B (3:30)

Yeah.

A (3:31)

And I mean the fact that he can win this stage shows that he comes in in great shape and it will be somebody that we will see in more stages. He, he, he owes it to his status and to his team to perform. And the Vuelta seems to be a race that really suits him well. You know, he's been in the front already. He's won I think a couple of stages, two or three stages already in the Vuelta. So it's definitely a stage rate that works well for him. But I did not expect him to win today, that's for sure. That was a surprise.

B (4:08)

No, it was a shock. Did you know the Vault is the only Grand Tour that he's won stages in.

A (4:14)

Three?

B (4:14)

Yeah, Mr. Vault have been top ten here two times. He was six tier last year. I mean, yeah, he has had a weird last for years where he kind of underperforms everything except the Volta. It feels like I, I don't know what. I don't know. I didn't see this coming. Like he was unbelievable in that final corner. Like he just got the inside. Pedersen, I guess left the gap open there. He went right through it. And then they come out with the short straightaway. It's like a 25 meter straightaway. If you come on the inside, you're going to be hard to stop when you're sprinting for that shorter distance. Are you surprised with Jonas Finnegaard and Visma putting in so much work to be contesting this stage, I mean, he picks up four bonus seconds, it's not nothing. But also combined with sprinting for the points in the middle of the stage, I said to you before I recorded if this was Tade Pagachar, he'd be getting crucified by people saying, oh, he's wasting energy. What's he doing? You know, look, look at his. The UAE rivals are. Almeida is back there in 28th, Russo's in 35th. Most of the GC contenders are further down, not putting in these massive anaerobic efforts early in the race. Why, why is Jonas doing this and why is Visma investing the energy to do this?

A (5:32)

Obviously the first reason is he's feeling great, that's for sure. I mean, he wins the stage yesterday, he's up there again today, you have to be in good shape and you know what I mean? Every second counts. I'm not surprised. I'm not. I was, I was surprised to see him sprint for that intermediate sprint. I didn't know, really, I didn't understand what was that about because I don't know if he thought they were bonus seconds or something. The only, the only other explanation I can think of is that he thinks that he, he can win also the points classification, which is not impossible in the va. It, it happens more often that class classification riders win also the, the, the points jersey. So that may be something that he's thinking about. But it's early on in the race to, I mean, didn't, it didn't cost too much energy. But I mean, my conclusion is that Jonas Vingegaard is feeling great, that's for sure. He has great legs, feels good on the bike and, and just wants to take advantage of it.

B (6:38)

Didn't we say at the zero though that like every effort counts and it's race.

A (6:44)

It does, it does. Now in, in, in the case of Jonas Finger guard in this va, Spencer, I'm not overly concerned about that. I think he's just that much better than his rivals.

B (6:57)

What's.

A (6:58)

Yeah, it won't really matter.

B (7:01)

I, I kind of agree. I think he might agree and that's kind of what makes it weird because like, why are you sprinting for mid, mid St seconds if you know that you're that much better? It kind of does make you think he's going for green already, which is, which is very ambitious. It's, it's very unyonis actually. That's why I'm so surprised. Like the man has been so measured and conservative and that's how he's had success. And then we're seeing. It's like he swapped brains with Tadpago from 2022. He's just sprinting for everything. It's really interesting to see. I don't fully understand it, but I'm. It's making this race better. I mean, any other GC thoughts you had? Like, is there anything we can even take out of this or not?

A (7:42)

Like, no, really. I personally think that, you know, the guys like, like, are you so. And Almeida and, you know, it's. It was not a flat sprint. There are always risks that there might be a gap. In my opinion, they're a bit too far back. That's not a great sign. They should have been, you know, 1050. I mean, Bernal, for example. Bernal was top 10, right? Or just the top 10. They should have. I mean, because it's. It's slightly uphill and it was harder than we expected. So I think they were a bit too far back. It's. It's a risk somebody might sit up and you lose 10 seconds without before you know it. No, other than that. I mean, I just want to come back on what we said yesterday about Visma. I mean, Axel Zingle was, you know, the incident he had with his shoulder. This morning we woke up to the news that he didn't get the green light from the team doctor to start. So there he. He. He had to abandon the race because he dislocated his shoulder. That's number one. And then what I said yesterday about his bike being stolen during the race is actually not correct. Afterwards the news came out that the fact that he went into the ambulance to get treatment on the shoulder an official thought that he abandoned. So they had actually put his bike in the broom wagon. And when Axel Zingli came out of the ambulance, he didn't find his bike and had to get a spare bike from the team. Now that's one thing about bikes from Visma. Then this morning we also saw that unfortunately in Italy, Visma Lisa bike woke up to an open truck that was broken in. And they got 13 to 15 bikes stolen during the night, which, you know, which is a nightmare for. For a team. It was obviously, I mean, it was obviously a planned. A planned attack. They must have been watching the truck and then, you know, seeing how he parked, how the truck was parked, and then they got in it and take 15 bikes away without anybody noticing it. That must be, you know, there's a lot of people involved, there's vehicles involved and it was planned. So unfortunately that that happened. It's. Yeah, we never had that during, during all of our years in the team, but I know teams who. It happened and it is just, I mean it's very disturbing. You know, you have to, in the morning, it's, it's crazy. You have to try to find a solution to get ready for the, to the start. Nowadays, fortunately, they have lots of people, lots of equipment, so they could, they could get through the stage. But they were missing, for sure. They were missing spare bikes. I remember, I mean, I don't remember which race or which, which year, but I remember things like that happened in the past and then teams were actually borrowing spare bikes from other teams. So they have, that had happened so, so that they could at least get through the, through the stage. And then depending on where they are based, like now, for example, Visma will have to bring a van with a new series of bikes to the race to be able to go on for the next two and a half weeks without any problems.

B (11:06)

Yeah, I mean it must be criminal organizations. These are not just like Joe Schmoe, like, hey, there's a van. I'm gonna take some of that.

A (11:12)

This is not a coincidence. It's not just all of a sudden people who show up, I say, hey, there's nice opportunity. You know, this is planned for sure.

B (11:19)

Because I mean, can you imagine unloading that? How do you, where do you even sell those? They're so unique and you have to have a network ready. They might have to start sleeping with their bikes in the room. Like, like amateurs. Johan?

A (11:30)

Well, I mean, you know, I mean the thing, I mean it's, it, it, it's simple. I mean it might seem, you know, simple but you know, what we usually did, I remember the, the, the mechanics, they, they always try to find a spot where they could park the truck like against a wall or you know, put two trucks against each other. I don't know. I mean, it should be a standard habit, I guess. I mean, of course, you know, you don't, you don't count on the fact that people are going to break into the truck, you know.

B (12:04)

Yeah, I mean, I guess it's possible they're getting in and like hot wiring the truck and then driving it away from the wall. I don't know. I actually frankly would like to know more about this. Maybe we'll do an investigative on what is actually going on here because it's, it's pretty interesting. A lot of moving parts. It be hard to get rid of those bikes.

A (12:21)

Yeah.

B (12:21)

You mentioned UAE Almeida and ISO, I don't love them being so far back. And if. If I could have one criticism of the. The organization they've built over there at ua, obviously they've had a lot of success. They're doing pretty good. Yeah, it's just the small. The small stuff when Pagacha is not at the race seems to fall between the cracks. Like, you just never get a ton. I never have a ton of confidence that, like, on a stage like this that, you know, I'm even looking. You said Bernal or Jai Hindley is in the top 10. Like, those guys are just on the front foot, and it kind of feels like UAE when Pagatra is not there. They're always on the back foot. Like, stuff's always happening.

A (12:59)

I don't know. I mean, I don't know, Spencer, if it's. I mean, I'm. I said I'm not. I'm not overly worried about this. You know, I would have liked to see them a little bit more in front, but anyway, they're not far behind. But it's a risk. It's a risk. If it's a slide uphill like this that something happens, somebody sits up and you cannot close the gap. It might just be that both are you. So. And Almeida come in a bit green, a bit off, you know, not. Not at their full potential. I think that's more the case because especially on the stage that Jonas won. Was it yesterday? Was yesterday? No, he won. Yeah.

B (13:40)

Yesterday.

A (13:40)

Yeah. Normally Almeida, a great. Almeida would have been there with them. He wouldn't have been like 10 places back or so. I. I just think they're a tiny bit of like 1 2% off, and that's enough to. To not be in front. But it's three weeks stage race, so a lot. A lot of things can happen.

B (14:02)

One writer I was surprised not to see up there, 23rd place, Tom Pitcock. Like, is this not another good Tom pick finish?

A (14:10)

This would. This was a good finish for him. Yeah. Yeah, this was a good finish. Yeah.

B (14:15)

And then you just probably slipped by. Yeah.

A (14:19)

Yeah. Well, hey, you know, it's stage three, so there's still a lot of other opportunities, but it's also the Vuelta Espana. It's high level. And it's not. I mean, it's not. It's not the, The. The. The Saudi Tour or the Arctic race. You know, it's. It's different level. So I just think that, that, I mean, he tries, but yeah, today. Today was a good stage for Pitcock to be at least in the top three or the top five. So he should have been up there.

B (14:49)

And like the team didn't really seem like. What's funny is he had multiple teammates finish in front of him which probably should not happen on a day like today. I don't fully get what was going on there. One writer who's not here, who didn't even have the chance to not win is Derek G. He was supposed to be leading the IS Premier Tech team at this RE race. Pulled out at the last second. Right then we knew something fishy is going on. And then now we, we hear that Ineos is trying to sign him. I think. What was that two weeks ago? A week ago we were talking about Ineos canceling a bunch of signing dav. Dave Barford didn't like it. We thought they must be making room for something like an incoming rider. It looks like maybe that writer is Derek G. Perhaps they think he's their GC leader of the future. He, he signed a contract extension. We looked this up. Five year contracts extension with Israel Premier Tech in 2023. We would presume for a decent amount of money. And then now he's trying to leave Israel. Premier Tech doesn't want him to leave. If you've ever met the owner of Israel Premier Tech you would know that it's not, might not be as easy to leave that team as others because he is a, a very firm man. Like he's not just going to sit down and let's deep pockets. Yeah. But the only thing Johan is what? So let's say they take Derek G to court, they make him stay. What, what are you gaining by that?

A (16:12)

Because he's already nothing. I mean I, I mean already like the last minute change of Derek G not going to the Vuelta, being left off by the team. We knew that something was coming. Right. So I mean I'm, I have several thoughts on that. First of all, I think, and I'm thinking as a team manager, as a former team manager, I think it's kind of not right from the agents to push for long term contracts. I mean in 2023 I'm pretty sure they were super happy and they were the guys who pushed for a five year contract. Yeah, in five year contracts that's very long. That's extremely long. So it must have been a good deal. So you sign that with, with, you know, and then all of a sudden if somebody comes with a better offer then all of a sudden it's like, you know, when you marry, you know, you marry your, your, your girlfriend and Then, you know, if, if a more beautiful girl comes, you don't leave your wife. I mean, at least normally you don't. This is the same, this is the same thing.

B (17:21)

There's probably differences between.

A (17:24)

No, it's, it's the same, it's the same thing, Spencer. It's, it's, it's, it's the same thing. They sign these long term deals and then, you know, somebody, you know, comes with, with, with, you know, a better looking girlfriend and they, they start to consider it. And I mean, from what I see today, I think Derek G. Put out a statement saying that, you know, there's personal reasons why he leaves the team. I'm going to guess in between the lines. They want to play the, the situation with Israel. I don't know if that's true or not. It's probably something you can use if you want to terminate a contract. And that's probably the reason why they put that out there. But I think it should be separate. You know, I mean, when they all, I mean, Israel has been known to be a team that pays riders really well. And you know, when they were able to sign big deals, it didn't matter. For most of them it was Israel on the jersey as long as they got their check. Yeah, right.

B (18:38)

That's a good point.

A (18:39)

No, I've seen the statement of Fuglsang. Not so long ago he just retired, right? He signed a big deal, you know, was there till 40 years old, made a lot of money. I'd never heard him complain about having Israel in his jersey. And now he retires and he said, oh, I'm so happy that I don't have to put Israel in my jersey again. I mean, come on, you know, it's. First of all, I think the team has nothing to do with, you know, the fact that the owner of the team is a Canadian from Israel. Israel guy, okay. He has his reasons to use the name Israel. It has nothing to do with politics or nothing to do with what's going on in the world. And if you, everybody's free to choose to ride for that team or not. And you know, I, I have to kind of laugh when, you know, they say, okay, well, you know, now I don't, I don't want to wear the name Israel anymore. But when they were paying the big checks, they were there to, you know, they put the jersey on without a problem. I don't know what's going on with Derek G. Obviously there's a huge interest from, from ineos. Probably a better team for Him. I don't know if the financials are going to be much better. Probably they will be a bit better. And yeah, I mean, we don't know. We just go off what, what has been reported. But it's, it's a strange one. It's a strange one. There is just like. He's a good writer. He's a good writer. He was fought in the Giro, but it's not one of the big names that cycling. You know, if you have Pugachar and you have Jonas, you have Almeida, you have Ayuso, you have Roglic, you have Remco. Derek G is not in that league. Right. He's, he's below. I mean he was fourth in the Giro. Simon Yates won, Del Toro was second and Carapaz was third. And Derek G. Was not close to those three guys. We don't know. It's probably going to be a good addition for Ineos and I have no doubt about that. But it's also not a writer who will dominate a Grand Tour in the future, I think that's safe to say.

B (21:04)

Yeah, yeah. I think there's two parts. I also, yeah, I don't want to weigh in. I, I'm decently friendly with the man who owns Israel, Premier Tech, so I don't want to. Okay, I'm by, I'm biased, I can't say anything. But Derek G. Is this. Either Dave Brailsford looks at him and says, this guy's so raw, he's gotten so good so fast he can be the next Bradley Wiggins or is this domestique for Ryder to be signed later? That we don't know yet.

A (21:32)

I think it's an intermediate solution. There's nobody else. I mean, it's obviously that if they want to strengthen their team, they will have to buy out someone. Right. Because there's nobody else available. It's becoming a trend though, right, in cycling that it's becoming a bit like football over here, soccer, as you guys call it. The guys sign multi year contracts and then whenever there's another opportunity, they want to leave. And then there's business being made between the two clubs, which is also here going to be the case. Ineos will have to pay a decent amount of money to Sylvan Adams and that's a parallel business. I think Adams can make a good bit of money out of the departure of Derek G. And he will play it, he will play it hard. Yeah.

B (22:32)

The problem is he probably doesn't care about that as much as like, let's say DSM Picnic postnl. Like their business is kind of selling riders.

A (22:41)

No, I mean they just did the same first. Did you see that in, in, in women's cycling, they just sold. Is it Charlotte Cole? Charlotte, yeah. So she's, she's moving to another team. I forgot which team it is. But it's immediate with immediate effect. So that's their, that's part of their business model. They have good writers and then they let them go for whoever wants to pay for them. And yeah, I think it's, I mean it's one of the smaller budget teams. So that's, I mean, I guess there's.

B (23:15)

Another, another source of revenue that, yeah, they really work that for and they've forked it well. They've gotten rid of a lot of riders who have not lit the world on fire when they've left that team. But so, but the problem with Derek G. Is so I don't think Adams cares about the money, so. But if a rider wants to leave, you probably should just get money for it because it's already a problem. Like he's already not at the Volta. What happens next year if you force him to stay? It's just tough. And if you're a writer, Johan, like Neos, I know they've had their problems, but they're still a top tier team. Like, don't you think that day to day training is maybe better at something, a team like ineos than Israel Premier Tech? Like the infrastructure they have, is that a draw?

A (24:00)

It's probably better. Not much better anymore. I think most of the teams are, are quite, quite. You know, they hire really specialist people. There's been a time that INEOS was head and shoulders above everybody else in terms of environment, infrastructure, entourage. I think it's not the case anymore. They're still probably better. But I think Adam says, I mean you say he doesn't care about the money. I think he does. You know, especially if you see, I mean if I would be Adams and I see who I have as my rival, which is ineos and you know, they have deep pockets and they want the asset that you own, which is the Herc gift. I mean, you already know. I mean this is where, this is where it becomes tricky for the rider. Right. I mean the moment Derek G. Has notified them that he doesn't want to stay and so he has, if I understand correctly, unilaterally terminated his contract for whatever reason. We don't know the reason.

B (25:04)

And this happened with Uterbrooks, remember?

A (25:07)

Yeah, that's different. That's different because Utter Brooks and I mean, it also happened with, with Maxim Van Gils. But that's different because it's the Belgian law permits that allows that. I don't know how it is. I mean, it could also be that the Canadian law allows that. I have no idea. But the fact is that Adams will say, okay, this guy wants to leave. We know we won't have him next year, but let's just. We don't care now how fast this is resolved. The longer it takes, the longer this drags out. I mean, it ultimately goes to court. The better it is for Israel, the worse it is for Derek G. Because Derek G wants now, he wants peace of mind. He wants to, you know, focus on the future. He wants to know that his place is ineos. This could drag through the whole off season and even through the beginning of next season, which is never good for the mindset of the rider. Right. So this is now, it's now in the camp of Derek G. And his advisors to solve this as soon as possible. Because once you know that this rider has said, okay, I don't want to stay, Adams doesn't care anymore. He doesn't care how fast, as long as he gets the most amount of money. The UCI rules say that there needs to be an agreement amongst the three parties. The rider, the old team and the new team. If that's not happening, then ultimately it's going to be a court which decides. So I don't know what if it's the Canadian law or if it's Swiss law. I don't know. I don't have enough details. But it's in the interest of Derek G. And his advisors to find a solution, a reasonable solution, as soon as possible.

B (26:59)

Yeah, it's unclear to me if, like, what if it's Canadian law? If. Can you. Maybe Canadian law does nothing to do with this because it's rad if the contract is like signed in Switzerland. I don't quite understand how all that works. The problem though, if Adams pushes it too far, Ineos has to move on, right? And then the offers off the table and then now if they push the.

A (27:20)

Offer will not be. The offer will not be off the table. I'm pretty sure that Ineos, because INEOS is already part of this, although officially they can be seen as being part of this. But there's for sure been negotiations and already, you know, been been estimations of, okay, it's going to cost us so much. This is the contract of Derek G. This may be the amount that we have to pay to get him out of there. It's not going to be Derek. If it's going to be Derek G. Who pays it, but it's not going to come out of his pocket.

B (27:50)

Yeah.

A (27:51)

So Ineos, indirectly, whether they want it or not, they're already part of this.

B (27:57)

Well, if it's like July of next year, presumably they would just sign someone else. Right. And then Derek G. Would have to stay with Israel Premier Tech.

A (28:05)

Yeah, but who's, who are they going to sign in July?

B (28:08)

Well, they would probably have to move on in the off season. Right.

A (28:12)

Yeah.

B (28:12)

Because you can't. They're not going to hold a roster spot for Derek G. Through the spring, I would imagine. But yeah, it's. I, I do think this will get resolved sooner rather than.

A (28:23)

Yeah, for sure.

B (28:24)

For sure. Because I think Sylvan Adams is going to get a big old check from Ineos.

A (28:28)

Exactly.

B (28:28)

And he's going to feel a little bit better about the situation. It does stink to lose because it's a Canadian. It's a pseudo Canadian team.

A (28:34)

Yeah.

B (28:34)

Losing a Canadian rider that they developed, that's probably not fun for them.

A (28:38)

It's not a great look.

B (28:39)

No. Anything else on that or do you want to predict tomorrow's stage four?

A (28:44)

Well, this was, I mean, yeah, it's kind of part of the Vuelta because Derek G. Was supposed to be the leader of Israel.

B (28:50)

What's funny, terrible race for him. It's all summit finishes, very few time trials, like very few time trial kilometers. So I don't know how much he's missing here, but it is, it is. It's already become a problem because he should be leading the team at this race.

A (29:08)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think his, you know, his, his focus is now on find, you know, getting a. The future he wants with another team. So he doesn't care anymore about the Vuelta.

B (29:20)

Now unilaterally getting or unilaterally destroying your contract or breaking your contract kind of sounds legally dubious to me. Like, can I unilaterally make myself President of the United States? Yeah, I've decided that I'm doing it.

A (29:37)

I'm pretty sure that if they, when they did it, they know that they have a case. I'm, I'm kind of thinking that, you know, the statement he put out definitely points into the direction that he does not want to be part of the team anymore because of what's happening in the world. That's my, my reading between the lines.

B (29:59)

That could be an angle, I guess that could. They could work, especially in the current climate. But let's take a quick ad break and then we'll predict stage four. Everybody, this episode is brought to you by Cook Unity. We all know eating healthy is crucial for our energy and health, but it shouldn't have to be boring. That's what I love about Cook Unity. I would eat the worst fast food possible every day if it was up to me. I do not like eating healthy. But that's all changed with Cook Unity because they have incredible fresh flavors for every diet, all crafted by award winning chefs using local seasonal ingredients high in protein, fiber and healthy fats. I've been using CookUnity myself for almost a year and honestly, it's probably added years to my life, especially when my wife is out of town and I'm responsible for getting the kids to school. Cooking, cleaning, taking care of everything. On top of this podcast in my newsletter, it keeps me eating healthy within minutes every evening. And I also am just loving their mission burritos. And I'm still able to stick to my goals, keep my blood sugar stable and avoid mindless snacking because I actually look forward to my meals and I have a meal ready. I don't have to. I'm not overwhelmed by the thought of making something from scratch and then just going for the least healthy option and the quality. It's next level. You're getting dishes from chefs who've won James Beard awards and cooked in top restaurants, all sent fresh, never frozen, directly to your door. Plus, there's tons of variety, so mealtime never feels repetitive. You can browse chefs by cuisine, dietary needs and discover new favorites every week. Fuel your day with the freshest, best tasting meal delivery made by award winning chefs. Go to cookunity.com themove free or enter code themove free before checkout for free. Premium meals for life. That sounds incredible. That's free. Premium meals for life. By using code the move free or going to cookunity.com themove free to redeem this offer now. All right, back to the show. All right, Johan, we're back. Tomorrow. Stage four, we, we finally leave Italy. We don't go to Spain, we're going to France. We're actually going to Tour de France territory, which is. It's really trippy that we go over the Alps. We start in Suza. We basically end in the outskirts of Grenoble at the base of the French Alps. 207 kilometer long stage. There's multiple mountains, there's three categorized climbs early in the race, but then basically from like 120k to go on. They descend off the final mountain pass and it's downhill to flat for the rest of the stage. Slightly uphill in the last few kilometers. Just some disputed numbers we found in the road book on if it is an uphill final kilometer or not. I looked at the Google maps. It does look like there's a slight rise like almost similar to stage eight of the 2023 Tour in Limoges. The Mads Pedersen actually won over Jasper Phillipson. But I'll read the odds and then we'll, we'll predict our winners. Mads Pedersen is the favorite at +175. Jasper Phillipson at +500. Ethan Vernon +700. Ular at +1600. Felipe Ghana who did not look great today. Plus 2000 Ben Turner. Plus 2500 Casper Vanuden. Plus 2500 Nico Den +3300. Again, if you want to know more about betting, you want to know where you can bet where you live. You want to get the best price, best signup bonuses, go to Next Bets. That's NXT bets.com bet outcomes. The link is in the show notes to, to access that treasure trove. But Johan, how do you think this is going to play out and who's going to win?

A (33:31)

Yeah, I think, I think bunch print there's, it's hard the, the first half, half of the stage is hard. There will be some splits, there will be some sprinters who get dropped, but I, I think you know, the downhill and then the second part of the stage is completely flat. I think it's, it's too far for a sprinter or with a team around him to not be able to make it back. So I'm going to go Jasper Philipson. It is a drag. I know that Peterson is probably the heavy favorite, but it's definitely not as hard as yesterday. Tomorrow sprint and, and I think Philipson will take revenge for. I mean obviously the day he was dropped. He had no chance today anyway seeing, seeing that, that finish. But, but yeah, I'm gonna go for Jasper Phillips especially because he's plus 500. So that's an interesting one.

B (34:32)

Yeah, I think the main mistake we made today for today's stage was that maybe the lead end of the final kilometer was harder than we thought. Tomorrow's it is uphill, but it's very slightly uphill. So you could imagine Phillipson winning on this. I don't think that's, that's crazy at all. And that's a very good price if he's plus 500 I'm still going to go Mads Pedersen, just because I. It's. It's unclear to me where Philipson's fitness is. If he maybe isn't at his very, very best after that Tour de France crash.

A (35:04)

He's probably not. He's probably at his very best.

B (35:07)

You said he had surgery right after the Tour.

A (35:09)

Yeah, yeah, he had surgery. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

B (35:11)

Which, I mean, these guys are so good at coming back from that. But it's. It's not nothing like it does. He might not be at his very best, and I think he does have to be at his very best to win tomorrow. So I'm gonna go Mads Pedersen at plus 175 for the win. And Matt's Betterson, he's got to be feeling a little frustrated at this point, and, I mean, it's still a live points battle, so he's going to be up there doing what he can. Probably wants to avenge today's loss tomorrow.

A (35:38)

Yeah, most likely. And he has an amazing team.

B (35:43)

Yeah, very, like, very impressive team.

A (35:45)

Yeah.

B (35:46)

It was a little funny with today's stage where Chicone let him out, but has to pull off before he's totally blown because then he has to slot in behind Pedersen so he doesn't lose time on gc. I don't think that will be as big of an issue tomorrow because it's an easier finish. They can have someone else lead them out. That's not Julio Ciccone. It Little points classification check in. Did you know Jonas Vinegar's already leading the points classification? 65 points. Phillipson's 50, Patterson's 43. So both these guys do have to start making up ground on Vinegar before they get into the big mountains.

A (36:20)

So that might have been the reason why you're also sprinting for that, you know, for that intermediate sprint.

B (36:27)

Impressively ambitious if that's true. You could be right. Anything else on tomorrow's stage that you're excited about before we get going?

A (36:36)

I'm not overly excited about tomorrow's stage.

B (36:39)

But could be good. I. I kind of like these stages. They don't throw too much at you. They're like, you know, we're gonna start late, we finish late. Not a lot is going to happen during the stage. It's very easy to watch.

A (36:51)

It's easy. Yeah. Yeah. That's it for me, Spencer.

B (36:54)

All right, thanks, Johan. And we'll be back tomorrow to predict the team time trial on stage five. We shift gears very quickly into the GC battle.

A (37:01)

Okay, thanks. All right, bye.