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The World and Everything In It
10.27.25 Supreme Court cases covering police power, double jeopardy, and attorney-client limits, Moneybeat on the tariff drama with Canada, and an Iraqi church massacre
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- [00:06]
Jenny Ruff
Good morning. Police enter a home without a search warrant. A defendant says he received a double punishment and the limits to attorney client communication.
- [00:15]
David Bonson
I don't understand, like, what do you think went wrong? Like, why was it so serious? And you say, I can't tell you. Just trust me.
- [00:23]
Lindsay Mast
That's ahead on Legal Docket. Also, the Monday money beat and the world history book. This week marks the 15th anniversary of a deadly attack on Christians in Iraq.
- [00:34]
Jenny Ruff
This is a Christian civilization that's made.
- [00:36]
Kent Covington
Us hate the country which doesn't protect.
- [00:38]
Paul Butler
Us and our children.
- [00:47]
Jenny Ruff
It's Monday, October 27th. This is the world and everything in it from listener supported World Radio. I'm Jenny Ruff.
- [00:54]
Lindsay Mast
And I'm Lindsay Mast. Good morning.
- [00:59]
Jenny Ruff
Up next, Kent Covington with today's news.
- [01:02]
Kent Covington
President Trump was in Malaysia on Sunday to oversee the signing of a new peace deal between Cambodia and Thailand. Trump helped to broker a ceasefire three months ago after deadly border clashes.
- [01:13]
David Bonson
18 Cambodian prisoners of war will be released. And under this agreement, observers from ASEAN countries, including Malaysia will be deployed to make sure that the peace prevails and endures. I have no doubt that it will.
- [01:30]
Kent Covington
While both sides agreed to halt fighting in July, each has since accused the other of fresh attacks. Trump's threats of economic pressure prodded the two nations to halt skirmishes along their disputed border. President Trump also signed economic frameworks with Cambodia, Thailand and Malaysia, some of them involving critical minerals. And while the US Wants to rely less on Beijing for those minerals which are needed for high tech manufacturing, US And Chinese officials now say a trade deal is drawing closer. Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant said that ahead of a planned meeting this week between President Trump and Chinese leader Xi Jinping.
- [02:06]
David Bonson
I believe that we have the framework for the two leaders to have a very productive meeting for both sides, and I think it will be fantastic.
- [02:16]
Kent Covington
That meeting is set for Thursday in South Korea. Under the deal, the United States would, at least for now, halt plans for steeper tariffs on Chinese goods, while Beijing would hit the pause button on new export controls on rare earth minerals. The ongoing federal government shutdown has continued to cause thousands of flight delays each week, along with some serious headaches for air travelers. That as a large number of air traffic controllers working without paychecks for now are calling in sick. National Air Traffic Control Association President Nick Daniels says his workers are distracted, which.
- [02:51]
David Bonson
Makes this system less safe.
- [02:53]
Kent Covington
Every day that this shutdown continues, tomorrow.
- [02:57]
David Bonson
We'Ll be less safe than today.
- [02:58]
Kent Covington
But Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy is assuring the public that flying is not any less safe. He says that's because if they have shortages or if controllers seem too stressed.
- [03:08]
David Bonson
We pay close attention to that and we will reduce the capacity of airplanes taking off and landing or we will cancel flights.
- [03:17]
Kent Covington
Duffy says roughly half of all flight delays right now are due to staffing shortages. Nearly a million and a half federal workers missed paychecks on Friday. Meantime on Capitol Hill, still no sign that the government is any closer to reopening. Democrats continue to criticize President Trump over military strikes against what the administration says are drug cartel vessels in international waters. The Pentagon announced the 10th such strike on Friday, saying US forces hit a boat operated by the Trende Aragua cartel, killing six on board. Senator Tim Kaine says he's concerned about those strikes and about the buildup of military assets near Venezuela. If we're going to be in a war, whether it's against boats in Nicaragua chosen off a secret list that the.
- [04:02]
David Bonson
President won't share with Congress or the.
- [04:04]
Kent Covington
Public, or a land invasion in Venezuela, it should be done. Following a debate and a vote in Congress, a handful of Republicans have also voiced some concern, though most continue to back President Trump's decision to designate cartels as terrorist organizations and strike them accordingly. The administration is deploying an aircraft carrier to the Caribbean in the latest escalation of firepower there. The Pentagon says the military's mission is to disrupt cartel trafficking before the drugs make it to US Oil. Hurricane Melissa is spinning over the northern Caribbean, packing monstrous winds as it bears down on Jamaica. It is expected to strike the country's southern shoreline today as a Category 4 or 5 hurricane packing winds in excess of 140 miles per hour, possibly more than 160. And then there's the rain. Larry Kelly with the National Hurricane Center Life threatening catastrophic flash flooding is possible through portions of Jamaica and then spreading northward across the Caribbean into Cuba, Haiti.
- [05:05]
Nick Eicher
And then eventually the southeastern Bahamas.
- [05:07]
Kent Covington
The storm has already been blamed for deaths in Haiti and the Dominican Republic. Jamie Rome, also with the hurricane center, says Melissa is moving slowly and that is not good news.
- [05:18]
Paul Butler
Potential rainfall amounts in excess of 3ft.
- [05:22]
David Bonson
Over heavily mountainous terrain that is almost certain to create catastrophic flooding.
- [05:28]
Kent Covington
Life threatening flash flooding, roads impassable, communities cut off. Jamaican authorities have activated shelters and closed Kingston's North Manly International Airport. Officials in France say they have arrested two suspects in connection with the theft of crown jewels the Louvre museum in Paris. The announcement on Sunday came one week after the brazen daylight heist. Authorities arrested one suspect at a Paris airport attempting to leave the country. The thieves, disguised as maintenance workers, carried out the heist in under eight minutes, making off with jewels valued at more than $100 million. I'm Ken Covington. And straight ahead, legal docket plus, David Bonson and the World, her history book. This is the World and Everything in it.
- [06:39]
Lindsay Mast
It's Monday, 27th October. Glad to have you along for today's edition of the World and Everything In It. Good morning. I'm Lindsay Mast.
- [06:47]
Jenny Ruff
And I'm Jenny Ruff. Time now for legal docket today. Three criminal law. One on the Fourth Amendment, one on the Fifth Amendment, and one on the Sixth Amendment. So let's start with the Fourth Amendment. Case v. Montana. The Fourth Amendment protects people and their homes from unreasonable searches and seizures. It also says no search warrant shall be issued without probable cause, meaning a reasonable belief that a crime is being committed. But there are exceptions.
- [07:15]
Lindsay Mast
In this case, police weren't investigating a crime. They were conducting a welfare check. William Trevor, Case's ex girlfriend, called the police because she had been on the phone with Case when he threatened suicide. She heard him cock a handgun, heard a pop, then silence at his house. Case didn't answer the door. Through the window, police saw beer cans, a holster, and what looked like a suicide note. After 40 minutes, they entered through an unlocked door without a warrant. Case emerged from a closet holding a gun in his outstretched arm. Police shot him but didn't kill him. Case was then arrested for assaulting a peace officer. He now wants the gun and other evidence suppressed at his trial.
- [07:58]
Jenny Ruff
The question here what standard applies to allow a warrantless entry under the emergency aid exception? Attorney Fred Rowley represented Case and argued police need probable cause in a welfare check just like they do in a criminal investigation.
- [08:13]
Paul Butler
There is no liberty interest more deeply.
- [08:15]
Kent Covington
Rooted in the Fourth Amendment than the.
- [08:17]
David Bonson
Sanctity of the home. The police entered Trevor Case's home without permission, a warrant, or even probable cause, and they ended up shooting him in his own house.
- [08:28]
Jenny Ruff
But Justice Samuel Alito could not imagine the police would need more certainty of an emergency.
- [08:33]
Kent Covington
What more did they need?
- [08:35]
David Bonson
They need to be able to look through the window and see him with.
- [08:37]
Kent Covington
A gun pointed to his head.
- [08:39]
Jenny Ruff
Are they? Raleigh said the police should have known the circumstances were not urgent because of their prior encounters with him. Case had threatened suicide before police knew of his mental health issues, and they knew he was likely attempting suicide by copying, meaning he wanted to provoke a confrontation with police. Rowley quoted a conversation captured on Body Cam.
- [09:01]
David Bonson
And I would just.
- [09:01]
Paul Butler
Just quote, for example, Police Chief Sather. Sather, who says he ain't got the guts.
- [09:08]
David Bonson
This is probably the 10th time I've.
- [09:10]
Paul Butler
Dealt with him doing this.
- [09:11]
David Bonson
As assessed by the officers on the.
- [09:14]
Kent Covington
Scene, they drew the inference that he.
- [09:16]
David Bonson
Was unlikely to shoot himself.
- [09:19]
Lindsay Mast
Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson didn't think that argument worked in case's favor. I find your argument very od.
- [09:26]
David Bonson
Right. In this very situation, I'm thinking the fact that they had a lot of.
- [09:29]
Lindsay Mast
Information about Mr. Case actually hurts your.
- [09:32]
David Bonson
Cause, not helps you.
- [09:34]
Kent Covington
On our axis of information and threat.
- [09:38]
David Bonson
Or risk, this seems like it's pretty.
- [09:40]
Lindsay Mast
High because police entered the house for a welfare check. Justice Elena Kagan suggested dropping probable cause language altogether.
- [09:49]
David Bonson
One of the things that strikes me here most of the way we know what probable cause is is because we have a body of case law that talks about it, and it talks about it in an investigatory criminal context. And in this context, that way of figuring out whether there's probable cause just disappears, because that's not the context we're in. Maybe we just use a different language. Do you have to have an objectively reasonable basis for believing that somebody needs emergency help?
- [10:18]
Lindsay Mast
Whatever the outcome, police need flexibility to help someone whose life is in danger.
- [10:24]
Jenny Ruff
Next case. The Fifth Amendment's double jeopardy clause. In Barrett versus The United States. Double jeopardy usually centers on the idea that a defendant cannot be prosecuted twice for the same crime. But also a defendant cannot be punished twice for the same crime.
- [10:40]
Lindsay Mast
Here, Dwayne Barrett drove a getaway car in a robbery that involved a firearm. Crime number one. During the robbery, a victim was shot and killed. Crime number two. A lower court found the separate crimes required two separate punishments. Under a firearm statute. The defendant argues that's wrong. A general rule says that when a defendant commits two crimes that arise from the same conduct, he's only punished for the more serious crime. But such an approach could potentially lead to bizarre results. Justice Alito brought up this hypothetical with the defendant's lawyer, Matthew Larson.
- [11:16]
Kent Covington
Well, just out of curiosity, suppose there is a person who is committing a crime, and this person is very well versed in the. In our double jeopardy jurisprudence. And so this person commits an offense that has two elements, A and B, and the maximum punishment for that offense is five years. And the person says, wow, if I get caught and convicted, I don't want to go to jail for five years, but I know that if I commit two other elements, C and D, and the maximum penalty for that offense is only one year, so let me go ahead and commit the greater offense. Does that make any sense?
- [12:01]
Paul Butler
So such a skilled defendant may engage in that conduct. Your Honor, there are ample safeguards in.
- [12:08]
Kent Covington
Place to protect against any injustice.
- [12:10]
Lindsay Mast
He said a court has discretion to impose the higher sentence.
- [12:14]
Jenny Ruff
It's true courts are to presume Congress did not intend for a defendant to be punished twice for the same conduct. But that presumption is set aside if Congress has made it clear it wants multiple punishments. So this case will boil down to statutory interpretation, whether Congress intended to authorize cumulative punishments or not. Finally, the Sixth Amendment. Villarreal v. Texas. The Sixth Amendment guarantees the accused the assistance of counsel for his defense. But lawyers still must abide by certain rules and codes of conduct. Think of it this Legitimate counseling includes a lawyer rehearsing the defendant's testimony with him before he takes the stand. Impermissible counseling includes things like scripting answers for the defendant to recite.
- [13:00]
Lindsay Mast
In this case, defendant David Villarreal was accused of murder. At his trial, he testified that he acted in self defense. About an hour after he took the stand, the judge called a 24 hour recess. The judge then told the defendant's attorney he could talk trial strategy with the defendant overnight, but not about the testimony itself.
- [13:21]
Jenny Ruff
Yes, and let me just explain the logic here. One purpose of a jury trial is to seek the truth from the evidence and testimony presented. If the defendant testifies, the prosecution will cross examine him to test the truth of his statements. And the defendant's attorney cannot coach his client on the stand. Preparation is over. So the judge here was extending that restriction to the overnight recess.
- [13:44]
Lindsay Mast
Villarreal was convicted of murder at the Supreme Court. Attorney Stuart Banner argued for the defendant and said regrouping overnight is crucial. A defendant needs unrestricted access to his lawyer. Anything less violates his Sixth Amendment right to counsel.
- [14:00]
David Bonson
Overnight recesses have always been times of strategizing discussions. This is like prime time for in the middle of a trial is an overnight recess.
- [14:11]
Paul Butler
Yeah.
- [14:11]
Lindsay Mast
Andrew Worthen for the State of Texas said the restriction is okay because it advances the purpose of truth telling.
- [14:18]
Kent Covington
It's an empirical predicate of our system of justice that an uncounseled witness is more likely to tell the truth than.
- [14:24]
Paul Butler
One who has time to pause and.
- [14:26]
Kent Covington
Consult with their attorney.
- [14:27]
Lindsay Mast
But Justice Kagan probed the limits of the restriction with this example.
- [14:31]
David Bonson
Do you think that counsel can say, listen, I've been noticing that you've been mumbling and you're also not making eye contact with the questioner. And it would just be a good idea if you stopped mumbling and made eye contact. Can the lawyer do that in an overnight recession?
- [14:52]
Paul Butler
No.
- [14:52]
Kent Covington
I would consider that to be coaching their testimony.
- [14:55]
Lindsay Mast
So if Texas Gets its way. The content of the defendant's testimony and how he presents himself are both off limits.
- [15:02]
Jenny Ruff
There's also a question of time. Short recesses. Think lunch and bathroom breaks versus long ones. Two precedents control here, and they're hard to reconcile. But both parties agree that limiting communications during a short recess is okay. They're only fighting about the overnight one. But that made no sense to Justice Brett Kavanaugh.
- [15:22]
David Bonson
Justice Kavanaugh, I'm trying to figure out.
- [15:24]
Kent Covington
The logic of a line based on.
- [15:26]
David Bonson
A 15 minute recess versus a lunchtime recess versus a lunchtime. Plus, I have another matter I have to handle. So it's going to be a two hour break recess versus an overnight recess.
- [15:36]
Jenny Ruff
The rationale for limiting attorney client communications during short recesses is trial logistics. Banner.
- [15:42]
David Bonson
Again, if defendants had the right to confer with counsel during every tiny little recess, you know, one minute, 10 seconds or whatever, it would just be impossible to run a trial. So there has to be some.
- [15:54]
Jenny Ruff
He said overnight is different. But Justice Kavanaugh still had concerns.
- [15:58]
David Bonson
It depends on the accident of a recess. So those defendants are going to be treated much differently. And does that make a lot of sense? I think it does.
- [16:07]
Lindsay Mast
The justices also wrestled with the line between discussing trial strategy allowed and trial testimony not allowed. The defendant argued strategy and testimony are too intertwined. A lawyer and his client must be able to discuss both. Texas disagreed and wanted the line. Justice Amy Coney Barrett proposed this language.
- [16:29]
David Bonson
Listen, you can't talk about the content.
- [16:31]
Lindsay Mast
Of the testimony or the manner of.
- [16:32]
David Bonson
Its delivery, but you can discuss any.
- [16:35]
Paul Butler
Strategic consequences of the defendant's testimony, such.
- [16:39]
Lindsay Mast
As whether to take a plea, whether.
- [16:40]
David Bonson
To call another witness, etc.
- [16:42]
Jenny Ruff
But how that would play out proved confusing. Here's an exchange between Texas attorney Worthen and Justice Kagan.
- [16:49]
Kent Covington
You can tell them you need to.
- [16:51]
David Bonson
Take the plea bargain.
- [16:52]
Paul Butler
And if the defendant says, well, how.
- [16:54]
Kent Covington
Did I do a terrible job? You would just have to tell them I'm under a court order. I cannot tell you why that's true, but you need to be. In my professional opinion, you need to understand that the best course of action for you now is to take a plea bargain.
- [17:07]
David Bonson
Now why? Why is that, Mr. Warden? The person says to you, what do you think went wrong? Like, why was it so serious that I now have to tell this? And you say, I. I can't tell you. Just trust me that you have to take a plea bargain. And the person says, what do you mean, trust me? I mean, I want this. I want to understand, like, why this went so wrong. Like, shouldn't the lawyer be able to say, here's what went wrong, here's why.
- [17:34]
Jenny Ruff
You should take a plea bargain, A difficult balance. I get the purpose of the limitation, but I wonder if a rule that's too restrictive could also impede truth finding. And that's this week's legal docket.
- [18:02]
Kent Covington
Additional support comes from Asbury University, where students are known, supported and prepared to lead customized visits. Available asbury. Edu visit. And from Cedarville University, equipping students for professional excellence and gospel impact. Cedarville. Edu World.
- [18:33]
Jenny Ruff
Coming up next on THE WORLD and everything in it, the Monday Money beat from Istanbul, here's Nick Eicher.
- [18:43]
Nick Eicher
It is time now to talk business, markets and the economy with financial analyst and advisor David Bonson. David heads up the wealth management firm the Bonson Group, and he is here now. Good morning to you, David.
- [18:55]
David Bonson
Well, good morning, Nick. Good to be with you.
- [18:57]
Nick Eicher
Well, let's begin north of the border, Canadian trade talks with the United States were thrown off course a bit last week after the premiere of Ontario. Doug Ford put on the air over the weekend during the World Series an anti tariff ad quoting Ronald Reagan. And this angered President Trump. He called off negotiations over the weekend on trade for Ford would back off a bit. He said he would pause the campaign, but that pause is not to take effect until today. So, David, what is your read on this unusual flare up over tariffs? Is it mostly political theater, do you think, or does it point to something else?
- [19:38]
David Bonson
Yeah, I thought actually the most interesting thing was that President Trump responded by announcing he was polling all talks and back to 100% tariffs with Canada. And then the market responded by going up 500 points on Friday. We are so far past the point of markets taking any of this seriously. It's really staggering. It was about 3:45 in the morning, Eastern Friday that I heard this announcement of what had flared up and you would expect, you know, six, eight, 10 months ago that it was gonna lead to some sort of market response. And I think that markets are doing what appears to me that counterparties are doing as well, which is just shrugging off all those types of threats and so forth. What's really interesting is that the president was upset and even the Reagan foundation chimed in that they thought that the quotes were altered or edited in a way that was a little deceiving. And there was no reason for Canada to do that because if they want quotes from President Reagan speaking against tariffs, there are plenty of them, I assure you of.
- [20:47]
Nick Eicher
Picked the wrong one, didn't they?
- [20:48]
David Bonson
Well, I think they picked one and then they misused it, is what the president feels. And of course, what really upset him was just their attempt to poke the bear. Doug Ford is not a fan of the president. And so it just, again, was taken to be a hostile situation that President Reagan did not agree with. Protectionism is indisputable. But the fact that this is all just going to blow over and there's going to end up being some sort of discussion with US And Canada and where it all goes, you know, that also is beyond debate. I mean, it's going to happen. And that's why markets shrugged it off.
- [21:25]
Nick Eicher
All right, David. Well, back here in the US and. Well, I shouldn't say it that way. I'm in Turkey at the moment, assuming I actually do get back home sometime soon. But back home, inflation went up slightly in the month of September, 3% inflation, year over year. It's a bit above the pace in August. And I still see that the Fed remains on track for two more interest rate cuts before the end of the year. Looks like the likelihood of that is in the high 90s. So it appears that is going to continue to be the case, the Fed cutting rates even though inflation is at 3% and not 2% inflation, which has always been the target. And that brings me to the question raised by the Wall Street Journal editorial board. Is three, the new two, what do you think?
- [22:17]
David Bonson
Well, as long as President Trump is there, it could be three, it could be four, it could be two. Nobody cares. They're cutting rates because they have been asked to do that and the pressure is on. And, you know, I believe that they're right to do it because they recognize that the thing putting upward pricing pressure is not monetary. And the Fed has to respond to upward pricing pressure that is monetarily driven by raising rates. But this is not the case. What is most interesting by far is that as the inflation rate ticked up a little, the Wall Street Journal is right. Anyone else who's pointing this out is right. Everyone is right now just sort of ignoring the fact that the inflation rate is higher than it was the last several months of Biden's presidency. And we're all talking about how we've beaten inflation. And the reality is it's just certain prices are a bit higher because of tariffs. That's what's going on. So I don't think the Fed should be responding because there isn't anything the Fed can do about that. But what I think is most interesting is that this was one of the first readings where the contribution to the inflation rate from this really lagged and antiquated housing measure that was actually way down. And the owner's equivalent rent did show a much lower number than it has, and yet the inflation number had stayed higher. So the impact of certain prices with tariffs is definitely more pronounced than anyone is wanting to talk about. But I still don't believe that gets to a level of the Fed saying, well, we're going to use interest rates to try to adjust, that there's nothing they can do. Why they want to be cutting rates, Nick, is because they're worried about the labor market. They're worried about a softening economy. And so, yes, the Fed will cut in October and they will cut in December.
- [24:09]
Nick Eicher
All right, David. So onto the government shutdown now. A lot of news on that over the past week. The shutdown now entering its fourth week, the pressure does seem to be starting to show a bit. I mean, lawmakers in both parties somewhat starting to break ranks with their leadership. Some Republicans pushing standalone bills, a few Democrats kind of hinting that they might support some narrow fixes. But still the leaders are really dug in and the White House has not said what kind of deal it would accept. So I'm wondering where you think things stand right now. And I guess I'm especially curious why we're even talking about the House past short term continuing resolution to keep the government open because the term is so short and the shutdown is so long. We're almost at the point that they're going to have to do some other kind of deal simply because time's running out.
- [25:01]
David Bonson
Yeah, they will at some point. The reason that they haven't yet is because absolutely nobody cares right now other than the government employees directly affected by it. It is absolutely stunning how little attention any of it's getting this week. I would guess I'm not being hyperbolic to say that in the week that just concluded, you had 100 times more press coverage of a sports betting arrest around, you know, prop bets and NBA basketball games than you did the government shutdown. There's no pressure for either side to have to capitulate yet. And there will be. But at this point, there isn't any, you know, heavy political pressure. Both sides are letting the clock run out. But you're very astute, Nick, to say that by the time they do come to a deal, then they'll be fair enough down the line that it's going to have to be something different. So any kind of really short term CR becomes somewhat ineffectual at this point.
- [25:58]
Nick Eicher
Well, David, before we go, I did want to get your take on this pardon for the crypto executive Changpeng Zhao, the founder of the crypto exchange Binance. This coming less than two years after he pleaded guilty to money laundering. And since that time he's become a business partner in a Trump linked digital currency venture. And even some Trump allies are critical of this pardon. Now, as soon as I brought it up, I heard you sigh and I take it this pardon is really bothersome to you.
- [26:31]
David Bonson
Yes, it is. And it's always, you know, hard for me, Nick, because I recognize that a lot of people are so appreciative of certain things the president has done in the policy realm that I don't think people like it when I'm critical. I cannot even imagine somebody defending this pardon. It would be incomprehensible to me. He pled guilty. He is guilty. It was a crime. He wasn't over sentenced. And he is in direct, very lucrative business with the president and his family. And then to now go get this pardon. I just, I guess the only thing people can say is well, what about the pardon the Bidens did and I thought that was wrong too. So I'm not going to do the whataboutism. It all bothers me. I recognize that at this time the presidential pardon right is something embodied in the Constitution. I'm not one who believes it is being executed these days as our founders envisioned, but there's not much else that can be said here. I really would have a very hard time seeing anyone defend this pardon.
- [27:36]
Nick Eicher
All right. David Bonson, founder, managing partner and chief investment officer at the Bonson Group. He writes regularly for World opinions and@dividendcafe.com David, thank you. We'll talk to you next time.
- [27:48]
David Bonson
Thanks so much, Nick. Good to be with you.
- [28:12]
Lindsay Mast
Today is Monday, October 27th. Good morning. This is the world and everything in it from listener supported World Radio. I'm Lindsay Mast.
- [28:21]
Jenny Ruff
And I'm Jenny Ruff. Up next, the world history book. One of the deadliest modern attacks against Iraqi Christians happened 15 years ago this week. World's Paul Butler has the story.
- [28:37]
Paul Butler
October 31st. Dusk settles over Baghdad. Inside the Sadat El Najjah Cathedral. Evening mass is underway. About one hundred and twenty Christians sit on the simple wooden pews of the Syrian Catholic Church known as Our lady of Perpetual Help. Meanwhile, militants detonate a car bomb outside the nearby Iraqi stock exchange. Terrorists armed with suicide vests and grenades attack the exchange itself, injuring two guards. It's a calculated diversion to draw Iraqi security forces away from the real target, the cathedral. Soon after the blast, a handful of militants linked to Al Qaeda climb over the courtyard wall and storm the church. Deacon Luis Clements was inside. Audio here from ewtn.
- [29:26]
Jenny Ruff
He says their intention was evil. It was to kill. They can see everyone in the church, an infidel deserving of death.
- [29:34]
Paul Butler
Terrorists throw several grenades and spray the crowd inside with gunfire. They approach the priest at the altar, tell him to lie down and then shoot him in front of the congregation. The militants then take survivors hostage during a short phone call. They demand that Iraqi authorities release all Al Qaeda linked prisoners, beginning with two women in Egypt, wives of Coptic priests. The terrorists claim the women converted to Islam and are being held against their will in monasteries. The terrorists also speak to an Egyptian television station and even issue a message directed to the Vatican. The threat is short and direct. You must pressure them to release our sisters. Otherwise death will reach you. All hostages are afraid to make a sound, fearing the militants will kill them if they do. Deacon Louise Clements. Once again.
- [30:27]
Jenny Ruff
He says, we stayed here for four hours in terror and fear. We had surrendered to fate.
- [30:33]
Paul Butler
Officials begin negotiating with the terrorists, but conversations soon break down. The militants threaten to blow themselves up if Iraqi security or US forces storm the building. But after dark, police decide to enter the church anyway. The lights go out as the security forces rush in and the terrorists begin shooting the hostages. A massive blast erupts as a militant near the altar detonates a suicide vest. As security forces gain entry upstairs. A gunman in the basement kills about 30 hostages there. The siege ends shortly after 10pm Survivors are evacuated out through the rubble and the carnage. The massacre leaves at least 58 people dead and 78 wounded. Casualties include two priests, many women and children, 12 policemen and five bystanders. Rad Bashar lives near the church and speaks with the Associated Press after the standoff ends.
- [31:33]
Kent Covington
It's a terrible day. Every day it gets worse. I want to leave Iraq. This country's worth nothing. All it's given us was suffering, murder and violence.
- [31:47]
Paul Butler
International response is swift. Pope Benedict denounces the assault as ferocious as Italy Airlifts 26 of the wounded to Rome for treatment. France grants asylum to 150 Iraqi Christians, including some of the injured in Baghdad. The tragedy prompts outrage. Thousands of Christians and Muslims take to the streets in northern Iraq, condemning the violence. This protester says, we don't want discrimination among Christians, Muslims and Kurds. All of us are fraternal minorities. The church reopens, but many talk about leaving. This man lost his son and grandson in the attack.
- [32:28]
Jenny Ruff
We don't want to leave because we've.
- [32:31]
Kent Covington
Watered this country's soil with our blood for thousands of years.
- [32:34]
Jenny Ruff
This is a Christian civilization with Christian history.
- [32:39]
Kent Covington
What's happened has made us hate the.
- [32:41]
David Bonson
Country, which doesn't protect us and our children.
- [32:44]
Paul Butler
Two months after the massacre, the church cancels its Christmas Eve service.
- [32:48]
Lindsay Mast
Thousands of Christians have already fled their.
- [32:50]
David Bonson
Homes in Baghdad and the northern city of Mosul in recent months as a.
- [32:55]
Kent Covington
Direct result of the renewed violence.
- [32:58]
Paul Butler
Fifteen years later, the specter of terror still affects the Christian community here. Christians continue to face discrimination and violence. Reports of harassment and intimidation are common. The Christian population in Iraq was once estimated at 1.5 million. Before 2003, only about 150,000 remain. The cathedral has been restored. Wood paneling now covers the inside pillars and walls and the bullet holes beneath. The updated sanctuary is airy and awash in beautiful light. A rich carpet covers the once blood stained floor, but a red marble line runs from the altar to the cathedral steps. Partly a nod to the attack, but also a reminder that it is only the blood of Christ that brings hope and salvation to the world outside. That's this week's world history book. I'm Paul Butler with additional reporting from Mary Muncie.
- [34:15]
Lindsay Mast
Tomorrow, how the EU is responding to Russia's drone incursions of its airspace. And and outside an abortion facility, a street preacher's style stirs tension with other pro lifers. That and more tomorrow. I'm Lindsay Mast.
- [34:29]
Jenny Ruff
And I'm Jenny Ruff. The world and everything in it comes to you from World Radio. World's mission is biblically objective journalism that informs, educates and inspires Scripture records the words of Paul. Therefore be alert, remembering that for three years I didn't not cease night or day to admonish everyone with tears. And now I commend you to God and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up and to give you the inheritance among all those who are sanctified. Verses 31 and 32 of Acts 20 go now in grace and peace.