← The Wolf Of All Streets
The Wolf Of All Streets
EXCLUSIVE: Pro Bitcoin Democrat Running For California Gov | CryptoTownHall
01:21:03
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- [00:02]
A
Good morning everybody. Welcome to Crypto Town hall every weekday here on X at 10:15am Eastern Standard Time. Good to see a lot of extra people in the audience today obviously for the mass announcement from Dennis Porter as it says above in the title. To be clear, we don't know what the announcement is. We've given him the platform to share and that will happen later in the show as he's on the west coast and will be joining. I know that there will be others joining with him. I just do not yet know who those people will be. But there is a lot to dig into on the show ahead of that massive announcement. Seems like we're getting stories left and right today. This is one of those days where there's just been a ton. We've got Fold selecting Stripe and Visa to power their new fold. Bitcoin crypto credit card. Another huge one. I don't know. Dave, did you see that? This just dropped literally a few minutes ago. 1.3 trillion Morgan Stanley to let E Trade clients trade Bitcoin in the first half of 2026. So that's obviously another huge announcement and then some pretty wild comments as well from Senator Atkins. These are just a few of the stories that hit. Senator, Senator, Senator. Sorry, SEC Chairman Atkinson. Senator from the great state of. Not a Senator saying that he will introduce an innovation exemption by year end letting crypto firms launch products without quote, unquote, burdensome rules. How those burdensome regulators and their rules.
- [01:36]
B
Well, I mean it's funny. Well, two things. First, the Morgan Stanley quote news unquote is basically they made that, that announcement quite some time ago. It was in winter, I think, you know, post election. They announced they would be doing it. And so this is basically to sharpening their pencil on their timeline. I mean, yeah, look, if you don't understand what happens to an asset class when literally tens of thousands of financial advisors can all of a sudden make a profit from making a recommendation versus not, then you're not paying attention to the history of Wall Street. So if you don't understand how big of a deal it is for bitcoin in terms of gaining its mass adoption as an alternative to gold, think of it this way. The entirety of Wall street will now have the ability to make money recommending spot bitcoin and self custody where they can't make a dime from recommending gold. Where do you think they're going to be channeling people? I mean, look, whether you agree or not agree, you can talk about gold bugs, but you talk to people, follow the money is kind of important. And if you don't understand that's what's going to be developing over the next two or three years, you're literally asleep at the switch. And so you can say whatever you want to say. That's just a simple fact. And we've seen it throughout history way too many times. And there's lots of other stuff that can be talked about as far as Paul Atkins is concerned. Look, there's a roundtable next Monday. I actually have just put the finishing touches on a comment letter that Ian and I are writing to it because we have very good data that shows that crypto markets handled well, function better than equity markets for institutions. That's a really strong statement. And the reason for it is because the lack of really dumb prescriptive regulations that we've allowed to grow up in the equity markets. Now, for those who don't know, I've been involved on pretty much every industry committee that's ever existed in terms of market structure for the equity markets. I'm very friendly with all the people who deal with it. It is literally what you get when every firm lobbies for new rules. And you have exchanges and all these for profit entities in addition to all of the firms that want barriers to entry against competition to create rules. I mean, if you don't know how equities work, you have organized, you have regulated tick sizes, you have regulated fees, you have this regulation that forces you to send orders to some to an exchange that displays a quote, even if it's for an infinitesimal size. And you have very good reason to believe it's no longer there. All this stuff is true. It makes it very complicated. Lots of message traffic, enormous costs involved in all of the high frequency trading that goes on. And Paul Atkins was the person who wrote the dissent against that rule. So when he says what he's saying, he's essentially saying, listen, we understand that surveillance is good. And anybody who saw what happened on Sunday night or Monday morning should understand that having surveillance to know that if people are going to try manipulation, we would kind of like to have a regulator to, you know, to understand was it really manipulation? That's different. And basically that's what he's saying is disclosure and surveillance is good, prescriptive rules are bad. Anyway, that's my monologue for this morning. Sorry, Scott. That's a good one.
- [05:06]
A
So I think it just speaks to the general regulatory environment. And once again, the SEC is sharpening their pencils here and reasserting that they will deliver on the promises of deregulation from before. There's also a joint SEC CFDC task force or meeting that is coming imminently. That was in the news today as well. And you made the point yesterday when talking about the leverage flush of this weekend yield. Leverage flush of two days ago. That was the big topic. The fact that even if that had happened in the United States, the SEC would have effectively been regulating one market while the CFTC would have been regulating another. They may not have even been able to figure out who was be who was manipulating the market on both sides of that trade.
- [05:53]
B
No, we know this through history. I mean, look, the flash crash in 2010, do you realize how long it took them to come to some conclusions? And they came to like an idiotic conclusion that some idiot mother's basement triggered it. Which is complete bullshit. I mean, yeah, he potentially had some, some slight causality, but it was absurd. And the reason is because futures and equity markets are interconnected and they, they propose this thing called the CAT Consolidated Auto Trail which is massively expensive. We're now on its second iteration. It's still not fully done. They're still arguing over who's going to pay for it. And by the way, it doesn't include futures. So it wouldn't have done a damn thing in understanding the flash crash anyway. By the way, that flashcards was in 2010 for those who are tracking at home. So we're 15 years later and they still don't have it. And a large part of coordinating between the agencies is to fix that. And you can fix it without spending enormous amounts of money. In fact you have, you could fix it pretty easily, but it would require the agencies to actually cooperate or be merged because the US is the only place on the planet that has the prudential regulators for both equity futures and equities in different regulators. So it really is a kind of a clusterfuck. There's no way around it. So understand that. But you know, that's why they're having these because Paul gets it and his head of trading and markets, Jamie Selway absolutely gets it. Oh, by the way, I've talked to Carolyn Pham and she gets it. She's the interim chair of the cftc. And my guess is if Kintenz isn't going to be, because I don't know, I don't know Brian, but I suspect he understands it. My suspicion is is anybody that's appointed to that will understand that as well. So it is, it is interesting, but his announcement is actually extremely important because it means that Lots of companies will be able to innovate and offer things. And so watch this space is. That's yet another thing that's not priced in.
- [07:43]
A
So we can go in any direction here. Obviously we could have a conversation about the market, which I think is always a good sort of place setting here. What we're looking at. Andre, you got your buddy Matt Hogan out there always with the amazing hot takes from Bitwise, saying that, you know, in the next year he thinks that crypto owned by publicly traded companies will double, obviously making some large predictions about price. Where do people think we stand right now with the market after that flush that we just discussed? Andrew, if you're up, you can go ahead and then, Andre, I'd love to hear your. Your thoughts.
- [08:20]
C
Yes, sure.
- [08:22]
A
Yeah, I just wanted to.
- [08:23]
C
You want to go first, a couple.
- [08:25]
D
Of thoughts on top of.
- [08:26]
A
Go ahead, Andrew.
- [08:27]
D
Yeah, just real quickly on top of what Dave had to say. The SEC has never in their history moved at the pace that they're moving right now. Like, this is historic speed for the sec. Like, absolutely historic speed. And it's coming on the heels of historic sort of knuckle dragging by Gary Gensler. So pay attention to what's happening with the regulatory bodies because the pace and speed at which they're going is extraordinary and they're trying to keep up with innovation. And again, that innovation has been pressed by crypto across financial markets. So the way that financial markets are going to move and shift and be shaped over the next, let's call it 18 to 36 months, will also be historic. Given that we'll have 24, seven trading, all sorts of stuff is going to move and change. The SEC is trying to keep up with what they know is innovation that's coming to all markets. So one, kudos to them and kudos to Paul Atkins. But just be aware that this is not normal for regulatory bodies. And the fact that the SEC is moving so fast, as fast as it frankly, actually can, is a credit to the work being done by crypto and some of the bodies associated with having conversations with regulatory folks in the crypto lobbies, let's call it. And then at the same time, those that persevered through the previous four years and, you know, stayed afloat to get to this moment. It is a historic moment. The pace and speed at which just the SEC is moving as, as I've never seen it happen before. Never.
- [10:26]
A
And Andre, before we jump to you and go to the market, since Andrew kind of kept that can of worms open and we do have Ron, I mean, Ron, obviously you're always on top of what's happening on Capitol Hill with policy and regulators. Is this just more of the same? Basically? A reiteration from the sec. Is there anything new here in your mind?
- [10:48]
E
I think Dave talked about it a little bit. There are some rumors going around about what's happening more at the cftc. They're doing very similar to the SEC with their crypto Sprint and taking feedback and such, but obviously they are very significantly limited with only having one commissioner with Fam there right now. Now, and Brian Quintenza's nomination still really up in the air. What's happening over there. And there's still four other commissioner slots that have to be filled. So it's a little bit mess to some of the rumors going around is that there might be an effort to merge the two agencies, as Dave was alluding to, because it is very different in the United States compared to the.
- [11:22]
B
Rest of the world.
- [11:23]
E
But of course, politically that's going to be run to a bunch of issues. If that is a direction that the rumors end up being too, wouldn't you.
- [11:30]
A
Think they would go with a joint task force or something? You know that and just kind of without consolidating the two agencies?
- [11:37]
E
Well, well, there kind of have been plenty of these task force before. So that's the other thing. It's like there are plenty of working groups, task forces. There's so many of them at this point. But at the same time, I mean, it does make political sense to combine them too. But there's a bunch of political hurdles if that were to be.
- [11:49]
B
Ron, I think it's worth telling the audience. There's a lot of non US people here. The reason is money. Let's call it. Let's call it what it is. There's the re. Being on the Agriculture Committee means that you have oversight of the CFTC and that means all the financial firms are become donors to your campaigns. Being on the Finance Committee obviously oversees the sec and once again, same financial firms, same donors. So right now you have two honeypots. And bringing into one honeypot means a whole pile of senators and Congress people would lose that donor base because they no longer would have the, quote, power over that industry. And while that is the absolute in any objective sense worst possible reason for leaving two agencies separate that should obviously be combined. It is, however, the single most important reason because money talks of bullshit walks in Washington. I wish it wasn't the case, but it is the case. We had a lot of cynical bitcoiners who understand this kind of intuitively. But I think it's worth explaining that. I mean, I know you agree with me.
- [12:56]
E
Yeah, 100%. And I think the other dynamic that is the X factor in everything here these days in politics is Donald Trump. And if he puts his weight making this happen. And he has weighed in crypto politics several times. So, you know, this is always something that, you know, folks need to think about different than most administrations. To your point though, Dave, you know, there's a lot of money and invested interest though. So I'm sure they push back again if these rumors were to be true. And again, I'm really just like pushing back like we don't know. But at the end of the day, it does make sense and Trump could have a way here. But it's kind of funny that this soybean regulator is that important to the administration to be even holding up the nomination at this point. So we'll just have to wait and see.
- [13:34]
A
Yeah, it seemed like Quintenz was a shoe in. I mean, he was a darling of the last administration and he's been around, so it's very surprising not to see him being confirmed quickly. But, Ron, you know, just since we have you a couple other questions, obviously we kind of get the market structure update on a regular basis here. Has anything changed on that front? And then the other kind of news in this realm was the letter from a number of Republicans to the SEC to basically kick. Give him a kick in the butt to get Donald Trump's executive order on retirement accounts in action here.
- [14:13]
F
Yeah.
- [14:13]
E
So at least in the market structure front, we are. There's two big things to look at. So literally a week from today is the rumored markup, the vote in the BAM Committee on their half of the market structure bill. The problem is that we haven't seen the other half of the market structure bill that's in the Senate Agriculture Committee, hence why there's two committees involved, because there's two different regulators, to Dave's point of the whole issue with some of these policies and going through financing such. But overall, we've seen at least the shutdown, probably the main factor here. The shutdown for the government is slated to be this week from today as well. So we can likely see a delay on that markup. It's unofficial, we still are waiting for the notice, but we could see a delay on the market structure bill vote maybe more into October given the shutdown drama. And it seems like we are barreling towards shutdown. Both camps, Republican and Democrat, are really digging their heels. We'll see what the Democrats say after they meet with Trump later this week. But overall, as you watch the shutdown, it seems like it's barreling that direction. That's going to probably delay market structure. And then to your point, on the regulatory side, there's still a lot of things going on, especially with the 401k letter you were talking about earlier. There's been pressure to more price and clear guidance on that front. Again, to your point, it seems like to Andrew's point, they're blitzing through, at least at the sec. And finally, just to focus more on the policy news front here, we do have the big Coin center dinner coming up on Thursday and sometimes that's been used to make announcements from the SEC or cftc. And Hester Purse is speaking again. So I look towards Thursday night. Maybe we'll see some developments there or some news. Kind of what Agnes was saying earlier, that's really good.
- [15:44]
A
Alpha, go ahead, Tony.
- [15:46]
G
Yeah, I actually spoke to Con, interviewed.
- [15:49]
B
Congressman Tom Emmer just last week and you know, kind of pushed been on the timeline for the market structure and it seems this is going to happen probably till December.
- [15:58]
G
Honestly, it's going to push through. As Ron mentioned, you got the government.
- [16:01]
B
Shutdown and all these things and we.
- [16:03]
G
Know how slow Congress can move. So realistically it looks like towards the end of Q4 they will have this bill passed. I'll be speaking to or interviewing Commissioner.
- [16:12]
B
Hester Purce tomorrow in person. So I'll be sure to follow up on some of these big news items.
- [16:17]
G
It's exciting to see how fast the agencies are moving and but to Ron's.
- [16:22]
B
Point though, it's kind of weird what's.
- [16:24]
G
Happening at the cftc.
- [16:25]
B
And a bit concerning that, there's no commissioners, they're just one who's the acting chair. So hopefully they get that resolved soon.
- [16:32]
A
Ron, here's a question. How far down the road can they kick the can before it becomes full midterm season and this ceases to be a priority at all?
- [16:42]
E
You know, at least in D.C. world, it tends to be kind of spring. Late spring is when folks kind of decided to pack it up and focus solely on the November election. So that's usually when folks look at that. So even if we kind of bleed into January and February potentially, I'm not too concerned. But again, it is whatever comes out of the Senate and gets voted on has to go back to the House because it will be different from what the House passed, which is clarity, it seems like. So that's just another X factor here. And then finally again when Trump does get involved, because he will, he got involved in genius act. I'm sure that will bring other dynamics into play on that front. So there's me a lot of drama with this bill. I'm sure we'll see the Credit card competition act amendments come back again. That's more on interchange fees and credit cards. But yeah, there's a lot of drama. It's crypto and politics and we combine the two together, it's never boring.
- [17:31]
A
Let's ship back to the market side. Andre, I had you queued up. So what are you thinking right now as far as where we stand?
- [17:39]
C
So one of the key questions, I mean we've seen these huge long liquidations yesterday, right. And we've seen big outflows as well, right. From ETFs. We've seen one of the biggest daily net outflows since I think eight weeks. Right. Since two months. And so question is, of course the sentiment already oversold, right. Is it excessively bearish? I think we still might have some more downside because at least based on our own crypto Asset sentiment index, it hasn't really flashed a contrarian buying signal yet. But it looks more and more bearish. So it looks more and more attractive from a risk reward.
- [18:21]
B
Right.
- [18:21]
C
But I think a bigger question is how do you make sense of all of these intermarket divergences?
- [18:28]
B
Right.
- [18:28]
C
We've seen continued all time highs in the S P500. We've seen continued new all time highs in gold. Right. But bitcoin seems to be lagging. Right. And I think how to make sense of all of this?
- [18:43]
B
Right.
- [18:43]
C
I think it has to do with the fact that Bitcoin appears to be more sensitive to changes in global growth expectations, while the S and P tends to be more sensitive to monetary policy right now. Right. It tends to change all the time, all these macro factors. But if you look at how these divergences have dissolved in the past, it usually it tends. So bitcoin tends to follow the S&P 500 higher, right. Some people say like our Bitcoin's like the canary in the liquidity coal mine. Right. It's like the best barometer of liquidity, which is true. Right. But in these cases where you've seen like new all time highs in the S P500 and where Bitcoin was lagging, it usually, yeah, dissolved in favor of like new all time highs and bitcoin rallying. So I'm actually quite optimistic that that bitcoin will follow suit. And I, we've talked about the reasons why probably thousands of times. Right. We've seen Fed rate cuts. It implies an acceleration in global money supply growth and US money supply growth in particular.
- [19:52]
B
Right.
- [19:53]
C
Yield curve steepening and so on. Rising inflation expectations, declining real yields. So I think like the macro picture itself is very, very bullish. And yeah, I think what could lead to this kind of fomoing in of investors into Bitcoin is probably a spike in the ism. Because yeah, as I've said like bitcoin tends to be more sensitive to global growth expectations and that should spike upwards. If you see this kind of spike in the ism. And I think what's, what's already pointing towards the scenarios earnings revisions.
- [20:31]
B
Right.
- [20:31]
C
You see these huge upwards positive earnings revisions, right. And they tend to lead the ISM manufacturing index. So I think yeah, it's just a matter of time before bitcoin starts rallying again. My view.
- [20:47]
A
Yeah, Kobe See letter had a great tweet yesterday that speaks to this confusion across markets. Here's what it said. Current situation. Number one, stocks are rising like the US economy is soaring. Two, oil prices are falling like we're entering a recession. Three, gold rising like the Fed is cutting rates into inflation. Four, Bitcoin is falling like Fed rate cuts are postponed. Five, home prices are rising like more rate cuts are coming. Six, treasury yields are rising like stagflation has arrived. I haven't actually checked the 10 year today but Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. Yeah, okay, good, finally because Wednesday, Thursday, Friday and Monday, all four days that it was trading basically since the Fed cut rates, it was rising.
- [21:28]
C
Yeah, it was rising but like the overall trend was is down over the past couple of months.
- [21:32]
B
Right.
- [21:34]
A
So yeah, but speaks to the fact that it was anticipated and dropping and then they make the actual cut and things go up. Which has to have your spidey senses tingling after seeing what happened last year when they cut rates and obviously it did not have much effect on Treasuries. Dave obviously can jump in anytime you there Dave? Can you guys hear Dave? I cannot hear Dave.
- [21:59]
B
No. Nope.
- [22:03]
A
Dave, just drop and we'll obviously bring you, bring you back up. So anyone else market thoughts specifically on where we stand at the moment?
- [22:13]
B
Yeah, I'd like to share some thoughts. Yeah, so I think since the tariff crash for all markets early in the year, I think the timeline has been pushed back. I know people are getting a bit antsy, you know, September, October and so forth. But if you look at what took place in the summer, usually it's selling may go away but we actually had some rallies over the summer. Right. So I think the pullback we're seeing is healthy bears are pretty much in control on the weekly bitcoin chart. So I think we're going to bottom out. Sentiment may go back to fear and then we'll start ripping again. It's, it's just cyclical and I think just the timeline has been pushed back. So I know people are wondering their four year cycle has been broken. I don't think it's just what happened at the beginning of the year is impacting the timeline now. Can you hear me? Yeah, can you hear me?
- [23:05]
A
Yes, I can.
- [23:05]
B
Yep. Yeah, it's whatever. It's like a Sprint commercial. Yeah, yeah, it's whatever. I, I've lost whatever. Anyway, three points now, 0.1. As far as fixed income though, the 10 year, you got to zoom out a bit once. If you look at the yield from the period of time before it became virtual lock, there was going to be rate cuts in September AKA the announcement of the revision down in employment. Until now the yield is lower, it was at 4:2 to 4:3. It's now a little bit below that. So you know, you have to understand it was well telegraphed. So the fact that it moved its sell on the news, it's, it's not the same thing. This was not a surprise, whereas that 50 basis point move was a surprise and people reacted to it. So the reaction to the cut was already normalized in. So I think that's a non event, it's not a big deal. But what will happen in the future, we'll see it. Juries out Second, as far as technicals go, the last time we saw a chart pattern of a major flush with virtually no volatility after regaining 50% of the flush. This has happened twice before. For those I'll let the sleuths go into it but I can tell you in both cases it was very bullish because you're seeing the inflows meeting demand and eventually the people who sold end up getting fomo, blah blah, blah blah lot. So we all know where that's going to go. Doesn't mean it's going to happen. When I say bullish, I mean six weeks later, not, not six days later, not six hours later. So just understand that as far as this four year cycle nonsense goes, the four year cycle, there's a political four year cycle but we've had the S P or other asset classes have not had four year cycles, they have cycles bitcoin had a four year cycle because it used to be that the single biggest demand drive supply driver was mining. It no longer is. It's not even close. Mining is now probably less than 5%, 10% of the supply that's being sold into new demand. So to hold on to these sort of cycles, three of them, I mean three, not 30, but three to me is silly. Doesn't mean there can't be echoes of it. Doesn't mean no one will care. But it does mean that you can't really, you shouldn't be relying on that on a technical basis because if you do you could literally miss what will be the next big move.
- [25:37]
A
Brian.
- [25:41]
H
I've been tracking, you know, mining profitability and been doing forward projections based on mining profitability and hardware changes since 12 years ago. So in 2023 I put together a forward projection based on September's numbers. I had 70,000 for September 2024. We were right within the bounds. I had 122 for September 2025. Once again I think right in the bounds. But just what Dave was saying, my numbers are actually breaking out of the four year cycle because 2026 I have at 204 for September now whether it sticks inside my model or not. But the last three years have been pretty good. So I do see us kind of breaking out in September 2026 is different. Normally we'd have a pullback here.
- [26:37]
A
How do you model all this? There's a proprietary and super secret.
- [26:42]
H
I mean it's based on hardware profitability so hardware efficiency. And then we assume that cost of power is pretty static. There's only so far down you can go with your cost of power and then your opex and then we model out a consistent difficulty increase. So we just assume that we can only pump out hardware so fast and it can only make so many increases in optimizations around hardware and then we kind of have a solid barrier of, you know, how far down we can drive our OpEx. So we just kind of model it out. So I have a, an optimistic model, a really optimistic model and an insanely optimistic model and we've actually been tracking right along the really optimistic model for the last three years.
- [27:35]
A
Really optimistic sounds good.
- [27:38]
B
Remain that way.
- [27:39]
A
I love it. Mark, you jumped up. You have requested to speech. You have any specific comments?
- [27:45]
F
I, I don't, I apologize for, for.
- [27:48]
C
Jumping in and, and hitting the mic. I just joined so let me, let me and I'll come back in a second. Thanks.
- [27:57]
A
No problem. And we're, we're getting Ready to get Dennis up on stage within the next five, ten minutes. So just so people know that that announcement is coming, we're just waiting for it all to come together in the background as we can continue to run the main show here. Tony, I just saw your mic lifted. Do you have a comment?
- [28:17]
B
Actually, it didn't. I don't know.
- [28:19]
A
Yeah, it's the glitchiest platform ever to anyone who's in the audience. And if you've never run a Twitter spaces, man, you guys have no idea. Nothing ever works on this platform at all. So Dave, what direction do you think we should head here? We got probably about 10 more minutes.
- [28:42]
B
Well, I mean we've covered the main things. It's really, everyone cares about the markets. The only other thing I'll say, just as a parenthetical side note, if you're expecting volatility, if you want to hear what one of the biggest seasonality effects that exist, at least in traditional markets today is Rosh Hashanah, which is the first day of the Jewish high holy day periods. That means in 10 days we have Yom Kippur, which is the Jewish high holy days. And if you don't understand a simple fact of asset management, one very good rule of thumb is that it's not until after Yom Kippur that many, many fund managers start their year end rejiggering of their portfolios. A lot of funds have fiscal year ends at the end of October and even the ones that are are yearly they start their their pre positioning. That's one of the reasons that October is often a volatile period. But if you're expecting fireworks before then, I mean it can happen because you know, crypto is dances to its own drum. But in financial markets it tends to be the calm before the storm these 10 days. So just take that with a grain of salt because as you probably tell, I'm pretty skeptical of most seasonality things. But if that one does tend to matter. And so if you're expecting us that volatility to break out. And by the way, volatility is so freaking low now, it's actually, it's crazy. Despite that liquidity flush, take a look at the 30 and 60 day volatility on Bitbo of bitcoin. And it's bouncing right around bottoms. That generally is something that the longer that goes, the more the next big move will happen. So we'll see. But I'm curious what people think.
- [30:25]
C
I think Jeff park had a similar observation.
- [30:28]
B
Right. Jeff is a brilliant dude.
- [30:32]
A
I've almost had to blacklist him from shows because he makes me sound so dumb and I never know what question to ask next.
- [30:39]
B
Jeff is. Jeff is a smart guy and we obviously see markets through a similar lens. But yeah, I mean, it's one of those things that people trying to understand financial markets, it all boils down to supply and demand. And we keep saying. Everyone keeps saying, who's selling. Like we had a spaces yesterday where we had a healthy debate between me and a couple of other people, different versions of it, on whether or not there's paper, bitcoin, and the market's being suppressed. And my answer to that is no. No, this. This seems pretty, pretty basic to me. But there are a lot of people who like conspiracy theories and they want to see shadows under the bed. And, you know, sometimes they exist. I mean, certainly gold and silver markets at times have been manipulated. There have been billions and fines to prove it. But I don't think that's happening in bitcoin. Although I think the Sunday flush in all coins probably was manipulation. But, you know, who the hell knows? I mean, Bruce, I see you up here. I'm sure your answer to that is, screw it. Who cares? Let it be manipulated and the market will punish the bad people and, you know, people will figure out. Right?
- [31:44]
I
Yeah, sort of. I mean, I believe in markets. I'd rather have markets doing it than, you know, filthy thieving tyrants in Washington D.C. stealing our money and doing it. It's not like those guys are super honest. You know, the difference is they have all the guns and they have the legal ability to steal our money by force and threat of force. So, you know, the world has bad people and good people, but we're not just going to magically make all the bad people go away, but what we can do is, is starve them of stealing our money and giving them a monopoly on force. Force and the ability to throw people in cages over stupidity. And then, you know, you still end up with bad and dishonest people in the public markets who will, you know, do bad and dishonest things, but at least they're, you know, you have more of a choice. So, you know, all else being equal, I'd. I'd rather, you know, in a perfect world, we could just erase all bad people and we wouldn't have bad people. But that's sort of fantasy thinking, you know, second, you know, it's right up there with the fantasy idea that, oh, if we, if we just give a monopoly of power and force to these wonderful angels down in Washington D.C. who steal our money and have all the guns there. They'll be wonderful and great and, and moral and they won't, they won't harm us. And I, I think that, you know, we, we've all seen that that doesn't work. That's not the case. You know, they, you know, they don't stop the problems. Whether it's, whether it's fraud or theft or hacking or whatever they're saying that they're going to stop, you know, or if it's poverty or crime or whatever, you know, the more power we give Washington in the form of regulations, it doesn't, it doesn't solve. A lot of people have this fallacy like, oh, if we just give them a bunch of power to be tyrants and horrible and throw people in cages, they'll stop all the bad things from happening. But that's not what happens. You give them all this power and they have all of the harm and they steal our money to pay for it. And they don't stop the bad things. They empower people like Sam Bankman, Fried and Bernie Madoff, who was head of one of the largest regulators. You know, Sam had better access than anyone in our industry. Sam had unprecedented access and he was loved. And they still had bills. Two years after he went to jail, they had bills for, still floating around. His lobbying power with the money he stole from the people was so powerful that the machine just kept going. Even after he was in jail, people were still pushing for his, for his stupid laws that he was trying to push, which would have given FTX an advantage. And he had a special meeting with Gensler talking about no action Relief. So, you know, the idea that these, you know, tyrant clowns, and that's what they are, they're tyrants, they steal our money. And their only legitimacy is their ability to use force. We would never listen to these people. Nobody would ever listen to Gary Gensler or any of these clowns in the United States or elsewhere. These people like Lagarde and Jerome Powell, these people are utter clowns. They wouldn't even, they couldn't even go on this spaces. They couldn't even hold their own against any of us because they have nothing to offer. The only thing that they have to offer is the ability to throw people in jail and put people in cages because they've been empowered with this, with this invisible social contract that nobody ever signed. And they have the ability to steal our money, to have this giant machine with all the guns and all the jails behind them, and it's totally illegitimate. It's totally crazy. And yeah, I'd much rather have markets work better. And, you know, sure, we have some bad things with it, but overall, I think markets would work a lot better.
- [35:17]
B
Well, I mean, it can't argue with half of that, but there is half that I will argue with. I mean, there is very little doubt that having a certain scaffolding in the United States in terms of oversight attracted and provided confidence to investors such that if you just look at the number of companies that want to list here to access our liquidity and the amount of money that raised, and if you compare the equity culture in the US versus the equity culture in Europe, where we didn't have the same sort of regulatory clarity, in a certain sense, there are certain things, such as best execution rules, such as knowing that, you know, disclosure rules in certain cases. Now, in almost every one of the rules, they've gone over engineered and gone backwards. They've done what you're suggesting. They, you know, because you employ thousands of people to write rules, what are they going to do? Well, guess what, they're going to write rules. And sometimes they're going to write rules that aren't necessary. What's interesting is we literally today have a head of the SEC and ahead of trading in markets who would be nodding. If they were standing next to me and we were on a stage, they would say, yeah, you're right, that's exactly what's happened. Now, that's. That is a very big departure from Gary Gensler. Gary never met anything he didn't think he could control and do better than everybody else. And so, you know, conflating all of them together, that's a bit over, a bit of an overestimation. I mean, I see a bunch of people in the audience who know this, who talk to these people. I mean, Eleanor, I don't think. I can't see. You look like a listener to me. You talk to these people.
- [36:47]
A
She's a listener. I tried to invite her, but I got denied, it would seem.
- [36:50]
B
Yeah, whatever. I mean, spaces. But I'm just, you know, we don't have very much time. But I do think it's over conflation. I mean, you know, Gary, you're up here and you have a microphone. We were talking about a lot of this stuff last night. You come from the commodity markets and you've seen the differences. I mean, you know, what's your perspective, Right? You know, we had a whole big debate on your, on your spaces yesterday about this. Are you there behind the mic? Yeah, but not Clear on the perspective on what? Like. Well, I mean, in terms of related or is manipulations happen? The question is, can regulators, can they make a positive difference or is it just complete bullshit and we should just let it all roll?
- [37:32]
G
I think the markets are going to.
- [37:33]
H
To determine what happens and the politicians are irrelevant.
- [37:40]
B
Okay. That's what I believe.
- [37:42]
G
I. I think markets have a way.
- [37:44]
H
Of correcting everything if we just get out the way, especially the idiots who've.
- [37:50]
B
Never built anything.
- [38:00]
A
If we got cut off there. Bruce, were you about to say something? We're gonna go ahead, Dave.
- [38:05]
B
I was gonna say I see Dennis in the audience, but I don't know if you can bring him up.
- [38:08]
A
Dennis. And Dennis is on stage now. I know that we have 8,533 people currently waiting to hear what he has to say. So Dennis, I don't know. Do you need a couple more minutes?
- [38:21]
F
No, we can jump into it here in just a moment. I also wanted to bring Wendy up that I feel like she's definitely going to have some important things to say for the conversation as well. So I'd love to have her jump up on stage.
- [38:35]
A
She's here. I don't know if you see it. We can't always see who is and is not on stage, but she is a speaker. Half the people always show as listeners, unfortunately.
- [38:45]
F
Yeah, okay, great. Because I see. Yeah, she sees. She's still seen as a listener. So glad to have her up here for this. So I'll get going in just a moment. I have something I'd like to jump into a little bit before I jump into this announcement. Some of the big things here is that, you know, just as a little bit of a disclosure, you know, for some of you that are in this space, you know, might be hearing about me for the very first time and I want to share a little bit about my work. And then we're going to jump into this announcement. But I'm the CEO and co founder of Satoshi Action Fund, which is a nonprofit that is highly focused on. On advocating for Bitcoin. What we do is we take ideas and we turn them into law. We have passed nine bills into law in eight different states, including the first ever SBR in history. We've also been very involved in trying to protect Bitcoin rights, including the right to self custody, the right to run a node, the right to mine, the right to peer to peer transactions. But one of the things that's always been very concerning for me ever since I started working in the space, which is a Little over three years ago. Actively, of course, because I was a podcast host before. That was just the bipartisan nature of bitcoin, the non partisan nature of bitcoin. In my opinion, we are headed down a very dangerous path with the partisan nature of bitcoin. And so it's been a big mission of mine for a very, very long time to make sure that both sides work together. I mean, ultimately, I was listening in a little bit earlier, and the talks about market structure. We can't get market structure done unless we have 60 votes in the Senate. And that's going to require some Democrats coming across the aisle to work with Republicans unless Republicans plan on winning 60 seats in the Senate. And I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon. You know, I've talked a lot to a lot of Senate leaders recently. I have been very actively engaged on market structure, and I do feel hopeful that we can get something done. I think a lot of people have lost hope on market structure, but I do believe there is a way to thread the needle and I'm going to be working very aggressively. I have been already working very aggressively in D.C. something I don't talk about a lot, but I have been spending almost all of my time there over the last four months working with predominantly US Senate offices to figure out how we can thread the needle on this and really ultimately bring everyone to the table so that we can, we can address a lot of the concerns that everyone has. So this next announcement that I'm going to be going into is going to be very important for developing the framework that we need to get to a good place on bitcoin across the political aisle across the country. And so I'll go ahead and start up. And Scott, if you want to go ahead and do the next steps too.
- [41:21]
A
As well, everybody's on stage. Who needs to be on stage that you've requested? The mic is really yours. I just want to say very quickly, I appreciate, obviously you've been teasing this large announcement. We actually haven't really known what it is, you know, here as well. So looking forward to all the details alongside everyone else, but very flattered that we were able to have you join and do this here, obviously as a sizable audience and everybody's excited to hear it. So I would just say take it away.
- [41:50]
F
Thank you, Scott. And I really appreciate you hosting it. I mean, you did it really without even asking me very many details. So I really appreciate that, giving us your platform to be able to speak about this announcement. So most of you guys know me, and, you know, for those of you that hadn't I told you a little bit about my work, but for those of you that do, you know me as the guy who passes bills. I've had the honor of ushering nine pro bitcoin bills into law, including the first ever strategic bitcoin reserve in history. Despite being highly involved in bitcoin politics, I've stayed away from putting my weight behind specific candidates for a very long time, even though I am very regularly asked to do so. Well, that all changes today. I want to bring to the stage someone I've known longer than most in this space. He isn't just a colleague. I consider him a friend. More importantly, he has been a leader on bitcoin policy since before it was popular and before it was politically safe. He didn't even do it as a fringe lawmaker like we see a lot of lawmakers, you know, raising their hands to pro bitcoin policy. He did it as the former majority leader of the state of California. Very few candidates in this country have a more impeccable record of standing up for innovation, freedom, and everyday bitcoin users. But what makes him different isn't just his record. It's his character. At the height of his political career, with immense power at his fingertips, he walked away. He chose family and raising his kids over politics. That decision tells you everything you need to know about who he is and what drives him. Now he feels compelled to return to public service because he's worried about the future of California and the country, and so am I. He knows the state has drifted away from what it could be and should be. His political thesis is simple but powerful. Protect the future, stand up for everyday people, and make California California again. And, yes, show the nation that there are strong Democrats who not only understand bitcoin, but who are ready to fight for it. This is someone who started working on bitcoin legislation as far back as 2017. That's when I got into Bitcoin. Eight years ago, he was pressing the mayor of San Diego to start a bitcoin reserve, telling them that just a million dollars would make them look like geniuses and in a few years. And he would have been right if they had bought. He has always been ahead of the curve. Before many of the biggest names in politics even knew what bitcoin was. And even after leaving office, he kept working from the outside, helping to pass pro bitcoin policy, including a recent bill we worked on together, which is now awaiting a governor's signature in the state of California. I even recently took him to D.C. to meet with lawmakers, often all at the federal level. And I kid you not, the most powerful people in D.C. even the former speaker of the House, gave him a standing ovation. That's how I knew how influential he was within his own party. That's also where I realized how fortunate I was to be working with him. So on this Tuesday, we don't just launch a campaign, we launch a movement to take back California's future, to prove that leadership is about vision, courage, and sacrifice. I couldn't be prouder to stand with him as he takes this step and as he makes Bitcoin an absolute centerpiece of his race. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the former majority leader and the next governor of California, Ian Calderon. Ian, thank you so much for joining us up here on stage today. I really am so proud of the fact that you have decided to throw your hat in the ring, and the stage is yours to share your vision for the state of California.
- [45:17]
G
Well, Dennis, thank you, buddy. I mean, I don't think I need to say anything. You said everything that needed to be said, man. That was a great introduction. I really appreciate it. I want to thank everybody for your time, and I want to thank everybody for being a part of this today. Dennis gave you a little bit of my background, but way back in 2010, I decided to run for the Assembly. I'd never run for public office before. And I started a campaign. I was 25 years old, and I had a whole bunch of people telling me, you're too young. You don't have enough life experience. This isn't something that you could do. And as much as I appreciated everybody's positive feedback, I decided to move ahead and put the time in. I knocked on about a thousand doors in my district, and I won. I won my primary by about 330 votes, and then I won the general by about 60% of the vote. And I was the first millennial ever elected to the California legislature. And in 2016, I became the youngest majority leader in the history of the state of California at the age of 30. And I loved what I did. I love this state. I love everything about this state. I love living here. I'm very, very much a proud Californian. But when I ran, my message was really clear that there are decisions that were being made in Sacramento that were impacting our state and specifically my generation and future generations negatively. And I wanted to be a part of that conversation because it was important that that voice be represented. And I did that. I was Able to do that for a good amount of time. But because I was young, I got elected at 27. All my major life milestones were also while I was in the legislature, I got engaged, I got married, had my first kids. And I got to a point where I was not with my family, I was not raising my kids, and that was bothering me. And in 2020, I made the decision to leave office because I wanted to be a part of raising my kids. And I was at the height of my power. I was at the height of my influence. And I got a lot of comments, well, why would you do that? Why would you, why would you leave that? Nobody gives up power when they have it. It's because I never gave a shit about having power. That's what, that's not what was important to me. What was important to me was to be at the table representing a perspective for a generation that I thought was being completely ignored and wasn't important to the people that were making decisions in Sacramento. But I wanted to be a dad more than I wanted to be a politician. I never got into politics with the idea that I was going to be a lifetime politician. And so I left. I left to raise my kids. And for the last five years I've been living a life, wonderful life. I started a business, a successful business, and I've been working that. And I've been doing a lot of work with Dennis Contin, continually staying engaged on these, these policy issues specific to bitcoin.
- [48:08]
A
And.
- [48:09]
G
But over the last five years, I've seen life just continue to get harder and continue. You know, there's a vice and you can just feel that grip getting tighter around you every single year. And recently my wife and I, my wife Elise, who you'll get to know out on the computer campaign trail, she's really cool, really amazing. We started having these conversations like what, what is our kids future in this state? You know, when are they going to come to us and say, dad, mom, I love you guys, but we can't even move out of your house, let alone think about buying something on our own. Even though. And the state of California has pretty much told us you can, you can buy a house, you know, the greatest wealth, you know, creation vehicle in the history of California, you know, to pass on that generation of wealth, well, that doesn't exist for you. And so we don't have that. We're not going to have the ability to participate in that and we're not going to have the ability to even start a family because we can't even afford to move out. So as much as I love you guys, I got to leave. And so the thing that drove me out of the legislature the first time is now the thing that is driving me back, which is my family and my kids. I want them to have a future here. And I don't see that future here in this state. And so I'm jumping back in the race for governor. I think it's time that California has a new generation of leadership. And this issue area is going to be a huge issue area for me because California has always been a leader on forward thinking ideas. It's always been a leader on technology. And we have not been leading in this space at all. I can't tell you how frustrated I have been over the last couple of years when I've been screaming at the top of my lungs, do not ignore this community. Do not ignore these people. They care about this issue. This is their most important issue. They care about a lot of things, but this is number one for them. And if you support them, they will support you. Don't turn your back on them. And the party didn't listen. Republicans did. Republicans saw it. And Republicans was able to. Were able to step in and take advantage of the fact that this is a huge voting bloc and could see the value of being supportive of these assets and that they weren't going to go anywhere. That this is going to be the future of not just this state, but this country. Democrats couldn't see it. And that really upset me. And ever since I can remember, I've been on the front line when it comes to this issue area. Legislating since 17. Wendy. I don't know if you guys know Wendy, but she's up here and she's speaking with us. She was the very first one to interview me back in 2017 when I authored legislation to create a California blockchain working group to establish, okay, what, what is blockchain technology and how can we use it to make the state more effective and more efficient? And I've been in, I've been all in on this issue. I've been all in on bitcoin since the beginning. And I think that California's future is going to be brighter if we finally do what we should have done from the very beginning and embrace this space, embrace this community, embrace these ideas and embrace this technology and get serious about what the state of California is going to do to position itself to be a leader on bitcoin in the coming, in the coming years. And so that is my motivation as to why I'm running for governor. And. And I feel very confident and very good about my chances in being a staying top contender in this race. And so I don't want to talk forever, because that's what politicians do is they tend to get up here and they just talk a lot. I want to be able to open it up for dialogue and have people ask some questions. But I really can't thank you all enough for jumping in on this and with. With me in this race and with your support and your backing, I know that we can make California the undisputed bitcoin capital of the country.
- [51:55]
F
Absolutely. Ian, really, thank you for coming up. Really impactful words. And again, I think people need to realize what is taking place right now and why I'm so incredibly excited about what Ian is doing. And keep in mind, like I said, I do not get behind candidates. I've done it one time in my entire political career where I've really, really gotten behind a political candidate, and I have not done it since because I have a lot of other work that I need to focus on. But this race is critically important for shifting the dialogue around how both parties, but especially the Democratic Party, views bitcoin. And to have Ian be able to jump in this race and be able to make bitcoin a centerpiece of his campaign is going to shift the dialogue and is going to create a permission structure to enable more Democrats to come out in support of this technology. Just keep in mind, also, you know, Gavin Newsom, who's leaving his office to go run for president, is going to be replaced by someone who's extremely pro bitcoin, which will give potentially even Gavin Newsom's campaign, if he runs for president, the ability to speak more strongly about bitcoin, or at least feel compelled to, because his own state is heading towards the bitcoin future. One of the biggest things that you said to me, Ian, and we've known each other for years, and this is part of the reason why I feel so confident in getting behind you. A lot of candidates ask me to get behind them. A lot of candidates asked me to support them, but I don't know them. I don't. I can't trust them. But I can trust you. One of the things that you had talked a lot about was how you were even pushing the former mayor of San Diego to. To buy bitcoin. And also your. Your belief in potentially the state owning bitcoin. I don't know, maybe. Maybe you could talk a little bit more about that. Do you believe that California should establish a strategic bitcoin reserve.
- [53:40]
G
Yeah, I believe that California should be holding bitcoin on its balance sheet. So, you know, we have for all of you, I'm sure you all recognize as we have a lot of issues when it comes to climate and when it comes to wildfires. And back in 2019, we had passed this bill that created this wildfire relief fund which put, you know, there's about $21 billion in it right now, which is a combination of public dollars, along with utility dollars, industry dollars, to try to backstop the damage that are done by these massive wildfires in the state of California. California. And it's a big reason why we keep losing insurers and providers in this state is because these insurance companies, they don't want to take on the liability of knowing that this is something that's going to continue to happen in the state of California and that they don't want to have to be on the hook for it. And so this, this reserve, sorry, this, this, this fund was established so that we could try to actually.
- [54:34]
E
Help take.
- [54:35]
G
Care of the costs and rebuild communities as quickly as possible. But the big part of it is that it's just not enough money because you're looking at 10/plus billion dollars in damage when these fires occur. And so two, three major wildfires, which is not unheard of in the state of California at a time. And the fund is completely depleted. And one of the things that I talk about is that part of a new generation of leadership in California is being able to think outside the box and use the new technologies and, and new policies and a new approach to solve for some of these everyday problems. And this is where I feel like bitcoin really, really steps in and becomes something that can really help the state of California. These major issues that are so important to California voter voters and when the voters are polled, wildfire and the threat of wildfire right behind the cost of living and housing is the most important issue because people are terrified. So the state needs to find a way, a creative way to be able to bolster that fund. And I think one of the ways that we can do that is by investing that money into bitcoin. If we had back in 2019 invested that money into bitcoin, that money right now that stands at about still $21 billion would be worth over $216 billion today. If we had just done half, $108 billion today, that you could go to insurer and you could say, hey guys, look it, we have this Fund. We're going to be able to help you backstop you when and take care of some of that cost burden. When you guys. When there's a wild, there's a massive wildfire and we need to rebuild and rebuild quickly. This could be something that'll drive insurers and providers back into the state because they feel confident and comfortable that we're, that the state is going to be there to help support them and help these communities rebuild. You know, the, the actually our state pension fund just invested some money and has already has exposure now to, to bitcoin through microstrategy. It's not direct. I, I'm, I, I self custody, I hold. That's what I think the state needs to be doing. But the state is already moving closer and closer and closer to actually holding bitcoin on its balance sheet. And when I'm governor, I'm going to be make, I'm going to, I'm going to make sure that we hold bitcoin on our balance sheet because of how important I think it's going to be to the fiscal health and responsibility that we have to our voters of the state.
- [57:00]
F
Well, I'm glad, I'm gladly glad to hear you say that because one of the biggest things is we've needed bipartisan consensus on a strategic bitcoin reserve. If you, and by the way, please make sure you follow Ian. Literally he's launching his campaign with us. I tell you, I kid you not. We are very fortunate that he decided to launch the campaign with this community. That just shows you how much he cares about bitcoin and how much he cares about this space. I'm not joking. One of the major broadcasting stations, Ian can share if he wants about what it's going to happen, but they literally called him and they're like, no, you need to do it with us. You need to do it with us. That's how great of a chance he has of being an absolute front runner and actually winning and becoming the next governor of California. One of the things that you talked about, Ian, was talk, you know, protecting the right to self custody. We actually worked on that language. So when you guys. The big thing here to keep in mind is that Ian is putting his money where his mouth is. Like even outside the legislature. He was helping me meet chairs of committees and talk to people and engage those lawmakers that he has relationships with. And we got that legislation introduced. It didn't get across the finish line this year, but we are going to continue to work on it. But we did with his help, get a bill to be able to help the state actually keep digital assets in their native form in the unclaimed property fund, which is a big, big deal. People don't realize how big a deal this is, but that has actually been passed in the house and the senate and awaits a governor's signature. So even outside the legislature, even outside of his political power, he was working overtime to be able to advance good legislation. So this is not someone who is coming in here to say, hey, look at me, I like bitcoin, you know, support me. You know, I would not get behind a candidate like that. This is someone who has been working on digital asset and bitcoin legislation since 2017. That's when I got into the space this. He was working on this type of legislation and he continued to do so after giving up all of his power as the former majority leader of the state. But now he's returning because he is deeply concerned about the future. And we need to make sure and we protect the future and secure the future with bitcoin in the state of California. But Ian, you said you self custody your bitcoin yourself. Talk about how you plan to make it a priority to actually protect the right to self custody.
- [59:03]
G
Custody, yeah. So I mean, just for a little more context in terms of how important this issue is to me and, and, and you know, the significance to me of being here with all of you today on my announcement, you know, I got, I got an offer to do my announcement not today, but tomorrow with a major news media company live on their show, their morning show and you know, that viewership about three people in California. And I said no, as much as I would love to do that and I'd still love to have you be my first live on camera interview, I made a commitment to this and this is important to me and I'm going to stick with this. And they were, they were, they were pretty floored that I turned them down. They didn't think that they were going to get turned down. And it was not out of, you know, disrespect or that, that I didn't value who they are. And, and you know, what they would do, you know, how beneficial it could be to my campaign. But I made this commitment to be here and to do this announcement Tuesday and I wasn't going to back out of that. And this is, this issue is too important, this community is too important to me to have done something like that. And you know, also going back to what Dennis said about putting your money where Your mouth is. You know, back in 2022, you know, my wife and I, we wanted to buy a house for our kids because I'd left the legislature when we had sold our home in LA to move down to Orange county. And we were renting in Orange county and we wanted to buy. And you know, we kept seeing we need to make a move because the rate at which the price of housing is increasing in California, if we don't make a new, we're about to get priced out. And so we tried really hard, we tried really, really hard to find a home. And you know, in the district where we wanted our kids to go to school and, and we, we couldn't get there, unfortunately. And, and actually we were, it was even to the point where we were escrow on a house, but we had to back out because of certain circumstances. And what we ended up deciding to do is actually put all of our money that we were going to use to buy a home into bitcoin and you know, sell custody of that bitcoin. And that's what we did, and that's what we have today. And our thought process, well, maybe down the line we could use that to buy a home one day for the kids. But my wife, who's a pretty big bitcoiner herself, she's like, I don't want to sell this and I don't want to ever get rid of this. And I'm like, I agree. I want to keep it in bitcoin. I feel safe, I feel protected. And this is the only thing that's actually helping us keep up with inflation. And the only thing that we feel is going to be secure enough if, you know, quote unquote hits the fan. So we, we, we're all in and we're, we're. I'm going to protect the right to self custody because I self custody myself. And it's important for me to have that security of knowing that I have access to this at any point in time and isn't for any other reason of knowing that I have something that I can count on to be able to protect my family if things go wrong or if there's a major natural disaster or, or, you know, whatever the reason may be, this is important to me because I do it. And, and, and I know that there are a lot of other families across this state that do the same thing for the same exact reasons. And so we need to make sure that nobody, not the government, the state, no one, infringes on our rights and our ability to be able to hold in self custody our assets and our bitcoin.
- [62:36]
F
That's incredible. Ian, thank you. Really. I'm really proud of the fact that we get to work with you and to be able to work on supporting your campaign. I'll personally be donating. I know people might, might take a little while for you to get to know Ian before you feel good about supporting him financially. But I promise you, if you pay attention to his campaign, especially if you're in the state of California, you are going to want to get behind him. I wanted to ask Wendy. Wendy. The reason why I brought Wendy up or why Wendy is jumping in on this with us is because she has known Ian for a very long time and I thought it was important to give her a moment to either ask a question or maybe just say a few words about Ian.
- [63:11]
J
Wendy, thank you for having me. Congratulations, Ian, on your announcement. And as most of you know, I am born and raised in California in Los Angeles county. And a lot of people don't think California is worth saving just because of everything that's happened over the last few decades. And I do believe California is worth saving. And I'm very excited that Ian will be running for governor to bring, to bring bitcoin to California. I think there's so many possibilities and so much good that can be done to better California as a whole with bitcoin. All the innovation that can happen and just jobs and just everything, it's just, it's such a wonderful, it's just such a wonderful asset. It's completely changed my life. And yes, I have known Ian since about, I want to say 20, 2018. I interviewed him on my channel 2019 and I can say that he has been in the bitcoin space since then. Everything he's saying is accurate. He talked about AB 2658. I believe that's what the bill is. And he has been working towards different goals regarding bitcoin since then. And he's not just some candidate that's popping up that is, you know, kind of riding the, the bitcoin hype and the bitcoin train. He actually cares about bitcoin. He cares about the future of California and he's put the work in to do so. So again, congratulations, Ian. And I will be supporting this in my own capacity because again, I'm born and raised in California and I have, I have a family here. I want things to be able to be affordable. I want California to lead the United States of America in bitcoin.
- [64:41]
F
Absolutely. Yeah. So thank you for everybody who's been tuning in. You know, Ian, I know you're going to have a very busy day with a lot of different media folks. We've been getting outreach from Bloomberg, from other major large organizations, Politico that want to interview you and get time with you. We're super excited about your race and also really honored that you would launch that race here with us. You know, a lot of people in this space know that the bitcoin community and the bitcoin ecosystem has immense political weight behind it now. And, you know, I will say that I'm here to support you.
- [65:16]
A
And this for some reason. You just went muted for a second.
- [65:18]
C
Can you speak?
- [65:19]
A
Yeah, go ahead.
- [65:20]
F
Yeah, I'm back. Sorry. I'm going to be working hand in hand with a lot of other Californians to make sure that they have the time to get to know you and to understand why they should support you. So thank you again for popping up. I don't know if you have any last comments. I mean, you could take questions, but I know you're very busy, so I don't want to assume that you're going to willing to take questions from folks on stage.
- [65:41]
G
Yeah, I really, again, just want to thank everybody for your time. You know, this is, this is going to be a marathon. It's not a sprint. There are some candidates that have been in this race for almost a year. And, you know, I got a lot of catching up to do. But I feel real strong about our position. I feel real strong about our message, and I feel real strong that we're going to be on the right side of history. This is important to me. I wouldn't be doing this if it wasn't important to me. I understand the sacrifices because I've lived this life. I've been in public office. I know what that means. I know what that entails. And if I didn't truly believe that I could make a difference and do the things that I say I'm going to do, I wouldn't do this because I wouldn't risk the time that I'm going to have to be away from my kids, four kids, the ages 8, 6, 5 and almost 4. I wouldn't. I wouldn't be sacrificing that and, and being able to be with them and take them to school every single day and to jump in this. If I didn't believe in my heart of hearts that this could be done, that we can change the trajectory of California and make it just be again the opportunity capital of the world. It is the. It is the best place to live. I love it. I love being here. You know, I love. I love everything about this state and my family being able to stay in the state. So I care a lot about it. And I really appreciate you guys taking the time to listen to me and would love to have your support.
- [67:03]
F
Thank you, Ian. And one thing I want to keep in mind here, you know, Ian's definitely the guy to run on a hopeful message. And, you know, I really love to see that in today's modern politics. But everyone needs to understand what is at jeopardy right now. The front runner currently today, right now, for the race for the governor of California is Katie Porter. Katie Porter is one of the most anti bitcoin, anti everything in this space. In fact, she's so anti that when she ran for US Senate just a couple of years ago, there was incredible money spent against her to stop her from being a U.S. senator because she is that dangerous to the bitcoin space. So we really have two options here. We can let Katie Porter go on and win and turn California towards an even darker page of history when it comes to bitcoin, giving more incentive to more Democrats to be against bitcoin. Or we can get behind a candidate who actually cares about bitcoin, someone who has proven time and time again that they'll be behind the space, not only through legislation, but as the former majority leader of the state, pushing other lawmakers. Like literally there were years ago when I was meeting with Ian, just after he had left the legislature, there were lawmakers. He was telling me stories of lawmakers who were like, we're just going to trust you, Ian, because we know that we can get behind you. And so the potential here is immense. California not only is a critical state, it's the fourth largest economy in the entire world that could potentially not only be owning bitcoin, protecting the right to self custody bitcoin, but also the California federal delegation, all the lawmakers that go to Washington D.C. it's one of the largest delegations. I think it is the largest delegation in the entire country. So as the governor of California with all of these lawmakers who again, trust him, like, I showed up to D.C. with Ian, brought him in the room. I just thought, you know, maybe a couple people would shake his hand. No joke. The guy stops the guy up, the member of Congress stops the whole room and turns towards Ian and they like literally give this guy a standing ovation. I was completely surprised and shocked. You know, you. You always assume that people might be a little bit popular, but he was very popular amongst that California delegation. Again, the former speaker of the House was in the room clapping for Ian. So not only can he influence the direction of California's politics at the state level, he can have a major impact on every single one of those Democrats who serve California and are showing up in Washington, D.C. as lawmakers to push them towards being more supportive of bitcoin. So when I said that this was important, and some of you might not care, some of you might just love that Republicans are running away with the show and Democrats are getting beat over the head on this issue. But that is a very dangerous direction that we are headed in. If we head towards a world where one party supports bitcoin and one party is against bitcoin, it will be a terrible future for our country, because we will spend every four years or so, when the party switch power, we'll spend four years supporting bitcoin, and then the next party will come in and will spend four years ripping away all the progress that we have made to pass pro bitcoin legislation, potentially putting in jeopardy every single piece of legislation that we are currently working on at the federal level. And so, by Ian coming in and supporting this and winning and becoming the next governor of California, he can pave the way for this issue to be a bipartisan issue. So that, yeah, we might disagree on the future of what to do with bitcoin, but we're fighting over what to do with bitcoin and not fighting over whether or not we should be doing bitcoin as a country. And this is really important also for things like a strategic bitcoin reserve at the federal level, which really has struggled to gain any sort of bipartisan consensus. There are tons of Republicans behind it. Senator Lummis has done incredible work to put this issue at the forefront of the policy dialogue. But in order to get Democrats on board, there needs to be strong Democrats who get behind it and who support it and who are encouraging their colleagues to get behind it. And that is something that Ian will do, not only as he's running for governor of California, but as the next governor of California as well. So, Ian, really, thank you again. I know you already sort of gave your closing remarks, but I. I could not more strongly let people know just the direction that could change for the history of bitcoin. Bitcoin politics will take a massive shift, not only from you announcing this race and getting out there and championing this issue, but also for when you are the next governor of California. People will be able to point to you and listen to you and trust you on this issue. And we could prevent people like Katie Porter from grasping onto the reins of power in California, which would ultimately head us towards a much darker path. Now, I know again, many of you are meeting Ian for the very first time. I said I'll be financially supporting him. I know a lot of other folks already are, but it'll take time for you to get to know him a little bit. Check out his, check out his website. Go to his website right now. It's obviously in his bio. Check out his social media. It's, you know, it's pretty clean. Right. He hasn't been talking a lot about politics because literally he is launching his campaign right now. But you're going to want to follow him. You're going to want to stay, you know, pay attention to the, to the press releases he's putting out, to the social media posts he's putting out. And then eventually, of course, and again, so people understand how campaigns work. When you launch, you launch, you launch pretty clean. You talk about the issues that matter to you. But over time on his website, you will see the development of policy issues around bitcoin and his support for things like protecting the right to self custody. So you won't see a lot there. Now, it's just a splash page, but I'll be working hand in hand with his campaign to make sure that bitcoin is sustained and maintained as a centerpiece of that campaign. So, Ian, I don't know if you want to say goodbye, any last words? But I'll be staying on for just a few more minutes to answer any questions and looking forward to convincing all of you that this is a very important race to get behind.
- [72:41]
G
Yeah, I just want to say again, thank you to you, Dennis. Thank you, Wendy, for jumping in and, and supporting me. I really appreciate it. You were the first one to reach out to me and expose me to this community. I'll never forget that. And Scott, thank you so much, man, for, for your time and for hosting us today. And what I will say is just kind of putting a little dot above the eye on a point that Dennis made. When it comes to creating the permission structure across the country, especially for Democrats, it is a thing and it is real. And we have an opportunity to do this. If there is a governor, a candidate for governor in the state of California that is gaining traction, that is gaining support, it is completely impossible. Embracing this, this technology, embracing Bitcoin and is, is continually rising in the polls and is. And is. And it's, it is A viable contender, which right now we are getting all the different types of intention that we would want and need to be able to determine that viability. Right now, as we speak, my phone is blowing up and I'm getting text messages and tweets and everything from all the right people that need to be talking about this campaign. But the permission structure is a real thing and it will work and it's going to work because I had a conversation just this this past week with a former colleague of mine who is currently serving in the member, as a member of Congress. And what he told me is, hey, I got an opponent, DSA opponent, Democratic Socialists of America opponent. And they're hitting me on being pro bitcoin. And I said, well, that's, that's silly. They're not looking at any polls. People, that's actually a good thing. People want, want their, their leaders to embrace change and embrace the future. And his response to me goes, I know, I don't get it. I think it's stupid, but I think it's great. Keep hitting me on it because I completely support it. And this is somebody that they're not, a couple years ago, just a couple years ago wouldn't have said that same thing and wouldn't have had that same position. So this matters. It absolutely matters. And there's a huge opportunity here to completely change the tone and the, in the tide when it comes to Democrats specifically and their support of this issue area. If they can see that I can do it here in California and that I'm going to do it here in California, that allows them to feel more confident and comfortable leaning in on their federal level where we really need federal legislation to provide those rules of the road and create consistency across all the states. In a state like California, I've been in the legislature. I'm telling you, this is a hugely, hugely influential state. In a state like California, being able to as a, as a strongly Democratic state and embracing bitcoin, it will mean something in Washington D.C. but thank you guys so much. I really appreciate it and I'll see you out there on the campaign trail.
- [75:10]
A
Guys, good luck. Keelan, thanks so much for joining. We appreciate you coming on, man.
- [75:16]
F
Ian, thank you. Really appreciate it. As a quick follow up, you know, Ian's going to be jumping off, so I really appreciate him coming up here and launching his campaign with us. You know, if you guys do take the time to get to know him, I can promise you I have for a while, over many years, you are going to be very confident about supporting him getting behind his race. I could not more strongly implore you to believe in the future of what his race can accomplish. At the end of the day, this has become a very partisan issue. There are already voters that are turning against the issue and are voting against lawmakers potentially who support bitcoin. And so the time is now for us to write the course of history for bitcoin politics. And there really is not another race in this country that is going to do that. Maybe in 2028 we get lucky with a Democratic bitcoin presidential candidate, but already we are seeing multiple presidential hopefuls on the Democratic side of the aisle espouse their opposition to the space. I pay very close attention to it. I monitor it all the time because it's an issue that's very important to me to keep bitcoin nonpartisan or bipartisan in nature. And we are headed on a dangerous path. We need to make sure that we do everything that we can to prevent us from continuing to go that direction as a couple other big things that are happening in our world. So like I said, I'm very involved in the market structure conversations, very involved in talking to Democrats, Senate Democrats and senators across the political aisle on this issue. If you're very interested in helping to support that, please reach out to me. We are making huge gains in those conversations. As a couple of other quick notes, for those of you that may want to be a part of one of the most exciting and the most aggressive and successful bitcoin advocacy groups in the entire country. We are hiring for a bitcoin director of bitcoin advocacy so someone will be able to go hand in hand work with lawmakers to be able to pass pro bitcoin bills into law. We've already done it nine times and we are not done. We are going to continue to pass bitcoin rights across the country. We are going to continue to pass strategic bitcoin reserve bills across the country. And in fact, I just had another state official reach out to me recently and say they're ready to introduce that type of policy. We already did it in three states, but we're not done. We need to keep continuing to move forward. And we also have some other very big stealth projects in the works that I can't, can't wait to get in front of you guys and share more about. There is going to be a lot of announcements that are going to be happening over the coming months and looking forward to working with you guys to make sure that we make bitcoin a centerpiece of US Policy, politics. So I know there were some other folks up here. Scott, I don't know if there was any other comments or questions or if you're just ready to shut the space.
- [77:48]
A
I know Wendy has her. Wendy has her hand up. So I don't if she has another comment, of course. Absolutely. Otherwise, we'll. We'll finish it up when you're done.
- [77:56]
J
Thank you. And Dennis, again, I just want to say I'm born and raised in California, and it generally is a Democratic state for the most part. And for a very long time, Democrats did not. They did not support bitcoin. They really didn't understand the power of it, which I thought was crazy, because when you think about a level playing field, that's what bitcoin does. And if this allows for a better quality life of myself, my family and my community, then I'm all for it. I mean, California is an absolute mess. It's been a mess, and we do need change. So to the people that don't understand how big this is, that's fine. You don't live in California. Most of you don't think California is worth saving. But really, if you want bitcoin to become fully embodied into everything American, you're going to need bipartisan support, and you're going to have to put your. Your hurt feelings aside and you're going to have to look at things in the bigger picture. So have a wonderful day, and God bless America and God bless California.
- [78:49]
A
Thank you so much, Wendy. Thank you so much, Dennis. Of course. And I know we're going to be hearing a lot more about this. Obviously, hopefully we can keep Ian and other pro bitcoin politicians at the forefront, especially in this environment where obviously the crypto lobby has absolutely taken over. So, Dennis, I'm sure you're working very hard to make sure that they have his back and that he will be supported in this race. Katie Porter's disaster. So this is really coming at the right time in the right place. So, Dennis, appreciate what you do, and you bringing us here once again.
- [79:26]
F
Absolutely. Thank you, Scott. And thank you, everybody for tuning in. Keep your eyes out for more announcements that'll be coming. Very excited about the future of bitcoin in this country. We have the chance to really make the United States and states like California the undisputed leader on bitcoin for generations to come. You really can't do that without bipartisan consensus. I know Republicans have done a great job of making bitcoin a centerpiece of their political politics and their policy, but we need both parties if we're going to be able to continue to make progress and if we want to make sure that the United States continues to lead it's going to require getting folks like Ian into office. So thank you again Scott. I really appreciate you hosting us. Thank you everybody for tuning in and I'll certainly be hopping around to some different shows and different spaces later today so keep an eye out for those as well.
- [80:17]
A
Thanks so much Dennis which is I was trying to change the title and I botched it in the while trying to do it so we are going to wrap. I'm going to go ahead and do that while because it will get stuck. There we go. Ian Calderon. So you guys get to see the the drama of X spaces in real time. That's what we got guys. We will be back obviously tomorrow. Thanks once again Dennis. We'll see you guys tomorrow. Have a good one By.