← This Can't Be That Hard
This Can't Be That Hard
305 - Using a Studio to Grow Your Photography Business with Michelle McAfee
00:33:36
Loading summary
Transcript49 lines
- [00:00]
Annemie Tonkin
When it comes to marketing, I frequently talk about if, you know, if they're all zigging, you need to zag. And I feel like the current state of photography really encourages people to run businesses that have an almost non existent footprint out there in the world. Right. We're shooting on location, we're working from our laptops, even not even like a dedicated office space in our homes. And mostly the the business is online, which is fine and it is certainly a nice way to keep costs down. However, when there are a lot of photographers out there and the competition is fierce, one way that you can set yourself apart is by having some sort of dedicated physical space. Now, if you are not a studio photographer, right, you're not making photos inside a studio space, then a studio can seem like an excess that you just don't need to take on. But my guest today, Michelle Lindsay of Michelle Lindsay Photography, has owned a studio for several years and that studio has gone through a handful of different reincarnations, two basic reincarnations, but has since become used for all kinds of different purposes. And I wanted to have her on the show today because I know some of you have studio space that you're paying rent on or you have access to, but you're not really utilizing it to its full list. Others of you are looking for creative ways to market your business. And I think this is an idea worth considering. But Michelle has really used her studio and kind of squeezed every last drop of goodness out of that opportunity. And I'm going to use the word opportunity because that's really what a studio is when it is a blank canvas. You can create all kinds of things with that that can feed your photography business from all different kinds of sites. So I'm very excited to introduce Michelle to you. If you have not heard of her before, you will enjoy not just her words today, but her work and then learning a bit more about the different opportunities that a studio provides. Welcome to this Can't Be that Hard. My name is Annemie Tonkin and I help photographers run profitable, sustainable businesses that they love. Each week on the podcast, I cover simple, actionable strategies and systems that photographers at every level of experience can use to earn more money in a more sustainable way. Running a photography business doesn't have to be that hard. You can do it and I can show you how. Michelle, it is so wonderful to have you on the show. We've talked many times, but this is the first time that we have talked with the record button flashing. So no pressure, but I am so excited to have you on the show. How are you today?
- [02:55]
Michelle Lindsay
I'm good. Thank you so much for having me. I've listened to the podcast for years, and I'm really excited to be here.
- [03:01]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, well, I am. I'm excited to share you with the wider photography world a little bit. I feel like I've got an insider scoop on somebody who's doing really cool things and thinking about her business in a way that should be the gold standard for all the photographers out there. You and I have spent some time in, like, the coaching realm where we're chatting, but every time that I come out of those conversations with you, I'm always like, I feel like maybe I got as much out of this as she did, so I don't know if.
- [03:28]
Michelle Lindsay
That'S fair, but thank you. It's a lot.
- [03:32]
Annemie Tonkin
Well, it is. It has been a really wonderful kind of conversation to continue on, and I. I'm excited to bring it to my wider audience. So let's just start. I'll have you introduce yourself as I. As I typically let my guests do, and give a little backstory. You've actually been in business, I think, longer than I have.
- [03:49]
Michelle Lindsay
I went full time in 2008, so 16 years. I started photographing in 2006. But, yeah, 2008 was, like the big year that I, like, made the jump to full time. So. Real name, My full name is Michelle McAfee, but I go in the professional world as Michelle Lindsay. My business is Michelle Lindsay Photography. When I launched my business, like so many photographers, I feel like it just kind of started snowballing and someone asked me to, you know, will you photograph a wedding? And I was like, sure. So I. I did start in the wedding world and spent a fair amount of time in the wedding world, but pretty quickly knew that it was not going to be sustainable for me personally, long term. I knew that I wanted to eventually have kids and have my weekends free. So pretty early on, I started making plans to, like, transition. And there was a very large chunk of time where I was in both the wedding and the portrait world, really building up my portrait business until I felt comfortable to be like, I can say no to every single wedding that comes my way. And I got there. And so that's the world that I live in now, which is portraits, kind of specializing in motherhood, maternity babies, and eventually, you know, most of those people want to continue to work with me. So families as well.
- [05:08]
Annemie Tonkin
It's a. It's a good feeder system. Those new babies, yeah, for sure. They definitely. They can turn Into I, whenever I talk to people who are exclusively newborn photographers or maternity and newborn, like you're leaving so much on the table. There's so much opportunity to continue those relationships. But of course if that's your subject matter of choice, that is, that is the, the whole purpose of being your own boss is getting to choose.
- [05:33]
Michelle Lindsay
Yeah. I was like looking at my numbers in December and the very first newborn I ever photographed, she's turning 14 this year. Like, isn't that wild? When I saw that I was like.
- [05:43]
Annemie Tonkin
Oh my gosh, the first, yeah, actually the first wedding I ever photographed, which happened before it was for a friend of mine and it was before I started my business officially. And officially she didn't pay me. So that worked out. But that was, she just posted because their anniversary is in December and she just posted that they were celebrating their 16 year anniversary and I was like, oh gosh, my photography business is old. So let's start talking about the concept of having operating a studio. Because I, I love the thing that I love about this. I had a studio for a period of time and it was actually, I was using it almost more as like a sales room and like a place to meet with my clients because I was still doing mostly either wedding at that time. It was like wedding work and on location family stuff. But I love sort of how your thought process around starting a studio is different really from a lot of people's.
- [06:40]
Michelle Lindsay
Well, so when I started diving into the world of studios, I was exactly like you. So I actually opened, I call it my studio pretty early on in like 2009. So I'd only been doing weddings for about a year, but I kind of knew I wanted to get a little bit into the more hands on, experiential piece of it. I wanted to sell products which is a very big piece of my brand and I feel very passionate about as a photographer. And so for many years I, my studio was exactly what you described. It was essentially a sales room where I would meet clients and show products to them. I did in person sales for a very long time. And the very first studio I ever built was literally in like, it was like an apartment. It was a hundred square feet of my living room, you know, and like a walk up apartment.
- [07:30]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah.
- [07:31]
Michelle Lindsay
And I completely decked it out with my, you know, photos and everything. And like when I look back at photos I'm like, oh my gosh, so embarrassed. But I mean at the time, you know, it was like I was at least, you know, I had a vision and I just, I Did it and I went for it. And then over the years, I would kind of like, I bounced around. So eventually I started renting, like, commercial space. And it wasn't until, I want to say, was it like 2012, 2013, when I had a space that I could actually, like, photograph in. But even then it was like, still really, really, really small. It had really low ceilings. So, like, any type of, like, lighting was just not really easy to do. I was always knocking into things. It was. It was in an old historic building, so I had these moms with strollers trying to navigate up the stairs with strollers. And it was. It was a good. It was a great, again, a great starting point. But I, like, kind of knew I wanted more. So I always knew I wanted to build, like, a studio. Like, I wanted, like the dream studio. And I had the vision from pretty early on, and I kind of just kept like chipping away at it and saving for it. And randomly one day, the. I was just driving and I knew that I wanted to get out of the current studio I was in because it was too small. It's the one that was way too small. And I saw a sign for commercial space for sale. And I, like, drove by and I kind of looked at it and I was like, well, this is interesting. And then, like, less than a month later, I had. I bought it. Which was kind of wild that it happened all so fast. But I just. I've been thinking about it and planning it for it for years. So when the opportunity came up and it was an empty shell, so it was the opportunity for me to build it from the ground up exactly the way I wanted it, which is the studio that I'm in now and my forever home. Yeah, but the studio now as it is, I still photograph in it a lot. But where I've really started to see the power of the studio is beyond photographing clients. It's allowed me to create this incredible experiential touch point for my clients whenever they come in, where I can design it exactly the way that I want them to feel about the photo shoot and about their photos. And I don't know if you would agree with this, but I have personally found that almost more important than the photos themselves, the way the clients feel about the experience of being photographed matters more. Like, you could take two photographers. One whose work is incredible and amazing, but gives a terrible experience, and a photographer who has mediocre images but gives a very personalized, high touch experience where the client feels so seen. And I feel like this the Photographer who provides that over the top experience is the one that's going to continue to see the repeat clients, the word of mouth, exposure, everything like that. So experience has always been a big thing for me. But the other area of the studio that has been really cool to start to utilize and grow more is using it for marketing purposes, hosting like client appreciation events here, creating content. Just having a space to like be able to go in and create content has been huge. So there's so many other avenues that I've been able to kind of like open up with how I utilize this space outside of just, well, a client books me and so now I'm going to do the shoot at the studio.
- [11:04]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. When I. So I've never owned, owned, owned a studio. I've had parts of my home that I created space for to shoot and, or use as like a sales room kind of a thing. But I have never had like a standalone building. But the first big studio that I had or the first real studio that I had was a rented space in sort of a shared space. And everyone in there were different kinds of artists and they participate. We participated in like a First Fridays kind of a thing where, you know, the first Friday of every month was an open studio kind of an opportunity. And just that one little thing brought me clients that for sure I never would have connected with because they were walking around downtown Durham and like stopping into the different places and then, you know, saw my work on the wall, got to sit and chat with me. And in a couple of cases I had those people reaching out years later like, hey, we just had a baby and I had your name in my whatever, like my Google Docs or something. Yeah, or I've been following you on Instagram ever since, so. So yeah, just that one little piece. I can definitely attest to the power that. Hang on guys, I have a quick message for you. Hey friends. Just a quick interruption. I wanted to take a minute to thank you as always for listening. If you're a new listener, I have a special welcome basket that I've put together just for you that includes three of my most popular actionable resources to help you build a more profitable, sustainable photography business. You can grab that@thiscantbethard.com welcome. But if you've been a long time listener, if you've been here for a while, I would really appreciate it if you could take a second to leave a review on Spotify or Apple or wherever it is that you're tuning in. Your support helps the show grow, reach More photographers like you and elevates the industry as a whole, no matter who you are or how long you've been listening. Thank you so much. And now back to the show.
- [13:10]
Michelle Lindsay
Yeah. And there, there is something about like the touch point of in person that is different than online. So, you know, I mean, you mentioned like, they, you know, they've been following. Following you online for years before they also reached out, but just they also had that like, touch point of.
- [13:26]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah.
- [13:27]
Michelle Lindsay
Seeing you in person. And I think there's a lot of power in that. I love, obviously, the online sphere. I think it's great and it's incredibly powerful for our. And I also think that combining that with in person, physical, kind of like connection experiences is such a compliment to that. And if there's ways that you can bring that into your business in addition to the online exposure, your marketing explodes.
- [13:57]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, yeah, for sure. And there's. I also think that in a business that is so competitive and there's, you know, there's a lot of people out there in the market, there are certain clients for whom having a physical space and sort of having that adds a certain amount of legitimacy or trust that is implicit in like, well, clearly this person has invested beyond just setting up a website. So I think that, you know, that's not to say that you can't build a thriving business without a studio. I haven't had a studio in years now, but it's definitely. I feel like because I had that early ish in my career, it was really helpful in kind of establishing that legitimacy earlier on than it might have been easy for me to do otherwise.
- [14:40]
Michelle Lindsay
Yeah, sure. Yeah, it's definitely. I mean, the clients walk in and they will often be like, oh, my gosh, it's so beautiful in here. Like, it does have a little bit of that, you know, that wow factor. So I agree with you on that. That I feel like it can add, if you're looking for that in your business, and it makes sense, it can add that little bit of legitimacy.
- [15:00]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah. So I'm sitting here talking about First Fridays, which is like a tiny little baby step in the direction of really utilizing a studio to its full potential. But you have gone many steps beyond that. If we think of our businesses like a wheel, your studio has kind of become the hub of your wheel and then you've got all these different spokes.
- [15:21]
Michelle Lindsay
Yes. So things definitely changed a little bit for me with my studio during COVID So when I first opened up the studio, it was my name on the door, like Michelle and Z Photography was in here, I was shooting in here. I had my computer in here at the time I had a part time employee I no longer do, but this was like where I worked out of. And a lot changed with COVID for obvious reasons. And I realized that I really kind of just wanted to use a studio for very particular, specific things. So if I was there for a client shoot, if I was hosting like a networking or vendor or client appreciation event, if I was, you know, recording marketing materials or content. And so the space was sitting empty and it felt like such a waste. And I started kind of thinking, like, beyond my uses for it and beyond also just my own personal need for it. Because I saw so many photographers, creative small business owners, who I would like talk to and they would be like, yeah, I'd love to do that, but I don't have a space. Yeah, I'd love to do that, but I don't have a space. And it kind of prompted this idea that, like, people need space and they need, in a sense, almost like, like blank space that they can come into and transform into their needs. And so I really saw both an opportunity for my business to diversify its income, but also to answer a real need that was in my community of small business owners and photographers for space to actually start propelling their businesses forward. Because I had seen such growth and elevation in my business and even just in my brand. Kind of what we were talking about before, like kind of that legitimacy of it. Yeah, that I knew that other businesses could come into the space if I rebranded it properly outside of, you know, my name and my photos on the wall and allowed them to come in and have their clients have that sort of like high end luxury experience that I was offering. And so that's actually what I did with the studio was I ended up taking my name off of it. I got a new sign. It went from Michelle Lindsay Photography to Studio at 428. I took my pictures off the wall, which was like the hardest thing, I bet. Yeah, I was gonna ask, but it needed, it needed, it needed to happen. It needed to happen. You know, it was a little slow going at first, but it's really started to pick up. And it has been so cool to see not just photographers, but creatives and other small business owners coming into this space and finally doing things. Like they will say to me, oh, my gosh, I have been wanting to do this thing forever and now I finally have a way to do it. So that's been really cool.
- [18:09]
Annemie Tonkin
So talk a little bit about some Examples of like, what are the things that people are using your studio for and kind of how does it work in this new life of the studio?
- [18:20]
Michelle Lindsay
Yeah, so we obviously have a very, like, there is a very big pool of photographers that rent it and they use it for their own personal photo shoots. And a lot of them use it for mini sessions because the space is pretty big. It's like 1100 square feet and it's got like this like really nice lounge area. So it's perfectly set up for bringing in, you know, multiple people and multiple shoots. So you can kind of have kind of clients over in the lounge area, like hanging out and waiting. And then it's got a shooting bay area with natural light. And so you can be like photographing on that side while your clients are kind of waiting over there. So we have a lot of clients, photographers using it for mini sessions. And then I also, in the holidays, always will put up styled sets for the photographer so that way they don't have to worry about, you know, going out and buying all of that and.
- [19:08]
Annemie Tonkin
Then setting it up.
- [19:10]
Michelle Lindsay
Yes. You know, it's. They can just walk in and have a beautifully styled set and just be able to easily provide that to their client, all just for like a low price of renting a studio. So outside of photographers, though, people have recorded podcasts here. I actually. One photographer, she's using it. I love how she's using it. She has started doing co working days for her clients. So she is a brand photographer.
- [19:35]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah.
- [19:36]
Michelle Lindsay
So she works. She works with a lot of small businesses, so she wanted to start bringing them together. So she's been hosting like, as kind of an appreciation to them, where she'll host these coworking days where they can come in and they can just kind of like talk and meet and it's great exposure for them. And then she'll usually do at the end just like this little extra thing where they'll all like create content together for their businesses. So I love that idea and how she's using that. We did a book launch here in the fall which was really, really cool. They did like their big book launch party, so that was really fun to see. I've had a couple of small businesses just do like, like client appreciat appreciation events, workshops, a lot of like different meetups and masterminds and things like that.
- [20:20]
Annemie Tonkin
It must feel so good as the owner of this studio to see it serving so many people so well. I feel like I think we all start out in our businesses because it's such an uphill climb to get to a place where we even have any breathing room to think about anybody but ourselves and our own businesses. It can be sort of hard to envision. But once you do get to that place of stability, you know, we all talk about this is kind of a lonely business and you're working by yourself other than the small amount of time, the small percentage of time that you actually spend with clients. And I feel like what you've done so beautifully over time with your studio is really sent, like create a sense of community and shared. It's the, you know, it's the rising tide in real life. Like that's, it's worked exactly like that.
- [21:08]
Michelle Lindsay
Well, first of all, thank you for saying that because it, like that's, that has always been my vision. And just to be blunt and honest with you, it's taken a few years to be able to like actually communicate that. I've had this idea for the studio and for this community for a very long time, but it, I. I just never could really communicate it. So to hear you say it back to me, just, it's, you know, just like the icing on the cake. But it's, I do feel like a very big driver for me in really moving this part of the studio forward, Opening it up to the wider community where I live was just to be honest, like Covid, because I felt very connected in the wedding photography world. Then I became a portrait photographer and I never really invested the time in finding a network of portrait photographers to connect with. I mean, I met a few here and there, but it just wasn't the same way that I was connected in the wedding industry.
- [22:09]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah.
- [22:10]
Michelle Lindsay
And then when Covid rolled around, I just felt like everything stopped and I just was sitting on this island alone and trying to make all these decisions, double triple guessing myself, thinking that my ideas, you know, weren't worth anything and that I was doing it all wrong and like, you know, going down the rabbit hole of like going on social media and comparing yourself. Right. And it just was not a good place. And I was like, there's got to be like a better way to do this than like all of us just sitting on our own island and trying to figure out how to do it on our own. Because any time I've seen my business propel and you know, over 16 years, I feel like there are very key turning points where I've been like, yes, I can point to that and say that was like a turning tide for me when it sort of elevated my business to whatever that next level was, you know, whatever. Whatever it was that I was trying to do. And the sort of defining factor around all of that was always having people around me to, like, bounce my ideas off of and support me. And so with the studio that really is kind of like in the photography community, the next rendition for the studio. So we actually, in the fall, just launched a photography collection. So it's a membership that photographers can join, and with it, they get hourly access to the. To the studio that they can use however they want throughout the year. So they can use it for client appreciation events, client shoots, mini sessions, things like that. But beyond that, it's meant to be a place where photographers can essentially share resources and resources, including the studio, but also resources like knowledge and education and ideas. We actually had one of our first meetups yesterday, and it was so cool to hear some of the photographers going around and they're being like, well, I have some. Some dresses. You know, can I bring them to the studio and I'll house them there and then anyone can use them. And that really has always just been my vision. I. When I look around, I see so many photographers working so hard by themselves. And I think that when we come together and we work together collectively, you move your business forward 10 times faster.
- [24:26]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, absolutely. All right, so let's talk about among the people listening. There's going to be a small number of people who own studio space, whether it's part of their home or, you know, a separate space. There are going to be some other percentage of people listening who have access to a studio space. Maybe they're a member of something akin to what you're talking about here. And then there's going to be the biggest proportion of people who have no idea, like, where they would even start with something like this. What would you say to those people? Maybe they're not even close to being able to purchase a building. But, like, where, you know, you started with an apartment, a space inside of your apartment. If you were starting back at the beginning, what would you be looking for? Or would you take it in a different direction?
- [25:14]
Michelle Lindsay
That is a really good question. To the best of my knowledge, when I started, because, I mean, you know, dating myself here, you know, 16 years ago. Sure, sure. You know, when I started my business, I. I honestly don't believe that there was as much access to studios as there is now. Definitely not. Because even outside of photography studios, like in our area, which I don't think I mentioned, I'm based in Northern Virginia, outside of Washington, D.C. there are, like, there are Even just like content creation studios. So, like you can use them for photography. But like, they're like, I think content creation because it's become so important, right, These sort of like places that you can come and create content, which is part of what, you know, Studio 428 is. It's just also has a community piece of it, but the access to that is greater. So back when I was getting started, I don't feel like that existed. I feel like the studios that I would have had access to would have been like sterile, techie type studios, which is the complete opposite of what my studio is. It's very, like, it's very approachable. It was designed with like, kind of like the client and the experience in mind. It almost looks like the lounge area almost looks like, you know, like you're walking into like an interior design showroom type thing. Right? Like, it has like that vibe to it. So I still think I would have done it the same way. I've actually never thought about that until you've asked this question. But I still think I would have done it the same way. Now, though, if I was starting today all over, because some of these options are available, I would absolutely find a space that I could start getting into to start utilizing for, even if it's for marketing purposes. So a lot of times when I'm talking to photographers and they'll be like, oh, your studio is so cool. Your studio's so cool. I just only do outdoor photography, right? And it's a valid point. It's a totally valid point. And there are so many ways to utilize a studio beyond just a client shoot. And when you really start thinking about those, that's when you start to see all of these other doors and even I would say, like, revenue streams start to open up for you that, you know, if you want that, that you can then choose to step through. So a lot of times we operate kind of like within our own four walls and we put on our blinders and we're like, this is what I do. I photograph families, you know, at Parks and Gardens, and I do mini sessions and things like that. And I'm just going to stay focused. I'm going to stay focused here. And if that completely fulfills you and you feel as though financially that is hitting the mark very easily for you and that, you know, you, you're not having to like ever say, oh, I kind of wish I, you know, I kind of wish I could pay myself a little bit more. I kind of wish my sales were a little bit Higher. I wish I had a few more bookings. Or for me even, honestly, you know what the studio does, it evens out my workflow. So that way, like my, my workload. So that way fall doesn't have to feel so chaotic because you can actually be shooting in like January and February and March. Maybe they're not your main genres, but. So all that to say that I think if you can remove the blinders and say, okay, I'm an outdoor photographer, but how could I use a studio space to either bring in new warm leads to maybe shoot some genres that I don't normally shoot in the off season? So that way I can take less families in the fall and maybe have a little bit more time for my family. Could I throw a client appreciation event? I mean, I, you know what I always think of for photography, Even if you're an outdoor natural light photographer, you. And let's pretend you're like, let's say you're doing families. Those families, the parents guarantee they need headshots.
- [29:08]
Annemie Tonkin
Absolutely.
- [29:09]
Michelle Lindsay
Like an amazing client appreciation event that you could throw. Hey, you're one of my top 10 clients. So I'm offering, I'm doing this day. If you want to come in to this, the studio space and I can do a professional headshot for you that you can use for LinkedIn or your business or whatever. Like what an amazing client add on and value boost for them. So I think just looking outside of a studio as well, I only shoot outdoors, so I don't need a studio space. I think if you can remove those blinders and the walls that you're operating in and say, but how could I use it? That's when you really start to see the power of a studio and just how it can help your business grow in different ways that you maybe didn't imagine.
- [29:53]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, so many people get stuck in their head about the cost of either, you know, purchasing, certainly purchasing a studio or even renting studio space where you're responsible for an entire lease. There are so many more opportunities these days, to your point, to participate in some sort of like timeshare kind of a situation in a studio like the one that you've set up. I think that for anyone who is worried about the cost, I get that. But sitting down and mapping out how you are going to, you know, knock the ROI on that investment out of the park, it's. There's just so many different opportunities and you know, it's like my head is just ping, ping, pinging with ideas here. This idea of having like a Headshot mini marathon type thing for as a client appreciation could be strictly client appreciation. It could also be a fundraiser like donate a hundred dollars to the, you know, whatever is something, especially if it's something local and important to your regular client base. They're going to love the opportunity to support that thing and get something that they need to get anyway with you cementing you as their go to photographer who they love and recommend and all those kinds of things. I mean, I just, I feel like the marketing potential all by itself, if you're creative enough about it, could cover that ROI and more. But you've got lots of ideas about this. I know we've talked about this and I think that you've turned that into a freebie, right?
- [31:26]
Michelle Lindsay
Yes. So I have a Freebie download on 10 different ways that you can utilize a studio to sort of boost your brand awareness and your sales. So you can download that online@studioour28.com backslash 10 ideas.
- [31:44]
Annemie Tonkin
Amazing. And it's just to be really clear, it's studio at 428, right?
- [31:50]
Michelle Lindsay
Yes. Not the hot sign studio 8.
- [31:52]
Annemie Tonkin
That will break your.
- [31:54]
Michelle Lindsay
I know.
- [31:56]
Annemie Tonkin
And we'll link it in the show notes, of course. So we'll, we'll make that available, but let everybody know where else they can find you. I know you've got a separate site for your photography work and I'd love to hear your Instagram.
- [32:08]
Michelle Lindsay
Yeah. So if you want to check out the studio online, the studio on Instagram is at Studio at 428. And then my photography business is Michelle Lindsay Photography. And on Instagram you can find me at Michelle Lindsay Photo.
- [32:25]
Annemie Tonkin
Love it. So good.
- [32:26]
Michelle Lindsay
Well, and Lindsay is spelled with. Lindsay is spelled with an A.
- [32:30]
Annemie Tonkin
You know, I was gonna jump into.
- [32:31]
Michelle Lindsay
That earlier with the name Lindsay.
- [32:33]
Annemie Tonkin
Yeah, it's like. And Michelle can be spelled different ways too. So you're. It's like me where I feel like I always have to spell everything out a hundred times. That's what links in show notes are for. So good. Well, it was lovely chatting with you. I do not have any doubt in the world that I'm going to be having you on again because we could have taken this a whole bunch of other directions as well, but. But we'll do that another day. This was wonderful and I am looking forward to checking out your. Your 10 ideas and comparing them to my 10 ideas. So well, have a wonderful day. Thank you so much.
- [33:07]
Michelle Lindsay
Oh, thank you so much for having me, Anime. I really appreciate it.
- [33:10]
Annemie Tonkin
That's it for this week's episode of this can't be that hard. I'll be back same time, same place next week. If you like the show, be sure to check out thiscan't bethard.com to explore all the resources we have for photographers. And of course, it would mean the world to me if you would leave a review of the show on itunes or Spotify. As always, thanks so much for joining me. I hope you have a fantastic week.