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- [00:00]
A
You're listening to this podcast, so I know you've got a curious mind. Here's a helpful fact you might not know yet. Drivers who switch and save with Progressive save over $900 on average. Pop over to progressive.com, answer some questions and you'll get a quick quote with discounts that are easy to come by. In fact, 99% of their auto customers earn at least one discount. Visit progressive.com and see if you can enjoy a little cash back. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. National average 12 month savings of $946 by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between June 20in May 2025. Potential savings will vary.
- [00:35]
B
The most telling piece of information for me, Spencer, is the interview of Lipowitz after the stage. You know, here's a guy who got third last year and he was very, very clear about it. He says, let's not even try. We know, we all know that Jonas is also better than us. So this is a race for third, you know, and I think that's really what he said. That's what he said. That's what he said. Yeah, yeah. And you know what I mean, we can speculate and calculate and try to guess and make all these theories as long as we want. There's nobody better to judge how the situation is than these guys. I mean, I have not seen, Spencer, a single rider in the pre race interviews who did not say that Pogacha was going to attack and go solo on the Tourmalet. They all know. Yeah, they all know. You know, it's like we can try to find, you know, little weaknesses here and there or what if, what happens? This. What, what if this happens? Nothing happens. It's just UAE going to the front and killing everybody and then Pogachar takes off. That's what happens.
- [01:44]
A
Everybody, welcome back to the Move Plus. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johan Berniel as always. And we're breaking down stage six of the Tour de France. Massive day through the Pyrenees, over the Col d', Espan, over, over the Tourmalet, up to a brand new summit finish that people thought was going to be, I think Bradley Wiggins, quote, was, it's going to be a limp finish, was anything but. Tade Picach, sorry, Tade Picachar destroys his competition, drops everybody on the tourmaline and then extends his lead with Jonas Finnegard coming in second. 2 minutes and 38. Yeah. 2 minutes, 38 seconds down. Isaac del Toro, his teammate, 2 minutes, 57 seconds down. Within the same Time as Rimco Evanopole, Paul Sixas, Florian Lipowitz, Juana uso, Mateusz Galmosa, Linny. Sorry, Shkomos is the last one in that group. Martinez is behind him. It was quite the demonstration, Johan. I think the gaps were even bigger because they didn't finish on top of the tourmaline. So I liked the stage. I like the domination. I could watch it all day. I don't believe that. It's boring. And then we will also preview stage seven at the end of this episode. But Johan, I'm dying to know what was your takeaway of the day?
- [02:48]
B
There's only one takeaway of the day, Spencer. It's Pugachar's domination and the way he is supported and surrounded and launched by his unbelievable strong team. Uae. It's not just Pogachar who was. We all know that he's the best rider in the world, but it's also not even close. I think at least this year or until now. Uae, we always thought, you know, we've always been talking about UAE versus Visma and you know, before this tour we were talking. We're debating who has the strongest team. Slight advantage for uae, we said. But man, it's not a slight advantage, it's a huge advantage. I think, I think UAE today was. Was unbelievably strong. You know, when they set the temple on before the Aspen and then on the Aspen it was just constantly elimination from the back. There has not been one single attempt for acceleration. Everybody was hanging on for their dear life. Yeah, we already saw that on the other stage that Pogachar won with that shorter uphill finish. But today was. Was unbelievable how strong they were and yeah, I mean, I think they had this plan. This was the plan. Several writers said it from UAE before, after the stage that this was the plan that they would go hard on the Aspen and then harder on the Tourmalet and that they would attack. Yeah, tactics are pretty simple, right? When you have such a strong leader.
- [04:26]
A
Yeah, it is very simple. It's okay. I got a plan. Let's get a bunch of strong guys, but I'm on the front. They're going to blow it up. We're going to have the second strongest guy in the race set up. The strongest guy. He's going to ride away from everybody. It was pretty simple tactically. I, you know what, I was watching the race with a couple of guys that I recall dominating the Tour de France. Lance Armstrong, Bradley Wiggins. And they were both up in arms about it. Couldn't. Oh, this is so boring. This is terrible. The race is over. Am I wrong in thinking a, that I remember Team sky being pretty dominant and putting a lid on things pretty early? I remember Lance punching people in the mouth very early in the race. Am I correct in that assessment? And is this necessarily boring or is this super fun?
- [05:09]
B
I don't find it boring as a spectator. I mean, at least the way I appreciate this sport. And you have one guy who's the strongest. I can really enjoy this destruction, this domination. I am. I am more a Pogachar fan than a Vingegaard fan. I'm not gonna hide that. But. But, you know, if Jonas would be stronger, I would enjoy it too, you know, but no, I. I like it. I like it. I don't find it boring. Um, it's also Spencer, listen, the way this Tour de France is designed, they should have known that this was going to be a possibility. If there's a big, high mountain stage on day six, there is a possibility that there's going to be destruction already.
- [05:54]
A
Yeah.
- [05:56]
B
So, you know, today you would say, you know, Bogachar and uae, they kind of had to do what they did. First of all, knowing that Bogachar is incredibly strong, knowing that the team is strong and that their next big appointment is on stage 14. So, I mean, okay, the time trial is on. Yeah, the time trial is after stage 14. I think stage.
- [06:20]
A
It's stage 16.
- [06:21]
B
Yeah.
- [06:21]
A
16 and 15. 15 is a really tough summit finish.
- [06:26]
B
So Anyway, until stage 14, that's their next huge appointment. So they had to do what they did today. Unless there's another situation where you have somebody in the leader's jersey and you know that they're going to keep it. But anyways, the Tourmalet, man, Tourmalet is the Tourmalet. And I think. And especially it being. What was it? 38k from the finish, 36k from the finish, the top. It's such a hard climb. You have to take advantage of that fact that the Tourmaline is there because that's where you can hurt your rivals and take time on them. I think they did what they had to do. If we compare the. Spencer, this is actually what's a bit different compared to other Tours. Let's just go back to last year's Tour de France. We had the first big attack of Pugache on Rotakam. That was stage 12. Today's. Today's stage 6. And today he takes more time on stage 6 than he took on hotel in stage 12. And remember, he took 2 minutes 10 seconds on Jonas and now he takes 2:40 almost on Jonas.
- [07:41]
A
So. Yeah, well, I think this, that's true and I think this course invited it because last year there wasn't really any big mountains until stage 12. So you could prolong the suspense. But also I think you know, Otacom, that's just like big climb finish. I think it would have been smaller gaps had the, it been a summit finish. I think they elongated the gaps. They basically spread the groups out by putting the descent and then that long, long, long climb at the finish. I don't think his gap would have been as big at a summit finish.
- [08:13]
B
No, I mean it would probably have been more than what was it now, 30 seconds right between Pogachar and Vingegaard at the top of the got of the 30 seconds. But you know, you could say, well, would probably have been a little bit more because maybe a minute argue that, you could argue that he did attack, but he didn't go 100% full gas because he still had to go 36 kilometers after the top. And, and, and Jonas did go full gas today because he wanted to try to catch him. Right. But it would not have been 2 minutes 40 seconds if the finish was on top of the Turmale today. I think that was the most impressive actually. And again there you see the real difference in how much better Pugachar is that he takes from the top of the Galibier to the Finish. He takes 2 minutes and 10 seconds on Jonas in a man against man downhill valley and long drag, 4 or 5% uphill. I think that's the information. I mean, okay, Turmale is Turmale. You could see clearly there. Bogacha was better, had an incredible team, incredible launch from Del Toro. Does it really matter if he has that lead out or not? I don't think so, but you could say, well, Jonas, initially he was, you know, he couldn't follow his typical like trying then look, look behind when he starts to do that. It's, it's, it's not a good sign. But for, for 2, 3 kilometers he stayed there at like 9, 10, 12 seconds. So initially I thought ah, you know what, this could be interesting. But man, when it was like in the last 2k of the Tourmalet, Pugach just put the hammer down, took 30 seconds and then did an incredible downhill. I mean he's Spencer, he's better than everybody on the climbs, he's better than everybody in the downhills and he's better than everybody on the flats of all his rivals.
- [10:21]
A
So he's pretty good in the time trials.
- [10:23]
B
So you could say maybe Remco. Remco is maybe better on the flats, but Remco is not a real rival for, for today. I think so, yeah. I mean, it's. Barring anything unforeseen illness or, you know, crash or whatever, which we hope it doesn't happen, we know who's going to win this Tour de France. But then again, didn't we already know that before the Tour started?
- [10:48]
A
Yeah, I was going to say we probably knew that in June. People didn't want to listen to the truth, Johan. I mean, I went back to 20, 24, the Pyrenees. I think the first stage was 39. Second gap between Pagat and Vinegard. The next stage was about 10. It was like just over a minute. I think you, we, we maybe would have seen something like that had it been a normal summit finish. But this ultra long, this elongated effort just stretches the gap out. Because, I mean, I, I guess the scary thought is he does the tourmaline at about 6.7 watts per kilo. And that might have been him holding back because then he like hits the gas at the top, pulls out, like, blows his gap open.
- [11:27]
B
You also have to think, Spencer, it's extremely hot. It', altitude, you know, it might not be far off his limit, you know, but he was definitely not going 100% full gas. He was, it was a controlled effort. I think especially the beginning. He made that acceleration, made the gap, and then you could see that from 2 1/2 K to the top, he did accelerate to increase that gap. He still had something.
- [11:54]
A
And how would you rate? The gotcha aside, how do you rate these other contenders? You have like in the, in the bubble behind you have Jonas del Toro, Evanopol, Sixas Lipowicz, Ayuso Shkomoza. How do you rate how they did today?
- [12:07]
B
I think the most telling piece of information for me, Spencer, is the interview of Lipowicz after the stage. Here's a guy who got third last year, and he was very, very clear about it. He says Pugachar does not even try. We all know that Jonas is also better than us. So this is a race for third, you know, and I think that's really what he said. That's what he said. That's what he said. Yeah, yeah. And you know what I mean? We can speculate and calculate and try to guess and make these, all these theories as long as we want. There's nobody better to judge how the situation is than these guys. I mean, I have not seen Spencer, a single rider in the pre race interviews who did not say that Pogacha was going to attack and go solo on the Tourmaline. They all know. They all know. You know, it's like we can try to find, you know, little weaknesses here and there or what if. What happens? This. What. What if this happens? Nothing happens. It's just UAE going to the front and killing everybody and then Pogachar takes off. That's what happens.
- [13:15]
A
Yeah. And. But do you think. Do you agree with that assessment? Is Jonas the second strongest GC guy at this race?
- [13:20]
B
I think so. I think so. I think, yeah. I mean, he's been the second strongest for the last, but it's the third year in a row now, then two years. He was better than Pogacha, although we don't know how we can judge. I mean, it's the same thing also with Jonas. Jonas had this bad crash in the Basque country, so obviously he was not on his best in 2000. Was it 2023?
- [13:47]
A
Yeah.
- [13:48]
B
2020.
- [13:49]
A
Was that 24?
- [13:50]
B
Oh, 20. No. 24. 24.
- [13:52]
A
Yeah. And he's been at least this one of the two strongest riders since 2021.
- [13:57]
B
Yeah. And then on top of that, Spencer, you know, every race he did where Pogacha was not he. He has won. So it's pretty simple, right?
- [14:05]
A
Yes.
- [14:06]
B
And all these other guys were there. All these other guys were there. Right. In. In several races. So these guys know what's going on. Right. I think it's going to be a really interesting battle for the moment. For the moment. I think the interesting fact is that Jonas is in second, but he's not far ahead. So somebody in that group of 5, 6, 7 other riders will say, huh, he's not that much better than us. We came back on him a little bit. Maybe there is a chance that's number one. And secondly, we'll have to see if this Jonas Wingaard is going to be solid during the next three, two and a half weeks. You know, we. We had some discussions about this Spencer during the Giro and after the Giro, that, yeah, it's the ideal preparation, the Giro. You know, he didn't go full gas. I. I don't know. Maybe it's an impression, Spencer, but. And it's obviously also magnified by the fact that Bogachar is so strong. But I kind of have the impression that Jonas is really good, but he lacks freshness. He lacks freshness and he's not as explosive. And maybe that's a consequence of having done the Giro? I don't know. I mean, you know, you can calculate and you can program everything, but at the end of the day, these are human beings and a body works and reacts differently than what the theory says sometimes. So who knows?
- [15:41]
A
Yeah, I, I, I think there would, that would be exactly why he might look like he lacks freshness. I, I am just a little bitter too, because I felt like for 30 years all we heard about was it's hard to do the Tour Geo double. And then in the last three years since Pagachar did it, which no one should ever judge anything, never exactly learn any lessons from Tada Picachar that now it seems the perfect preparation. It's like, I think it makes you pretty tired because who else looked pretty tired today? Johan.
- [16:08]
B
I mean, yeah, I was going to say, I already didn't like this one. I was surprised to see him. I was shocked on the roster before the start of the Tour. Davide Piganzoli, really, really good rider, young, young rider, big talent. Did a great Giro, most of it in support of the team and of Jonas Vingegaard, but also tried to go for himself. And did he finish top 10 finally? I think he finished top 10 in the Giro.
- [16:40]
A
Yeah, he did.
- [16:41]
B
He was, he was in contention for the, for the white jersey also for a while. And when I saw that, I said, man, that's, that's not a good decision. Obviously they had this last minute change with Walt von Aert not being able to do the Tour de France, and they were short on some riders, but to put him, I mean, this guy went full gas in the Giro. There's no doubt about that. That guy did not save himself in the Giro. And we're probably gonna see him. He's gonna be on a good level, but he's not fresh at all. He's gonna drag himself through this Giro d'. Italia. I think so. So, yeah, I mean, as you say, Spencer, who's done it two years ago, but that's not something that should be set as the new rule now that you can do the Giro and the Tour and you're going to be extremely good in both of them.
- [17:40]
A
I mean, Lance doesn't know who Davide Pigenzoli is. And he just looked at the TV today and goes, who's that guy? He looks pretty tired. There's something there. He does look pretty tired. I mean, speaking of visma, Speaking of, I, I too was shocked by that decision. Johan. I could not believe they selected him for this race, but yeah. Speaking of Visma, odd decisions, what's going on with trying to get Mateo Jorgensen up the road and he gets dropped very early on the tourmaline.
- [18:05]
B
Yeah, yeah. I don't know. Maybe at some point there was a lot of attacking going on, and then I saw Matteo trying to go two times in a. In a.
- [18:16]
A
In a.
- [18:16]
B
In a move on these little climbs before the Aspen, and it looked like it was out of control, and UAE was a little bit over the place. But listen, I mean, you know, uae, ultimately, they're going to get it together. If they're a little bit disorganized and it's chaos, you know, I think the only thing that they're going to accomplish, if they send Jurgensen in a break, they're going to piss off UAE and they're going to make them even ride
- [18:44]
A
harder, which I think happened the other day when they whopped everybody because they tried to get Jorgensen up the road. I think UA was pretty peeved about that.
- [18:53]
B
Well, I mean, listen, you have to try something. I mean, you know, I'm not criticizing Matteo, Jorgensen for trying, but also, I think it also says, Spencer, something about the condition of Matteo, because if he's supposed to be your second rider, your last rider to stay with Jonas, that's not a guy you should send in a break.
- [19:19]
A
Yeah. Yeah. I don't get that.
- [19:21]
B
Yeah, I don't get it at all. Del Toro is not going in breakaways.
- [19:24]
A
No. Well, we did see the. I guess the pushback on this. We saw at the dofine. Right. That. That was the Dofine that Mateo. I felt like his weakness in that race was climbing, like, hard climbs. So maybe Visma knew that he's not going to be able to stick around over the tourmaline.
- [19:42]
B
Yeah.
- [19:42]
A
So they. We got to get this guy up the road.
- [19:45]
B
Yeah. But, you know, I mean, already, Spencer, if you, you know, we.
- [19:51]
A
Before.
- [19:51]
B
Before, like at the beginning of the broadcast, we had Pedersen and Pip Arts, who I want to talk about, and Victor Campena, Chapter Road. Victor Campenaerts. Okay. Yeah, you're in there, but do you really think that they're going to let you go? And then still, I mean, if that would be a Piganzoli or a Sepkus or. But, you know, Kampenaerts is not going to have enough time on the Aspen to make it over to Tourmalet. So this is not Walt Van Aert, you know.
- [20:24]
A
Yeah.
- [20:25]
B
And then also, I mean. I mean, I hate to bang a little bit on Visma, but I cannot avoid the Impression that some guys. And still we're only stage six. Right. A lot can change. And some people. But usually what you see in the first week is what you see for the next two weeks.
- [20:44]
A
Exactly. That's exactly right.
- [20:47]
B
But for example, I think Victor, for example, is not at all in the condition he was in last year. Remember last year when sometimes one or two climbers failed? He was the guy with Jonas.
- [20:58]
A
Well, what did Victor spend doing?
- [21:03]
B
He did the Giro.
- [21:04]
A
Yeah, he did the Giro. Yeah. I saw him on the Giro. I was thinking, how is he going to be at his best in the Tour de France?
- [21:10]
B
So we have Jonas, we have Victor, we have Piganzoli, we have Sepkus for half the team. All these guys come from the Giro and then. And maybe someone else. Was Afini there?
- [21:22]
A
No, I think it's 4.04. Okay. So it's like a Mateo. The other two chaps whose names are escaping me that I can't remember right now.
- [21:33]
B
Yeah,
- [21:36]
A
we're getting old. Yeah.
- [21:37]
B
And then the Danish guy or the Norwegian guy.
- [21:40]
A
Oh, yeah,
- [21:45]
B
Yeah.
- [21:46]
A
But four guys from the Giro is. That's a lot of your team doing double duty.
- [21:50]
B
Well, UAE has a few, too. You know, they have Adam Yates, but
- [21:56]
A
he only did the Giro for, like, two days.
- [21:58]
B
That's true. That's true. Yeah. He crashed. That's true. Yeah. I forgot about that. Yeah. Yeah. Otherwise he would probably not have made the Tour team.
- [22:04]
A
No, I don't think so.
- [22:06]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [22:08]
A
So true. I. I mean, they're very, like, innovative team, but I feel like today we. We saw where sometimes maybe just doing the conservative thing is best, but.
- [22:20]
B
Yeah.
- [22:21]
A
Perhaps Matteo would have been dropped anyway and there was nothing to do.
- [22:24]
B
Well, I think the biggest. Listen, the biggest problem is, in my opinion, is if your leader is not 100% fresh, you know, if you. Obviously, Jonas is, I think. Well, I mean, it's difficult to say. We would have to look at the numbers. You think he's at the same level as the Giro? Probably. Is.
- [22:44]
A
Probably It Definitely. He's not weaker. I'm just looking at the spreadsheet I have of their power, and it probably was even more impressive. I bet his performance today was even more impressive because he's doing, like Giro d' Italia. Summit finish, power numbers. Not at the summit finish.
- [22:59]
B
Yeah.
- [22:59]
A
So. But here's. I guess we shouldn't lose sight of this. I think we said this ourselves. The question is not, is Jonas too tired to win the overall. The question is, is Jonas too tired to finish second because they were not going to beat Tad epicure. Anyway, so, like, none of this matters, but you don't want Jonas so tired that he can't finish second because what if, Tate, what if he crashes today on the descent of the Tour, off the Tourmalet, like you want to be there and be ready to win the race, but.
- [23:28]
B
Yeah, no, I think. I think, yeah, I think Jonas is the second strongest rider.
- [23:32]
A
I don't. I'm not. I thought Del Toro looked like fingers in the nose on that final.
- [23:36]
B
Well, I mean, he couldn't stay. He couldn't stay with Jonas on the turmale.
- [23:39]
A
And it's not my.
- [23:40]
B
It's not like Del Toro did a huge effort. I mean, he did that acceleration, which, by the way, I don't know if you saw the interaction between Pogacha and Del Toro after the stage. On the warming down, Jonas today told Del Toro that maybe he. He went. He was a bit too excited and he went a bit too fast because initially they went away with just the two of them, which.
- [24:07]
A
Just the two of them.
- [24:07]
B
I have been saying in some podcasts that they would go away. The two of them.
- [24:11]
A
Yes. Yeah, I remember you saying that.
- [24:13]
B
But so, so, so today said that he. He was a bit. He got a bit too excited and he went a bit too fast in that acceleration. But then he had some time to. To kind of take his own tempo and try to stay with Jonas and couldn't stay with Jonas sitting on the wheel. Okay. You're on the Tourmalet. It doesn't really matter too much if you're on the wheel or not at those slopes. Right. But, but yeah, I think. I think for the moment we have to. I'm going to say that Jonas Fingergaard is the second strongest rider in the race.
- [24:45]
A
And what do you think of Paul's success?
- [24:49]
B
Listen, really good. Really good. I personally think it's a really good result. He was what, he was fourth, fifth, 19th?
- [24:58]
A
Yeah, he's 19 years old. Yeah, it's pretty good.
- [25:01]
B
Initially, Spencer, I thought that on the early slopes of the turmoil, I. I didn't think he looked very good.
- [25:08]
A
I thought the same thing.
- [25:08]
B
I was worried about him. I was a bit worried. But then he kind of, you know, moved up bit by bit, and when the acceleration came, he was there and then he stayed there. You know, he was with. He was with Remco and Del Toro and Ayuso and Skill, Mozov and Lipovitz. Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, listen, it's. That's where I think we expected him to be. Is he going to Be the third strongest rider in the race. Personally, I'm not sure. I think if you would. I mean, maybe he's going to say differently in an interview, but if you would think, if you would, if you would ask Del Toro, sorry. Six us his real feelings. I'm pretty, I'm. I'm pretty sure he's disappointed. After today, I think he would have expected to be with Jonas Vengegaard.
- [26:01]
A
Hmm. I mean, yeah, I'm sure you're right. I bet even if, yeah, even if he was with Jonas, I bet he'd be beating himself up for not being with Dade. Is that.
- [26:11]
B
That's the mentality. That's the mentality. You know, that's. I think it's a great performance. It's only stage 6. I am slightly concerned about how, how he's going to do after 10 days, two weeks.
- [26:25]
A
I mean, he looks, I mean, everybody, we should say everybody except Tade looks on their knees six days in.
- [26:30]
B
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's like it's, you know, already at the beginning of the stage, Spencer, you know, before we went to the big climbs and it was attacking here and there, you know, after five stages, there was many, many like dead men walking riding. In this case, you know, you could see people really struggling. All the sprinters were getting dropped really early. You could see Merlier incredibly in pain. And then on the other hand, we had, you know, our good old Mats Pedersen in the breakaway with Victor Campenaerts and takes those 25 points, which, you know, it's another 25 points in the bag. Did you see that incident of Huep Arts, the guy from Lotto and the Commissaires?
- [27:23]
A
I did. I was confused about what was going on because he was not fined for
- [27:27]
B
anything after the stage. So. Yeah, I mean, nobody really knew. I mean, I have these two pictures here. You know, it was about the position and the so called illegal position of his forearms. So if you look at the pictures, you can see that he is on the hoods and his forearms are resting on the handlebars. Apparently that's not allowed and looks pretty natural, but I mean, it's almost impossible to not have. You have them lean on the, on the handlebars, especially with the, with the narrow width of the handlebars nowadays. And then I saw some information on TV also that, you know, one staff member of a team had sent 40 pictures of riders during the season doing the same thing. And at the same time, Victor Kompenaerts was riding exactly the same position.
- [28:25]
A
That's exactly how he rides.
- [28:26]
B
So I was very strange to see this UCI commissaire having a talk. We didn't really know what's going on on the live coverage. And then Huber Arts just, you know, went back to the, to the bunch. And then afterwards it was communicated that he got a warning. So not a fine, another disqualification. He got a warning and that out of protest, he made the decision himself to go back to the peloton. It's apparently a rule that most of the writers struggle with. And so I think that, I mean, of course this is in the Tour de France, so it's, you know, on live TV and it's going to be a topic of discussion, but it's very subjective also, you know, it depends on who looks and, you know, it's a. It's a not well defined rule and I'm all for, you know, rules that could, you know, contribute to the safety of the writers, but then at least apply them for everybody. The same all the time.
- [29:30]
A
Yeah. And it's hard not to sit like that when you're on one of these modern bikes. They kind of put you in that position. So on. On the breakaway, on how the stage started. So Mads Pedersen wins the. He bridges up to Victor Campenaerts. He was, he was hammering to get up there. He would be easy to watch and say, why aren't all the sprinters going up there? I don't think they could. I think Pedersen was the only one strong enough to go. And then he gets the intermediate sprint point. He now has a huge lead in the green jersey classification. Did you know that he got more green jersey points today than Tadipago did for winning the stage?
- [30:04]
B
How much was it?
- [30:05]
A
He got 25 for the intermediate sprint, 20 for the stage win.
- [30:09]
B
Oh, only 20. Okay.
- [30:10]
A
So right there we can see like it's going to be hard for Pagodrich.
- [30:14]
B
It's gonna have to be a sprinter. Yeah.
- [30:16]
A
Yep. Because he's losing points on days where he's putting out some of the most impressive performances we've ever seen. So.
- [30:22]
B
Yeah, yeah, probably form. Well, that's obviously why they changed that, you know, point system, which I think it's. It's right. You know, it's. I think the points jersey should be to a rider that when usually was a sprinter. Always until we had those dominators who. I mean, Pugach today takes the polka dot jersey also.
- [30:45]
A
Yep. And he's going to win. I bet he wins this thing because he's going to dominate on the climbs. I mean. Yeah, I Kind of like it too, because it's like, okay, tada. You want to win the green jersey, you got to get in a breakaway tomorrow. You gotta hold the peloton off. Like, you really gotta earn it. You're not gonna win it by accident.
- [31:00]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [31:02]
A
Well, should we take a quick break, Johan, and then we can come back and talk about any other. We'll talk about the tourmaline times and then we'll preview tomorrow's stage. If that works for you. Okay, we'll be right back, everybody. This episode is brought to by Oneskin. The summer riding season is here, which is why I've continued to rely on Oneskin. It's been invaluable to have a daily routine that delivers both powerful skincare and longevity benefits, all in a few simple steps. At their core is their patented OS1 peptide, born from a decade of longevity research and is proven to target visible signs of aging, helping you unlock your healthiest skin now and as you age. My favorite product, as I'm up here in the high altitudes of aspen, is their OS1 face sunscreen. Because we got a high solar radiation up here, and the OS 1 face sunscreen is incredibly easy to put on every morning before I go to the studio like, like I will right now. And outside of moisturizing, it makes sure I have sun protection right from the moment I outside. And for the rest of my body, I also have the OS one body sunscreen. So for a limited time, try one skin with 15 off using code the move at OneSkin co. The move, that's 15 off OneSkin co with code the Move. After you purchase, they're gonna ask you about where you're gonna ask where you heard about them. Please support our show by telling them we sent you. Again, that's oneskin co themove for 15 off, everybody. This episode is brought to you by Lagoon Sleep. With the Tour de France underway, every rider is looking for an edge. But the thing that's more impactful than having the fastest bike or slickest wheels is sleep. And that's what Lagoon is best at. And sleep works exactly the same way as structured training. One bad night, just like one bad workout's not going to be a problem. But a training block where you're chronically under recovering is. And it starts with what your head is on for eight or more hours a night. Lagoon is a small company built by athletes for athletes. A former Olympic trial swimmer who tested over 60 pillows couldn't find one built with recovery recovery in mind. So he built it himself. You can start with a two minute quiz that matches you to the right pillow for your sleep position and body type. Fully adjustable fill so you can dial in the exact height and support you need. The result, you fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer and start training days feeling better. And the data is real on this. Athletes sleeping under seven hours are 50% more likely to get injured mid block. And that's not an insign insignificant number. That's a huge number actually. And that's why I've been loving my Lagoon sleep pillows. They match me with the otter and as a hot sleeper and I don't have AC this month so I, I gotta stay cool with something. And the otter is keeping my temperature regulated with its generate gel memory foam. And since, since switching I've noticed waking up more refreshed and it's easier to jump out of bed at 4:30am to watch the beginning of these stages. So for the riders looking to perform at this tour recovery, it's not a nice to have. It's a critical piece of their arsenal. And if you want to be like them, if you want to recover like Tad A, go to lagoonsleep.com the move and take a two minute quiz. Use code MOVE N O M O V E for 15% off Lagoon, the marginal game gain you've been sleeping on. All right, Johan, we are back. So before we get into the tourmalet climbing times, Jonas Finnegaard was on a one by single chain ring today. What was going on with that?
- [34:08]
B
I was surprised. I mean I only saw it, I mean I only remarked it when on the top when they had like a side shot and I saw him on the big chainring and I saw it was a single chainring. Obviously he's using the one by of SRAM with the 13 sprocket explorer and apparently it's a 52 chainring. I mean you have to be minimal on 52 because otherwise you don't have gears enough on the flats to ride 70k an hour.
- [34:36]
A
And on the downhill, 52, 10, right?
- [34:38]
B
50 to 10.
- [34:39]
A
Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so that's a pretty big gear.
- [34:41]
B
Yeah, so. But apparently it's 52, 36, 13 sprockets. Spencer, I. You know what I mean, they must have their reason. I've seen most of the other Visma riders on a two by. Seb Kuss was on a two by. I don't understand man. I mean it's, it's for a stage in the high mountains with a climb like the Turmole. Everybody who's on a, you know, we all, we probably all have one buys on our gravel bikes. Right. And on our mountain bikes for sure. But on the road and especially in the really high mountains, these gaps between those, you know, like you have a 36 in the back.
- [35:25]
A
I don't get it.
- [35:26]
B
Then your next one must be a 32, otherwise you will never get to the 10 down. And then on the other hand, you have Pogachar, who's riding the classical Shimano system, which I suspect if it's a 54 chainring, then normally Shimano allows a 40 as the small chainring. You can't go any lower, otherwise the gap is too big. So he's on a 40 chainring, probably. But you do have these smaller gaps between the different sprockets. So the thing is, Spencer, if you are outstanding and you have an unbelievable day and you have a one buy, it doesn't matter. But if you, you're a little bit off, you're going to miss that sprocket that, you know, usually you would need to, you know, kind of take a little breather. You have no margin of error with a one by. It's either you. It works or it doesn't work. There is no in between.
- [36:31]
A
Yeah.
- [36:32]
B
And so I was surprised to see because. Why would they do it? Is it because of. Okay, you. It's eliminating the risk that your chain drops. Okay, I can understand weight wise, these bikes are now so light that they're under 6.8 if they really want to. Although it's an aero bike. But anyways, it's going to be 6.8, 6.9 kilos. The Cervelo, I think.
- [36:56]
A
Yeah, I would think, because Colonago, we had our spat last year about if that's a heavy bike or not. And they told me they can get that. The Aero Colonago, they can get it down close to the, to the weight, 6.8. So I'd imagine the Cervelo could do the same.
- [37:13]
B
And then it's. And then the third reason is aerodynamics. But yeah, I don't know. I. I'm not a fan. I mean, I'm a fan. I mean, I can understand if it's a specific stage where it's not in the high mountains, even. Spencer, I have my doubts. And this is not, not related to the Tour, but I have my doubts. I mean, there's. There's quite a few riders on SRAM who have been using this in the classics. Like in Tour of Flanders. Yeah, I have my doubts there too. You know.
- [37:40]
A
Interesting. I kind of like it. On that type.
- [37:42]
B
Well, yeah, I mean, it, you have to shift a lot. You. There, there's more risk to drop the chain and stuff, but still there's also these gaps, you know, I mean, on those steep walls with the cobbles. If you're, if you have really good legs, it doesn't matter. But if, if, if you are a little bit off, you're going to appreciate a double chain ring.
- [38:06]
A
Just as an act of journalism, I'm riding this 5440 that you described from the Shimano home every day. And we live at the top for the Tour here. We live at the top of a 14% climb. It is so hard to get up that thing. And actually I can't imagine not having the little gaps. Like, if you have big gaps and you're hurting that much, it has to make a difference. I'm more confused than anything about why Jonas would do this. I don't understand it.
- [38:34]
B
Yeah, he does it often. He, he seems to like it. He's done it on a lot of stages in the, in the Giro also. He likes it.
- [38:42]
A
I mean, I guess. I don't know, maybe he likes to cross chain and that's like a more secure way to do it. That would be my only guess.
- [38:49]
B
I'm not a, I'm not a huge fan. But anyways, you know, I'm old, I'm old fashioned, I'm grumpy, I'm complaining.
- [38:59]
A
You know, I, I have a double on my gravel bike. That's how much I like the double. So. Okay, I'm the same way. I don't like these.
- [39:05]
B
I mean, I, I could. I. I mean, I have also double chainrings on my road bikes. I mean, I would not, I would not oppose. I mean, if I, I mean, a single chainring for, for a recreational rider, I think it's pretty good. Yeah, super, super comfortable. You eliminate another thing that can go wrong. You know, if you're riding Scram Electronic, you're losing a potential spare battery if you run out of, if you run out of battery in there. Yeah, yeah, but, but, yeah. Anyways, listen, I'm sure they've done the tests and if Jonas likes it, he's going to keep using it. But it was. Yeah, it was. Especially for a climb like the Turmale. I think it's, it's, It's a bit of a risk.
- [39:53]
A
Well, the proof could be against us, Johan, because the tourmaline, the climb they did today, the most, I guess the most prolific climb, the first climb ever in Tour de France history. The most prolific climb over the years. 17K long, 7.4% average. That's. That's a long climb for people like that don't know. It took Pagacha 43 minutes and 2 seconds. And for these top professionals, for them to take over 40 minutes to do a climb is so rare. Like you rarely even see climbs long enough for that to happen. Like if you are a very fit amateur, like if you think I could beat these guys, like you're that level of fit. It would probably take you an hour and 20 minutes through this climb. That's how big this climb is.
- [40:34]
B
Double. It's always. Spencer. If it's always.
- [40:37]
A
It is always double.
- [40:38]
B
Fits. Fit. Cyclotourist. Just. Just multiply by two and that's. That's going to be your time. And you, you know that. And you're not going to have to go very easy. You have to push.
- [40:48]
A
It's funny you say that. There's a climb on the way into the studio where Matthew Ricatello has the kom and I'm. No matter how hard I push, I can't get within double of the time.
- [40:56]
B
Yeah. Which it's.
- [40:58]
A
And I'm going hard on that thing. But so that's two minutes fast. Over two minutes faster than the record which was set by Jonas Finnegaard in 20:23. So Jonas beats his own record and eight. Eight other riders in the group behind also break the record. So they were flying up that climb today.
- [41:16]
B
Yeah, I mean already, I think. Listen, obviously a lot also has to do with the run in. Right. The first 10km is UAE setting this pace. So that was already super fast. You know, there's only one. I mean if these, once these big guys go with. What, what, what did pogacha go with? 5,6k to go from the top.
- [41:36]
A
Maybe more.
- [41:37]
B
But anyways, there's only one way they're not going to beat it. If, if the lead in is slow and tactical, there's not much going on. The fact that UAE just started straight away and just burned one after the other. Everybody set their own tempo. It was clear was going to be a KOM today, but by over two minutes. That's quite something. And that was actually Jonas and today crossing together because remember.
- [42:08]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [42:09]
B
Ultimately it was finishing potere and Bogacha won that stage. But I do remember that Jonas tried two or three times a big attack to try to drop Bogacha because he had dropped him the day before on the Mariblanc.
- [42:24]
A
Yes, man, what a different time. It's like hearing you describe, like, the invention of fire. Yeah. Pagatra getting dropped by Jonas. Jonas attacking.
- [42:35]
B
Everyone thought only two, three years ago.
- [42:38]
A
I know. And then it was shocking when Pagacha attacked and won Dakota Ray. People were blown away by that.
- [42:43]
B
Yeah.
- [42:44]
A
But, yeah, they were. They were flying up the climb today. And it's not. The interesting thing to me is it's not just we. We all know Tad is very fast. He's going to go fast. But all of these guys, you know, we say it every year that you. This proves that you have to be significantly faster every year than you were the year before to stay competitive.
- [43:03]
B
Yeah. So breaks the record. Jonas breaks the record. Del Toro breaks it. Remco sex us Lipowicz Del Toro Ayuso skillmos. All these guys broke the record.
- [43:22]
A
Yeah. Like, if I just came up to you on the street yesterday and said, remco evidentable is going to break the record on the tourmaline tomorrow.
- [43:28]
B
Yeah.
- [43:28]
A
You'd be like, whoa, he's going to ride away and win the stage.
- [43:31]
B
Remco was, you know, Remco was pretty solid today, I have to say.
- [43:34]
A
He was really good. Really good.
- [43:36]
B
This. This. This was. This is a climb where two times he. He. He broke one time in the Vuelta. When Sepkus won the Vuelta, he. He got blown. He got dropped there very early. And then in the Tour last year was also. Yep. And today he was. He was up there. Didn't. I mean, he obviously got his own temple. Couldn't respond to the attack. But I think he looked pretty solid. He is. So just a little bit more detail on his weight, you know, because. So he is 4 kilos lighter, close to 4 kilos lighter than in the spring, but he is 1 kilo lighter than he has his ever lightest weight, which was when he was third in the Tour.
- [44:21]
A
Interesting. Yeah, he climbed like it today. He was very good, very solid, very
- [44:27]
B
consistent, very good, very strong on the last climb.
- [44:31]
A
Also is that kind of proves the theory that I think. I think we had that he's not naturally as good of a climber because he just runs at a higher weight, and he has to be at a really low weight to be able to climb consistently with these guys.
- [44:48]
B
I mean, maybe. Yeah. I mean, I think he's. Listen, he's a pretty good climber, man. He.
- [44:53]
A
He's been wobbly, like, every stage race. He just, you know, think of, like, the last two years, he just gets found out on these climbs. And then today it's like, well, where did that come from? You didn't climb like that since 2024.
- [45:05]
B
Yeah. He didn't look like he was. I mean, at least in the group he was in. He was either driving it because behind, behind Jonas and Del Toro and who was the other guy? Was it Lipowitz was there with them?
- [45:21]
A
Lipowitz, no sex.
- [45:22]
B
Us six offs. And then it was, you know, he was in that other group and yeah, yeah, he looked, he looked pretty good. Let's say he's going to be pretty happy with today's result because I think it's going to be a big relief for him. It's. I think it was kind of a nervous build up. Build up to. It was the first big mountain, you know, to find out, okay, how am I going to be, you know. Because the last experiences were not very good.
- [45:52]
A
No. And now. So he's 3:30 back. Del Toro's 3:27 back. Jonas is 242 back. If they went into the time trial right now, like not impossible that he would be second. So he's got, he's got to be feeling pretty good. One guy we've not mentioned is Torsten Train. The yellow jersey. Just tragic day in yellow. He gets dropped and he would have been out of yellow anyway. Gets dropped earlier than I thought he would.
- [46:17]
B
Yeah.
- [46:17]
A
And we thought, well, he's going to lose so much time on the tourmalet that he's going to be out of yellow. And then he crashes into his teammate's wheel descending the tourmalet, which is not fun at all.
- [46:26]
B
Yeah, that was obviously, you know, a result of being completely cross eyed, I think.
- [46:34]
A
Yes.
- [46:35]
B
Not being very lucid. Let's not forget also Spencer, he also crashed yesterday.
- [46:40]
A
Yeah, both days he was in yesterday.
- [46:42]
B
So, you know, it's still to be. I mean, he was already on one of those little climbs before, before the Aspen. I already could see that he was struggling. He was, he was having difficulties to close a gap. So it didn't look like it was going to be a great day for him. Yeah, I was, Yeah. I mean we were wrong by thinking that he would keep his eight minute lead, at least some of them, some of it to stay in yellow and then until stage 14. But it's been a shorter yellow experience than we thought.
- [47:15]
A
To be fair, only 11 riders finished within eight minutes of pagacha today. Okay.
- [47:19]
B
Yeah. Yeah. That's maybe the reason. That's maybe the reason Jordan J.
- [47:25]
A
Got was 8:18 back. That's a top 10 finisher in the Tudor franchise. That's crazy.
- [47:29]
B
That's crazy.
- [47:29]
A
That's crazy.
- [47:30]
B
And then. Yeah.
- [47:31]
A
So of course before, before they start doing their weightlifting.
- [47:34]
B
After the crash, Spencer of Thurston train, he looked, it looked pretty serious at the beginning. He didn't move. I mean, he didn't make any intention to get back on his bike.
- [47:44]
A
Yeah.
- [47:45]
B
And so obviously then he lost a lot of time. More than half an hour. Almost half an hour. No.
- [47:49]
A
Yes.
- [47:50]
B
And I have doubts if he's going to be at the start tomorrow. He was asking for like super cold spray on his shoulder on the last climb.
- [47:59]
A
Yeah,
- [48:01]
B
yeah, that's. That's not a good sign.
- [48:06]
A
And yeah, no, it's. It's really like really sad. Not a great way to end your. Your time in yellow. Also, Jonas crashed yesterday. I noticed last night when I rewatched the stage.
- [48:15]
B
Yeah, he did, yeah.
- [48:17]
A
Let's Preview stage number seven. 175km. We all know, we all know the stage like the back of our hand. We got a sprint stage into Bordeaux before we preview it. We have a partnership with NextBets. Nxtbets.com bet outcomes. If you want to bet on the stage, definitely head over there because it shows you exactly how to bet. It shows you where you can bet and most importantly it shows you the different prices. So for example, I can see the best price in the US right now to win the Tour de France's tied up a GIA. 1400. Should have gotten them yesterday at -550 or whatever it was. The points classification. Mads Pedersen -160. That's actually decent price for where that is right now. Let's look at young rider classification. Del Toro is now minus 135. Should have listened to us two days ago when he was plus 160. But Johan, I'm going to look for the odds of this stage. But while I do that, I assume 165 kilometer stage with the least amount of climbing of any road stage in this race. 841 meters of climbing. This has got to be a bunch bent. Correct.
- [49:23]
B
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, typical Bordeaux stage, 175k.
- [49:27]
A
No, it is, I think 175k.
- [49:29]
B
Yeah, yeah. This one little climb after 137km. The sprinters won't have a problem with that. So for sure it has to be a bunch print tomorrow. Spencer. Complete bunch print or we don't know what's going to happen in the final. I mean, yesterday was a bunch print of what was it? 30, 35 riders. Because there was this crash. Yeah. I mean, without seeing the odds, Spencer, I'm going to say the guy who's not the favorite because I know who the favorite is on the, on the bookmakers. I'm going to go for Olaf Koj again.
- [50:09]
A
I like.
- [50:10]
B
I think he looked incredibly good. He's in great shape also physically. I mean it's not just his sprinter legs. I think he looks like he's in the best physical condition of all the sprinters and you know he doesn't really need a lead out train but he will have two lead out guys. He will have down hall and Case Ball or cease Ball, whatever it is. I don't know if it's case or cease. So yeah, I'm picking Olaf Coy for the win tomorrow.
- [50:46]
A
So the. I like that pick. The odds are Tim. This is on DraftKings because Next Bets told me that's where the best price was. Tim Meerlear plus 100 Olaf Coy plus 200 Jasper Phillipson plus 500 Binyam Girmai plus 900 Max Cantor plus 1600 Mads Pedersen plus 2800 I'm going Coy too. I think Coy is the fittest sprinter. I rewatched last night. I rewatched the stage last night. He launches, he gets a gap but they don't pull him back at all in the last few hundred meters like he. It was Mark Cav. I'm going to say it again. It was Mark Cavendish esque. Just the acceleration and the ability to hold that this guy is really fit right now. So I'm going especially at this price. Plus 200. I'm going olive koi plus 200 especially
- [51:31]
B
also Spencer listening to both Merlier and Philipson yesterday both of them said that it was so fast they were completely on the limit and like in the last kilometer and something tells me, I mean I just, it's just from observation and I don't know, I mean I've said it, I said it already. I think on one of the shows. I have the impression that Philipson is not his usual self that is normally in the Tour de France he looks different. I think he. Of course if you're a sprinter, I mean you can get away with being bulky but he doesn't look as slim as the usual Philipson who wins three stages in the Tour de France.
- [52:19]
A
I mean you, you tried to warn me off of him.
- [52:21]
B
Maybe tomorrow, maybe tomorrow. I'm, I'm proven wrong. But my initial takeaway is that Philipson is not in the same condition as usual.
- [52:30]
A
I think you could be onto something there. I, I wonder where Matthew Vanderpool's head is right now because I would have thought that Mads Pedersen stage was perfect for him. He was nowhere. And then I wonder if he's just fully dialed in on the Mountain Bike World Championships and maybe he's not. I mean, that's. He said that's his big goal for the year.
- [52:49]
B
Training camp. Training camp for that.
- [52:51]
A
Training camp for that. Did you know? Eight, two part question. Did you know Fernando Garveri is at this race?
- [52:58]
B
I saw that today. Yeah. Yeah, I saw that.
- [53:00]
A
Do you know what his odds are for tomorrow?
- [53:03]
B
I mean, Fernando. It's been a while since Fernando Gavidia has been in the mix for a sprint in any race. I don't know.
- [53:10]
A
Plus 10,000.
- [53:11]
B
Plus 10,000. Yeah.
- [53:13]
A
This is a guy who was, like, seen as the writer that was going to knock Cavendish off his spot.
- [53:19]
B
I mean, he was. When he came onto the scene, and then he was on Quick Step. He won a couple of stages. No. In the Tour. Yeah.
- [53:27]
A
And actually it supports our Olof Koi pick because it was the same way he popped onto the scene. He was so good. He won multiple stages. And that tends to be what happens to these sprinters that come out of nowhere. Not out of nowhere, but burst onto the Tour scene with a lot of pizzazz. They tend to win multiple stages.
- [53:46]
B
He's on. He's on. No, he is.
- [53:49]
A
He is. Yeah. I'm gonna. If I'm gonna say my wild card for the stage, Max Cantor, plus 1600. I thought he looked pretty impressive on stage.
- [53:58]
B
Yeah. A really good lead out. He trained also yesterday. I mean, I don't know. It was the consequence of the chaos that was. That happened after the crash. But he has a few guys, a few good guys there. Although, I mean, I. Okay. One thing is being he was. Was he second yesterday?
- [54:16]
A
He was second, yeah, he was second. Yeah.
- [54:18]
B
Okay. And today he did win the intermediate sprint.
- [54:22]
A
Yeah.
- [54:23]
B
From the peloton. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [54:26]
A
And he's got a strong lead out, too.
- [54:28]
B
Yeah. Yeah. I would be surprised if he wins,
- [54:31]
A
but probably a good pick for the top three, the more I think about it. Yeah. Cause he often does land in the top three. So before we go, Ventum trivia, everybody knows the rules. I'm looking for the rules. Answer the day's trivia question correctly and get entered to win. For a chance to win a $5,000 credit toward a Ventum bike of your choice, the winner will be announced on air, on the move on the final stage on July 26. Yesterday's question was PO has hosted the Tour more times than any other. Than almost any other city. How many times has it been featured? The answer was. The answer from Ventum was 77 times. I looked this up though. It's 67 times and which is a lot. I believe that ties it for Bordeaux, but Bordeaux will pass it when they finish there tomorrow. Today's question is the Col du Tourmalet is the most climb pass in Tour history. When was the historic climb debuted in the Tour? Do you know the. I do.
- [55:29]
B
No, I don't know the answer. I don't know the answer, Spencer, But I have heard the stories that it was the assistant of the Tour de France director who went to. Who had to go somewhere and he. He went over a pass which was called Turmale, which was unpaved. Unpaved. So it was dirt uphill and downhill. And so he came to his destination with the message, something. I mean, this must have been early 1900s, right?
- [56:03]
A
Yeah.
- [56:04]
B
And so he said, okay, I arrived, delivered the message, and we can pass here. And that's how the turmole got in. Included in the Tour de France. Imagine this climb, Spencer. So we know how hard it is. So I mean, it was not flatter. It was the same steepness, but no, no, no paved road. And these bikes. Yeah, one gear.
- [56:37]
A
One gear. Yeah, yeah, I guess one gear. No gears would be. Your bike's not moving.
- [56:41]
B
I mean, I don't know. I mean, back in those days there was. I mean, maybe that was because there was. There was a system. They had. They actually. Two gears. They had one.
- [56:50]
A
One sprocket like the flop hub.
- [56:52]
B
And on the other side they had another sprockets. And basically what they did, they took out their wheel on the top of the climb and they went on a. They turned around the wheel, the back wheel, and they had the other heavier gear for the downhill.
- [57:07]
A
That's crazy. Did they coasting?
- [57:09]
B
But yeah, yeah, yeah. It was not on fifth gears. It was coasting. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Going down on fixed gear. That's.
- [57:19]
A
I actually cannot imagine doing the Tourmalet without pavement and without.
- [57:23]
B
There's gear. Yeah, that's crazy. It is. You know, another crazy. I mean, a few years ago, a few years ago, I saw this on Spanish tv. A few years ago, there's an ex professional cyclist who I raced with. He was on Banesto and on Reynolds and he was one of the teammates of Miguel in the Rhine. And for a good cause. He rode up the Tourmalet backwards.
- [57:52]
A
Oh my God.
- [57:54]
B
So pedaling back. So sitting backwards.
- [57:58]
A
Whoa. That's insane.
- [58:01]
B
Yeah.
- [58:02]
A
Oh, my God.
- [58:04]
B
So raise money for some kind of foundation or something.
- [58:09]
A
Ruben.
- [58:10]
B
Ruben Garos.
- [58:12]
A
Shout out, Reuben.
- [58:13]
B
Yeah.
- [58:13]
A
And if you, if you want to enter this competition, make sure you go to ventum.com, sorry ventumracing.com the move. And while you're there, use code the move. 10 for 10% off anything on the site, including any bike. So don't miss out on. On that chance. And Johan, is there anything else you want to talk about before we take off?
- [58:34]
B
No, I think we covered everything. Congrats for an unbelievable show. And, yeah, hopefully we can see a few other developments now, which we will. Stages will be different from now on. Yeah, everybody's gonna be, you know, licking their wounds till the next big appointment.
- [58:55]
A
Well, in the race is gonna enter a weird phase. You know, it's. There's no mountain stages until stage 14. And it's going to be a lot of sprint transition breakaway days, I would imagine.
- [59:07]
B
Easy on. It's not going to be easy on uae.
- [59:10]
A
No, no, not at all.
- [59:11]
B
This is, this is the price you have to pay for such a domination of, you know, such a domination. That's that everything is for you. And they're going to get through, you know, some stages in the central massif that are very, very hard, although it's not a mountain stage, but it's very hard. Sometimes some of those stages are harder than a real mountain stage.
- [59:32]
A
Yeah. When you talk about the race being potentially out of control today, it's like it's never really out of control if there's the Aspen and the tourmaline, because no, you just have the option of going hard on those, but if they aren't there, it can't get out of control.
- [59:47]
B
Okay. All right, thanks, Johan.
- [59:49]
A
And we'll talk tomorrow.
- [59:53]
B
Foreign.
- [59:57]
A
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