's a major bet that's been played, it's paid off successfully. And you know, most of the guys that are probably watching the World Liberty Financial going, yeah, Ethereum may stink based upon what all these other people are saying, but these guys who had no crypto experience launched their own exchange within a year and have done $5 billion and put $5 billion of liquidity on the table. Good enough for me. You see what I'm saying? Like, it may. It may just be as simple as where is all the weight in the momentum focused? And Ethereum is that. And whether it's right, wrong or indifferent from a tech perspective, you know, there's been a lot of success even recently. You know, Ethereum's kind of looked in the past, you know, as kind of the past ICO craze coin, and there hadn't been meaningful business done with it since until now. Now exchanges are being built on it. And, you know, that's. I think if you looked at kind of the major headlines that we've all been focused on, it's all centered around exchanges. It's all centered around customer experience and usability.
- [20:14]
A
And I had to do a bit of a deep dive on World Liberty Financial because I got a call yesterday morning to come on News Nation and talk about it, and I was like, better know what I'm talking about. So obviously I showed the chart before. It's trading at 22 cents or so 23. It pumped up to above 40. Right. And then you know what happens? Like, there's some. There was a 20% online. So basically how it broke down. They did the sale last year, I think, October 15th. It was only accredited investors and foreigners. Those people bought 20% of the supply and 20% of that supply unlocked yesterday. But the reason I think this dumped and didn't get more interest to the upside was that they promised that was going to be 5% of the total 100, whatever billion, billion tokens. And then their own fund also unlocked. So that was unexpected, I guess. Whether those moved or not, nobody knows. But they had a fund investing in it themselves and that led it to go from 5% of the tokens being the circulating supply to 20 to 25% being the supply overnight. Mind you, this was already trading on futures for the last week on Binance, which I just. That was a chart I showed. So I think actually this will do exceptionally well. To your point, like, whether it should or not, I don't care. Like, I'm not going to get into the morality or the ethics or whether they built anything that's even unique. I mean, this is like a fork or something, right? I mean, there's nothing like new here particularly. But you have the president and his sons deeply invested in this, and their stake in this alone right now is worth three to six billion dollars.
- [21:53]
B
Well, yeah, well. And if you look at the landscape of all the behemoth exchanges that are coming together, the Robin Hoods the coinbases, the Krakens, the Geminis. There's really no decks. That's the lead horse other than them. And that's the. Especially in the us that's a really unique spot that, you know, if you could have a hundred percent of that market share or anywhere close to it for even a short period of time, you would be doing very well.
- [22:25]
A
Yeah, I thought that actually this thing would just have crazy trading around it based on what we saw with the Trump token. But it's almost funny the fact that the Trump token launched randomly on a Friday night after trading hours and was a surprise, kind of captured the volume and interest and fomo, this being so long telegraphed, I think people were already trading the futures and had made up their mind on what they wanted to do with it. Maybe they have a lower target to buy and stuff. So it didn't really get. I thought this was going to be like the, you know, Coachella of altcoin launches based on.
- [22:59]
B
Well, here's what I do know. I know that the crypto brothers, let's call them the president's sons, are wanting this to succeed not just for the money. They, they have reputational risk. They bet heavily, reputationally on Bitcoin and on crypto as a whole. This is their baby. And so what, what did you, what did they say? I looked at the tweet of. I think it was Don Jr. And.
- [23:26]
A
He said, I can look it up.
- [23:27]
B
Yeah, yeah. It was something along the lines of, you know, we're. This is not just a random meme coin. This is a governance token for World Liberty Financial. What he's saying to the people when he says that is that I'm put. We're putting value attached to this coin that the world's gonna see as value, and it's gonna be in the form of governance or voting or access or some sort of intellectual value or access value that has not been defined yet. And so the question that I have to ask when I look at these types of opportunities from an investment perspective is, you know, do I bet on the jockey? Do I believe that they're gonna continue to. To figure out ways to add value to this token over the long term? Well, in my opinion, that's a resounding yes, or at least for the next two and a half years. So, you know, I'm with you. I think there's a lot of upside potential here, especially considering how bad the crash was after that liquidation. But that liquidation may also be in an indicator of that the price went way well beyond what they thought.
- [24:40]
A
I left something out. So the October 15th sale to accredited investors in the US and foreign. So anyone us who is telling you they invested and is not accredited, there could be something shady going on because there was a lot of people saying, hey, I invested. And people are like how? But it was 1.5 cents in the first round and 5 cents in the second round. So at 30 cents, 40 cents with this thing topped out, talk about like a 2025 X for the first investors, they're going to sell that 20%. Oh, and by the way, like if you do a direct listing on the stock market as opposed to an IPO like Coinbase did, there are no new coins and new shares. So if you want to take the optimistic view, like Brian Armstrong and early Coinbase investors had to commit a certain amount of shares for the direct listing to sell. And people say insiders are selling. But the only way to do a direct listing is for liquidity to come from insiders that transparently commit. The difference is a direct listing, they. They transparently commit. And there's SEC rules and here you don't really know who the has the coins and when they're going. And now the government's token, by the way they're. The rest of the vesting schedule has not been determined. Apparently it'll be voted by governance. So well, but here's could be in a year.
- [25:53]
B
Here's the key issue. And it's just like with the meme coin phrase craze. It's like if a meme coin creates a lot of liquidity out of. No, out of thin air. Right. And the people who control the supply or have that supply, they choose to sell into that. The question becomes is does that capital roll back into the project or does it roll out of the project? In my mind that's really the.
- [26:14]
A
Or not. And that's what they asked me on TV yesterday and what Dave Weisberger rails about every day and I was like, I can't give you that answer. Maybe I haven't done a deep enough dive. But this is not specific to World Liberty Financial. This is the problem every token has. Tell me how I make money as a token holder. If company does well.
- [26:33]
B
Yeah, yeah.
- [26:35]
A
Or is it just going to be financial engineering and who buys it and who sells it. And by the way, if it's just speculation, I'm in on speculating on the Trump self interest.
- [26:46]
B
Exactly.
- [26:48]
A
Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. But World Liberty Financial I think is going to be really, really interesting. I think a Day when the markets were closed and we're at 6 super low volumes was like just questionable time to launch it, like on Labor Day holiday. But I think it's gonna do good. That's it.
- [27:07]
C
Well, remember too that you know, speculation or not speculation and gamification, it has effectively become, you know, a big part of the ethos of just overall markets at large. Right. Jeff park has talked about this a lot. Right. So gamification continues to be a thing and it will forever be a thing going forward with markets. So whatever the reason is, you know the old adage and idea of value investing, the old thought process associated, I'm buying this particular asset because of earnings coming up in three weeks and I blah, blah, blah, you're playing from behind at that point. So as it relates to tokens, as it relates to shares, as it relates to equity, as it relates to anything, the question is why do you think it's going higher? And is that narrative going to actually play itself out? It almost doesn't matter what the narrative is. It can be insane, the narrative can be ridiculous. But if that narrative actually plays itself out, you make money. So that's the new norm as it relates to markets. And so.
- [28:16]
B
Well, it's proven right, because Dogecoin, Pepe, all of these things, they're not small projects, guys. I mean people have been made billionaires out of these projects. Like legitimate 30 plus billion dollars. Yeah. Many times over. So you're right. I think everybody is looking at the these types of opportunities and really just investing as in general with much shorter timeframes in mind. Much shorter.
- [28:42]
A
I think they're stretched out.
- [28:44]
B
Yeah.
- [28:46]
A
People are. People have enough problems with my appearance today for me to have a stretchy head conversation about my eye bags in the comments while we're going. Just so everybody knows, I genetically have eye bags. I'm not tired. I'm actually getting the best sleep of my life. What actually happened was that I quit eating processed food and alcohol, as I said, and I dropped so much weight so fast. Now I'm just dying, fighting to put it back on. It's crazy. If you drop all that stuff, man, you start looking like how much you eat, you just disappear anyways.
- [29:18]
B
So, yeah, you know, World Liberty, if they take. I. I read a headline today that said that they've extracted $5 billion out of that. I don't know if that's.
- [29:30]
A
I think that's their value of everything they're holding. I don't know that they've.
- [29:34]
B
Okay, so let's just extracted any to be fair, let's say it's 10 of that. Let's say they took 500 million off the table just like they did with whatever they took off the table with the Trump Coin. Whatever liquidity got extracted, if they use that liquidity inside the decks, that's a good thing. That's just deepening the liquidity pool inside their exchange. And it would be a good reason to sell. No different than if you needed to acquire a competitor and you were a traditional company and you sold stock at a very high price because it reached higher price than you could have anticipated and you were allowed to sell enough to go make that acquisition possible where otherwise it wouldn't be. Same type of thing could be like we don't know what their objective is. But I tend to lend to giving them the benefit of the doubt as it pertains to it not just being a short term money grab. I don't think this liquidity is getting completely extracted from, from this project is the point. I think it's. I think they're trying to build a large dex and in order to do so you have to have a lot of liquidity to back.
- [30:38]
A
They're going to make. They make a lot more money by this going up 100%.
- [30:42]
B
That's my point.
- [30:42]
A
There's so many to pull to make it go up. So just naturally I love. There's people telling me that I'm shilling World Liberty Financial. We're having a conversation about the biggest thing in the market and how we objectively think it's likely to perform. And if you think for some reason we're shilling it by saying the Trumps have a self interest in pushing their thing that they control up, we're stating the obvious honestly. Maybe you have tds apparently. Here's the truth.
- [31:11]
B
I don't own any of it. I, I don't. I wish I did. I wish I was right on the tip of the spear as it pertains to some of these projects that he's been involved in and the family's been involved in. Because if you were waiting by the bedside table when Trump Meme Coin launched, you made a ton of money. And I mean a ton of money. But if you didn't, you lost a bunch of money. Same thing here. If it depends on where you get in. This is so early in what they're trying to accomplish. This is highly speculative and I don't own any. But I still, to your point, think it's fascinating and it is the biggest news story of the day. Yesterday should be.
- [31:48]
C
Well, it. And, and to, you know, speak to when people have feedback world where volatility can be extracted from other tokens and then moved into Bitcoin, like that is a, that is a meaningful and tried and true strategy across this industry. Right. So if you buy World Liberty Financial at 22 cents and it goes to 41 cents, you extract that particular particular yield and turn it into Bitcoin. And bitcoin goes to 135 over the next 60 days. I don't know. That's a pretty decent shill. I'll take that shill all day long.
- [32:27]
B
Well, it's compounding on compounding and if you're right on those series of events, it does not take very many rights to make a huge impact. I mean, compounding, the laws of compounding, if anyone wants to do a little research and you don't know about it, Einstein said it's the most powerful force in nature. And he said if man is either a slave to it or he understands it. So, you know, it's one of those things that the laws of compounding work to an exponential curve, which means they don't look very sexy until they do. And once they do, it's a rocket ship to the moon. And so, you know, it's. I think that what Andrew's saying is if the game is played, and I remember this, when the ICO craze was going on, it was like, what ICO is coming out next and can I roll the profits from one to the next? And some people played that game exceptionally well. I mean, they were just right on the nail on, on every now the.
- [33:25]
A
Options aren't there, but now you can't do that. So there's like one every six months or year that people might even have interest in. The Meme Coin craze is dead. Yeah.
- [33:34]
C
Yeah.
- [33:34]
A
You know, I don't think there's been a billion market cap launched Meme Coin since Trump Token in January. I read, I would agree, which is crazy. Although I guess Kanye went to three and down below a billion in like 12 minutes or something. There was one that played just the tip with a billion but didn't quite make it and you know, finish, but. So there's really just very few ways to speculate on something brand new in this space right now. And frankly, you don't have to. We could talk about how boring Bitcoin is. Hash rates at an all time high, you could talk about price and we could argue about what's going on. The network is humming along just Crushing right now.
- [34:16]
C
Yeah. All of that falls under the don't get bored with Bitcoin, right? Like, the minute that you get bored with bitcoin, there's a material move and you could have done one, two or three or four things to benefit from that move. So what is it that you're doing? What is it that you're thinking about? What is it that you're spending a little bit of time researching that says, you know what, I want to benefit for the next 15% move? I want to benefit a little bit more than 15%. How do I go about doing that? Right? Do I, you know, am I taking advantage of a token that's not Bitcoin, that will move 30% to Bitcoin's 15% and then taking that yield and turning it into, you know, additional Bitcoin? Am I using options? Am I using, you know, the trading of Bitcoin ETFs and the move that they make to also turn it into additional yield? What do you do? It's not hard to spend half a day, you know, using chat, GPT or whatever it is to take a look at some of these strategies. It really is not that hard. It's very, very simple. You can be a monkey and just begin typing stuff in there and you're going to get somewhere. And if that somewhere is you own more bitcoin and it goes up, you know, you're, you're in a, you're in a really, really great spot. Just take the time to do it right.
- [35:36]
B
Well, it's an educational tool, right. It's no different than YouTube or any of these. In a very short period of time, you can learn a lot and it is exceptionally powerful. And to your point, those tools are where the alpha is, right? Unless you just want to buy and hold and be an investor, trading requires you to shorten your time frame.
- [35:58]
A
Right?
- [35:58]
B
Trading, by definition, is not investing. Investing is more macro and it's more based upon what you believe to be the intrinsic value of something and it's recognition of that value today versus what it'll be 20 years from now. Now trading is like, where's the market going and what time frame am I measuring it on? You can't trade successfully without those additional tools, in my opinion, because the, the, the amount of volatility you need to make the risk reward ratio worth your effort has to be there. That's why traders love the most volatile, deep liquid stock that they can get their hands on. That's what you're looking for. And I think that's why MicroStrategy has honestly been just DCA. Amen. Listen, there's one thing better than just DCA. It's intelligent DCA, which means buying when the market is exhausted based upon what you define being exhausted as on the dips. That is how you get the best blended cost curve into anything, honestly. So I couldn't agree more.
- [37:09]
A
Yeah, dollar cost averaging. But doing it better seems very appealing.
- [37:13]
B
Well, you have to ask the question, like dollar cost averaging has been the most powerful tool against volatility risk that you, that man's created. Like that's how you avoid volatility risk. But the question then becomes, okay, why am I picking Tuesday at 9am randomly to make my acquisition purchase? What? Why wouldn't I monitor the week with automated tools to pick the time in which I dollar cost average that week based upon when market exhaustion points are met and based upon when you see volume shifting from one direction to the next. Those would be the opportune times to take advantage of that week's purchase. And that's what our tools at Arch Public do exceptionally well. And they're completely user driven. So if you define bitcoin price movement as being on sale with a 2% move on a one hour candle, well, you can program it to take advantage of when bitcoin drops by 2% on a one hour candle. Boom. It's a triggered event and you added a little DCA point to your cost curve.
- [38:23]
A
Andrew, you were about to say something.
- [38:25]
C
Well, again, there is the opportunity associated with both volatility and gamification will grow and grow and grow and grow. And you would be shocked if you had an inside look as to how some of the biggest hedge funds in the world go about their business looking for the gamification opportunity on a daily, weekly, monthly basis. And then the tools that they use, by the way, to extract, you know, yield and performance and alpha from that quote unquote moment. Right? So, so from 50, 000ft you get the Warren Buffett, you know, you know, commentary, which is, you know, you, you buy when everybody's bleeding and, and, and you know, you, you sell when everybody's, you know, celebrating. That's easy enough to say. It's very, very difficult to do. Very, very difficult. And a guy like Warren Buffett and other folks in his position, they aren't sitting at their computer saying, oh, looks like everybody's bleeding. I'm going to buy. That's not how they do things. They have tools that effectively take that philosophy and turn it into, quote, unquote, Math. Right. When something goes down by this significant amount of percentage point, I know that there's going to be people that are running for the doors. I'm going to capture all that running for the doors energy and put it into my position. Same thing when everybody's running into the theater, you know, because there's euphoria. I'm going to hit the eject button to a certain percentage because I know that's going to benefit my position. So having the ability to do that, whether it's with tools or without, is the nature of the best performance across any, across any asset. Whether it's crypto, whether it's, you know, equities, whether it's bonds or whether it's, you know, real estate, all of those things, you know, you, you need some level of tools and philosophical commitment to go the opposite direction and.
- [40:28]
B
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Yeah, and that's, that's the hard part. And I, you know, let's talk about a market that is. There's a few markets like that right now in the crypto space. I'd say the NFT markets at all time lows.
- [40:39]
A
I think NFTs are amazing. They've been done great.
- [40:44]
B
Well, here's the thing I'll say about the NFT market. If, if we're right about Ethereum, right. How much wealth is going to be created in the hands of ETH holders and most of the most significant projects, the projects that we admire the most from nft, you know, OG perspective, they're all on Ethereum. That's going to catch some of that money. I'm just telling you it's too easy. If somebody's been sitting on Ethereum for five years and they pump well, it seemed, it seems logical that they're going to spend the money in, in the easiest ways to not only wrap good NFTs. Yeah, exactly.
- [41:22]
A
The good FDA, they've done well, like doodles and punks. I don't think I've ever lost value denominated in ETH. So as much as we can joke about NFTs, if you own the right ones, they've been a high beta, never losing trade against eth. If you're looking to compound well and.
- [41:39]
B
You have crazy weird companies that are supporting them now. I mean there's people, there's Wall street based public companies that have pudgy penguins on penguin.
- [41:48]
A
Apparently he has a pudgy shirt all the time.
- [41:51]
B
Yeah, well now there's a NASCAR that has a pudgy penguin on it. They launched a game this weekend that me and my kids have been playing. And it's exceptionally high quality. Like you play the game and you tell me if it's not one of the best mobile games that you've ever played.
- [42:04]
A
I've heard that.
- [42:05]
B
And so what's cool about this is like, that's real world branding and marketing coming to life from an NFT project that may turn it into the. I mean this is very, very speculative and exceptionally generous in application of the analogy. But we could be looking at the next Mickey Mouse that's created by a community, right, that becomes an animated character that peripherates through v film, TV, through culture. Right. And if that happens, those NFTs, I, to, to your point, I think they have exceptional upside. There's such a limited quantity of them.
- [42:43]
C
Well, we're going to get, you know, NFT ETFs at some point. I mean, you know, I don't know if it's Vaneck or Bitwise or something, but yeah, they have, they had a pudgy penguin that was, you know, ringing the bell at the, the, the nysc.
- [42:57]
A
Hey, can I point something out that just happened that's really weird. Sorry to interrupt, but the stock market opened. There's the SPX below support, but at the exact same time Bitcoin popped 111.
- [43:13]
B
Yeah, inverse gap fill. That's an inverse proportion as, as we.
- [43:19]
C
Were saying as it relates to volatility and gamification. There you go.
- [43:25]
A
Not, not trading like a, not trading like an asset that's married to one another.
- [43:32]
C
Well, here, here's the thing, right? So we just came off the Labor Day weekend, right? For all intents and purposes, today is the ending. Sell in May and go away. Right? All the traders are back. Everybody's back at their seats in front of their screens. There is no 40% this morning.
- [43:53]
B
Everywhere in the country.
- [43:56]
C
Everybody's there. So yeah, it's just whether you like it or not, Bitcoin first and now to some degree, Ethereum are going to be, you know, Wall Street, Wall street attached assets. They're just going to be in terms of price action and so act accordingly. Right, like act accordingly. So we shouldn't have changed the, the name of this podcast, you know, beat Bitcoin.
- [44:25]
A
I think we're at a 110 thing. Let's hey, change the title. We'll change it for viewbacks. That's what we'll do. It's a thing.
- [44:34]
C
Well, think about this, right? So again, let's talk about Arch Public. If you're using Arch Public tools today. Right. So you would have had the ability to catch 107 depending on your settings. Right. You're working with one of our concierge program teams. You say, you know what, I want to tighten everything. I want it to buy at 1 1/2% down and I want to sell at 3% up. Right. You're looking at those numbers and you have the opportunity to catch a low inside of an hour and then maybe you're selling off just a small piece of that when it pops at the Open today, you have the tools to be able to do that. You can walk into the Arch public warehouse and it is a warehouse and you can have setups associated with just about anything. And so that when something like this happens, you have the ability to, to capitalize on it and not miss it. Right. Like it's cool to talk about it on this podcast and then look at Trading View and be like, holy smokes, this thing. A couple of green candles just went bizarro world. That's neat. Or you can be using tools that say, listen, it's neat, but I benefited from it in a meaningful way and I have options now to be able to take a new position, to take yield and turning into, into something else as well.
- [45:56]
B
I'd say most of the customers that I talk to and interface with, they have like a 2 to 1 bull bias. So when, when the trigger event on the sell side is, they're only selling half of what they had entered into on the buy side, that, that creates accumulation strategy, a very intelligent DCA curve like we were talking about. But when the upside trigger events do take place, that's that yield generation potential that you're harvesting. And if the upside pops don't happen, it doesn't. Nothing happens. You, you have the line in the water, you've set the parameters, you know exactly what needs to take place in order for that triggered event. And now it's set it and forget it. To Andrew's point, if you layer all of those, if you just create an infinite number of instances that you consider to be what you want when you want to buy, you can set it and forget it and just wait for the market conditions to meet one of those instances and then that trigger event takes place.
- [46:56]
C
A couple of announcements to a reminder that we're available on Coinbase, Kraken and Gemini now. And then another reminder that Coinbase News is official.
- [47:07]
B
Yeah, Coinbase is official.
- [47:09]
C
Yeah, it is official. And so we've also added a couple of additional symbols. We've added Doge As a symbol that can be used with all of our tools. We've added flare that can also be used with all of our tools. So now you're talking about the better part of maybe, I don't know, 8, 9, 10 symbols that we cover. Bitcoin, Ethereum, XRP, Solana, Sui, Doge, flare. I probably forgotten one, you know. Yeah, there you go, the second biggest one. So, so you know, the ability, what we're seeing, you know, a lot of our customers are having conversations about, listen, I want to increase my bitcoin stack, but we've got a big XRP community. I want to increase my XRP stack and their ability to, to, you know, farm Sui and Solana volatility and turn that into a significant longer hold position with Bitcoin. And let's say XRP is really extraordinary. I mean, it is really extraordinary. And they're able to do it across a couple different exchanges too. So they're not having to meaningfully move huge amounts of assets from one exchange or another. We've got, you know, exchange coverage now across the, across a bunch of them that people already have capital on. Right.
- [48:25]
B
Well let's, that, let's break that down a little bit more. Andrew, like most of the people that do what Andrew's talking about, they don't believe in sui. They're not trading Sui.
- [48:37]
A
How dare you.
- [48:38]
B
Because they. Well, I'm not saying that sue is a bad trade. I, I wish I'd gotten in when was pumping it, you know. But here, here's the reality. They're, they're using volatility across whatever your asset is volatile. Who cares? You see what I'm saying? Like if bitcoin's not volatile today, something else else is. If XRP isn't volatile volatile today, something else is. So by them setting up instances across all the symbols, they're just getting the volatility that is available to trade for that day. And if you create a one to one buy to sell ratio, then you're not left with position in whatever asset you're trading. You're not left with an accumulation strategy. You're left with cash yield. You're left with the percentage move that you've been able to capture as a byproduct of that movement and that's yield. And you can, to Andrew's point, then reapply that into an investment strategy. You can keep it to trade higher volumes. It's completely at your discretion, but it does allow you to the opportunity to take gains and turn them into more gains, which is that compounding effect that we, we were talking about earlier, according.
- [49:52]
A
To Zoots, it is pronounced sweet.
- [49:54]
B
Sweet.
- [49:55]
C
Yeah. There's. We. We get suing sweet from a whole host of folks. Another thing that, that, you know, needs to be mentioned. And we've been, you know, on this podcast with you, Scott, for, let's call it a year and a half now, and we've been doing what it is that we do at Arch Public for almost five years. We've got tens of thousands of customers now that have signed up to use our products, you know, join us and use our free product. Right. If you have a question, if you're skeptical, if you want to understand our customer service and all those things, use our free product. Use our free product forever. And now, again, across multiple exchanges, multiple symbols, you have the ability to say, you know what, I'm going to put thousand bucks on Coinbase, use this with, you know, Doge and whatever, and see if it does what they say it does, and it will do what we say it does. And then it's just a question of, okay, how do I leverage these tools to benefit in a market that offers me significant volatility that I can turn into to real money? And so, yeah, the most valuable thing.
- [51:06]
B
That we can offer you is, is a free access to the full unlocked version. And that is what we've given. There is no symbol restriction. There's. There's nothing that keeps you from using this tool exactly the way we've talked about it on this show. Setting up multiple instances across multiple symbols, harvesting the volatility, doing investment strategies from an accumulation perspective. All that is available under the free version.
- [51:32]
A
Hey, I had an idea. Can we do a video? Maybe. Can we. I don't want to give away the secret sauce, but could we do a produced video or hear on actually setting it up and showing people? Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
- [51:43]
B
Well, I was gonna lead into that.
- [51:44]
A
We never done that. We talked about it.
- [51:47]
C
We have.
- [51:47]
B
But honestly, Scott, most people don't take the time to watch produced videos anymore. Some people do. But what we can offer you right now, before we even produce video done, is we've got a team of customer service people that love to educate people on the software. They. I don't. They don't care if you're a free user forever. They will spend the time to get you to a place where you're up and running and you feel like you have control of the reins and that you're commanding the show. If you get to that point and it's not for you, I Promise you you will have found the exercise beneficial and you will have seen tools that you have not been exposed to before for. And that's really what our value proposition is. We're going to go first, we're going to give you value at no cost to you and we're going to serve you exceptionally well in that process so that you can actually, you know, benefit from it. And if you choose to upgrade to our concierge. And the only difference between our free version and the concierge is that in the software we have hard coded different tiers of capital that can be pushed through the software on an annualized basis. And so it just allows you to trade more. So if you're somebody who's looking to trade less than $1,000 a month, the free product is yours forever. And it will automatically allow you to reset that, that threshold on an annualized basis. And we'd love to serve you and get you up and running.
- [53:08]
A
Yeah, I want to bring up the most important chart of the day before I let you guys go because this one blew my mind. And I think it's highly relevant to the conversation. There's the percentage of adults 18 to 64 have sex weekly or more and it's down to 37%. It was 55% in the 90s. Is this because so many people are using arch public that they are having so much fun they don't do sex anymore?
- [53:29]
B
No, it would be the opposite. They would have a lot more time on their hands and idle hands of the devil's workshop. So it would have been. In fact, I bet you if you overlay this chart to the obesity chart, you'd find the answer.
- [53:41]
A
That's exactly what my wife said when she saw it. Yeah. And social media. Yeah, the rise of social media and, and, and free online porn. Let's not forget that.
- [53:52]
B
Probably that as well. Those are three major movers.
- [53:56]
A
Well, given.
- [53:58]
C
Given that I generally resemble a pudgy penguin. I'm with Tillman on that obesity issue. You know, that makes sense. You know, that makes it.
- [54:07]
A
Oh my God. 37%. That's a pretty low number.
- [54:11]
C
That is a pretty low.
- [54:12]
A
18 to 64. This isn't like. Yeah, yeah, wow.
- [54:16]
C
This isn't like 60 year olds.
- [54:18]
A
Just let you know how awesome the 90s were. I bet if you went that took that chart back to like 1960s, it would be like 80, 89 with no such.
- [54:28]
C
They didn't have anything else to do. They didn't even have cable tv. I mean, what else did you do?
- [54:34]
A
Yeah, free Love, man. All right, guys, now let me find the actual website I wanted to show you. Here it is. Once again, Arch Public. Go try it out. Make a call. Talk to those amazing customer service guys. They're dying to talk to you. Just dying, like literally waiting by the phone right now, like the Jerry Lewis hotline and they call in.
- [54:55]
B
Our team is the most proud thing I look at in our company. Our software is incredible, and I don't think there's anybody out there that's delivering that value. But the hands on customer service experience is what I hear about the most. Our team is incredible on that front. And if you couple that experience and that value from a transfer of knowledge perspective with the software, we don't have unhappy people. Everybody loves and they get. They're able to get what they want out of our program, which is the most important thing. We want to meet you where you are.
- [55:32]
A
Yeah, well, you said that there would be a tool that you would enjoy using that you've never used before. And it's a. Sounds like that's also the case for all of the men in America based on the recession of sex that we saw before. Guys, check out Arch Public and we will be back next week. It's. I don't even know what else to say. I'm out of here. Bye, guys. Have a good one.
- [55:54]
B
See you guys. Let's do. That's dope.