The Working Genius Podcast with Patrick Lencioni

Episode 99: "ID Pairing with Claire Laughlin"

Date: November 4, 2025
Host: Patrick Lencioni
Guests: Claire Laughlin, Cody Thompson

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the "ID" (Invention and Discernment) Working Genius pairing, featuring master facilitator Claire Laughlin. Host Patrick Lencioni, himself an ID, and co-host Cody Thompson explore what it's like to have this pairing, how it shows up in work and life, how IDs can contribute—and sometimes frustrate—teams, and the practical value of understanding and balancing these gifts. The discussion is peppered with personal anecdotes, humor, and practical insights for anyone wanting to better harness their own or others' geniuses.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. What Does It Mean to Be an ID? (Invention + Discernment)

• Definition: IDs are called "discriminating ideators"—they rapidly create ideas and simultaneously vet them internally.
• Living as an ID: Both Claire and Pat describe their minds defaulting to idea-generation whenever they're not on task. For them, invention and discernment often blur together and operate in a rapid, looping process.
  • Claire: “The minute the pressure subsides... my brain starts creating new ideas... It's so hard to just not invent new things.” [03:11]
  • Pat: "It's what we do when we don't have to do something else." [03:32]

2. Internal ID Loop & Challenges

• IDs often cycle so quickly between inventing and discerning that it's hard to separate the two.
  • Pat: “Sometimes that we call it the ID loop happens so fast... it's like invent, discern, invent, discern, you know, it goes all together.” [05:46]
• This can lead to confusion about whether order (I before D) matters; ultimately, the key insight is the power of the combination.

3. Annoyances and Interpersonal Conflicts

• IDs can unintentionally frustrate others:
  • Coming across as too confident (“I could literally have thought about something three minutes before, and I'll present it as though I've been thinking about this my whole life.” – Pat [10:19])
  • Jumping to solutions quickly without explaining their reasoning.
  • Giving others (especially non-IDs) wide-open, ambiguous tasks that would energize them but drain others (e.g., asking someone with an ET pairing to "just play with it"). [17:08]
• Claire recognizes the need to ‘stay in her own lane’ with discernment at home, assigning lanes of decision-making by personal genius to avoid clashes. [08:21]

4. Strengths and Joys of Being an ID

• Deep satisfaction in being asked for advice or a challenge to solve: “When you hear the words, 'I have a problem or I need some advice,' that actually is an activation for invention discernment…” – Cody [15:45]
• Both Claire and Pat get energy from being the "doctor is in"—helping others solve problems on the fly. [15:03–15:23]
• Fast creative ideation: Pat describes looping the office to come up with podcast topics in minutes. [21:30]

5. The Importance of Wonder & Slowing Down

• Claire has learned, thanks to Working Genius, to slow down and intentionally start with Wonder—asking, “What is the actual problem that I’m solving?” [14:05]
• This prevents wasting energy inventing solutions to the wrong problems.
• Both recognize that their natural pace may need self-management to foster better collaboration (“Slow down are probably two of the words that have been said to me the most that I don’t like to hear.” – Pat [19:34])

6. Difference Between IDs and Other Pairings

• IDs are constantly filtering new ideas with discernment, so their ideas are “three-quarter baked,” compared to WIs (Wonder + Invention), who prefer to run initial ideas by a discerner afterward.
  • Cody: “I think like people might look at that and think like that’s a weird label [discriminating ideator] to feel pride in. But...you guys...don’t just throw out stuff for the sake of throwing out stuff. You’ve really thought about it.” [22:30]

7. Applying the Working Genius Model

• Claire finds that virtually every business problem takes on new clarity when filtered through the Working Genius model, making her a more effective consultant and teacher. [24:36]
• Both panelists note the model’s pervasive value not just at work, but in family life and self-awareness.

8. Podcasting & ID Geniuses

• Many podcast hosts are IDs: they enjoy “figuring it out as they go” and have a well of new topics. [19:53]
  • Cody: “In some ways...I think that's because they naturally feel like, 'I got plenty ideas'... I would have run out.” [21:12]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On idea generation:
  Claire: “It's so hard to just not invent new things.” [03:11]
• On presenting rough ideas as facts:
  Pat: "I could literally have thought about something three minutes before, and I'll present it as though I've been thinking about this my whole life." [10:19]
• On self-management:
  Claire: “I have to really practice all the time. I have to lean in and teach myself...slow the mind down. Lean into the wonder. Be more curious.” [18:36]
• On giving an ET the wrong type of project:
  Claire: “I would give her all this ID work... No clarity at all... and she's an ET... It's the best job in the world. He goes, no, no, no, for you it is. For me, it's a nightmare.” [17:08]
• On the quick solution trap:
  Pat: “There's a problem to solve. And I'll say just do this. But I don't explain how I got there...rather than just say, just do this.” [18:34]
• The lightbulb moment:
  Pat: “They're like, oh wait, there's a working genius explanation for this. And it's so fun...people's light bulb goes off.” [25:48]

Important Timestamps & Segments

• [01:16] – Introduction of guest Claire Laughlin and the episode topic: ID pairing.
• [03:11] – Claire describes the restless invention of IDs.
• [05:46] – Discussion of the ID loop and whether order matters.
• [08:21] – Claire on dividing discernment “lanes” at home to avoid conflict.
• [10:19] – Pat on how IDs might appear more confident than warranted.
• [14:05] – Claire's self-training to begin with Wonder.
• [15:03–15:23] – Both share how energizing "problem asks" are for IDs.
• [17:08] – The disconnect when assigning ID tasks to non-IDs.
• [18:34] – Jumping to solutions without taking others through the process.
• [19:53] – IDs as podcast hosts and their preference for improvisation.
• [21:12] – Cody highlights the inexhaustible idea well of IDs.
• [22:30] – Difference in how IDs and WIs handle ideas and discernment.
• [24:36] – Claire on how Working Genius changed her consulting practice.
• [25:48] – The model’s transformative effect on workplace understanding and relationships.

Episode Takeaways

• For Teams: IDs add fast, creative problem-solving but must be mindful to explain their process and avoid leaving others behind.
• For Individuals: Understanding your pairings increases self-awareness, prevents burnout, and enables more joyous collaboration.
• For Facilitators & Coaches: The Working Genius is a powerful lens for almost any interpersonal or process problem—train yourself and others to name and balance their gifts.

Episode Tone & Style

The conversation is candid, humorous, and practical—full of playful self-deprecation (“Oh, so you’re an ID? ADHD?”), genuine admiration for the model’s power, and collaborative riffing. The tone is invitational rather than instructional, making listeners feel seen and understood, whatever their Working Genius.

For those who haven’t listened:
You’ll come away with a rich understanding of the ID pairing, how to leverage it, common pitfalls, and why self-awareness is everything. The episode is packed with real-world applications and encouraging examples from home, coaching, and work life.