Them Before Us Podcast #096 | Talking Toxic Mom Groups & Cash for Babies?

Summary

Podcast Summary: Them Before Us Podcast #096 | Talking Toxic Mom Groups & Cash for Babies?

Date: January 13, 2026
Host: Jennifer Friesen (Training Director, Them Before Us)
Key Guests/Contributors: Katie Faust, Sam (“Pro Life Sam”)

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Episode Overview

This episode splits into two primary themes:

1. The problem of declining birth rates and the international response, including the debate over financial incentives ("cash for babies") and their effectiveness.
2. Navigating toxic dynamics in “mom groups,” inspired by celebrity Ashley Tisdale’s recent reflections, and how Christian frameworks can foster healthier communities.
   The episode closes with a new segment, “Here For The Comments,” highlighting the meanest and most ridiculous hate comments the team receives online, mixing humor with insights on online advocacy and criticism.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Population Decline: A Global “Winter”

• Initial Framing:
  “We are in a population winter.” (A, 00:08)
  Both hosts highlight the demographic crisis: nearly all developed countries are below replacement fertility rates, facing potential long-term population shrinkage.

• Historical Perspective:
  Katie recalls learning in the 90s about “overpopulation” anxieties and policies (e.g., China’s one-child policy), which reality has radically undercut:

  “Turns out that was 101,000% wrong... we are in a massive population decline... some countries may go extinct in a couple hundred years.” (Katie, 01:04–02:47)

• Government Approaches:
  Governments (Japan, Scandinavia, etc.) have tried various pronatalist policies—direct financial incentives, tax credits, paid parental leave—but with limited fertility impact.

  “Money has not made a difference.” (Katie, 02:48)

  Jennifer discusses the Institute for Families study (May 2025):

  “When governments increase direct financial support for children, fertility rises by a demographically meaningful amount.” (Jennifer, 03:05)

  In the U.S., proposals focus on expanding tax credits and indexing support to inflation, but the hosts remain skeptical about real impact.

• Root Causes: The Marriage Factor Katie strongly argues the main factor is later marriage:

  “From the data I have seen, there is one thing... that directly increases the birth rate. One, and it is get married sooner.” (Katie, 04:32)

  She connects delayed marriage to fewer children per family (even for women who wanted more):

  “Maybe she can have one baby, maybe she can have two, unlikely she'll be able to have four.” (Katie, 04:32–05:47)

  The deeper issue, she contends, is social and cultural—discouraging early marriage, prioritizing career/education above family-building:

  “We won't do is tell people to change their sexual decisions, to tell people to change their relationship expectations... you should actually prioritize marriage and kids in your 20s.” (Katie, 05:47)

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2. Cultural Narratives, Government, and Motherhood

• Retro Myths & Policy Realities: Jennifer and Katie critique modern narratives that paint the 1950s family as purely oppressive for women, and trace how economic and policy shifts deeply affected family formation.

  “The government had everything to do with wanting another 50% of the populace in the workforce.... They benefit from more bodies in the workplace and full control over your children.” (Jennifer, 06:50–09:24)

  They argue for reframing motherhood and marriage as culturally vital, suggesting that governments were more than passively uninvolved—they actively shaped norms for economic reasons.

• Countries That Buck the Trend:
  Katie notes Israel and Mongolia are unique for maintaining replacement fertility levels:

  “They tell a very elevated story about the importance of motherhood. Mothers are exalted and revered... there’s a whole narrative around the importance of this role that only a woman can play.” (Katie, 09:24)

  The hosts see this as cultural “storytelling”—attaching value, prestige, and community narrative to motherhood (and, by extension, fatherhood).

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3. Toxic Mom Groups: From Celebrity Culture to Everyday Experience

(Segment Begins at 11:56)

• Ashley Tisdale's Case:
  Jennifer recaps Ashley Tisdale (now Ashley French), a celebrity who experienced exclusion and "toxic" dynamics within a celebrity mom group—mirroring high school cliques.

• Gendered Social Dynamics:
  Katie observes that women tend to express conflict less directly, often via gossip or exclusion:

  “We tend to go around back... a little more underhanded comments… gossip does tend to be a little bit more of a female specific sin.” (Katie, 13:04)

  She links macro trends (cancel culture) with micro behaviors in mom groups—ostracism instead of direct conversation.

• Christian Community Contrast:
  Katie says, in Christian groups, relational ethics—directness, inclusion, caring for the “weaker” member—significantly reduce toxicity:

  “I exist not so that I can get what I want out of this relationship... a lot of the reason I exist is to make sure that she gets invited to happy hour.” (Katie, 13:04–15:40)

  She argues for biblical conflict resolution—private confrontation, not public shaming:

  “In Christian circles, it doesn't matter… we’re supposed to be different, do different.” (Katie, 16:50)

• The Cost of Exclusion:
  Katie highlights the real pain of social isolation:

  “It's detrimental to who we are as humans… it's an opportunity for all of us to reject the way the world operates when it comes to connecting.” (Katie, 15:40–16:50)

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4. "Here for the Comments": Hate, Humor, and Advocacy

(Segment Begins at 17:47)

• Premise:
  Jennifer and Sam (“Pro Life Sam”) introduce a new segment where they read (and sometimes rate) hate comments received on Their Before Us content, using humor as a tool to deflect vitriol and teach effective responses.

• Most Notable Hate Comments:

  • “I hope you choke on your Christmas dinner.” (Day 1, 21:22)
  • “Religious freaks.” (Day 2, 22:54)
  • “F off and die.” (Day 3, 24:34)
  • “Your kind is literally holding us back as a nation.” (Day 4, 26:01)
  • Direct death threats, e.g., "end Katie Faust" or "I hope you get hit by a car, a train, a rock or a stray bullet..." (Around 28:30)
  • "Drink bleach."
  • “How do we end Christianity? Simple: criminalize it with a strong negative deterrent such as the death penalty.” (Day 9, 29:50)
  • Criticism for using a rainbow in an image ("deep inner evil within you. Disgusting." Day 10, 31:15)

• Commentary on Hate:
  Jennifer and Sam both mock and dissect the logic of the comments, pointing out inconsistencies, the progressive use of “progress” as a buzzword, and the irony when critics accuse them of backwardness.

  • “Christianity has built society, and progressivism is actually reverting us back to…child slavery, child sexual abuse.” (Jennifer, 27:11-28:22)
  • On direct threats: “Christianity thrives under pressure and heat because nobody's doing it for fake, you know?” (Jennifer, 30:06)

• Final Reflections:
  Sam:

  “I wish them all well, I pray for them, and I hope that their lives get a little bit better so they don't have to spend their time commenting really awful things on strangers' Facebook pages.” (Sam, 32:50)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (w/ Timestamps)

• “Turns out that was 101,000% wrong... we are in a massive population decline...” (Katie, 01:27)
• “There is one thing that directly increases the birth rate... and it is: get married sooner.” (Katie, 04:32)
• “The government had everything to do with wanting another 50% of the populace in the workforce.” (Jennifer, 06:50)
• “They [Israel and Mongolia] tell a very elevated story about the importance of motherhood... there's a whole narrative around the importance of this role that only a woman can play.” (Katie, 09:24)
• “I exist not so that I can get what I want out of this relationship... a lot of the reason I exist is to make sure that she gets invited to happy hour.” (Katie, 15:04)
• “It's detrimental to who we are as humans... social isolation is incredibly painful.” (Katie, 15:55)
• “We’re gonna do more ‘Here For The Comments’ in the future, teach you how to reply to the haters…” (Jennifer, 33:02)

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Suggested Listening Timestamps

• [00:08] – Introduction of population “winter” and pronatal incentives
• [04:32] – Marriage rate as the main driver of fertility decline
• [09:24] – Israel and Mongolia's unique cultural approach to motherhood
• [11:56] – Ashley Tisdale’s toxic mom group and broader mom-group dynamics
• [13:04] – Gendered conflict and Christian approaches to healthy social groups
• [17:47] – Beginning of "Here For The Comments" segment
• [21:22] – The Twelve Haters of Christmas and standout hate comments

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Tone & Style

Warm, direct, sometimes wry or irreverent—especially during the hate-comment segment, where humor and camaraderie soften the sometimes toxic digital atmosphere. The discussion is both pragmatic (citing studies and policy specifics) and values-driven, reflecting the hosts’ Christian ethos but aiming for broad, evidence-based children’s rights advocacy.

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Conclusion

This episode advances the Them Before Us mission by:

• Challenging common beliefs about population and pronatal policy,
• Urging a revamp of marriage/family narratives over financial incentives alone,
• Offering practical wisdom on navigating toxic social environments, and
• Equipping listeners to face online hostility with resilience and wit.

Listeners leave with a deeper understanding of population dynamics, the social dynamics shaping family life, and how to stand strong for children’s rights (and personal dignity) in both public and private spheres.

Transcript

[A]

Hey everyone. You are about to hear a piece of a conversation we recorded for our radio program that airs on American Family Radio on the weekends. But this is a great conversation Katie and I had about how to incentivize people to have more children, which is extremely important for developing nations right now. I don't think there's a single developing nation, maybe two, that are having enough children to offset how many of their citizens are dying. We are in a population winter. Katie and I will get into that. And we also talk about what does it look like to be in a toxic mom group. Celebrity Ashley Tinsdale, married name Ashley French, wrote about getting stuck in her celebrity toxic mom group. And Katie shares her insights on why mom groups can get toxic and what we should be looking for, especially if you're a believer, our friend groups should look different, can look different. So I hope you enjoy this part of our conversation.

[B]

You know, I remember when I was in high school in the 90s and I was in like a global affairs class and we had to read articles on overpopulation and how overpopulation was the big problem happening in the world and that it created conflicts across borders and it stressed and depleted resources and there was going to be more wars over water and that overpopulation was the root of all evils. And obviously there were some governments that took that really seriously. You know, the year that I was born was the year that China instituted their one child policy because they felt like the scarcity of resources was going to demand that they reduce their population. And it turns out that was 101,000% wrong because now we are in a massive population decline that we're probably going to see the eradication of some several ethnoses, the Koreans, at least the South Koreans, the Japanese, many smaller countries in Europe, they are so far below replacement rate when it comes to sustaining their population that they may go extinct in a couple hundred years. So it is not an overpopulation crisis. It is an underpopulation like bomb that we're looking at. And so many governments throughout the world, Japan is probably the first one to try it. A lot of different Scandinavian countries have done it too, is how do we get people to have more children? And the way that many of them have tried to solve it is give them money. Like there's, let's just give them money. Like we can give them credits, we can give them baby bonuses, we can pay for parental leave.

[A]

And.

[B]

And so far money has not made a difference. So Jen, tell us a little bit about this Institute for Families Study that kind of talked about how there is a financial aspect to this that might actually make a difference as it relates to people wanting to have more kids.

[A]

Yeah. So they named the report and this was from May 2025. Pronatal policy works in America can't afford to forego it. So their take on the studies done around the world and looking at some different countries is that cash for kids basically does increase fertility. Well, fertility, but having children, I guess it doesn't answer the questions on people who struggle with fertility. But when governments increase direct financial support for children, fertility rises by a demographically meaningful amount. And then you and I talked about number of ways that this can happen. Some of it basically I think broke down to allowing people to keep more of their money when they have children. So I guess it kind of increases. The more children you have, the less taxes you have to pay. And they kind of wiggle around with all these things. And let's see, the proposed US Approach is a larger child tax credit that's usable against payroll taxes, paired with a stronger refundable credit and inflation indexing. I guess they're trying to help with, you're going to have more grocery bills. So then we'll offset it by giving you a bonus here. But then when you were looking at this, you were thinking that they kind of missed some of the data or they're looking at the data in a different way. And you were saying that maybe this is not the right way to go about trying to get more people to have kids.

[B]

I can appreciate trying to make things financially more like lightening the financial load on people that are having children. For sure that helps, but I don't think it changes the number of children that people are going to have. From the data that I have seen, there is one thing. There is one thing that directly increases the birth rate. One, and it is get married sooner. The biggest problem with fertility right now is not people can't afford to have kids. It is you are getting married too late. A woman is in her prime fertility from her late teens to about 35 years old. And if a woman doesn't get married until she's 29 or 30 or 33, maybe she can have one baby, maybe she can have two, unlikely she'll be able to have four. And a lot of women report not having the number of children that they wish they could have. And it's not necessarily because of fertility problems or financial problems. It's because they didn't pair up soon enough. And so anybody that is talking about solving the Population crisis. Who is not addressing the crisis in the decline of the marriage rates, especially early marriage. They're.

[A]

They're going to.

[B]

We're all going to spend money on things that don't actually move the needle. And it's the same kind of trap that we're in with kind of all of the major social problems that we're facing today, which we're happy to throw money at. Dealing with homeless youth, we're happy to throw money at, like, helping people escape poverty. But the thing we're not. We won't do is tell people to change their sexual decisions, to tell people to change their relationship expectations, and to tell people, you should actually not just pursue a master's degree and then a PhD and then think about getting married and having kids when you're 32. Like, to actually solve the population crisis, you should tell everybody, but especially young women, hey, prioritize marriage and kids in your 20s. But that's an area where, you know, a lot of people will say, well, that's not the government's job. The government shouldn't be involved in my personal life. Well, good luck solving the population problem if government's not going to speak to the kinds of decisions that naturally lead to solving the population crisis.

[A]

Well, there's like, so many thoughts I have off of this. You wrote a tweet looking at a Facebook meme, kind of graphic thing that Talked about the 1950s were so terrible for women because they didn't have no fault divorce. So they're trapped in these loveless marriages, and that's the only thing holding them in there is they couldn't get no fault. They couldn't get no fault divorce. Right. And you said this basically is rewriting history to make it like the villain is the 50s, and marriage and the hero riding in on the white horse is no fault divorce. But I was thinking too, you know, women in the 40s, 50s, whatever, post World War II, you had all this technology, the advent of technology and being home and raising your kids really got it. You know, your laundry took however much time when you push the button, but still you were told your value is in being the perfect housewife and the perfect hostess, and your kids go off to government schools and women are literally sitting around like, I was adding to the war effort, but now I'm like, home, and I got a new. The pearl necklace, I guess, and what am I supposed to do? And so I do think that's a part that sort of gets ignored. Is that women's quote, women's work and the idea of like, what it meant to be a family and the most important part of that was like the formation of humans. And all of that just kind of got shoved off. So then the women's magazines come along. That's like, no. You know, where you'd actually be happy is if you go to work full time and you're an insurance adjuster, your kids are in government school and your husband works full time and you work full time. That's true happiness. Instead of recognizing like, no, maybe there's more meaningful work you have time to do now that the menial labor has some technology behind it. And I just think, like you said, people think the government has nothing to do with marriage. Well, the government had everything to do with wanting another 50% of the populace in the workforce. They just increase their tax base, their income taxes, all this stuff. They benefit from more bodies in the workplace and full control over your children. So it would make sense then, from the conservative perspective, to reframe, to re. Incentivize. What does it mean to be married and have children? Form your own children, to be good citizens, good people, patriots, people who are adding something to the a. Adding something to the culture. But that part kind of has. Has gotten ignored. No, no, the government has nothing to do with it. Well, it had to do everything to do with cutting it up.

[B]

Outside of sub Saharan Africa, there are two countries with a above replacement rate fertility number, and they are Israel and Mongolia. You think, what on earth does Israel and Mongolia have to do with each other? And the answer is they tell a very elevated story about the importance of motherhood. Mothers are exalted and revered not to the status of God, but socially, there's a whole narrative around the importance of this role that only a woman can play. Whereas in a lot of different circles, you know, you can actually see declining rates of marriage and parenthood among women, the more degrees they get. And it's because there's a different story that they're being told, right? This is where I'm going to find value. This is where I'm living my. This is the thing that I can contribute the most to society. I mean, mothers, I mean, why would I want to take away time for the most important thing, which is getting these degrees or advancing my career? But in Mongolia and Israel, you know, Israel is a highly educated place. Those women are no dummies, but they're hearing something about the status of motherhood from all corners of society, that this is valuable and it's important and we're going to offer you some respect and some social credit if you choose to take on especially what is at the beginning a high investment, high personal cost status, you know, role. So I think a lot of this obviously has to do with how early we are getting married. But one reason why young women are not getting married early is because we're not telling the right story about motherhood. We're not telling the right story about marriage. We're not connecting, connecting it directly to this incredible, not just personal value, but social value as well.

[A]

Well, and I think the same thing could be said. We, I think we talked in the last week's episode about the vilification of young men, white men in particular. And the story of being a good man means caring for people who are vulnerable. Vulnerable being a good husband, being a father. This doesn't mean your life is over and wrecked and all your fun is going to be gone. It's the most fun, adventurous, amazing things you could do as a man or as a woman is to be a parent and bring about that next generation. So we just need a new story. You're right.

[B]

Yeah. Well, we want to talk about this story too, that we saw on MSNBC, on MSN.com, this toxic mom group breaking up with my toxic mom group. Now, this is interesting because, well, I have a lot to say about it, but do you want to give us kind of a rundown of what this woman was writing and what she encountered?

[A]

Yeah, this was an actress who's from the show High School Musical, Ashley Tisdale, who's now Ashley French. But she talked, she has celebrity mom group that, you know, there's a lot of drama about who's in that. But she just talked about, you know, you're looking for those moms who are similar to you in values. Your kids are the same age, but all of a sudden, the same things that she experienced in high school. You're getting left out. You see people hanging out without you. You kind of get excluded when you're at the group. And she was just saying, look, you're not expect. You don't have to stay in a group of moms just because your mom's. That's not treating you well. And some people are saying, well, it's, it's her personality that's the issue here. So. But I just thought more broadly, you know, what's your experience being a mom before all the social media drama could even happen? And then how do you think women can navigate some of these things?

[B]

Now it's interesting because you can see this on A micro level, but you can also see it on a macro level. And that is that, you know, women don't tend to confront as directly. We tend to go around back. We tend to have a little more underhanded comments. We tend to do a little bit more like gossip. I think gossip does tend to be a little bit more of a female specific sin. And there's been some recent clips and articles written by a woman named Helen Andrews, who says that feminine tendency to obviously value a lot of social inclusion, but then also seep it out in toxic ways if, you know, she feels like cancel culture is a projection of the way that, that women specifically address conflict. So, you know, this mom, the celebrity mom, kind of got canceled in the sense that nobody came to her directly and said, we don't like you. We don't want to hang out with you. They just started to exclude her. They just started to other her, like unperson her. So I do think that these are real distinct struggles for women. Whereas guys, so funny, you know, guys, if they've got a problem with each other, sometimes they'll be like, dude, can you knock the heck off? Or, oh, there you're at it again. I are we going to do this? Oh, we're not. Fantastic, let's move on. Or they will hit each other and fight and then be like, all right, thanks for taking care of that. Like, it's very direct, you know, physically and emotionally, which has some advantages and has some drawbacks. But I guess when I was reading this story, what I thought is I don't have a lot of exposure to mom groups like that because the Christian ethic and the way that we are commanded to communicate, to love, even principles like the strong are supposed to sacrifice for the weaker brother. I think in all social groups there are very clearly people who socially are weaker, whether it's their status or their ability to communicate or, you know, what they have to offer the group. And in Christian circles, it doesn't matter, right? We're not supposed to make value judgments based on, how much do I get out of this, how much do I like her? I am actually here for her. I exist not so that I can get what I want out of this relationship or be invited to the happy hour. I. A lot of the reason I exist is to make sure that she gets invited to happy hour. And the biblical command to directly go to somebody who has wronged you privately and show them their fault. And if you, if they listen, then you've won them over. And if you don't, the answer is not to go to the Facebook moms group and then start a separate chat and tell everybody what she does.

[A]

Then.

[B]

Then you find somebody else to go with you to establish the matter. I mean, like, there's just healthy ways to communicate and forbidden ways when it comes to talking about the things that you cannot do in the Christian circle. That just, in my opinion, has made it a pretty healthy environment when it comes to friend groups. So anyway, I. I feel for her. I feel for this struggle because I know other women have faced it too. I'm just so grateful that God has given us patterns of communication, requirements of how to connect with one another. That largely means that I think a lot of Christian women, at least in my world, don't have to deal with some of these toxic environments where they are excluded or they are shunned. And let me just say, that's actually incredibly painful. Like, we need human connection. Like, we need food. Like cruel and unusual punishment, you know, in the prison system, for example, is solitary confinement. Like, even if you are in a prison, at least you've got some fellowship, you know, at the meals or, you know, in the yards or when you're exercising or whatever. But to be socially isolated, it is detrimental, detrimental to who we are as humans. And that's why these kinds of examples of being excluded in real life or even online is so painful. So it's an opportunity for all of us to reject the way the world operates when it comes to connecting, you know, when it comes to dealing with confrontation. And for women especially, I think that calls us to let the Bible direct our steps more than our own insecurity or what might naturally come to us when it comes to conflict resolution. We're supposed to be different, do different. And maybe this celebrity mom is going to find her group of people that treats her differently, and maybe they will be believers.

[A]

Hey, everyone. This is a segment we are going to call here for the comments. I'm Jen, training director with Them before us, and we're welcoming to the show our friend Sam of pro life, Sam fame. Sam, what are your handles on Instagram and Twitter?

[C]

Yes, it's prolifesam, so you can find me there. But I just joined the Them Before Us team as the communications manager. So I'm really excited to get started on these projects and it's been super fun.

[A]

Sam and I are working together and we are in the comments a lot, which is why we decided to kind of do a new segment that will be on radio, our podcast, YouTube. Basically, we look at all the haters, the Hateful comments. We put them into our staff chat and laugh about them and then decide how to make content and monetize it. So it's win win for everyone really. People feel heard and seen and then we make money and laugh off your. Their hateful comments. So. But it's pretty fun. And part of what we want to do with here for the comments is teaching how to respond to some of the, you know, if there's genuine questions, genuine comments, of course we want to respond and then some for the hater ones, we more just want to have a light hearted posture toward it. So Sam, what was your idea to sort of celebrate the end of the year? How did you want to maximize some of the latest comments that we got?

[C]

You know, when I started doing pro life activism that when I got hate comments I would feel so stressed and I would be like upset and. But now that I've been doing it for a long time, it's, it's almost enjoyable because just they, they come out with like the craziest things. And so yeah, I just decided we should do a 12 Days of Christmas of hate comments. And each day we should do some of the top ones that we get the craziest and most outrageous comments that we get sent in our inbox or under our posts.

[A]

Yeah. And most of these were collected from a post Katie just posted on her Facebook, which we did not expect to really. Sometimes Facebook is interesting. She put this on Twitter. It got basically nothing, no attention. She put it on her Facebook official page. It's atiefaustauthor, I believe on Facebook. And I think we're almost to 6,000 comments now, most of them horrible. And actually the hilarious part is I learned how to filter them out so they're just automatically being hidden by the C word that took a majority of the trash out and then every. All of the basic cuss words. So people have to get a little creative and put stars and different symbols in when they're trying to use bad language now or no one ever sees it, they're just yelling at Katie into a void that nobody can see. So but that's where the majority of our comms are. So if you want to go check it out and get in the comments, go to her Facebook and you'll see it. So this is the 12 Days of Christmas Children's Rights Activist Edition or the 12 Haters of Christmas. Yeah, well, and I have, I have number one. So while you're pulling up the other ones. Okay. On the first day of Christmas, our haters said to us. I hope you choke on your Christmas dinner. I like too, that you were pulling. You were kind of pulling along themes because there's too many comments to do all of them. And wishing some sort of ill on Katie was a quite a prominent theme. Hoping you choke on your X. Miss dinner, I guess, actually was a big one.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

One person said, I hope you have a life full of waiting at the DMV and red lights or something like that. And I actually was like, that cracked me up. I thought that was kind of a very low key. You disagree and you're being kind of mean, but a very low key way to go about it is like, you know what? I respect it. This person just wants her to straight choke to death. So. Yeah.

[C]

Yeah. And I love that they can't even write Christ. They have to say Xmas because, like, I feel like it was the demon in them. They couldn't spell it out. So, Yeah, I thought we'd bring that one in strong.

[A]

Yeah, that's our first one to lead off day one. Have you heard too, that the X was a symbol for Christ? Actually, I think in like the Greek or Roman times or something, even X to symbolize Christ is like what Christians used to do. So it. A lot of people think it's like the atheist thing and it's like, oh, no, you're actually still doing the Christian tradition, so. Ooh, sorry about that. Okay, number two is a little more on the nose. Not that inventive. I'll give. Wait, what would you rate the first one on? Originality?

[C]

You know what? I would actually rate that one a good eight out of ten. It was holiday themed. It was original. I. I liked it. I liked it.

[A]

I did that one with an emoji of like a turkey popping up, looking around like, oh, no, don't do it. Okay. And then number two. You got that one.

[C]

Yes. Religious freaks. That one's original. That's new. I've never heard that before. There's not an entire song written about that specific, you know, thing that people say about us. But it was a little lazy. That's all I have to say about it. It's a little lazy.

[A]

Yeah. Jesus freaks. That's the DC Talk. Did you grow up listening to DC Talk?

[C]

You know, not really. Just that one song which tells you how popular that song was. Yeah. So it cracks me up that that that's the one thing that we do hear pretty often.

[A]

And the irony of it, I don't think in her post she talked about God at all. And, you know, Them before us is non religious, non partisan. Of course, those of us that work for them before us are Christians. But the entire argument we're trying to make is based off biology. There's a man and a woman. They produce a child. That child has a right to both. Where did we talk about religion? And that's their. You know, the only thing they can think of to dismiss it is, obviously, you guys are freaks, you're religious. It's like, where did we talk about God at all?

[C]

I also love when they say you don't need religion to be a good person. But then when we use religion to just basically stand up for children's rights and say, you can't kill babies, then they're just like, you're religious. Freak breaks it. It's like, maybe you do need religion a little.

[A]

Right? Yeah, we're gonna put this one kind of low. I think I'll give it, you know, one or two out of ten. It's just basic. It's not even on theme, really. It's not. We didn't bring up religion. They brought it up. So, okay, number three. F off and die. Did you edit this to say F? Oh, okay.

[C]

I didn't want to spell it out what it really said, but no, it's great.

[A]

I actually was wondering if they self edited to be slightly more appropriate. No, we did.

[C]

That's what I was thinking. I was like, I don't know who's reading this, so I'll just. We all get the point here. So.

[A]

Yeah, no, this one I actually would give.

[C]

Yeah, this one I would give a little bit higher of a rating. It seems lazy, but it's the passion behind it that makes me excited where it's like. It's not just like a simple oh, you suck, or you know, something like that. It is passionate. It is F off and die. So I feel like we hit a nerve with this person, you know?

[A]

Definitely. Yeah. But then there's like no punctuation. Really. There's. You're not really sharing more of what you think about the situation. But you're right. They're kind of combining two pretty common insults to F off and then to die. But they're like, you know what, I'm gonna really spice it up and I'm gonna put an and in there. That's our third day of Christmas. So I don't know. I'm gonna say like 4 out of 10. Passion maybe. But I do find cursing pretty low brow in the sense of it can be done so humorously or emphatically. In a way that cracks me up because I'm just not, in that context, very much homeschooled, raised in the church, but it's not even very. This isn't, like, humorous or very inventive, you know.

[C]

That's true. That's true.

[A]

Okay, now this one's a little more interesting. This is day four. Do you have that one?

[C]

Yep, yep. It says, your kind is literally holding us back as a nation, which.

[A]

Okay, we have a lot to unpack here. Your kind, now, we're all human. I think we're all human. They don't think we're all humans. Progressives. Right. You have to be born. You can't be too old, you can't be disabled, and then you can't have voted for Trump or apparently. Okay, so you're less than human, but you're kind. Probably an ode back to religious freaks, would you think?

[C]

Okay, yeah, yeah.

[A]

So the religious. You religious bigots are literally holding us back.

[B]

What do they mean by that?

[C]

Yeah, which is so funny because, like, religion usually is what progresses us morally. Like, we're the ones who are like, oh, how about we not have slaves? How about we treat children with dignity? How about we, you know, give women equal rights and basic care? Like, I feel like this is all Christian stuff. So I would argue that we push us forward pretty well as a nation.

[A]

Well, and that's what's so interesting is folks on the political left have taken the term progressive. So they took things that are pretty basic human realities. To be male, to be female, that marriage is between a man and a woman. It produces a child. A child has a mother and a father. But we need to progress past that because there needs to be many kinds of families, and love makes a family, and all you need is love, and let's use the word parents. And that's progress. Right. And a lot of people have talked about progress or going forward is not automatically a good thing. If you have a guardrail and you have a cliff and you have people that are like, go forward, go forward. Progress, progress. It's like, no, that's death. We're all going to go over this cliff and die. Everybody stop. Like, what is this guardrail for before you decide to remove it? I think that was a Chesterton quote. Yeah. So the reality is Christianity has built society, and progressivism is actually reverting us back to, like, Greek and Roman times when children got thrown out and killed or, you know, child slavery, child sexual abuse.

[C]

That's child sacrifice.

[A]

Yeah. That's the direction we're Going it's actually back in time. Not pro. Yep. Not progress.

[C]

Yep. The next one, honestly, this is the one that I think like I'm not scared but like this was the one that was like the most intense in my mind because it said end Katie Faust. Like to me that's just like a, just a direct death threat. Like I feel like you're not even trying to like hide it, you know, you're, you're literally just saying to end her as a person. So I don't know that one. I, I did want to add it on there, but that one probably needed to be reported to the FBI or something.

[A]

Yeah, seriously, we. And the amount of death threats actually. And we're gonna, we're laughing about it here, but we'll skip through a little faster just because we're running out of time. But the next one, I genuinely hope you get hit by a car, a train, a rock or a stray bullet or anything else that will take your homophobic face off the earth. The next one, end bigots lives. That goes back to. If you can put people into a category, a political category, you can justify harming them. Right, the next one. This is day eight. May cancer and heart disease find you and your family swiftly. That's like a bit of a play off of people will be like, I hope your daughter or son is gay. Which is like, do you think that's a bad thing? Do you think that's an insult? Because why are you using it that way? But right. Number nine, this was an interesting one.

[C]

So it says some people are asking, how do we end Christianity? Simple really. We criminalize it with a strong negative deterrent such as the death penalty. Oh no, they're trying to kill Christians again. Like this is so new and actually.

[A]

That works so well in history and is working so well around the world even it's crazy. Nigeria, where Christians are just being slaughtered. You think about Christmas Day, Easter Sunday and Sunday, that's when Christians will get murdered. And you watch Nigerian Christians going and sitting in a bombed out church for their Sunday morning service again, knowing that people died there a week earlier, they'll go back to church the next Sunday. So actually the kind of pressure that gets applied to Christians around the world when they think that threatening people with death slows it down. That's what Romans figured out real quick too. I mean, even at the bottom of the barrel, being murdered, mass murdered in the Coliseum, which someone commented, I used to feel bad for Christians getting killed in the Coliseum. Now I understand it. That was one of the Comments in the Obergefell one that I remember seeing. But it never ends the way they think. Christianity thrives under pressure and heat because nobody's doing it for fake, you know? So pretty crazy. Yep. The tenth of haters.

[C]

Yeah, I liked this one. The fact that you made your little image rainbow color shows the true deep inner evil that is within you. Disgusting. It's like, I actually thought that was hilarious because they're like, oh, you're using the rainbow to. To be against gay rights. Which is hilarious because you're using the rainbow, which God made as a promise to his people, and you're the one who twisted that into gay rights somehow. So you guys stole the rainbow first. All right, we're taking it back. All right. This was ours. So if you're talking about this deep inner evil because you stole something, well, you're the one who stole it first. So how deeply evil are you?

[A]

Seriously? And the rainbow was literally a promise. Literally a promise that God wasn't going to destroy humans again via flood for their horrible wickedness and evil against him. The irony of them using rainbow to celebrate pride, a sin, and celebrate wickedness and rebellion against God, it's. Isn't it ironic? Oh, here we go. Another one. Not very original. Drink, Bleach. Okay. This one, though. You are the reason we need more. Tyler Robinson's US Guy who killed Charlie Kirk allegedly killed Charlie Kirk on trial. You should do a public outdoor speaking tour so we can all watch it happen. This is progressivism in a nutshell. They don't have good arguments. Very few people commented a good argument. You have, like, 20 seconds. Any final thoughts on our 12 haters of Christmas?

[C]

You know, I wish them all well, I pray for them, and I hope that their lives get a little bit better so they don't have to spend their time commenting really awful things on strangers Facebook pages.

[A]

And that's what it is. Hey, we're gonna do more here for the comments in the future, teach you how to reply to the haters. But we hope you had a great new year, and we will catch all of you in our next segment, whether it's radio, podcast, or YouTube. See you guys soon.