Thinking Fellows: "Where Lutheranism Disagrees with Thomas Aquinas"

Podcast: Thinking Fellows (1517 Podcasts)
Date: November 25, 2025
Hosts: Caleb Keith, Scott Keith, Bruce Hillman, John Hoyam, Adam Francisco
Duration: ~61 minutes

Episode Overview

This episode grapples with the growing fascination among Protestants—particularly young, intellectually curious evangelicals and some Lutherans—for Thomas Aquinas’ theology. The Thinking Fellows dig into historical and contemporary Lutheran critiques of Aquinas, focusing on fundamental theological divergences, especially around grace, justification, and the role of reason. The conversation also addresses why Aquinas’ system is alluring today, its limitations, and the risks Lutherans see in adopting his framework uncritically.

Main Themes & Discussion Points

1. Why Aquinas? The Thomist Resurgence

Timestamps: 00:54 – 02:50

• Rising Popularity: Aquinas is increasingly influential among young men, Protestants, and even those identifying as "scholastics."
• Online & Real-World Influence: Host Caleb Keith notes direct encounters at church and online with self-identified scholastics, showing Thomism’s reach beyond academia.
  • Caleb: "But today we're going to do what I think is a very online optimized title ... what did Aquinas get wrong from a Lutheran perspective?" [02:05]

2. Core Lutheran Critique: Scripture vs. Reason

Timestamps: 03:01 – 07:46

• Scholasticism’s Roots: The theology the Reformers opposed was largely built on Aquinas’ synthesis of Aristotelian philosophy with Christian doctrine.
• Key Areas of Disagreement:
  • Doctrine of sin
  • The will
  • Grace
  • Faith
  • Justification
  • The Church
  • Eschatology
• Primary Lutheran Concern: Scholastic theology’s use of reason and extra-biblical sources leads to conclusions not necessitated by, or even contrary to, scripture.
  • Scott: “...you come up with conclusions that are not always supported from Scripture alone ... This is where the early Reformation argument is.” [04:32]
• Appeal of Systematic Coherence: Thomistic systems provide logical completeness, which is appealing but may demand bending or surpassing Scripture’s own testimony.

3. Embracing Mystery vs. Totalizing Systems

Timestamps: 07:46 – 09:22

• Lutheran ‘Comfort with Mystery’: Lutherans are more comfortable living with unresolved tension or mystery in theology, as opposed to constructing all-encompassing logical systems.
  • Adam: “Something in Lutheran DNA...a higher sense of mystery ... I think a lot of times Lutherans are not willing to follow that logical consequentialism as far as, say, Calvinists and Thomas would.” [07:46]

4. Nature, Grace, and Justification: The Theological Heart of the Dispute

Timestamps: 09:22 – 19:16

• Nature & Grace Framework: Thomistic doctrine that “grace perfects nature” undergirds inclusivist and merit-based soteriology.
• Anonymous Christians: Critique of the idea that people outside explicit faith in Christ can be saved through general access to God's truth and grace.
  • Bruce: “One of the major Lutheran criticisms ... is that it puts the human being in the position of making his or her way to God ... instead of, as we say in the Reformation, solas, by grace alone.” [11:45]
• Infused vs. Imputed Grace:
  • Adam: “...the baptism is sort of this first infusion of a powerful grace, not a declared grace that God gives you from the bench of the courtroom because of Christ's sake.” [14:09]
  • Lutherans stress that grace is imputed (declared), not infused as a kind of spiritual “superpower” to be cooperated with.
• Bucket Analogy:
  • Scott: “When you're baptized, you're brought through the doors of the church and you're handed your grace bucket ... the rest of your life is about trying to fill up that bucket of grace in the hope that ... you can trade it in for salvation.” [15:31]
• Active Perseverance and the Role of the Will: Aquinas gives a post-baptismal role for human cooperation, which Lutherans see as dangerous for leading back to merit.

5. The Lure and Risks of Scholastic Theology Today

Timestamps: 20:22 – 33:16

• Explaining its Current Appeal:
  • Provides an intellectually robust, unified worldview amid a fragmentary culture.
  • Offers moral clarity and systems for apologetics.
• Is Mixing Systems Possible? Many contemporary Protestants want to retain "the comfort of grace alone, faith alone" while using scholastic/Thomistic categories.
  • Caleb: “...people are postulating: is the problem, the order? ... What if I just took this whole category and dropped it in the sanctification bucket?” [29:21]

6. Natural Law and Cultural Engagement

Timestamps: 33:16 – 37:53

• Natural Law: While some Lutherans import Thomas’ natural law theory to give an objective grounding to ethics, others see the risks in adopting his metaphysical framework wholesale.
  • Adam: “...appreciation of Thomas in Lutheran circles is usually ... more along the lines of natural law.” [33:03]
• Christians’ Motivation for Public Morality: There’s a desire to reinvigorate Christian witness in public life by grounding it in Thomistic or natural law concepts.

7. Why Lutherans Resist Thomism: Simul Justus et Peccator (Simultaneously Saint and Sinner)

Timestamps: 39:13 – 54:37

• On Grace and Meritorious Works:

  • Lutheran critique: Any system that imports human merit—even after justification—tends to lead back to pride and moral anxiety.
  • Scott: “It all gets to be a scam to try to make, to bring merit back in... I have now done something that has made God smile today. That's the end goal of the sinner.” [39:54]

• Law & Motivation: Discussion of what motivates the Christian life if merit is excluded. Lutherans root motivation in identity: child in the family, not merit-seeker.

• The Reality of Sin: Even with best moral efforts, sin persists; sanctification is not linear.

  • Adam (quoting Thomas à Kempis): "Now that I'm older, what I've actually found is I just have learned to sin better." [53:46]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• The Allure of Scholasticism:

  • Scott: “It is appealing because you can, through Thomism, come in with conclusions that really fit and make sense ... It's just maybe it's wrong because that's not actually what Scripture is saying.” [06:31]

• Metaphysical Synthesis & Intellectual One-Upmanship:

  • Bruce: “...by returning to the medieval synthesis of reason and revelation, we can do an end run around the whole problem of modernity ... that's certainly a huge part of the appeal for a lot of Christian intellectuals who are frankly embattled...” [36:13]

• On Sanctification & Performance:

  • Bruce: “There is a great burden and a great accusation if you do attach performance to salvation.” [52:43]

• Simul Justus et Peccator in Practice:

  • Adam: “…sin is just all the way down and it's not going away. ... We can polish it and we can give it plastic surgery and we can dress it up, but what we really need is a savior from it...” [54:14]

• Aquinas’ Odd Biography:

  • John: “...to really sort of get him to change his mind, they spring for like a super hot prostitute to get him to sin ... Thomas was such a good bloke that he ... started poking at the prostitute, like to get her out of that room to avoid falling into sin...” [56:01 – 56:38]
    (Told as a humorous yet illustrative story of Aquinas’ reputation for virtue and the monastic ideal.)

• Final Lutheran Position:

  • Caleb: “Christianity is not a system for progressively improving the world as sin. It is ... the total death and the total resurrection of the world in Christ ... the solution is not sort of progressive or cooperative work with God in this world to transform yourself, the world, or other people. It is Christ who has totally transformed you and will raise you from the dead.” [59:00--60:27]

Important Timestamps for Key Segments

| Segment | Timestamp (MM:SS) | |-------------------------------------|------------------------| | The rise of Thomism | 00:54 – 02:50 | | Lutheran critique: Scripture vs. Reason | 03:01 – 07:46 | | Embracing mystery (vs. totalizing systems) | 07:46 – 09:22 | | Nature, grace, and justification | 09:22 – 19:16 | | Accountability and merit in grace | 14:09 – 17:19 | | Scholasticism’s contemporary appeal | 20:22 – 33:16 | | Modernity, metaphysics, and natural law | 33:16 – 37:53 | | Protestant attempts to reorder Thomism | 29:21 – 31:08 | | Simul Justus et Peccator, sanctification | 39:13 – 54:37 | | Aquinas’ colorful biography | 56:01 – 57:53 | | Final Lutheran affirmation & summary | 59:00 – 60:27 |

Conclusion

The hosts affirm that while Aquinas offers intellectual depth and coherence, Lutherans historically and theologically object to his system when it leads away from the radical grace of Christ alone. Any system that imports human cooperation or merit—even if re-categorized as sanctification—ends up burdening consciences and obscuring Christ's finished work. The comfort and challenge of the Lutheran approach lies in embracing mystery, confessing total dependence on Christ’s grace, and rejecting the temptation to seek God’s acceptance through works.

For listeners looking to grasp the Lutheran/Thomist divide, this episode provides both a lively and deeply informed tour through its main controversies, contemporary relevance, and perennial tensions.