5.26.25 Legal Docket, Moneybeat, and remembering the cost of freedom

Summary

The World and Everything In It
Episode: Legal Docket, Moneybeat, and Remembering the Cost of Freedom
Release Date: May 26, 2025

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Introduction & Memorial Day Tribute

On this special Memorial Day episode, Jenny Ruff opens with a heartfelt acknowledgment of the day, honoring those who sacrificed their lives in service to the country. She emphasizes the podcast’s commitment to fearless and truthful reporting, grounded in God's Word. Jenny states, “We're grateful for their sacrifice and the freedom we have to speak the truth boldly and report the news without fear” [00:05].

Legal Docket: Supreme Court Case on Religious Liberty

Case Overview

The episode delves into a pivotal Supreme Court case that centers on religious liberty and the Appointments Clause of the U.S. Constitution. This case involves Christian business owners challenging a government-mandated task force responsible for recommending preventive medical services, specifically the distribution of PrEP (pre-exposure prophylaxis) drugs for HIV prevention. Jenny Ruff warns listeners that some content may be unsuitable for younger audiences and suggests skipping ahead if necessary [07:59].

Background and Arguments

The task force, originally established in 1984 to provide expert recommendations on disease prevention, gained enforceable authority with the Affordable Care Act. The plaintiffs argue that the task force members should be classified as principal officers appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate, thereby violating the Appointments Clause. Jenny Ruff explains, “The Appointments clause says the president shall appoint officers of the United States by and with the advice and consent of the Senate” [10:25].

Defense Perspective:

• Deputy Solicitor General Hashim Moupon asserts that task force members are inferior officers under the clause since they are subject to supervision by the Secretary of Health and Human Services (HHS). He emphasizes that the Secretary can review or rescind recommendations, maintaining oversight [12:06].
• Justice Sonia Sotomayor supports Moupon’s argument by comparing task force members to Supreme Court law clerks, who also exercise independent judgment despite being removable at will [13:58].

Plaintiff Perspective:

• Lawyer Jonathan Mitchell contends that the task force exceeds advisory roles by making binding decisions without proper presidential appointment and Senate confirmation. He argues, “The task force is doing a lot more than merely advising” [14:22].
• Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson questions the independence of the task force given the Secretary’s authority to review recommendations within a one-year interval [15:20].

Courtroom Dynamics and Potential Outcomes

As the case proceeds, Chief Justice John Roberts and Justice Elena Kagan express concerns about the structural validity of the task force’s establishment. Justice Brett Kavanaugh presses on statutory interpretations, leading to a nuanced debate about the scope of appointment powers [16:00].

David Bonson summarizes the complexities, noting, “Structure and all that kind of stuff... this is pretty inconsistent with everything that we've done in this area” [17:05].

The Supreme Court’s decision could redefine the Appointments Clause parameters and necessitate legislative adjustments if a constitutional violation is found [18:27].

Moneybeat: Analyzing the "Big Beautiful" Bill and National Debt

Overview of the Budget Bill

Kent Covington reports on Senate Republicans' scrutiny of the recently passed House budget bill, referred to by President Trump as his “big, beautiful bill.” This legislation includes tax cuts and allocations for border enforcement and national security [01:01].

David Bonson and Nick Eicher provide insights into the market's indifferent reaction to the bill’s passage. Bonson states, “The national debt is the greatest threat to our national security” [01:50], while Eicher critiques the bill’s insufficient spending cuts, labeling them as “wimpy and anemic” [01:26].

National Debt Concerns

With the Congressional Budget Office projecting a $37 trillion increase in national debt over the next decade, Senator Rand Paul warns of its implications for national security [01:36]. House Speaker Mike Johnson counters, asserting commitment to reducing debt over time [02:04].

David Bonson adds, “We've ballooned to $37 trillion. Public debt, now $29 trillion. The debt to GDP ratio stands at 120%” [23:03], highlighting the urgent need for fiscal responsibility.

Market Reactions and Bond Yields

In the Monday Money Beat, David Bonson discusses bond yields, challenging the prevalent narrative that rising yields signal distrust in U.S. creditworthiness. He argues that current yields reflect realistic expectations of economic growth and inflation, rather than fear [26:58]. Eicher supports this by explaining, “bond yields are for the long bond for 10 years... we have to understand bond yields are for the long bond for 10 years” [26:58].

Bonson emphasizes the importance of distinguishing between genuine economic indicators and political fear-mongering, stating, “We have to be immunized against false narratives” [26:58].

President Trump’s Address at West Point

Over the weekend, President Trump delivered a commencement speech at West Point, blending praise for the cadets with political critiques. He condemned previous administrations for unwieldy military engagements and criticized Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives. Trump declared, “They sent our warriors on nation building” [02:26], and asserted that such days are over [02:56].

Nuclear Energy Policies

President Trump signed executive orders empowering the Department of Energy to approve advanced nuclear projects swiftly. Senator John Barrasso defends the move, stating, “We need to be uranium here, the next generation nuclear power plants” [03:30]. However, critics argue that expedited approvals could compromise safety standards [03:07].

Food Stamp Restrictions and State Responses

Several states, including Indiana under Governor Mike Braun, seek waivers to prevent SNAP (Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program) recipients from purchasing sodas and candy. Eicher criticizes this interference, saying, “That's where you get the worst of government involved” [04:13]. Industry groups like the National Confectioners Association oppose these restrictions, arguing they minimally impact purchasing behaviors [04:25].

International Update: Ukraine Prisoner Swap

A significant prisoner swap between Ukraine and Russia saw over 300 prisoners exchanged, including Ukrainian soldiers committed to rejoining the front lines. Kent Covington reports, “We're going to have to enlist again. We'll take up weapons into our hands and defend Ukraine once again” [04:20]. This exchange occurred amid renewed Russian attacks on Kyiv, resulting in at least 12 fatalities [04:25].

Recent Court Decisions

The Supreme Court issued two key opinions last week:

1. Unanimous Decision: Upheld a fraud conviction of a government contractor despite the victim not suffering an economic loss.
2. Stalemate Decision: In a case on the constitutionality of a religious charter school, the recusal of Justice Amy Coney Barrett led to a 4-4 split, affirming the lower court’s shutdown of the charter school without setting a nationwide precedent [19:24].

Support and Donor Drive

Jenny Ruff highlights the ongoing Spring 2025 donor drive, welcoming new supporters and emphasizing the impact of listener contributions. She mentions, “Every new dollar that comes in is eligible for a one to one match” [06:32], encouraging listeners to visit their website to support the mission of biblically grounded journalism.

Memorial Day History Segment with Bob Case

Bob Case explores the historical and cultural significance of Memorial Day, tracing its origins to the Civil War's Decoration Day. He connects biblical narratives to American commemorative practices, highlighting texts like 2 Samuel 3:31 and the hymn “God of Our Fathers.” Case underscores the importance of remembering fallen soldiers, stating, “Memorial Day is a day to be thankful and remember those Abners who have fallen in the service of our country” [31:07].

He also discusses significant patriotic songs from the Great American Songbook, including “This Is My Country” by Don Ray and Al Jacobs, and reflects on the balance between honoring military service and celebrating national freedoms [35:07].

Conclusion

As the episode wraps up, Jenny Ruff reiterates the importance of Memorial Day and the podcast’s dedication to honoring those who served. She leaves listeners with a reflection from Psalm 119:132-133, emphasizing grace and peace [37:19].

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Notable Quotes:

• Jenny Ruff [00:05]: “We're grateful for their sacrifice and the freedom we have to speak the truth boldly and report the news without fear.”
• Nick Eicher [01:26]: “I think the cuts currently in the bill are wimpy and anemic, but I still would support the bill even with wimpy and anemic cuts if they weren't going to explode the debt.”
• David Bonson [01:50]: “The national debt is the greatest threat to our national security.”
• President Trump [02:26]: “Every cadet on the field before me should savor this morning because this is a day that you will never, ever forget.”
• Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson [15:20]: “How can it be that the task force is independent if the Secretary has a one year period of review before a recommendation goes into effect?”
• Nick Eicher [26:58]: “We have to be immunized against false narratives.”

This comprehensive summary captures the multifaceted discussions of the episode, from high-stakes legal debates and economic analyses to poignant historical commemorations, ensuring listeners are fully informed of the key themes and insights presented.

Transcript

[Jenny Ruff]

Good morning. It's Memorial Day and today a Supreme Court case involving religious liberty turns on a technicality. Christian businesses arguing an advisory board that became a powerful agency upsets our system of checks and balances.

[Nick Eicher]

You know, the idea that we would take a statute which doesn't set up an independent agency and declare it one strikes me as pretty inconsistent with everything that we've done in this area.

[David Bonson]

Also today, the Monday Money Beat. David Bond standing by to talk about market reaction to the big beautiful bill and a musical history book. Today.

[Jenny Ruff]

It's Monday, May 26th. This is the world and everything in it. From listener supported World Radio, I'm Jenny Ruff.

[David Bonson]

And I'm Nick Eicher. Good morning.

[Jenny Ruff]

Up next, Kent Covington with today's news.

[Kent Covington]

Senate Republicans are now taking a hard look at the budget bill passed in the House last week. That is, of course, what President Trump calls his big, beautiful bill. It includes tax cuts and funding for the president's other top priorities on border enforcement and national security. And on those points, Senate Republicans are largely united. But some, like Senator Rand Paul, say the bill fails to address Washington's spending problem.

[Nick Eicher]

I support spending cuts. I think the cuts currently in the bill are wimpy and anemic, but I still would support the bill even with wimpy and anemic cuts if they weren't going to explode the debt.

[Kent Covington]

The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office projects that the bill would add trillions to the national debt over a decade. And Paul says the spiraling debt is a threat to America's national security. House Speaker Mike Johnson responded on Sunday.

[David Bonson]

The national debt is the greatest threat to our national security, and deficits are a serious problem. What I think Rand is missing on.

[Kent Covington]

This one is the fact that we are quite serious about this.

[David Bonson]

This is the biggest spending cut in more than 30 years.

[Kent Covington]

Speaker Johnson adds that turning the debt around takes time, but the president and Republicans in both chambers are committed to that end. While some Republicans are concerned about overspending, Democrats slammed the bill, claiming it will cut important benefits and hand tax cuts to the wealthy. President Trump addressed graduating military cadets at West Point over the weekend.

[Nick Eicher]

Every cadet on the field before me should savor this morning because this is a day that you will never, ever forget.

[Kent Covington]

The president blended praise with politics in his commencement address. He criticized past administrations for involving U.S. troops in what he framed as unwise overseas entanglements.

[Nick Eicher]

They sent our warriors on nation building.

[Bob Case]

Crusades to nations that wanted nothing to do with us, led by leaders that.

[Nick Eicher]

Didn'T have a clue in distant lands.

[Kent Covington]

He also took aim at the prior administration for DEI initiatives and imposing social ideologies on the military. He said those days are over. Republicans are pushing back against criticism of the president's effort to speed up production of nuclear energy. President Trump signed executive orders Friday to grant the energy secretary authority to approve advanced nuclear designs and projects. Critics claim the move could compromise safety. But GOP Senator John Barrasso says never.

[Nick Eicher]

Again can we be dependent on Russia.

[David Bonson]

Or China for nuclear material or anything related to energy. The president is absolutely right. We need to be uranium here, the next generation nuclear power plants.

[Kent Covington]

Barrasso says ramping up energy production is key to America's economic and national security. He adds that we will need massive amounts of energy to win the AI race against China. Friday's orders would reorganize the U.S. nuclear Regulatory Commission to ensure quicker reviews of nuclear projects. Numerous states are asking the Trump administration for waivers to ban food stamp recipients from using those benefits to buy sodas and candy. Indiana is one of those states. Governor Mike Braun it doesn't make sense.

[Nick Eicher]

And that's where you get the worst of government involved.

[David Bonson]

They want to push it, I think.

[Nick Eicher]

For the wrong reasons. Then you get industry buying into it.

[Kent Covington]

That's not going to fly with the.

[Nick Eicher]

Current administration, nor with mine here in Indiana.

[Kent Covington]

Some companies and lobbying groups, though, are pushing back against the change. Those include the National Confectioners association, which argues that the restriction is not really affecting change. They claim Candy represents only 2% of purchases using so called SNAP benefits. Last week, a panel commissioned by the U.S. department of Health and Human Services issued a report identifying poor nutrition as a key driver of chronic disease, especially among youth in America. Former Ukrainian prisoners of war heard they're returning to Ukraine after Kyiv and Moscow completed a major prisoner swap. The two countries exchanged more than 300 prisoners on Sunday after exchanging hundreds more on Friday and Saturday. And at least one of those Ukrainian soldiers plans to head right back to the front lines, he said. We will return anyway and we'll enlist again. We'll take up weapons into our hands and defend Ukraine once again. Sunday's exchange came just hours after Russian drones and missiles again rained down on Kyiv and other regions in another massive attack, killing at least 12 people. I'm Kent Covington. And still ahead, the Monday legal docket. Plus a musical history book commemorating Memorial Day with World's Bob Case. This is the world and everything in it.

[Jenny Ruff]

It's Monday the 26th of May. Happy Memorial Day. We do want to honor those who gave their lives in service to country. We're grateful for their sacrifice and the freedom we have to speak the truth boldly and report the news without fear. So if you're making time for us today, we're glad you have this is the world and everything in it. Good morning. I'm Jenny Ruff.

[David Bonson]

And I'm Nick Iker. Hey, good word, Jenny. It is always right to express gratitude for the fact that freedom is hard fought and costly. So happy Memorial Day to all. Well, we are also grateful for the many new donors who joined us on Friday and over the weekend as we kicked off our spring 2025 new donor drive. Welcome to those of you who are new to us. Your support is what makes World possible. The new Donor drive continues today and through the week. And as we emphasized on Friday, generous longtime donors are offering to give alongside all new donors. So every new dollar that comes in is eligible for a one to one match. And so that doubles your new giving power. It's also a demonstration that no one here gives. This is a team effort and so if you make a first time gift, we have friends who will match it and make your money go twice as far. So be sure and visit wng.org newdonor Next up on the WORLD and everything in it legal docket. You do know we cover every case the Supreme Court hears each term. But this case in particular involves some content that may not be suitable for young listeners. So if you have children nearby, you may want to factor Fast forward the podcast about 12 minutes and then come back and listen later.

[Jenny Ruff]

Yeah, Today's case may not seem unsuitable. It centers on the Appointments clause of the U.S. constitution. But this little known clause plays a critical role in our system of separation of powers and checks and balances. To help unpack this case, and here's where it might become unsuitable for younger ears, we'll go back 44 years to June 5, 1981. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention published an article in its Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report. Five previously healthy young men in Los Angeles had contracted a rare form of pneumonia. Two had died.

[Nick Eicher]

More cases started popping up in other cities like San Francisco and New York. They were different illnesses, but all reflected immune systems that were not working.

[David Bonson]

The audio from WUSA9 by 1982, scientists identified this condition as AIDS Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome. It's caused by the human immunodeficiency virus, hiv. It's largely preventable given that it's transmitted most commonly through dangerous sex acts and injection drug use. Today, medication can help control the virus in those who have it. But There is no cure for those who don't have hiv. Drugs have been developed that are designed to be taken before exposure. They are delivered by pills or shots to a person who plans to engage engage in the behaviors just described. The drugs are known as PrEP pre exposure prophylaxis.

[Jenny Ruff]

In 2019, a government task force recommended PrEP for preventive medical services. Under the Affordable Care act, insurance plans are required to cover these drugs with no cost to the consumer, no co pays, no deductibles. A group of Christian business owners and individuals filed a lawsuit. They're opposed to a drug that conflicts with their conscience and goes against the biblical design for sex, a drug that's marketed to make harmful behavior, quote, unquote safer.

[David Bonson]

The plaintiffs argued the mandate violated their religious freedoms by requiring them to pay for these drugs. They've made arguments on religious liberty, but they also took aim at the task force that's making them pay. The argument concerns the structure of the task force, the way the members are chosen. They say it violates the Appointments clause of the U.S. constitution. And that is the issue before the Supreme Court, right?

[Jenny Ruff]

The Appointments clause says the president shall appoint officers of the United States by and with the advice and consent of the Senate. In other words, when nominating key government officials, neither the president nor the legislature goes unchecked. The president's picks are subject to the legislature's approval. These are known as principal officers.

[David Bonson]

Now, you keep reading and you see that the appointments clause also talks about a second category of officers, inferior officers. These can be appointed the same way, or Congress can pass a law vesting the power to appoint inferior officers in the president, a court, or a department head. So again, two branches at play to keep anyone from having too much control.

[Jenny Ruff]

So, to summarize, officers fall into one of two camps, principal or inferior. The line between the two can get a little fuzzy, and the parties to this lawsuit are fighting about which side of the line the task force falls on. The task force at issue in the case was originally established in 1984. It was made up of experts who recommended way to prevent disease, screening for diabetes or lung cancer, for example. The statute establishing the task force requires them to act independently and free of political pressure.

[David Bonson]

Back then, in the 1980s and 1990s, none of this was a big legal issue. The task force simply made recommendations, advice, guidance, suggestions. Task forces do things like that all the time. But along came the Affordable Care Act, Obamacare became law, and some of those task force recommendations now had the force of law. So the task force had real authority.

[Jenny Ruff]

So let's turn to how the parties tried to resolve this problem. The government takes the position that the task force members are inferior officers. An agency within the Department of Health and Human Services is responsible for convening the group. At oral argument, Deputy Solicitor General Hashim Moupon for the government said that setup means HHS Secretary Bobby Kennedy ultimately oversees it.

[Nick Eicher]

Task force members are inferior officers because they are subject to ample supervision by.

[Jenny Ruff]

The secretary in issuing recommendations that bind the public. Moupon said the secretary can review the recommendations or ask the task force to rescind them before they take effect. Chief Justice John Roberts said the task force has technical expertise in science and medicine. Is the secretary really supposed to supervise technical advice?

[Nick Eicher]

I mean, is the secretary really supposed to be in the position of going down the line and saying, yeah, I mean, I know you think we should use this particular thing with this atomic.

[Kent Covington]

Structure and all that kind of stuff.

[Nick Eicher]

But I've got a different view on that?

[Jenny Ruff]

Moupon said the secretary does have that authority, even if he defers to the expertise of the task force.

[David Bonson]

Justice Sonia S Mayor bolstered Moupon's argument. She gave the example of Supreme Court law clerks. They research technical legal issues to help the justices to offer more proof the task force members are inferior officers. Moupon said Secretary Kennedy has the power to fire them.

[Nick Eicher]

Most importantly, the secretary can remove task.

[Jenny Ruff]

Force members at will.

[Nick Eicher]

And this court has repeatedly recognized that at will removal power is a powerful tool for control.

[David Bonson]

Now that's important, but it's not the only factor. Justice Sotomayor returned to her law clerk analogy to show that subordinates who are subject to at will firings can and do exercise independent judgment all the time.

[Nick Eicher]

My law clerks I asked to give me their independent judgment of what an answer should be and they'll tell you there's sometimes a lot of times I don't accept it. And I certainly have the power to fire them. And they still do it, Correct, your honor.

[Bob Case]

All right.

[Nick Eicher]

That's the nature of asking people to advise you, correct?

[Jenny Ruff]

Lawyer Jonathan Mitchell argued for the Christian businesses. He said the task force is doing a lot more than merely advising. Mitchell made the argument that they are principal officers because they make final decisions that bind citizens and insurers and because they weren't appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate, the task force is unconstitutional. Mitchell went on to say that even if they lose that argument, that doesn't concede the other. He argues the members of the task force aren't inferior officers either, as the government suggests.

[Nick Eicher]

They cannot be inferior officers because their.

[Kent Covington]

Preventive care coverage mandates are neither directed.

[Nick Eicher]

Nor supervised by the Secretary of Health and Human Services or by anyone else who has been appointed as a principal officer.

[Jenny Ruff]

The statute establishing the task force doesn't.

[Nick Eicher]

Allow require that task force members and their recommendations be kept independent and to the extent that practicable, protected from any.

[Kent Covington]

Type of political pressure.

[David Bonson]

But Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson asked, how can it be that the task force is independent if the Secretary has a one year period of review before a recommendation goes into effect?

[Jenny Ruff]

Mr. Mitchell, can I ask you about the interval?

[Kent Covington]

Because we have something in this statute.

[Jenny Ruff]

The requirement that the Secretary establish this minimal interval after the recommendation is made, before they come, it comes into effect.

[Kent Covington]

So Mr. Moupon says during that interval.

[Jenny Ruff]

The Secretary can not only delay the.

[Kent Covington]

Recommendations, but can also, in his view, take some steps as to the constitution.

[Jenny Ruff]

Of the task force. The Secretary's getting involved.

[Kent Covington]

He's making decisions.

[David Bonson]

Mitchell clarified that one year interval is there for the sake of the insurers to give them time to adapt to the rules. He again emphasized that regardless of whether the Court considers considers task force members, principal or inferior officers really doesn't matter, there's still a constitutional problem. Mitchell emphasized that nothing in the statute gives the Secretary the power to appoint. The statute simply says an agency director will convene the task force. And Justice Clarence Thomas agreed. He said convene usually just means calling a meeting or something.

[Bob Case]

The Court was convened this morning. The chief didn't appoint anything.

[Jenny Ruff]

The government argues convene does mean appoint. The statute allows the agency director to appoint, and under the law, the Secretary has all the powers of a director. Justice Brett Kavanaugh asked Mitchell for his take on that. Reading the relevant statutes, they say those.

[Bob Case]

Together give the Secretary the authority to essentially stand in the shoes of the Director. You want to respond?

[Nick Eicher]

Sure.

[Kent Covington]

The Secretary is a liar.

[Jenny Ruff]

Mitchell said it's still problematic under the current structure. Sure, the Secretary can appoint, but so can others.

[Bob Case]

And you just said then you can read the statute to allow the Secretary to appoint.

[David Bonson]

That's kind of the end of it.

[Nick Eicher]

No, I don't think so.

[Jenny Ruff]

That's not vesting. Anyone can appoint.

[Nick Eicher]

Under the statute, the Secretary of Energy could appoint. The President could appoint. The AHRQ Director could appoint.

[Jenny Ruff]

Someone from the private sector could appoint.

[Nick Eicher]

The statute doesn't say anything at all about who appoints.

[Bob Case]

No one is vested with the authority.

[Jenny Ruff]

Because the statute takes no position on who appoints.

[Nick Eicher]

Yeah, so, okay.

[Bob Case]

And I think I understand your argument. Your argument. Something's gotta speak specifically to appointment.

[Jenny Ruff]

Again, the conflict here stems from the fact that the law establishing the task force was passed when it was still just advisory. The ACA essentially upgraded the task force into an agency and its members into officers. Nobody disputes that. Still, Justice Elena Kagan found it odd.

[Nick Eicher]

We don't go around just creating independent agencies. More often we destroy independent agencies. That seems to, you know, the idea that we would take a statute which doesn't set up an independent agency and declare it one strikes me as pretty inconsistent with everything that we've done in this area.

[Jenny Ruff]

The court could go in a lot of different directions here, both with clarifying the Appointments Clause parameters and the appropriate fix if it finds a constitutional violation.

[David Bonson]

Finally, the court handed down two opinions last week. First, in a unanimous decision, the court upheld a fraud conviction of a government contractor even though the victim of fraud fraud suffered no economic loss. And in the case on the constitutionality of a religious charter school, the court reached a stalemate. We reported this one two weeks ago. Justice Amy Coney Barrett recused from the case and that resulted in an evenly divided court four to four. What that means is the lower court's decision shutting down the charter school is affirmed. And because the Supreme Court's opinion is deadlocked, it sets no nationwide precedent.

[Jenny Ruff]

And that's this week's legal docket.

[Kent Covington]

Additional Support comes from biblestock.org Helping Bible teachers bring the land of the Bible to life through photos and videos. Biblestock.org.

[Jenny Ruff]

Coming up next on THE WORLD and everything in it, the Monday Money beat.

[David Bonson]

It's time now to talk business, markets and the economy with financial analyst and advisor David Bonson. David heads up the wealth management firm the Bonson Group, and he's here now. Good morning to you, David.

[Nick Eicher]

Well, good morning, Nick. Good to be with you.

[David Bonson]

Well, David, Speaker Johnson pulled off a razor thin vote. The House passed its big beautiful reconciliation bill and yet markets kind of gave it a shrug. You've said that the usual explanations are off base. So walk us through why you think investors didn't share this one.

[Nick Eicher]

Well, my view is that a lot of the narratives around what happened and market response are a little lacking, just in the sense that I don't believe that markets didn't know that a bill was going to get passed. I think there is no way markets could have known when and exactly what because there was a lot of unpredictability on those specifics based on what you said, the razor thin majority that Speaker Johnson had to work with with. But that's different than the markets being expected to breathe a sigh of relief that we extended the Trump tax cuts. I just have never believed that there was a point at which markets didn't know one way or the other that was going to happen. And I think that in terms of what the bill itself is, it's hard for me to believe that markets would be that surprised because most of what what we're talking about here is not really all that great for markets. I mean, the extending of the Trump tax cuts is status quo. Not extending the Trump tax cuts would have been disastrous. But I've referred to this before as asymmetrical risk reward. There was risk if the tax cuts were not extended, but not a lot of reward if they are in the sense that people are going to be paying the same taxes they were the year before. That isn't a pro growth tax cut. It's just an avoidance of a really problematic tax increase. Nick, the issue is the spending, okay? The issue is that we know that there is 36, almost $37 trillion of national debt, that the deficit for this fiscal year is over $1.8 trillion, that we're going to be adding to the national debt significantly. Is there a chance that the Senate ends up dealing with some of this? There's a chance, but I think it's pretty clear the politics of this. The Republicans have been asked to get in line and I don't think there's going to be enough. Maybe some modest adjustments, some modest tweaks, but for the most part, there just still is not a political will to deal with the spending and there's a willingness to add to the deficit it further, which is disappointing. It's not what markets are responding to this week. I don't believe markets are remotely surprised that we're still in a big spending mode. But, you know, personally, I'm disappointed. I'd hope more could get done there.

[David Bonson]

All right, David, let's talk a bit about the debt. It's been a good bit since we talked about the problem of the federal debt, which, if I have it right, has ballooned to $37 trillion. Public debt, now $29 trillion. The debt to GDP ratio stands at 120%. What does this mean? David, we've talked about this before, but it does bear repeating. I'd like for you to spend a few minutes talking about what it means to carry this level of debt.

[Nick Eicher]

Well, there's one other metric that you didn't share, which is the budget deficit to gdp. The percentage of the annual deficit divided by the total goods and Services of the economy that's running 6.1%. And from 2000 to 2020, the deficit to GDP was somewhere between 0 and 3%. And so what I'm getting at is we were growing the economy around the same level that we were growing the debt and now that is just significantly declined. The deficit is growing more than the economy. And that is the metric that has to change now because we have grown the debt itself from about 10 trillion when President Bush left office to getting close to 40 trillion now. We have an even larger need to deal with this. But even if we just said, hey, we're going to live with 37 trillion of debt forever and in the meantime we just want to stop the growth of that, then you need to get the debt growing less than the amount of the economy. And so you need something more pro growth. And I'm sorry, but no, tax on tips is not the pro growth growth prescription the doctor ordered. Now there is some pro growth in this tax bill. Okay? I think the, the 100% business expensing incentivizes further capital expenditures. The R and D research and development deduction gets enhanced, but neither of those were made permanent. And so you might get a kind of spurt of additional expenditures. But this temporary stuff that goes on to make it fit in a budget window is suboptimal for growth. So ultimately the debt has to be dealt with. And I've said this countless times, I'm never going to stop saying it. No honest person, left wing or right wing, conservative Democrat, it doesn't matter. Nobody is talking about dealing with the debt. If they're not talking about entitlements, if they're not talking about Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, these are the issues primarily feeding it. I would have hoped that this bill would have done more for discretionary spending. It didn't do that much. Look, I just want to remind everybody, the House Republicans when President Biden was in office passed a budget to cut spending over 10 years by $17 trillion. Now it didn't go anywhere because they didn't have the majority in the Senate or the White House. You know what the House Republicans just passed now 2 trillion over 10 years. So somehow 15 trillion extra could be cut when they're not in power. That can't be cut when they are in power. I mean, come on.

[David Bonson]

Yeah, good point. Hey, David, we've got to run here in a minute, but one last thing I think we have time for. You wrote in this week's Dividend Cafe about bond yields and I wonder if it's worth here at the end taking a minute or two to kind of talk about the particulars of the bond market reaction to Big Beautiful. You're saying there's a false narrative around that and I'd like for you to talk a bit about why that matters.

[Nick Eicher]

Well, it matters a great deal to always be immunized against false narratives. I think for investors and for people that listen to this who are trying to learn more about the economy. And it's become really quite systemic. This narrative of oh boy, the debt issue is bad, a premise I agree with and the bond market is rebelling against it. It a conclusion that is just demonstrably false. My own view is that we have to understand bond yields are for the long bond for 10 years. It really is the best measure we have of what people expect total economic growth to be, what's called nominal GDP growth. But that's a combination of inflation expectations and real growth expectations growth net of inflation. And so let's say you like I, Nick, would be really, really happy if we got 1.5% inflation for the next 10 years and 3% real GDP growth, which is, you know, 3.1 is what we averaged from World War II all the way to the financial crisis. Well, if you combine those two together, that would be four and a half. That's exactly where we're at now. Now people that are sitting here going oh, four and a half is so high the bond market doesn't trust American credit worthiness. Do they want a 3% yield? Because we had 2 to 3% bond yield from the financial crisis up to Covid. Why with very low inflation? Because we had very, very, very low growth. So I don't believe we're going to get 3% real growth. I certainly don't believe we're going to get higher than that. That and yet I don't understand the hand wringing over bond yields unless it gets 5, 6, 7%. And then you start saying, okay, it's either measuring in fears of higher inflation or it's measuring some sort of concern about the credit worthiness of the United States. But neither is even remotely on the table right now. And I think there's some maybe using it as a political diversion, but I have a problem with that because I want to be critical of the things that need to be criticized for the right reason. But to try to do fear mongering about something that isn't true in the present tense just desensitizes people. It makes them numb and not pay attention to what is a real fear. So you know, that's the reason it matters. Nick.

[David Bonson]

All right. David Bonson is founder, managing partner and chief chief investment officer at the Bonson Group. He writes regularly for World opinions [e-mail] David, thank you so much. We'll see you next week.

[Nick Eicher]

Thanks so much. Good to be with you.

[David Bonson]

Today is Monday, May 26th. Good morning. This is the world and everything in it from listener supported World Radio. I'm Nick Iger.

[Jenny Ruff]

And I'm Jenny Ruff. Up next, the world history book. Today is Memorial Day, a day that has roots in the Civil War. It began in the 1860s as Decoration Day when hundreds of new war cemeteries were established. Families gathered to lay flowers at the graves of their sons, husbands and fathers. By 1890, every Union state had adopted it.

[David Bonson]

After the two world wars, Memorial Day became a day of remembrance for all members of the US military who fought and died in service. Back in 1968, Congress set its yearly observance to this last Monday in May. Today, Bob Case considers how both the Bible and the great American songbook honor the fallen.

[Bob Case]

We are introduced to the first national important commemorative military memorial service in the biblical songbook. In 2 Samuel 3, the powerful Jewish king David and the nation of Israel have gathered to remember the great Israelite General Abner, murdered by a rival General Joab. 2 Samuel 3:31 has David in full mourning. Then David said to Joab and all the people with Joab, tear your clothes and put on sackcloth and walk in mourning in front of Abner. At the memorial service, David publicly recites his lyrical elegy with the famous closing refrain, do you not realize that a prince and a great man has fallen in Israel this day? This Davidic acclamation has reverberated for centuries in English speaking military funerals, ever since the publication of the 1611 King James Bond. A common hymn at religious military commemorations on Memorial Day is God of Our Fathers, the unofficial hymn of the United States Armed forces. Composed in 1876 by the country parsons, Daniel Roberts. It's fittingly played beautifully here by the President's own United States Marine Band. The lyrics include references to our collective reliance on God in this free land. By thee our lot is cast, Be thou our ruler, guardian, guide and stay. Turning now to a great American song of military remembrance. In the years before the Civil War, the United States had no universally recognized national anthem. As the clouds of war gathered, it was thought that an anthem was needed to inspire Union American patriotism. In the fall of 1861, Julia Ward Howe attended a Union army camp outside of Washington D.C. she heard the soldier singing the famous song John Brown's Body Lies a Mold set to the tune of an old Methodist camp meeting song, John Brown's body lies a moulding in the grave. She loved the vigor and the martial spirit of the music, but found the words inadequate for a lasting hymn of patriotism. Her famous Unitarian minister, Reverend James Freeman Clark suggested she write some new lyrics. Early the following morning in her her Washington D.C. hotel room, she wrote the words we sing today. Her lyrics cast the war as a terrible conflict in which one side has the advantage of God's terrible swift sword. The distinguished military historian Henry Steele comedy called her lyrics the one great song to come out of the Civil War, the Battle Hymn of the Republic. It's hard to find serious songs that celebrate and honor our fallen warriors in the Great American Songbook. The songs are mostly dedicated to love and romance. Most songs written during wartime were patriotic, catchy and geared to the universal themes of service and adventure.

[David Bonson]

He was a famous trumpet man from all Chicago Way. He had a pokey style that no one else could play. He was the top man at his craft.

[Jenny Ruff]

But then his number came up and.

[David Bonson]

He was gone with the draft. He's in the army now.

[Bob Case]

Don Ray became famous for his novelty song Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy performed by the Andrews sisters in 1941. But a year earlier, in 1940, he and movie score composer Al Jacobs wrote one of the most popular patriotic songs to come out of the Great American Songbook. This Is My country this is My country Land of my bird this is my. Not long in after publishing this Is My Country, Dong Re enlisted in the US army himself.

[Nick Eicher]

For this is my country to heaven.

[Bob Case]

To hold Christians are citizens of a heavenly country. We are called to love Christ and His kingdom. Mustable. But we're also to seek the good of the land God has placed us in. Memorial Day is a day to be thankful and remember those Abners who have fallen in the service of our country. They gave what President Abraham Lincoln called the last full measure of devotion supporting the principle of liberty and justice for all in the United States. We consider Memorial Day the unofficial start of summer. But we mustn't forget its true meaning. As we gather with friends and family, let us take time to reflect on and remember the uniformed fallen princes who will not be with us as we celebrate our hard won freedom. I'm Robert Case for this Is My.

[Nick Eicher]

Country country to have.

[David Bonson]

Tomorrow as more US States and even more countries embrace a separate what can be done to counter society's embrace of the culture of death and remembering one of the victims of last week's shooting at the Jewish Museum in Washington. That and more tomorrow. I'm Nick Iker.

[Jenny Ruff]

And I'm Jenny Ruff. The world and everything in it comes to you from World Radio. World's mission is biblically objective journalism that informs, educates and inspires the psalmist. Turn to me and be gracious to me, as is your way with those who love your name. Keep steady my steps according to your promise, and let no iniquity get dominion over me. Verses 132 and 133 of Psalm 119. Go now in grace and peace.