The Audi TT is Back! Lotus is in Big Trouble. Best Porsche 911?

Summary

THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends

Episode: "The Audi TT is Back! Lotus is in Big Trouble. Best Porsche 911?"
Date: September 5, 2025
Hosts: Doug DeMuro, Filippo, Kenan

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Episode Overview

This week, Doug DeMuro and his co-hosts deliver their signature, sharp-witted insight on the hottest automotive news, deep dives into car culture, and lively debates—ranging from the Audi TT’s electric return, Lotus's dire finances, Nissan’s moves, Ford’s recall saga, the Porsche 991 market, a spirited Forerunner ranking, and audience Q&A (including cost-per-mile defense and birth-year car dreams). Highlights include passionate rants, rare trivia, and more than a few memorable laughs.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Audi TT’s Electric Comeback (00:37–05:35)

• Return of the TT: Audi unveils the "Concept C," a fully electric, hardtop convertible sports car built on the upcoming Porsche Cayman/Boxster platform. This marks Audi’s reinvestment into sporty nameplates as it joins Formula 1.
• Hosts’ Reflections:
  • Filippo recalls the revolutionary impact of the original TT in the late ‘90s:
    "That car was revolutionary. This is beautiful. This is so cool." (01:13)
  • Designers/history: Peter Schreyer is mentioned for his pivotal design work; he’s now associated with Kia but has recently retired.
  • Design skepticism:
    • Kenan is excited, but Filippo quips, "The only thing I can promise you is that it won't [look like the concept]." (03:54)
    • Reference to past concept cars—the odd-looking Audi Rosemeyer—and the likelihood that the production car will diverge from the concept.
  • Electric Boxster/Cayman discussion: Purists (Filippo) mourn the passing of gas/manual models, while Doug notes the performance merits of EVs (lower center of gravity, weight).

Notable Quote:
"Audi doesn't have like a storied history. We don't come to Audi for dynamics. We never did... This is cool. It looks cool. And it would be cool if it existed." — Filippo (03:25)

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2. Nissan’s Off-Road Offensive & Z Manual Drama (05:35–10:52)

• Xterra Reboot: Canceled in 2015 at the wrong time (per Filippo: "single worst automotive product planning decision in my lifetime"), the Xterra is returning (2028) as V6/hybrid, body-on-frame, not EV.
• Nissan Z (Nismo) Debacle:
  • Nissan’s decision to finally release a manual transmission for the Nismo Z is seen as "too little too late."
    • Filippo: "They've sold 11 units... 12." (08:19)
    • Kenan: "Too little, too late." (08:24)
  • Surprised at the Z's flop, especially versus the visible Supra community.
• Regional Car Bias: Reflections on regional car tastes—California, Midwest, and the rarity of new Zs.

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3. Ineos Grenadier Price Drop (11:00–13:59)

• Significant markdowns: SUV drops $8,000; pickup $8,500—still pricy (starts at $72K), but supply gluts force incentives.
• Market Fit: Filippo’s take: Grenadiers are for buyers who want a "tough" image but not the hassle, “rich guys who want an old SUV, but they want air conditioning and infotainment.” (12:16)
• **Dealer inventory is huge; demand is tepid, confirming it's a niche market product that oversupplied.

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4. Lotus’s Financial Woes (14:02–17:14)

• Q2 Losses: Lotus lost $263 million in six months and will cut 550 jobs in the UK.
• Surprise at size: “I'm astonished they have 550 employees. Truly, I'm not exaggerating.” – Filippo (14:23)
• China sales and tariffs: Discuss Lotus’s new Chinese ownership (Geely). Some Lotus models (Elettra) can't be sold in the US due to tariffs, but their China business grows modestly.
• Lotus’s Identity Shift: From “simplify, add lightness” to “pump cash into a classic brand.”
• Amira Praise: Kenan: "The Amira is a phenomenal sports car…"

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5. 'Leno’s Law' & Bureaucratic Frustration (18:39–26:28)

• California’s Cancelled Exemption:
  • The bill to exempt classic cars from emissions standards fails—killed without public reason by Appropriations Chair Buffy Wicks.
  • Filippo rails against statehouse opacity and lack of technical competence, suggesting more (not fewer!) legislators for constituent accountability.
  • On lost revenue and enforcement: “All these cars are already here. The cost to California is happening now in lost registration fees… The State Assembly is not particularly sophisticated.” (20:32)
• **Discussion on unregistered cars with out-of-state plates and virtually no enforcement.

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6. Upcoming Audi RS6, Mercedes, the German Super-Wagon Saga (26:28–29:29)

• RS6’s Next Gen: Plug-in hybrid V8 coming; Audi recognized for sticking with V8/hybrid while Mercedes’s new E53 is a less-competitive V6 plug-in hybrid.
• Specs Race: M5 Touring at 717 hp; BMW, Audi, and Mercedes fight for the segment.
• Mystery Pause: They recall the time Mercedes stopped selling V8 AMGs for a year with no explanation.

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7. Ford Recalls—Why So Many? (30:31–34:18)

• Background: Ford set the manufacturer record for recalls largely due to a consent order from past recall sloppiness (backup camera), requiring strict monitoring and resulting in over-cautiousness on new faults.
• Recent recall: 900,000 vehicles (rear wiring harness issue).
• Conspiracy Theory: Filippo jokes Ford killed the Escape model to avoid another mass recall.
• Regulatory realities: Doug notes that recalls are often voluntary; Ford’s scrutiny has made them hyper-proactive.

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8. Talk Cars Segment: Selling Station Wagons & Viper Stories (34:29–44:44)

• Doug Considers Selling His Wagon: Reflects on ownership costs, practicality, and emotional attachment. (35:14–39:02)
• Kenan’s Dodge Viper SRT10 Review:
  • Drives a 2005 model deemed "worst" by many, but loves the lunacy:
    “It is so crude and poorly built...you're constantly getting cooked… But it's awesome. It's the kind of lunacy I want.” (39:30)
  • No traction/stability control; massive engine; tremendous road presence.
• Viper Generations Debate:
  • Filippo argues only three real Viper generations exist; first and second are essentially a facelift difference.

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9. Milestones & YouTube/Media Updates (47:37–50:46)

• Doug DeMuro’s Channel Hits 5M Subs:
  • 2.26 billion views; the team reflects on viewership being more meaningful than subscriber count.
  • Speculation about notable viewers, e.g., Trump, Jannik Sinner, Jerry Seinfeld.
• Throttle House: Waiting for them to deliver on a Top Gear/Grand Tour-style promise.

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10. Porsche 991—The “993” of Modern 911s? (52:48–57:12)

• Market Report:
  • Filippo posits the 991 as the "993 of the modern 911," i.e., the best-loved, most valuable of its era.
  • Kenan pushes for the 997 instead, citing enthusiast favor for hydraulic steering and purity, but Filippo says the market disagrees.
  • Rising auction prices for base, manual 991.1s (even basic models fetching $70K+).

Notable Quote:
"I think the 991 is the 993 of the modern 911...Mark my words." — Filippo (53:52)

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11. Audience Q&A & Rapid-Fire Debates (61:46–87:28)

a. Audience Gifts (62:09–65:42)

• Gifts received: A 1997 Ferrari lineup Road & Track magazine and a crystal Lamborghini Countach model.

b. Doug & Car Buying Habits (66:14–67:49)

• Doug is predictable; unlikely to surprise the team with a wild new purchase anytime soon.

c. Market Data & Product Decisions (67:57–69:20)

• No Android app yet for Cars & Bids—iOS focus due to user base.

d. The Best Driving Interstates (69:20–71:36)

• I-70 across Utah/Colorado—the favorite. For real scenery: skip interstates, use US highways like US-50.

e. Ranking Toyota FourRunners (71:41–74:47)

• Lively debate:
  • Filippo: 5th gen = best ever (might even be best SUV ever), then 4th, 3rd, 6th, 1st, 2nd.
  • Kenan & Doug: 3rd gen’s personal favorite, but conceding 5th gen's mass appeal.

f. Manual BMW M5 vs. AMG E55 (74:47–76:51)

• E39 M5's price justified by manual transmission experience and enthusiast demand, not just stats.

g. Worst State for Car Enthusiasts? (78:08–81:03)

• Virginia is named "the worst": radar detectors banned, strict speed laws, high property taxes.

h. Kenan’s Car History (Pre–M5) (81:44–82:55)

• E39 525i → E39 M5 → E46 330xi → E36 M3 → Ferrari 355.

i. Birth-Year Cars (82:55–84:41)

• F40/F50 for Kenan and Filippo (born in the benchmark supercar years).
• Doug’s 1994 picks: Mark IV Supra, FD RX7, R32 GTR, Saab 900.

j. CT5V Blackwing vs M5 Ownership Cost (84:47–86:35)

• Listener asks if Kenan regrets spending as much on his E39 as a new CT5V Blackwing would cost.
  • He defends the decade of joy and use ("$40K loss over 100K miles—cost per mile is not bad, and I love it.")

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Filippo, on bureaucratic mishaps:
  "Lawmakers don't know anything. And when something that you know a lot about appears in this sort of situation, you start to realize what else are they voting on that you don't know a lot about…" (21:34)
• Kenan, on Xtreme Viper Ownership:
  "It has a fear factor...because there's no traction control, no stability control." (40:57)
• Doug, on car buying:
  "You only think about entry price, don't think about TCO [total cost of ownership]." (56:58)
• On the rising Porsche 991 market:
  "The market is going to prize the 991.1 manual in a crazy way." (53:58)
• Filipo, on the Grenadier:
  "Rich guys who want an old SUV, but want air conditioning and infotainment." (12:16)
• On California bureaucracy:
  "There’s not enough legislators… If you knew your neighbor was a state rep… That would really have a benefit in getting the bills passed the people want." (22:01)
• On car enthusiast “cost per mile”:
  "For 100,000 miles. In one of my favorite cars." — Kenan (85:51)

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• 00:37–05:35: Audi TT’s electric comeback & concept car debate
• 05:35–10:52: Nissan’s Xterra return & Z manual drama
• 11:00–13:59: INEOS Grenadier price drops & market musings
• 14:02–17:14: Lotus’s financial crisis
• 18:39–26:28: California ‘Leno’s Law’ and state politics
• 26:28–29:29: RS6, Mercedes E53, Super-wagons
• 30:31–34:18: Ford recall saga & Escape model axed
• 34:29–44:44: Talk Cars Segment: personal car sales, Dodge Viper driving
• 47:37–50:46: Doug’s 5 million YouTube subscribers, Throttle House
• 52:48–57:12: Porsche 991 as the new “best of breed”
• 61:46–65:42: Listener gifts: Ferrari magazine, crystal Countach
• 66:14–87:28: Audience Q&A: buying habits, best interstates, 4Runner ranking, BMW vs AMG, car-unfriendly states, cost-per-mile, dream birth-year cars

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Summary Takeaways

• The new electric Audi TT excites, but brings skepticism on whether the production model will match the concept.
• Lotus is in a dire financial spot, and many legacy brands are navigating new identities under Chinese ownership.
• Nissan, after questionable past decisions, is revisiting old hits like the Xterra and placating enthusiasts with belated manual options.
• The Porsche 991’s values and reputation are rapidly rising, poised as the “classic” of its era.
• Spirited (and often comedic) debates on every topic—value, ownership, regulations—showcase the hosts’ automotive knowledge and passion.
• Audience Q&A brings out thoughtful, detailed answers on costs, experiences, and “what-if” car dreams, all delivered with fun and candor.

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This episode is a must-listen for those who love witty, high-level car talk that’s as insightful as it is entertaining—covering not just cars themselves, but car culture, market trends, and the real-world joys and pains of automotive obsession.

Transcript

[Doug DeMuro]

Olivia loves a challenge. It's why she lifts heavy weights and likes complicated recipes. But for booking her trip to Paris, Olivia chose the easy way with Expedia. She bundled her flight with a hotel to save more. Of course, she still climbed all 674.

[Kenan]

Steps to the top of the Eiffel Tower.

[Doug DeMuro]

You were made to take the easy route. We were made to easily package your trip. Expedia made to travel flight inclusive packages are atoll protected.

[Filippo]

Hello and welcome to this car pod.

[Kenan]

I'm Kenan.

[Filippo]

I'm Filippo and let's start with the news. Big news this week.

[Kenan]

Yes, the Audi TT is back. Audi is releasing a new concept. They're calling it the Concept C. And this is going to be fully electric, hard top convertible, two seat sports car. They're going to release soon in conjunction with them joining Formula one. They want to get some of the sporty cars back out there. It is based on what will be the new Cayman Boxster platform.

[Filippo]

Look at this. This is a beautiful thing. You guys don't remember the TT came out in the late 90s? Well, were you there when it came out in 97?

[Doug DeMuro]

I remember I was in Europe.

[Kenan]

You didn't speak English at the time.

[Filippo]

Exactly.

[Doug DeMuro]

But the Germans didn't either.

[Filippo]

Automobile magazine had it on the COVID and it said that the headline was Audi shows us its tts. And that was like they got like a ton of hate mail for that. Tough headline, tough headlight, but that car was revolutionary. This is beautiful. This is so cool.

[Kenan]

I think it is really cool. I am excited for this. Admittedly when the old TT came out, it was such a new design language. Like you said, it introduced the fenders.

[Filippo]

It changed a lot of things.

[Kenan]

Changed a lot of things. I don't know if this does quite as much, but it is cool that it is coming back and have a TT again. I think will be.

[Filippo]

You know what the fellow who designed the original TT is doing right now?

[Doug DeMuro]

Designing Kias. No, he left Kia.

[Filippo]

No, I think he's still there. Peter Schreib, I think he's still there.

[Doug DeMuro]

I know who you're talking about.

[Filippo]

I think he's still at Kia doing the Kia thing. So this is full electric. It's right now a concept car. But they have already announced it's going to be a production car and this is illustrative of what their design philosophy.

[Kenan]

Will look like right now. It is interesting that something's coming out on this platform before the Porsche upon which it's based. Now I wonder if that's for them to test. Like, is this viable? Do people like it? What tweaks can we make before the debatably more important kind of, or do.

[Filippo]

We know, will there still even be a Porsche?

[Kenan]

You know, that's what I'm thinking. I'm thinking that, you know, that they know that it's going to be a gas car.

[Doug DeMuro]

The Porsche Cayman and Boxster produced. Production ended this week. That they're, they're, they're not making anymore.

[Kenan]

There's the new sad week for us all.

[Filippo]

RIP 1996. 30 years of that car. Beautiful car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, there'll still be a Boxster maybe. It might be electric.

[Filippo]

A Boxster EV is not a Boxster.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, the original Box.

[Filippo]

I'm gonna say, spoken like a purist, you know, I'm not a purist about the Camry, but like, the Boxster is this. Come on.

[Kenan]

It's amazing.

[Filippo]

The whole point is like a manual, like, like you're in the car glued to the road, like experience. I drove those early 986s. They are fun.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, the EV will be, have lower weight mass, center of gravity will be.

[Filippo]

Lower, but it's grounded to the road. It's going to have, it's going to.

[Doug DeMuro]

Have, it's going to have a flat six. No. Too bad. Neither did the 718. Were you mad? The 718 box, you're correct.

[Kenan]

And then they came out with the 4L.

[Filippo]

It sold.

[Kenan]

They sold a lot of those.

[Filippo]

Will be clamoring for the 718 when they find out that the next one's.

[Doug DeMuro]

Strategy, make an engine nobody wants to and then make it desirable.

[Kenan]

They want to drive interest purely to.

[Filippo]

The secondary market, regardless of what happens with the Porsche, which we will cover in grave detail, and I stress the word grave when it happens. This I am into. Audi doesn't have like a storied history. We don't come to Audi for dynamics. We never did. Even for the original. The tts, they were good, but they were never up to the level of their rivals. This is cool. It looks cool. And it would be cool if it existed.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Kenan]

And Will, I'm hopeful that the production car does end up looking like this. And they say that it seems like it will.

[Filippo]

The only thing I can promise you is that it won't.

[Kenan]

Exactly.

[Filippo]

Do you remember when the Audi came out with a concept car called the Rosemeyer?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Filippo]

Pull this up. This is one of the ugliest things you've ever seen. And it's called the Rosemeyer, which.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. That's a car.

[Kenan]

Oh, yeah. Isn't this the AVUs?

[Filippo]

No, the AVUs is crazier. The Rosemeyer.

[Kenan]

Wow, that's cool.

[Filippo]

Yeah, they got the mirrors on the roof so that the people behind you can see themselves.

[Kenan]

This looks like an R8 and a TT like ran into one another, but earlier.

[Doug DeMuro]

But earlier.

[Kenan]

But like kind of in the like late 40s, early 50s.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Yeah. It's really.

[Kenan]

How interesting. I think it's cool.

[Filippo]

Oh, well, it looks. Yeah, no, I don't know.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think that this will be a little bit more true. I mean, that concept seems kind of realistic for what 2027 vehicles look like.

[Filippo]

If Audi can create a car that looks like this, I am here for it. If Audi can actually come to market, they're newer.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's a good sign.

[Filippo]

They apparently have a new head of design and he's trying to make a spl and he's Italian, which all great automotive designers ever been to.

[Doug DeMuro]

Shrier. True.

[Filippo]

That's true. Shrier's a great.

[Doug DeMuro]

By the way, he retired in 2023.

[Filippo]

He's gone. Oh, you know, one time. Here's a story for you. One time, I was on a Kia trip in Seoul, a press trip for the Niro ev. And we were having dinner in the Kia employees cafeteria. And it's this massive room and it's two stories high and there's like a bio wall. And it was late at night. The whole. The thing had gone on all day, the drive, the president, whatever. And we were having dinner, all the journalists. And the only other person there having dinner was Peter Schreier with a couple of Korean guys.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. Yeah.

[Filippo]

And it was like, whoa, that's legit. And everybody was like looking at him.

[Doug DeMuro]

Like, that's the Peter.

[Filippo]

Okay. All right, next news story, please.

[Doug DeMuro]

I have good news. Nissan have been listening to this podcast. They've been listening to Doug talk about how they should bring back the Xterra. And boy, will they.

[Filippo]

Yeah, they canceled the XTERRA 2015ish right as the off road SUV market was starting to heat up. It was the single worst automotive product planning decision in my lifetime. Time.

[Doug DeMuro]

Really, we're going with that.

[Filippo]

Can you think of a worse one? There are bad. There are some bad ones that a lot of companies.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I'm sure it can.

[Filippo]

But this was egregious. And then they had this like arrogance about it, like, we're not going to bring it back.

[Doug DeMuro]

We don't need it.

[Filippo]

We got the frontier. You know, we could make it easily off the frontier. We're not going to. That market's going to Die. Meanwhile, since they've canceled this car, Toyota sold a million and a half, 400. But anyway, they're bringing it back.

[Doug DeMuro]

The. The new exterior will reportedly come back in 2028 with a V6 and a hybrid power. Some earlier reports from last spring that kind of mentioned this thought it would be an ev, apparently will not be a hybrid. This is part of a large push that Nissan is doing to introduce new models. They plan on having 20 newer updated models between now and 2028. Body and frame platform purportedly legit.

[Filippo]

Just like I was saying Honda was too scared to do. Nissan go, go do it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Which must be a bespoke one. The Frontier doesn't exist anymore. Frontier?

[Filippo]

What do you mean? It's brand new Frontier. It's a Frontier chassis. That's what. That's how Toyota does it with the.

[Doug DeMuro]

4Runner and the Tacoma Fair. There'll also be like an updated Rogue. There might be an Infiniti with the Twin Turbo V6. You know, we don't know yet.

[Filippo]

An Infiniti Xterra G wagon. Finally, Infiniti gets some cred.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep.

[Kenan]

What if they could pull this off?

[Filippo]

They can't.

[Kenan]

I mean, it's Nissan. They won't obviously. But if they could, this would be. This would be pretty cool.

[Filippo]

It would be a flagship Infiniti based on the. The new Xterra. By the way, I am all for a V6 Hybrid Xterra. Toyota has obviously gone the hybrid route. The body on frame thing is great. Super here.

[Doug DeMuro]

And hopefully it looks something like this. There have been some spy shots. It looks like they've like revealed that it's part of presentation. It has a Nissan front end and like a very boxy rear end, which is good, dude. The Armada is also bought in frame. They're used to it.

[Filippo]

The Armada is boff.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep.

[Filippo]

Yeah, they know what they're doing, dude. And they sell that as the patrol in the Middle east. And people drive those over sand dunes. That car is hot out there. And not just because the weather's hot.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know, Nice part of Nissan's product offensive. Go to the next one includes. Doug, some good news for you.

[Filippo]

Nissan has announced that they are going to do a manual Nismo Z. Because when they announced the Nismo Z initially, apparently there was so much clamoring from enthusiasts that they had left off a manual that they listened to. Enthusiasts are going to make a manual. You know what my response to this is? Don't bother. I was one of the people clamoring right when I reviewed that car because I Thought it was insane that they were doing this. I clamored. But my review of the Nismo Z came out. Oh, Throttle House is top billing. My review of the Nismo Z came out. That was January of 24. It's been two years. They've sold 11 units.

[Doug DeMuro]

1212.

[Filippo]

It's 2L, 2L.

[Kenan]

Too little too late.

[Filippo]

Dang. Do you not agree with me?

[Doug DeMuro]

I think it will get them some additional sales. 12, 13, 14 total. No, I mean they should have had it from the beginning. Obviously.

[Filippo]

I've been surprised at what a flop the new Z has been because the.

[Doug DeMuro]

Backup camera is really bad.

[Filippo]

It uses a lot of parts from the old Z, which I think was one of the reasons they were able to even make a new Z. Yeah, and one of those is the outdated backup camera, which is fine, but it's been a huge flop and I'm surprised they're even putting any effort into this. Like it's, it's clear to everyone this car will not see another generation even though it's brand new. Like they're trying to save a little face here. I won't get them a manual.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let's be honest. It probably wasn't that hard.

[Filippo]

Well then they should have done it.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know, Nissan product planning, I thought, yes.

[Kenan]

I suspect they held off on it in hopes that this would garner more interest later on in the product.

[Filippo]

Yeah, I think that's exactly what they.

[Kenan]

Did and that was a mistake because.

[Filippo]

It isn't going to, I don't think they were planning to do a manual initially, but I do think once they saw the demand, they did hold off on it being like, hey, let's give it two years of sales with an auto and then we'll come in the manual and those people will buy new ones. But I think the truth is that no one is buying new ones.

[Doug DeMuro]

Right.

[Filippo]

I do see a lot of Supras.

[Kenan]

I do. That is a very good point. I was thinking that yesterday when I saw a new super shocked like and.

[Filippo]

I watch a lot of Instagram reels of people with like crazy modded ones getting pulled over by the police. So like they're around.

[Kenan]

We saw it at the Car Week. But I, I also, I, I, it is such a shame though. I, I like this car, but we do live in a place in the country where we see a lot of new cars. We can gauge pretty actively where consumers are buying.

[Filippo]

Yes.

[Kenan]

And I never these cars. I, I, maybe three years.

[Filippo]

I would say though California actually has a specific bias, I think, against towards others. Like I saw Buick. That Buick that I sent you?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, you sent me a picture of a new enclave.

[Filippo]

A new enclave. I look, I pull up next to me and I'm like, what is this car?

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, that's why you sent it to me. Bu. Conclave.

[Filippo]

There's not a lot of Californian buyers to that. California, I think though, is. Is actually biased towards buying Asian cars generally. Asian cars have a long history here. There's more Asian people on the west coast generally, nonetheless don't see them. You don't see these like in the Midwest. I can imagine this car is completely non existent.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Same. They got Mustangs and Also Marque Golf GTIs and ours when we were at Road America for that event. I've never seen more market. Really.

[Kenan]

It was the unofficial car, like with the question. Because it was crazy.

[Doug DeMuro]

Never see them here and ever.

[Filippo]

I saw, I saw one of the. I saw one. This is the one you have, right? The Mark Eights. I saw one today on the road and it said 40 on the side and it was bright green.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, yeah.

[Filippo]

Look pretty cool.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

And I felt bad. I felt so bad because the people in it were clearly car enthusiasts and I was in this Maybach sl and if it had been tomorrow, I'd drive in the Countach to work and they.

[Doug DeMuro]

Would have been so into it.

[Filippo]

Okay, us, our next news story. Oh, ineos. INEOS is dropping prices and it is a significant drop.

[Doug DeMuro]

Really is.

[Filippo]

The SUV is down $8,000. The Quartermaster, which is somehow the name of the pickup truck, is down almost $9,000 $8,500. They still are expensive. The SUV starts 72. The truck starts at 86. Because of the chicken tax. I. It's great news for INEOS enthusiasts. I have a personal opinion about ineos.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, please.

[Filippo]

Like two opinions. Number one is it's. It came and went.

[Doug DeMuro]

It was cool as it just came.

[Filippo]

It was cool.

[Doug DeMuro]

It came out two years ago. Still a new product.

[Filippo]

Yeah. But it. But my point is like, it has come and gone.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, it's gone.

[Filippo]

Like the people who really wanted them got them. And they're. They're not the easiest sell to people who don't really want them.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's true.

[Filippo]

Second thing about any of us, I kind of think that the Grenadiers are for rich guys who want to like, seem like they're like, like, I think like rich guys want it on an old suv, but they're like, no, they're not like ready for that.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

And then they get a Grenadier when I. When I see a grenadier. That's what I think. You wanted an old Defender, but you weren't. You weren't.

[Kenan]

And they didn't want to wait to do. They didn't have the patience to do a restaurant project. I just want something new.

[Filippo]

But you can buy a rest. Restauranted ones are pretty easy to find, like, just available. But I think even then, Even then, this. These are like guys who, like, they want a Defender, like an old Defender, a G wagon, but they want air conditioning. They want infotainment, like, to be honest, like, you know, and they, they hope that it kind of pulls it off.

[Doug DeMuro]

And I'm convinced you've just described the mission statement of that like, what? That's what they've always been.

[Filippo]

Maybe it works, then. Maybe it's fine. Huge price drops are. Because these are not selling. If you go to an INEOS dealer, we have one here in San Diego. If you go to an INEOS dealer, I don't know if you've been paying attention. It's. It's National City. And if you, if you've been. If you looked online. Unbelievable inventory at these dealerships. They've already been big incentives. There's already been big lease programs. A price cut is no surprise. They're way stacked up. We had heard they were going to stop production for a while, that there's not an enormous amount of demand right now for these.

[Kenan]

Not really a surprise.

[Filippo]

I guess they need a different vehicle.

[Doug DeMuro]

They produce too many like it was. They should have accepted that it was going to be a niche vehicle, especially in the US and made it limited, limited, limited production.

[Filippo]

You never know what goes into these production numbers, what rules. You know, they built this thing in France. What rules did they create with the French Union? I just think ultimately the market dictates demand, period. The automaker wants to dictate demand. Right. Like, this is cool. You're going to buy it. Well, 58,000 of them sitting at dealer lots tells you where the tariffs also did hurt them.

[Doug DeMuro]

Terrifyingly terrifying. They increased price as a result and now clearly need to decrease this all. Any inventory. Yeah.

[Filippo]

Okay, next news story, please. Ah, yeah.

[Kenan]

Ah, yes. Speaking of companies that are struggling, Lotus, Lotus, British companies. British companies. So Lotus has announced that they lost $263 million in the first half of this year.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Kenan]

To be honest, not entirely a surprise. However, this does come at the cost of a lot of jobs. They're cutting 550 jobs at the UK headquarters.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm astonished that they have 550 employees.

[Filippo]

Same astonished they have 550 employees. Truly, I'm not exaggerating. I'm surprised to hear that. And to be honest, I'm astonished. They have $263 million to lose. Where did Lotus get this money? Seriously?

[Doug DeMuro]

Lotus sells Lotus, which is now owned by Geely, if memory serves. Oh, yeah, does sell. Their sales in China continue to increase slightly, but their sales were up in China. But because so many of the products are not made in China, there's large shares in the US which is impacting all their entire product line, except for the Emira, and I think they're struggling to sell here.

[Filippo]

Well, more than impacting, this car cannot be sold in the us. I'm going to go down as the only American who ever drove a Lotus Elettra.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's true.

[Kenan]

That's probably true because they sent it.

[Filippo]

To us to review and I mean, a few other journalists drove it, but like, that was it, which is really.

[Kenan]

Tough because they're still, they're in a tough spot paying off development costs. They're still paying off the development cost of the Amira. They're really still paying off the cost of that thing.

[Filippo]

What is this, the Avisia?

[Kenan]

Yes. Which of course we're still, you know, I don't know, waiting on that. Still hasn't gone into production. So yeah, they're in a really hard spot. To your point. Their CFO was quick to point out their quarter over quarter growth was 35%.

[Filippo]

But still in terms of, that's in terms of volume and sales.

[Doug DeMuro]

Volume?

[Filippo]

Ye.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes.

[Kenan]

In terms of revenue growth. Yeah, 35%. So. But, but nonetheless, like they, I mean, but this is the great Lotus tradition. Lightweight, struggles with money. That is kind of how things.

[Doug DeMuro]

Lightweight. Do you know how much?

[Kenan]

Well, not that one.

[Filippo]

I mean, I think that, that we're, we're kind of getting away from some of the core Lotus principles just because the brand is strong. You know, this is how the Chinese are able to, are going to be able, if they want to infiltrate some of the Western car markets, is taking some storied beloved brands such as mg, such as Lotus, such as Volvo, and kind of infusing their capabilities, their technology capabilities. Because there's, there's always going to be sort of reticence from Americans in particular, but, but generally, you know, Europeans, et cetera, to buying Chinese cars. And so the, the famed Lotus story of simplify and add lightness. I think it's now just like take a brand and pump some cash, do.

[Kenan]

Some stuff with it. Yeah. That said, the Amira is A phenomenal sports car. Like, it's a really excellent sports car. So it is just a shame that, yeah, I'm not selling as much. The value retention hasn't been as strong with the cars in general. Like, it. They have the Lotus problem.

[Filippo]

The Eletra not selling here is probably a good thing for Lotus. Like, it wasn't going to sell anyway and like they could save face and be like, you know, we got tariffed.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Like nothing we could do out of our hand.

[Doug DeMuro]

Massive drop in deliveries in Q2 year over year. Oh, something increased quarter, but 44 down year over year.

[Filippo]

Yeah. So are they only selling cars in China? Basically? No, they sell cars in. They sell cars in. In Europe.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

I see a mirrors here and there.

[Doug DeMuro]

I've seen an Elytra in Europe.

[Kenan]

Really?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes, I have a picture of it. It was parked in a street in.

[Kenan]

Verona as it had sunken cobblestones.

[Filippo]

Was it at a dealer?

[Doug DeMuro]

Parked very illegally.

[Filippo]

Was it at a dealer?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, it was on the street.

[Filippo]

Dealership.

[Kenan]

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[Filippo]

Okay, next. So. Oh, Jay Leno. The Leno's Law situation.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. I'm confused by this.

[Filippo]

All right, what you got? What you got?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, I'm just confused.

[Filippo]

Leno's Law is gone. It's done. There was a. There was a. There was a law that was going through the California State assembly that was going to exempt historical vehicles from emission standards. The car was 35 years old or older, so 1990 or older, it was going to be exempted from emissions. And what's happened is it went into the Appropriations Committee and the chair of the Appropriations Committee, who, by the way, is named Buffy Wicks.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. What?

[Filippo]

Buffy Wicks.

[Kenan]

Someone elected this person.

[Filippo]

Buffy Wicks in Oakland. She represents East Bay. She didn't allow the bill. She and the committee, which is all Democrats. Majority Democrats, didn't allow the bill. Bill to advance to the State assembly for a vote, which is a shame. I think the reason. She did not give a reason, which is what we've come to expect from our lawmakers.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

God forbid they should be accountable to the people or communicate with the people in any way. These people who don't have any challengers from anybody, they don't have to do this. They can just keep running for office repeatedly and not be accountable. But it seems to me like there was a fear of cost associated with the bill. They would have to do with special license plates. They would have to change all their forms. They would have to start figuring out exactly, does the car have insurance, et cetera. There was gonna be more processes. The great irony. And of course, all these. This guy from the Smog. From the Air Health association is quoted. Who, by the way, I don't think is real. I looked him up. Cannot find a LinkedIn. I think he's AI. Dead serious. I don't think they have a spokesman. I'm dead serious. And I think that whatever this organization is just lies about this dude being real. They named him, like, Michael Barrett or some, like, very, you know, Buffy Wicks.

[Kenan]

Right. She's a real person.

[Filippo]

So my thinking is that the great irony of the whole situation is that all these cars are already here. The cost of California is happening now in lost registration fees. The fact that we can't register these cars in California has stopped no one from using the cars in California. But the State assembly is not particularly sophisticated. And I will say that watching this bill go through and watching it get killed now and watching some of the amendments made to the bill and some of the discussions around the bill really educated me on the Fact that lawmakers don't know anything. And when something that you know a lot about appears in this sort of situation, you start to realize what else are they voting on that you don't know a lot about, but someone else does, and they're making stupid decisions in that case, too. So they're like, oh, well, it's gonna have a cost. It's gonna introduce pollutants. Well, no, it's gonna be cost positive for the state because they're gonna get revenue from all the registrations and the pollutants are already here. And there are so many cars that would fit this law that are already driving around. The CHP doesn't even have the manpower to make these traffic stops anymore because there are so many out of state people. And you realize that these people are not particularly sophisticated.

[Doug DeMuro]

Like, that's why kind of independent part of governmental, like the Congressional Budget Office at the federal level are really important because that's how you get those analyses done. States, though, don't have the capacity to do all that.

[Filippo]

You know what the problem really is?

[Doug DeMuro]

Partially because we insist that they cut costs, that they don't invest in that.

[Filippo]

You know what the problem really is? There's not enough legislators. This is a little 180 from what you thought. I would say there's not enough legislators. I think that if. Because the legislators don't have to answer to the people, Buffy Wicks doesn't say anything. She just kills the bill and moves on with her life.

[Doug DeMuro]

Doesn't say anything. They have to answer, and then they get elected.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but the problem is that she doesn't know her constituents. She's never done a constituent. She doesn't have to because she gets elected with 100% of the vote every time because nobody runs against her. If we had 1,000, I looked it up already. That's true. If we had 1,000 assembly members or 2,000, like in New Hampshire. New Hampshire's the only state that does it, right? There's like, New Hampshire has like 600 state reps, even though the whole state population is like 800 people. So most people in New Hampshire are state representatives. Right. And if you knew if your neighbor was a state rep and you could be like, hey, you really ought to vote for this. This would really actually have a benefit in getting the bills passed that the people want to get passed. There are 35 California state senators of some crazy. That's less than the number of U.S. house members that California has. So every state senator has a bigger district than the U.S. house. Members who we already know aren't listening to the people. So I think we should have 20,000 legislators.

[Doug DeMuro]

Doug Demuro, for do you want to.

[Kenan]

Be one of these? Yeah, sure.

[Filippo]

I don't know. It doesn't matter because like so many people would be. You just kind of like you get a text message like oh, there's a vote coming up and then, and then you vote. Like I said, like I said, it'll contribute to the politicians really knowing the issues.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well Doug demuro, are you announcing your state House campaign?

[Filippo]

I actually think it would be great and I legitimately think this is a problem people have with politicians and, and you start to realize these people have no my when I was a kid in Denver, our United States Congressperson, I don't need to name names. I don't need to go down that road. But that person, that individual, there was no chance she was ever not going to be elected. And she continues it's been 40 years to just exist without really being accountable the way so would I run. Yeah, like let's do this. Like I want a job for.

[Doug DeMuro]

So the thing that you're not that I think is kind of missing here. That person had a pretty much assured seat for life because she had constituents.

[Filippo]

That supported her once. One time because she won that one race where there was. Right. The previous person retires. This is what happens. The previous person retires. There's a groundswell right for the seat because everybody knows it's a job for life and you don't have to do anything. That person wins and then no one ever challenges that person ever again. Right?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, only if there aren't challengers that think they have a realistic shot away.

[Filippo]

Yeah. Which is.

[Doug DeMuro]

So we should be encouraging people to run for the for local office.

[Filippo]

20,000 legislators. Anyway, the point is the legislation, the legislators were not sophisticated enough I truly believe to understand the benefits of this which is the cars are already driving around. Nobody's behavior is going to change. California will lose out on the revenue from the cars coming and that's that counterpoint.

[Doug DeMuro]

The only way that they become educated by that if there is, if there's a ground self support and people that are great at communicating maybe who have.

[Filippo]

A large YouTube I wrote letters, we talked about them on the pod every day. They don't listen to their constituents. They don't have to. They're not.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't agree with that thing but if there's a round, if there's great explanation for why that matters and that reaches them, it's more likely that they are informed Letters is one strategy. Let's be honest. That doesn't work. But media does. But participating, it doesn't. Becoming more. Becoming more visible on whatever channels did it.

[Filippo]

Then I will say no. I will say not enough.

[Doug DeMuro]

If you think they're not educated enough. We didn't do our job.

[Filippo]

I will say we did.

[Kenan]

They didn't listen. No, because they don't listen listen.

[Filippo]

They don't care.

[Doug DeMuro]

You gotta reach them where they're at.

[Filippo]

But where they're at is I don't think they're that interested in listening. And also I think part of the reason there wasn't as big of a groundswell as support. Nobody cares. We all know we can get away with running out of state plates and nobody's ever gonna challenge it. And by the way, it's impossible to prove anyway. This is something else I discovered. The law on the books is that if your car is six months in California, you gotta register it. CHP has access to license plate readers. CHP is only allowed to use those license plate readers for up to 90 days. So there's no way to prove. Unless you get pulled over multiple times and they're like really going after you, there's basically no way to prove that your car is not registered in California. So, like this, you know, this is a cool idea. It's great. Everybody is going to continue to operate the cars knowing that there's really no enforcement stat to getting you not to do that, nor is there a way to actually legally do it. So that's California in a nutshell.

[Doug DeMuro]

Let's move on.

[Filippo]

Move on to our next news story. Oh, the Audi RS6. Speaking of California, the Audi RS6, there's apparently. You don't think this is related to.

[Doug DeMuro]

No plug in hybrid, so yeah, we're good.

[Filippo]

Exactly. There's apparently a next gen audi RS6 that's testing. You know what? I sometimes Forget that the RS6, which is beloved and amazing and awesome, is based on the A6.

[Doug DeMuro]

Whoa.

[Filippo]

Which is like one of the bad.

[Doug DeMuro]

There's a new A6, which.

[Filippo]

But the previous A6 was the number one slowest selling car on the entire market. The average A6 was like 650 days on the lot.

[Doug DeMuro]

There hadn't been like, like redesigned. I technically was redesigned like 2017 or something.

[Filippo]

But it's an interesting point because, like the market's not that interested in the car that underpins this. But this, the market's really interested in this.

[Kenan]

Yeah, they want the big boy.

[Filippo]

It's like the GTI at some Point. They just stopped selling the Golf.

[Doug DeMuro]

I would not be shocked if they stopped selling though. I mean there is currently an A6. It's electric by the way. If you're wondering it wasn't the Asics E Tron sportback is what it's called.

[Filippo]

Somebody blocks got one of those. Or maybe an A5.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I saw what's house.

[Filippo]

I don't know which one it is. Hard to know.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'll put it out to you.

[Filippo]

The next RS6 is supposedly going to be plug in hybrid.

[Doug DeMuro]

You accept V8 though. Plug in hybrid V8 which is big coming for a car that's coming out now from a platform that's otherwise mostly ev.

[Filippo]

Well yeah, but the rival is a.

[Doug DeMuro]

Plug in Hybrid V8. Well, I know but. But it's nice to see Audi kind of actually delivering on what they need to do.

[Filippo]

How about the fact that Mercedes is just kind of bailed on this E53.

[Doug DeMuro]

Is a plug in Hybrid V6.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but the E53 is not a competitor to this car. I like the E53.

[Doug DeMuro]

All these cars have so much power that honestly they're all kind of competitors to each other.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but the guy, the people who buy these cars, that's not how they feel about it. They're like every last horsepower, every zero to 60 time. They like fight over on forums like they're, they're really into.

[Kenan]

They're on Audi zine.

[Doug DeMuro]

To be fair. The 2026 Mercedes AMG E53 plug in hybrid wagon which exists.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

But now 604 horsepower.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's more than the last E63 wagon.

[Filippo]

But the RS6 now has 621 currently. And if they do a plug in hybrid, what does the M5 have? The M5 Touring is at 717.

[Doug DeMuro]

Are you impressed?

[Filippo]

There's a level where Mercedes can go and Mercedes owned this segment. I don't get it.

[Doug DeMuro]

They probably will have an E63. Right.

[Filippo]

It's weird though. It's been a while since there was that thing that they didn't tell anybody.

[Doug DeMuro]

About where they didn't sell V8s for a year.

[Filippo]

They just, they just roll. They didn't. They came back. No one really knew what happened there. Someday when Mercedes people are not under NDAs. I hope we get that full strive. We'll always wonder about it.

[Kenan]

Nothing happens. Don't go for that. Nothing is good vacation potting.

[Filippo]

Back then I would have been hitting it hard. I don't think a lot of people know that that happened.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no.

[Kenan]

People are wondering and you're not.

[Filippo]

Well, we don't know. Yeah, we're sitting here like there was a. There was a two years. 21 was the end of V8 for Mercedes mid year. They just stopped for AMG, by the way. They completely stopped. They never told anybody why. And then a couple years later they came back and there was never communication.

[Kenan]

Whether it was nice. Once on vacation.

[Doug DeMuro]

I got tired.

[Kenan]

Now it's back again. Don't worry.

[Doug DeMuro]

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[Filippo]

Do we have more?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Kenan]

That is the end. Oh.

[Filippo]

Oh, yeah. Ford. Okay, I want to talk about Ford because this is important. Ford's been recalling a lot of cars. In fact, somebody told me it was the greatest number of recalls in the history of the automotive industry.

[Doug DeMuro]

That was factually accurate.

[Filippo]

Okay. Do you know the genesis of this? And I'm not talking G70.

[Doug DeMuro]

Dude, the issue that you stole my Genesis joke. I don't know if you think of a better answer. No, I don't know the origin.

[Filippo]

Okay. Okay. A couple of years ago.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Ford had to do a recall about backup cameras.

[Doug DeMuro]

Sure.

[Filippo]

You know this story?

[Doug DeMuro]

I vaguely remember this.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but do you know the story, what I'm saying? No. Okay. A couple years ago, Ford had to do a recall about backup cameras. They were calling 600,000 vehicles a recall. In 2020?

[Doug DeMuro]

Sure.

[Filippo]

Ford. Apparently, according to NHTSA and Ford, they signed a consent order. Do you know what that is?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep.

[Filippo]

Yeah. Cause you had to. At one point, there was a custody battle for Filippo.

[Doug DeMuro]

No. I. But I promoted cons.

[Filippo]

NHTSA and Ford signed a agreement, a consent order. Ford didn't fully comply with this recall and they were too slow and they apparently weren't comprehensive enough or something. Ford signed a consent order. They would pay a massive fine to the government, $165 million, but also that they would have regulatory oversight of their recalls going for the next three years. And I think that Ford is still, obviously they're still under the consent order and I think they're like trying to be pro. By the way, I'm not excusing, but this is an explanat of why there are so many. I think Ford is under this consent order. They are being monitored by an independent organization about the recalls and they are just being incredibly careful and proactive about recalling cars. This latest recall, 900,000 more vehicles.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, it's 700,000 Escapes maybe or some of that.

[Filippo]

If F150 trucks. Rear wiring harness could chafe against the rear axle, causing the electronic parking brake to unexpectedly engage while drive. Could chafe. Philippa, the chance chafe. It could chafe sp. Ford also canceled the Escape. You know, we didn't talk about this on the pod. No, we wanted to. We didn't.

[Doug DeMuro]

We didn't talk about the Escape and the mkc.

[Filippo]

I think that's a big news story. Legit. Ford cancels the Escape, which means that Lincoln, which is intended to be a luxury brand, rival to Lexus and all them, doesn't have a compact. There's no Lincoln that rivals the RDX, the X3, the fairly comfortable. What was that Lincoln called? Well, that's.

[Kenan]

That Lincoln called.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, yeah, the one that was the competitor, the stablemate to the Escape and the competitor to the point.

[Filippo]

But that's my point.

[Kenan]

Not the Corsair.

[Doug DeMuro]

It was a Corsair.

[Filippo]

That's my point. The fact that Lincoln doesn't even have the recognition in the segment, let alone now they don't even have a vehicle.

[Doug DeMuro]

They don't have the car yet. But I think there's something else coming. There's some EV is replacing it.

[Filippo]

Do you think they canceled. This is a conspiracy theory. Do you think they canceled the Escape because they didn't want to have to recall it in three years? And they were just like, hey, they.

[Doug DeMuro]

Still will have the recall it, by the way.

[Filippo]

They were like, the fewer cars we produce, the fewer cars we will have to recall 700,000 of next year. I think let's just cut. Let's just stop making cars.

[Kenan]

That's one approach.

[Doug DeMuro]

The considerable is A good understanding.

[Kenan]

That's bad.

[Doug DeMuro]

The little known secret about a lot of things that are regulatory in nature is that they're often voluntary. Getting any kind of like safety test done, crash test, that's actually largely voluntary in the US but you do it because you want to be the top safety pick. Plus, and some independent agencies will just buy a car and do it. Recalls largely voluntary, Not. Not exclusive, but largely voluntary. So it is interesting, like maybe they're. They have so many because they know they need to be incredibly careful. Yeah.

[Filippo]

Because of this consent order.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

It's an interesting thought.

[Doug DeMuro]

Also, they should build cars without issues that require the little recalls.

[Filippo]

But hey, you wonder though, if other automakers were under such scrutiny, if they would also probably be more proactive.

[Doug DeMuro]

Recall.

[Filippo]

I'm just saying, I think Ford, their quality problems over the last few years have been well documented and are very clear to a lot of people. Nonetheless, I think that's the reason why we're seeing so many recalls out of Ford. Okay, we have to move on to the talk cars segment.

[Doug DeMuro]

We have to move on so desperately.

[Filippo]

The talk cars segment is sponsored by the Jaguar S Type. And that Sting song, Desert Rose, that was in all the Jaguar S Type commercials back in 2000. That's a rare sponsorship. But Sting wanted a song to get out there a little more. Do you remember that song?

[Doug DeMuro]

Look it up on the commercials. What kind of Jag? S Type.

[Filippo]

He was in the back of an S type driving through the desert one time.

[Doug DeMuro]

I was in Italy and went with a friend to their seahouse and her dad drove a Jaguar S Type diesel.

[Filippo]

Wow. Probably a 1.2 liter.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. It wasn't fast, nor was it luxurious because it was an S type.

[Filippo]

Well, listen, Sting was a part of it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep.

[Filippo]

A couple things we gotta talk about in the talk car segment, but the most important is. Filippo, go ahead.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think it's time to sell my station wipe.

[Filippo]

That's huge.

[Doug DeMuro]

Huge. I've owned it for 4ish years.

[Filippo]

Pull it up.

[Doug DeMuro]

Bought it from a guy named Sam on Cars and Bids.

[Filippo]

Bought it on Scars and Bits.

[Kenan]

Yeah. Not our friend Sam.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no. Different Sam. He's. He's my friend Sam for 27,150, had 65,000 miles. Some of that. Scroll down a little bit. Yeah.

[Filippo]

How many miles you got now?

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm at 119.

[Filippo]

Wow. No way.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. We've driven it.

[Filippo]

You drove this car 55,000 miles in four years?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Given that, we've also driven 17,000 miles in the car we bought eight months ago. Impressive. We haven't really.

[Filippo]

I agree. And there's another car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. It's been such a great car. It's been just exceptional in every way. Yeah. But there's a couple of. Of things that are becoming real. One is that it's a 11 year old car with 118,000 miles. Yeah. There we're getting to like the cusp of. I will need to start either investing time and energy and money into it or just be kind of done with it.

[Kenan]

Some would argue you already have, considering you spent 300.

[Doug DeMuro]

I spent $6,500. There was some rust issue that. To get the brake line.

[Filippo]

Talking about investing time and energy, don't you want to invest the same time that Sam invested in centering this photo into your. Into your car to carry on his legacy?

[Doug DeMuro]

I do. Legitimately, this car's been excellent. We've owned it for so long. We don't really need a large market. The GTI is so competent for longer trades. Yeah, I just like. I don't. We never drive it.

[Filippo]

So you're going to get rid of the wagon 500 a bar?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no. Both are getting gone. The 500 a bar is mentally gone in my head.

[Filippo]

You drove it yesterday. I saw you drove it here today. Oh, my God. Well, it's mentally gone in his head, except for the fact that he's using it to commute.

[Kenan]

So basically he just materialized here today. There's between his house and here.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, this car sits on my block for the vast majority of the time. One time I got hit while it was sitting on my block.

[Filippo]

So you don't drive this anymore when you're going to Arizona?

[Doug DeMuro]

It depends. We. We drive the GTI more often than we drive this.

[Filippo]

Filippo's got a family situation in Arizona.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, we've driven to Arizona a lot in West Texas.

[Filippo]

But you know, you think of Filippo and you see Filippo and you're like, oh, Filippo, the, the European. No, he's, he's Arizona, West Texas.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. We go to El Paso with some frequency. We'll go there in a couple weeks, which is wonderful. But historically we've taken the. This station wagon, which is wonderful because you can fit everything you could possibly need. We usually carry things back for some.

[Filippo]

The GTI doesn't have that capability, so.

[Doug DeMuro]

It'S not quite as big. So we have to be. We have to decide, can we do that?

[Filippo]

How about you sell all three and get two great cars?

[Doug DeMuro]

You know, I've thought about it. My wife, though, loving as she is, has said that we can't get entirely different cars. We have to like stagger, you know.

[Filippo]

Not a lot of thought went into your car purchases though. Like they just sort of happened.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Filippo]

And I think that that's true.

[Kenan]

They all did just kind.

[Filippo]

I think that like if you wanted to sit down and like really put pen to paper and think through this.

[Doug DeMuro]

I was considering an Audi E6E Tron Sportback cuz $400 a month leases.

[Filippo]

Okay. But again this is another one that's just gonna happen.

[Doug DeMuro]

This car is so good. I will be sad to lose it. But we just don't use it enough anymore because the GTI is so close.

[Filippo]

The problem is he's been talking about selling his 500 Abarth for a year. He started the conversation about this car. So that means come spring of 27 this thing's gone.

[Kenan]

I'll be buckled in tight.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think just we don't use it enough anymore to make it it a th000 miles last week. But that's different. I don't know man.

[Filippo]

Why is that different? Why did you. Why did you drive it last time?

[Doug DeMuro]

Cuz we needed to carry a lot of stuff.

[Filippo]

Well there you go. So you need something that has to like.

[Doug DeMuro]

Could we rent a car for the insane. The issue with this car is that I think it's worth call it $15,000 has 120,000 miles. It's been two accidents. Well including the time I got hit in front of our house. It just isn't worth that much anymore. And it's a great car for 15,000. Yeah. So don't want to just keep it? I don't know.

[Filippo]

Because I do think you're going to start running into some challenges with maintenance and.

[Doug DeMuro]

Sorry. Second owner aging bids.

[Filippo]

What do you think Buffy Wicks would think about this car?

[Doug DeMuro]

She'd be into it. She lives in Berkeley. Yeah.

[Filippo]

I think she's in Oakland. But same.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay. Yeah.

[Filippo]

Okay. Well obviously Kenan and I are supportive but neither of us think this is going to happen. Speaking of things that's not going to happen Kenan, tell us about your Dodge Viper experience.

[Kenan]

Ah yes. So I recently borrowed a Dodge Viper 2005 SRT10. The third gen. Third gen?

[Filippo]

Yes.

[Kenan]

One of our investors in cars and business selling it on site. You're going to do a review of it relatively soon.

[Filippo]

Is the third gen agreed to be the worst Viper.

[Kenan]

Most people say that it is. Which is why I was curious to drive it now I went into it with that. That was the Viper. I remember as a kid that came out like when I was getting into cars. So when I think Viper, that's still kind of the Viper I think of. But I have to say, I loved it. Like, it is so crude and poorly built and not a lot of thought went into design at all. You know, you're constantly getting cooked partially by the, the transmission tunnel, partially by the exhaust. It becomes so hot that the dead pedal you can't touch with bare feet, which you need to do because the pedal box is too tight to shoes, like. But it's awesome. It's the kind of lunacy I want. However, I will say it is slightly more refined than the first gen, which of course this car has a top that goes with the car, you know, which is nice. You have to zipper it up. It has door handles electronically actuated, which is a big deal for that.

[Filippo]

Air conditioning.

[Kenan]

Well, the first Gens did get air conditioning in 1993, but the, it also has it airbags, lock doors that lock doors that lock windows that are power windows.

[Doug DeMuro]

Windows.

[Kenan]

So it's got a lot of modern luxuries and amenities by Viper standards. But the things I like about it is that it, it's just an 8.3 liter nav 10, a six speed manual transmission. And it has a fear factor because you just constantly respect, you know that there's a chance that it goes wrong. And it's because there's no traction control, no stability control.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know, you're it.

[Filippo]

The biggest engine car Filippo's ever driven, 3.5 liter V6. Meanwhile, he's driving around on an 8.3 liter. But I will, I will drive that.

[Doug DeMuro]

Car this week at, At Steve's request.

[Filippo]

You're gonna.

[Doug DeMuro]

I will.

[Kenan]

You will absolutely hate the car.

[Doug DeMuro]

That is the biggest displacement engine I will ever have driven.

[Filippo]

Well, that's like the biggest displacement.

[Doug DeMuro]

Correct?

[Filippo]

That's. That's it.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no, no. I, I, Ken and I were talking about this.

[Filippo]

500 cubic inches.

[Doug DeMuro]

Ken and I were talking about this like. Nah, I've been in a bunch of pre war things that was at 15.

[Kenan]

Liters, at 25 liters, but it's, it is a big.

[Filippo]

He's driven. He's driven.

[Doug DeMuro]

He's been in it.

[Filippo]

Oh, what is it? What does the cylinder look like in a 25L? Is it a big.

[Kenan]

Is this my point? There are pre work cars that. This 8.3 is not a huge displacement for a lot of those cars, but for modern cars it is. I, but nonetheless, my, my point with it is, is like I think I wanted to drive that because I've always been curious about this car but also I was curious if that would attract me still to the first gen. Which I think it does. I like the way the first gen looks. I underscore that AC is a must in the first gen. Cuz if it's hot in that car with AC on you need it.

[Filippo]

Can I make a suggestion?

[Doug DeMuro]

Top down?

[Filippo]

What about a third gen pull up.

[Kenan]

Third gen. Third gens are great values.

[Filippo]

It's like 03 to 08 I think.

[Kenan]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Ish. Not 09.

[Kenan]

Yeah I'll adjust the years.

[Filippo]

We sell them pretty regularly and they. Oh not 1912 for some reason we have on our list there.

[Doug DeMuro]

You never know.

[Filippo]

That's where it bombs. You never know. You never know. I do know actually from lipo.

[Kenan]

Give us an idea. But yeah, I mean they sell for like.

[Filippo]

These are pretty affordable.

[Kenan]

Affordable and it being 24.

[Filippo]

This black one's 24. The previous one was 38. These are the most recent sales. 47 58. But that's a Mamba with only 10,000 miles. I mean that's a. That's a nice one owner. 10,000 mile Mamba. Even that's only a 60 car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Can you explain to me the difference between the third and the fourth gen?

[Filippo]

Yeah, there's a significant difference.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. One. One of them I know is a hard top but still the difference between.

[Filippo]

The third and the fourth gens is the.

[Kenan]

Yeah, exactly. He said it.

[Filippo]

I've never personally, personally I think there were three Viper gens.

[Doug DeMuro]

Whoa. You're reading the first two together.

[Filippo]

The first two are the same gen and I understand they. And by the way I owned a second gen which in my opinion was a first gen. I know they came with a coupe in 96 but like it's the same car. It was a facelift and they added a coupe. Okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's why they added windows. So yeah, that's.

[Filippo]

Yeah, that's part of a facelift. Sometimes you had windows.

[Kenan]

Sometimes you had windows.

[Filippo]

Eventually the YJ facelifted to add windows. You know what I mean?

[Kenan]

But I'm not.

[Filippo]

Why don't you get one of these?

[Kenan]

I'm not opposed to it because I really, I really enjoyed it. It had a surprisingly good sound system. Like it was. It was like it was. I drove it in all conditions. I drove it on twisty roads, cars and coffee. I drove it in traffic. I didn't drive well. I drove it in all San Diegan conditions.

[Filippo]

Cool down.

[Kenan]

And I have to say the people's response to the car was incredibly. Yeah, that's A very good value. It was incredibly positive. It was the only one at cars and coffee. People were all over it. I constantly drove around, people were going, whoa, Viper. Like you just.

[Filippo]

Yeah, it's pretty cool.

[Kenan]

I enjoyed driving it.

[Filippo]

I think it's cool. The third gen, specifically, I'm looking at it in a new light. I will say there's a lot of C7 in this world, but that came after.

[Kenan]

This was much earlier than the C7, so I can't. You can't help that. You know, people stole this great design.

[Filippo]

Little C6 when you release, I think.

[Kenan]

Well, yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

Do you like it more because it was in fast. In too fast. Too furious.

[Filippo]

Was it?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Kenan]

I never watched any of those movies.

[Doug DeMuro]

To be clear.

[Filippo]

You've never seen the first one.

[Kenan]

I saw the first one.

[Doug DeMuro]

The third one.

[Kenan]

No.

[Filippo]

You should watch just the first watch too. 2. There's some famous lines in 2, like in 1, but other than that, I don't think any of the rest. Three is important. Goes a little off message. After three, it's over. But one is.

[Kenan]

One is.

[Filippo]

One is, in my opinion, the greatest car movie of all time.

[Doug DeMuro]

1.

[Kenan]

I have seen a number.

[Filippo]

You think I'm wrong? What do you think? Gone in six seconds. Bullet, give me a break.

[Kenan]

Gone 60 seconds.

[Filippo]

Okay, we have.

[Kenan]

But I enjoyed it.

[Filippo]

Yes, yes.

[Kenan]

But I very much enjoyed it. And so, I don't know, it's. It's certainly on my radar, but it's on your radar.

[Filippo]

Just like selling it. Abarth is on his radar. You know, at least I'm. At least I'm willing to admit that I'm not buying cars.

[Kenan]

Look, I'm not going to buy anything anytime soon.

[Doug DeMuro]

But it's something. I'm ready to sell my Fiat. But then I was told by a producer that I had to wait. And so I'm waiting.

[Filippo]

Sell the Fiat, sell the wagon, sell the GTI. Here's what you do. I'm serious. These are the two cars.

[Doug DeMuro]

You think I'm at 40 if I do all that?

[Filippo]

What's an E tron GT lease at?

[Doug DeMuro]

More. Too much.

[Filippo]

Too much for you? What are you trying to be at?

[Doug DeMuro]

0 would be nice.

[Filippo]

Sort of. What payment are you? Well, yeah, but like, you want an EV with like a crazy deal.

[Doug DeMuro]

Maybe, Maybe I. I've thought of. Wait, wait. I want to go down this road. I've thought a lot about this because I do kind of want an ev. I think an EV would fit my life.

[Filippo]

He's not going to buy.

[Doug DeMuro]

I know.

[Filippo]

The whole point of these is you Leave.

[Doug DeMuro]

But there's not that many EVS yet that use Tesla Supercharger. There's a few. The Ionic 5 is one. My wife thinks it's hideous.

[Filippo]

Wait, that use Tesla superchargers that have.

[Doug DeMuro]

Access to the supercharger network and the right plug directly to maximize speeds.

[Filippo]

Don't they all have the Tesla plug now?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, no, they're mostly coming out.

[Filippo]

But you, what do you care? Super?

[Doug DeMuro]

Because the only way this works is when we go to Arizona, which is a little bit too far. We can stop and charge a Tesla supercharger.

[Filippo]

Where's the supercharger?

[Doug DeMuro]

Correct.

[Filippo]

I'd rather not stop.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'd rather. No. Well, we stop anyways.

[Kenan]

Stop anyway.

[Doug DeMuro]

We. The audi products, the A6 and Q6E Tron, which are cheap to lead, I.

[Filippo]

Think is an excellent car, but they.

[Doug DeMuro]

Don'T have that yet. They in theory were supposed to buy this fall, but they originally said that they would all have any NACs.

[Filippo]

They don't have NACs at all.

[Doug DeMuro]

There's an adapter that Audi will come out with this fall or winter.

[Filippo]

An adapter for the existing cars.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but like what? So that makes it harder. Rivian 2026 does have access, but too expensive for me for now.

[Filippo]

What about the Vista?

[Doug DeMuro]

We recently started hosting in person events. Come to some, by the way, and honestly, selling merch could have been a nightmare. Hosting the trackside cars and coffee was a load of new logistical challenges for the entire Cars and Bits team. But Square made it super easy. Easy. Taking payments was smooth, fast, and way less stressful. So I could actually focus on talking with people instead of fumbling with transactions. Today's episode is brought to you by Square. Smart, streamlined tools that make running your business simple. Because the right tools make all the difference. What I love about Square is how intuitive it is. There's no steep learning curve, no tech headaches. And whether you're selling shirts at an event, running a coffee shop, or managing a boutique, Square just works. It's all in one. There's payments, sales, tracking, inventory, and even payroll if you need it. Square keeps up so you don't have to slow down. Get everything you need to run and grow your business without any long term commitments. And why wait? Right now you can get up to $200 off square [e-mail]. go CarPod. That's S Q, U A R E dot com, G O slash CarPod. Running your business smarter with Square. Get started today.

[Filippo]

Okay, I want to talk about. I want to talk about three other going to go faster. Number one YouTube channel hit 5 million subscribers. Yes, it did.

[Kenan]

Congratulations. That's a huge.

[Doug DeMuro]

We're only a month, number two.

[Kenan]

I'm not even going to. I don't have a chance to get over to it, but congratulations, number two.

[Filippo]

That was big. That was a big thing that happened. 5 million. And you know what's the best about hitting 5 million? I don't think we'll ever hit 6.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow.

[Filippo]

We definitely won't hit 10. No. The best thing about 5. Oh, yeah, there we are. 5 million subscribers.

[Doug DeMuro]

Look at that. 2,000 videos or 2,000 something.

[Filippo]

Okay, so the best thing about hitting 5 is that we were at 4, 9 for so long. It was like kind of like, how many subscribers you got? Oh, five. But I was lying. Yeah, now I'm truthing.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes, now you're truthing. Truthing.

[Filippo]

Okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

How many views do you think you've had in that time? I have the number in front of me.

[Filippo]

2.2 billion.

[Doug DeMuro]

2.2, but 2.26 billion.

[Filippo]

I've always felt that the number of views is way more exciting than the number of subs. Like, I don't care that much that we have 5 million subs. 2 billion views is so real.

[Doug DeMuro]

302 million hours.

[Kenan]

Because not all of the subscribers are watching all the time, but the views are. People saw it.

[Filippo]

Do you think Trump has watched one of my videos?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Do you think Jannik Sinner has?

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, Yannick certainly has.

[Filippo]

He's in the car.

[Doug DeMuro]

He's got an A12, maybe. Yeah.

[Kenan]

No, he does.

[Filippo]

Do you think Joe Biden has Joe Biden? Do you think he uses YouTube? See, I think that's the thing. I think to the extent that these people use YouTube, maybe I always think about this, like, who's out there? Who is watching? Like, remember when I met Seinfeld and I walked up to him, he said, watch all your videos. And I was terrified. It could be a lot of people. Okay, next topic I want to discuss, speaking of YouTube, is Throttle House.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Like, six months ago, we had this big report that Throttle House was top gear or something. What happened to that? Where's that?

[Kenan]

I think it takes time to then put out the content after the announcement.

[Filippo]

I'm ready. I'm ready.

[Kenan]

I am ready.

[Doug DeMuro]

I wonder, have you texted Thomas and James?

[Filippo]

I could text them, but I want to make a point of it on the pod to try to get people to. Thomas and James aren't the issue. There's all this staff, there's all the contracts.

[Doug DeMuro]

Production.

[Filippo]

It's production. I'm ready. I'M I'm telling you right now. I'm ready.

[Doug DeMuro]

Production's so slow.

[Filippo]

I want to see Thomas and James. What. What have they been reviewing lately?

[Doug DeMuro]

Pull. Pull up Some good stuff. They've also sold two cars on Cars and Bits.

[Filippo]

Sold two cars on Cars and Bits. Did they bring money?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, yeah, they.

[Filippo]

Well, I saw them a couple days before they sold the cars and they. It seemed like they were already over.

[Doug DeMuro]

They did an LC 500 and a 911.

[Filippo]

Pull up. What do we got? What do we got?

[Doug DeMuro]

Five, nine months ago. They've been putting out a little bit less.

[Filippo]

Okay, so they're doing some comparison. I noticed they're doing less content because.

[Doug DeMuro]

Of the Top Gear Grand Tour. Yeah.

[Filippo]

Is it Grand Tour?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Ah, darn. I thought it was. What's Top Gear? Is that over?

[Kenan]

They're dead. That's dead. They killed it.

[Filippo]

Completely dead.

[Kenan]

Completely over. Until someone reboots it in a couple years.

[Filippo]

So these guys are Grand Tour?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes. Alongside the train spotting guy, supposedly.

[Kenan]

Which will last for one.

[Filippo]

What else we got here? There's an aerial atom. There's an S5. I haven't done the S5. These guys are killing it still.

[Doug DeMuro]

Have you not done the S5?

[Filippo]

You have? No, but they got one coming next week.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, I'm so glad we're only four months behind.

[Filippo]

We're four months behind. But, dude, I had the RS6 performance before they did, so take that, Thomas and. Or James.

[Doug DeMuro]

Is that factually accurate?

[Filippo]

I know.

[Doug DeMuro]

Don't. I don't think so. All right.

[Filippo]

Last thing I wanted to talk about is a couple of months ago, I realized this never came out of the pot. A couple of months ago, I ran my Ford GT into my house.

[Kenan]

Yeah, not for the first time.

[Filippo]

No, no, that was the first.

[Kenan]

I'm pretty sure you've done it.

[Filippo]

I used to hit the front stuff in my garage. Like, that was like. It was pillows. I eventually put pillows there to stop hitting stuff. But I ran my Ford GT into my house.

[Doug DeMuro]

Your garage? Really? Well, I don't know, but like the.

[Filippo]

I don't know that it makes that much of a. The exterior. Like, it wasn't like I drove too far in, you know, that part of.

[Kenan]

The car is the nose.

[Filippo]

Nose which on that car, pointing.

[Kenan]

Well, he could have backed in.

[Doug DeMuro]

And you know what also has happened? You have hit my garage.

[Kenan]

You know what?

[Doug DeMuro]

If.

[Kenan]

So if you got a garage, look out, Doug.

[Filippo]

Doug will come and hit a garage door.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yes.

[Filippo]

In this case, it was just part.

[Doug DeMuro]

Of the building structural.

[Filippo]

Like I hit an exterior Part of the building ran to with my Ford gt. And you know what happened? Sean's going to be mad because we could have turned this into a promo. You know what happened? I got the whole car. Ppf, the paint protection film, and nothing happened. Yeah, like the PPF was damaged, but then I took it to Kevin, our boy at Elite Finish. Miramar Road or whatever. Kenamar Drive.

[Doug DeMuro]

Nice. Well done. Pull that out.

[Filippo]

Miramar.

[Doug DeMuro]

Kenar.

[Kenan]

Kenmar.

[Filippo]

And they fixed it and there was no problem.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kenan]

That's the beauty of ppf.

[Doug DeMuro]

Hey, Ken.

[Filippo]

I knew that PPF could stop me from like rocks flying up, but I ran into a house slowly.

[Kenan]

I once scraped a 599 at the exotic car. There are a lot of poles and so we bring guide and I just barely. But it was a little tiny piece of PPF and just cut it. No damage to the paint. It is nice in those situations, so it's rare that that happens.

[Filippo]

I was going to just leave it too, because I don't care. But then I realized I hit the house once.

[Kenan]

You. You going to do it again?

[Filippo]

And then I almost did the other day. That's why I brought this.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's nice to be the one person on this podcast that's never run into a garage.

[Kenan]

All right, Wait, you will.

[Filippo]

I want to. I want to do the market report. The market report this week is sponsored by the Lincoln ls, which was the companion vehicle to the Jaguar S Type that SP Sting revealed for us in the Desert Rose Music video and V8.

[Doug DeMuro]

Available with a V8. Available with a manual, but not in conjunction. I didn't say that it was available to be in the manual. So available to be and available.

[Filippo]

That's correct.

[Doug DeMuro]

And it is a car that Kenan would have if he were still in Ohio.

[Kenan]

My grandfather had one. It was a lovely car.

[Filippo]

Okay, what I want to talk about is the991, the market report. We don't have any market reports here. The only market report we got to cover is the991, which is good because there's actually great questions this week, some of which are for you. Really. The 991 is. God. Okay, I'm going to espouse a theory on the pod today. It's September something or other. I don't know when this goes live, but I'm going to espouse a theory on the pod today. The 991 is the 993 of the modern 911. Meaning the 993 was the. Is Considered best of breed the best air cooled they sell for crazy money even though they're slow it is the one Everybody wants the991 is that for the modern era.1 mostly what do you not think I'm right?

[Kenan]

997 is the correct.

[Filippo]

The market doesn't agree with you. I agree with. Agree with you. I think the 997 is a godly automobile however the market thinks it's a little weird looking the twos are. Are pretty hard to find and nobody likes the interior except me I love i997 interior I think was like the last purposey Porsche interior flat bar across.

[Kenan]

These like people don't like that they're half of them are turbocharged and half of them aren't People hate that push.

[Doug DeMuro]

Pull bolt like talk about manuals.

[Filippo]

Let me tell you something.

[Kenan]

What?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah manual.

[Filippo]

I'm talking manual because. Oh man. Well I'm not only talking manuals but what's become clear to me is that market is going to prize the 991.1 manual in a crazy way this red one. No, no. Just keep the autos up this red one this is 74000 car. The sticker on this car that is.

[Doug DeMuro]

A strong 102 for a base.

[Filippo]

This is an 8 year old base model with these. With I mean base base base base wheels, base interior, no options. Go back to the thing. Go back to the rest of them. There's a ton of these like this that. That 13. That's a 13. That's a 13 year old automobile that sold for $67,000 with some miles on.

[Doug DeMuro]

It Also relatively low spec the market.

[Filippo]

Already is prizing these cars if you have a 991.1 or any 991 because honestly it's. It's. It's true for that one's and I.

[Kenan]

Think that DOT one might become. It's na.

[Filippo]

Yeah the na is going to help and I do think that the market feels that the 992 wonderful though it is became came when. When. When all is said and done and people are fighting about it on renlist in 15 years they're going to say that the 992 is where it's. It's switched from being a sports car to more of a luxury touring car. As great as the 992 is and by the way I'm not referring to the GT cars they have their own world. I'm talking about Reggies.

[Doug DeMuro]

My disagreement is I mostly agree with you. I think it is the end of an era, especially before went to a 3 liter twin turbo for everything.

[Filippo]

By the way, I'm not saying this. I feel this way. I'm saying I think the market.

[Doug DeMuro]

I have a feeling that the 997, because it's relatively rare and because the 991 went to electric electronic power steering instead of hydraulic, I think the 997.2 will become the most prized. I don't.

[Filippo]

I think it's like 964,993. A lot of enthusiasts love the 964, but the market congealed around the 993 and a lot of people will. Will argue for you that the 964 is the 1, but the 9. 9, the 993 really is the one that like became the thing. And I think that's what's going happen to happen here. And also 997.2s lot, they're rare. There are a lot of automatics and they.

[Doug DeMuro]

You're right, they don't have quite the value differentiation. Although an 09 Carrera S for 67, which is the same price they sell for big money. They're still worth actual stuff.

[Filippo]

They sell for big money. But we're talking about a Carrera 4S here as opposed to. We just looked at a base, base, base.

[Doug DeMuro]

Newer and also lower mile could be open that 09. We look at least 50,000 miles.

[Filippo]

That red 991 was a Nicki Minaj super base. And it is still pulling 73. 5.

[Doug DeMuro]

Probably 110.

[Filippo]

Only because it is a manual. Last of the breed. They don't care that it's Nicki Minaj. They don't care that it's a beige interior.

[Doug DeMuro]

Super bass for those that don't know super bass, dude.

[Filippo]

Boom boom, boom boom.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. That, that. This one had a 88 sticker.

[Filippo]

88 sticker. It sold for 73. Yeah, 74. This car lost $14,000 in appreciation in 10 years. That's nuts that it's lost 15%. I mean that's nothing. Drove the car for free. That's crazy. 991. 991 is market.

[Doug DeMuro]

God, mark my words, I should buy one.

[Filippo]

You probably should. You won't lose any money. The problem is you will never spend that kind of money. And this is the problem with Filippo. He only thinks about entry price, doesn't think about TCO.

[Kenan]

I love the 991. First 911 I ever drove. Brand new when it came out. 991 Carrera S, I have a hard.

[Filippo]

Time respecting the 991 because I worked for Porsche when it came out and, like, I knew how dysfunctional the organization was. So, like, to me, it's just like.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't know the 993 error. You just didn't know.

[Filippo]

Yeah, I didn't know. So it was more dysfunctional.

[Kenan]

It almost went under in Reno.

[Filippo]

Did you know that?

[Kenan]

Oh, that's right.

[Filippo]

In Reno.

[Kenan]

Because the Germans wanted to get out of the rain.

[Filippo]

Yeah, I don't know why. I'm sure there were significant tax incentives involved. Okay, you have an L405 thing, then we gotta get onto the thing.

[Kenan]

Yes, the. The L405 is one of the. Of my favorite Range Rovers. I think they look phenomenal.

[Filippo]

This is the range that was sold from 13 to like 20.

[Kenan]

This one. So this one, you look. This looks rich. If I saw this blue with the silver. Get out of the way. Sold for 19. 1.

[Doug DeMuro]

Why don't.

[Filippo]

Why did.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, that's crazy. I'll split it with you guys.

[Kenan]

Now, I understand, like, Range Rovers don't have the best reputation in terms of reliability. Yeah, I mean, but still, how many miles this had? This one had 83,000.

[Filippo]

You know, range Rovers don't have the best rep, but L405 seem to be coming in with miles. I don't know.

[Kenan]

Miles. And look, I mean, everything.

[Doug DeMuro]

Hold on.

[Kenan]

Looks nice still in this car. So, like, we. I think that's an unbelievable V8. And it's a V8, a supercharged one. I think that is an inexpensive way to look very wealthy. And it still looks really, really good.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I agree.

[Kenan]

There's one in this building that we're in that we see occasionally, this exact spec. And I like, every time I say.

[Filippo]

It, I go, damn, it's aged well.

[Doug DeMuro]

Why don't I own that?

[Filippo]

It's aged well.

[Kenan]

Why don't you.

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't want to deal with maintenance.

[Filippo]

But you're not going to own a Range Rover.

[Kenan]

Somebody991 in a Range Rover.

[Filippo]

Every car that comes up. Hey, Career gt.

[Doug DeMuro]

Our friend Dan just had an issue and he's going to sell his because.

[Kenan]

Friend, our friend and CEO friend, CEO.

[Doug DeMuro]

Dan, has had an issue because the shifter wouldn't go up.

[Filippo]

Well, sometimes stuff breaks, but the car is getting older.

[Kenan]

But then. But Dan likes to work on cars.

[Doug DeMuro]

Tinker.

[Kenan]

That was a treat.

[Filippo]

Go back. I'm curious what the. What, what the mileages are on some of.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, that. That's what they all cost.

[Filippo]

But yeah, that was Actually a strong.

[Kenan]

I mean like 17 5.

[Filippo]

Click on that one. I actually prefer the short wheel, but I think it looks better.

[Kenan]

81. But again, to your point, they come.

[Doug DeMuro]

In with miles sort by mileage. Highest miles first.

[Filippo]

Oh, wow. We can do that. Oh wow.

[Kenan]

Absolutely we can. Let's see.

[Filippo]

These are some sports autobiography. Yeah. This is a.

[Doug DeMuro]

This is a pre body.

[Filippo]

Click on that guy.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh.

[Filippo]

275 of the 165,000 miles.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. Wow.

[Filippo]

I mean I wouldn't necessarily say that it's indicative that it can do that, but some of them have.

[Kenan]

Some of them have.

[Doug DeMuro]

At least one has.

[Kenan]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

133 in Georgia and that's a big boy.

[Doug DeMuro]

And it sold for 19. I don't know.

[Filippo]

I agree with you. It's. It's pretty amazing what these sell for considering how they look. This car has not aged into looking like a used like baller on a budget used car thing yet.

[Kenan]

No.

[Filippo]

There are still legit people driving this.

[Kenan]

Yeah, absolutely. If I saw that parked outside of any. I mean pretty much, yeah. Look at that.

[Filippo]

The early years with those wheel, I felt those wheels were the best wheel they ever really. The early years with those wheels I still think are just like some of the most beautiful SUVs. You don't like that?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Filippo]

Silver isn't the color I'd get, but I would get something with silver. With the silver.

[Doug DeMuro]

Silver bar.

[Filippo]

Yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

The wheels less so.

[Filippo]

I've been using Deleteme for years now and I'm still just as grateful for it today as I was the day I signed up. They've been a great supporter of my channel and my privacy. The first time I saw my personal info online, my name, old phone number addresses, even family details. It was on dozens of sites. As someone who's pretty visible online, I've had to deal with weird stuff, random emails, odd messages, People diggin too deeply. That's why I take privacy seriously and why Delete Me is a core part of how I protect myself and my family. Deleteme is a subscription service that removes your personal information from hundreds of data broker sites. You give them your info once and they go to work sending personalized reports every few months to show exactly what they've removed. They keep monitoring so it doesn't come right back. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for Delete me now with a special discount for our listeners today. Get 20% off your DeleteMe plan when you go to JoinDeleteMe.com Demuro and use promo code DEMURO at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to JoinDeleteMe.com DEMURO and enter code demuro at checkout. Support this car pod and your privacy. That's joindeleteme.com demuro code demuro. Okay, we gotta move on to the questions. The questions are brought to you by Cars and Bids All. Thank you. Cars and Bids is the greatest place where you can buy, sell, or try trade cars fully paid. What?

[Doug DeMuro]

I said yes, because you buy, trade.

[Filippo]

You can buy or sell people.

[Doug DeMuro]

Thank you.

[Filippo]

Look at what we got right now on the site. We got a McLaren, we got this giant thing. We got a Super Trofeo Stradale. The other STs, there's great stuff. Anyway, Cars and Bids. To find out more about Cars and bids, go to carsandbids.com thank you.

[Kenan]

Yes, there will be a post in the community tab where you can ask questions.

[Filippo]

Well, okay, that's the question. So now we have questions. Community tab.

[Kenan]

But before we jump into questions.

[Filippo]

Oh, wow. Okay. What do we got?

[Kenan]

Recently, a couple of viewers sent us things, sent us some gifts, which I thought were very nice. They sent us notes as well. But I'm going to show the gifts mostly. So this is a road and track with the entire Ferrari lineup from 1997.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow.

[Kenan]

So F50, 456, 550 Marello and 355 SP.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow.

[Filippo]

The F50, the 550, the 350.

[Kenan]

Yes.

[Filippo]

And the 456 GTA.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

GT Whoa.

[Kenan]

Don't insult the 455 6. God will punish you.

[Filippo]

One Filippo first drive.

[Kenan]

Oh, it gets better. If you flip through some of the concept car they had premiered, the. It was the multiple, the first gen multiple in there.

[Filippo]

The last of this first Drive says the QX4 will win people over with a heady mix of overall comfort and driveline sophistication. Folks.

[Doug DeMuro]

It didn't also. Same engine as a Pathfinder, same drivetrain as a Pathfinder.

[Filippo]

Yeah. That's so true. Wow. This is cool. Why was this sent to us? Somebody thought we would appreciate this. We do.

[Kenan]

A listener named Tim from Washington sent us this and he just was appreciative and wanted to because he knew we appreciated the Ferrari lineup at that time. I think even Filippo would. And we wanted to send us to.

[Doug DeMuro]

I love that.

[Filippo]

SLK230 is new Legacy 2.5 GT.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. Which gen? Oh, wow.

[Filippo]

And this article written by the same guy who did the QX4, Andrew Bornhop, says, My personal list of favorite sports sedans has Just grown by one. There was one of these outside the office today. Did you see? It was 2.5 GT. Right?

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow.

[Kenan]

Wow.

[Filippo]

Well, this is great.

[Doug DeMuro]

There's also an ad in the. On the back.

[Kenan]

Yeah. Q45.

[Filippo]

This is good stuff.

[Kenan]

Some good cigarettes.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, my God. Don't, don't, don't, don't.

[Kenan]

Don't tear it. Be gentle with this.

[Filippo]

1956 meets 2001 Porsche Boxster. And you know what happened now it's an electric.

[Doug DeMuro]

Well, that was how.

[Kenan]

But that's not the only gift that was sent in. Another gift was sent in specifically for you. And I'm going to handle this because it's fragile.

[Filippo]

Oh, give him.

[Doug DeMuro]

What happened to the magazine. We will not let you touch it.

[Kenan]

And I think you're going to break it. This comes from Steven. He said that he had. He sends a note that he said hello. This was on his desk for many years, and he thought it was time for a new home. And he wanted to thank you for years of quirks and features. And here's a little plinth.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, you can hold that.

[Kenan]

And be careful with this. But here is a crystal cut. Don't, don't. Geez. Don't do it.

[Filippo]

Wow. This is a Lamborghini Countach.

[Kenan]

It's a Countach.

[Filippo]

It's a Crystal Countach.

[Kenan]

You have a Crystal Countach?

[Filippo]

No, I got a real one. I got the real one.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, I don't know. Crystal one's cool.

[Filippo]

Made of metal.

[Kenan]

You're gonna break that wing. I am so afraid. I am so afraid.

[Filippo]

Wow, this is really cool.

[Kenan]

Isn't that neat?

[Filippo]

What I'm gonna do with this is I'm gonna take it home and keep it away from Kenan, who will probably break it. No. Look at this. Crystal Lamborghini Kunchhorst.

[Kenan]

No, he's holding it.

[Filippo]

This is as good as it gets.

[Doug DeMuro]

Somebody come to Kenneth.

[Filippo]

Somebody come to KE Kenan. I'm a careful person.

[Kenan]

Yeah, I remember what happened with your career GT engine model.

[Filippo]

I got another one and a VHS.

[Kenan]

He held it for 30 seconds. And I heard smash in the other room. And I just heard maniacal laughing from him. And it was a great story.

[Filippo]

We're still telling it.

[Kenan]

I still have to fix that, by the way.

[Filippo]

No, I got another one and the VHS tank. At some point, I got some money somehow, like, I overpaid my taxes, and I got some big refund. And I was like, you know what? I'm gonna buy a courage.

[Kenan]

How cool is even like, the seat. Like, if you look at the seats, they're like cracked.

[Filippo]

I know it is. It looks like a low body car.

[Kenan]

It definitely is a low body car.

[Filippo]

But we're gonna. We're gon a five liter. That is really cool. I love that. And. And we're not going to put it in the pod decoration. I'm going to take that home personally and lick it whenever I want to. Please. Okay, we got to talk questions. We got to do questions. This is beautiful. We'll leave it here for just the day.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's a good idea.

[Filippo]

But then I'm taking it home.

[Kenan]

Okay. But thank you for sending those and that's very kind of you guys to do that.

[Filippo]

Yeah, I really like. I'm going to read this QX4 review later and decide. Decide whether I want to get into a QX4. Okay. First, first question. First question from F40RCK5. It's September. Who else is surprised that Doug kept to his promise of buying zero cars? Or are we about to be hit by the biggest Doug sember yet? Are you surprised that I haven't bought a car? No, we do have a car coming.

[Doug DeMuro]

No surprise. We haven't announced it yet.

[Filippo]

Yeah, it's a surprise.

[Doug DeMuro]

I was gonna just smirk to the camera and set.

[Filippo]

But it's not necessarily me buying a car. Are you surprised that I haven't bought a car?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Filippo]

What about you?

[Kenan]

No. The A class taught us all we needed to know about you buying cars. Like silly cars. Unless it's something of note that you like, want to further your collection of cars with, you're not going to buy it. And even then you're happy with the three you have.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm. He owns more than three cars.

[Kenan]

Listen, three notable cars. Thank you for correcting me, but the Courier gt the crew dust.

[Filippo]

It notable. Oh my God. The people in Austria. Dude.

[Kenan]

And Graz. I apologize to the.

[Filippo]

What Austria has is Mozart and the G wagon and Vienna.

[Kenan]

There are more. Many more classical composers that.

[Filippo]

Well, there's more people that came out of Graz like the Supra. But we're not going to talk about them. Neither of you are surprised, even though you always profess.

[Kenan]

No, because I never. He just. He constantly talks about cars he wants and then he seldom buys one.

[Filippo]

I rarely talk about cars that I want.

[Doug DeMuro]

What do I. I think you should not buy other cars.

[Filippo]

We're done. I just have realized these are the cars that I want and they seem to be great. And at this life stage with little children. Little, little. We're teaching them to swim. You ever. You ever teach a Kid to swim in a lot of water. It goes in your mouth. I don't have time for cars. All right. More cars. I have enough.

[Kenan]

But no, I. I do not think that come the end of the year.

[Filippo]

You will purchase a vehicle or next year. Well, okay, next. What, what am I going to get? What am I going to get? An F50?

[Kenan]

Yeah, if you could you.

[Filippo]

A 456 GTA.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, you could.

[Filippo]

If I could, I. You could.

[Kenan]

456 GTA. You get that for 45. I bet we could.

[Filippo]

All right, from coup r, are there any plans for a cars and bids Android app? The website's a question, but an app would be really nice to have a.

[Doug DeMuro]

Corporate answer them to give you the real.

[Filippo]

No, give us the corporate answer. We like that.

[Doug DeMuro]

We're constantly evaluating whether or not we. We started out. We have an iOS app that has gotten really phenomenal response and reviews. And we started with that based on where most of our users are. The percentage of our users that are on an iPhone is much higher than the percentage that are on Android phones, which is true in the US what percentage?

[Filippo]

Like what percentage?

[Doug DeMuro]

I don't remember off camera.

[Filippo]

Give me a bali of mobile.

[Doug DeMuro]

Something like 65 to 70% was.

[Filippo]

So you're turning your back on 35% of our users, including coupon.

[Doug DeMuro]

The other part of that answer is that we designed from the beginning the mobile experience. So when you go to it on Chrome, Safari, Opera, whatever, your web browser of choice, the experience is a really phenomenal one. Right. So the app was like, it was meant to be additive and was a test of whether we could make it enough of a differentiated and great experience to be worth it. And starting with the platform where we have the most users was are we.

[Filippo]

Going to have the app or not?

[Doug DeMuro]

Maybe in the future.

[Filippo]

Okay. It didn't get us any. Really. I can't believe you're turning your back on 30% of our users.

[Doug DeMuro]

I want to be an Android user again. I might if you switch.

[Kenan]

I swear to God, the only reason.

[Doug DeMuro]

I have an iPhone is that Doug peer pressured me years ago into getting one. Okay, it's time to go back.

[Filippo]

Next question. There's some good ones in here. I can't wait for some of these questions. Kenan's going to blow up in about three of them. Next question from Shotgun Sam. 911. And by the way, 911, I think is a reference to the car and not the terrorist. Which east west, never forget which east west interstate in the US provides the most enjoyable cross country drive. What about the best north South Interstate? I've driven all the east west interstates in the US the most enjoyable is undoubtedly Interstate 70, which runs from the middle of nowhere in Utah to somewhere in Maryland. And the most beautiful part of any the entire US Interstate system is the drive from the middle of Utah to Denver. However, through the Rocky Mountains and throughout the beautiful red rocks in eastern Utah. However, if you are driving for beauty, you should not be on an interstate highway. The interstates were built for expediency, truck transport, goods transport. And if you're, like trying to get your dog to Nantucket real fast, they are not built for people who want to have to see America. And so if you want a beautiful drive, you got to get on the US highways. You want to be on US 50 and you want to see America that way. Do you have anything to add?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Filippo]

Okay.

[Doug DeMuro]

Spot on. Christ.

[Filippo]

Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Don't take an interstate, folks.

[Doug DeMuro]

I mean, do. Because it's way more convenient.

[Filippo]

This is what we Learned from Lightning McQueen, Radiator Springs, the Interstate Bypass. This is a car. This is a car podcast. We're going to talk about cars. Yeah, cars. The Interstate bypassed Radiator Springs and Mater, and all those people flow. They didn't have any people people anymore.

[Doug DeMuro]

That is the true story of Route 66 and many others.

[Filippo]

Yeah, Route 66. So I've decided it's kind of BS. Yeah, there's. Okay, the Route 66 was a US highway. There are interstates, US highways, state highways. There are thousands of US highways. You know how many they decommissioned? That one you want. You can still have that experience if you want it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but it changed where people were driving through. So towns that were built up. We exist because people drive through here.

[Filippo]

You can still have Route 66 on U.S. 50, on U.S. 40, and on many other U.S. highways that still span across the country and still have stoplights as they go through various towns, including Radiator Springs.

[Doug DeMuro]

And some parts of those are also the Honda Sound Road, where you drive down it and it plays a song.

[Filippo]

That is a thing somehow.

[Doug DeMuro]

It's on one of the U.S. highways.

[Kenan]

You only like the Ferraris.

[Filippo]

Next question. This is a good one.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh.

[Filippo]

From Caliber, ORP rank, all the four runners. I don't want to do the rankings much. The four runners. I'll do.

[Doug DeMuro]

All right, first one best.

[Filippo]

Okay, new one best.

[Kenan]

New one.

[Doug DeMuro]

Whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Kenan]

New one, best. That feels like.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. Okay, so we're at six generations.

[Filippo]

Are we? Okay, so there was the first one, the boxy one with the roof that Came off. The second one was the like middling one in the middle there.

[Kenan]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

The third one was the famous.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

The fourth one is the famous with the V8. The fifth one is the one that just ended that. They sold 2 billion.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay.

[Filippo]

And the 6 one's brand new.

[Doug DeMuro]

I will start this off. The third gen is the best gen.

[Kenan]

I knew you're gonna say third gen. You know what?

[Doug DeMuro]

No. Third gen started to break it to.

[Filippo]

You, but yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna posit something to you and I want you to listen. Tight.

[Doug DeMuro]

Build.

[Filippo]

Construction of the 5th gen will go down as the 993 of the Forerunner.

[Doug DeMuro]

What? What? Yeah.

[Filippo]

Right now people like the third gen because they're six grand and like. No, they're durable. That will be the fifth.

[Doug DeMuro]

I will say that.

[Filippo]

And there will be 10 times more fifth gens to buy.

[Doug DeMuro]

The fifth gen is number two for me.

[Filippo]

Fifth gen, number one by far.

[Doug DeMuro]

I will accept that. Because as long as you're not saying.

[Filippo]

The sixth gen, I'm gonna, I'm gonna say this. Not only is the 5th gen the greatest forerunner of all time, it may be the greatest SUV ever made with some small exception. Yeah, 100 series might be an exception, but only some, only 0607, maybe 0305s. If there was a guy who owned one sitting here.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, 100 series. I was like, that's not a fifth gen. Okay, what is your number two?

[Filippo]

Number one, fifth gen. Number two, fourth gen. Number three, third gen. Number four. The current one. Number five, the first one. And number six, the second one, which everybody forgets about. That's the.

[Kenan]

That's about. Yeah.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow. I'm gonna stick with number one being the third gen, number two being the fifth. Okay.

[Filippo]

You gotta say fourth for 30. Number three, fourth. Thank God.

[Doug DeMuro]

Man.

[Kenan]

Poor second.

[Doug DeMuro]

Trying to remember the first one was the one that was basically. That was two door.

[Filippo]

It was a two door boxy thing. You could pull the roof off. But dude, the new one is awesome.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I think I'm gonna put the new one. It has to be third, fourth. No, the third is the fourth gen. The new and third. And then second is fifth. Five and first is six.

[Filippo]

First is last. First has a following and it deserves it. You could pull the roof off. It was cool. It started the world.

[Doug DeMuro]

Truck with a cab cover.

[Filippo]

Here's a question for you.

[Doug DeMuro]

I'm standing by that. It's a pickup truck with a cab cover.

[Filippo]

It basically was. Right?

[Doug DeMuro]

The second gen is a real suv.

[Filippo]

Yeah, but that was part of the fun. Of the first gen. And ever since the first gen they've always tried to go back to keep some of that magic. Here's a question for you. Do you think Toyota regrets naming and Honda regrets naming the cars the 4Runner, the RAV4 and the CR V like in today's world where cars get named. They could have named it like the passport like they did and the pilot but instead they called it the cross RV Comfortable runabout vehicle. You think they're like damn, what were we thinking?

[Kenan]

Well that is a objectively they didn't.

[Filippo]

Know it would take off. Like RAV4 is stupid 4Runner.

[Kenan]

I still kind of like it's active and like it fits. Yeah. I think any of the four wheel drive.

[Filippo]

But don't you think if they could go back knowing how popular the RAV4 would one day be they would have called it anything else?

[Doug DeMuro]

No.

[Filippo]

Okay, next question. These are these start to become for Kenan and Filippo.

[Doug DeMuro]

Okay.

[Kenan]

Okay.

[Filippo]

From over leverage Question for Kenan and Filippo. He's reading question.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, I gotta stop. Great username.

[Kenan]

Yes.

[Filippo]

After owning. All right, you ready for this? This is gonna hurt you. After owning a Rentech W211E55 in Flint gray cool car. How can you justify the price of a nice E39 M5? Great question over leveraged.

[Kenan]

Well, do you have. You want to shift your own gears, you want to put it in drive. I mean come on, you may have a rental car. You still go.

[Filippo]

Is that the only difference?

[Kenan]

No one I think the there are a of lot of reasons why you prefer the E39. I mean the driving experience. The Rentech is awesome because AMG cars are great in that you just point them in straight line. You put your foot. It's kind of an American approach to power. You just kind of go dynamically. I've never felt that they're that great. It's like that said I would love I dream of having a 211 next to my E39. I have both is like the dream. The E39 is just regarded by enthusiasts because it combined a great number of things great naturally braided V8 manual transmission, rear wheeel drive, great looks all those things.

[Filippo]

So I think they 211 E55 is 469 horse.

[Kenan]

Well the rentech is. He's probably putting five something to the ground. I'm sure.

[Filippo]

Well that's.

[Kenan]

But it's modified. I mean it's like okay, great. You could modify E39 to also put 600.

[Doug DeMuro]

Can you?

[Kenan]

And then Apple everybody loves do people Absolutely.

[Doug DeMuro]

The.

[Kenan]

The three put 600. I will say warranty from the fact.

[Filippo]

The presupposition of this question is that there they're. They're like identical enough to be compared. But I agree the M5 is not only sportier but because it's a manual.

[Kenan]

Adds a lot to it.

[Filippo]

There's just a. I mean how drive any car. How do you justify the fact that a 250 TR is $25 million?

[Kenan]

But I think that's pretty light for a 250. True point. Exactly.

[Filippo]

There's like a. There's like an. There's like an intangible. Like I enjoy the driving experience of a manual car.

[Kenan]

Right.

[Filippo]

And I don't necessarily believe that M5 is a better handler than a 211.

[Kenan]

I think that. I mean neither are what you call super sharp. It was that era was. But I would say in your words, the. The market speaks on what those cars are worth and there is a reason.

[Filippo]

Yeah. So how can it be justified? Well, because more people want the M5.

[Kenan]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

And they're willing to pay more for it.

[Kenan]

I understand in your world that that might not be the case. And I agree the 211 is a really cool. Really cool. Most complicated cup holder of all time. But I think that the market disagrees with that.

[Filippo]

And the 210.

[Kenan]

Not just me. The mark pull up a 210.

[Filippo]

8:55, whatever. Sell those anymore?

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, but rarely. We sold so many for a while.

[Kenan]

I. Oh man.

[Filippo]

On those blocks I don't like 99s but. But look at nine grand. 5,600.

[Doug DeMuro]

Why don't we own these?

[Filippo]

Why don't you have one of these? I. Dude the greatest. One of the greatest cars I ever owned. I'm not kidding. And it was super reliable.

[Doug DeMuro]

You have.

[Filippo]

You have an Automatic.

[Kenan]

Single automatic car991.

[Filippo]

You know what you ought to do?

[Doug DeMuro]

No, I didn't say. Yes, it is.

[Filippo]

You know what you ought to do. The. The facelift was in 2 2000. The wagons are legal.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

That's the car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Never liked the wagon.

[Filippo]

Sell me a 2211E55.

[Doug DeMuro]

I've always.

[Filippo]

It's so practical. I agree it's ugly, but it is so practical.

[Doug DeMuro]

I've always thought that the S212 so my generation E class. The trunk is too like stylistically looks like they shrunk it a little bit too much. This. They extended it a little too much.

[Filippo]

It's too long. I agree. However, it was incredibly practical.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

Of course you could Stick. I could stick Kennen back there. I could stick six cannons back there. Okay.

[Kenan]

Standard unit of measure.

[Filippo]

Next question from mini truck Matt. Hi. Doug Cannon and Filippo. I recently got a speeding ticket for 9,265 in the middle of the Mojave Desert.

[Doug DeMuro]

Good feet, buddy.

[Filippo]

This made me wonder what is the worst place in the US for car enthusiasts either due to low speed limits or overly restrictive speed limits for the environment. Virginia. Virginia is the worst place in the United States for car enthusiasts. People. People complain dearly about California and all of its draconian laws and all that. But I think that's only because California is big and a lot of this stuff gets publicity. People don't realize the sort of middling states can also have some real crazy stuff going down. Virginia is wild. It is the wildest of them all. It has. Radar detectors are banned.

[Kenan]

Yep.

[Filippo]

You have to have front and back plates. You have to have stickers on both front and back plates. You have to do safety inspection. And their speed laws are unreal. They have relaxed them a little bit, but not of a lot all that much. Virginia is the worst place to be in car enthusiasts. And you have to pay an annual property tax on your cars that is astronomically high.

[Kenan]

It is the Switzerland of the United States.

[Filippo]

Except it isn't good enough to justify.

[Kenan]

Yes.

[Doug DeMuro]

Can we discuss one underrated benefit of California on interstate highways? Only CHP can.

[Filippo]

What's that about?

[Doug DeMuro]

Which is a great rule. So you drive into Arizona.

[Filippo]

I passed a San Diego police car the other day fly. And I was like, yeah, I don't think he's going to do it. Other passport.

[Doug DeMuro]

They can pull you over. They just have to then wait for CHP to write a ticket. If not reserve. The upside to that is you then enter like Arizona and there's police officers pulling you over every jurisdiction. Ford Mustang GT that has no decals on the side. That was a Utah Alex Penfold or something. I have generally discovered unsafe.

[Filippo]

As a. As a enthusiast, as a person who drives cross country all the time, I have generally discovered that the concern. Conservative states tend to be more aggressive in their speed enforcement and generally. Yeah, Arizona is a scary state to speed in. They are. They have a mandate from their. From their populace to enforce laws. We like the cop. And so they go out there and they enforce laws. And like if you are even thinking of speeding in.

[Doug DeMuro]

I think something.

[Kenan]

It's a great irony that they want laws to be enforced but they hate the government.

[Filippo]

Don't tread on me.

[Doug DeMuro]

Right.

[Filippo]

We're pro police. Which Is it blue line? Blue line sticker and a don't tread on me flag.

[Kenan]

I think there's some cognitive dissonance since not realized there.

[Doug DeMuro]

But can we discuss how hard it is to get pulled over in the Mojave Desert? There's a lot of roads and not that many.

[Kenan]

That was a little weird. That was bad luck, I think.

[Filippo]

Well, he's going 92 and a 65. I mean, dude.

[Kenan]

I mean, honestly, out there. Yeah, it is.

[Doug DeMuro]

No, but you shouldn't do that. I don't condone speeding.

[Filippo]

One thing that does annoy me about California is that 70 is the highest maximum speed. Right. You go out. I was on a speed limit. 80 road. Texas apparently has 85s the local road.

[Doug DeMuro]

And parts of like the. Of Highway 10 through New Mexico or 75.

[Filippo]

Oh, 75 is kind. I mean, when I drive in this country. When you hit the Arizona border, you're at 75 miles an hour speed limit until you get to Tennessee, Arkansas or Tennessee, you basically can go 75. So you just fly through those 70.

[Doug DeMuro]

For most of that Arizona section. But yeah, it becomes 75 after Yuma.

[Filippo]

It's become 75 after Yuma, which is the first city.

[Doug DeMuro]

Point taken.

[Filippo]

Okay.

[Kenan]

Yeah. Another bad state speed is Ohio. Ohio is a really.

[Filippo]

Ohio's always. Ken, how many times you got pulled over for speeding there?

[Kenan]

Only twice. Ever. Twice in. I don't know. I've been driving. How old am I? So 13 years.

[Doug DeMuro]

You know that I've never received a speeding ticket yet.

[Kenan]

You'll get it.

[Filippo]

You speed Arizona a lot. Okay, there's two more questions. Oh, three more questions.

[Doug DeMuro]

Three more.

[Filippo]

Very quick. Three more questions. Three, Three, three, three, three. One of them I didn't put on here. But someone asked, and I'm curious also to have the response. I don't know why I didn't paste it in the document. Kenan, what we know you're obsessed with M5, et cetera. What cars have you owned before the M5?

[Kenan]

First car was also an E39 525i then the M5.

[Filippo]

Love the platform.

[Kenan]

Yeah, I do love the platform.

[Filippo]

The E39 was the first car. The M5 is the second. His second car.

[Kenan]

Yeah, I went from the base most base model to the the big boy. Then I went to. Then I had an E46 330xi, which is a daily. Great daily. Then I had an E36 M3, then a Ferrari 355. And that's where I am now.

[Doug DeMuro]

Do you think eventually you'll experience a different chassis like an E60.

[Kenan]

No.

[Doug DeMuro]

F10.

[Kenan]

No, no, I'm over. No. I don't want that. I don't need that. That in my life. But I know I'm like there are other cars. I'm open to it. Just not right now.

[Doug DeMuro]

You want an E350 wagon?

[Kenan]

Absolutely not.

[Filippo]

Yours.

[Doug DeMuro]

They're still E3. I don't think these more than 39. So it gets better, right?

[Kenan]

Yours have been. I don't need yours been hit twice.

[Doug DeMuro]

Oh, Kenneth. I have better pay match. Just throw that out there.

[Filippo]

Oh, wow. Jesus. It's true, but wow. Okay, next question. We got the answer there. Canon's Only ever had E39 or E46 or E36 BMWs from the era of which he. And then the Ferrari and my Ferrari 330XI is a surprise. I always forget that Canon had a 330XI. Did you have the million spokes?

[Kenan]

No, no, no. It was the so good. No, I did not have those, unfortunately. And I think that was not on the all XI's.

[Filippo]

Yeah, there was only on the XI the million spokes.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah. Imagine cleaning that for Canon though. Dude.

[Filippo]

Let me tell you something. As a child who grew up in Colorado, BMW come out with all wheel drive. The E46 was a big deal. The E30ixs were really popular in Colorado, highly sought after. And we. I used to see them as even. Even. Now you go back to Denver, you see a few and then the XI. The E46 was a huge all wheel drive in a BMW. You can finally own a BMW in Colorado. Okay, next question from Shooks24. At some point I'd like to own a car for my birth year. My question to you is, what is the one car that you would consider owning from your birth year? I'm gonna. I wanna do this. I wanna do this. F40. F50 some BS. All right, nice.

[Doug DeMuro]

You showed him, right?

[Filippo]

Got him.

[Doug DeMuro]

Sounds right to me.

[Filippo]

What's. What is your. I assume yours is F50.

[Kenan]

Of course, if I could own anything.

[Filippo]

What is your.

[Doug DeMuro]

I. I don't know. Nothing. Comes to my fourth year, 1984.

[Filippo]

Type in 1994. Just type in 1994 and let's see what we can find for him.

[Kenan]

Off to that thunder.

[Filippo]

Honestly, 36AMG. That Voyager dude. Felipe, we got some good stuff.

[Doug DeMuro]

C4O a C4.

[Filippo]

You got a Mark IV. I forgot. Mark 4 is Mark 4.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah, yeah, that's.

[Filippo]

You got FDRX7 too.

[Doug DeMuro]

And R32.

[Kenan]

Let's go by lowest r33 price. Which is how he would sort it. There we go.

[Doug DeMuro]

So true.

[Kenan]

Boom.

[Doug DeMuro]

I remember when this car sold. Good car at the time.

[Filippo]

That may have done it.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yep. There we go.

[Kenan]

There you go. A 1994 Saab 900 SE Turbo with a five door.

[Doug DeMuro]

But it's fine.

[Filippo]

I told you it would beat an F40 and F50 and some BS and that's exactly where we ended up. Scroll down a little, see if we can find something a little bit more exciting. S City, Honda City. Oh, Saturn.

[Kenan]

Oh, yeah, Saturn.

[Doug DeMuro]

I love that.

[Kenan]

This one was nice. Nice.

[Doug DeMuro]

I remember.

[Filippo]

Kind of Filippo.

[Doug DeMuro]

Hey, Doug, didn't you review a Saturn sl?

[Filippo]

Yeah, yeah. In one day. All right, last question. Last question. Last question. This one is intended to rile up Kennan. This is how we're going to end. Question from Modali. Kenan, does it haunt you that you could have bought a CT5V Blackwing for the amount of money you spent on maintaining your M5?

[Doug DeMuro]

He asked.

[Kenan]

No, because it took me 10 years to do that. You forget that this amount of money is cumulative over the lifetime and 100,000 miles of use.

[Filippo]

Like how much money?

[Kenan]

The CT5V Blackwing didn't exist when I was in college. In the car. I bought the car. I needed a car.

[Filippo]

What did the car cost you to buy?

[Kenan]

I paid 10,800 a lot.

[Filippo]

What do you put into it?

[Kenan]

I think. I think all in, like, with the purchase price of the car, I think I'm at like 72 total.

[Filippo]

Okay, so you put 62 into it. 10 grand to buy, and then what do you think it's. What do we think it's worth?

[Doug DeMuro]

Probably with 30.

[Kenan]

We sold one that was really similar.

[Filippo]

But yours is like. It's yours. And it's really nice. Like, yours would sell for the most because of what you've. Like, how obsessed.

[Kenan]

Yes, but this one was really nice. This one was maintained very thoroughly. Same almost. I mean, I don't expect mine.

[Filippo]

I think yours, if this pulled 30, I think yours would probably pull a little more. When did. Oh, this was two years ago. I think yours would pull a little more. So you're in it for a 72, you said. Yeah, so. So 35, you would have lost 40.

[Kenan]

Yeah.

[Filippo]

For a hundred thousand miles.

[Kenan]

For a hundred thousand miles.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Kenan]

In one of my favorite cars. So I don't.

[Filippo]

100,000 miles.

[Doug DeMuro]

A lot of miles. Cost per mile is not bad. Now, it doesn't include, you know, gas or presumably regular maintenance, but I mean, no, that.

[Kenan]

I mean, that amount of money is everything. Regular maintenance, every light Bulb, every bolt, every like everything.

[Doug DeMuro]

Every car wash. Everything including the purchase.

[Kenan]

Well, the car that doesn't cost anything because I, I do that myself.

[Doug DeMuro]

Your time.

[Kenan]

Yeah, but that's.

[Filippo]

Enjoys it.

[Doug DeMuro]

That's true.

[Kenan]

It's a pleasure, actually.

[Filippo]

Canon has turned the script a little on the haters, hasn't he? Here.

[Kenan]

Well, I mean people love to come after you for that, but it's like, yeah, you've owned a high performance car for 10 years. I mean like that's well.

[Filippo]

And 100,000 miles. Really used.

[Kenan]

Yeah. And it still drives great and I still love it and so it sticks around. So. No, I do want to see T5V Blackwing, but it doesn't. It doesn't haunt me in the slightest.

[Filippo]

You know, I was thinking the other day I was filming a video in the parking lot with the Vistic.

[Doug DeMuro]

Sure.

[Filippo]

And I was thinking I could get a CT5V Black Wing. That's pretty cool.

[Kenan]

It's such a cool car.

[Doug DeMuro]

Yeah.

[Kenan]

That, that manual transmission is great. And the sound. And you get to experience range anxiety in a gasoline powered car in 2025.

[Filippo]

Such a special thing that still exists. And in 20 years we're still going to be talking about how cool it was.

[Kenan]

Absolutely. I really. It would be redundant to happen, but I hope to.

[Doug DeMuro]

Is it the Last main old V8 sedan? It is, right?

[Filippo]

Yes, it is.

[Doug DeMuro]

Wow.

[Filippo]

Can we zoom? Oh, no. Because it's got a thing. Look at this ad. So folks, Lexus LX450 and you know where you. You can't buy. Here's an ad for it. You can't buy it from Lexus anymore. You know where you buy it? Cars and bids.

[Doug DeMuro]

And you know where you make that diagram word.

[Filippo]

Anyway, thanks so much everybody.

[Doug DeMuro]

Been a pleasure.

[Kenan]

Oh my God.

[Filippo]

Best podcast we ever did. Filippo, any parting thoughts?

[Doug DeMuro]

Goodbye.

[Filippo]

Goodbye.

[Kenan]

Goodbye, everyone.