I Drove Chinese Cars in America! Making Sense of the Jaguar Rebrand! Miura Fire?

Summary

THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends!

Episode: I Drove Chinese Cars in America! Making Sense of the Jaguar Rebrand! Miura Fire?

Release Date: November 22, 2024

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Jaguar Rebranding and Marketing Strategy

The episode kicks off with a deep dive into Jaguar's recent rebranding efforts. Doug, Ken, and Filipo discuss the controversial marketing campaign Jaguar launched, which involved deleting all previous social media posts to unveil a new brand image overnight.

Doug criticizes the approach, stating, “This is the worst of the worst car company. Like, being totally honest. They could leave tomorrow and no one would notice” (02:27). Filipo echoes his frustration with the brand's inconsistent messaging, noting, “Jaguar revealed this yesterday. They also deleted all of their previous social media posts and posted this” (02:02).

Ken adds that Jaguar's move to create inflammatory content was a deliberate strategy to regain attention, comparing it to Tesla's Cybertruck launch: “The Cybertruck was kind of that way. It worked. And we talked about that for nine months” (04:38). Despite the backlash, Doug acknowledges that the campaign succeeded in making Jaguar a topic of conversation, something the brand hadn’t achieved in years.

TWR Tribute to the XJS

Transitioning from Jaguar's woes, the hosts highlight a tribute project by Tom Walkinshaw Racing (TWR). Ken introduces the "Super Cat," a homage to the classic XJS model, boasting a supercharged 5.6-liter V12 engine producing 660 horsepower and a six-speed manual transmission.

Doug praises the project, saying, “It's cool as hell. But of all the resto mods and almost all of them have been like yawners like Singer. This is cool” (12:35). The team discusses the car's modifications, including a full carbon body and significant weight reduction, enhancing both performance and aesthetics. They anticipate its debut at upcoming car shows, predicting strong interest from enthusiasts.

Chinese Cars: MG Cyberster & Xiaomi SU7

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to Chinese automobiles entering the American market. Doug shares his experience driving the MG Cyberster and Xiaomi SU7, emphasizing their impressive build quality and performance.

Filipo challenges the prevailing negative perception of Chinese cars, stating, “There's this perception among American consumers that Chinese cars are kind of or the Chinese goods are kind of crappy” (19:58). However, his experience contradicts this belief as he praises the vehicles’ design and functionality. Doug adds, “They drove great. They existed great. They have some great quirks and features” (19:00), highlighting how these cars rival more established brands in terms of quality and innovation.

Car Events and Personal Stories

The hosts reminisce about their experiences at various car events, particularly focusing on Amelia Island. Doug recounts an amusing incident where a Miura coupe caught fire on stage during an award presentation, drawing parallels to Valentino Balboni’s experience in 1967: “It catches on fire as Miura's do. Well, Balboni is there” (34:46).

Ken expresses his enthusiasm for attending these events, mentioning plans to visit Scottsdale and Goodwood Festival of Speed next year. The camaraderie and shared passion for cars are evident as they discuss the excitement of meeting fellow enthusiasts and showcasing unique vehicles.

Market Report: SC430 and Autozam AZ1

In the market report segment, Doug and Filipo discuss recent high-value sales, including a pre-facelift Lexus SC430 sold for $48,000 with low mileage. Doug remarks, “All the enthusiasts who lined up around the original Lexus SC being like it's a driftmobile... the market loves this car” (39:03).

They also highlight the sale of an Autozam AZ1 for a record-breaking $2,500, surpassing previous records. Filipo notes, “These are desirable. Like just legit. Well presented, nicely modified” (43:03). The discussion underscores the continued demand for classic and well-maintained vehicles, despite general market trends.

Listener Questions and Discussions

The episode concludes with a Q&A segment where listeners submit their questions. Highlights include:

• Daily Driving a Million-Dollar Car: When asked about driving a car worth over a million dollars daily, Ken humorously suggests the Bentley, stating, “It's a Bentley that happens to be able to do 260 miles an hour” (56:04). The trio debates the practicality and image of such high-end vehicles for everyday use.

• Best Example of a Car Not Sold in America: Filipo advocates for the Nissan Terra, lamenting its absence in the U.S. market. “Nissan continued to make the Xterra in other markets called simply the Terra... They could have sold this in the US and done well” (58:22). Doug concurs, reflecting on missed opportunities by automakers to capitalize on emerging trends.

• Fake Air Intake or Blinker Signal: A humorous discussion ensues about a listener’s query on whether a specific car feature is a fake air intake or a blinker, highlighting the trio’s lighthearted banter and attention to automotive details.

Throughout the Q&A, the hosts maintain their signature blend of insightful commentary and relatable anecdotes, engaging listeners with both technical analysis and personal stories.

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Notable Quotes

• Doug on Jaguar's Branding Failure: “This is the worst of the worst car company. Like, being totally honest. They could leave tomorrow and no one would notice” (02:27).

• Ken on Inflammatory Marketing: “The only way to get people to talk about it is to be negative. The Cybertruck was kind of that way. It worked” (04:38).

• Filipo on Chinese Cars’ Quality: “There's this perception among American consumers that Chinese cars are kind of or the Chinese goods are kind of crappy” (19:58).

• Doug on the Autozam AZ1 Sale: “These are desirable. Like just legit. Well presented, nicely modified” (43:03).

• Ken on Million-Dollar Daily Drivers: “It's a Bentley that happens to be able to do 260 miles an hour” (56:04).

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Conclusion

In this episode of THIS CAR POD!, Doug, Ken, and Filipo navigate through a spectrum of automotive topics, from Jaguar's faltering rebrand to the surprising quality of Chinese cars entering the U.S. market. Their candid discussions, marked by humor and expertise, provide listeners with a comprehensive overview of current automotive trends, market insights, and engaging personal anecdotes. Whether dissecting high-profile brand moves or exploring niche car modifications, the trio ensures a rich and informative listening experience for car enthusiasts and casual fans alike.

Transcript

[Doug]

This episode is brought to you by. Skinny Pop Popcorn. Perfectly popped, endlessly delicious. Oh, so light and crunchy. Skinny Pop Original Popcorn is the snack you've been searching for. Made with just three simple popcorn kernels, sunflower oil and salt. Snacking never felt or tasted so good. Perfectly popped, endlessly delicious. Give yourself permission to snack and pick up Skinny Pop Original Popcorn today. Hello and welcome to this car pod.

[Ken]

I'm Ken.

[Filipo]

I'm Filipo.

[Doug]

And let's just get into it. Started off Jaguar. Jaguar. We're going to start with the news and talk. Jaguar. Jaguar has rebranded and. Can we play the video? Let's just play the video. Filippo hasn't seen it yet.

[Ken]

There's sound.

[Doug]

Evidently there's. There is sound. Yeah, I watched it.

[Filipo]

Oh, I hate every single part of this.

[Doug]

Let it play. It's gonna. Might change your mind later. It might be different.

[Filipo]

British.

[Doug]

Right? All right.

[Filipo]

Two. Two main issues.

[Doug]

First of all, Live Vivid.

[Filipo]

There's a lot of adverbs that should have been used that were not Live Vivid, which both me every single day in normal life and especially bothers me here. And also copy nothing.

[Doug]

Don't you mean every single lead day? Okay. Can I tell you, this is this. Jaguar revealed this yesterday. They also deleted all of their previous social media posts and posted this, like their whole Instagram was. They deleted every post, like, post by post. Like, they hired some dude to delete, delete, delete overnight. Like, and nobody noticed because Jaguar. And then they post this like the morning.

[Filipo]

Yeah, right.

[Doug]

It's on Twitter. It was on all the places.

[Filipo]

Yeah, I saw the news. I just hadn't bothered to watch the video.

[Doug]

Well, now you've seen it.

[Filipo]

It was back in time.

[Doug]

It was enormously criticized, as one can imagine. Okay, I got a different take.

[Filipo]

Of course you loved it.

[Doug]

I didn't love it. But, like, it ain't working. What's been happening the last hundred years certainly. Do you get what I'm saying? Like, this is the worst of the worst car company. Like, being totally honest. They could leave tomorrow and no one would.

[Filipo]

They are selling cars.

[Doug]

They're literally not selling cars this year.

[Filipo]

Right.

[Doug]

Like 25.

[Filipo]

The. They can only go up. Like, regardless of what they do, they can only go up.

[Doug]

I think it's stupid and insane, but, like, the. The.

[Filipo]

It.

[Doug]

It. The previous. You remember in the past when they were trying to sell cars using normal marketing with normal cars that didn't work. They didn't sell cars.

[Filipo]

Stakes are.

[Doug]

Although they actually had.

[Ken]

Stakes are low.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

They actually had some great years when they first released the XF and the xj and that's the F Pace, but then they released no new cars for.

[Doug]

A decade, there was. Well, that was one of the issues. But I think also just the brand has gotten stale. No one really knows what it's supposed to be. Then they tried to pivot to electric with one electric car, and now they've pivoted to cosmetics.

[Ken]

Like, it's really difficult.

[Doug]

It's weird as hell and not good, but, like. And everybody's pissed online. This is. This is not Jaguar. This is not what Jaguar is supposed to be. And it's like. I think that's the point, guys, because I think what Jaguar is supposed to be has kind of continuously failed for my entire lifetime. Like, I'm not exaggerating. Yeah, they did that music video with Sting and that guy who killed somebody. And I. I just. There was that, too. Madonna did one with the green xkr.

[Filipo]

Oh, really?

[Doug]

There was.

[Filipo]

I was thinking a little bit more.

[Doug]

Recently, Ford owned jagged. There was a Bond movie where there was a Ford out Aston Martin. There was a Vanquish. There was an xkr, which Ford owned. And then there was a Thunderbird in that same movie.

[Filipo]

I remember the Thunderbird.

[Doug]

It was pinkish red.

[Filipo]

Also, like the. In all of them, M drives around in an xj, all the more recent ones. But what does this mean?

[Doug]

It means that there's something new coming. I'm not going to defend it. I think it's stupid, too. But I also think, like, let's just kind of let them do it, because for the first time in automotive history, people are talking about Jaguar. People have not talked about Jaguar this much since the E Type was shown at the Paris motor show in 1959. And people were beating down Stephen Jaguar's door to hand him deposits. I'm not. I'm not kidding. Like, am I wrong?

[Ken]

No, you're not, Rue. And the other thing about this is, like, they knew they had to do something inflammatory.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

And realistically, the only way to get people to talk about it is to be negative. The cybertruck was kind of that way. It worked. And we talked about that for nine months. Right here we are talking about this. So it was successful in that regard.

[Doug]

Some, like, video with, like, black lights and, like, Jaguar and then a picture of the leaping cat. No one would say the difference is.

[Filipo]

That nobody's going to talk about this starting tomorrow.

[Doug]

Well, we're talking about three days.

[Ken]

Right. Well, they keep rolling this stuff. I think the next update comes December 2nd, is when they said there's going.

[Doug]

To be the next update.

[Filipo]

What does that mean?

[Doug]

Reveal a new car at an art show?

[Filipo]

At least in your.

[Ken]

Some fashion exhibit in Berlin is what this whole thing looked like.

[Doug]

Will it, Will it be a new car?

[Ken]

Very.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

Is there actually a new car?

[Doug]

There's a new concept car. Look, I think my point is just. I think it's stupid. Just like everybody else thinks it's stupid. But, like, this company is bad. They are not succeeding and that for the first time, people are talking about them. And so, like, I'm gonna let it play out. I'm just gonna let it play out. See what happens.

[Ken]

They took that, that break to go teach skiing, you know, between college and they're experimenting with.

[Doug]

And they're experimenting. Yeah.

[Ken]

And look at this guy. He's excited about it.

[Doug]

You think?

[Filipo]

Here's what I don't get.

[Ken]

This guy's thrilled.

[Filipo]

First of all, Jaguar should learn to copy a lot of things if they want to be good. First of all, copy nothing. Wrong, wrong monitor. But much, much more important that like they. They spent surely millions on this video and on the reveal. Well, they've revealed nothing.

[Doug]

Did they spend millions?

[Filipo]

Yes.

[Doug]

Let me, let me counterpoint. All they did was two things. They hired these folks who I better not busy to walk. Yeah, right. These clothes can't be expensive. That's she's wearing like a garbage bag kind of situation. This is a rug. And they deleted all their social media posts. You and I could have done in an hour. If they were going to spend millions, I would have done it. I would have done that for 800.

[Filipo]

There's no doubt that they spent millions on this campaign. And I just don't like Scout, which is a brand that is a revival of an old, old brand that nobody's talked about in a century.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

Did a big reveal. They got a ton of earned media by showing cars.

[Doug]

Yes.

[Filipo]

Turns out that if you show cars that people might be interested in, but you can get.

[Doug]

You're missing the point. Jaguars going to do that too, are they? But they've already captured our attentions. Now everybody's sitting here, everybody who complained about this is sitting, are thinking, what the hell are these guys going to do?

[Filipo]

No, because you're thinking that it doesn't have the staying power.

[Ken]

Yeah, he is.

[Filipo]

No car will connect to this ad campaign unless it's a Golf Harlequin.

[Doug]

Maybe it'll be a Harley. Maybe a XJ220 revival.

[Ken]

Now that'd be cool. I don't. I don't be Electric.

[Filipo]

It'll be. I don't know what.

[Ken]

Maybe it was in. We didn't see it. Maybe it was that rock.

[Filipo]

Watch it again.

[Doug]

Look, I think that you're all missing the.

[Filipo]

How many views does this unlisted video have?

[Ken]

It's.

[Filipo]

It is unlisted.

[Doug]

What?

[Ken]

4.8 thousand.

[Filipo]

So they're.

[Doug]

Most people didn't watch it on YouTube, on other platforms. I haven't seen it on YouTube yet.

[Ken]

But, you know, I mean, it could have. I mean, maybe that's it.

[Doug]

Create exuberantly. Create the exuberant.

[Filipo]

No, no, that's not. That's not. I fully had said either of those things.

[Doug]

Is that a tire? Wait, go back here. Go back to that. She's wearing a tire. That's a clue. Look, all I'm saying is. All I'm saying is people are hating this. I get why they're hating it. It's really stupid. But I think it has gotten our attention in a way that Jaguar has not gotten our attention long time. And I think there are marketers out there who are like, yeah, that was the plan. And now you're curious. Admitted. If they had just done a stupid, boring campaign, you'd be like, Jaguar, whatever.

[Filipo]

Had they had they come.

[Doug]

Now you're curious.

[Filipo]

We're changing a lot of our tact. Here's our new design language. Here's the direction we're going to go in.

[Doug]

Would do. And Filippo only does like the basics.

[Filipo]

Who buys Jaguars if not people like Filippo?

[Doug]

But the point is they want new people. They want people like Kenneth. They. Right now they got people like you.

[Filipo]

Well, they're going to reveal a city size luxury EV problem.

[Doug]

I want to see an X, an electric XJ220.

[Ken]

I would have a better power rock because that's what we think. I think we might be getting here or whatever. Cosmetics. They can't.

[Doug]

Wearing a tire. I'm just saying.

[Filipo]

Road worker.

[Doug]

So maybe it's a construction vehicle.

[Ken]

AA yellow.

[Doug]

Okay, so we gotta move on from Jaguar and we must move to Jaguar. Jaguar. Now this is apparently a. This is gonna be the car. Oh, they announced a car exists. They're gonna release it at Miami Art Week, which is in a couple of.

[Filipo]

Weeks, which we, as we all know, beginning of December.

[Doug]

You know, I'm sure you've been there a bunch of times.

[Filipo]

Haven't been, but dream of.

[Doug]

That's the point, though. They're going to show this thing. It's called the Jaguar design vision concept. And apparently the goal is to bring the Jaguar brand upscale. They're talking about $100,000 plus EVs. Here's the thing.

[Filipo]

The Jaguar brand was upscale. They spent 20 years moving to like less premium.

[Doug]

They regret that.

[Filipo]

Or premium instead of luxury.

[Doug]

They regret the fact they came out with the E pace at a 299 lease deal. As long as you walked in with a mop as a trade in.

[Filipo]

What do you think X E Lee seals are? They're the 20.

[Doug]

That car's long gone. We don't think about the X anymore. We got a new thing.

[Filipo]

Got a new thing. And it looks like it could be cool.

[Doug]

It could be cool.

[Ken]

Looks like a 300 wagon to me.

[Doug]

Yeah, but that's cool.

[Filipo]

That's with new 7 series front.

[Doug]

It does look like if you pop this off, this is a Chrysler.

[Ken]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Maybe they're gonna come back.

[Ken]

If you bemoan the loss of the Chrysler 300, $250,000 thing like you think.

[Doug]

It'S gonna be 250.

[Ken]

If they're really trying to move upscale like Bentley. Yeah.

[Doug]

The goal is to move up market. 100,000 plus is kind of what's been floated. I don't know about Bentley, but here's, here's what I don't get.

[Filipo]

Okay, go back a slide. Because this is their new logo.

[Doug]

Their new logo. The G is uppercase. That's a good point. The J might be.

[Filipo]

The rest is not.

[Ken]

The rest is not the U.

[Filipo]

Could be, to be fair.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

Jaguar. Okay. When you think luxury, especially in the us you think British brands.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

They've un. British fied all of their history.

[Doug]

You're missing the point. And I think, I think a lot of low effort Instagram commenters are missing the point. That's what they're trying to do. They're. They're on their tethering from their previous reputation completely and they're going to Miami Art Week with a, with a GT car that's going to cost 200 grand and be electric. And they got a lowercase A.

[Ken]

Right. They're trying to move out of Coventry and into London. That's what, that's the kind of move they want to go. They want to be more modern.

[Filipo]

And that looks like every.

[Doug]

Like, I think they're trying to move out of Coventry into like Prague or Berlin. Berlin, something like that. Something a little edgier.

[Ken]

Edgy. Yeah, exactly.

[Filipo]

For all the edgy people in Berlin that have 100 plus thousand euro.

[Doug]

Well, there are a couple of wealthy people in Berlin.

[Ken]

I think that this looks like it's there. Maybe they're going to make Refrigerators.

[Filipo]

Oh, I think it's a mid scale hotel.

[Doug]

No, it looks like a garage door.

[Ken]

In all plausible things by the way.

[Doug]

You're missing the point. That's what they're trying to do. They want to get your attention. Okay. We spent way too long on this. I'm moving off Jaguar, our next story.

[Ken]

Speaking of Jaguar, what is this? So this is kind of an interesting wrestler mod thing. So TWR Tom Walkinshaw Racing is making a tribute to the xjs a very.

[Doug]

You didn't know that. Of course.

[Ken]

Of course he didn't know that. Lipo. Go back to sleep. This car is going to be called the super cat.

[Doug]

Super.

[Ken]

But it is cool. So it has a supercharged 5.6 liter V12, 660 horsepower and six speed manual transmission.

[Doug]

This isn't, it's not the V12 that was in it before.

[Filipo]

It's.

[Doug]

It's some.

[Ken]

Maybe in cylinder count only but it looks so it's been pretty beefed up one might say. And man the presentation is beautiful. But in addition to that like the body obviously is pretty extreme. Full carbon body. It's 20cm wider than the normal.

[Doug]

I mean look at those flaps.

[Ken]

I know. And it weighs substantially less too. This thing weighs 3,500 pounds compared to the original three. 900 pounds. And they weren't trying to say.

[Filipo]

And they were light at the time.

[Ken]

Yeah, exactly. So another notable thing about the design. Magnus Walker and Kaiser Salim worked on the design of this particular car and so they. Which again Magnus Walker known for Porsches, so kind of unusual.

[Filipo]

They chose design though. I mean, I mean I guess.

[Ken]

But when you think him. I think long hair Porsches. That's what I think of like that's.

[Filipo]

What now you think restaurants.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

TWR thinks that he should help with this.

[Doug]

I think it's cool as hell.

[Ken]

It's very cool.

[Doug]

So of all the Resto mods and almost all of them have been like yawners like Singer. This is cool. Yeah.

[Ken]

But yes, it's gonna cost 285,000American dollars.

[Doug]

That's not that insane.

[Ken]

And they're gonna build 88. I think what that means they're going to attempt to build 88 and they're allegedly going to start delivering them in 2025.

[Doug]

285,000.

[Ken]

Yeah, 285 sign up.

[Doug]

That's a cool.

[Ken]

A lot for an XJS.

[Filipo]

Cool looking car.

[Doug]

I can't get an XJ 220 for that money. You got a stick V12 for 285. Huh. Does it have a warranty. I meant to give it as a.

[Ken]

Warranty, but evidently Matt Fair got to hear this thing recently and he said on Instagram that it sounds like a mercy when you start it. And he like, actually seemed pretty excited about the car. So I'm kind of curious. I'm sure we'll see it in car week and stuff like that, but I.

[Doug]

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[Ken]

Finally, not Jaguar.

[Filipo]

Finally, not Jaguar.

[Doug]

This is a boring news. I know. We'll start quickly.

[Filipo]

One minute or less. The current. Go. The current CEO of Volkswagen North America has left. He's now the past CEO as of yesterday. And they have a new CEO who was formerly at Porsche and at Rivian.

[Doug]

Okay, there you go. There you go.

[Ken]

All right, story.

[Filipo]

But we're just getting more and more interesting from here, so you will regret that story.

[Doug]

Short story.

[Filipo]

All right, this is Alexis RZ.

[Doug]

Yeah, it's.

[Filipo]

It's the Toyota BZ4X or Subaru Solterra.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

Of Lexus.

[Doug]

It's literally better than those two. But that's not saying it has a some of them.

[Filipo]

Do some of them have a model S Ask steering wheel.

[Doug]

Yes.

[Filipo]

What's the word?

[Doug]

What's it called? All right, thanks.

[Filipo]

Yoked. They cut the price of the beauty of the RZ the base model by $11,000. And where's extra 43?

[Doug]

Oh my God. That's still $28,000 too much.

[Filipo]

Yeah, but it is now the same price as a BZ4X. Now we all assume the BZ4X will have a similar price cut and of course the BZ4X at the dealership out the door is 20 grand less than what they're asking.

[Doug]

What would you. What would it take to get you into a BZ4X? Ugly, poor range, poor performance. Like it's just quite bad. What would it take to get you into BZ4X? By the way, low. I'm sorry lowercase B. Uppercase Z4 uppercase.

[Ken]

X. Toyota has to bring it to his house and it needs to be.

[Filipo]

$20 a month or less which, which by the way Fiat last week had a lease deal that was about $40.

[Doug]

Wait, you wouldn't do it at 35amonth for X?

[Filipo]

No, I don't want to hassle but it is really noble. They're coming the price $11,000 on a car that came out two years ago and they're matching BG Forex prices which so busy forest prices are probably also going to fall some amount I just.

[Doug]

Don'T understand these automakers had Tesla to benchmark. I was at the I went to the Lexus RZ launch they did here in and I just couldn't understand it. Then they had Tesla to benchmark. They knew what the what the benchmark was for range and performance and price tag and instead they come up with this whose performance is laughable in comparison and range. The RZ's range is better. The BZ4X range is trash.

[Filipo]

The all wheel drive BZ4X the higher the all wheel drive RZs, the higher trims have less than 200 miles range.

[Doug]

Yeah but they had some good horsepower number. No, that's not acceptable. 350 or something. It's not acceptable.

[Filipo]

I totally there's a people will buy them because you go to a Lexus dealership, you want an ev, where are you gonna buy this?

[Doug]

And that's the only sales Toyota's pursuing this electrification strategy very like, they pursue other strategies, which is very solely and careful, but the consumers are not. They're buying the best, the nicest, the fastest. And I literally went to a. I can't remember which automaker told me they, they had limited the performance of their EV because they didn't want people to be like, surprised. And it's like, no, this is not how it works. People are expecting 0 to 60 in 2.8 seconds for like 40 GS. It's what Tesla does. As far as I'm concerned. If you can't deliver Tesla level range, performance, pricing, there's no point. There's no point. And none of them can. None of them can. The Mach E is close, but none of the others.

[Filipo]

The Mach E is close. The Lucid Air is close to Model S performance and expensive as Rivian's are. Not that they're similar from Model X. There are competitors in the space. The Ionic 5.

[Doug]

Well, Rivian is very close to Model 3. Cars that deliver other things that Tesla doesn't. And Rivian is one of them. It can off road, it looks way better. It's obviously bigger inside.

[Filipo]

Ionic 5, EV6 or in the red ballpark.

[Doug]

Generally speaking, though, a lot of these EVs, if you just look at it on paper, it's like, why would I ever consider this trash? That's one of the reasons, I think it's so insane that Tesla opened up their charge network to all these other companies because, like, you had this massive advantage and this other massive advantage.

[Filipo]

I mean, it's not a mistake in that it's probably good for EV adoption, but it is rough. By the way, this now is about the same price as the basest Lexus nx.

[Doug]

Really? Well, I'd still rather have the NX with this said. Speaking of evs, yesterday here in the studio, we had some Chinese cars.

[Filipo]

Yes.

[Doug]

Automobiles manufactured in China. Their VIN started with L. Really? Yeah.

[Filipo]

I don't know the Chinese, Vince.

[Doug]

Yeah. And here's the deal. One of them was a convertible sports car from the storied MG brand.

[Filipo]

Can you pull it up? Can the mg?

[Doug]

It's called the Cyber Ster. It is not called the Cyber Steer, which is what I thought it was called.

[Filipo]

Good catch.

[Doug]

And then also we had the Xiaomi SU7. You, I'm sure, are well aware of.

[Filipo]

I am, of course. Jim Farley was.

[Doug]

This car was in our office yesterday. Yesterday.

[Filipo]

So cool. Legitimately, is it?

[Doug]

Anyway?

[Filipo]

Yeah, it was. Wait, can you find a picture of the taillights? Doug did a full video so everybody will get to enjoy it.

[Doug]

I got big videos coming with the SU7. SU7 and the MG Cypress.

[Ken]

Actual error. I have to say I didn't know what to expect, to be honest with you. When you said you're going to do these, I actually thought it was pretty cool, to be honest.

[Doug]

It looks good. I've sent the picture to a bunch of people. Everyone I sent it to is like that thing looks good.

[Filipo]

And the SU7 also looks good.

[Doug]

The SU7 is what we say. Sure, yeah, China. And we felt that it looked good also. Yeah, we myself the party anyway. No, legitimately though there's this perception among American consumers that Chinese cars are kind of or the Chinese goods are kind of crappy because that we border stuff on Amazon and it's cheap plastic stuff. It comes from China and we drive these cars. I drove these cars around like San Diego yesterday and they were great. They drove great, they existed great. They have some great quirks and features.

[Ken]

Well, I thought it nice. I thought it was fascinating to look at because we had a cyber truck in the office last week. Panel gaps, not particularly great build quality, not particularly nice.

[Filipo]

Oh this thing though, right?

[Ken]

Well that one was gold but this one, this one the was nice. It was nice.

[Doug]

It was well made and I think that speaks of.

[Ken]

I did. It felt not good. I think one thing to keep in mind a It's amazing how far the Chinese have come in such a short period.

[Doug]

Couple years. Xiaomi, the people who brought us the SU7, they were making smartphones in 21, not a single car. Smartphones, 21.

[Ken]

Wow.

[Doug]

Here we are. 24. They got it. That by the way, that SU7 set the all time Nurburgring lap record for a four door car. The SU7 Ultra which has 1500 horsepower.

[Filipo]

He had the Max here.

[Doug]

I had the Max which strangely is the mid range model. Some naming issues.

[Filipo]

Well, to be fair, Apple has the same naming structure with their chips.

[Ken]

M4, M4 smartphone heritage.

[Doug]

And that's by the way when we got the spec list which was sent to us not on Google Docs but on Feisu Docs I'm sure you know.

[Ken]

Oh, very familiar.

[Doug]

A lot of the specs like it's like talks about processor like you know how like you would send a spec list for a Lincoln and it would be like 28 inch screen and V6 and all wheel drive. This was like 2800 bubble flob Qualcomm processor and I'm like okay, I didn't realize that's part of a car.

[Ken]

Dang. It had the blue Flobble Flob.

[Doug]

It had a 2800 booble flob. Wow.

[Ken]

Overclocked.

[Doug]

Obviously.

[Ken]

The other point I want to make that is yes, they've come up very quickly, but also this comes from a nation that is very good at manufacturing. They have really honed their processes. So it's not really a surprise that things are like well put together. The panel gaps are tight and like they seem to figure that out very, very.

[Filipo]

Also the Chinese government makes out of a lot of manufacturing required there to be joint partnerships. And so whenever any manufacturer started building cars in China for the Chinese market or otherwise, it was actually part of a joint manufacturing.

[Doug]

I don't want to a lot of those learning. I don't want to get into the politics.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Because I don't want Filippo to cry and I don't want Ken to tell us about how Emily's dad was there on January 6.

[Ken]

He was not there, but.

[Doug]

Emily doesn't exist. He was there in my mind. But I will say these cars are heavily tariffed and they're probably not going to come to the US even, even my beautiful, my beloved Sue 7. Not even the Su5. Not even the souffle. We'll make it to the US but.

[Filipo]

But it's such a long episode when.

[Doug]

You think about the Koreans and how long it and how they were able to make the strides. Hyundai came to the US in 86, Kia came in 95. Within 15 years they were there 25. It took Volkswagen 65 years to make products that are acceptable. And I would argue they're still not. Like, have you been in an Atlas Cross Sport and. But the Chinese are already like caught up. It's amazing how quickly this happened. Part of it is they don't have to go through the trouble of developing.

[Filipo]

Engines which makes a huge difference. Difference.

[Doug]

And the thing that's like successful for these cars is tech and they can do tech. Tech is pretty easy to do. And the Cyber store had like 18 screens.

[Filipo]

Right. How was the driving experience?

[Doug]

It was okay.

[Filipo]

I know you'll talk about it more.

[Doug]

In depth in my review video. Coming to the Doug Demiro, you. It was okay. It, it, it was pretty. The handling was pretty good considering it weighs 4,000 pounds. The steering got light at high speeds. Like it. Clearly the Chinese are not known for high performance vehicles or for track. They don't have a lot of Chinese F1 drivers.

[Filipo]

MG obviously has never been a car.

[Ken]

With power, so there's one.

[Doug]

But think about like Brazil gave us Senna. Brazil gave us Senna. The Brazilians know how to tune handling, right?

[Ken]

They build a lot of fast cars in Brazil.

[Doug]

We know about the Brazilian auto industry. Heck, yeah. Oh, yeah. People are going to be like, there is a Brazilian auto industry and there's 19 cars and they're really great. People are going to get so mad that we just did that. By the way, you know what? Brazilian VINs start with no. 9. Okay, we are talking cars. We've already moved.

[Filipo]

Can I sit? Since you brought up the Volkswagen atlas, I was thinking last night, legitimately, I was thinking about this last night as I was walking the dog. Are you familiar with Volkswagen's SUV naming scheme? Okay, there's the tier in Europe. There's the T. Rock. T Rock house, Tick.

[Doug]

What about it?

[Filipo]

Why doesn't Alice over the T?

[Doug]

Because it's not sold in Europe. It's sold in America.

[Filipo]

It's only in for the European markets that they care about the T's, apparently.

[Doug]

Do you know what Tiguan. Where they got that name?

[Filipo]

Isn't it some wind?

[Doug]

No, Tig for tiger and iguan. Because in Germany, in German, leguan apparently is the term for iguana. Tiger, iguana. Put them together. Tiguan. I'm not excited. I'm not making this up.

[Ken]

That's true. Verifiable.

[Doug]

This is real.

[Filipo]

But then why isn't the atlas, the.

[Doug]

Tatlas or the tialis would have been actually good, right? I would probably like it better.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Okay, Kenan, tell us your top cars story of the day.

[Ken]

So your favorite YouTuber.

[Doug]

My favorite YouTuber, Whistling Diesel. Yes.

[Ken]

Second favorite, good old Cody bought a car recently and it happens to be a car that we have had some feelings about. The market has as well, and that is the Ferrari SF90. So he bought a matte black Ferrari SF90.

[Doug]

Whistlin bought an SF90 and he posted on Instagram. He's all proud of his SF90. And I whistle dearly, obviously. Pull up the whistle. Can you do that? Oh, no, we can't pull up Instagram here, right? Yeah. I love whistling Dearly. He's a dear, dear friend of mine. We've texted twice. Both times I texted him and said, oh, my God. Whistling, I love you. And he said, who is this? Who is this guy, Please, I'm busy. And I said, no whistle. It's me, Doug. I love you. Okay, fine. Anyway, he just liked it. But he bought an SF90, which we don't. We're not fans of here on the pod.

[Filipo]

Single human.

[Doug]

No, people bought there. There's people who spent 6, 700,000.

[Filipo]

And there's been people that have spent four. Great.

[Ken]

Calls to dealerships. I said an Instagram that people are losing hundreds.

[Doug]

The SF90.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

It was like a 700 car with a. Got a lot of options. What's it worth now? Could I trade if I had a one to one for Toyota Goat? Would people do it?

[Ken]

I think people would be the right person would. Yeah. Yeah.

[Doug]

They. Yeah. So just take over payments.

[Filipo]

Oh they would be thrilled by that.

[Doug]

Probably a lot of people out there who are just gonna walk away from these.

[Ken]

I mean even in August, this one on our site was bid to 488. You got a sticker on that now you figure? I have. Let's see if we. Do you think there was in that one? Yeah.

[Doug]

What is that sticker?

[Ken]

And this was time when dealers were 21. So deers were gouging people.

[Doug]

It was a 21 this car.

[Ken]

Yeah.

[Doug]

What was the mileage?

[Ken]

Yeah, I'm guessing.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

2,600 miles.

[Doug]

This car lost $300,000. 226. No, it was a. Wasn't it a 650 sticker.

[Filipo]

Yeah. I mean.

[Ken]

But dealers were asking a lot over at the time too.

[Doug]

I mean 200 grand in 2600 miles.

[Filipo]

And there are more egregious examples.

[Ken]

I heard brag at the time about how they sold one for 890 or 900 and it was. And yeah, they're worth in a lot of cases. And again this was in August. They have depreciated substantially.

[Doug]

You know what's funny about this? We're talking about whistling. We're now on the SF90, but let's roll with it. Well, Ferrari. Ferrari for years sat on the sidelines of this market. Like the 600, $700,000 car. Like something above the sports cars. The 430 and the 458.

[Ken]

Like they said, below the supercars.

[Doug]

But below the supercars. And they only had the front engine V12s which while we loved them were not like for the. The kind of person who would buy one of the sports cars but wanted something more. There was nothing available for him. Right. Wouldn't be.

[Ken]

When you say you'd be a connoisseur.

[Doug]

Right. They finally come out with one at the worst possible time. And. And they don't limit the production.

[Filipo]

And what if it was a bad time? Is that it wasn't an attractive product.

[Doug]

Part of the mystique and desirability of expensive Ferraris is that you can. They're limited production and you can Flip them. And I think this car has taught Ferrari an interesting lesson which is the demand for the 599 SA Aperta. The reason those cars were selling for a million bucks in the aftermarket is not because a lot of people wanted a 599 SA Aperta. It's because there were 30 of them. And with that level of scarcity creates this interest and this mystique. There ain't 30 of these. There's 30 at every. @ every exotic car lot.

[Ken]

Yeah, that's pretty true. That is 75 by the way.

[Doug]

But nonetheless, does anyone have genuine interest in this car except for it can help them get on the list for the next special projects car? Or it could, you know what I'm saying? Like is there actually an interest in this car? Not at the price point.

[Ken]

I think there were. Well there are a number of things that led them to being. We'll get back to whistle and diesel. There are a number of things that led to this car depreciate. One is that it looks. It's very difficult to distinguish it for two people from the F8 which was in production at the same time.

[Doug]

They look the same.

[Ken]

They look the same. Except twice better.

[Doug]

The 296 looks better. Oklah. I am dead serious about this. Dead serious. People are gonna. On the comments break, you didn't mean that. I would rather have a 296 than SF90, I swear. Because at this performance level it doesn't. I'm. They're doing zero to six like two and a half seconds. I'm good. That's enough for me. It's like a 296 looks better. I swear.

[Ken]

And of course the fear with this car is like, like the law. Ferrari like was. Was the hybrid before it. You got to imagine that Ferrari will not support the technology of this car at all.

[Doug]

Right.

[Ken]

And so like the battery stuff, I'm sure that will be problematic for owners in the future. And so I think people are worried about that. And it's at this weird transitional time when people want the last of Ferraris. They want the last nav 12 Ferrari and like they're scrambling for that. And this is the next generation. People aren't as excited about that.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Ken]

But it is fascinating that it has depreciated so much to the point where whistling Diesel has bought one and we can only imagine.

[Doug]

Okay, so that's the question. Is whistling going to destroy it? Obviously we hope so.

[Ken]

We hope so.

[Doug]

And so do SF90 owners because that's one less. The problem is they're churning out like four a day. So you'd need like many whistlings, right? Like, is there a. Is there a Euro whistling? Who destroys.

[Ken]

If the video does well, maybe he'll do another one.

[Doug]

Europe, though, I don't think you're allowed to destroy things. I think, like, there's rules, like regulations.

[Ken]

Right, but not. Not for whistling Diesel.

[Filipo]

No.

[Doug]

In Tennessee you can destroy everyone and I bury it in the yard.

[Ken]

And so if he. If he does a great video series of destroying this thing, maybe it goes up in flames in a field. He might actually be someone who was able to make money on one of these cars and not lose hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars.

[Doug]

The first person who ever made money on an SF90, aside from the Ferrari dealer. Can I posit you something? Do you know that Whistlin said at 10 million subs he would get a Bugatti?

[Ken]

Dang, how many subscribers?

[Doug]

I don't know. But if you're not subbed, do it. If you're folks out there, if you're not subbed to whistling, you go sub to him now. So he blows up a Bugatti.

[Filipo]

He 8.5.

[Doug]

8.5.

[Ken]

Getting close.

[Doug]

He's getting there.

[Ken]

He's getting close.

[Filipo]

I will say he burned down an F8, right? That was a car.

[Doug]

Who signed in on this? You sub right now, right? Sub Cannon. Sub personally, what is this? This is like a cars sub for cars and bid supports. Whistling.

[Filipo]

He has personally owned cool cars, though, right? Like, he doesn't destroy all of them. I don't know, like a huracan or something, right?

[Doug]

He had a huracan that. Yeah, he had a huracan. Didn't he get from T.J. hunt? Yes, he did. We also love. I legitimately, I love tj. Okay, we got any other top car segments? Yes.

[Ken]

So we're coming to the end of the year. It's getting cold. And that means we're looking forward to next year. And I've started to look forward to autumn.

[Filipo]

It's 70 degrees today.

[Doug]

Well, in other parts of the country.

[Ken]

It'S bigger than San Diego, in case you forgot. I mean, he's lived here for like two years and he's already forgotten from Wisconsin. And he's like wearing a hoodie because it's 64 degrees and he's cold.

[Doug]

You know what I think so they.

[Filipo]

Want to advertise their merch. You know what I. Oh, for sale at merch.

[Doug]

You know, when he had to. When he grew up in Wisconsin, he had to walk around with the Name Filippo. And I bet he just wants to block that out.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Ken]

Do you just go by Phil?

[Filipo]

What do I go by now?

[Doug]

Well, you go by Filippo, but in California, people are a little bit more accepting of people named Filippo. Like, as a 13 year old in Wisconsin, I bet people are like, I bet there was some stuff. Philip. Philly.

[Ken]

I'm calling you Phil.

[Doug]

Yeah. Okay.

[Ken]

So anyway, look forward to events. And now is when you start to book stuff, events, because it get. It kind of books up quickly. So my friends and I, every year I go to Amelia Island. I haven't missed it last. Except for 2020. I haven't missed it the last, like, seven or eight years. Love going to Amelia Island. Can't wait to go this year.

[Doug]

You're going to Amelia? Yeah.

[Ken]

Going to me for sure. Of course you won't, but why not? Because it's in Florida. Yeah.

[Doug]

I do not like Florida. And by the way, to all the Floridians out there love Florida.

[Filipo]

Right?

[Doug]

No, I mean, I would. If I went, like, I'd go see and, like. And, like, pop in on that.

[Ken]

That was the first time I ever got to see you wear a suit.

[Doug]

Yeah. I was a judge at Amelia one.

[Ken]

Year, and a mirror caught fire driving up to get it to work.

[Doug]

I. I awarded an award to a Lamborghini mural. This is what happened.

[Filipo]

Okay.

[Doug]

You want me to tell the story?

[Ken]

Yeah, I was there. I watched it happen.

[Doug]

Okay. Hoovy and Tavares and I were judges at Amelia island one year. And the category we were judging Amelia. And a lot of these concourse events are trying to appeal to younger people. And the category we were judging was called, like, the Car that Would do best on YouTube or something. And I lived in Georgia at the time. I was thrilled to go down there. It was easy to go to Jacksonville. And so I did that. Hoovey was there, Tavares and I, we all wore suits, we all judged. And we awarded the award to a Cadillac deville limousine that the Pope was supposed to ride in on a visit to Latin America, but he did not.

[Filipo]

But still. Damn.

[Doug]

Now, the limousine was owned by the Peterson Museum, who declined the award, which actually is a wonderful thing because Peterson doesn't need awards. But the second place car was owned personally by a guy, and so he was gonna win the award. That's really cool. Like, Peterson, we don't need the Pope. Car doesn't need an award. Later, by the way, I tried to review the Pope car, and they're like, nah, that thing was blessed. You're not allowed To. I swear to God. So anyway. I swear. So anyway, we award it to a Miura. The Miura is driving up on stage because all the cars have to drive up on stage to collect the award. And as it's driving up, first off, we were supposed to present in the middle, and our word kept getting pushed back and back and back because the mirror wouldn't start. Finally, they're award best in show. And it's like our awards gotta go up. Like, it can't go after best in show. And they get the Miura started and it's driving up onto the stage and it catches on fire as Miura's do. Well, Balboni is there. And so Balboni walk runs over and he's like fanning it. He's got, like a jacket. He's like, fanning the flames on this mirror that's on fire. And I'm sitting there thinking, this was what it was like in Santa Agata in 1967. I'm watching a flashback. Valentino Balboni is trying to put out a fire on Amira. This happened.

[Ken]

Yeah. He knew what he was doing. It wasn't his first time, but then he also, like, continued. And then he worked on it like he has. Jack Bob was, like, in there. Like, it was incredible to watch.

[Doug]

Like, the car never made it up. Of course.

[Ken]

This is like when you're at a million for this particular thing, there's, like. It's, like cordoned off. Like, there are, like rows of seats to sit in to watch this happen.

[Doug]

Right.

[Ken]

Like, it's a big event. It's a big. Everybody is there watching it. This poor car.

[Doug]

After a big resto, too, I heard later. Anyway.

[Filipo]

Award it.

[Doug]

I don't know. I think he did get the award.

[Filipo]

Yeah, he deserved it.

[Ken]

But, boy, was that. That must have been so embarrassing and terrifying at the same time.

[Doug]

But you get a great story.

[Ken]

How many people have had Valentina well.

[Doug]

Before it was delivered blow on their car? Yeah, no, a lot. That don't know. Probably me. Okay. But anyway, your point is, I'm going to show. Yeah.

[Ken]

Go into Amelia for sure. Debating going to Scottsdale, which is in January, which is a little bit earlier, but I'm not sure if we're gonna be able to do that.

[Doug]

I would like.

[Ken]

Definitely going to car week next year. Already booked a house, my friends. We're ready to go.

[Doug]

Yeah, got to be.

[Ken]

You have to be.

[Doug]

Right.

[Ken]

That thing about these big events.

[Filipo]

A week before you went, but. Yeah.

[Ken]

Well, sometimes you look out, but not always. And in this Particular case we got more of where we want to stay in Carmel and all that stuff. But yeah, I'm starting to look forward to more events and there are other ones I'd like to do. I'd really would love to figure a way to go to the Bridges in the Hamptons. Seems like an incredible event. Would love to be able to attend that at some stage.

[Doug]

But there are a couple cars and caffeine and carburetors in New Canaan. Will you go with me to that? I've never been to that.

[Ken]

You haven't been?

[Doug]

No, it's always. I'm always on Nantucket. I don't want to go to Connecticut for that. I would love to.

[Ken]

If you could find out if you could get over to Connecticut.

[Doug]

I know I ought to do it. It's an amazing event. It's like a very casual cars and coffee. But like McLaren F1 show up. Like it's like. It's the craziest casual cars and coffee in existence because they only hold like three a year. Like the spring, the summer and the fall. And so unlike like a weekly one, like big stuff shows up to that, you know.

[Ken]

The other one that's getting kind of is the Audrain. Audrain. The Audrey Museum in. In Rhode island does a Concord and that's starting to really take off.

[Filipo]

Last year you went and filmed at their museum. Although the cars got.

[Ken]

Two years ago it got rained out, unfortunately.

[Doug]

You know what I'd love to do one year?

[Ken]

Great people.

[Doug]

I got a list. I got to make a list of car events. I want to go to another one. Honestly. Is. Is. Is Detroit. Woodward. Woodward is cool.

[Ken]

Oh, Woodward.

[Doug]

Yeah. It's the same week as pebble though is the problem. And so I would rather go to pebble but Woodward just on a normal Saturday night. Woodward is cool as hell. And I sure during the Dream Cruise it's really cool. Goodwood would be cool to go to. Yep, good.

[Filipo]

What?

[Ken]

Yeah, Revival and Festival Speed are both on my list. Not for this year, but I would like to like to get to those eventually.

[Doug]

Monaco gp, Monica GP Historics.

[Ken]

Monaco Historics. Le Mans Classic is another one I like to go to. There are a bunch. But right now for this year, definitely going to be. Definitely going to carry.

[Doug]

So if you're going to Amelia or to car week, look for Kennen. Yeah, he'll be there and say hello.

[Ken]

I don't bite.

[Doug]

He'll talk E39M5 with you if you've got an E39M5 if you want an E39M5. If you want to just hear Ken and do his thing and talk about the E39 M5 or talk about.

[Ken]

Or we're talking about Ferraris.

[Doug]

Oh, yeah, yeah. He'll talk about.

[Ken]

I like a lot of other cars. I just happen to really love the M5.

[Doug]

He'll talk about other stuff, too, but he'd prefer. We'd all prefer to talk about the E39 M5. On that subject, we must move on to the market report, which is brought to you by Cars and Bids app to download. We have an app. Did you know? We have an app. Did you know?

[Filipo]

I didn't. I didn't.

[Doug]

We got tons of downloads on this.

[Filipo]

You know what we should talk about instead? We have a video series right now. We got a video where Doug bought a car. He bought a new duck car. Ken and I also bought vehicles. Nick showed up, as did Aversa.

[Doug]

Actually bought a car.

[Filipo]

And we went out earlier this week. A video went live where we did some challenges. The Doug ideated that were a little bit evil. And then next week, it'll be the final.

[Doug]

We got a video series where we got check cars. Sean's looking at me. Why? We got a video series where we got. We took cars to the desert and it was amazing.

[Filipo]

It was legitimately a great time.

[Doug]

Is going to be even better.

[Filipo]

I drag race a Corvette like I am in a Corvette and I drag race other people.

[Doug]

Boom. It's. And if you haven't watched it yet, I don't. I don't like you.

[Filipo]

Why did we do all of this, Doug?

[Doug]

We did it because we got merch now. Merch cars and bids.com YouTube can wear a gray shirt with gray pants. What do you have, Kenneth?

[Ken]

I've got the countach shirt on, which is one of my. I don't know if that angle.

[Doug]

LP5000. It should be LP5000s, but we'll move on.

[Filipo]

And then I have a Karogi tea.

[Doug]

T. Filippo, can you imagine people wearing?

[Filipo]

But there's also great hats.

[Doug]

There are.

[Filipo]

And also, every dollar you spend on the merch store enters you into the.

[Doug]

Possibility of winning one of the cars from our desert car challenge series. You could win Filippo. C6 Corvette.

[Filipo]

You could.

[Doug]

Okay, this ad was way too long. It was not intended to be an ad. You can also ignore all that and just listen to the pod. The next. I want to talk about the SC430. Pull it up.

[Filipo]

Yeah. Strong sale.

[Doug]

Pull it up. Pull it up. We sold an SC430 for 48,000 United States dollars. This really happened. This is by the way, this was a pre facelift SC430. If you're in the SC430 community, you know what I'm talking about. I again want to state that all the enthusiasts who lined up around the original Lexus SC being like it's a driftmobile, it has a 2JZ, they did a V8 were all outshone by old people who prefer this. And the market loves this car, loves.

[Filipo]

A 7,000 mile version.

[Doug]

Yeah, it had low miles but we've these sell for big money still.

[Filipo]

They do. An IS250C sells for nine with that makes 280 horsepower. How much?

[Doug]

90.

[Filipo]

In my head it was 290 but I decided to cut it down 300.

[Doug]

Big boy.

[Filipo]

Dang.

[Doug]

Dang.

[Filipo]

Wow.

[Ken]

Well, there is demand for these even there has been for a long time. When I worked at that exotic car dealership. You actually wrote for Autotrader and you wrote an article on one of our cars which had I think it was like 151 miles. Memory serves me, I mean and the guy who bought it emailed us and he was like I have one with. It was a very weird email. He said I have one with 26,000 miles. It's worn out and I want to get a new one. I can't anymore.

[Doug]

So I bought it. They don't sell it anymore.

[Ken]

And so he bought it from us.

[Doug]

Yeah, no way.

[Ken]

It went to Florida.

[Filipo]

Of course it did.

[Doug]

So I mean a lot of it's California. Looks like Santa Barbara. Of course it was.

[Filipo]

What color is it?

[Doug]

Black or the purple?

[Ken]

Purple.

[Doug]

I just want to say legitimately these SC 430s are insane. It's unbelievable how much they sell for. And the mark the not the 2JZ powered rear wheel drive sporty SC market is hot. The SC430 old guy market is hot. I remember when this car came out and I was a kid it was like 2002 and people were so mad car enthusiasts online the forums were like they ruined the Lexus sc. Yeah, ruined it so much they created a giant market of people who love them.

[Filipo]

Top Gear's worst car ever, right?

[Doug]

Yeah, Top Gear.

[Ken]

Worst car in the world ever.

[Doug]

Laughed at it because it was such a depart a bad departure from the this is just a great example of how car enthusiasts have no clue that what the general public is looking for.

[Filipo]

And also car like old E320 cabriolets Mercedes also worth surprising money like there's.

[Doug]

Demand for regular, comfortable, reliable the A320.

[Filipo]

Famously a four door car.

[Ken]

This one you could technically save a 430 convertible.

[Doug]

Oh damn. You got a 430 Spider.

[Ken]

And then that shows up. It's like.

[Filipo]

Well, I will also say we think that this or we know this is the highest public sale of an SE430.

[Doug]

What about when it was new and they cost 70 grand?

[Filipo]

Public sale in an auction. Secondary auction. I don't know.

[Doug]

No, but you're right. Speaking of strong numbers, we got a.

[Filipo]

Record for the Autozam AZ1. And the best part of this is that we got a record for the Autozam AZ1. The last time this same AZ1 sold.

[Doug]

This AZ1 just sold for 2500, which is an AZ1 record. And like Filippo said, this autos, this AZ1 previously set a record on cars and bid the last AZ1 record which.

[Filipo]

Had not been broken yet, which was 34. Yeah, we broke it for the same that car. But post a bunch of modifications. Doug reviewed. This car belonged to Kevin, who you've seen on the. On this.

[Doug]

I've driven. I've driven this car. The record breaker.

[Ken]

It was great.

[Doug]

It was great.

[Ken]

Love driving. Little and buzzy.

[Doug]

Little and buzzy.

[Filipo]

That's what you want though.

[Doug]

Like the Countach, but littler.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Fuzzier, but very similar.

[Ken]

You can redline it first, second and third gear and not be doing 40 something.

[Filipo]

That is something special.

[Doug]

Japan, dude. It's a wild place.

[Filipo]

40 grand is a lot of money for a car that's not that low. Mileage like these are desirable. Like just legit. Well presented, nicely modified.

[Doug]

Well, they deserve to be. They're pretty.

[Filipo]

They're pretty cool.

[Doug]

All these K cars are kind of dumb except for like this one.

[Filipo]

And that was exactly the take I was gonna have this.

[Doug]

The Beat and the cappuccino are all cool.

[Filipo]

The Beat cappuccino are worth very little because they are like normal cars.

[Doug]

Well, and they were made in much higher numbers. I think that's the reason because I actually.

[Filipo]

I think they're all cool. They're not.

[Doug]

The Beat is the more drivable one. Yeah, it's pretty big inside the Beat And I had zebra pattern seats. They all did. Oe swear to you. I swear to you. Zebra. My bad. With a zed. But the AZ one. And do you remember what the Suzuki version was called?

[Filipo]

The Suzuki cappuccino. We just.

[Doug]

There was a Suzuki version of this.

[Filipo]

Yes, I do. The. Oh my goodness.

[Doug]

Suzuki Cara or Kara.

[Filipo]

I was gonna say Sarah, but then I thought that that's a Toyota. Toyota Sarah.

[Doug]

Anyway, the point is this made money, it deserved to make money. It's cool as hell. And there's other. Other market report things to discuss. Canon, give us something.

[Ken]

Yes. So we recently sold a car that, like, stands out in my mind now. I love the GT3. Wonderful car. This 991.1 GT3 sold for 20 for $118,900.

[Doug]

You understand the can of worms you're bringing up here?

[Ken]

Yes, it's a tip.

[Doug]

It's a tip.

[Ken]

And it had the engine thing, but Porsche recalled all of them.

[Doug]

Do you know what, the engine thing.

[Filipo]

Yeah, they recall them, replace everything.

[Doug]

They're exploding well.

[Filipo]

But then they replace them.

[Ken]

They recalled all of them and they also recalled them quickly, which people don't.

[Doug]

Really realize the engines were exploding.

[Filipo]

Well, now they don't because they've been fixed. Replaced rather.

[Ken]

Well, they don't because they've been fixed.

[Doug]

Okay, but we're trying to sell these cars.

[Filipo]

Yeah, these things are there continued issues, like, I'm sure that should be priced down.

[Doug]

There have been a couple, but that's true of every car. I. Yes, they've been recalled and replaced. But they are all tips.

[Ken]

Yes, they are all tips. And I realize that. However, 996 GT3s, the first GT3 offer in the United States, 96.2. Those on average, according to classic.com are selling for about, on average the last five years, selling for 118 grand or $108,000. So for $10,000 more, you get that rather, which I think I probably would too.

[Filipo]

But this is objectively.

[Ken]

That is pretty like that is to.

[Doug]

Put it in perspective, these are fun. These are cool, these are modern, which the996 GT3 cannot even remotely claim. Yeah, that's a stick, though. I love how the 996 GT3 looks. I will say that I think more to the overall point here, it's interesting that you can still get a couple of 911 GT3s in the low hundreds, because there was a time when I was younger that 997 GT3s were in that market. In fact, every GT3 when it was new was 150 grand, and then it depreciated to 100 when it was used. Those days are over, like. And they're not even really depreciating much. So.

[Ken]

No, I mean, if you want to.

[Doug]

Spend 100 GS and be like, have a cool Porsche, a GT3,996 or this.

[Ken]

Drive to really drive and use, I mean, this is.

[Doug]

Yeah. Because the thing about these cars, this is also like the996 in general thing about these cars is they're the bad GT3. And everybody kind of knows that, but.

[Ken]

They'Re still a GT3.

[Doug]

It's like saying the bad cannon like you still have canon.

[Ken]

Well, that's very kind. Thank you.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

I don't know who the comparison point would be for that, but this, I think this Sean producer, I love the idea of this car for. I mean, granted it's still a lot of money, but relative to other GT3s, considering the 997.1 GT3 is 150,000, what.

[Doug]

Is the new GT3 cost? MSRP today?

[Filipo]

You gotta assume 200 something.

[Ken]

Oh, yeah, one assumes new GT3 MSRP 183.

[Doug]

222. 5. Oh, for the dotted 222 5.

[Ken]

220.

[Doug]

So this is half price. I mean, I get your point. It will always have the stigma though, if you show up PCA gatherings. It's like the Boxster of GT3. But you're right. Drive if you just want to go drive.

[Ken]

Yeah. And admittedly if you maybe you can't drive manual or something like that, or you want to be able to use it on a more frequent basis or.

[Filipo]

You want the fastest track speeds.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

Or you're going for times. I. I think it's a very compelling buy.

[Doug]

Let's talk gsf.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

You have an interesting point here.

[Filipo]

We sold a GSF the other day. We have one live right now. But we also sold one earlier this.

[Doug]

Week for 55, 55 US.

[Filipo]

The this car had an 85K sticker.

[Doug]

85 stick. So over the course seven years ago.

[Filipo]

Seven years ago. And reasonable number of miles. I mean they had what, 40,000. Some of that. Scroll down 40,000. An. An F90 M5 also worth 55.

[Doug]

Pull up a new table up that.

[Filipo]

F90 M5 that the motor's one that we sold had a 115 sticker.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Filipo]

So depreciation is wild. I mean same sale price, similar mileage.

[Doug]

If memory a little newer. Less miles sold for two grand to five.

[Filipo]

Right.

[Doug]

The Lexus sold for more. For more. So the BMW is newer with less.

[Filipo]

Miles and depreciated twice as much.

[Doug]

What was the horsepower number on the BMW? Because isn't the difference insane? What's it on this 467.

[Filipo]

But the GSFs are remaining so desirable.

[Doug]

It's true with the ISFs too. People want reliability, used car market values, different things. But I think this is a great point. I wanted to Talk about this because you found. I didn't realize this was happening. The GSF has all race cars. Cars aren't that old. The GSF has already overtaken the M5 and used desirability already.

[Filipo]

After 7 years the market.

[Doug]

I'm gonna, I'm gonna throw out something. The market does not trust high performance.

[Filipo]

BMW engines, especially M5. Especially on five engines.

[Doug]

I think that's true though of all of them. Look at x6ms. Look at x5ms. Okay.

[Filipo]

Well, I mean, sorry. Especially the. I think M3s have a little bit of a buffer there.

[Doug]

I don't know man. ISS the market does not trust used.

[Ken]

BMW because after the warranty period ends, that's when the problems start coming.

[Filipo]

Gsf. There's a couple of small things that are known in the community but like.

[Doug]

And I don't have problems. I've driven both these cars pretty significantly. The M5 drives way better. Way better. First off, it's a newer generation of automobile and but the next, well, no.

[Ken]

Offense, it's an M5.

[Doug]

It's an M5. It drives amazing. It's got way more power. It's faster. I felt this car was, was excellent but dynamically could have improved. The powertrain is fine but like 467 horse is not 600.

[Filipo]

The M5 has 20 more horsepower.

[Doug]

To be perfectly honest. If I'm thinking about one of these, I'm thinking gsf like it's got, it's going to be reliable. Buy the used off warranty car. Plus you can get that blue with those gold.

[Filipo]

Looking at that mouse infotainment thing, that was bad. But like that's what you're signing up for and you're paying more than an F90 M5 and I don't blame you.

[Doug]

Yep.

[Filipo]

I also would.

[Doug]

Yep.

[Ken]

Mom.

[Doug]

You think about people want these. Well, that's because you're willing to delegate the cars. And I will say the value differential between the two as it widens will be what the market feels that you need to spend to get the M5 to a level of drivability that the GSF is already at. Right. Like, like if it's a 10 grand difference, the market then values the extra power at this. And, and then the rest of the value differential is that spend. And you're a guy who spends on his cars. And that makes sense. It does drive better.

[Ken]

Yeah. But I, I drive. So I, I would drive.

[Doug]

And you spend and you spend. And that's the thing because there are a lot of other people who drive. But can't outlay that level of or.

[Filipo]

Aren'T willing to put up with the. Will it start today?

[Ken]

To be clear, both these cars are automatics. I'd never consider either.

[Doug]

But nonetheless, I'm glad you're on this pod because you are like a lot of grumpy car enthusiasts. We need to have that.

[Ken]

I've never had. Never had an automatic. Only.

[Doug]

There we go.

[Filipo]

I've only owned one.

[Ken]

Yeah, but you found one and you didn't.

[Filipo]

It wasn't something I have needs to say this.

[Doug]

I got more manuals than the two of you put together. Put you two together. I got more.

[Filipo]

I have a higher proportion of manuals. Yeah, I have to think about that. I have a higher proportion of males.

[Doug]

No, I got three out of six. We got both the same 50%, Ken. And the wins that nonetheless, I do have three. And the two of you put together. Only have two. Okay, we got to move on to questions. Questions. Questions are sponsored by Filippo. Yeah, personally. He does the logical thing. Okay, questions first. Now remember, you can ask us questions, too. Carsandbids.com and then click the Communities tab and there will be a post there that says, hey, ask us questions. We are not podcasting next week. Next week is Thanksgiving in America. Instead of podcasting, we will be giving thanks.

[Filipo]

And will we post on Twitter?

[Doug]

Oh, yeah, I might do that. I kind of left Twitter because it's kind of a cesspool.

[Filipo]

Can you do it on.

[Doug]

I'll do it on Twitter just for you.

[Filipo]

What about like, Facebook or Instagram?

[Doug]

I'll do it on All Blue Sky. True Social.

[Filipo]

I don't know. Take your pick.

[Doug]

I'll pop it onto True Social would do well there. Okay, first question for Max McCullough. Hi, Doug. Can we get a swear jar on the podcast? Except instead for swearing. It's for Ken whenever he brings up the Ether nine. Five. Folks. Ken, there's a complaint on the. On the. Whenever you read the comments that can. I'm talking about his ether 5. Too much. First off, a couple things. Kenan has more depth in car than he reveals on the podcast. Yeah, Kennan is a big Ferrari enthusiast. He talks about Ferrari with me way more than we talk about the ether 9m5. But also, this is who Cannon is, Right? That'd be like telling Filippo not to be logical and sensible and reasonable. The other last night, I asked Filipo what his favorite color is, and he said, I don't have one. And then he clarified his favorite color used to be blue.

[Filipo]

Yeah, there was a time and decided.

[Doug]

He didn't want a favorite color anymore. Just. It wasn't that important.

[Ken]

It would offend the other colors.

[Filipo]

I no longer felt notable. It wasn't a color that I identified with especially.

[Doug]

So, like, you're giving Ken and crap like you could. You should get to know Filipo.

[Ken]

I have to. I have to admit there's a meme in my friend group about you.

[Filipo]

And it's.

[Ken]

Every time we bring up a car that you're going to buy, you always mention something, then you never buy anything. That's.

[Filipo]

That's the meme I reach out sometimes. There's two cars that I strongly consider.

[Doug]

Waste the time of dealers.

[Filipo]

I do not.

[Doug]

I don't waste car dealer time unless I'm buying.

[Filipo]

The last time you bought a car, I reached out to dealers on your behalf.

[Doug]

Yeah, we were ready to buy and you negotiated me a discount of $0.

[Ken]

But as I dab right in the middle.

[Doug]

Have we ever told the story on the pod?

[Filipo]

I don't think so.

[Doug]

We've never told this story on the pod.

[Filipo]

I gotta tell the story.

[Doug]

It's such a good story. Okay. I wanted to buy a Toyota Sequoia TRD Pro, right? And there. It had just come out a year earlier, but there were used ones that had already flooded.

[Filipo]

2.

[Doug]

There were a few. There were two new ones I couldn't find at sticker. And used ones were like, not all at sticker either, but almost.

[Filipo]

There were two TRD Pro in white, which was the requirement.

[Doug]

Want the roof rack, remember?

[Filipo]

Right. It was a very. There were legitimately two cars in the car.

[Doug]

And I didn't want the red interior.

[Filipo]

And you didn't want the gun box.

[Doug]

I didn't want the gun storage safe, actually. I would have been happy with that. You never know what's going to happen. And so. And anyway, so Filipo, I said to Filipo, look, I need to buy this car, but I really don't want to do it myself. Filippo loves, like, the car buying process and like, dealing with dealers. He loves it. So I was like, why don't you negotiate this for me? So we find one in Ohio. It was in. It was in. It was near where Kenan is from, actually northeast Ohio.

[Ken]

Kent, Ohio, I think, is where it was.

[Doug]

And we find it, Toyota of Kent. And Filippo reaches out and he says, listen, I'm interested in Sequoia. And they were asking 82 or something.

[Filipo]

Which, by the way, like, for the few grand below sticker.

[Doug]

A few grand below, right at stake. It was like the cheapest One.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

And so Felipe said, I'm interested in this. And so that the people, they start going at the negotiation, right? Yeah. Filippo offers 80. And they said, no, 81. No. 81. Five. And eventually they say no. And Filippo goes, okay, we'll take it for the 82. Then I will say this was a day of negotiations.

[Filipo]

It took time. And also, it's really hard to negotiate when it is already the cheapest one in the country. There's two for sale, period. And Doug is willing to spend it.

[Doug]

Was willing to do it. So at the end of all this, they didn't. They never. They found out. They discovered, like, my name, but they. No one at the dealer knew who I was. And so there was no, like, benefit that I got from being me. So at the end of the day, this is all true. At the end of the day, they call me up and they're like, all right, we need to get your information. Take a deposit, get it done. I gave them my credit, my driver's license, and then they went dark.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Doug]

And two days later, they call me. They're like, we. We sold it to a local buyer. So not only did Filipo spend a day negotiating and get the. The price down $0, but we didn't even get the car. But.

[Filipo]

But there was a. The other one in the country was in Nevada. And I did negotiate about a couple grand.

[Doug]

And then Doug. 200 bucks. You got off the Nevada.

[Filipo]

I got like a grand off. And then Doug backed out for this Ohio one. And then I had to write the. The very kind salesperson who I talked to a lot on the phone, a review on Google reviews, because he didn't get a sale out of it because Doug wanted the specific car.

[Ken]

You were the person.

[Doug]

So after that, we found a new one. Okay, next question is from. But that was my favorite. That was the Philippe. He spent a day negotiating, got the price down $0. And we. So then we met at Ask, and we still didn't get the call. That is a fully fun.

[Filipo]

Last week, I reached out about a green C7 Corvette that was for sale at dealership in Sacramento. And I emailed back and forth with one of their online salespeople who was very helpful. And I, like, I thought they were a little bit high on their price, and I thought if they got down like two grand, we'd be in the right spot.

[Ken]

Two grand.

[Filipo]

They refused.

[Doug]

He refused, and they sold it to somebody else the next. For their asking price.

[Ken]

He lost it over 2G.

[Filipo]

Well, I was only willing to pay the Market appropriate price.

[Doug]

Okay, we got to go over a couple more questions. Next question is from poo. It's actually underscore poo. If you had to daily drive a car worth over a million dollars, what would you pick? It's a good one.

[Filipo]

Can you list some cars that are worth over a million dollars?

[Ken]

250 losers. So what other.

[Doug]

I mean isn't she run?

[Ken]

The answer she wrote is definitely the answer because it's more reliable than its predecessor.

[Doug]

But also it's just like it's usable.

[Ken]

It's a. It's a Bentley that happens to be able to do 260 miles an hour.

[Doug]

It would be annoying to drive around in a Shiron though. People would be excited about it. Courage. Nobody looks at you could drive that.

[Ken]

But it's would be tough.

[Filipo]

Tell design Columbus.

[Doug]

I tell design Columbus. I can't imagine the mill, right? Like if they wanted a mill says over.

[Ken]

It's not the objection to daily use. It's the objection that it's not worth.

[Doug]

Like like I remember I tried to buy that car from a television design and they refuse to sell to me because it is part of our heritage. And I'm thinking myself huh, not a good part.

[Filipo]

Okay, it says over a mil. You think I offer them 10?

[Doug]

I don't. I would have been willing to go up to 150 cash. And you know what? Those Italian design houses are all kind of perpetually in financial. I should stay in. I should stay in contact.

[Ken]

Hit him again.

[Doug]

I should hit him again. It's like the Gilmore Girls wrangler. I should hit him again.

[Ken]

I think the Chiron is probably the correct answer there.

[Doug]

You got a better answer? He doesn't know any cars over.

[Filipo]

I don't know any cars over a million.

[Doug]

Probably the she though. Yeah.

[Ken]

I don't think the Lagonda tariff is over a million anymore.

[Doug]

No, it's not. I thought about that because what other like luxury cars over a million bucks, right? It's all sports cars. And so I guess the question is asking what super high end sports car is the most reasonable not to get caught up in how much do you.

[Filipo]

Think Mercedes would charge me for their S213 off road version?

[Doug]

Remember the portal axle 450 pull that up. That is a possibility.

[Filipo]

They told me for.

[Doug]

Hey, by the way, what about a 6x6G? Those aren't a million bucks anymore though.

[Ken]

What should I be looking for?

[Doug]

Just type in E450 portal accurate. Yeah, E454x4 squared is I think what they call it. What they called it, you got to type in E4E400.E class.E class wagon.

[Filipo]

It may have been, it may have been an E400 at the time.

[Doug]

Wagon 4x4 squared. And then just hit enter. You don't have to delete portal. I can just hit it. There it is. Yeah, there it is.

[Filipo]

Wow.

[Doug]

I don't think that'd be a million bucks though.

[Filipo]

But I would, I would, I would pay him a million just to have.

[Doug]

Answer this question.

[Ken]

Oh, yeah, Nah. Sharon's answer. I was gonna say, what do you think Volkswagen would want for their GTI W12?

[Doug]

No. Oh, okay. Next question comes from. Oh, yes. Yes. Fellas, what is the best example of a car that wasn't sold in America but if it was, it would have been a financial success. Success. This is a great question. Everybody's always like, what do you want to import? What would have been a success? The answer is the Nissan Terra. Pull it up.

[Ken]

Nissan Terra.

[Doug]

The Nissan Terra. Here is a fun fact.

[Filipo]

Or Terra 2, which is a different.

[Doug]

Vehicle for our audience that doesn't know you're thinking the Toronto.

[Filipo]

I am thinking of the Toronto 2.

[Doug]

Here's a fun fact for our audience that doesn't know the Nissan Xterra, which was a body on frame, SUV ish thing that was relatively successful. It was canceled in the US after the 2015 model year. Right. When off roading became a thing. Like they canceled it and then the market blew up. But for our American audience that doesn't know, Nissan continued to make the Xterra in other markets called simply the Terra. And it wasn't as cool looking, but it was still pretty trucky and capable. And they never sold it here at sell in Asia. I think that Nissan's biggest mistake, and Nissan has made a ton of mistakes like it's wild. But their biggest mistake was getting rid of the Xterra the day before off roading became a thing.

[Filipo]

Yeah, it's a good example.

[Doug]

And they could have sold this in the US and done well, maybe a boxier version of it.

[Filipo]

Yeah. In a similar vein, I think that the current Gen Gymney would have sold well for a year or two.

[Doug]

I think it would have been a.

[Filipo]

Hit and then people would have realized it's not a good car. But people drive a lot of bad cars.

[Doug]

People drive a lot of bad cars. It's cool looking and it's cheap. Right.

[Filipo]

I think it would have done. It would have been hard to federalize, like to get it to pass.

[Doug]

Suzuki. Suzuki. It's such a shame about Suzuki. They left the US market like the day before. They started making desirable cars. The Swift. Swift is cool too. They had the ignis before.

[Filipo]

I know it became desirable.

[Doug]

What was that weird looking Suzuki hatchback thing? We're not going to get into this.

[Ken]

Do you think the R34 GTR if it had been sold in the US would have been pretty successful but the.

[Doug]

Problem was it would have just been hard and they came out with the next one.

[Ken]

Well, I'm aware but that's not the spirit of the question.

[Filipo]

This is a key area.

[Doug]

Yeah, I think that, I think that they would have been successful with that car just because there was so much hype about it at that time. But decisions were made years before the hype started and it's such a shame.

[Ken]

But the NDR 35 killed it in the end.

[Doug]

They are R34 GTRs are now legal. They're not left hand drive. There are some conversions but it's a shame.

[Filipo]

And they're real money Aereo area.

[Doug]

No, I was thinking of some. I think I was thinking of the. Some sort of ignis hatchback. Anyway, we'll discuss off camera.

[Filipo]

All right, we will.

[Doug]

Big Ultima Hater 6 asks a very interesting question. Do you think the electric G wagon will face the same depreciation of other ev? For those of you who don't know an EV that was purchased last year is today worth the same as a pencil sharpener? Does that apply to the G wagon? No, just a regular manual. Does that apply to the electric G wagon? Because the G wagon has always had incredibly strong depreciation.

[Filipo]

It is not depreciation incredibly strong.

[Doug]

Is it going to follow the depreciation curve of an EV or the depreciation curve of a G wagon?

[Filipo]

Well, I'm going to. I think that the question is a bit of an issue. During COVID G550s had no depreciation. They are depreciating, but not, not, not as ranges. I think that they will have depreciation like somewhere between there and most other.

[Doug]

If they do. I want one. If I can pick one of these up for 65, I want.

[Filipo]

I think you've got a couple of years if demand is strong while supply is still low. But then I don't think they stay up.

[Ken]

I'm scared. I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't. The thing with the G is that even what props of older G values is. They all look the same and like. I don't think that. I don't, I Think the demand will be sufficiently high for that car for a pretty long time because you sacrifice basically nothing.

[Filipo]

Fair point.

[Ken]

And you can drive around for people who want to. They want a G, but they want to signal to people that they're environmentally conscious. A lot of stars in la.

[Filipo]

Yeah.

[Ken]

They want the electric one.

[Doug]

That's true.

[Ken]

And I don't.

[Filipo]

And it does look like every other.

[Doug]

G. The thing about the G Wagon is the only reason everybody wants one, we would all be driving one. Except the image is horrible.

[Ken]

Image is tough.

[Doug]

And then there are some people who don't care about that and just do it anyway.

[Filipo]

And they're the ones creating. Right.

[Doug]

But. But now here's an opportunity to get out of the Teslas and get back into a G and do the electric thing. Like you said. I would love to have one. I think they're cool.

[Ken]

It was.

[Filipo]

Kenny makes a good point. They might not appreciate.

[Doug]

I think they're going to depreciate like a G Wagon and not like an ev. I agree with Ken.

[Ken]

Looks the same. Yeah, it looks the same. They did not mess with the design.

[Doug]

The right car. It drives well.

[Ken]

Yeah.

[Doug]

It's fast, it's. It's bulky and brawny. That's what people like.

[Filipo]

Driving around in traffic in la. Who cares?

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Ken]

And you're sitting in silence and like it actually might be nice. It might be more desirable than the gas one for some people.

[Doug]

Yeah. Okay. We can do two more questions. Okay, two more questions. One of them is ridiculous and one of them is good. The good one is from Ryan. Jg. Jg. If you were to all choose a different car for the eighteen thousand dollar enthusiast challenge, what car would you choose? Panamera Turbo.

[Filipo]

Knowing the challenges or not knowing the challenges? Yeah, knowing the challenge, which most people don't yet know all the challenges.

[Doug]

But what would you choose? I would. I legit would choose a Panamera Turbo. It's a good choice. Yeah.

[Filipo]

It's arguably a better choice than what you made.

[Doug]

It is arguably a better choice. Yeah. I didn't put a lot of thought into it when we. When Sean, actually what you like what.

[Filipo]

You said when we proposed it was, I will only do this if I'm in a Cayenne.

[Doug]

Didn't I also say or a Panamera. I think you may have, but definitely wanted a kind preferred a kind.

[Filipo]

I think for if I'm like just buying an $18,000 car, the two that come to mind, besides the C6 Corvette that I did buy, an S2000, you can get a pretty nice S2000 for 18. You can also get a mediocre 996, 911. Neither would have been better for these challenges. The C6 would have been. Is the right car for the challenges. But Filippo, interesting cars.

[Ken]

You think in the drag race.

[Doug]

No, no, no, no.

[Filipo]

That's what I'm saying.

[Doug]

You would choose an S2.

[Filipo]

I'm thinking out. People don't know there's drag race yet in the. The. In the challenges. I think that those would have both performed worse than the car I chose. But I like if I would have.

[Doug]

Been good $18,000 car. What about you? What if we had forced you to not have an E39 M5?

[Ken]

I bet 60 M5 had to stop a lot for fuel. No, E60 M5 was another one.

[Doug]

I34 M5.

[Ken]

But man, for the Price Ranger and they some tough E60s.

[Filipo]

I don't know.

[Ken]

We would have made it. And they're all S. Smg, obviously. But then I was thinking. Yeah. If I were thinking Automatic, I considered W211E55AMGs. Those are right in that price range. And that is a better car.

[Doug]

I want to switch to that now. What you take? I already have it.

[Ken]

Too late. I said it. You can have. Yeah, you can have a wagon. Yeah, but those aren't.

[Doug]

Those are good. That's. Okay, fine. Those are 60m5 actually. Would have been funny and interesting.

[Ken]

Yeah. But it would have exploded.

[Doug]

Okay, last question.

[Filipo]

Three for 18.

[Ken]

Good luck charging, Filippo.

[Doug]

Okay, final question is from Nick. She. And it is. Kenan, go over to the thing. The question is. I have an important question. Is the thing here a fake air intake or a blinker signal on the little blinker.

[Filipo]

Obviously you think it's a blinker. It's where the side indicator is. Yeah.

[Doug]

Okay. What do you think?

[Ken]

Yeah, I thought it was a blinker.

[Doug]

Suicide door handle.

[Filipo]

Okay. That is the other option.

[Ken]

I agree with that. But like, you'd be opening this half of the car. Like, it'd be open the fender of the car.

[Filipo]

Also, I love our designer dearly. I don't think he thought about doors.

[Doug]

No, I think it's one of those. A lot of cars have, like, fake intake vents there.

[Filipo]

No, no, it's a. It's a side indicator. No, and it better be amber.

[Doug]

By law. I think they're always amber on the side.

[Filipo]

I think in other markets they can be white.

[Ken]

You advise you advised on the logo? Yeah, surely. When I remember being pitched this and.

[Doug]

A couple others and I was like.

[Filipo]

I like, like them all, by the way, have you? There are others. This is the car we chose for the logo. But there are other cars, other cars.

[Doug]

We made other cars. There's like trucks and stuff.

[Ken]

I think I do remember. I think I have them.

[Filipo]

There's also some like some.

[Doug]

Some of them convertibles.

[Ken]

Close to a car like a 458.

[Doug]

This looked like that Honda electric Honda thing, didn't it? That Honda EV thing that sold in other markets.

[Filipo]

The. The Honda E. Yeah. Does not look like a Honda E at all.

[Doug]

It looked like some concept car version of the Honda E that was coopier. Someone will post in the comments about it.

[Filipo]

Anyway, the point, nobody understands what you reference.

[Doug]

That's an intake, not a blinker. And if it was a blinker, it would be amber and white. Blinker side are not allowed.

[Filipo]

Agreed.

[Doug]

Before we sign off, we have one more thing to discuss. Someone sent us a dog. Someone who sent us a business card saying that they were a Subaru ambassador, his name was Fred, sent us this dog. The dog has a caller that says Subaru.

[Filipo]

Can I say hi?

[Doug]

And on the thing it says no on this. It doesn't like you. On the thing it says Subaru loves pets. I'll tell you what, if you can name the state for me that the company is headquartered in that created this dog.

[Filipo]

Indiana, obviously.

[Doug]

Nope. New Hampshire. The dog. What?

[Filipo]

Oh, the company that made the dog.

[Doug]

Will you.

[Filipo]

I should have listened.

[Doug]

Yep. The dog stays with me. His name will be Fred, after the person who got him for us. After Mike. The Audi thing, robot, and then these bizarre Toyota things. Things. Speaking of the bizarre Toyota things. By the way, thank you, Fred, for our dog, which is very plush and beautiful.

[Ken]

No, you can't touch the dog.

[Doug]

Speaking of the Toyota things, again, we are not here next week, but we don't have to be because this was our best podcast ever. Goodbye, everyone.

[Ken]

Goodbye.

[Filipo]

Bye. Damage.com.