Aston Martin Bringing Manual Transmissions and V12 Engines Back! Ferrari Goes EV!

Summary

Podcast Summary: THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends!

Episode: Aston Martin Bringing Manual Transmissions and V12 Engines Back! Ferrari Goes EV!
Release Date: February 7, 2025
Hosts: Doug DeMuro, Ken, Filippo

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1. Tariffs and the Automotive Industry

[00:37 - 02:24]

The episode opens with a discussion on recent tariff announcements by the Trump administration. Initially, tariffs of 25% on goods from Canada and Mexico, and an additional 10% on Chinese imports were slated to affect the automotive industry. However, Filippo clarifies, "They actually said midday Friday that they would be announcing the tariffs on Saturday... but on Monday they rolled them back and they never went into effect" [01:10]. The hosts express concerns about the potential impact if tariffs had been implemented, noting that "an enormous number of cars are built in Canada and Mexico" [01:46]. Doug DeMuro adds, "It is hard to explain how significant of an impact this would have on the auto industry" [01:46], but ultimately, the tariffs were not enforced, aligning with their initial predictions.

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2. Aston Martin's Strategic Shifts

[02:47 - 07:03]

Ken introduces the first major news story: Aston Martin's recent strategic changes under their new CEO, Adrian Hallmark, who was formerly with Bentley [02:47]. Hallmark has decided to delay the release of Aston Martin's anticipated electric vehicle (EV), stating, "no, we're pushing that down the road" [03:17]. Despite this delay, Filippo mentions Aston Martin's collaboration with Lucid for engine purchases [03:20].

A significant focus is on Hallmark's advocacy for the return of manual transmissions and V12 engines. Ken highlights, "We need manual transmissions. He believes in the idea that he's seen Porsche's business model, what they've been able to do with that" [03:33]. Though Aston Martin had previously offered manual transmissions in models like the Vantage, these did not resonate well with the market [04:09].

Doug DeMuro critiques Aston Martin's position, stating, "Aston Martin has the same flaw as Jaguar and Maserati, which is they are not enthusiast brands. They are luxury brands" [05:06]. The hosts discuss the brand's challenges, including overproduction and lack of a dedicated enthusiast following, contrasting it with brands like Ferrari and Porsche [05:06].

Despite the criticisms, Filippo remains optimistic, suggesting that with the right marketing and car offerings, Aston Martin could carve out an enthusiast niche [06:32]. Ken echoes this sentiment, appreciating Hallmark's vision and hoping for exciting new models [06:46].

Doug DeMuro remains skeptical, recalling past attempts by Aston Martin to revive interest through special editions and manuals without significant success [07:03]. However, he acknowledges the potential positive impact of their racing ambitions, particularly with the Valkyrie [07:03].

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3. Aston Martin Valkyrie and Racing Ambitions

[07:54 - 11:10]

Ken shifts the conversation to the Aston Martin Valkyrie, an upcoming supercar powered by a naturally aspirated V12 Cosworth engine [07:57]. The team discusses Aston Martin's plans to enter the Valkyrie in racing events, including Le Mans, after extensive development testing [08:15]. Doug DeMuro reminisces about his experience driving the Valkyrie, describing it as "vibration city" with an engine that "revved to 15,000" [08:18].

The hosts highlight the resurgence of major manufacturers in racing, noting Ford's return to Le Mans and Ferrari's participation in Formula One [09:01]. They argue that such moves are essential for brands to regain their enthusiast appeal and market relevance [10:01]. The potential success of the Valkyrie in racing could enhance Aston Martin's brand image, making it more appealing to car enthusiasts [11:00].

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4. Ferrari's Shift to Electric Vehicles and Market Performance

[11:10 - 17:14]

Ken brings up Ferrari's announcement to launch their first electric vehicle on October 9th, noting the brand's move towards electrification [11:15]. Filippo adds that in 2024, 51% of Ferraris sold were hybrids, indicating a significant shift in their vehicle lineup [11:55]. Ferrari is targeting the Chinese market, which has a high demand for EVs, to expand their presence [12:12].

Doug DeMuro revisits his previous critique titled "Ferrari Lost Its Luster," clarifying that while Ferrari is experiencing record profits and increased car sales [12:42], his main concern was with their past business strategy of limiting sales to select clientele [13:03]. He explains, "Ferrari's point would be we're selling cars and making money through you... selling them to people who remember the old era" [17:14].

Filippo counters, suggesting that Ferrari's strategy of targeting new wealthy customers without strict exclusivity could still preserve the brand's prestige [14:16]. However, Ken expresses concern that Ferrari's broader sales approach might dilute their luxury and exclusivity, making them resemble brands like Maserati [15:27].

Doug DeMuro acknowledges the complexities, noting that a stronger presence in markets like China could help Ferrari maintain its brand value [17:14]. He emphasizes that while selling more cars to a wider audience can increase revenue, it might also risk undermining the brand's elitist image [17:12].

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5. Audi's Naming Structure Confusion

[19:55 - 22:43]

Ken introduces the next news segment about Audi's confusing naming structure [19:55]. Filippo explains that Audi plans to differentiate their electric and gas-powered vehicles by using "E-Tron" for EVs and "TFSI" for traditional engines [20:08]. Previously, Audi had attempted an odd-even naming system where even numbers denoted EVs and odd numbers indicated gas-powered cars [20:11]. This system led to inconsistencies and confusion, especially with multiple models like the E-Tron SUV and sedan [21:17].

Doug DeMuro reminisces about Audi's historical naming conventions, highlighting the shift from the simplistic A3, A4, A6, and A8 to more convoluted designations [20:50]. The hosts critique the lack of clarity in Audi's recent naming strategies, expressing frustration over the complexity and resulting market confusion [22:24].

Filippo and Ken agree that reverting to more straightforward naming, akin to Audi's original lineup, would be beneficial for brand identity and consumer recognition [22:39]. The discussion underscores the importance of a clear and consistent naming strategy in maintaining brand integrity and customer loyalty.

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6. Honda and Nissan Merger Talks

[22:51 - 24:38]

Ken brings up the recent, yet stalled, talks between Honda and Nissan regarding a potential merger [22:58]. Initially, Honda suggested restructuring Nissan, potentially making it a subsidiary [23:02], but Nissan's board rejected the proposal, leading to the collapse of merger discussions [23:02]. The conversation touches on Nissan's financial struggles, with rumors of impending insolvency if a merger doesn't occur [23:28].

Doug DeMuro speculates on the future, suggesting that without a merger, Nissan might face bankruptcy, and its assets could diminish in value [23:35]. Filippo points out that other Japanese manufacturers might be eyeing potential deals, but Honda's reluctance to take on Nissan's issues complicates matters [24:05]. The hosts agree that while the merger talks have fallen through for now, the automotive landscape remains uncertain, and further developments are expected [24:38].

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7. Car Gift Exchanges and Discussions

[25:28 - 35:31]

In a lighter segment, Doug DeMuro shares anecdotes about gifting cars to Filippo, including a Matchbox Chevy Blazer EV and a used Mercedes-Benz CLA shooting brake [25:35 - 26:23]. The trio humorously critiques these gifts, highlighting the impracticality and uniqueness of such presents.

Doug transitions to discussing his recent video on the Toyota 4Runner, referencing the mixed reactions from the community [26:27 - 29:22]. He defends the new hybrid 4Runner against criticism, comparing it to past generational shifts in other vehicles and predicting that enthusiasts will eventually appreciate the updates [28:05 - 29:22].

The conversation evolves into a broader discussion on enthusiasts' resistance to change in beloved models, referencing vehicles like the Land Cruiser and Subaru Outback. Doug emphasizes that such resistance is common across the automotive community, drawing parallels with past reactions to new car models [29:44 - 31:10].

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8. Market Report: Depreciation of Audi X3M

[35:53 - 44:54]

Ken presents the market segment focusing on the depreciation of Audi X3M models [35:53]. He notes significant drops in resale values, highlighting that a 2020 Audi X3M initially priced at $85,700 was sold for $44,500 [41:00]. Filippo corroborates this trend, mentioning similar sales figures [41:21].

The hosts discuss the implications of such depreciation, suggesting that it offers buyers an opportunity to purchase high-performance SUVs at reduced prices [42:00]. Ken appreciates the balance of performance and affordability, while Doug DeMuro praises the X3M's driving dynamics, asserting that it "handles well, it's fun to drive" [43:05].

They also touch upon the minimal differences between various X3M models in the U.S. market and the subtle design changes that may confuse average consumers but appeal to enthusiasts [44:12 - 44:54]. The segment concludes with a consensus that the Audi X3M represents a compelling value proposition for buyers seeking performance without the hefty price tag.

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9. Audience Questions and Discussions

[52:02 - 66:10]

The hosts engage with audience questions, addressing topics such as the transparency of auction sale prices and the possibility of racing their E39 M5 against Ken's vehicle [52:02 - 55:10]. Ken expresses disinterest in street racing, emphasizing safety and legality, while Doug DeMuro humorously contemplates future importations of high-performance vehicles [55:31 - 56:10].

A significant question revolves around the willingness to purchase EV sports cars. Ken firmly states, "EV sports cars don't have any... I want an engine. I want sound. I want vibration and emotion" [55:37], reflecting a preference for the traditional sports car experience. Filippo, however, is more open to EVs under specific circumstances, such as long road trips and improved EV sports car offerings [56:07].

Another audience question inquires about the future values of imported cars as import regulations ease [57:06 - 60:35]. The hosts predict varied outcomes depending on the model's popularity and desirability. Ken anticipates steady appreciation for iconic models like the Audi Z8, while Filippo is less optimistic about models like the R34 Skyline due to increased supply [59:02 - 60:35].

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10. Conclusion and Final Remarks

[66:06 - End]

In the concluding segments, the hosts recap their discussions, share humorous anecdotes about past car challenges, and emphasize the evolving nature of automotive preferences and industry trends [66:06 - End]. They encourage listeners to engage with the podcast through the Cars and Bids platform and promote upcoming features and content [70:00].

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Filippo: "They actually said midday Friday that they would be announcing the tariffs on Saturday... but on Monday they rolled them back and they never went into effect." [01:10]

• Ken: "We need manual transmissions. He believes in the idea that he's seen Porsche's business model, what they've been able to do with that." [03:33]

• Doug DeMuro: "Aston Martin has the same flaw as Jaguar and Maserati, which is they are not enthusiast brands. They are luxury brands." [05:06]

• Ken: "It's possible... I'm rooting for Aston Martin commercially and I'm rooting for them on the racetrack." [06:46]

• Filippo: "There are a lot of wealthy people." [14:16]

• Doug DeMuro: "Ferrari has not lost its luster. I apologize deeply for the folks who didn't understand the incredible nuance." [17:12]

• Doug DeMuro: "If the consulta really want to stay real, they're going to have to do classes of younger vehicles and maybe start thinking about moving up to a more modern era." [39:44]

• Ken: "EV sports cars don't have any... I want an engine. I want sound. I want vibration and emotion." [55:37]

• Filippo: "If there were a cool EV sports car, I don't need my daily driver to have four seats." [56:36]

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This episode of THIS CAR POD! delves deep into significant industry shifts, brand strategies, market trends, and community interactions, providing listeners with comprehensive insights into the evolving automotive landscape.

Transcript

[Doug DeMuro]

Ryan Reynolds here from Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail] Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month.

[Ken]

Required intro rate first 3 months only.

[Doug DeMuro]

Then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms at Mintmobile do. Hello and welcome to this car pod.

[Ken]

I'm Ken.

[Filippo]

I'm Felipe.

[Doug DeMuro]

And let's get into it, starting with the news. Ah yes, our first news story, tariffs.

[Filippo]

What's the new story?

[Doug DeMuro]

The news story is this. They didn't happen. Here's a funny story we had. We had a clip that happened to go up right when he was saying he would do the tariffs where we were like he's not going to do the tariffs. And people like this aged badly. Your guys are idiots. And then he didn't do the tariffs. We were right. All right.

[Filippo]

On Saturday the Trump administration announced they would put 25% tariffs on all goods from Canada and Mexico and 10% additional tariffs on all goods from China.

[Doug DeMuro]

It was midday Friday and it was a tough situation, but yes, that is exactly what happened.

[Filippo]

They actually said midday Friday that they would be announcing the tariffs on Saturday. So be careful. But then on Monday they rolled them back and they never went into effect. Now I will say there's a one month freeze.

[Doug DeMuro]

There's a one month freeze. I will say I don't know where this is going to go so I don't want to devote a lot of time to it. It is hard to explain how significant of an impact this would have on the auto industry. An enorm number of cars are built in Canada and Mexico. Enormous number, not just cars that you think of being Canadian and Mexican. Like, like the Bricklin SV1 and the MX.

[Ken]

They came first in my mind.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm talking about like real cars, most.

[Filippo]

Cars that you can think of as the best selling car.

[Doug DeMuro]

The Chevy Camaro built at least in.

[Filippo]

Part in one of those two places.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, that's the other thing. Then there's a lot of suppliers that are located down there. I read an article saying that the auto industry would stop in one week if those tariffs came into place.

[Filippo]

The big question mark and why we can't really speculate that much more is that even Once they were communicated to be going into place, there wasn't that much great actual guidance on how does this work, what is and is not exempt because there's always cars. And that was really clear. So there were a lot of estimates of what would happen. Car prices could go up 1 to $9,000. A lot of factory workers could be furloughed. Tariffs are on hold for a month. We'll see what happens in a month.

[Doug DeMuro]

It didn't happen in the end. And I still, consistent with what I said in that short, I still suspect they will not happen. It's just too damaging to the economy. And the stock market hated it. And current administration is really tied to how the stock market feels about their policies. And I have a suspicion they're just not going to let it happen, is my guess. We'll see, I guess. Okay, move on to our next news story, please. Ah, yes.

[Ken]

Ah, yes, Aston Martin. Now, this has been a very big week for Aston Martin. So those of you who are unfamiliar, a little while ago, they hired a new CEO, Adrian Hallmark. He came over from.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's this fellow.

[Ken]

That's this fellow. He came over from Bentley and he has. That feels right, some big ideas. So the first thing was that regarding their ev, which they said was going to come out soon, he said, no, we're pushing that down the road. Which is, again, not a surprise. We talked about it recently. A lot of manufacturers are doing this, but Aston Martin not only pushes, all enthusiasts go, yes, you know, just another win over an ev.

[Filippo]

Aston have an agreement with Lucid to purchase their engines.

[Ken]

So it's a little bit different. So like they. It was, yeah, they talked about that a little bit. They were doing some collaboration with Lucid, but they're like, yeah, push that down the road.

[Doug DeMuro]

The most interesting thing, though, that came.

[Ken]

Out of this, the most interesting thing was that the CEO, in addition to a bunch of other things, said we need manual transmissions. He believes in the idea that he's seen Porsche's business model, what they've been able to do with that. The 911R started in the ST and these special Porsches that have manuals. And he said, we need that. Now, admittedly, he had recognized that Aston Martin does currently make a manual transmission in the velour of velour, or however it's pronounced. But even he was like Harry Metcalf said, it wasn't very good. And I think he kind of felt the same.

[Doug DeMuro]

But he realized, he also said that they need to make more special versions of existing line cars, which is also in line with Porsche's business model. That's your GT3s, your GT4s, et cetera. Yes.

[Ken]

Car to take gets directly to the.

[Doug DeMuro]

911St and it's an interesting concept. Now I will point out Aston has tried this before. Like they did. Remember when they did like the limited run V12 Vantage with a manual and nobody really cared. Right. It wasn't like the GT3 where people are lining up down the block and people are posting on Renlist about how their spoiler tips are going to be in a slightly different color than the rest of their car.

[Ken]

While that is true, now cars are going more ev, which we'll tie into another story we'll get to in a minute. That's a good point.

[Doug DeMuro]

So here's them standing in their own.

[Ken]

Which is exactly, exactly what we said, that if, if, if Ferrari won't do it, somebody else should who has an exotic car brand.

[Doug DeMuro]

And if anyone is gonna, it makes sense for Aston too because they, I wouldn't want to say they have nothing to lose, but they're like, oh no.

[Filippo]

No, I'll say it. They have nothing to lose.

[Doug DeMuro]

They're not in a great spot. Like Ferrari is obviously gone in a different direction but is making a lot of money. Aston, like, you might as well give, give it a try.

[Ken]

Well, you know what, you know what Adrian Hallmark said? It's one of my favorite quotes. I have to get this exactly right. He said, my mission is to be the first CEO in 100 Aston Martin sustainably profitable, which is quite a. Ford couldn't do it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ford couldn't. I will say it's interesting over at Bentley, he obviously had a big impact. He made the. He gave the Continental GTA V8 decontented.

[Filippo]

That car sold many of them.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, I killed the Mulsanne. He's a traitor. No, it's an interesting idea, but.

[Ken]

Well, I think what the brand is Aston Martin. It is.

[Filippo]

They had a seven speed manual vantage, which was the only way to get a manual and an AMG engine and they still couldn't sell those.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's the thing. They did this. They had manual vantages up until a couple years ago and no one was buying them or interested in them or even really knew they existed.

[Ken]

I think it's. Well, from everything that I read, there are a lot of flaws with it. It wasn't implemented, that wasn't developed.

[Doug DeMuro]

Regardless, like I hate to say it, but Aston Martin has the same flaw as Jaguar and Maserati, which is they are not enthusiast brands. They are luxury brands. Like enthusiasts don't want them. People who want luxury things want them. You know what I'm saying? And so there's not like, this is why Astons depreciate like crazy. They overproduce the cars. They're not like cars that you and I line up to buy. It's not like Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche. It's not an enthusiast brand. Could they become one? It would take a lot of work and a lot of investment. They built a factory to build an SUV that now retails on the used market for $47,000.

[Filippo]

I think that there is a chance it could do it with the right cars, with the right reviews of those cars, with the right public perception, the right marketing. It is doable and it is filling a niche that you both have said that I don't care about, but that you both have said is a necessary one.

[Ken]

Yeah. Aston Martin, though, look, I appreciate the fact that I want to see what they're going to do, what his vision is. He said, admittedly, like these changes, some of these changes are going to come in the next year, year and a half where they're going to start implementing these things. But these special edition models will take longer.

[Doug DeMuro]

I also remember, remember when they made all those weird special edition vantages on that 06 body? And again, it felt more like lipstick on a pig than like a GT3R. Some of them literally had lipstick.

[Ken]

But think about. Yes, that is true. But think about how desirable that V8 Vantage actually was. How many of those they sold. The DB9, same thing. They sold tons and tons of those. So what happened? I think that the idea of following someone with a strong vision for what they should be doing and giving that a real shot is the way to go. It's what Andreas Pringer has done at Porsche. It's one guy that had a very strong.

[Doug DeMuro]

And I shouldn't be too fatalistic until they start implementing to see it happens. I just have seen them try it before. They did manuals, they did special editions. Neither had a big impact. And now they're in what I would consider to be a pretty rough spot.

[Ken]

They're in a rough spot, but if they make exciting cars, they make exciting cars. If Ferraris are silent in EVs and Aston Martins still have V12s in them, that's compounding.

[Doug DeMuro]

And on that subject, well, we're not quite there yet.

[Ken]

We're still on Aston Martins. The next news story has to do with the Valkyrie, speaking of 12 cylinder engines. So Aston Martin Valkyrie, it's this insane looking supercar. NA V12 Cosworth V12. So they have announced they're taking it racing and when I say racing, they're actually going to use a V12 engine on a racetrack which hasn't done that.

[Doug DeMuro]

Is that engine that's in the Valkyrie that I drove?

[Ken]

That's my understanding, yes. A race bred version of that engine.

[Doug DeMuro]

That engine seemed pretty race bred. Like you couldn't speak in the car or be in the car without earplugs. Yeah.

[Ken]

But I'm sure race car driver would get in and be like maybe.

[Doug DeMuro]

But dude, it was like vibration city and it revved to 15,000. I've never seen anything like that.

[Ken]

Yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

So they're going racing with a V12 in Le Mans.

[Ken]

Yeah. So their goal is to get to Le Mans. So it's going to debut later this month at Qatar or Qatar is where they're going to actually have the first time this car will debut on track. But they have a really big year set for it. They're also going to take place at the 12 Hours of Sebring and then their goal is to get to Le Mans. They've already done 9,230 miles of development testing with the car. What? Which is a lot.

[Doug DeMuro]

Someone drove that car 9,230 miles.

[Ken]

That's what they're saying. Since the car. Yeah, since the car was in testing in July of last year.

[Doug DeMuro]

I drove that car 11 miles from PCH to Newport coast, drive back down Newport coast, drive back down pch. And I decided I never wanted to get inside it again as long as I live. You know, this is an interesting story also because we're not talking about it today, but we should. Ford also announced this week or last week they're going back to Le Mans and what? Racing has had a resurgence. Ferrari's there now. Everybody's obsessed with Formula one. I honestly thought, and I don't like to talk about it because people already know I'm not a big motorsports guy, but I honestly thought there was a period in the late 2000s into the 2000s and 20s when racing maybe was like had had seen its peak and was kind of sunsetting and. And that's still kind of true in nascar, which is really. But Le Mans racing and Formula One are like the most popular they've ever been in their entire history. Yep.

[Ken]

I. For Formula One. Obviously it comes back to the marketing that Liberty has done with like the. The whole series on Netflix and like getting them back. But no, it's exciting and it's exciting to see real manufacturers, like storied manufacturers who have one in the past, do.

[Doug DeMuro]

This and that Ferrari is there and that Aston is there and that Ford's gonna be like, this is. These are. This is real stuff. This isn't like Audi just winning every year because they're the only ones who.

[Ken]

Tried with diesel power, by the way.

[Doug DeMuro]

Go by to be like, you know, it wasn't anything dominated for. No, I'm kidding. That was a lot. Audi, if you're listening, heck of a job. No, it really was. That was a serious effort. But this is now. It's like really competitive and legit. Everybody's back racing is like, return well and think of.

[Ken]

Yeah, just watching it next year, Ferrari battle Aston Martin. Like, it will be exciting.

[Doug DeMuro]

It will be cool to see these cars and to see these. Now they're trying to sell on the back of this stuff. Aston is essentially selling a street version of this car. I mean, that's pretty cool.

[Ken]

I mean, yeah, if the 60s all over again, if this car wins. I mean, imagine like, that is so cool. So I'm rooting for Aston Martin commercially and I'm rooting for them on the racetrack.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, and that's another thing. If the two tie in, right, like if this is a successful thing, then that brings enthusiasts interested into the brand and suddenly they have kind of something going here.

[Ken]

Yes. So it's possible.

[Doug DeMuro]

And suddenly Aston Martin becomes an enthusiast brand. Meanwhile. Yes, here are people putting together a Ferrari dashboard that goes inside an suv.

[Ken]

Yes. For the UK market. Potentially. It looks like it's a right hand drive, but anyway, Singapore.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let's go into Singapore.

[Ken]

Let's go into Singapore. So, yes, on the topic of Ferrari, they have announced that they are going to have their EV is going to launch on October 9th. They've picked a date. So that car that we talked about.

[Doug DeMuro]

A couple weeks ago, eight months from.

[Ken]

Now or a day to fear, as I do, because they said they're going to launch it in a quote, unique and innovative way, which means it will be incredibly cringy and very bizarre, just like Jaguar did. But it is interesting. So, you know, we knew this was coming. We saw testing about it a couple weeks ago. But on the topic of hybrids and electric stuff, Ferrari says that 51% of Ferraris they sold in 2024 were hybrids. That's the 2, 9, GTB and GTS. And then the SF, which is essentially.

[Doug DeMuro]

Their volume car, which is essentially their volume car, which.

[Ken]

So it makes sense.

[Doug DeMuro]

But is the sport utility vehicle hyper nav 12 but we know there will be a hypernav but in 2024.

[Ken]

Nav 12 so you know, take that. But I do take that.

[Doug DeMuro]

I drove one. It was great.

[Ken]

It was interesting. In reading this, I also read some more stats. So you know, the Chinese market is what they're targeting specifically, which has a huge appetite for EVs. So it makes sense that I suspect a lot of these Ferrari EVs will probably up going there. But that, but again like it's clear that this is like we talked about. This is a different Ferrari customer to the.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, to what I think I want to talk. I, I, we did, I did that whole segment on Ferrari's luster. Had they lost their luster and there was a lot of comments about that and I want to cover that maybe now, maybe later. Let's cover it now.

[Filippo]

Ferrari. Can I say one thing? Stock is up 8% since they released profit numbers early this week. They had $1.5 billion US in okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

I want to make a point here, I want to make a point here about my Ferrari lost its luster take. Because Ferrari's got record profits. Their stock price is like 7.8x from when they launched on the stock market. They're selling more cars than ever.

[Filippo]

They're killing, making more money per car.

[Doug DeMuro]

More money per car than ever.

[Ken]

13,752 last year.

[Doug DeMuro]

13,000 cars last year. They're obviously absolutely killing it. So I'm sitting over here with my Ferrari lost its luster take and there are some people who are questioning maybe the sanity of that takes. You know what, I want to amend that to two things. First off, about 70% of the people who watch that seem to think that I was complaining about the cars themselves. I don't care about the cars. They seem to be fine. I don't know. It's not what I was talking about. I was really specifically talking about their former business strategy, which was that they would sell a lot of cars to certain people just to get them out the door and then those people would then be invited to buy certain cars and that was like a big portion of their market. It seems to me that in the sense of that strategy, Ferrari has lost its luster. However, I also am starting to realize they're moving on from that strategy. They no longer care about trying to sell the same 12 cylinder models to rich guys so that those guys will buy the Enzos and that all those cars get sold and resold and everybody makes money. Ferrari doesn't care about that anymore. What I think Ferrari cares about is just selling cars to people, whoever they are. And I think we are going to see a situation where you don't have to be invited to buy a Ferrari or you don't have to have bought five other ones before, but you just have to be rich. And to be fair, maybe that's the way it.

[Filippo]

There's a lot of wealthy people.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep.

[Filippo]

Now there's a lot of income disparities increase. Even more wealth disparities have. That means there's a lot more people that can afford some caliber Ferrari. And also probably their base models are better than they once were. The 456, the California Portofino May. I'm going back in time for, for.

[Ken]

For our friends is a flagship model V12.

[Doug DeMuro]

I do think that. I do think that, yes, there are more rich people than ever. And I think Ferrari's sitting here looking at this and saying, why are we limiting production, limiting demand, and only selling cars to certain people who honestly will eventually age out? Like, why not just open it up to the whole world of rich people? Now, the drawback is the whole world of rich people includes some really tasteless, questionable. But I think if you're Ferrari, like, you're a public company, you're like, whatever. And so when I'm sitting here being like, they're not going to be able to sell 12 cylindries, now Ferrari's like, we don't care. We're selling them to other people. We're selling them to. We're selling them in China. We're selling them to people who have billions and don't care about how the waiting in line to get one. That was always Jay Leno's complaint. Now Ferrari's over here being like, screw it.

[Ken]

Personally, I've never liked the gatekeeping that they do. However, it does start to smell a little bit like Maserati when you see him everywhere. And it does lose its luxury.

[Doug DeMuro]

Their argument would be tough. You like the old ones, Play with the old ones. We're going to sell a lot of cars to a lot of rich people.

[Filippo]

You do have to be careful because you still need to be appealing as an automaker. You need to have some, like, scarcity. They're going push. They're pushing. They might push too far.

[Doug DeMuro]

One interesting thing that has happened that has allowed these automakers to really push it is Asia. So back in the day, you could only sell expensive cars in two places, the United States and Switzerland. That was it. And that was true from the 1940s until yesterday afternoon. Pretty much like, kind of seriously Asia has allowed all these companies to open up. They can pretty much double their volume. And nobody in Switzerland and America realizes. Right. We don't think that they're any less special than they ever were because we don't go to China and see them everywhere.

[Ken]

Last year, they put a 10% cap on the cars they were delivering to China. I suspect that number changes dramatically.

[Doug DeMuro]

They just increase it 10% every year and eventually 300,000 cars in China.

[Filippo]

What was your stat? 20% of their revenue came from purchasing.

[Ken]

Yeah. I found this. Yes. So options. If you ever look at a Ferrari window sticker, there's a little section that says there are some options and it says other. And usually it is an insane figure. 50 grand, 100 grand. I've seen $200,000 in options. Ferrari says that last year, 20% of their total revenue came from just options. Paint, colors, leather swatch, like leather.

[Doug DeMuro]

I mean, company doesn't.

[Ken]

It's a different Ferrari.

[Doug DeMuro]

Seats are $2,500 extra on a Ferrari. They're standard on a RAV4 hybrid.

[Ken]

Car play, I think 49 car play.

[Doug DeMuro]

Like, yeah, of course they made a lot of money, but surely the profit.

[Filippo]

Margin is quite significant from that too. And you can tell people to do it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Also, the dealers won't let people order base cars. They you walk in, you say, I want a Nicki Minaj super base.

[Ken]

Nice.

[Doug DeMuro]

They say, get out. They say, we get. You got to put 100 options on this car to hit quotas. You got to do it anyway, the point is, Ferrari has not lost its luster. I apologize deeply for the folks who didn't understand the incredible nuance.

[Ken]

In my opinion, I'm concerned about their luster.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm concerned about their luster. But I think Ferrari's point would be we're selling cars and making money through you. Specifically you. Specifically guys like you who remember, like the old era. I think specifically they don't care about guys like you. They're saying, we got new people who have new money. They want cars, we'll make them for them.

[Filippo]

And also in the long run, we're all dead. So they don't need to sell cars forever.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ferrari also another thing. That's another thing that's important about Ferrari and specifically the EV and the Asia thing is Ferrari's name is not as strong in China. And so they got to get these cars in the hands of billionaires.

[Ken]

Is it not?

[Doug DeMuro]

All the western brands names are not.

[Ken]

The most globally recognized brand in the. I mean, I don't think it's weak.

[Doug DeMuro]

In China, Porsche, all these brands do not, you know, they sell like, 2, 9, 11 a year in China. Like, they, they're, they're not as interested in our Western status symbols quite as much as we are. They got to send those cars out and get those cars in the hands of Chinese.

[Filippo]

They need to make them visible.

[Doug DeMuro]

They got to make them visible. And so let's sell, sell, sell.

[Filippo]

And they have. Now, will they go too far?

[Doug DeMuro]

We'll find out.

[Ken]

Yes, they will.

[Doug DeMuro]

He already thinks they've gone too far.

[Ken]

I know they're going. There's absolutely no question. They're just like the old ones. Just give me my old ones and continue to supply parts for them because they were built like garbage back then.

[Filippo]

Just to throw it out. Had you bought their stock in 2015 thinking they would improve, you'd be right. They're up 723%.

[Doug DeMuro]

As we all know, wearing pants sucks. I'm a shorts guy, but I've worn shorts at times when pants probably would have been the better option. Pants really are unavoidable, even for me. It's February, it's cold outside, and you deserve to be comfortable in whatever you're wearing, no matter what you're doing. That's where public rec comes in. Their pants are a game changer. Designed to be as comfortable as your favorite sweats, but way more stylish. We're talking about super soft fabric, no stiff seams, and enough stretch to keep up with whatever your day throws at you. And public rec isn't just about pants. They have so many great style options. Whether you're working all day in the office, running errands, or just grabbing a meal with your friends. Who doesn't want to look sharp without sacrificing comfort? And I tell you, once you put them on, you're going to wonder why you ever wore anything else. Whether you're hanging out with friends, working on a car, or driving something with very tight sport seats, or just walking your dog, these pants have you covered. So this February, treat yourself right because comfort is always in season. Upgrade to public rec and feel the difference. And for a limited time, you can get 20% off at public rec by using the code cars at checkout, just go to publicrec.com, use the code cars, and you're all set. And when they ask how you found them, be sure to mention our show. It really helps us out. Find your perfect fit and never compromise on comfort again. Public wreck where comfort rules. All right, next news story. Audi. Here's a picture of Audi's lineup.

[Ken]

It's a sea of grayness 2000. Every car is gray.

[Doug DeMuro]

2015, 2015 ish 15 because I think pre checking. Okay, what is the news story? Yeah. All right.

[Filippo]

Kevin, you obviously are very familiar with Audi current naming structure.

[Ken]

Yes, it's one of the easiest to follow.

[Filippo]

A year or two ago they announced they were changing it and all EVs were going to be even numbers and all gas powered cards were going to be odd numbers. The A5 and the A4 were going to be gas and electric version each other. They've walked that back and now they will. All electric cars will have E Tron after them and all gas cars will have TFSI after them. But that means that they were about to reveal a new new A7 which was not going to be the. The hash bracket once was it's gonna be the A6 but gas powered. But now that will let me give.

[Doug DeMuro]

You a little history. When I was a Kid, Audi had three products. The 80, there was the 9, the 8 there will. Well there was the 90, the 100 and the 200. The 100 and the 200 were just trim levels of each other. So the 90 was a completely different car.

[Filippo]

Yep.

[Doug DeMuro]

A guy named Johan Dineshen came in 1996, renamed the Whole thing. You know what he did? A Ford A6, A8. It was so simple. It's so simple in fact that every other brand since then has been trying to copy it. Right? Including CT4, including himself and other like Infiniti and Cadillac. But all these brands try to copy it. Audi with the names in the last few years. Remember the 55, 35 which I based on nothing.

[Filippo]

It was, that was their like the trim designation. It was no longer 2.0t.

[Doug DeMuro]

It was 45 relative to other engines in the market. So then they, they didn't even launch that in the U.S. because the U.S. product planners were like that's the dumbest.

[Filippo]

Thing I've ever heard did. But nobody talks about it.

[Doug DeMuro]

They launched in the US on like one model.

[Filippo]

The Q7 had that designation.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, they launched in Canada, it was all over Europe and the Middle East. Anyway that ended. Then they did Q4, Q6, A4, A5, A7. The odd and even thing. It was okay then. Remember when they came out with the E Tron as their electric car, Then they realized they had to come out with other cars called E Tron. So they had an E Tron SUV and an E Tron sedan. But then there was also a Q4, E tron.

[Filippo]

Yep.

[Doug DeMuro]

Horrible. Yep. How did they screw this up so bad?

[Filippo]

I think they're going back to their roots a little bit because there will be the A4, the A6.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know what, this is just another example of what you said. Ferrari bring us. You know what, Just give us back the 2015 lineup. We loved it.

[Filippo]

Can you do me one good look at it?

[Doug DeMuro]

R8.

[Filippo]

Can you name any car here that's not the R8? Just like point to it and name it a 7.

[Doug DeMuro]

TT.

[Ken]

That looks like a 8 or something.

[Doug DeMuro]

6. That's the problem. That was part of the problem.

[Ken]

S5.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's an A4, by the way. Away.

[Ken]

S5. Is it the Allroad?

[Filippo]

Yeah, all done.

[Ken]

Q7, Q5, Q3.

[Filippo]

Well done. You only got a couple wrong.

[Doug DeMuro]

It is weird that they did A three, A four, A six, A eight. They did it just to mess with Canon. Okay, bring us our next news.

[Ken]

They got me in the end.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ah, yes, a Nissan Altima and a Honda Accord.

[Ken]

Must be Filippo.

[Doug DeMuro]

That looks like a still from a Straight Pipes video. Love.

[Filippo]

Love you Straight Pipes.

[Doug DeMuro]

All right.

[Filippo]

A few weeks ago we talked about how Honda and Nissan had kind of agreed to merge in some way. Details, tbd.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes.

[Filippo]

Turns out those details will forever be TBD because they've basically said they're not going to do.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't think they're forever be tbd, it sounds like.

[Filippo]

So what happened was Honda said, hey, Nissan, you need to figure out your restructuring and have a really good plan for that, but what we can do is make you like a subsidiary of Honda. And Nissan was like, no, we're not going to do that. And they were apparently quite offended by what Honda was implying and did not want to be a subsidiary. So Honda, or so Nissan had said that they're not interested in merging anymore.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, now remember though, the rumors around this when it first was announced was that the Japanese government was pushing it. Yes, they still are. So. But I don't know. So if they still are, maybe they come back to the negotiating table at some point soon. Remember Nissan? Also, the other thing that was, the other thing that was announced around the same time was Nissan said they were going to run out of cash this year.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but they've stated the board, the Nissan board has stated pretty unequivocally, presumably with a lot of pressure from Renault, that has a majority stakeholder of Nissan, that they do not agree to anything that Honda has proposed. Well, that they're not happy.

[Doug DeMuro]

They'll be not agreeing to anything right until bankruptcy, insolvency, and then the entire value of the company will be in their corporate headquarters in Nashville.

[Filippo]

Right.

[Ken]

I don't even.

[Doug DeMuro]

Whatever that's worth. $47 million. Some commercial real estate broker is going to sell Nissan in three years. And Honda, dude, I'm telling you, they can say whatever they want. This is happening. Mark my words.

[Filippo]

I don't know that you actually get agreement to do it. There are other Markham manufacturers, which is.

[Doug DeMuro]

A city in Ontario.

[Filippo]

There are other deals that I think the Japanese government would not be very open to, but would be a better fit for Nissan in their current ideation.

[Doug DeMuro]

Something's going to happen here.

[Filippo]

Something's going to happen. But Honda doesn't really want to take on Nissan's issues. Nissan isn't thrilled by being said, hey, you have issues. And so here we are.

[Doug DeMuro]

Something's going to happen here. We all know Nissan has issues. The only cars they sell are to rental fleets and people with bad credit. They haven't come out with a good car. When. When was the last time? Name it.

[Filippo]

Nissan sells 3 million cars a year globally.

[Doug DeMuro]

2.4 million of them are sold to Europe Car and Avis and Enterprise and Hertz. Yeah.

[Filippo]

And Honda sells about a million cars more a year.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but they don't sell the fleets at all.

[Filippo]

Correct. But I think that Honda has realized as they're doing some diligence that Nissan's at a tough situation and they can't be trusted to govern themselves is what I think Nissan said.

[Doug DeMuro]

What?

[Filippo]

What Honda is saying. And by the way, it sounds like I'm just saying that that's.

[Doug DeMuro]

So Honda's out here saying Nissan can't govern themselves. And the Nissan board says we don't want any part of you. Yeah, this sounds like it's going to go well. All right. I'm telling you, though, this ain't the last you heard of this news. Oh, agreed. Move on to the next segment, which is talk about cars. Okay, I have three important talk cars segments today. Four, actually.

[Ken]

He has been frothing at the mouth Cars segments.

[Doug DeMuro]

One of them was Ferrari Luster Revisited, which we already talked about.

[Ken]

Okay, check that one off.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. The second one, I have a present for Filippo. Oh, I got a present for. I was at the store. That's so cool. I was at the store the other day and you know how I always. We always. We like the exotic cars. You know, I got Filipo his version of an exotic car. No way. It's a Matchbox Chevy Blazer ev.

[Filippo]

I'm thrilled with moving parts.

[Doug DeMuro]

This will undoubtedly be the worst selling Matchbox car in history.

[Filippo]

No, it was in the best movie.

[Ken]

This worst.

[Filippo]

Don't forget it was in the Barbie movie before it came out.

[Doug DeMuro]

Now for you, I also got.

[Filippo]

I'm so thrilled.

[Doug DeMuro]

This is another really happy surprise. A Mercedes Benz CLA shooting brake. Now, I want to be clear about two things. Number one, this is a 2020 model used. Number two, this is not the AMG. This is a CLA 180D. Good. All right.

[Filippo]

I'm so. I'm honored by both of these gifts.

[Ken]

Thank you. Threw it at him.

[Doug DeMuro]

I was at the store. I was at the Target. There.

[Filippo]

Designed for a lifetime, unlike the cla.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think that model's actually already cancele. They brought a shooting brake to the new cla.

[Filippo]

No.

[Doug DeMuro]

So this is a Europe only base model and a. And a car that nobody wants. Chevy Blazer ev. Hey, do you think that's the front wheel camera welder? Do you think that's the front wheel drive Blazer ev? The all wheel drive Blazer ev or the rear wheel drive Blazer ev?

[Filippo]

That's a really. I'm going to open it up and find out.

[Ken]

Wow. He's going to ruin all the money.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, while you open it, I want to move on to my next car segment which is the 4Runner video I posted. I love the 4 run new Forerunner. Fantastic automobile.

[Filippo]

Much better.

[Doug DeMuro]

Fantastic automatic.

[Filippo]

Per your review.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wonderful car. I posted a video saying this and boy was there some complaints. If you read the comments of this 4Runner video, it's everybody is like, I will keep my 5th gen. Thanks. This is the worst thing. Can't believe they got rid of the V6. It's the worst thing they ever did in the world. And I just want to say to all the folks out there in Forerunner land who are haters, two things. Number one, I was a kid when the 4th gen and the 5th gen came out. And I remember that they were hated when they came out. The same level of hate that this thing has now. The 5th gen came out. Everybody said it was ugly, too advanced, too big, and it lost the V8. Everybody thought it was the crappiest crap that had ever crap. And now people are like, oh my God, I can't get my 5th gen up. Same with the 4th gen. No, got rid of the 3rd gen. The 3.4. The greatest engine in the history of cars. Can't believe you cut out the 4 liter. This is a horrible thing. Why would you do this to us? Mark my words. Here's more word marking. Oh, in 20 years people are going to be like, like this hybrid Forerunner. I'm clinging to it. I'll never give up my hybrid Forerunner.

[Filippo]

I agree.

[Doug DeMuro]

This is just how these people are and the comments are vicious. And I just want to be like, you have no concept. Part of the problem is that the Forerunner people, they stay in their own four Runner lanes. And so they don't realize that this happens because it's every 10 years that a 4Runner is redesigned. They don't know that. In other words, I post videos about new. Yeah, but I post videos about new cars all the time. And I see this complaint all the time. And I've actually been doing this long enough that I've now gone into some second generations of cars. Like I reviewed the previous one and now I'm on the new one and you get that complaint. Like I remember people hated the one I first reviewed and now they hate the new one and said they love the one I first reviewed. It's hilarious. And so that's just, they just have to be just cool with it. They just have to get there. Now one of the other complaints, people like you hated this, the Land Cruiser, but you like the 4Runner, especially the powertrain. The powertrain is much better suited to the 4Runner. For one thing, it's cheaper, cheaper than the Land Cruiser and also it's smaller. And so those two things make the four Runners hybrid four cylinder, a lot more tenable than the powertrain. And the Land Cruiser, where you're paying more and getting a more taxed, struggling vehicle. I love the 4Runner. I think it's great. And I think I am absolutely confident in saying this because I have no doubt that the 4Runner community will come around to this. Like zero doubt in my mind. I've been there. I've been through all of these.

[Filippo]

The revisionist history around some cars is wild.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's wild.

[Filippo]

The FJ Cruiser, not a popular automobile.

[Doug DeMuro]

And now it's such a Ford. Toyota never should have canceled this. I remember when it came out and everybody complained, why isn't it more like the actual fj? This is a cartoonish car. It's so stupid. They could have made it more like practical and instead it has these stupid doors and now it's all anybody wants.

[Filippo]

Now A low mile FJ Cruiser is like 100 grand.

[Doug DeMuro]

It is. That is, that is accurate. There is so much revisionism. Even. You know the other funny thing, when I was a kid, there were cars like the camry, the like 90s Camry. And every. All enthusiasts agreed they were the Crappiest, stupidest. Like when the RAV4 first came out. And now enthusiasts are even getting into those. Like, oh, this was like og. It was like my childhood. And it's just like, I remember when everyone hated this crap. Okay, I'm never giving a gift on the air again.

[Filippo]

I love this gift so much. Also, based on this, it is a front engine at the very least. Interesting. I love this gift very much. And I agree with your point fully, but which is rare.

[Doug DeMuro]

We usually disagree on this. Wild. There is so much revisionism. So much. I remember when, in 98, when the Land Cruiser went to a V8 that was absolutely vilified in the press. A V8. A Land Cruiser. Can't believe they would do this, ruin everything. Because the Land Cruiser up until that point had been a six cylinder. Like, since it came out, it was a six cylinder. That was like part of its DNA. It was always a straight six in every iteration, every version, it was a straight six. And then, oh, it's a V8. And then, of course, now, God forbid they make one without a V8.

[Ken]

As enthusiasts.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Ken]

I don't. As enthusiasts. Think of you. Yeah. We are a fickle bunch. That's true. But I try to keep an open mind. Not when it comes to EV Ferraris, but I try to keep an open mind. Generally.

[Filippo]

I'm excited for when the next M5 is a four cylinder, too.

[Ken]

Oh, I've given up on the M5. It weighs more than a. I will.

[Doug DeMuro]

Say, you actually raise an interesting point, which is if I. If my whole life was forerunner, I would like, like your whole. Like, you're. You're so into M5 that, like, you've had to come to terms with the fact that it isn't what it once was. If my whole life was forerunner, would I. Would I still make the same argument, like, kind of dismissing their concerns? Maybe not. But I know. I know as a point of fact, because I have been here before, many times. They will come around.

[Ken]

Yep. I mean, another example is the M3, the current. Like, a lot of people have come around on the song, and I've heard many of my friends say, it's like, you know, it doesn't bother me more.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's like, Yep, yep, interesting.

[Ken]

Exactly as I. You and I said, you're gonna see.

[Doug DeMuro]

These four runners out on the trails. You're gonna see. You're going to see a modded. You're going to see what they can do. And people are going to be like, these are great. And people are also going to See that This, this hybrid powertrain is actually pretty good. And it honestly and truly is because I know because I have one in my sequoia and.

[Filippo]

Different engine.

[Doug DeMuro]

Different engine, but the same, it's the same complaint. They, they went down in cylinder count and up in hybrid count. And that's a, that's a pansy thing to do. That's what people say. And it's like there's no replacement for displacement. It's like my car's 550 pound feet of torque. Let's go. Let's do a towing competition right now.

[Filippo]

I'm also excited for you all to come around to the new Countach soon.

[Ken]

Oh, I like it.

[Doug DeMuro]

God, that's the worst thing that ever happened.

[Ken]

To be honest with you. I think the rear three were so cool.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know how Mercedes gull wings or Porsche 959s have typically always been valuable and will continue to go up in value. It's kind of similar to gold, which is why we've partnered with a company called acre Gold. Financial experts and big banks agree the value of gold is climbing new heights in 2025 and beyond. So how do you get in? Buying gold can feel complicated and expensive, but acre Gold subscriptions make it easy and affordable. With subscriptions from 30 to $250 per month, Acre Gold makes gold ownership a reality for every budget. How does it work? Well, make automatic monthly payments into your stash until you reach the price of an acre gold bar. Once you pay for your bar, Acre gold discreetly ships it to your door. Markets go up and down, but gold has stood the test of time. It's real, it's solid, and now it's easier than ever to own. Secure your wealth and take control of your future. Start [e-mail] on the subject of the new K. My last talk car segment is the future of concours. Okay, so I submit my Courier GT to the La Jolla Concorde elegance. It's a great story. La Jolla Concorde elegance, which is a concours event held here in San Diego and people wear hats and such, but it's not me. It's kind of like a middling, like it's not like a prime event on the concours show circuit, let's say.

[Ken]

No, certainly not much smaller.

[Doug DeMuro]

And it's smaller and it's like less prestigious on it. And proven by the fact that a couple years ago when Kennan debuted his showed his Ferrari, he was parked next to a 348 that was missing Its door panel.

[Ken]

Right. And I was. I was afraid that Mike. I didn't have my car judged because I was afraid it would not meet concourse standard. And the car next to me, this. The seat looked like a. Like, a topical map of, like, Sahara. Like, it was just so cracked and, like, just like, it was true.

[Doug DeMuro]

This isn't just Kenner being a snob by the.

[Filippo]

This.

[Ken]

I mean, like, genuinely, it was.

[Doug DeMuro]

It was a driver, but it was, like, a rough car.

[Ken]

I know the people own the car. They're lovely, but they know it's a beater. And they were, like, stunned.

[Doug DeMuro]

As I recall, I finished third.

[Ken]

You did, because there were, what, like.

[Doug DeMuro]

Five cars in the class, and you chose not to be judged.

[Ken]

Zino. A TestaRossa in that 348. And I easily think I would have been, like, close with the Testarossa. Sorry, Fernando, but it was close.

[Doug DeMuro]

So, anyway, I submit the Courrero gt. So last year, I submitted the Countach. It won an award. Kevin prepared it.

[Ken]

Yes, I prepared it very proudly. And we won the Chuck Spielman Preservation.

[Doug DeMuro]

Award because it's such an original car, which it is, honestly. We painted the wheels a couple of days before the concourse.

[Ken]

But other than that, they love the stickers, though.

[Doug DeMuro]

So anyway, so everybody came up to me at the concourse last year and said, hey, where's the Courier gt? Where's the Cruise gt? I said, hey, I'll bring it next year. So I submit it, and they say. They call me and they say, hey, it's 350 bucks to submit a car. They say, hey, we can't take it because it's not 25 years old. Well, it's 22. And also, it's not like this is Pebble Beach. So I'm like, all right, well, fine. They said, but, hey, you can submit it. There's a parking lot show that you can submit it to for the same price. And I said, no, I'm not going to do that.

[Ken]

Well, to be fair, there. It's the road that goes up in La Jolla. It's like, it's. It's. It's not. It's a very. It's not just a parking lot somewhere.

[Doug DeMuro]

But anyway, and they. And I knew things were going to go bad when they called me, and they were like, we heard. We saw you submitted your GT Carrera. These are old. These are Duesenberg guys. They don't know what that car is.

[Ken]

You know, they like auburn speed tails.

[Doug DeMuro]

They like. They like a good boat Speedster. Yeah, that's. That's what they're out here. They're looking for the chrome. Dude, if I had a Stutz Bearcat, I'd be front and center. They'd have made a Stutz Bearcat class for me. So anyway, anyway. So anyway, they said, no, you can't submit it. I said, well, you know, I think the audience might like it. And they said, still said no. I said, all right, well that's fine. And I got a refund and I'm not going to show it because I can't. But, but, but I. One of the things I, I thought about, about this, this whole experience, which I found, I. I don't really care. I mean, I'm going to go anyway, just not with a car. I just found it kind of amusing. But one of the things I thought about, about this thing was the, the Concour's events and their future Concours events primarily focus on Chrome, big 30s, 40s cars, some 50, 60 stuff, but. And at the Monterey Car Week, where you have probably the most prestigious Concours event in the world, the Pebble Beach Concours d'elegance, tickets are on sale and they're just generally available. Like you could go online right now and buy it $495. Meanwhile, the quail event that week, which is all about modern supercars and hypercars and Paganis and Carrera G and Mark 4 Supras. I wish. No, like real stuff. They would look at a Mark IV Supra and say, excuse me, like real stuff. Like all the hottest, like craziest Pagani Utopias and Bugattis and all that stuff.

[Ken]

And stuff debuting too?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes, that event sold out in four seconds and tickets cost $1,800. And I'm sitting here thinking to myself, is this indicative of where the hobby is going? Like, are the young people, Are the Concours events gonna start to sunset? And when they say no to a Carrera gt, is that like. But, but, but you see how Quail succeeds with those types of cars. Is this the future of the Concours? Like, are we. Is, is this is our generation finally having its moment?

[Ken]

I'm hesitant about it. I think they're. I think that what Concours need to do to stay relevant is to have younger classes, which Amelia island had made a point of that they did. In fact, they have a best of show pre war, best of show post war. So there are two cars.

[Doug DeMuro]

The younger classes, the young, now granted, 100 years old, right now granted, the.

[Ken]

Younger class, the one last year I think was a 250lm.

[Doug DeMuro]

But you are right. You are right because I've been to that Amelia and they have several classes. 40s are being shown. I judged, I awarded an award to a 1995 Cadillac. Right.

[Ken]

That ended up looking an awful lot like an Espada or mirror.

[Doug DeMuro]

But no, you're exactly right at Amelia. They realized because like hey, we're going to start losing these young people. Let's add newer classes. But that's kind of my point though, right? If pebble beach doesn't make that switch now. Pebble beach is the most prestigious of them. They probably don't need to do that anytime soon. But smaller concours events, you're seeing it though.

[Ken]

I mean they had McLaren F1s on the lot last year. So you're definitely seeing that. I do, yeah. I definitely worry about some of the longevity of these events. But also a lot of events concour ish things have popped up recently like the odd train is doing an amazing job and they invited me to judge their young timers class. Although it rained and they had to cancel.

[Doug DeMuro]

But the fact that they had that kind of proof though of what I'm saying.

[Ken]

Exactly. So I think that all concours will go that way.

[Doug DeMuro]

What I think people don't realize about concours events is that they kind of cut off in like the 60s and never really expanded beyond that. Like. Like pebble beach back when it was back in the day used to be for brand new vehicles and people would bring rebodied. Like not rebodied but cars in the period that had a body had been created by some showman and it would show up there and it was like this. Nobody had seen it before. It was incredible. Like in the 40s and cars like that would win best in show and then they hit a wal and kind of stopped accepting cars past a certain year. Not accepting but winning. I mean every car that wins is.

[Filippo]

30S, 40s, 50s again just like California smog exemptions.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh man. 50 year old cars are not smog exempt. 50 year old cars anyway. And I have a suspicion that if the concurs really want to stay real, they're going to have to do classes of younger vehicles and maybe start thinking about moving up to a more modern era.

[Ken]

Yeah, I don't disagree.

[Filippo]

How does the quail justify its 4x price?

[Doug DeMuro]

Because it sells out. They should. They should charge 5x, they should charge 10x. It sells out. I'm not joking with you. It sells out in a day. Like the way they justify it is they literally have no more space and every year they've bumped the ticket price by like 50% and they still sell out in a day.

[Ken]

I think two years ago it was 800. Last year it was 1200. This year it was 1600.

[Doug DeMuro]

1600. And that tells you where the people want to go and what the people want to see in my opinion.

[Ken]

And I believe it was sold out. Yeah by like 2:30 in the afternoon.

[Doug DeMuro]

Gone.

[Ken]

Gone. All tickets including for standby and stuff. So yeah it wow.

[Doug DeMuro]

Then people are selling them on stump up for like three grand. Meanwhile again you could right now you could go on to the Pebble Beach Concord website and just buy a ticket, walk up, buy a ticket. 500 bucks general admission. It's a different world.

[Filippo]

Different world.

[Ken]

It certainly is. But I look forward to going to concourse events and seeing how they evolve in the future. I love seeing all the I, I'm the person who still walks through the pre pre war cars in those like.

[Doug DeMuro]

Free 16 and would you.

[Ken]

I'd love to have a pre worker.

[Doug DeMuro]

You'd love to have a chrome thing? Yeah. Do you with. With the Hyuga horn?

[Ken]

Yeah. I'm. I mean personally I'm a Packard guy so like. But I still have an hooga horn. Okay. I love a Packard.

[Doug DeMuro]

Those were our top car segments. We're going to move on to the market report. I have nothing to say in the market report but Kenan has a lot. Kenan, let's talk X3.

[Ken]

Okay. Yes, let's start. So recently I was you know just kind of scrolling through cars and beds. I've been thinking about getting an SUV myself and I noticed that X3M are coming down in value. We sold this one for 44,500. Now this one had 36,000 miles on it. It's a 2020 model and I think this has the window sticker or a Monroe label that said that it cost 857 new.

[Doug DeMuro]

This is an $86,000 car. It's also doesn't have 550 horsepower.

[Ken]

Yeah, 500 horsepower. X3M competition. It's like that's a lot of. Now I realize they're going to continue to go down in value but that's a lot of car. And this is very good looking and it's modern.

[Doug DeMuro]

Like this car's not going to have reliability issues for at least least two to three years.

[Ken]

At least two to three months. No.

[Doug DeMuro]

But really though like this is an impressive situation. I agree. 85 sticker. 4 years ago the personally drove 36,000 miles this has real modern day performance.

[Ken]

Yeah, absolutely. They're phenomenal. The X3M is phenomenal car to drive. So it's like these are seriously compelling.

[Filippo]

We sold another one for 38k with very similar mileage. That one there.

[Ken]

Yeah. Look at this. The prices are 40, 43,400 and not.

[Filippo]

Compact, so a little bit less.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think these cars are cool also. A lot of enthusiasts watching. I'll be like, Ah, SUVs, it's cool. I think this drives pretty well. You ever drive one? I mean, I, I have a suspicion that this. Would you complain about SUVs all you want, but I have a suspicion that this would run circles on a racetrack around a lot of performance cars from not that long ago. Yes, your M5, but a lot of performance cars from not that long ago. Just generally.

[Ken]

Yeah, no, I, I don't disagree. So I.

[Filippo]

This deals.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's. It's fat, it handles well, it's fun to drive. 5.

[Ken]

Yeah. I'm always looking. I've mentioned before, I stomach the cost of maintenance, but I cannot stomach depreciation, which is only expense you feel when you sell the thing. And the fact that these are half price already five years later is like depreciation's our friend. Yes, exactly.

[Filippo]

You and I, you wait two more.

[Doug DeMuro]

Years and you get into one of these at 32, 33, 28. 28. I mean that's, that's like real value. Really, really an appealing car. I already think they're appealing cars. When I see them on the road, I really take notice of them. I think they're cool. It's a lot of. They're cool, they're fun. But that's like.

[Ken]

I once saw this reel on Instagram. It was a guy who's talking about philanthropic things. He said buying a new car as philanthropy because I suffered the depreciation so that an enthusiast can inflate it after me. It's an exercise and I'm here for it. I'll take advantage of that.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm so impressed by this. I didn't really realize that these were already into the 30s. It is an enormous amount of performance, by the way.

[Filippo]

It's true for all of these. Yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

GLC 63s are at this number. Type in GLC 63.

[Filippo]

We don't sell that many of them.

[Doug DeMuro]

But neither did Mercedes. Mercedes. I never see GLC 63s. They're cool, but I never.

[Filippo]

Yeah, back in June. Wow. GLE4063s are not that far off, to be honest.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but Kenan and I Like the little car we.

[Filippo]

We.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, no. Hit GL63. Let's see what those are going for.

[Filippo]

Gle.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no, no, no, no. Let's do GLS.

[Filippo]

Oh, GL63s are free.

[Ken]

22. 5.

[Filippo]

We recently a GLS 63 which is 2016 and up of that same body style. 4 for 20 something. No way out of space between 63. We RNM'd RNM to 25, but this.

[Doug DeMuro]

One'S sold at 34. That's the new body.

[Filippo]

That's a new body.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, the new. The facelift of that because the new one came out.

[Ken]

That's a.

[Filippo]

That's a lot of car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Wow.

[Filippo]

That's a lot of car.

[Doug DeMuro]

It is amazing. Like, I feel like in this era there were a lot of improvements fast like CarPlay and. And technology really improved quick. And I don't feel like there have been that many improvements since then. It's a lot of. The market's a lot more focused on EV fees. And so, like this. These cars to me still feel very modern and they're depreciating it to a level that's like, astonishing. When. When the predecessors of these were in their 30s, they felt like older cars. You didn't. You couldn't get like x x 5ms. Original x 5m has always felt older. This is like. Feels like a pretty modern car. That X3M feels like a new car. If I park that in front of my house, my neighbors be like, whoa, we got a brand new car.

[Ken]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Till yesterday, the X3 looked like that.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. And there's not even an M on the new one.

[Ken]

And to your point, also, in terms of looks, like styling has become so much more incremental amongst manufacturers. Like, like the Rang, a great example. New Range Rover. It's like, looks like a smoother version.

[Doug DeMuro]

Frankly, the GLS is too. Frankly, the X6 X3 is like. I think a lot of these cars you really have to know to know the new glc. It's wild how. That's such a great point. It's so subtle that, like, you can get away with lying to people.

[Ken]

I would don't lie. But if you. If you pull up to the valet and they don't know, I mean, also.

[Doug DeMuro]

It'S not Even close to 3M is a good call.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Ken]

Yeah. X3M is a very compelling.

[Doug DeMuro]

You don't even need the comp.

[Filippo]

No, you don't.

[Ken]

It's a great car.

[Doug DeMuro]

475 horsepower. That's got to be doing 060 in four seconds.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Is that also encourage you to probably. No, it's close and it's 36. And it's an SUV that you can put a dog in.

[Ken]

Isn't courageously 3.7?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but I don't. It might be 3.7. I don't know.

[Ken]

A wise man once told me all performance cars are the same fast.

[Doug DeMuro]

All performance cars the same fast. You've heard it here first. 3 7.

[Filippo]

With the competition on the road, they all.

[Doug DeMuro]

I promise you that would be the courage. Ain't nobody doing a hard one two in a Carrera or a launch crew GT launch. I get beaten off the line by Priuses at every stoplight.

[Ken]

Except for that crazy guy in Monaco that drives the black one around and just slides it every.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, no, I mean I could sl. I could slide it, but starting off is hard.

[Ken]

Well, for our sake, please don't.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, That's a great one.

[Filippo]

Can we talk about one more? Yeah, you want the FDR X7. We just sold one today.

[Ken]

This car I was. I was very excited about because this.

[Filippo]

Is your search decisions are incredible to me.

[Ken]

Hey, you try searching sometime. Felipe, this car, very exciting. So FDR X7, you and I agree, one of the most beautiful Japanese cars of all time.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think it's the most beautiful Japanese car ever made.

[Ken]

The 2000 GT exists, but we'll move on. No, this car, but this is a unicorn. Manual transmission, 41, 700 miles. And it's mostly stock. And when I say mostly stock, it's like a head unit, some brake pads.

[Filippo]

And there's not even a head unit. It's great.

[Doug DeMuro]

Where is was this in Canada?

[Ken]

This Washington stock?

[Doug DeMuro]

I wish there had been a can. I would have swooped in.

[Ken]

But it sold for $46,000, which I think is, I believe is that it's the most most expensive non modified one we've sold. Correct.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's got to be up there.

[Filippo]

We sold another one for that same price point. But the last four that we've sold.

[Doug DeMuro]

Have all RX7s are so. FDR 7s are so cool. They're one of the coolest cars that exist. And unlike the Supra, which doesn't look as good and doesn't drive as well. Well, the RX7 has never gone way up in value because everybody's scared of the rotary engine. And you know what?

[Ken]

With good reason, rightfully so. Yep.

[Doug DeMuro]

We have such a dude. If this, if this had a 2J from the factory in it, this would be a $200,000 car. Does that an RB26 or Mazda's version of that. Right. Like an R34 Skyline is a 200 car. An NSX is a 200 car. Not really. A Mark 4 Supra is a 150 car. These are 477 grand because they have a rotary instead of like a legendary six cylinder.

[Ken]

Right. I, I mentioned this on the Live now show that we do on the Cars and Bits channel. And my parents knew an aerobic and they were like new. An aerobic constructor who had one brand new at the time. And even then every time she pull up somewhere she'd open the hood and let the heat out of the engine.

[Doug DeMuro]

I mean there's, there's. In order to run a rotary apparently there's like stuff you got to do.

[Ken]

Oh, there's a lot of stuff you got to do.

[Doug DeMuro]

And there wanted to find a rotary special.

[Ken]

It would be really handy. You're yourself. But they are Rotaries are special engines. It's a great concept. It just never worked.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's the other thing that nobody talks about. It actually drives better. Like the 2J is a smooth powertrain and the RB can be modified like crazy. There is nothing like the smoothness of a rotary. It is so nice. You know, I was sitting next to Jay Leno when he drove his first rotary Mazda RX7.

[Filippo]

Oh, is that right?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Which was then sold on cars and FCRX7.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't remember anything about that. No. An FB. I don't remember anything about that experience. I just wanted to drop that. No. These are incredible cars. Why don't I have an an fd? Cuz I'm afraid of maintenance. Like it's the same as everybody else. I don't, I don't want the headache.

[Ken]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

One other Japanese car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Look at that car.

[Filippo]

Look up AW11.

[Doug DeMuro]

Do you know those don't weigh anything by the way. Those weigh nothing.

[Ken]

That's part of the benefit of the rotary engine. It's compact, it's lightweight. There's just less going on.

[Doug DeMuro]

These are like Miatas. They're like a, like a, like a more serious Miata. I'm serious, like in terms of what they weigh and how athletic they are, people, they came out at the same time as the Super. The 3000 GT and 300 CX were all pigs. They were heavy. And so people lump this car in there. But that is not true. The FD is a light little car. You want to talk? Aw.

[Filippo]

For some reason I do think that the, The super weighed 600 pounds more than the R7.

[Ken]

Than the 600 pounds in the 90s too. That's.

[Doug DeMuro]

You couldn't have filled the RX7 with enough people to counteract that way.

[Ken]

No, not really.

[Doug DeMuro]

I mean assuming you got a £200 person driving the Supra and there's back seats and this. Let's not even talk about the sports port roof. Okay. What do you want to talk about? AW11. We.

[Filippo]

We sold them for 23 grand.

[Doug DeMuro]

23 for a blown low mileage. It's.

[Filippo]

I can't decide if that feels really expensive for a 1989 small Toyota coupe.

[Doug DeMuro]

This is in Mississippi. Yeah.

[Filippo]

Is that a lot or is that a little? Because it's special. It's a mid engine Toyota that like I'm sure handles incredibly well.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'll tell you this.

[Filippo]

23 grand for 1989 small tune two door coupe.

[Doug DeMuro]

I drove an SW20 Turbo.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

Amazing. Absolutely. Also, I have Never driven an AW11 blown AW11. If this car were local, I would absolutely do that. It's so cool. I drove an SW20 Turbo and it like I'm thinking to myself, I'm driving around thinking myself, why do I have all these expensive cars? This thing is just as good.

[Filippo]

We sold the one that you reviewed.

[Doug DeMuro]

We sold the one I reviewed for real money. It was. It was a red turbo. It was probably that one. It was really. Yeah, it was really nice. But even 35 seemed like a pretty good number because it was just so good to try.

[Filippo]

Doesn't that and 25 grand for a nice AW11 feel like a lot of.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't know.

[Ken]

I don't know. I mean, someone had been turned into kit cars.

[Doug DeMuro]

It feels like a lot when you think that an NAQ. You can still get an NA for seven, but it feels cheap when you think that a 348 is 100 grand. And this. That's a great point.

[Filippo]

That's a great point.

[Ken]

I've always liked these cars. Always wanted to drive an SW20.

[Doug DeMuro]

Dude. It is so good. I was astonished. It just felt so perfectly like just responsive and light and little in the most wonderful way. Great manual box. Everything about it was good. And you felt you could beat on it because it was a Toyota. Yeah. Have a cool car you're looking to sell. Sell it on Cars n Bids. Cars and Bids is the ultimate online marketplace for cool cars. And it takes just a few minutes to submit your car. Our expert auction specialist team will build your listing and get it live on Cars and Bids. In as little as three days. Cars and Bids has over 750,000 registered users. And our content brings more eyeballs to your auction than our competitors. This means you'll get more money for your cool car. Just look at these cars auction, where cars and bids brought more money than our competitors. This and this and this and this. Get started today. Go to carsandbids.com and hit the sell car button. I can't wait to write your Doug's take. We gotta move on to questions. Questions are the backbone of our podcast. They're the lifeblood of our podcast. The questions are, of course, sponsored by Filippo.

[Filippo]

Oh, thank you. Do I get something for.

[Doug DeMuro]

Do I have to pay Filippo, who's wearing a Land Cruiser shirt because he's one of the biggest complainers on the beforerunner video. He was in those comments being like, can't believe Doug got paid by Toyota FJ40. He's got some alternate username. Anyway, questions. You can ask your own questions. Go to carsandbids.com, click on the community tab and there will be a. Look at that slr. You see that thing?

[Ken]

I did see that.

[Doug DeMuro]

Go back to that. I don't even care. Look at that thing.

[Ken]

Was this spotted just somewhere?

[Filippo]

Wow.

[Doug DeMuro]

Looks like Portuguese plates. That is so cool.

[Ken]

Wow.

[Doug DeMuro]

Anyway, anyway, questions I just love. I don't want to own an slr. I don't really want to drive an slr, but seeing an SLR is like the greatest moment of my week. We ask us questions. You go to the pod thing. The pod thing will be on the pod thing. Okay, first question. First question from JRAD 1600. Why is the final sale price of the sold after auctions always kept a secret? Not disclosed. Have you discussed displaying those prices? Yes. Yes. Can we do this?

[Filippo]

Yeah, we're going to. Very soon.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, next question.

[Filippo]

There you go.

[Doug DeMuro]

Next question from Hugh Brown. Question for the adult on the pod.

[Filippo]

Oh, okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

What happened to the second E39 M5 you bought for the challenge? Any chance you could race it against Kenan in his car to see who the E395 king is? Maybe he thinks you're the adult.

[Ken]

Well, as an adult, I don't race. But yes, we're going to be selling.

[Doug DeMuro]

That racing button as an adult. E races.

[Ken]

Yeah, but we're not. So we don't condone street racing here, but that street racing.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let's take it to the track.

[Ken]

You want to ship those cars to Chuck Wall again?

[Doug DeMuro]

Ship them. I'll drive it out there. I'll beat you. Okay. What's happening to the car?

[Ken]

We still have the other E39. I'm looking at it currently over there, but it. Yeah. So it's going to be on cars and bids very soon. In addition to the Cayenne Tur.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let me tell you what happened. Can I explain what happened? We had three cars.

[Filippo]

I don't know where you're going with.

[Doug DeMuro]

We had three cars for the challenges.

[Ken]

Well, yes, three of our cars and one of Nick's.

[Doug DeMuro]

And then Nick had a car, too, which wasn't part of. We did a gig giveaway. A guy won a car and we let him choose one of the three. First time it's ever been done in the history of challenges. That's what Trump would say. It's probably been done a bunch. He chose the Corvette.

[Filippo]

Correct.

[Doug DeMuro]

The reason the M5 and the Cayenne have not been sold on the site yet is because we had to have this whole process play out. The giveaway. There was a certain amount of time, and then the guy had to come and pick up the car, which he did. His name is Michael. He lives in Colorado Springs. He drove the car home.

[Filippo]

He made it home and I'm told got 28 miles per gallon on the car.

[Doug DeMuro]

28 miles per gallon from sea level to 7,000 fee.

[Ken]

That's what Filippo honed in on there.

[Filippo]

That is the one detail I. Piece of information I received.

[Doug DeMuro]

The point is, now that Michael has chosen his car and picked it up, we're going to sell the other two. And let me tell you something. We're going to make money. We're going to make bank. We bought the M5 for 19 5. I stood on it a couple times. I think we're going to sell it for.

[Filippo]

Half of. That statement is correct. You did stand on it.

[Doug DeMuro]

What did we call it?

[Ken]

He didn't stand on it, but he did scratch it. I pushed him away.

[Doug DeMuro]

I scratched it. You ran over a t. Did you run over a TV with the car?

[Ken]

Did you scratch the fender?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I did. Did you run over a TV with it? Did you run over a TV with it?

[Ken]

I gently barely backed over it. The television that was next on the.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ground, he was driving the car. There was a tv. He said, I'm gonna run over this.

[Ken]

Well, it was so rutted up, I didn't want to damage the rest of the car. I didn't realize I'd have to avoid a TV on a beach. Welcome to San Diego. Ridiculous.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't want to hear the specifics. All I remember is you ran over a TV with the car. Love.

[Filippo]

Yes, Alex.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, next question. This is a legitimate Question. And I want to pose it to you first, not him. You don't answer until he's answered.

[Ken]

Great.

[Doug DeMuro]

From Big Ultima Hater 6, what would it take for you to buy an EV sports car?

[Ken]

Gun to my head, pull the trigger. EV sports cars don't have any. I have no real interest in them. I I sports car is experiential. And ev, although they're fast, it's like it doesn't provide I, I would like an engine. As a part of my experience in sports car, I can see having an EV as a daily, where it's just a, an object like my phone that just it's a utility. But for a sports car, it needs to be experiential. And to me, speed is not enough. Acceleration is not enough. I want an engine. I want sound. I want vibration and emotion.

[Filippo]

I have a different answer here because I think frequently. Of course I do. I think frequently about what situation I would buy an EV in. My wife and I both don't really have a commute, doesn't really make that much sense and we take a lot of long road trips, which an EV is not well suited for. If there were a cool EV sports car, I don't need my daily driver to have four seats. Now all my daily drivers do have four seats. Like I don't need that. And if I could combine ev, I don't need gas, I can charge at home or at work or whatever. And I had a commute and it's a fun sports car ev, I would do it.

[Doug DeMuro]

But what would, what would the benefit of having a sports car on that commute be instead of a Model 3? Right.

[Filippo]

If depending on what my commute is, would be fun.

[Ken]

But a Model 3, you put your dog.

[Doug DeMuro]

So in your mind, commute is like on some curve.

[Ken]

Sure.

[Filippo]

And like we live in San Diego, there's only one convertible EV and it's the original Tesla Roadster. And if there were another convertible ev, that's appealing in Southern California, first off.

[Doug DeMuro]

There was an i8 Roadster, not electric. Second, there was a Jeep Wrangler 4xe.

[Filippo]

Again, all hybrids, not electric.

[Doug DeMuro]

Third, I believe I drove an MG Cyberster right here in the office that's.

[Filippo]

Not sold in the U.S. hummer is the Targa, whatever.

[Doug DeMuro]

What about the Hummer?

[Filippo]

You can get my point though. Like if you can drive one and it's enjoyable in Southern California and it's a little bit more fun.

[Ken]

But do you want for more fun to argue your point here? Do you want a stiff riding like sports car as a daily.

[Filippo]

I don't want to imagine the situation.

[Doug DeMuro]

Which he could get a Model 3 for 14 on the site but pays up to buy an EV sports car.

[Filippo]

No, obviously I'm not spending on any of these things, but I'm not buying a car, period. I did two weeks ago, but I'm not buying a car again, period.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, so in this hypothetical where you can get an EV sports car for the same price as a regular car, where it, where you have a commute that takes you on a curvy roads.

[Filippo]

Or just where I want the top down, that could be a fun sports car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. Yeah. So the answer for you is you wouldn't either. And my answer is the same as Kennen's. So that's kind of that. Now we know why there's no EV.

[Filippo]

Sports cars except for the upcoming Boxster.

[Doug DeMuro]

I drove that. Yeah. Let me tell you something. I drove that MG Cyberster. Yeah. And it was a great car. And I mean that sincerely. And it's not just because the Chinese government has implanted something in my brain that is forcing me to say this or else it'll explode.

[Filippo]

To clarify, not just because or not because two thirds?

[Doug DeMuro]

Just because? No, the Cyber Stir was cool. It really was. But I was sitting there thinking why would someone buy this? Like sports cars are experiential.

[Filippo]

Why does somebody buy a Toyota Camry Solara? Because they want a slightly sportier looking version of a Camry.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. I would posit two responses to that. Number one, the MG Cyber store is a Camry Solar can get for seven grand. The MG Cypress store is $86,000. When the Camry Solar number two, it.

[Filippo]

Was more expensive than a Camry.

[Doug DeMuro]

People buy Camry Solara for one reason and one reason alone to flex. Right.

[Filippo]

Okay, I'll accept that answer.

[Doug DeMuro]

Next question. Next question from CJ Kitel. Hello. Doug Cannon and Filippo as we enter. Huh.

[Filippo]

Hello. For sure my name spelled wrong but hello.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. As we enter a new period of time with cars from the 2000s beginning to be eligible for import to the US what do you anticipate will have their value increase or decrease with increased Demand in the US?

[Ken]

Great question. Z8 is the first one comes to mind. It's like I think because they made quite a few and so I suspect like values have been down on Z eights generally. I think they'll continue to go down. I think that it's a good point.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's a good one.

[Ken]

I think Zondas will continue to go up as they become, I mean allegedly.

[Doug DeMuro]

Brings a new market in. I agree.

[Ken]

For $10 million, but I bet those continue to go up. Very special car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep, good one.

[Ken]

What's another one?

[Doug DeMuro]

NSXR with the fixed headlights?

[Filippo]

I think the. The. The same way.

[Doug DeMuro]

Seriously. That's a special car. And they came out in 02, which means they're two years away from being legal. And same thing is going to happen R34 with those.

[Ken]

I was, I. On the topic of R34, I actually think values might go down. We have a bunch of them that are coming into the US now and so like supply has gone up on them and I wonder if values stay as high as they have.

[Filippo]

They're all pre purchased. Like every R34 basically at this point is pre purchased.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, the values went up because there was so much interest. I actually think the qu. I think is actually related specifically to the R34, which is which cars start to see their prices increase as they get close to that 25 curve, you know. Another one is the RS4 Avant. B7 RS4 Avant.

[Filippo]

That car is E61M5.

[Doug DeMuro]

E61M5. Both of those cars are not particularly valuable right now.

[Ken]

I think E46M3 CSL might be one of them on that list. People will do the manual conversion to them as they should. That's a good one. Yeah, there are quite a few.

[Doug DeMuro]

There are cars though that like, are these special Euro import. Like my G Wagon cab values are going to go down. Defender values went down because it. The 25 thing just opened up a much wider market. Now gcabs are still valuable in Europe, but you know, you don't have to federalize it anymore. My car is now 25. Like I federalized it. I got six great years with it. Before it was legal because we legalized it, but now I could just buy one and, and the results are. Are perplexing and, and difficult to accept. No, I don't really care. Let me tell you this. I want, I want to make a point here.

[Filippo]

Ooh.

[Doug DeMuro]

In four years, four short years, I am going to import a. Yeah, thumbs down. I'm going to import a C55AMG wagon.

[Filippo]

Okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay.

[Ken]

I'm here for that.

[Doug DeMuro]

I was my favorite C. It was my favorite AMGC class. That's a. That is a sketchy thing to say.

[Filippo]

You're slicing that pretty thin here, dude.

[Doug DeMuro]

I loved all AMGC classes. Oh, do you?

[Filippo]

Okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

All except the new C4.

[Filippo]

I haven't liked any, which I like, but they're not.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's not the same. You haven't liked any AMG. C class. The C36 and the C43, the originals. The C55, that body was so little.

[Filippo]

I've also never liked a C class estate.

[Doug DeMuro]

The C63, the original C63. You don't like that wagon?

[Filippo]

I've never been a C class fan. Filipo's this has legitimately been true consistently across my entire life.

[Doug DeMuro]

Must be nice to just be an E class guy.

[Filippo]

Yep.

[Doug DeMuro]

I, I, you know, I sometimes plan for the future, which. Which might need some austerity, you know what I mean? Next question. Two more. Next question.

[Filippo]

I would then import a C180 estate, not a C55.

[Doug DeMuro]

But son, you know what he would import there? You know what he would import. You know what car he's looking forward to in a couple years. E46 compact.

[Ken]

I would be so into it if you got one of those.

[Doug DeMuro]

Filippo has this interest in the E46, in all these cars, but he won't import them. He's like the one guy who should. He's got the money and the interest and he won't do it.

[Ken]

Yeah, look at, look at those headlights.

[Doug DeMuro]

That could be those.

[Ken]

What was the creature from Lilo and Stitch like, lots of ice, that sort of thing.

[Doug DeMuro]

Why did this happen? Why didn't they just give it the headlights from the regular car?

[Ken]

I don't know. This must have cost so much more to do on their cheapest car. It makes no sense.

[Doug DeMuro]

So weird and heinous. Just obviously I want one. You agree?

[Ken]

Oh, of course.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I am.

[Ken]

S54 swapped that thing in a heartbeat.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, God. Could you imagine S54 swapping that? Throwing some good suspension on there, putting the little gills in. You show up at Filippo's house, he would run inside, he'd be like, please don't hurt me.

[Filippo]

Is there a single photo where the hood looked like it was painted alongside the rest of the car?

[Doug DeMuro]

What is our every. What is the deal with ass, this one included? What is going on?

[Ken]

That's a good point.

[Doug DeMuro]

Unfortunately, those were all sold as 316ds. Okay, two more questions. Next one from Ethan Hickerson. Doug, what car have you reviewed, have you had to do the most research on? The answer is the cars that will get the most views. I'm always afraid. Trade. Yeah, like an F50. You got to really do some work in that video, Right? Great. Next. I'm serious. Next question from Inexpla. How about bringing back the Doug car? I know Doug has enough vehicles in his personal Fleet. But how about from time to time buying something weird to keep around the office for a few months for the gang to drive and make videos? No, I don't. I will never buy another car as long as I live.

[Filippo]

Well, I. I think the person might be asking about something like the Cayenne.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, let's talk about that. Let's talk about that. So I'm not personally going to do it.

[Filippo]

Right.

[Doug DeMuro]

Would the company be interested in doing it?

[Filippo]

I think if you. If you make a really.

[Ken]

A producer shaking his head yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let's say I want to multiply. Like, I want to multiply.

[Filippo]

I also want to multiply.

[Doug DeMuro]

We want multiply. Right? Right. I'm not doing it. I've imported too many cars, too many headaches, Tariff tariffs. Now, I don't know how it's going to be tariffed.

[Filippo]

I like to think that you and I combined have some weight now. You have some weight and I have a little bit. So combined.

[Doug DeMuro]

So let's do this. But I want to be very clear here. And it's the same with the Cayenne. I'm not associated with this. I'm not paying for this. I'm not in any way, shape or form part of this, financially. And headachely, it's not even the finance headache, it's really the headache because. Remember when the A class was dumping fuel?

[Filippo]

Yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

I brought the A class, thinking that it was going to be the coolest little thing. We brought it here, we got it outside, it came off the truck, and it was just dumping fuel on the ground. And I said to Filippo, I gave him the keys, and I said, handle this.

[Filippo]

And I think Ken did. It was great.

[Ken]

Yeah. Mercedes, like, it was fine. But. Yes. Now, of course, we'll back up to eight seconds ago when you said that you're going to import a C55 in.

[Doug DeMuro]

Five years, and I'm going to hold firm to that. So, fine, I'm not buying any more cars. But in five years, I'll grant myself a $23,000 exception. But it's.

[Ken]

You want. You're not going to do that anyway.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, I absolutely am going to do that.

[Ken]

You don't want to deal with the headache.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ramy will take care of it all for me.

[Filippo]

In five years, it'll be a different Doug.

[Doug DeMuro]

In five years, I'll be ready.

[Ken]

He goes through this.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no, I'm done. I've been clear about this. I haven't bought a car in, like, two, almost two years now. Yeah. Countach was the last car I bought. Okay. Daily Drivers don't count. I don't understand. I'm.

[Ken]

It's a car. You said I'm not buying a car. You purchased a Vortex for transportation. Four wheels.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm going to give you a car. Who's the one?

[Filippo]

This is the title to.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm saying I'm not buying any more cars, but when the daily drivers age out, I will replace them. I'm not going to be driving around on a HUP mobile because I said I wouldn't buy any more cars like the daily driver. Cars are boring. They will be replaced. Nobody cares about those. When I do videos with them, Literally no one watches. Nobody cares. However, I haven't bought a fun car and I'm not going to. Okay, but if the office wants to buy a car.

[Filippo]

If the sequoia had a V8, it would have been a fun car.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, it wouldn't have. If the office wants to buy a car. A car. Yeah, I'm interested.

[Filippo]

I. I hear you.

[Doug DeMuro]

You do? You do something with the money for the company. Sometimes you have some role with the finances. Cuz I get emails from you about like how the finances are going. So you must have some sway, right? Couldn't you misplace 20 grand and we get a multiply?

[Ken]

I don't even think it would be 20. It be a lot less than 20.

[Doug DeMuro]

All in.

[Ken]

All in. I bet still less than 20.

[Filippo]

If you have a multiple at 30T, let me know. Carved maybe.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay, last question and I believe this one is just for me and Filippo from Grunkle Letanar. Question for Doug Oral. But it's going to be for us. Which Eagle model was your favorite and which was the most unusual? Okay, this is a tough one. The most unusual. The most unusual was undoubtedly the Eagle Premiere. Pull it up please.

[Ken]

Yeah, I was so shocked by that.

[Doug DeMuro]

The eel. I'm sure we've never, never sold one. No, no, no, that's fine, that's fine. It'll come up. Eagle Premier car. There you go. Click on that. So the Eagle Premiere was a re badged. Do you know?

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. The Eagle Premier was also sold as the Dodge Monaco. That was the, the common one that we also got in the States and it was sold as the Renault Premier. I don't know where. But in other markets this was inexplicably also sold as a Renault. Now there it is with a Renault badge on it. Amc, what are you thinking of? This is going deep. But AMC and Renault got, got tied up together and they made cars in Wisconsin together. And then AMC became Jeep and Eagle. And so Eagle kept the Renault tie and so there were some Eagles that were Renault's. This is deep stuff. This is 35 years ago Detroit stuff.

[Filippo]

What am I thinking of?

[Doug DeMuro]

Nothing. You're thinking of nothing. Yeah, there you go. Those were the three, the Dodge Monaco. There's the E, that was the Eagle Summit sedan that I don't even know what it is. And there's the Eagle Premiere. Okay. The best Eagle though was the Vision tsi. No, it's the, everybody knows it's the dsi.

[Filippo]

I don't agree with the Eagle lineup. Turns out co comes back on something else. Yeah, the Vision TSI is good.

[Doug DeMuro]

Vision TSI was one of the first cars with a Tiptronic. They called it Autostick. This is true. And you could manually shift. Porsche had come out with it like the prior year and then Eagle came out with it. So it was the famous big two Porsche and Eagle.

[Ken]

Really cutting edge technology. Very sharp talons on that Eagle.

[Doug DeMuro]

It didn't work either. The Autostick was, was designed very differently than Tiptronic. It didn't really shift gears. It kind of told the transmission the max that you wanted to go to and all the transmission actually turned out to be the weak point in the whole car. And there are none of these left anywhere even in Detroit.

[Filippo]

I, I was going to say the AMC Eagle, which was then they called the Eagle Wagon briefly is the best.

[Doug DeMuro]

But that was, wasn't an Eagle.

[Filippo]

It was then called the, referred to as the Eagle Wagon.

[Doug DeMuro]

Maybe for an afternoon.

[Filippo]

Yeah, the best.

[Doug DeMuro]

Actual, the actual answer to this question, by the way, the Eagle Talon TSI is the best Eagle. It was the DSM car. They sold two generations of it and it is just as good as the Eclipse. And I always felt, honestly I always felt it looked better. Yeah, cuz they, cuz they did some of them with white wheels. With white, with white wheels.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

And anytime you can do white wheels, I can't, I don't know how to do it. There you go. There's one.

[Filippo]

What sedan was I thinking of?

[Doug DeMuro]

1 GT DSM. There's nothing like a 1G DSM dude. You get a 1G DSM, a volt meter and a straight stretch of road and you got yourself a weekend, you know what I'm saying?

[Ken]

No, absolutely have no clue what you need.

[Doug DeMuro]

A had all sorts of electrical issues. Just tons. All right. Volt meter and you would do the straight stretch of road cuz like you'd get like a little bit down. Oh that's, that's right.

[Filippo]

Anyway and you want to fix it on a straight. Straight to avoid.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, you would. That's where you would do your testing, right? Okay. All right. That's the end of that. This was. This was the finest pod we've ever done, I believe.

[Ken]

Best one we've done, for sure.

[Doug DeMuro]

Filippo, any parting words?

[Filippo]

Sure. Check out cars with beds. Dot com.

[Doug DeMuro]

Goodbye, everyone.

[Ken]

Goodbye.