Session 79: PinkPantheress

Summary

Therapuss with Jake Shane – Session 79: PinkPantheress

Host: Jake Shane
Guest: PinkPantheress
Release Date: June 26, 2025

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Introduction

In Session 79 of Therapuss with Jake Shane, Jake welcomes renowned artist PinkPantheress for an engaging and introspective therapy session. The episode delves deep into PinkPantheress's creative journey, her struggles with Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD), and her perspectives on friendships and personal growth. The conversation is both humorous and heartfelt, offering listeners valuable insights into managing mental health while navigating the complexities of the music industry.

Background of PinkPantheress

PinkPantheress shares the origin of her unique stage name, which blends elements from the classic Pink Panther movies and a term from the game show The Chase. She recounts her early days on TikTok and her transition from producing music anonymously to embracing her persona publicly.

“I was making a Tick Tock account and then I wanted to call myself the game show aspect is because I was watching a game show called the Chase. And answer to one of the questions was Panther S. And I really like the way it sounded, so I wanted to call myself that, but then it was taken, so I put pink in front of it.” [04:00]

Music and Creative Process

PinkPantheress discusses her musical influences, emphasizing the significant impact of British music and genres like drum and bass and jungle. She contrasts the British music ecosystem with the diverse and fragmented nature of American music scenes.

“I'm from the UK, so a lot of my music is very. It’s all very. It hails a lot from what I grew up listening to. And that's why I feel like a lot of Americans are less familiar with some of the genre.” [08:30]

Her creative process involves starting with the beat—whether self-produced or provided by another producer—then developing melodies before crafting lyrics. This approach highlights her focus on the sonic quality and emotional resonance of her music.

“For me, it comes from hearing the beat first. Whether I've made the beat myself or I'm using a producer's beat. I have to get familiar with the beat. Once that happens, then I kind of do melody passes with my voice. And then once that's been figured out, then lyrics come last for me.” [27:20]

Dealing with OCD and Perfectionism

A significant portion of the conversation centers around PinkPantheress's experience with OCD. She explains how OCD manifests in her life, particularly in her need for perfectionism and repetitive thoughts.

“I have OCD. So what that means is I have to touch things evenly. I have to, like, count things really. Like, intrusive thoughts. I'm very superstitious. So if I don't do it, it's bad luck.” [18:20]

Pink discusses her struggle with negative self-perception and how her OCD drives her to maintain exceedingly high standards in her work and personal life. She emphasizes the detrimental effects of this perfectionism, such as feeling unworthy unless she meets her own lofty expectations.

“That's something which is actually very detrimental to me as a human being because it means that I can negative and very. And people interpret a lot of what I say is like, which. And I just said this somewhere to someone else, but I said, like, people rightfully take my words and they obviously take them to me in exactly what I'm saying. But what I mean to say, whenever I say, like, I'm this. I'm this is this is that in my head, I have such a high standard. I want to be the best.” [20:06]

Coping Strategies and Mental Health Insights

PinkPantheress shares her journey with Exposure and Response Prevention (ERP) therapy, a form of cognitive-behavioral therapy beneficial for managing OCD. She explains how ERP has helped her control intrusive thoughts and reduce compulsive behaviors.

“ERP is a form of therapy for OCD. So I did a lot of that. So I can choose. I'm very lucky, by the way. This is a very lucky thing to have. I can choose which thoughts to dwell on.” [53:36]

Jake contributes by sharing his own experiences with self-esteem and anxiety, creating a mutual understanding of their mental health challenges. Their dialogue offers practical advice, such as silencing negative self-talk and focusing on positive affirmations.

Jake: “I was like, wait, shut up.” [62:50]
PinkPantheress: “Exactly. It feels like this is what it feels like. It feels like this shut up.” [63:00]

Perspectives on Friendship and Relationships

The episode delves into the dynamics of friendships and romantic relationships. PinkPantheress emphasizes the importance of investing in meaningful connections rather than maintaining superficial ones. She discusses recognizing and distancing oneself from friends who treat relationships as disposable.

“I can't do it. It's really hard for me because I'm like. But I, I. Because I'll always have this doubt in my head that you'll have my back. And I need people that have my back.” [68:59]

Jake shares his frustrations with a stagnant relationship, prompting PinkPantheress to offer strategies for addressing unreciprocated feelings and handling jealousy.

Jake: “I've been in a situationship for 3.5 years. And we finally had a real talk about feelings. And then the next week he had a new girlfriend. Should I tell her? And how.” [63:08]
PinkPantheress: “Well, we can't know unless we have the... We don’t know what was in the contents of the conversation.” [63:18]

Notable Quotes

• “Emotions are like people on the street. You don't have to acknowledge them.” [61:36]
• “Being nice to yourself is so important.” [46:57]
• “If someone says I'm mid or I'm ugly, I'm like, like, I don't have the receptor again to care anymore.” [42:53]

Conclusion

Session 79: PinkPantheress offers a candid and insightful exploration of mental health, creativity, and personal relationships. Through her honest discussion about OCD and perfectionism, PinkPantheress provides listeners with valuable coping mechanisms and reinforces the importance of self-compassion. The episode not only highlights her artistic journey but also underscores the significance of nurturing authentic relationships and maintaining mental well-being.

Listeners unfamiliar with the episode will find it both relatable and inspiring, as Jake and PinkPantheress navigate the intricate balance between personal struggles and professional success with humor and empathy.

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Notable Quotes:

• PinkPantheress: “For me, it's always the way it Sounds and then the feeling that I give off when I sing and the feeling of it.” [30:59]
• Jake Shane: “I can't lie. I can't lie.” [57:55]
• PinkPantheress: “You can't hate on someone for having it if you don't have it yourself.” [55:04]

Note: Timestamps are approximated based on the transcript provided.

Transcript

[Jake]

This is the way it feels to move through summer in Lululemon iconic aligned softness without the front seam for our smoothest look and feel ever. Summer won't know what hit it. Stretch your limits in the non stop flexibility of the new Lululemon align no line pant in select stores [e-mail] hi and welcome back to Therapists. I'm recording this from my hotel room in Washington, dc. I just got back from France. If you didn't see, I had a very, very horrible travel day yesterday. And honestly, like, as I tell the story about it, I'm like, damn. Like, it. Like, it really wasn't that horrible. But like, like, I know, I'm just so dramatic. But like, in the moment, like, I thought, like, my life was over, like, in. Okay, so. So when I was flying from Nice to Paris for my layover, like, I knew I had, like, such little time to get on my flight. And the Paris airport, if you haven't been, is the worst airport in the entire world. It's miserable. It's huge. It's impossible to get around. And, like, my app tells me this one gate. And so I run to the gate, like, sprint. Like, there is sweat dripping from my face. Like, I get on a bus and then I go through passport control and then I sprint and there's like, there's literally two ways I can go. One to gate K, one to gate M. Okay, online. It said Gate M on the app. It said gatekey. I'm like, why would the app. Why would the app be wrong some. It's feeling like, a bit too easy. Like there's no security I have to go through. And I know, like, when you're like, getting on a connecting to, like, America, like, you have to go through security even after passport, even after the passport stuff. And I'm like, something feels too easy and. And like, I'm dripping sweat. I get to the gate, it's not my flight. In fact, there is no flight. I'm just like, I have like 10 minutes left. And, like, my body, like, gives up. Like, I literally can't run anymore. I run back anyway and then I get lost. I run back. I like, try to run back through the passport thing. They're like, you can't do this. And then at one point, I just look around. I'm holding Cassandra, I'm dripping sweat, and I feel so, so defeated. Finally, I get on another flight to New York. I'm in a middle seat. People are eating salmon next to me on both sides. It was horrible. It Was horrible. It was the worst travel day of my life. But I'm here. That's. That's me. That's. That's my update for you. France was amazing. I went to Cannes Lion. It was incredible. I went on vacation. I was. I had such a wonderful time. I barely tanned, obviously, because I can't tan. I don't even think I got burnt because I put on so much sunblock. Tonight we have on Pink Pantheress, who I just absolutely adore. I think she's so incredible. Her music is so amazing and, like, unlike a lot of the stuff we hear today. So it was super, super cool to talk to her. And she's also, like, so fucking funny. Like, her humor was so similar to my humor. I just thought she was such a fun time to hang out with and to learn about, like, her music and her. And it was just so fun. And I'm really excited for you guys to learn more about her, if you don't already. I'm still on tour. I'm about to perform in Washington, D.C. and then New York at Radio City, then Atlantic City, then Boston, and then I have a few more shows to see if I'm coming to a city near you. Go to passthatpost.com and click Live with Jake Shane. And to submit a Tell me what's wrong. Go to passthatpost.com, click tell me what's Wrong and leave a name and number if you're feeling fancy. Okay. Enjoy the episode. Love you, Pussies. Hi, welcome back to Therapists. Today we have one of my favorite artists on Pink Panther S. Hi, nice to meet you. Wait, so your stage name came from the game show and the Pink Panther movies?

[Pink Pantheress]

So it came from. So I was making a Tick Tock account and then I wanted to call myself the game show aspect is because I was watching a game show called the Chase.

[Jake]

Okay. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And answer to one of the questions was Panther S. And I really like the way it sounded, so I wanted to call myself that, but then it was taken, so I put pink in front of it. Oh, like the movie?

[Jake]

Yes. Do you like the Pink Panther movies?

[Pink Pantheress]

Of course I do. Well, it depends which one we're talking. We're talking Peter Sellers or if we're talking Steve Martin.

[Jake]

Do you like the Steve Martin ones?

[Pink Pantheress]

Of course I do. Have you seen those ones?

[Jake]

I've seen. I've only seen the Steve Martin ones.

[Pink Pantheress]

Wait, okay. Do you remember any of it? Like, I would like to buy a hamburger.

[Jake]

Yeah, I remember. I don't remember.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay. It's Fine. I'm very well versed.

[Jake]

Wait, I watched your music video for tonight.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

Amazing, Amazing. I love it. I love it. Where's the. Was the. What was the inspiration behind it?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, oh, I was. I was. Okay, so I was listening to a lot of older music and I was listening to a lot of. Do you know who. Jamiroquies. There's an artist called Jamiroi that was fine. And well, he's. He's. He's from the uk, so maybe that's why.

[Jake]

But.

[Pink Pantheress]

And he has a music video from a song he has called King for a Day. And it's very Georgian. It was set in the Georgian times and I was like obsessed. I was like, I would love to do something similar to this. And I also watched The Madonna, the 1999, I think, or 2001 Vogue Live should at. I feel like the Grammys or something.

[Jake]

I don't know. I think I know what you're talking about. That performance where she did like. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And I loved it. So I was like, I really want to do something similar and I really.

[Jake]

Yeah, it's amazing. It's amazing. And it's one of your longer songs.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, it is actually.

[Jake]

It's one of your. Because normally you said that you don't like your songs going above 2:30, right?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, yeah, but it is, it is. It's nearly three minutes or I think it is on Spotify, it's like three minutes something in four seconds.

[Jake]

And then. Or do you have any other songs on the mixtape that are a little longer?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, I think so. I don't know if any of the others actually go over three minutes, but I think they are like similar to the Tonight. Yeah.

[Jake]

Right, right. And then what? Well, how do you decide between like when you're doing like it's either a mixtape or an album, like, how do you decide?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, it's all about how you go into it and what you are thinking going into it. So if I'm. I went into this project not like thinking of as a mixtape. So that's how I proceeded. But if I went on into it thinking it was an album, then I would proceed as such.

[Jake]

And then how do you. What's like the difference in your mind between the two?

[Pink Pantheress]

Just how honestly and this is going to sound really, is how seriously, I think about every component with a mixtape. You have more freedom to be fun. Okay, so I was. I. You can sample more. I sample more or I feel like way more liberty to just kind of go crazy and just do whatever. Throw in Some random. But with an album, it's like, okay, everybody on mute. Yeah.

[Jake]

Do you have, like, an experience with a song that you overthought and then you were like.

[Pink Pantheress]

You put it out and you were like, yes. I feel like I have before. I've had songs where I'm like, I could have just left it at the original demo and it would have been probably a bit more enjoyable for people. But, I mean, shoulda, coulda, woulda, shoulda, coulda, woulda.

[Jake]

I read something the other day that was like, those are like, the three worst words in the English language.

[Pink Pantheress]

Shoulda, woulda and coulda.

[Jake]

Yeah, because it's like, you can't.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah. Because you can't. I was saying this to literally just now with my manager. I was like, whatever. The beauty of an outcome is that you don't know what the other outcomes could be. So you just live with the reality of what the reality is. Yeah.

[Jake]

Do you take, like, a lot of, like. Do you take a lot of, like, personal inspiration for your music or, like, how do you, like, what's your process like?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah, I take a lot of my. My pros. Well, we were just talking. I was just talking about someone else. But a lot of my personal decisions come from my tastes, so. And my tastes are obviously informed by what I grew up listening to and where I'm from. I'm from the uk, so a lot of my music is very. Is. It's all very. It hails a lot from what I grew up listening to. And that's why I feel like a lot of Americans are less familiar with some of the genre. Like other people describing music as, like, hyper pop. Sometimes I'm like, not quite. Not quite. But, you know, it makes sense why, like, maybe someone from America would think of it as that, because they aren't necessarily too familiar with what it actually is. The genre is called drum and bass and it. Drum and bass. And that's where you'll find the really quick drums and the breaks. And that is a genre called drum bass.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And. And. Or jungle. It kind of leaks into others. But that's what a lot of Americans call hypo, because it's very sped up.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

Quick, very like. But it's not that in. In. But who. But who makes the rules? No one makes the rules. No one makes the rules. So it really is whatever you want to be. But I wouldn't necessarily call hyperpop.

[Jake]

And then.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

Wait, what did you grow up listening to?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, this is going to be very broad, but just British Music. Because we. It really just is that. Because British music is its own thing.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, you can. There's genres, obviously, in the uk, but there it really is its own entity as well, in my opinion.

[Jake]

What. What is it. What's the difference between that and, like, American? Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I was just saying, like, America is. You have to remember how big America is.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

America is a whole. It's. It's a hot. The music over here is its own. It's a whole. It's its own ecosystem. Like, it's a whole climate.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

In the uk it's kind of like a. More like. Like if, for example, if somebody knows a song up in Scotland, I. Most likely they're gonna know it down in London.

[Jake]

Interesting.

[Pink Pantheress]

And this. And it's not every. Every song, because obviously you have local music that will, like, inform a certain area's culture or whatever in the uk, but generally speaking, a song will be nationwide, in my opinion. Have to put that out there. But, like, in my experience of being in the uk but in America, it's like, you know, like, I had. I had. I had an ex from St. Louis who. Who would name artists that, like, somebody from this state wouldn't know and that this person would know and this person would know, and they. And even, like, genres in one state might be different from a genre in another state. And so for that reason alone, I have to call it British music.

[Jake]

Yeah. Who are some of your favorite British artists?

[Pink Pantheress]

Lily Allen.

[Jake]

I love Lily Allen.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

I really love Lily Allen.

[Pink Pantheress]

I went through a huge.

[Jake]

Sorry, I got excited.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's okay. Calm down. But no, I love Lily Allen. Isn't she really good? She's amazing.

[Jake]

Have you done her yet? No. My God, I would die. I. When I was in eighth grade, went through, like, the big. When she released Jesus, I went through, like, the biggest Lily Allen film.

[Pink Pantheress]

What's that one song she has on? That's like a. No, no. What's that one?

[Jake]

Oh, oh, it's called out for a really good. I liked. I love Air Balloon too.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes. Okay. The whole album's so good. But, yes. Lily Alle. I love Imogen Heap. Kate Nash. I love. Obviously, I loved Amy Winehouse. I love. I mean, who. I can't really name, honestly. A. A British artist I really don't like because I think all of them have really informed me, like, all that classic era of, like, 2001 to, like, 2000 and, like, even 10.

[Jake]

Yeah. That was like, the golden years.

[Pink Pantheress]

I feel like the golden years. And then Disclosure came out in, like, what 2012, when I was like. Like, this is a whole different plane of music.

[Jake]

Disclosure is British.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

I did not know that.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's crazy. Their live shows are honestly beyond anything crazy. Yeah.

[Jake]

Okay. And do you live in London full time?

[Pink Pantheress]

I do.

[Jake]

You hear.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, I live between here and London.

[Jake]

Okay. Okay. I was just in London. I went to Marks and Spencers.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's my. I used to work there.

[Jake]

What? They have everything ever.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, yeah, it's like one of those. What do you guys, like, Sears or something?

[Jake]

Oh, so like a Target.

[Pink Pantheress]

What is C is.

[Jake]

Then what is C is so random that you.

[Pink Pantheress]

What is his.

[Jake]

It's like, what is Sears?

[Pink Pantheress]

Right? Yeah. You don't know what Sears is?

[Jake]

Like, I know what Sears is, but, like.

[Pink Pantheress]

But you just never go in.

[Jake]

No, and I don't think they have, like, Sears like, branded food.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, right. Okay. Well, forget it. It's like. Like JCPenney.

[Jake]

Like, it's like Target girl.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, it's not like Target, because Target is like, our Sainsbury's.

[Jake]

What's a Sainsbury's?

[Pink Pantheress]

Tesco's.

[Jake]

Tesco's.

[Pink Pantheress]

Do you. Do you have. Do you know what that is?

[Jake]

I know.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, good.

[Jake]

Then I feel like I know what Marcus Spencer says, because I always get the prawn trips. Prawn chips from there. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, well, that's like, what Target is for us. Or as does. As does. It actually is. Is the British Target.

[Jake]

Well. And I love it. What's it so.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah, it's.

[Jake]

I love it.

[Pink Pantheress]

You like Japanese food?

[Jake]

I love Japanese. It's my favorite food.

[Pink Pantheress]

Actually, there's another one that I was. There's an I called wasabi. You should try.

[Jake]

I love wasabi.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

When I had an internship, my. Oh, my God. Do you have, like, blockout periods of your life?

[Pink Pantheress]

Of course.

[Jake]

I'm like, where did I work during.

[Pink Pantheress]

How old are you?

[Jake]

25.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

How'd you think I was?

[Pink Pantheress]

No, I. I thought you were, like, 24. Well, yeah, I'm 23.

[Jake]

You're 23?

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm turning 24 soon, though.

[Jake]

I know. Happy almost birthday, April. What?

[Pink Pantheress]

19?

[Jake]

Yeah. Aries.

[Pink Pantheress]

Are you Scorpio? What does that mean?

[Jake]

It's like, dark and dark, angry and full of, like, dog anger all the time.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, it's not giving any of those things.

[Jake]

Oh, thank you. It's like, am I being fed lies by those closest to me?

[Pink Pantheress]

All right, I see. That's the darkness in you because you're cynical.

[Jake]

Oh, okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

But, Mike, so no, jc, we were just talking about birthdays. And what were you saying before that you had an internship? What were you doing?

[Jake]

See, that's what I'm saying. I forget. But I remember every day I would go to Wasabi because they had one in times.

[Pink Pantheress]

If you did.

[Jake]

No. One time I got fired from an internship. Can you believe why I went on my phone and I fell asleep at the desk.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, who could blame you?

[Jake]

I know. Well, I didn't know. It was my first foray into corporate America and I had no idea that you weren't allowed to go on your phone that well.

[Pink Pantheress]

Falling asleep, though, I mean.

[Jake]

And then I discovered without my phone, I get really tired.

[Pink Pantheress]

So what, you have what's it called? Narcopsy?

[Jake]

No, like, it's a phone addiction.

[Pink Pantheress]

I also have a phone addiction. I'm trying really hard to.

[Jake]

No, I. It's really bad.

[Pink Pantheress]

What apps are you on? Because I'm not. I'm not. You on social media? I'm not on social media.

[Jake]

What?

[Pink Pantheress]

I download apps.

[Jake]

Wait, wait, like games?

[Pink Pantheress]

Apps?

[Jake]

Wait, what do you mean you're not on social media?

[Pink Pantheress]

I know I'm on social media. My bad. I mean, I don't like. I'm not doom scrolling on social media.

[Jake]

Okay. I do scroll.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's not the reason I'm there because I download games.

[Jake]

What games?

[Pink Pantheress]

All games. You can think of a lot of escape room games.

[Jake]

Are you serious?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, I love a little puzzle, so I just play like, I download these scary escape room games where you just have to like these detective series games.

[Jake]

Wait, is it. That sounds fun. Will you send me them?

[Pink Pantheress]

Absolutely.

[Jake]

Wait, that sounds up my alley for a game.

[Pink Pantheress]

Good. I need more people to get on board.

[Jake]

Okay, I will.

[Pink Pantheress]

Good.

[Jake]

Okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, so that.

[Jake]

So that.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

Wait, so what, what like. Okay, so we were talking music, but what like TV shows and movies do you like? Like what do you watch?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I used to be a film student, so actually.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm well versed in the film department. Or I used to be TV series, though. I was just. I don't watch any.

[Jake]

Wow.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, I did watch the one everyone said to watch though. Oh, what's it called? Adolescence.

[Jake]

But with adolescence. Good.

[Pink Pantheress]

You haven't seen it. Oh, okay. It's. No, it was really good. I love all the acting was just so good.

[Jake]

I know. I heard the kid was amazing.

[Pink Pantheress]

The cat amazing.

[Jake]

I know.

[Pink Pantheress]

And the dad, what's his name? Stephen Graham, I think his name is. I love him.

[Jake]

Oh, it's a British show.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah.

[Jake]

What other. Oh, do you. Would you consider British shows in a different league Than like, in the same, like, league. As, like, British, like art music. Because you know how you're like, everyone's watching, everyone's listening to the same thing. Like, would you consider everyone to be watching the same thing?

[Pink Pantheress]

Let's put it this way, my manager's British and if I feel like. If I said Waterloo Road, Coronation Street, EastEnders, if I said Holby City, if I said the Bill, she's knowing all of these, or if I say Strictly Come Dancing, or if I listen, you. This is all going.

[Jake]

But, no, but you want to know what I do now that you would be shocked. Tell me, what is the way that they speak? And it's. No, it's like in code, like loop to loo. Cockney. I know. Cockney.

[Pink Pantheress]

Apples and pears.

[Jake]

I know, I know. I know it.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, you're fluid in it.

[Jake]

Like, what is it? Apples and pears.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, apples and pears. The stairs. Tea leaf. You're a thief.

[Jake]

Oh, I never heard that one.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, God. Dog and bone.

[Jake]

Phone.

[Pink Pantheress]

Get off your dog and bone your phone. Yeah, you didn't like that?

[Jake]

I like apples and pears.

[Pink Pantheress]

See, that one's not giving for me.

[Jake]

Because I like loop de loo.

[Pink Pantheress]

Who was that?

[Jake]

Oh, I'm sorry, I think I just made that up.

[Pink Pantheress]

Crickets. I'm sorry. Loop de loo. I'm trying to think what the rhyme would be.

[Jake]

I think it was soup. Loop de loop. Soup.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, I feel like you're talking about spaghetti hoops or something. Or loop.

[Jake]

I don't know.

[Pink Pantheress]

We'll get to the bottom of it, don't worry. Yeah, and we'll get to the bottom of it, but caught your own. Sounds cool.

[Jake]

Well, because my best friend is British.

[Pink Pantheress]

Who is. Do I know her?

[Jake]

Her name's Alice.

[Pink Pantheress]

He's from London.

[Jake]

Yep.

[Pink Pantheress]

Alice.

[Jake]

Yeah. She. Well, she moved to America when she was 12.

[Pink Pantheress]

Get out.

[Jake]

I don't know, but her whole family is British, so I'm. I have. I. I do very British things with them. Like, I have a lot of sausage rolls all the time.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, you're good. Does she have a British accent?

[Jake]

She has a British accent with certain things. So, like, when she says water, it's water. Water, yeah. Or like room.

[Pink Pantheress]

Rum room and rum room.

[Jake]

I don't know. But her parents have, like, the thickest and her accents. And, like, her brother has the thickest accent and thick.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, all right, that's good. Well, that's nice. I would love to meet her one day.

[Jake]

Yeah, I'm sure you will, but it was just. Are you going to Coachella.

[Pink Pantheress]

Say that again.

[Jake]

You want to Coachella.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, I'm actually not.

[Jake]

I love your performances. I die for them.

[Pink Pantheress]

Stop playing with him.

[Jake]

I'm not playing with him.

[Pink Pantheress]

Right. I have a really weird thing. I'm going to be so real with you because I was saying that's what. I'm being very open about mental health right now.

[Jake]

Let's be open and honest.

[Pink Pantheress]

So I have ocd. Okay. And so what that means. So what that means is. And it's pure.

[Jake]

I love OCD as well.

[Pink Pantheress]

What's pure? Row.

[Jake]

I have. So I don't have it, like, where it's, like, neat, but it's like, I have to touch things evenly. I have to, like, count things really. Like, intrusive thoughts. I'm very superstitious. So if I don't do it, it's bad luck. If I don't do it, like, the family's gone. No, it's more like. Like, I'm gonna get in trouble in my job. Like, I'm gonna lose my job. Like, got you.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, I.

[Jake]

But it's really bad. I'm on a lot of meds for it. What's. What's pure? O.

[Pink Pantheress]

So pure. Well, that, for me is. I don't have any. I don't necessarily have many of the fears that you might have about certain things, and I don't need to touch anything. And I. I don't really care about neatness. I'm actually quite untidy, honestly.

[Jake]

Me as well.

[Pink Pantheress]

However, I do have this thing where once I have a thought, it's loops, Loops, loops for the whole. For a month. Oh, it's just. And it will never stop. Never stop. And I get it over. I get over some, like, my biggest fears. My biggest fears are always just in the loop. So when it comes to performing, how it plays in that role. And also, one thing OCD does make me personally, personally do is it means that if I'm not the. If I don't consider myself a certain standard at what I'm doing, I don't see the point doing it, or I don't. Or I. I don't enjoy it because I'm like. Well, I'm.

[Jake]

So it's like everything either has to be perfect or it's not done right.

[Pink Pantheress]

And that is something which. That's something which is. Is actually very detrimental to me as a human being because it means that I can negative and very. And people interpret a lot of what I say is like, which. Which. And I. I just said this somewhere to someone else, but I said, like, people rightfully take my words and they obviously take them to me in exactly what I'm saying. But what I mean to say, whenever I say, like, I'm this. I'm this is this is that in my head, I have such a high standard. I want to be the best.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

But because I'm not the best yet, I. I don't have any way to word it other than just by saying, well, I'm can't be bothered.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm crap. And I don't know whether. And that is something that purely come. And that's something that's birthed from my OCD from not being satisfied with anything less than perfect. So.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

So all that to say with performing. I love performing, yes. I love seeing the people in front of me. That's why I do it. Corny to say, but very much the truth. But I. I love my fans, obviously. I love people seeing my lyrics back. And obviously you. The learning experience of going from somebody that was really shy to then becoming a better form is amazing, enriching experience for me. But can I. When I speak very colloquially and informally to people about it, I don't talk about it in a positive way. No. Because I don't. I just simply don't think I'm that good yet. So until I'm that good, then I'm always going to be a bit like, I understand.

[Jake]

So it's like, you can't be like.

[Pink Pantheress]

I can't be very like it.

[Jake]

You're like, if I'm not perfect, I'm not saying I'm great.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. And that's what. And that is really one of my downfalls as a human being. It really sucks because it goes. Because it goes with a lot of things that I do. It goes along with even some songs I put out. Like, genuinely, I'm very, very much, very. I'm very much a perfectionist, and it sucks. But we are here and we're working on it, honey.

[Jake]

And we are working on it.

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm 23, but that's, like, the only thing in life I feel like I. The only. I'd say it's like, I. Other than my, like, that one, my ocd, I'm so perfectly like, oh, like life is daisies and butterflies, but when that hits, God, it's trash. And I didn't know what it was because I spent my whole life think, we're not getting into this convers. But my. My point is, performing Coachella, if I am so inclined one day to do it, I will Be there. But I'm not going. Are you going?

[Jake]

I am gonna go. Who are you gonna say I'm not seeing? Many, many people. I think I'm just gonna see Charlie.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

And Gaga.

[Pink Pantheress]

You're seeing two artists, but you're traveling to Palm Springs. Well, I mean, very worth it for the two you've mentioned.

[Jake]

I think I'm gonna see Charlie and Gaga. And I think I'm gonna see. Well, because I'm also working.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, you're working. That's okay.

[Jake]

And I think I'm gonna see Post Malone. I would like to see Green Day.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, I've seen them live. That's so good.

[Jake]

I know.

[Pink Pantheress]

I love that.

[Jake]

I want to see 21 guns.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. You kind of look a bit like Billy Joel. Armstrong. Joe Armstrong.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

Actually, like younger him.

[Jake]

Do you think he's fit?

[Pink Pantheress]

You know what? When he was younger, like, he was kind of. There was something. There was some material there. There was some fabric that we could work with.

[Jake]

Right, right. So how long have you been producing music for?

[Pink Pantheress]

Since I was like 17.

[Jake]

And how did you start?

[Pink Pantheress]

I was producing for a girl I went to school with. I thought that, well, she's. She. And she's really. She still makes music. She's really good. And I just really wanted to get involved, so I was like, let me produce. I didn't know how to. But I just learned as we went.

[Jake]

Huh.

[Pink Pantheress]

And it was fun.

[Jake]

And then you just started putting them out on, like the Internet and stuff.

[Pink Pantheress]

She would put it on Spotify, but it was for her music. It was her music, but I was producing for her. She put it out on her Spotify. And then I got involved in my own stuff about a year later. And then we dropped it. Somebody leaked our project recently from all those years back. They leaked it. And I was like, do you not.

[Jake]

And how do you. How does it feel when your gets leaked?

[Pink Pantheress]

What a sentence. I don't enjoy it, but I'm not mad. Equally, I'm very. When it comes to the Internet era of music, I'm very. As most people watching this or you or anyone that knows me on what I've said in Feed, I'm very, very liberal when it comes to music and sharing and sampling. I'm very liberal.

[Jake]

Do you. So you started putting out your own stuff a year later? What. What was the moment that was like things where it was a shift. Was it when you put out just.

[Pink Pantheress]

For me, I think it was when I put out Break it Off was when I was like, okay, this is like the Beginnings. And then just for me was like another beginning. And then pain started doing. So that was another one. It was really weird. It was kind of like I was like.

[Jake]

Yeah, it was like.

[Pink Pantheress]

You know what I mean? And then, like, it was funny because I wasn't. I wasn't. I was anonymous at this point, so it was very much music led.

[Jake]

You were anonymous. Like, you didn't show.

[Pink Pantheress]

Faceless.

[Jake]

No way.

[Pink Pantheress]

Faceless.

[Jake]

And then when did you.

[Pink Pantheress]

I this. When I was about 21, I want to say. And actually, I really did do the whole. When I did the Boys Liar Part two video. That was when it was really like, okay, this is her.

[Jake]

Oh, no way. Yeah. Did you know Boys A Liar Part.

[Pink Pantheress]

Two was going to be a big song?

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

I didn't think about it.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And I. Yeah. And that's really the case with me because I. Again, because I'm very familiar with the Internet era of music. It's so, like, you never know. So I was just like, I'm just gonna expect nothing and just hope for the best.

[Jake]

Right? That's the best. That's.

[Pink Pantheress]

It really is the best. That's the best.

[Jake]

I don't care what anyone says, like, that is the best. If your expectations are set, then they'll always be met.

[Pink Pantheress]

So true.

[Jake]

Is that horrible to say?

[Pink Pantheress]

No, that's OCD thinking.

[Jake]

Oh, okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yep. Cheers.

[Jake]

Eyes.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, what's that? What's the eyes?

[Jake]

It's like, if you cheers without eyes, it's bad luck. See.

[Pink Pantheress]

So what, you can't walk under ladders.

[Jake]

No. No.

[Pink Pantheress]

Walking on cracks. Nothing.

[Jake]

No. See, I haven't really thought about that.

[Pink Pantheress]

True.

[Jake]

But, like, the. The. Under the ladders. I can't.

[Pink Pantheress]

Umbrellas and doors.

[Jake]

Umbrellas and doors. I won't do. I used to, like, have to, like, look at myself in the mirror ten times over.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

Be like, yes, yes, yes. And then I would have to, like.

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm not laughing.

[Jake]

I mean, listen, it's funny. It's funny.

[Pink Pantheress]

I've had to do some pretty. I've had a very micro phase of that kind of, like, compulsion. Doing a very micro phase of it. And I'm trying to remember what I used to do. Oh, you know what I used to do? I'm. I'm a very big maladaptive daydreamer. So sometimes this is really, like. Okay, so what I would do is I pretend to be in this scenario, right. In real life, and I'd be, like, acting as if some, like. I was acting like when I was in high school, I, like, had a boyfriend So I kind of like going around in my house like I had a boyfriend with me. And then if something in real life took me out of it, I would have to repeat.

[Jake]

No, no, no, no, no, no.

[Pink Pantheress]

To like, remind myself that this isn't part of my own now adaptive daydream storyline in my head. So let's say my mum comes in. I'd have to. It was like three, two, one, and scene. That was my. No, no, no.

[Jake]

Okay, got it.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's a bit complicated.

[Jake]

No, no.

[Pink Pantheress]

But that was my.

[Jake]

Very much understand that.

[Pink Pantheress]

My one compulsion.

[Jake]

I used to have to pray every time I cursed, girl. No.

[Pink Pantheress]

Do you still do that?

[Jake]

No, but I would, like, literally speak in tongue. Oh, yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, I kind of hear it.

[Jake]

I would be like. And then I would be like, oh, okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

And I'm not even Christian, so, like, it was super random. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, my God. That's the biggest gag of all.

[Jake]

Wait, I'm curious about your writing process. Tell me, how do you start a song? How do you like. Because a lot of some artists that I've spoken to, like, they view it as kind of like, formulaic, where they'll like, write certain. The verse and then the chorus and then. But does. Does your song. Does it just like, how do. How does it come to you?

[Pink Pantheress]

For me, it comes from hearing the beat first. Whether I've made the beat myself or I'm. There's a producer that's given me a beat. I have to get familiar with the beat. Once that happens, then I kind of do melody passes with my voice. I'm like, you know. And then once that's been figured out, then lyrics come last for me.

[Jake]

Lyrics come last.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. I feel like most people are like, lyrics first or something.

[Jake]

No, that's. I've heard both.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, okay, cool.

[Jake]

I've heard both. Do you have a favorite song that's. You've had, like, the most fun producing and writing?

[Pink Pantheress]

Fun. Oh, angel, which I made for the Barbie movie.

[Jake]

It's a great one.

[Pink Pantheress]

What was so fun about it being in that studio? You know what's so funny? You know who came in was. And I. This just kills me is Charlie Puth randomly came in and I. It was just. It was just so funny and random. I was like, okay, like, he's in the room. Love it, love it, love it, love it. And he's such an eccentric. Like, his personality is. Honestly, I've never been around somebody so eccentric before. Very interesting. But he is in. I mean, as we all know, genius. He's kind of like I mean, I don't even know if I could even say this, but he's kind of like AI in a person musically. Like, if you, like, you need something musically done. He can calculate in his head exactly what chord that should be.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, this. Like, he played a chord and I was like, this might be the best chord I've ever heard in my life. And that was. We kept it in.

[Jake]

Oh, wow.

[Pink Pantheress]

And he was very cool. He was like, you know, you don't even need a. You don't even need to credit me or put me in the cr. In the. In the producer cuts and stuff. And I was like. And then he. He whisked away into the night, never to be seen again.

[Jake]

What do you think?

[Pink Pantheress]

He's a. You know, he's a very helpful in the studio. Really cool experience and very random, and that was really fun. And then we had a random Irish jig come into it, and it was just such a fun song and I loved it.

[Jake]

How long have you been making Fancy Dot for? Because you said you do it really quick.

[Pink Pantheress]

August last year. It was actually done last year. It's been done since, like, November, but we wanted to save it for at least to this year. Yeah.

[Jake]

Okay. And then what, like, do you have, like an. When you create a mixtape or an album, like, do you have an overall theme?

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, it's funny. I don't go into. Well, I wouldn't say that I'm the most purposeful when it comes to them.

[Jake]

Themes.

[Pink Pantheress]

I am very. I try to be as consistent. I'm more consistent with. Well, I try and be more consistent with my. This. The references for the sonics, if that makes sense. So, like the beats or the drums or the. Like, if I want a certain tempo, then I can try. Try and kind of stick to a certain tempo or a feel. But themes so much. My lyrics, I. They are all pretty. Some of them are pretty sad. I didn't necessarily have a theme that I wanted to necessarily completely exude when it came to my last album, but people kind of. But there was a lot of songs where I was talking about death and that. That was something which I guess I consciously did. So that ended up kind of being a theme, right? Death. And then with this one, I wanted it to be not that. Like, more like fun and mature. So this one, actually, I was like, yes, this is me being a lot more purposeful with my. Because as a musician, I feel like every. Every musician's priority is different with their music. My priority with my music is always the way it Sounds and then the feeling that I give off when I sing and the feeling of it I'm not too necessarily anal about. Like, this lyric means this and this. This. It's all feelings.

[Jake]

Okay, so you're way more like. You're way more of a. Like a sonic person. Yeah, got it, got it, got it. Because I have friends that, like, don't listen to the lyrics that My best friend Alice is like. I don't do lyrics. Like, I just do, like the feeling. Yeah. How it sounds?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jake]

Did you. Oh, when? Okay. So you said you used to work.

[Pink Pantheress]

At Marks and Spencer's in the men's department.

[Jake]

Oh, well, what was your favorite meal from there?

[Pink Pantheress]

What a question.

[Jake]

Because how do they make all of those meals every day?

[Pink Pantheress]

The duck and hoist and wrap was my favorite. And how did they make it every day? Were you talking about the ready meal section?

[Jake]

Yes. There's every cuisine. I've never seen anything like it in my life.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, like, you mean how. Which factory are they?

[Jake]

Yeah, like, how is it happening that fast?

[Pink Pantheress]

Love. Oh, you know what is the best is the salt and pepper chicken.

[Jake]

Oh, that sounds. Sounds good. Do you like wagamama?

[Pink Pantheress]

See, I was gonna bring this up when we were having the whole it suicabi thing, but, yes, that is my favorite. One of my favorites.

[Jake]

Yeah, the katsu curry.

[Pink Pantheress]

See, that's a. Not even to be that. But that is that. Those are rookie numbers. We need to get you on to the yakisoba.

[Jake]

I've had the yakisoba.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

No, I've had the yakisoba. I've had the katsu curry. I've had, like, a chili ramen. Oh, no, I'm well versed.

[Pink Pantheress]

What about the starters? Are you getting the beef brisket pow buns?

[Jake]

No, I'm getting the squid.

[Pink Pantheress]

The crispy squid, the crispy chips.

[Jake]

Yeah. Yes, you are.

[Pink Pantheress]

You have impressed me today. You are now you are my. Yeah.

[Jake]

Yes. No, I'm telling you, I'm like, well versed in London food.

[Pink Pantheress]

Amazing. Kind of people hate English London food.

[Jake]

I've never in my life had better Indian food in my life.

[Pink Pantheress]

Thank God you said that, because let me tell you, the people I've had to convince.

[Jake]

What? I feel like it's like a known.

[Pink Pantheress]

Fact, but people aren't convinced.

[Jake]

I went to this restaurant called Jamovar.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

Have you?

[Pink Pantheress]

Where's that?

[Jake]

Mayfair.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, I will go. It blew your mind.

[Jake]

No, no, no, no. First of all, the birani. The birani in London is so different than the birani here. Because it's like a puff pastry at the top. And then they have to, like.

[Pink Pantheress]

And we have poppadoms.

[Jake]

Poppadop is my favorite thing in the entire world. It's my favorite thing in the entire world. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

I love papadoms. They are my favorite things.

[Jake]

My favorite thing. Yes, yes. Like a mango chutney.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's really good.

[Jake]

Or the. The green.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes. I love Indian food from the uk. I mean, I love Indian food everywhere I go, but really, the UK does it so good because there's a certain sweetness that there is to those dishes over. I don't know. But you can't replicate it.

[Jake]

You can't, you can't. And, like, I tried to get birani here the other week, and it, like, wasn't in, like a. It was like. It's like. It's almost like it's served in, like, a pot pie.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah.

[Jake]

Puff pastry. And they like. Oh. And they cut it around.

[Pink Pantheress]

I've never had the biryani. Honestly, I've never had a biryani. I'm really basic when it gets to that storm.

[Jake]

What do you got? I love corn. I love lamb.

[Pink Pantheress]

Same, same. I love chicken kuma.

[Jake]

I like lamb korma and chicken tea masala.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes. Go off.

[Jake]

Shrimp, coconut curry.

[Pink Pantheress]

We're saying this, like, we're naming the niches. Things we're naming like.

[Jake]

I know, but it's true, though. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

So fire.

[Jake]

It is.

[Pink Pantheress]

A little bit of coconut rice on the side.

[Jake]

Oh, wow. Yeah. I love the food in London personally.

[Pink Pantheress]

Good, good. No one says that.

[Jake]

I know no one says that, but they're just maybe not going to the.

[Pink Pantheress]

Right places or they're just so biased against it. People, really. I've noticed people who hate British people over here. They're hurried us. They're like. Or they make or they say stuff. They'll be like. They'll be like, I'll see loads of tweets. That's like realizing Pink's British. I can't listen to her anymore. What?

[Jake]

I'm like, wait, why do people not like British people? I love British people.

[Pink Pantheress]

I think it's. I don't know if it's like a fake thing I'm seeing online or if it's real life too. But yeah, people make fun of us, but it's fine. I'm sure we don't mind too much.

[Jake]

You guys stick together.

[Pink Pantheress]

We try.

[Jake]

You do?

[Pink Pantheress]

We do.

[Jake]

Wait, so you said you took the mask off in 2021. What was like, the decision making that went into that?

[Pink Pantheress]

For the betterment, for the advancement of my career. And also just I think there was a point where I was like, I know I'm going to want to get credited. I know I'm going to one day want to have a face to the name. So I felt like doing that made sense.

[Jake]

Was it scary?

[Pink Pantheress]

It was a bit scary. I was. I was actually kind of concerned people was going to call me ugly or something, you know what I mean? And they didn't. But. And honestly, I wouldn't have cared if they did. The fear was more so like doing a face reveal and then somehow it affecting my career genuinely.

[Jake]

I get that. You have to think about it from all angles. This episode of Therapist is brought to you by booking.combooking. yeah, I am finally back from France, or at least I should be by the time this airs. So we used booking.com to book a lot of our stay in France because everybody has different, like, needs and it was very difficult for us to go hotel by hotel. So on booking.com we just put in what everybody wants. Like if somebody wants a lot of mirrors or somebody wants a bunch of pillows or. Yeah, I know that sounds stupid, but it really is. Like, people are very particular when it comes to picking a hotel for vacation. And booking.com makes it so easy. Easy. More so. I know it is about to save my life for the rest of tour because we are going to get to these places and once again, Matt is going to have nowhere booked. So it's just very easy. In the morning we'll wake up, he'll put in exactly what we want and which. And I always say we need to be walk walking distance somewhere so we can always walk because obviously I don't drive. And he'll put that in in the morning and book us all rooms and it'll be the easiest thing ever. Booking.com just really makes booking a stay or a vacation so easy. You can book car rentals if you want to drive. I obviously don't, but some people do. Really and truly, booking.com has made booking my trip to France, which hopefully, again, I am back from, so much easier and it has made this tour so much less stressful because I don't ever have to worry about where we're sleeping because I know that booking.com will always find something for me. Find exactly what you're booking for at booking.combooking. yeah, book now on the site or in the app today.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, I think a lot of people were very pleasant. These price. I don't know.

[Jake]

I don't know for some reason, I didn't realize it was in 2021. I always thought, like, no, okay, 2021. That feels so much closer than it actually is. I'm, like, thinking it feels like a year ago. And I'm like, but you've been on the scene for, like, four years. And then I'm realizing, 2021 was four years ago.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

Yes.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's funny because I feel like my career. I'm funny as an artist. There's a few artists as well, like this, and usually a lot of my favorite artists look like this. I am an artist that I'm very happy to, like, take a little period off and come back. I'm not always like, boom, boom, boom, boom, in your face. In your face. And that's something I chose by design as well. I don't wanna. No, no, it's not. I don't think it's very good.

[Jake]

Do you. Do you, like, is making music still a fun pastime for you, or is it, like, now that it's your job, like, you're like, okay, I don't want to do this right now when I'm off.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, no, I, I. There was a moment where I feared it would be that, and then I took a break. And then I was like, this is just what I needed. Just what the doctor ordered. Because then I came back into it and I was like, God, I'm so inspired.

[Jake]

So.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. Which is good.

[Jake]

What do you do on your breaks?

[Pink Pantheress]

Nothing fruitful. I'll tell you now.

[Jake]

I don't know.

[Pink Pantheress]

I don't go on holidays. I don't go on holidays. I've never been on holiday. Have you been on holiday? When was your last holiday?

[Jake]

Like, okay, no work, right?

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, no, this is a holiday.

[Jake]

Oh, tell me for the.

[Pink Pantheress]

Today.

[Jake]

No, that I went skiing for the first time ever in January.

[Pink Pantheress]

Where'd you go?

[Jake]

Courchevel.

[Pink Pantheress]

Is that in America?

[Jake]

It's in France. Never in my life. And that was probably the first holiday I've taken in a minute.

[Pink Pantheress]

Wow. Wow, wow, wow, wow. That sounds really fun, actually. I mean, I'm. I. I wouldn't. I haven't been skiing. I'm not gonna lie. I don't know if it's for me.

[Jake]

But that's what I thought, too. It's really. It was really good for my mental health.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, good.

[Jake]

Yes. Because you're like, okay, so I was really scared to do it.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

I went with my best friend's family, the British ones. And you guys are flipping best friends. No, I know. We do everything Together.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, my God. Me and my best friend. Like that, too. Yeah, she's. Yeah.

[Jake]

What star sign is she or me? Well, you're an Aries. What's she.

[Pink Pantheress]

Is she. I don't know anything about. She is my actual best friend. I just don't know anything about stuff.

[Jake]

I'm a Scorpio. My best friend Alice is a Pisces.

[Pink Pantheress]

So we're like, oh, my God. I didn't know her flipping star sign.

[Jake]

Doesn'T make me Scorpio. And Pisces are like, what are you. Yeah. Yeah. Oh. Oh. How interesting is that?

[Pink Pantheress]

How do you memorize all of this?

[Jake]

What do you mean, memorize?

[Pink Pantheress]

Because in order to know that. That anything.

[Jake]

Pisces go together, because my best friend is Pisces. And, like, it's a thing where, like, we are together.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, but when someone says, like, I'm a Capricorn Rising, how would you know how to react?

[Jake]

Okay, so Capricorn are very, like, regimented, and they're very like. Like. Like, get done. And so the Rising is like, the mask you portray to the world. So, like, my Rising's a Gemini. So, like, I come off very chatty or, like, very, like, social. But, like, that's not who I actually am.

[Pink Pantheress]

So, wait, what would it be for Aries if I'm. What am I?

[Jake]

Aries are very fiery. They're very. Like, I am quite. Yeah, they're very like. Like, people can describe them as, like, very blunt. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, I fear that's me.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, it kind of read me up and down. Wait, what's my Rising? She knows everything.

[Jake]

So your Capricorn Rising is why you are so. In addition to also it being your ocd, but it's why you're such a perfectionist.

[Pink Pantheress]

Wow, that's really good information.

[Jake]

I might have just made that up, but it's what I think.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, I'm joking. That sounds right. Honestly. And honestly, that's all very interesting. The only reason why I get shocked when people know all these things is because I'm like, which part of your brain do you store this information?

[Jake]

I used to be addicted to, like, memorizing things when I was little.

[Pink Pantheress]

You. You. You. You got that.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

You got that ocd?

[Jake]

Yeah, I used to memorize library cards.

[Pink Pantheress]

My brother, actually. Funny. My grandma told me this the other day. What happened? I saw you and then you were like, where's yours?

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Have they got names?

[Jake]

Yes, that's Patrick.

[Pink Pantheress]

And what's this?

[Jake]

Cassandra.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, that's good, right?

[Jake]

Cassandra's like, you know, I haven't I need to take her to the dry cleaner.

[Pink Pantheress]

Really? This feels really good.

[Jake]

No, Patrick's clean.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh.

[Jake]

Cassandra's been on planes. She's come with me on tour.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay. On tour?

[Jake]

Yes.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah. Because you. Okay, I did see that. That's really good.

[Jake]

I. I love it. But do you. I get. Have you done like a full fledged tour before? Hell, yeah. Yeah, I get that.

[Pink Pantheress]

So is it not scary? It's to it. You've got a harder job than I do? Yes.

[Jake]

No.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

Why do you say that?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I'm imagining your tours as you like talking. Yeah.

[Jake]

Yes.

[Pink Pantheress]

That is difficult to do on stage.

[Jake]

It's just. It kills when you say something that you think is so funny and everyone's like, yeah, like it's horrible. And you have to. Then my. My escape from that is acknowledging that it missed.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, that's what I used to do, but now I kind of allow it to not.

[Jake]

Right. What do you mean?

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, Like, I used to do the same thing when, like, if I say something because I say so much stuff.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

So. And a lot of what I think I'm hilarious.

[Jake]

Obviously you are.

[Pink Pantheress]

H. No, you didn't need to agree with me. Thank you. I wasn't. What I'm saying is, I wasn't trying to fish right then. But.

[Jake]

But you got.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, no, no, no, no. That's not what I'm trying. What I'm saying is. What I'm saying is I think that I'm funny and then I'll say something and then obviously, especially in America, because I'm British and we have actions. A different sense of humor. We just have a different sense of humor. I feel like there's crossover, this cross.

[Jake]

It's way more dry.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's a lot more dry. And it's hard to tell when someone's telling a joke. So I'll say something. And also I feel like I think things are funny and they're just not too fair and like, silence. But I used to do the acknowledgment. I used to be like, so none of you found that funny? But now I'm just like, move on.

[Jake]

Right. But I think it's funny when you.

[Pink Pantheress]

Acknowledge it is funny when you acknowledge, though, it is funny.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. I think. Because now I think people think I'm like, like, really weird.

[Jake]

What I think you. Honest to God, I. I think you are one of the funniest guests we've had.

[Pink Pantheress]

I don't think I'm weird. I think I'm. I think I. I just think a Lot of Americans, because of the timing, are like, oh, I don't know if she's joking or not. And I think they think that I'm a bit, like, off kilter. Whereas if back in the uk, it's like, we are all like. Like, this isn't weird.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

But thank you for saying I'm funny. Yeah. You didn't know what we were going in for then, did you? I'm gonna trick you.

[Jake]

No.

[Pink Pantheress]

No. Okay, let's move on. What next?

[Jake]

Oh, I'm having a really fun time with you.

[Pink Pantheress]

Thank you.

[Jake]

Are you having a fun time?

[Pink Pantheress]

I feel like we're on a date.

[Jake]

I also feel like we're on a date. And, like, it's one of those things I. Oh. I feel like we've really just developed a new friendship.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh.

[Jake]

With each other.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, sorry, I thought you were gonna say romance. Well, it's okay.

[Jake]

Well, this is like a friend date, right?

[Pink Pantheress]

I just. I think. I thought it was something different anyway, but, yeah.

[Jake]

Okay, I'm gonna ask. I don't think I'm really excited to ask you this.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

What are you therapist about today?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, therapist. What am I mad at in the world? What aren't I. Let's me. Let me not. Let me. Let me. Let me. Let me personalize this so I'm not talking about something we'll talk about for years and years to come in this podcast. But personally, what am I therapist about in my own life? I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna say anything about myself because I want to be nice to myself today.

[Jake]

Oh, I love that.

[Pink Pantheress]

You know what I mean?

[Jake]

I was so nasty to myself this weekend.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, that's peak and. But I know how it is, and that's me every.

[Jake]

I was like, wait, I feel ugly. So I went home.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, no, you left somewhere.

[Jake]

Yes. No, I was like. I looked in the mirror and I was like, I'm gonna go home. Yeah. And then I went home and I watched tv and I had that. It was amazing.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, that's good.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

You went home and you. And you did the right things.

[Jake]

And then. And then I FaceTime my friends by FaceTime, my friend, and they told me. They were like, wait, you look really good without even me fishing. I even say, like, because I look ugly. And then I was like, well, I just go, it sucks.

[Pink Pantheress]

I know exactly the feeling. And I. I know that feeling so well. But, yes. What am I therapist about? I'm trying to think what this week has really gotten. Got to me. I don't really. Let me Get. No.

[Jake]

Do you want me to go first?

[Pink Pantheress]

You go first.

[Jake]

I'm pissed about traffic on a Sunday.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, that's what I was gonna say.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

I was gonna say traffic on the, specifically the day of today because I thought it was weekend. So I thought, or I thought it was Sunday so there'd be less people in the roads. But there are more people. Isn't it strange?

[Jake]

No. It was 9pm last night and I was stuck in traffic and I was listening to this is Nicki Minaj for three hours, naturally. And it was, it was amazing. But like it was also horrible because like we were in bumper to bumper traffic and it was 9pm on a.

[Pink Pantheress]

Sunday and I was seeing white legs. Just so. Yeah, I'm gonna say okay on that strain, I guess I'm therapist about. Oh, goodness, goodness, goodness, goodness. I'm gonna say I need to cut my hair and it's really long. So underneath this hair, this is a wig. I, I, I want to show you kind of slightly, but I don't want the camera.

[Jake]

Okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

Here on everything.

[Jake]

Do you want, do you want to hide?

[Pink Pantheress]

There you go. You see that?

[Jake]

Okay, so it's shorter.

[Pink Pantheress]

So you see this? This is my natural hair underneath. This is a reveal. I've never done that before and I, and I feel like a lot of people are now going to not be able to unsee. But yes, my natural hair underneath is really short.

[Jake]

Like, and what is the length like here?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, like yours, literally.

[Jake]

And then what, why do you need.

[Pink Pantheress]

Because it's too long. Because that's the thing.

[Jake]

It doesn't work with wigs.

[Pink Pantheress]

Then it does well for me. You don't want to, it's just, there's a whole, Listen, this is a whole, there's a whole climate in here. And I'm telling you, if the hair is too long then it bunches too much and it makes the wig look too thingy. So you kind of need to like.

[Jake]

Got it.

[Pink Pantheress]

And look even right now I'm like, I'm being watching my thing. I'm like, there's a fucking kind of bump going on. It's annoying me. But like again, we're being nice to ourselves.

[Jake]

We are being nice to ourselves.

[Pink Pantheress]

So. And I've never said that, but maybe you were the catalyst I needed to realize. Like being nice to yourself is so.

[Jake]

I think you were the catalyst I needed to realize that because I made a video this weekend that was like normalized. Calling yourself ugly.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh.

[Jake]

And then I was like, wait, like why should we, why am I the.

[Pink Pantheress]

Problem that's one I will say, actually, that's very interesting. My. So is a lot of your. Like when you're like, God, I feel like. Is it a lot to do with. When you look inside the mirror and you're like, I want to go.

[Jake]

It's just like everything. Like, it's like the mirror, it's like. Like how I feel in my own skin. It's like, oh, I feel gross. Like I feel like. And then when I'm out, I'm like. I feel like I'm constantly like looking for a partner and if I'm like. If I'm feeling ugly, it's like I don't want.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, like you're looking for something. You're looking to date right now.

[Jake]

Desperately. Really desperately.

[Pink Pantheress]

I don't know why I thought that you were somewhere in some. I don't know why I thought you're in a relationship. I don't know why you were giving that. But that's. Actually, I thought you would have mentioned it. You would have said, like my boyfriend.

[Jake]

Yeah, I would have. I've never had a boyfriend.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, 25. I mean, what. There's no rush.

[Jake]

I haven't had sex in two years.

[Pink Pantheress]

But what's the problem?

[Jake]

What's the problem? I can't find anyone.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, no, not the. What's the. I mean, like. So you. You're really trying. You're really trying to get in that bedroom, huh?

[Jake]

Yeah, like, I. There's people you can call, but I'm desperate.

[Pink Pantheress]

Aside from that, there are so many people for you out here.

[Jake]

Thanks.

[Pink Pantheress]

I've got my. My roommate actually might be interested.

[Jake]

What?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, if you like. Yeah, if you like. He's kind of tall, though.

[Jake]

I love a tall guy.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, I might do that.

[Jake]

Set me up.

[Pink Pantheress]

I might do that. That'd be really nice because he's also looking for somebody right now.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes, he is. Listen, I'll make sure it works. You. You're both cute. He's cute. You're cute.

[Jake]

Why not? Why not something fun for the girls for the summer.

[Pink Pantheress]

Summer romance. And we can go on double dates because I'm, you know, in a relationship.

[Jake]

Yeah, we can cut it.

[Pink Pantheress]

I am. I mean, I already said on Tick Tock that I was.

[Jake]

Oh, you did?

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, I did. But not too much. But yeah. Well, we're gonna listen. LA actually I thought was good for dating.

[Jake]

Oh my. Says who?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, no, not me, but I've never. I don't really date in la. But you. Is there not a lot of gays looking for love there's so many. I'm literally like, tell me.

[Jake]

Like, you would think so, but they're.

[Pink Pantheress]

Just not for you.

[Jake]

You know what it is? They're all twinks.

[Pink Pantheress]

And you're not into that.

[Jake]

I think.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, you are. You are. Oh, got you.

[Jake]

Like, I'm looking for, like, a top.

[Pink Pantheress]

True.

[Jake]

They're few and far between in la.

[Pink Pantheress]

Got you. Got you. And if there are, they're taking.

[Jake]

And then if there are, everyone's like, it's going for them. Have you seen the. The Hunger Games?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, God.

[Jake]

You know the Cornucopia?

[Pink Pantheress]

So that's what it's giving. It actually is definitely giving that, to be honest, from what I've seen and heard. But, you know, that's magic. Magical. You're gonna find some of these. Two years, huh?

[Jake]

Two years. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

But, like, can I actually say something, please? Is not. I would put it this way. I wouldn't mind a two. I. If someone said two years break, I wouldn't say no.

[Jake]

But you've at least. Like.

[Pink Pantheress]

I know I have. No, I get what you're saying. Like, the option's there, but I'm saying, like, a break is good. Go back into it and it's been.

[Jake]

A while and you're just like, I know, but, like, for me, it'll be like, ow. Do you know what I mean?

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, my God. Got you. I understand what you're saying.

[Jake]

Like, you know what I mean?

[Pink Pantheress]

I do get what? Well, in so many words, I get what you're saying. Yeah. Got you.

[Jake]

Got you. Before I let you leave.

[Pink Pantheress]

Not that. What is this?

[Jake]

It's the town. It's. It's nothing crazy.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, good.

[Jake]

It's just the tell me what's wrongs. So the pussies write in and they tell us what's wrong. We give them advice.

[Pink Pantheress]

Where did your name come from? Actually?

[Jake]

What?

[Pink Pantheress]

What?

[Jake]

So, okay, I reviewed octopus. Like, I love eating octopus. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Ridiculous.

[Jake]

Yes. And so I would go with high and like, hi, Jake. Tense up. Like, tentacles up. And I would eat octopus and I'd rate it out of eight because they have eight tentacles. So I'd be like seven out of eight tentacles.

[Pink Pantheress]

You really enjoy eating octopus? I've never had it. Where's the best place to get it? Nobu no Poo.

[Jake]

Chiconi's. West Hollywood.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

Is amazing.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay.

[Jake]

Angelini is amazing. There's a place in Florence that's incredible.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, cool.

[Jake]

One time I went to. What's it called? In. In London? Hakkasan.

[Pink Pantheress]

Oh, yeah. I love that place.

[Jake]

Me too. I got the Best octopus from there.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay. I must try.

[Jake]

I know. Am I so well versed in London food? Are you kind of gagged?

[Pink Pantheress]

Wait, so you. Did they know I was coming in? Or is it, like, for every. Okay, good for anyone.

[Jake]

Yeah, good for anyone. Because I like to leave things up for surprise. Like that this one guy is leading me on and trying to get with me, but his girlfriend is my. Is my. She's kind of my friend. How do I handle this without being messy? It's me. It's a mess.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, you can just. Can we not silently reject the man and call it a day? Wait, is that. That does apply? That could.

[Jake]

Yes. And he's. He's lying to his girlfriend.

[Pink Pantheress]

Silently reject.

[Jake]

You know what I would prescribe.

[Pink Pantheress]

Wow, you really do have a vocab here.

[Jake]

Boy's a liar, part two.

[Pink Pantheress]

Ah. To, like, listen to and, like.

[Jake]

Yeah, because he's a liar.

[Pink Pantheress]

True. The girl. The girl that he's going for should listen to it.

[Jake]

Yeah, yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And get some motivation to just.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, no, I mean, why. So does she. I mean, I would love to know more about this. Does she like him back or something?

[Jake]

Yes. She wants to go for him even though he's in a relationship with her friends.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. I always think about what I would do in this situation, but I've never been in a situation where I fancy. As soon as I know someone's in a relationship, I'm like, you're not cute anymore.

[Jake]

Oh, because they're a liar.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, because they're in a relationship.

[Jake]

Oh, okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, I just turn it off.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm done here. Yeah. My mission, my work is done.

[Jake]

Oh, I get jealous.

[Pink Pantheress]

Do you? I turned off my jealousy receptors when I went to a girl school.

[Jake]

Really?

[Pink Pantheress]

Turn them right off. I said, nah, nah. I genuinely haven't. I've. I've. But that's something. That's something that comes with ocd. That is a road. That's an OCD thing for me personally. Yeah. Because erp, you have to learn how to filter which thoughts you want to enter the consciousness.

[Jake]

What's erp?

[Pink Pantheress]

ERP is a form of therapy for ocd.

[Jake]

Exposure therapy. Yep.

[Pink Pantheress]

So I did a lot of that. So I can choose. I'm very lucky, by the way. This is a very lucky thing to have. I can choose which thoughts to dwell on. Jealousy. I said, we are done here when I was, like, year nine.

[Jake]

So I need to go to your erp.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, it's. It's. It does. It's. It's hard. It's Hard. But once you get it, it's. You get it.

[Jake]

I used to not be able to add songs to playlists, so my explosion therapy, swear to God, my exposure therapy, used to be adding this onto the playlist and letting it sit there.

[Pink Pantheress]

Really?

[Jake]

Yep. And I would sit there for 30 minutes, and she'd be like, how are you feeling?

[Pink Pantheress]

That's. That's really cool, actually. I'm, like, kind of gagged by that. Mine would be. What would it be? It would be talking about, like. Like existentialism and, like, what was it? She'd like. She would make me, like, talk about being older.

[Jake]

You're so young.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, thank you.

[Jake]

You are.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, thank you. Why? There's a. It's a fact. Okay. I don't know why I said thank you.

[Jake]

My friends are all really fun and match my vibe, but one of us is the star of the friend group, and I can't take it anymore. She's annoying about it, too. And I don't know if I'm jealous or if it's just getting out of hand at this point. Help.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I've been in this situation. There's definitely a way that you could. But this is the thing. I. Again, learning not to be jealous. You learn to realize that some people have a natural star power. And I hate this word, but aura. Some people have.

[Jake]

Why you hate that word?

[Pink Pantheress]

Because that word has been ruined by bloody social media. TikTok. Whatever. It's been ruined. It's now a corny turn of phrase in my book, but it kind of has. Like, I learned that some people naturally have it and some people naturally don't. But the thing is, if you don't have it, then you can't hate on someone for having it. So the girl writing this in, you have to look inwards and think, is it because I just. I'm not necessarily as vocal or as, like, quote, unquote, fun or as mystical as said person. Or is it because she's doing too much?

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

She needs to figure that out. Because if they're doing too much, then girl, leave the friendship.

[Jake]

Right?

[Pink Pantheress]

Or tell her and be like, get out. Calm the down.

[Jake]

Do you watch. Do you watch the White Lotus?

[Pink Pantheress]

No, I don't.

[Jake]

Okay. Did you see the finale last night? Okay, so what I'm gonna bring up is there was a monologue in the finale last night where Carrie Coon is like. So the entire. There's this group of three girls throughout the show, and they all talk about each other the entire time, and they. About each other, and they Fight. And then in the finale, Carrie Coon comes to this realization. What? Like, would you. Sorry, am I spoiling for you, Louise? Oh, okay. There's. There's. She comes to this, like, really beautiful realization where she's like. I don't know, what would you say it was like? Yeah, she's like, our friendship matters. Like, even if we're just doing nothing, like, it feels deep to me. And then she like gets past the point and there's like this star of the friend group. Her name is Jacqueline. And she's like. And she looks at Jacqueline and she's like, I'm really happy that you have a beautiful face. And she turns to this other girl and it's like, I'm happy you have a beautiful life. And I'm just happy to be at the table.

[Pink Pantheress]

Amazing.

[Jake]

And so I would maybe recommend that.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, that's good.

[Jake]

It was really moving. I. I cried. No, I didn't. Sorry.

[Pink Pantheress]

But I teared up because the very subtle lie that. Well, do you like, comfortably.

[Jake]

No, See, I. But I told you right after. See, I said I. I cried.

[Pink Pantheress]

See, that's me too. I do say. And I call it a prank anyway. I do, I do, I do, I do. You did prank me a little bit.

[Jake]

No, I never. I am so uncomfortable lying because. Well, back to my ocd, I always feel the need to over explain myself and over. So I can't lie.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's so true. Otherwise, then you're a bad person if you lie too much. Yeah, okay. Okay. Boom. What? Yeah, I already answered the question. I mean, like, friendship groups are a bit peak though. That's. I really do love just a one on one best friend couple. I've got a few best friends. Love them, but a little circle.

[Jake]

Do you find it hard to make friends after you've chosen this as a career?

[Pink Pantheress]

I think it's harder for me to meet people, but I think that I. I'm somebody where if I meet someone and there's a jowl, I don't let them go. Do you feel still have me?

[Jake]

Do you feel that way about us?

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean.

[Jake]

Because I do.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's really cute. And honestly, I would definitely love to join you guys's friendship group and be the star.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

And be that star that you're looking for. No, I'm joking. I think you're great. I think you're really fun and. Yeah, I don't. I. I would. Listen, we're gonna be getting Nobu at some point. No.

[Jake]

Huh?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. No, you said this octopus was bad.

[Jake]

From there, it's not great.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay. Oh, you know where we should go actually.

[Jake]

Where?

[Pink Pantheress]

And I'm actually being so serious about.

[Jake]

Going where I love cucu.

[Pink Pantheress]

I love.

[Jake]

Yeah, it's the best. Do you like Korean barbecue as well?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes.

[Jake]

Okay, so across the street from Gyukaku in Beverly Hills. Genoa.

[Pink Pantheress]

I know.

[Jake]

That's my favorite place in la.

[Pink Pantheress]

Okay, so we'll set it up.

[Jake]

Yep.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. Imagine if I go all manages to set that up for us. I see.

[Jake]

I want to become a singer slash songwriter and I don't know where to start or if I should tell anyone. My family and friends aren't exactly the biggest artist type of people. Any advice?

[Pink Pantheress]

Don't tell them then. Like, don't tell them. Like, honestly I. This is the advice I give to so many because a lot of people have the same issue and my advice is don't tell these people. I. Because I knew it was going to hold me back if people knew in my life because they're also not musical people.

[Jake]

You know, your family?

[Pink Pantheress]

My family and my friends. And I was worried about judgment and so for me, don't I block them off. Everything I didn't tell them. Kept it a damn secret. And I allowed myself to blossom in private. And there's no thing I love more in life than a secret. I love well kept secrets. God, really?

[Jake]

Are you good? Secret keeper?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

I mean, yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

I love when people have secret passions that aren't illegal.

[Jake]

Okay, wait, so you. How long were you able to keep this from your family and friends for?

[Pink Pantheress]

Honestly, a good while. Like no. You know what's so funny? It was, it was about one month after pain had like taken off and like my friend sent it to me, was like, this sounds like you. And I was like, it's not me.

[Jake]

Shut the.

[Pink Pantheress]

That was one thing. And then I. And then I in the same as you, I'm like, I can't lie. I can't lie. So I had to be like, actually it is me.

[Jake]

And that was where I'm gagged.

[Pink Pantheress]

Huh?

[Jake]

Were they like, I'm gagged?

[Pink Pantheress]

Weirdly enough, I actually, they weren't that gagged at all. They were kind of just like, oh, that's really cool. Good for you. I was like, like, fair enough. Actually, I'm really happy at that reaction. I'm. I don't. I will say I don't do things for reaction.

[Jake]

Okay, but you had a Hannah Mon. Then you left. You lived Hannah Montana.

[Pink Pantheress]

Kind of got the wig too.

[Jake]

That's awesome.

[Pink Pantheress]

Another. That's another receptor. I had to turn Off. I had to turn off the caring about appearance. Like people commenting on your appearance or me bashing my own appearance. I had to turn it off. It's gone. I. I can't remember what it feels like.

[Jake]

Can I ask how you turn them off?

[Pink Pantheress]

For me, it's just every thought that comes in, like, let's say I'm looking at myself. I'm like, right. I'd say for me, it's about when the thought comes in. It's about letting the subconscious thought come in, but literally not letting yourself address, like, your conscious thought, dwell on the thought. Because you know how thoughts go. Like this. You get the. This is how thoughts work. You get the subconscious thought. And then your conscious brain is like, like questioning that thought. It's like, well, I'm not actually that ugly. Well, my best friend said I was really pretty today, so I can't actually be that ugly. Or you'll take selfies to try. And these are the compulsions. You take selfies looking at them back. Once you cut all of that out, once you don't one if you get the thought, I look kind of ugly today. And then you cut out all of the compulsion part to, like, make yourself feel better. Like, you will. I promise you. Like, the thoughts will very much either dim down completely or they'll go. This isn't for everyone, though.

[Jake]

I. I think that is some of the most poignant advice ever given on the show.

[Pink Pantheress]

Girl. Like, it's. Girl, it changed like this. The only way I can live is, like, doing that.

[Jake]

That is amazing. Oh, that reminds me of a quote I saw once that was like, emotions are like people on the street. Like, you don't have to acknowledge them.

[Pink Pantheress]

Exactly. I think a lot of people. I will say the only reason why I'm saying, like, it's only I. It's not every brain that. That can comprehend this kindness. And I'm not saying I'm different. I'm not. I'm not. I had to train myself for years and years. So it's not something that you like. You really. It's like I. And I went through a lot of BS thinking wise.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

And a lot of time by myself to figure it out. But yeah, I mean, damn, like, anyone can do erp. And it really helps anyone. Like, you don't need to have ocd. Erp.

[Jake]

Right?

[Pink Pantheress]

Anyone can do it.

[Jake]

Wow. I think I'm gonna try to practice that tonight because I have a. An event I'm going to and I'm really anxious about it and I'm gonna Feel ugly.

[Pink Pantheress]

Exactly. Try it tonight. Like look in that mirror and kind of be like, okay, I'm having these here. But actually this is what it feels like. It feels like this. What was that just then?

[Jake]

I was looking at you.

[Pink Pantheress]

That was silence.

[Jake]

Okay. Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

So that silence, that is exactly what you. That's what your brain should be thinking when you get that thought.

[Jake]

Oh, can we try one more time?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah. Okay. Allow your subconscious to call you ugly right now.

[Jake]

Okay.

[Pink Pantheress]

And then practice what we're doing.

[Jake]

So freeing. Just like, wait, shut up. Yes, it's like, wait, shut up.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, it kind of. Well, it kind of is. Is treating them like they're nothing.

[Jake]

Yeah.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, but listen. Yeah. It's not for everybody, but if you struggle, then it's good. It's good for anxiety.

[Jake]

I've been in a situationship for 3.5 years.

[Pink Pantheress]

No.

[Jake]

And we finally had a real talk about feelings. And then the next week he had a new girlfriend. Should I tell her? And how.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, we. We can't know unless we have the. We don't know what was in the contents of the conversation. Because what if they decided that they weren't right for each other? I mean, a week later though, you know? I mean, that might mean that he was cheating though. If there was overlap. Should she tell her?

[Jake]

No, I don't think so either.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, because. What?

[Jake]

Because.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, no, only tell if there's overlap that you are very you. That you can discern.

[Jake]

So maybe do some detective work and see if there's overlap.

[Pink Pantheress]

For me personally, I'm not doing that detective work, honey. I'm going to bed. I'm going to bed like this.

[Jake]

Good night.

[Pink Pantheress]

Very silently and very comfortably. But if I find out there's overlap, of course I'm going to tell some. Of course I'm telling you. Hell yeah.

[Jake]

Hi, Jake and gorgeous guest. How do I get over a friendship breakup with a group of 11 girls? Oh my God. I didn't do anything wrong. I just drifted away from the friend group. I've been friends with some of them since I was 5 and I've spent my whole life with them.

[Pink Pantheress]

11?

[Jake]

I know we can't be friends forever. I know we can't be friends forever. But I feel like I can't even state my case. They keep avoiding me. Oh my God. I have been there. Eleven girls, no less. But I have been there. And it is genuinely the most heart wrenching worst feeling I've ever experienced.

[Pink Pantheress]

Like having to leave hundred grand?

[Jake]

No, like being left and is what this is like. What's this sounds like. It's like she drifted and then they were like, we're done. And now they won't tell her why. It's so immature. Like, you really just have to tell yourself, like, if they're behaving this way, like, I. This isn't who I'm gonna want to be around.

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, actually, this is something that I came to reckon with. Girl school. Girl school. I learned everything about life in that place. I'm being so serious. And I will say, for me, it's as simple as choosing not to be friends with people that treat people so disposably. That makes any sense. And this isn't just friends. This can also be your boyfriend, girlfriend, lovers, any type of lover or friend or anyone in your life that can. That you can tell treats things very disposable at their disposal.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

I can't. And you. There are signs where you can tell.

[Jake]

Like, what are some of the signs?

[Pink Pantheress]

Like, not being able to tell friends. I mean, this isn't also a must, by the way. This. These are my signs. These are my personal signs, which I look, look for when I'm looking for a close friend. I like friends that say they love me. I like. I like friends that can. It's not a required thing, but I like people that can laugh at themselves when they're with me.

[Jake]

Self deprecation.

[Pink Pantheress]

You have to be able to laugh at yourself, but you also have to laugh at me. I actually. Funny. This is quite controversial. A lot of people don't understand why I do this. I only really like friends. Not really like. Sorry, but my best friend, the way that. Why. The reason my best friend is because she literally kind of like, bullied me.

[Jake]

What?

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah, she's not gonna like me for this, but she knows exactly what I mean. She bullied me into being a better version of myself.

[Jake]

I have similar situations.

[Pink Pantheress]

She bullied me into, like, I'm telling you, like, she wouldn't let me get away with anything. And what. And the reason why this is good? I mean, some people say it's bad. For me, the reason it was good was because it stopped me being a little. A little. What do you call it? I stopped me being super sensitive. It taught me the ability to joke at myself. It taught me the ability to like.

[Jake]

Like.

[Pink Pantheress]

I mean, exactly that. Take a joke. It taught me to take a joke. Taught me to. That's not to say that everything's a flipping joke. There are obviously some things we have to take seriously in life, but when it comes to me, if you're Poking fun at me. I'm like, I have no choice but to take it as a joke.

[Jake]

Me too.

[Pink Pantheress]

I. I just can't. Like, I even. That's why. Exactly. With the Internet comments and, like, I can deal with being a person in public, in a public eye now, because if somebody says, oh, she's mid. Oh, she's ugly. Oh, she's this. She's fat. She's. I'm like. Like, I don't have the receptor again to care anymore.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

It's gone.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

I've already had this growing up. Like, sorry, my best friend wasn't saying anything of the sort to me like that, but even having her, like, me wearing some trousers and she's like.

[Jake]

Like, that's so it's like sisters. And she. It was like, sisterly. Like, she had you grow thick skin.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yes, that's exactly what it is. And I'm so thankful and I love her for that because she taught me the element of humor.

[Jake]

Oh, that's awesome.

[Pink Pantheress]

Love her, but. Yeah, yeah, but you've had that too.

[Jake]

Yes. And going back to this girl, like, if. If your friends can't teach you anything and they're not. They're not even talking to you, and there's no love in five years. Like, I know this sounds crazy right now, but in five years, you were gonna look back and be like, oh, my God. Thank God. Yeah, thank God. Thank God. Because it led me to whoever I'm with five years later.

[Pink Pantheress]

Disposable. Genuinely, so many people that think of others as is disposable. And honestly, a lot of. Of couples, I. I fear there's a lot where Couples where I. Where one member will be somebody that's fairly, like, disposable.

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

And that's why a lot of. There's a lot of advantageous partners out there that take advantage of their partners because they know that, like, the. The couples that don't work, in my opinion, are couples where like. Like, I feel like you either have to be both. All like, what they call. I'm trying to, like, separate, so it's an easier conversation. So let's call. There's two types of people in the world. I've described this a few times. In my opinion, the way my brain works, there's two types of people in this world. You have people that are kind of, in my opinion, like, more shallow, surface level, emotionally tied people. And then you have people that are, like, really all in. I will die for you. I love you. Like, we are tired soul mates for life. I used to Be this person. I used to be a more shallow enjoyer of friends and. And family, whatever. I used to be that person until I met my best friend and until I got older and I met my managers and everyone. And I realized that being. For me personally, it works way better to be an all in. I'm invested in you. We're going to be friends for life. You're going to be the godfather, godmother of my kids. You know what I mean?

[Jake]

Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

And so now, these days, I don't choose to make friends with people that I only see as, like, oh, you know, like, we're friends on the weekend.

[Jake]

Right. Right.

[Pink Pantheress]

I can't do it. It's really hard for me because I'm like. But I, I. Because I'll always have this doubt in my head that you'll have my back. And I need people that have my back.

[Jake]

Right. Also, as you grow older, like, like in White Lotus last night, she. She said, as I. As we grow older, I feel that it's hard. It's. We need to justify all of our decisions. Like, we. It's harder to make passive decisions because everything needs a justification as you grow older. And I think part of that is that.

[Pink Pantheress]

Wow, sounds like I need to watch this.

[Jake]

It was. Seriously. No, no. Her monologue last night changed my life. Because I was like, yeah, because I. Because everyone hated that friend group the entire time. Everyone hated them. And something about it. I was like, no, they love each other. And I know they love each other. You do? Okay, Pink, what did we learn today?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I honestly learned a lot about you.

[Jake]

You learned a lot about me?

[Pink Pantheress]

I learned a lot about you.

[Jake]

What'd you learn?

[Pink Pantheress]

Well, I learned that you won, like, a lot of Japanese restaurants in the uk. I mean, that's. I mean, come on. That's rookie. Rookie numbers. As I said, you have ocd.

[Jake]

Huh?

[Pink Pantheress]

You enjoy going on tour and that. You make it obvious when you. Your joke didn't land. Then, you know, I called nuggets.

[Jake]

Nuggets.

[Pink Pantheress]

Do you guys call them over here? Like a punchline? The nugget didn't land.

[Jake]

Oh, okay. I like that.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's a good nugget.

[Jake]

Yeah. I mean, yeah, I learned that you're perfectionist, but it's tied back to your ocd. And you've actually done a lot of work on your OCD because of exposure therapy, and you're able to turn those negative receptors off in your head.

[Pink Pantheress]

Yeah.

[Jake]

And that you're a really, really fun time.

[Pink Pantheress]

Thank you.

[Jake]

And I loved hanging out with you.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's really sweet. You are amazing. You're so funny.

[Jake]

You're so funny.

[Pink Pantheress]

Did you. What did you explore? I mean, you said you listen to my music. What did you expect something coming in, meeting me? Or did you kind of like, I thought.

[Jake]

I think you were good. I. I knew you were funny. I did not think you were gonna be this funny. Yes. I did not think you were gonna be this funny. Like, I thought I was gonna be the leader. Like, I thought I was gonna be.

[Pink Pantheress]

I'm a star.

[Jake]

No, I thought I. I was gonna be way more intimidated and, like, really? Because, like, I don't know, I thought you were gonna be, like, I'm the coolest. Like, I don't know. Like, I don't know what I was expecting. I was scared.

[Pink Pantheress]

That's really fun. You. As in, you thought I was gonna be on, like, some stu.

[Jake]

So, like, superstar. But you got really vulnerable and really honest and really funny.

[Pink Pantheress]

That is just not. I will say, that's so interesting. I really want to set the record straight. I'm not that.

[Jake]

I. I know.

[Pink Pantheress]

I. Well.

[Jake]

Well.

[Pink Pantheress]

No, you are so fun. And thank you for being on here.

[Jake]

Thank you for being here. Well, Pink, thank you. Thank you for being here.