Podcast Summary: Therapy and Theology

Episode: S10 E4 | How To Forgive When the Hurt Was So Unfair

Release Date: October 2, 2025
Host: Lysa TerKeurst
Guests: Jim Cress (Licensed Professional Counselor), Dr. Joel Muddamalle (Director of Theological Research at Proverbs 31 Ministries)

Episode Overview

In this deeply honest and practical episode, Lysa TerKeurst, Jim Cress, and Dr. Joel Muddamalle confront the raw difficulty of forgiveness, especially when the hurt was deeply unfair or unacknowledged by the person who caused it. Drawing on biblical wisdom, psychology, and personal experience, they explore what forgiveness is (and is not), why it's essential for emotional and spiritual health, and offer step-by-step, compassionate guidance for starting the journey—even when it feels impossible.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Initial Resistance to Forgiveness

• Lysa frames how natural it is to resist the idea of forgiveness, especially amidst deep wounds, feeling that it's “an unfair gift” given to someone who "hasn't even apologized or acknowledged their hurtful actions."
• "If I wait for them to own what they did and say they’re sorry, I may attach my well-being to the person who’s hurt me for the rest of my life." (Lysa, 03:44)
• Key Insight: Forgiveness isn’t a gift for the offender; it’s God’s prescription for your own heart to heal (Lysa, 03:45).

2. The Goal of Forgiveness: Peace, Not Reconciliation

• Dr. Joel dives into Romans 12:18, highlighting the conditionality Paul describes: “If possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone.” (04:24)
• The goal for Christians is peace—internally first—regardless of the other person's actions.
• Forgiveness is an act you do for your own peace, not necessarily to reconcile or restore a relationship, and reconciliation requires conditions that aren’t always met (Dr. Joel, 05:31).

3. The Consequences of Unforgiveness

• Dr. Joel describes unforgiveness as a “cyanide pill we take ourselves,” building walls that eventually become a prison (07:05).
• Jim points out that unforgiveness doesn’t just separate us from others, but creates a disconnection from our own selves—leading to dissociation and loss of self-awareness (Jim, 07:41).

4. Anger and Hardness of Heart vs. Healthy Boundaries

• Lysa vulnerably shares that she used anger as a shield to avoid repeated pain, thinking she needed a hard heart to protect her tender one (08:14).
• Jim clarifies the difference between walls and boundaries: “Walls focus on pushing you out. Boundaries are about keeping myself safe inside.” (09:45)

5. Forgiveness as a Biblical Command and Daily Practice

• Lysa details how, after extensive Bible study (and searching for loopholes!), she realized Scripture presents forgiveness as an “absolute command,” but makes reconciliation conditional (12:10–13:37).
• She connects forgiveness to daily practices outlined in the Lord’s Prayer, viewing it as essential as eating and sleeping (19:40).
• "Connect these two verses: In the morning, sweep your heart clean… And as the sun is setting…tend well to anything left over in your heart." (Lisa, 20:39)

6. Physical and Spiritual Consequences of Withheld Forgiveness

• Jim references a Duke University study suggesting unforgiveness is linked to physical ailments and early death due to the emotional and spiritual toxicity it causes (16:27).
• Unforgiveness is “like dropping blood in the ocean—sharks (the enemy) draw near; it’s a call for the enemy to come right in and have a heyday” (Lisa, 17:24).

7. Practical Steps to Begin Forgiveness

• Jim and Lisa share a practical exercise using 3x5 cards: List out all instances of hurt, then use a spoken script and a symbolic act (covering cards with red felt representing the blood of Jesus) to release each one in forgiveness (22:10–25:00).
• Script: “I’m now choosing out of obedience to God to forgive this person for this way they hurt me. Whatever my feelings do not yet allow, the blood of Jesus will cover it.”
• Emphasize: Forgiveness is both a decision and a process—triggers and emotions may resurface, but these are invitations to deeper healing, not evidence of failure (Lisa, 25:10).

8. What Forgiveness Is NOT

• Not letting them “get away with it” or minimizing the wrong: Forgiveness does not release the other person from consequences or accountability (31:12).
• Not denying the impact: It’s okay to acknowledge the pain, but strive to do so without ongoing bitterness (32:09).
• Not dropping boundaries or erasing memory: "No amnesia, no lobotomy." Boundaries can and should remain in place as long as needed (32:18).
• Not the same as reconciliation: “Forgiveness and reconciliation don’t always hold hands.” Sometimes the relationship cannot continue or must remain limited (33:25).

9. Conditions for Reconciliation

• Dr. Joel uses a musical metaphor to explain Paul’s instructions to live in harmony (Romans 12): Reconciliation is only possible when both parties are “playing in the same key”—conforming to the “key of Christ.” Where destructive behaviors persist, harmony (reconciliation) isn’t possible (34:10).

10. A Final Empowering Invitation

• Lysa closes with a liberating reminder: “You deserve to stop suffering because of what another person has done. Forgiveness is your choice… put a stake in the ground and say, I am going to forgive because I want to live. I want to move on, I want to be healthy, and I don’t want this to hold me back.” (35:49)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Lysa: “Forgiveness is God’s prescription for the human heart to heal. It’s much more about me and God.” (03:44)
• Dr. Joel: “Unforgiveness is the gift you give yourself, which is a cyanide pill.” (05:31)
• Jim: “Walls focus on pushing you out. Boundaries are about keeping myself safe inside.” (09:45)
• Lysa: “Jesus laid down His life to accomplish a high and holy purpose. He did not lay down His life to enable bad behavior to continue.” (13:37)
• Dr. Joel: “The condition of forgiveness is not an awareness of what they’ve done… Jesus says, ‘Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.’” (26:27)
• Lysa: “You’re not letting them get away with it… Sin always comes as a package deal—there is a painful consequence already built into it, whether we see it or not.” (31:13)
• Dr. Joel: “Forgiveness and reconciliation don’t always have to hold hands.” (33:25)
• Lysa: “You deserve to stop suffering. Forgiveness is your choice… I am going to forgive because I want to live.” (35:49)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:44] – The true purpose of forgiveness and initial resistance.
• [05:31] – Dr. Joel’s analogy: unforgiveness as a self-destructive act.
• [07:41] – Unforgiveness disconnects us from ourselves.
• [09:45] – The distinction between walls and boundaries.
• [13:37] – Forgiveness as a biblical command; reconciliation as conditional.
• [16:27] – The deadly impact of harboring unforgiveness.
• [19:40] – Forgiveness in the Lord’s Prayer; practical daily practice.
• [22:10] – How to start forgiveness using the 3x5 card exercise.
• [25:10] – Understanding forgiveness as both decision and process.
• [31:13] – What forgiveness isn’t (not minimizing, not enabling, etc.).
• [34:10] – Dr. Joel’s harmony metaphor for reconciliation.
• [35:49] – Lysa’s closing encouragement to choose forgiveness for your own freedom.

Overall Tone

The episode is warm, compassionate, and honest, balancing biblical truth with empathy and plenty of lived experience. The hosts repeatedly give permission for the struggle, acknowledge the messiness, and encourage listeners with practical hope.

Takeaways for Listeners

• You are not required to wait for an apology or acknowledgment to heal.
• Forgiveness is for your own heart, health, and future.
• It’s both a momentary decision and a healing process; triggers are part of that journey.
• Boundaries and wisdom are essential—reconciliation is separate from forgiveness.
• Letting go does NOT mean forgetting, condoning, or exposing yourself to repeated harm.
• Choosing to forgive is choosing freedom, peace, and life.

Recommended resource:
Surviving an Unwanted Divorce by Lysa, Dr. Joel & Jim—includes practical guides to forgiveness.

For further support or questions, visit the show notes or Proverbs 31 Ministries.