9.5.25 Culture Friday on redefining reality, a review of The Paper, and Ask the Editor

Summary

The World and Everything In It: Culture Friday on Redefining Reality, “The Paper” Review, and Ask the Editor

Episode Date: September 5, 2025
Podcast: The World and Everything In It
Hosts: Myrna Brown, Lindsay Mast
Guests: John Stonestreet (Colson Center, Breakpoint Podcast), Colin Garbarino, Paul Butler
Episode Focus: Discerning cultural shifts in morality and truth, protecting girls’ privacy, how art (and media) shapes values, a review of “The Paper” (the new Office spin-off), and the editorial role of memory in faith traditions.

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Main Theme

This episode scrutinizes the ways culture is redefining reality—morally and practically—highlighting three major areas:

• The societal shift toward labeling good as evil and vice versa, especially in immigration and gender policy debates
• The impact of activist art and entertainment as cultural guides
• Consequences for truth-tellers in societies where free speech is under threat

A review of the new TV series “The Paper” explores comedy’s evolving edge, and the “Ask the Editor” segment discusses how Christians should remember (but not venerate) religious relics.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Redefining Reality: Calling Evil Good and Good Evil

(timestamp: 06:01–15:47)

• Art As Activist Medium:

  • Take Us North, a video game simulating migrant journeys across the US/Mexico border, is discussed. Developers collaborate with undocumented immigrants and anthropologists to keep the narrative authentic.
  • John Stonestreet reflects on Neil Postman’s Amusing Ourselves to Death:

  “So much of our art and entertainment has become activist art and entertainment…Everything has to have an activist bent. It’s not about just kind of laughing and having a good time anymore.” (07:57)

  • Art as a mechanism “to embed ideas into societies—not through debate, but through imagination.” (09:00)

• UK Grooming Scandals & Cultural Blindness:

  • Authorities failing to protect girls from immigrant-perpetrated violence, prioritizing not appearing “racist” over victim safety.
  • Stonestreet:

  “There’s no way anyone would argue, ‘oh, yeah, it’s actually worse to have an opposition to illegal immigration than it is to rape a young girl.’ …And yet this is…what’s been embedded in UK culture…You end up becoming all upside down on it completely.” (09:42)

2. Protecting Girls’ Privacy Under New Gender Policies

(timestamp: 10:28–15:47)

• California School District’s Bathroom Policy:

  • Girls are forced to sign a religious or mental health exemption to avoid sharing bathrooms with boys identifying as female.
  • Lindsay Mast:

  “This seems to be setting up girls to be ashamed of having very normal desires for modesty, or to have to reveal their own private problems.” (11:01)

  • Middle schoolers staged walkouts to protest.

• Redefining “Normal” and Enforcing Confusion:

  • Stonestreet:

  “The normal posture is that boys should share girls’ private spaces…and if you disagree with that, that’s abnormal…This is the definition of losing touch with reality.” (12:22)

  • The invention of “cisgender” as a concept demonstrates the effort to redefine what is “normal” in gender discussions.

• Advice for Parents Facing Cultural Change:

  • Courage is Required:

    “We live in an age of deception and confusion. Orwell famously said, in an age of deception, telling the truth is a revolutionary act…as a parent, my job is to prepare my kid for the world they’re going to actually live in.” (14:25)

    • Cultivate discernment, and especially courage: “Virtues have to be practiced—they’re muscles we have to exercise.” (15:27)

3. Free Speech and Truth-Telling in England: The Graham Linehan Case

(timestamp: 15:47–19:25)

• Graham Linehan’s Ordeal:

  • Irish comedian and TV writer, outspoken critic of trans ideology, is exiled from the UK and arrested for his speech.
  • Linehan:

    “You cannot tell the truth without the police coming to your door.” (16:25)

  • Five armed UK police arrested him at Heathrow in a “bully move” for “telling the truth”—shows the cost of dissent.

• Parallel to US Satirists and Truth-Tellers:

  • Babylon Bee’s Seth Dillon, featured in the new documentary “Truth Rising,” is cited as another truth-teller facing culture’s resistance.
  • Stonestreet:

  “What it means to live out our calling, at bare minimum, is to be someone willing to tell the truth…sometimes [there’s] an initial cost…But you watch how God used those particular acts of courage…” (17:38)

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On Art and Activism:

  “Our art reflects culture, and sometimes our art leads culture…so much of our art and entertainment has become activist art and entertainment.” —John Stonestreet (07:45)

• On Inverted Morality:

  “There’s no way anyone would argue—'Oh, it’s actually worse to have an opposition to illegal immigration than it is to rape a young girl.'…And yet this is…what’s been embedded in UK culture…all upside down.” —John Stonestreet (09:42)

• On the Need for Courage:

  “Virtues have to be practiced—they’re muscles we have to exercise. This is an opportunity to exercise that muscle of courage.” —John Stonestreet (15:27)

• On Free Speech in the UK:

  “You cannot tell the truth without the police coming to your door.” —Graham Linehan (16:25)

• On Looking Back at Acts of Courage:

  “Soren Kierkegaard famously said that life has to be lived forward, but can only be understood backwards.” —John Stonestreet (18:25)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• 06:01–15:47: Culture Friday — activism in art, UK grooming gangs, activist education
• 10:28–15:47: Girl’s privacy and changing gender norms in California schools
• 15:47–19:25: Graham Linehan, free speech, and truth-telling consequences
• 20:52–26:01: Review: "The Paper," The Office spinoff
• 26:24–31:54: Ask the Editor — remembering the faithful, the role of relics

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Art & Culture Review: “The Paper”

(timestamp: 20:52–26:01)

• Overview: “The Paper,” a mockumentary Office spinoff set in a struggling local newspaper, helmed by Greg Daniels.

• Plot: A new idealistic editor (Domhnall Gleason as Ned) attempts to revive the “Toledo Truth Teller” amidst ridiculous budget constraints and incompetence.

• Style/Tone:

  • Lighter on risk than The Office:

    “Greg Daniels and company are playing it pretty safe…Watching the first season of The Office can be a startling experience…The Paper merely tiptoes where The Office once gleefully stomped.” —Colin Garbarino (23:44)

  • Lacks an equivalent to Michael Scott; eccentricities are spread among many characters.
  • More subdued tone, slightly less innuendo and crude humor than The Office; some PG-13 language on Peacock.
  • Oscar Nunez returns as Oscar the accountant.

• Memorable Moments:

  “Remember the five W’s?”
  “Is that a gang?”
  “No, it’s who, what, when, where, why…It’s what they teach you on the first day of journalism school.” (23:13)

• Reviewer’s Verdict:

  “The Paper has a more subdued tone than The Office, and it takes a few episodes to hit its stride. But fans of mockumentaries and cringe comedy will find a lot to like if they give it a chance.” —Colin Garbarino (25:38)

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Ask the Editor: Memory, Relics, & Protestant Perspective

(timestamp: 26:24–31:54)

• Listener Criticism: Recent segment on a Catholic relics collection in Pittsburgh sparked protest from some Protestants who wanted a clearer stance against relic veneration as "idolatry."

• Paul Butler’s Explanation:

  • Biblical – There’s value in remembering God’s faithfulness, as in Joshua’s stone monument, and Hebrews 11’s “cloud of witnesses.”
  • The story aimed not to promote relic-venerating but to encourage considering “ephemera of faith”—material reminders that point to Christ, not objects of worship.
  • Protestant listeners are urged to reflect on how material culture can help recollect and celebrate God’s faithfulness, without idolizing.

• Notable Quotes:

  “We've thought of it not as promoting Catholicism per se, but as an opportunity for Protestants to consider the ephemera of our faith, material reminders of the many faithful who make up a cloud of witnesses who preceded us and laid down their lives in service of the king and his kingdom.” —Paul Butler (31:12)

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Summary Flow & Utility for Non-listeners

This episode offers a deeply engaged critique of recent social issues—immigration, gender, and free speech—connecting contemporary news stories and cultural products (like TV and video games) to larger trends in Western morality. The interplay of biblical worldview with journalism, education, and the arts foregrounds the challenge for Christians: to discern, stand firm in truth, and cultivate courage in a world swiftly redefining reality. The episode’s review segment and editorial commentary broaden this theme, questioning the cultural significance of pop art and religious traditions while always returning to a biblical frame.

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Listen For:

• Cultural impacts of activist art — and how it shapes public morality (07:45–10:00)
• When protecting privacy becomes “abnormal” (12:22)
• The cost of speaking truth in environments where “wrong is right” (16:25–17:38)
• What makes “The Paper” both familiar and different from “The Office” (23:44–25:38)
• The editorial responsibility in handling faith traditions in reporting (31:12)

This summary should give you the substance, tone, and memorable moments from the episode—equipping you to discuss its content knowledgeably without listening.

Transcript

[Colin Garbarino]

Good morning.

[Myrna Brown]

The state of free speech in England, protecting girls privacy and what it looks like to call evil good and good evil.

[Lindsay Mast]

That's ahead on CULTURE Friday. And the new office spinoff heads to the newsroom.

[Colin Garbarino]

Remember the five W's?

[John Stonestreet]

Is that a gang?

[Colin Garbarino]

No.

[Lindsay Mast]

And ask the editor. Considering the record of Fates.

[Myrna Brown]

Its Friday, September 5th. This is the world and everything in it from Listener supported World Radio. I'm Myrna Brown.

[Lindsay Mast]

And I'm Lindsay Mast. Good morning.

[Myrna Brown]

Up next, Kent Covington with today's news.

[Kent Covington]

European leaders say they will continue to stand with Ukraine, that after a meeting with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky on Thursday and during that meeting, the leaders endorsed.

[Paul Butler]

The work of their chiefs of defence and defence ministers.

[Kent Covington]

European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said European allies will be, in her words, relentless in their efforts to keep Ukraine strong.

[Lindsay Mast]

We must turn Ukraine into a steel porcupine, indigestible for present and future aggressors.

[Kent Covington]

She says that means ensuring Ukraine's military is well trained and equipped. Leaders in Kyiv say they must have ironclad security guarantees ahead of any potential peace deal with Russia. And French President Emmanuel Macron spoke to that need at a news conference alongside Zelenskyy. Macron said more than two dozen countries have already pledged to send troops into Ukraine if it is threatened after the war ends. Fireworks on Capitol Hill as a Senate panel grilled Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. On Thursday, Democratic Senator Ron Wyden pressed Kennedy about the firing of the now former CDC director Susan Menarez after less than a month on the job.

[John Stonestreet]

Did you, in fact, do what Director.

[Colin Garbarino]

Monarch said you did, which is tell her to just go along with vaccine recommendations even if she didn't think such recommendations aligned with scientific evidence?

[John Stonestreet]

No, I did not.

[Kent Covington]

Democrats sparred with Kennedy throughout the hearing, and he fielded tough questions from some Republicans as well, including a pair of physicians, Senators Bill Cassidy and John Barrasso.

[John Stonestreet]

Secretary Kennedy, in your confirmation hearings, you promised to uphold the highest standards for vaccines. Since then, I've grown deeply concerned.

[Kent Covington]

Barrasso also questioned him about high profile staffing shakeups. For his part, Kennedy said, with regard to HHS vaccine guidance, we're going to.

[Paul Butler]

Make it clear, evidence based and trustworthy.

[Kent Covington]

For the first time in history, Kennedy has scaled back promotion of routine immunizations, emphasizing individual choice, and he has pressed for stricter scrutiny of vaccine messaging from agencies like the cdc. Elsewhere at the Capitol, a number of Republicans and Democrats joining forces in a bid to ban lawmakers from trading stock. Supporters of a new bill, call it an effort to end what they say is effectively legalized insider trading in Washington. It's a cause fostering rare harmony between conservatives like Congressman Timber Jet.

[Colin Garbarino]

This body has been enriching itself on.

[John Stonestreet]

The taxpayer's dimension and dad Gamut. It's got to stop.

[Kent Covington]

And liberals like Alexandria Ocasio Cortez.

[John Stonestreet]

If anyone says, you know, this isn't.

[Myrna Brown]

Fair, I'm going to have to divest.

[John Stonestreet]

All my stocks if I'm going to run for Congress.

[Lindsay Mast]

Maybe you should stay home.

[Kent Covington]

The bill would ban the trading of individual stocks, securities, commodities and futures by members of Congress as well as their spouses and dependent children. President Trump has said that he would sign a bill banning stock trading by lawmakers. Texas is working to make it easier for residents to sue providers who ship abortion drugs into the state. World's Benjamin Eicher has that story.

[John Stonestreet]

With Republican Governor Greg Abbott's pending signature. A new law will allow residents to sue out of state individuals or organizations.

[Colin Garbarino]

That ship abortion drugs into Texas.

[John Stonestreet]

In violation of state law, abortion drug distributors could face fines up to $100,000. Only a pregnant woman or her family is entitled to keep the full amount.

[Colin Garbarino]

Which is while others could keep up to $10,000 and must donate the remaining funds to charity. But some blue states have so called shield laws designed to protect abortion drug providers from penalties in other states. And that sets the stage for a.

[John Stonestreet]

Legal battle in federal court.

[Colin Garbarino]

For World I'm Benjamin Eicher.

[Kent Covington]

Italian designer Giorgio Armani has died at the age of 91. Armani rose to fame in the fashion world in the 1970s, eventually dressing the rich and famous in classic tailored styles. His black tie outfits and glittering evening gowns were often seen on award season red carpets. Today, the $10 billion Armani empire employs more than 9,000 people designing clothing, accessories and more. I'm Ken Covington. And straight ahead, responding when the world calls evil good and good evil. Plus, a new comedy from the Creators of the U.S. version of the Office. This is the World and everything in it.

[Lindsay Mast]

It's Friday, September 5th. Glad to have you along for today's edition of the World and Everything in It. Good morning. I'm Lindsay Master.

[Myrna Brown]

And I'm Myrna Brown. It's Culture Friday. And joining us is John Stonestreet, president of the Colson center and host of the Breakpoint Podcast. Good morning, John.

[John Stonestreet]

Good morning.

[Myrna Brown]

Well, let's start with Take US North. It's a socially conscious indie game that's described as a blend of art and technology to ignite positive cultural change. Here's the developer, Carla Reyes, talking about it.

[John Stonestreet]

The game that we're currently developing is our debut original project, which is a narrative adventure survival game about the migrant journey through the Sonoran Desert to cross the US Mexico border. So it's a very heavy hitting topic, but it's one that we're really trying to tackle sensitively and authentically.

[Myrna Brown]

To keep it authentic, Reyes says they've partnered with an anthropology lab at UCLA that specializes in clandestine migration. They're also collaborating with undocumented immigrant filmmakers with lived experiences of crossing the border. So, in other words, they're working with people who are in this country illegally. People on social media are calling this an illegal immigrant simulator posing as a video game. It caught my attention, John, because I had just read one of your recent Breakpoint articles where you pointed to a number of disturbing instances of unchecked violence against girls in the UK by immigrants. The story is that authorities in the UK are failing to protect these girls out of fear of being called racist and in the name of social cohesion. Now, admittedly, we're talking about two different stories, but both seem to have a common thread. And I'm not talking about the immigration issue. It's calling evil good and good evil. How do you see it, John?

[John Stonestreet]

Well, I'm not really familiar with the game to speak of, but it is interesting. I've thought for a long time, ever since reading Neil Postman, which became one of those frameworks by which I almost see everything about entertainment. His book Amusing Ourselves to Death, just in terms of the intersection between entertainment and the wider culture. And sometimes our art reflects culture, and sometimes our art leads culture. And so much of our art and entertainment has become activist art and entertainment. It's not about just kind of laughing and having a good time anymore. Everything has to have an activist bent. It's interesting because that's not something that Postman would have ever imagined. I think when he was writing about the power of entertainment to shape culture and how it exactly does that, he was talking more about distraction and about becoming silly. You know, I remember basically that was one of the big punch lines is, you know, entertainment makes us silly. And so when entertainment becomes culture, we become a silly culture. Well, we become an activist culture. I mean, you know, education is about activism. It's not about learning. And now our art is about this as well. And I know we're gonna get some emails about people who resist the ide of gaming, video gaming, being considered art, but it really is an expression of human creativity. It's something that goes after the imagination and not the brain. But of course, you see then that there are ways in which ideas get embedded into societies, and usually not through debate. And that's really what the commentary was about, this epidemic in the UK of the grooming gangs, the rape gangs targeting UK young, and then the police really either not doing anything or penalizing anyone who complains because it's a racist or a racially insensitive thing. And you see how these ideas really get embedded. And when you see it played out, it's so absolutely absurd. There's no way anyone would argue, oh, yeah, it's actually worse to have an opposition to illegal immigration than it is to rape a young girl. I mean, no one would actually say that out loud. And yet this is kind of, in a growing sense, what's been embedded in UK culture in terms of what the greatest evil is. And you end up kind of becoming all upside down on it completely. And so I don't think, you know, the stories are identical at all. But at the same time, it is interesting that in the. In the form of the imagination, you quote, unquote, explore things to become sensitive to someone's lived experience. But you can't do that without making a moral statement of some kind. And this is no exception to that.

[Lindsay Mast]

Well, John, next week, the Temecula Valley Unified School District in California is set to address a new bathroom policy exemption plan. The bathroom policy there allows students to use the one that aligns with their gender identity. So the gist of the policy is if your daughter doesn't want to share bathrooms or locker rooms with a boy claiming to be a girl, she needs to sign a document claiming she either has a religious objection or a mental health problem. So rather than protecting girls spaces, they are asking girls to either take on a religious label or admit some sort of mental health problem. This seems to be setting up girls to be ashamed of having very normal desires for modesty, or to have to reveal their own private problems. A whole host of issues. Now, I will say there are some devout Christ followers on that board and in that community fighting back against this, at least one of them publicly, asking for prayers for wisdom and unity and protection and discernment.

[Paul Butler]

So we just go back to Genesis 3 and say we just want privacy for our students now, and that's what we want.

[John Stonestreet]

So what's happening behind the scenes?

[Paul Butler]

You have site administrators, district administrators, teachers, board members like us trying to come up with a solution to deal with this wokeism, because that's what it is.

[Lindsay Mast]

The California Family Council says that earlier this week, there was a middle school walkout over this at a school where girls are being asked to share a bathroom with the boys. So we're talking 11, 12, 13 year old girls here. Middle school bathrooms and locker rooms during puberty are already sensitive areas. And now to essentially tell girls they have a mental problem because they want privacy. How would you advise parents to talk about the effects of this on girls if it moves forward or, God forbid, spreads?

[John Stonestreet]

Well, listen, this is a better example, I think, even of the game of callings. Scripture says woe to those who call right wrong and wrong right. And we often think about that as being true of individuals, which it is. But it can be true of entire communities, it can be true of entire societies, it can be true of entire civilizations who call up, down, and down, up. I mean, think about how this has reversed. Now, the way this law is being written and implemented, the normal posture is that boys should share girls private spaces and girls should share boys private spaces. And if you disagree with that, that's abnormal. This is the first time in the history of the planet where anyone's even thought about this crazy idea, much less implement it, much less enforced it on adolescent and pre adolescent young women. I mean, this is the definition of losing touch with reality. And you think about all the language games that have taken place in the entire LGBTQ movement. I remember the first time I heard the word cisgender, right? The idea that we need a word that refers to. To the fact that someone would continue to identify with their biological sex for their life, which is exactly where 99% of the population through the history of the world would fit into that. It's like, why do we need a category for normal? Well, you need it so that you can redefine normal. And this is exactly what this law does. It flips it upside down. I mean, listen, it's offensive enough that the religious objection is being put into the same category as a mental health problem. I mean, that's offensive. But the bigger question here, believe it or not, yeah, trust me, I want to blow a gasket over that one. But to actually just flip the definition of normal is what this entire movement has been about from the very beginning. And it happens then in the form of law and policy. I appreciate you, by the way, mentioning the believers in Temecula. Some of those I know, I certainly know the California Family Council. I'm so grateful for their courage and their voice, and they are showing us what to do. So to go back to your question, which I know was a long time ago about how do we advise parents. There's just so much about this moment where I think that we live in an age of deception and an age of confusion. And George Orwell famously said, in an age of deception, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. I believe, as I've said many, many times here, that God determines the cultural moment in which we live. In other words, we're not just called to a job or to a ministry or to an act of charity and kind, although we are. But we're called to a particular time in history. And if that time is like ours, where up is being called down and down is being called up and right is being called wrong and wrong is being called right, then it is our calling to be truth tellers. As a parent, my job is to prepare my kid for the world they're going to actually live in, not the world I want them to live in. So part of it is not just cultivating discernment, although it is not just helping them understand and embrace the truth, although that's true. But it's also to cultivate courage. And courage is a virtue. And virtues have to be practiced. We have virtue muscles. These aren't like helmets that we put on. They're muscles we have to exercise. And so I would say this is an opportunity to exercise that muscle of courage. That's a really hard thing to think about as a parent with a kid, but that's, I think, what it means to be called to this moment.

[Myrna Brown]

Well, we'll wrap up with a story about Graham Linehan. He's an Irish comedian, writer, and co creator of two popular sitcoms in the United Kingdom. He's also one of Britain's most outspoken critics of trans ideology. And for taking that stand, he's been sued, banned from the social media platform X and ostracized from the showbiz community. In fact, it got so bad, he says he had to leave the UK and move to America. Here he is talking about the state of free speech in England.

[John Stonestreet]

The country's almost impossible for someone like.

[Myrna Brown]

Me to live in.

[John Stonestreet]

You cannot tell the truth without the.

[Myrna Brown]

Police coming to your door. I actually have to come back at.

[Paul Butler]

The start of next month to go.

[John Stonestreet]

On trial in an absurd case that you'll see just how stupid it is when it happens.

[Myrna Brown]

That was just a couple of weeks ago. And then earlier this week, while traveling from Arizona back to London, he was arrested by police at Heathrow Airport and tossed in a cell. So as I read about his ordeal, I couldn't Help but think about Babylon Bee creator Seth Dillon. Of course, he'll be featured in today's global streaming premiere of the documentary Truth Rising. And John, I can't think of a better time for this documentary about Standing for the Truth to be released.

[John Stonestreet]

I can't either. I think that's exactly the point of Truth Rising. And as the focus on the family and the Colson center, as we started kind of going down the path to create this film along with our friend and the guy that I call the Gandalf of our age, Os Guinness, that is what really emerged, that this is what it means to live out our calling, at bare minimum, is to be someone willing to tell the truth. But this story about Linehan is just so absolutely incredible. One of our my colleagues pointed out the fact that in his, as he described it, five UK policemen came to arrest him armed. Now, you know, a policeman being armed in the United States is not unusual, but in the uk, you don't know. And not just one, but five. And you also think about what a bully move this was, how pathetic, how sad. You think about kind of the initial cost that people sometimes have to pay for being willing to speak up and say the truth. The story of Seth Dillon and the Babylon Bee is one of those. Certainly the story of Jack Phillips, which we also tell in Truth Rising, is one of those. And then you watch how God used those particular acts of courage and there's no way you could have ever imagined, you know, everything that would line up because of that. Soren Kierkegaard famously said that life has to be lived forward, but can only be understood backwards. Seth Dillon and the Babylon Bee, they're looking backwards right now, watching God's hand. Jack Phillips has become an expert at recognizing how God orchestrated and arranged his obedience and brought about good in the name of Christ. And you know what? This comedian will at one point, I think, be able to see that as well. He's not at that place now. He's looking forward. And it looks crazy because we do live in a, in a culture that calls up, down and down, up, which tells you just how important it is, how effective it can potentially be to tell the truth.

[Lindsay Mast]

John Stonestreet, president of the Colson center and host of the Breakpoint podcast. Thank you so much, John.

[John Stonestreet]

Thank you both.

[Kent Covington]

Additional support comes from Dort University offering.

[John Stonestreet]

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[Kent Covington]

Edu and from Eyewitness powerful audio dramas bringing faith, courage and history to life in unforgettable ways. At the letter I witnesspod.com.

[Lindsay Mast]

Today is Friday, September 5th. Thank you for turning to world radio to help start your day. Good morning, I'm Lindsay Mast.

[Myrna Brown]

And I'm Myrna Brown. Coming next on the world and everything in it, one of the shows that remade television finally gets a spin off. Here's arts and culture editor Colin Garbarino.

[Colin Garbarino]

It's been more than a decade since the Office ended its nine season run on NBC, but the mockumentary series depicting the ups and downs of a paper company remains firmly entrenched in America's cultural consciousness. Now the Office showrunner Greg Daniels returns with a spin off series called the Paper.

[Paul Butler]

And here we are, the Toledo Truth Teller, the local newspaper.

[Colin Garbarino]

How did we get here? In the first episode, the documentary crew from the original series heads back to Scranton. Twenty years after they began chronicling the lives of Dundermift employees, they learn the company was bought by a paper conglomerate.

[Paul Butler]

Innovate sells products made out of paper. So that might be office supplies. That might be janitorial paper, which is toilet tissue, toilet seat protectors, and local newspapers. And that is in order of quality.

[Colin Garbarino]

Enervate is based in Toledo, Ohio, in a historic building that once housed the city's newspaper. The Toledo Truth Teller. That bastion of midwestern journalism has fallen on hard times. More than a thousand newspaper employees used to fill the nine story structure. Now the entire staff occupies half of one floor, sharing the other half with the sales force for softies. Bathroom tissue.

[Paul Butler]

That's absolutely insane if I do say so myself.

[Colin Garbarino]

But the Truth Teller is getting a new editor in chief who plans to improve the newspaper's fortunes. I have a lot in common with Superman, too. We each have our kryptonite. For example, for Superman, it's, well, kryptonite, obviously. For Clark Kent, it's Lois Lane. And for me, I guess my kryptonite is my love of journalism. Domhnall Gleason, who's probably best known for his appearances in the Harry Potter films and the Star wars sequels, plays the idealistic Ned. He's in way over his head, especially since he doesn't have the necessary budget to improve the paper. He's stymied at every turn by Enervate's upper management and one of his own editors.

[Paul Butler]

And would all of these be paid positions?

[Colin Garbarino]

Yes, but they would make the paper worth reading again.

[Myrna Brown]

Can we do that?

[Paul Butler]

No, no, no.

[Colin Garbarino]

To reinvigorate local journalism, Ned must recruit folks from around the office to act as volunteer reporters.

[Paul Butler]

I wrote a paper in junior high.

[Colin Garbarino]

Not quite the same Thing I've tweeted. You've tweeted?

[Paul Butler]

I'm in a group text.

[Colin Garbarino]

Okay. Much of the show's comedy comes from watching these painfully inept amateurs try to piece together news stories. Remember the five W's?

[Paul Butler]

Is that a gang?

[Colin Garbarino]

No, it's who, what, when, where, why. It's what they teach you on the first day of journalism school.

[Paul Butler]

So not a gang.

[Colin Garbarino]

But just like in the Office, the Paper doesn't merely focus on the staff's professional activities. We get plenty of personal rivalries and romances as well. The kinds of emotionally fraught situations that made the Office so relatable.

[John Stonestreet]

Detrick thinks I'm sad all the time, but actually, a lot of the times I'm just tired of pretending he cheered me up the last time.

[Colin Garbarino]

Of course, the big question is, how does the Paper compare with the Office? On the whole, I would say Greg Daniels and company are playing it pretty safe with the Paper. Something they didn't do with the Office. Watching the first season of the Office can be a startling experience. I still wonder how they got away with putting some of those episodes on network television. The series didn't pull any punches as it skewered social decorum and politically correct office culture. The Paper merely tiptoes where the Office once gleefully stomped. How you doing?

[John Stonestreet]

My name is Desic Moore. I sell ads for the paper, which.

[Colin Garbarino]

Means I'm not supposed to interact with anybody in news. Ken calls it the Chinese Wall, which I thought was wrong, but I guess.

[John Stonestreet]

It'S an actual news term.

[Colin Garbarino]

Another difference is that since the Paper is on Peacock rather than network television, episodes sometimes include PG13 language. But overall, the series has less innuendo and crudity than the Office had. But maybe that's to be expected since there's no character as outrageous as Steve Greil's Michael Scott. Instead of having one maniac who sucks everyone else up into his whirlwind, this show takes Michael Scott's many eccentricities and dispenses them among the various characters in little doses. Every one is somewhat quirky. This means that the audience is deprived of having a self aware Jim and Pam to identify with when the story veers into absurdity. The show does, however, have Oscar Nunez reprising his role as Oscar the accountant from the original series.

[Paul Butler]

Not again.

[John Stonestreet]

I'm not agreeing to any of this.

[Colin Garbarino]

Don't you guys have enough? After nine years, nobody wants this. I actually think some people will want this. The Paper has a more subdued tone than the Office, and it takes a few episodes to hit its stride. But fans of mockumentaries and cringe comedy will find a lot to like here if they give it a chance. I'm Colin Garbrino.

[Myrna Brown]

Today is Friday, September 5th. Good morning. This is the world and everything in it from listener supported World Radio. I'm Myrna Brown.

[Lindsay Mast]

And I'm Lindsay Mast. Finally today, Ask the Editor World executive producer Paul Butler is here now with an inside look at why we chose to run a recent story.

[Paul Butler]

As an amateur historian and documentary filmmaker, one of my favorite portions of the Old Testament is from Joshua, chapters three and four. You'll remember the account. After 40 years in the wilderness, the children of Israel are finally entering the land of promise. The priests are told to stand in the middle of the Jordan river with the Ark of the Covenant. When they enter the water, the Jordan river responds, much like the Red Sea had done four decades earlier. God causes the seasonally high river to stop flowing and the people cross over on dry ground. But before the priests can exit the river, a man from each tribe is commanded to take a large stone from near where the priests are standing and carry those rocks to their campsite, their first site inside the promised land, an area later known as Gilgal. God tells Joshua this pile of stones will be a monument, a sign for those who will come after them, evidence for their children and grandchildren of what God had miraculously done there. These stones, or ebonim, were to be a memorial for the nation forever. When writing any history, researchers, of course, comb through original documents, diaries, oral histories. But another important thread of research surrounds what's known as ephemera. These are physical fragments that give researchers an insight into the interests, values and culture of a subject or a particular time. You can think of ephemera as the junk drawer of historical research. They're just fragments that, on their own, don't tell much of a story. But when considered together or in the context of history, often a vivid picture emerges. They are informal monuments to the events of history. Well, that brings me to some criticism we received after last month's feature on a Catholic church in Pittsburgh that has one of the largest collections of relics in the world, second only to the Vatican itself. A handful of listeners expressed concern with what they saw as a lack of clarity and biblical objectivity in our reporting. Many said we should have more clearly stated that those who venerate relics are participating in idolatry. One listener, who didn't want her name mentioned writes, from a Protestant perspective, I believe relics to be worthless and have no Christian value. Les Osterlin from Minneapolis suggested that focusing on relics takes away from God's glory and puts it on some relic or a person for living a good life when we should be glorifying and worshiping God alone. He goes on in his feedback to ask, what's the point of this story? As the producer, the world and everything in it, and the executive producer for World Radio, let me try to tie these threads together and briefly explain why we approved the story and included it in our program. Hebrews chapter 11 includes what many call the hall of Faith, a significant list of faithful and righteous saints who fill the pages of the Old Testament. There is biblical precedent to remember those who have gone before us not to elevate their righteousness, but to elevate the work of God in the world through them. The author of Hebrews goes on to refer to them as a great cloud of witnesses, and as we consider them, we are to lay aside every weight and sin that ensnares us, just like they did. Now, to be clear, the author goes on to say in Hebrews chapter 12, verse 2 that we are to look to Jesus as the author and finisher of our faith. He is to be our focus. So that helps us know what to do with the previous chapter as we consider the saints of old and all their foibles. The benefit comes in how they point us to the Savior and secondarily instruct us on how to live in this world as we do. And that brings me back to our report. The primary point of the story was not a warning against idolatry, which many thought should have been the emphasis. I approve the story because I believe there is a place for remembering the faithful since the birth of the church, particularly the martyrs. I think of the Apostle Paul who encouraged the church in Corinth to follow his example of following Christ's example. Now, perhaps our story didn't go as far as many wished, but I will say that the second voice in Emma Eicher's story did point out that the veneration of relics is rooted in Roman paganism. He also observed that many everyday Catholics are likely doing much more than just honoring the relics and warned against worshiping them. We've thought of it not as promoting Catholicism per se, but as an opportunity for Protestants to consider the ephemera of our faith, material reminders of the many faithful who make up a cloud of witnesses who preceded us and laid down their lives in service of the king and his kingdom. Returning to the biblical site of Gilgal and the stone pile monument for just a moment in Hosea. We later learn that Judah eventually made that area a center of great idolatry. They forgot God and the story of his faithfulness that a pile of stones was there to testify to. May we not forget. I am Paul Butler.

[Lindsay Mast]

All right, it's time to name the team who helped make things happen this week. Colin Garbarino, Johnstonestreet, Anna Johansen Brown, Becca McCallum, Mary Muncie, Cal Thomas, Hunter Baker, Teresa Haynes, Nick Eicher, Josh Revisit, Janie B. Cheney, Arsenio Orteza, Josh Schumacher, David Bonson, Emma Eicher and Mary Reichard. Thanks also to our breaking news crew, Kent Covington, Mark Mellinger, Travis Kircher, Christina Grube, Steve Klosterman and Lindi Langdon. And thanks to the moonlight maestros, Ben Jeiker and Carl Peetz. Paul Butler is executive producer, Harrison Waters is Washington producer. Chris. Kristen Flavin is features editor and Les Sillers is our editor in chief. I'm Lindsay Mast.

[Myrna Brown]

And I'm Myrna Brown. If you enjoyed the program this week, could you take a moment and share it with a friend? It really helps to grow the program. Send a link to a particular story or from your podcast player, share the link to the whole thing. Thanks. The world and everything in it comes to you from World Radio. World's mission is biblically objective journalism that informs, educates and inspires. The psalmist writes, for God alone my soul waits in silence. From him comes my salvation. He alone is my rock and my salvation my fortress. I shall not be greatly shaken. Verses 1 and 2 of Psalm 60. Here we are at the end of another week. Be sure to go to a Bible believing church this weekend and give praise to the Lord. Encourage others and let others encourage you. And Lord willing, we'll be right back here with you on Monday. Go now in grace and peace.