The Nissan Xterra Returns! Is it too Late? Ferrari Caught with Fake Engine EV Sounds! THIS CAR POD!

Summary

Podcast Summary: THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends!

Episode Title: The Nissan Xterra Returns! Is it too Late? Ferrari Caught with Fake Engine EV Sounds!
Release Date: January 10, 2025
Hosts: Doug DeMuro, Kenneth, Felipe

---

1. Major Los Angeles Fires and Impact on Luxury Cars

The episode opens with a discussion about the devastating fires sweeping through the Los Angeles area, particularly affecting affluent neighborhoods like Pacific Palisades and Malibu. The hosts emphasize the tragic loss of both human lives and valuable properties, including high-end car collections.

Notable Quote:

• Kenneth [00:28]: "This is a real thing. This is serious. It's a serious thing... a huge deal."

They highlight the vulnerability of luxury car owners, noting that many possess multi-million dollar vehicles that are irreplaceable. The conversation touches on how rapid fire spread can quickly turn wealthy neighborhoods into disaster zones, leading to significant property and automotive losses.

2. Nissan Z Sales Surge and the Decline of Sports Cars

The hosts analyze the surprising sales figures of the Nissan Z, which reportedly sold 3,164 units in 2024, outpacing the Toyota Supra's 2,600 units. Despite this growth, the overall sports car market is experiencing a downturn.

Notable Quotes:

• Felipe [06:33]: "The Nissan Z sold 3,164 units in 2024 which is up 500 units from the year prior."
• Kenneth [07:03]: "But the point is, you know, the Supra, you're right. This was a bunch of reused parts from the old Z."

They discuss how economic factors and changing consumer preferences are impacting sports car sales, suggesting that while dedicated enthusiasts continue to support models like the Nissan Z and Toyota Supra, the market at large is shifting away from traditional high-performance vehicles.

3. Honda's Concept Cars Debut at CES

Transitioning to automotive innovations, the hosts cover Honda's unveiling of two concept cars at the Consumer Electronics Show (CES): the Zero SUV and Zero Sedan. These concepts blend traditional automotive design with advanced AI and technology features.

Notable Quote:

• Kenneth [18:00]: "Honda came out with a couple of concept cars. One of them was this. They're both called the Zero. There's the Zero SUV and the Zero Sedan."

The discussion highlights the trend of automakers presenting new vehicles at technology-focused events like CES, reflecting a shift towards emphasizing technological advancements over traditional auto show unveilings.

4. Ferrari's EV Test Mule and Fake Engine Sounds

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to Ferrari's controversial move to incorporate fake engine sounds into their upcoming electric vehicles (EVs). The hosts express skepticism over Ferrari's ability to maintain the brand's legacy without authentic engine noise.

Notable Quotes:

• Doug [33:05]: "Ferrari Caught with Fake Engine EV Sounds!"
• Kenneth [35:08]: "But the point is still here and it's still clear. I. All I'm saying is I agree with everything."

They debate whether adding artificial sounds undermines the pure driving experience Ferrari is known for, questioning if this strategy will alienate long-time enthusiasts or attract a new customer base.

5. Repair Costs of Modern Cars with Advanced Sensors

Felipe shares a personal anecdote about his car being damaged by an uninsured driver, leading to exorbitant repair costs primarily due to advanced sensor systems. This highlights the growing financial burden of maintaining modern vehicles equipped with numerous electronic features.

Notable Quotes:

• Felipe [44:27]: "Guess how much that I've gotten a quote to repair."
• Kenneth [46:10]: "Imagine how much more expensive they're going to be repair."

The conversation underscores the challenges owners face with the increasing complexity of vehicle electronics, suggesting that repair expenses may become a significant concern as cars become more technologically advanced.

6. Market Report: BMW 1M Sale

The hosts present a market report highlighting the sale of a BMW 1M for $50,500 with 63,000 miles. They discuss the car's enduring value despite newer models like the M2 outperforming it in specifications.

Notable Quote:

• Kenneth [48:08]: "And the thing that's interesting to me about it is that it remains tremendously valuable despite the fact that the M2 has come out."

They argue that the BMW 1M's sustained value is a testament to the appeal of "special" vehicles, which retain collector interest and market value beyond mere performance metrics.

7. Listener Questions and Discussions

The episode concludes with a series of listener questions covering a range of topics:

• Resto Mod Cars: The hosts express enthusiasm for restoring and modifying classic cars with modern technology, viewing them as a harmonious blend of old aesthetics and new functionality.

  Kenneth [51:06]: "I love restomods. I think the concept of an old car on a new car."

• Car Giveaway Outcome: Michael from Colorado won a car giveaway, choosing the C6 over the expected M5, prompting the hosts to discuss the implications and next steps.

• LinkedIn Seagull Picture: Doug explains the story behind his seagull profile picture, linking it to his move to California and his automotive career.

• Suzuki X90 Review: Kenneth clarifies his selection criteria for reviewing cars, mentioning that the Suzuki X90 hasn't appeared on their platform yet, but he anticipates covering it in the future.

• House Renovation and Garage Tour: Doug humorously responds to a request for a garage tour, highlighting the typical content divergence between standard YouTuber tours and his own focus on automotive content.

• Tennis Players: A light-hearted discussion about the hosts' morning tennis games, reflecting their camaraderie and personal interests outside automotive topics.

• Monkey Noise in Videos: The hosts joke about bringing back unique sound effects from older videos, maintaining their signature style.

• Updating Doug's Score Chart: Kenneth affirms that the Doug Score is continuously updated to reflect the latest market and feature changes, ensuring its relevance.

• Porsche 997911 Value: The conversation delves into whether specific Porsche models, like the 997911, will appreciate in value. Kenneth expresses skepticism, noting that only limited, special editions might retain or gain value.

Notable Quotes:

• Kenneth [50:21]: "Special wins out over good."
• Doug [61:24]: "I would absolutely choose all Hoovies cars because they're."

---

Conclusion

This episode of "THIS CAR POD!" navigates through pressing automotive news, from catastrophic fires threatening luxury car collections to the evolving landscape of sports car sales. The hosts provide insightful commentary on industry trends, technological advancements, and the future of iconic brands like Ferrari. Additionally, engaging listener interactions offer a personal touch, reinforcing the community aspect of the podcast. Overall, the episode delivers a comprehensive and engaging exploration of contemporary issues and interests within the automotive world.

---

Notable Timestamped Quotes:

• Kenneth [00:28]: "This is a real thing. This is serious. It's a serious thing... a huge deal."
• Felipe [06:33]: "The Nissan Z sold 3,164 units in 2024 which is up 500 units from the year prior."
• Kenneth [07:03]: "But the point is, you know, the Supra, you're right. This was a bunch of reused parts from the old Z."
• Doug [33:05]: "Ferrari Caught with Fake Engine EV Sounds!"
• Kenneth [35:08]: "But the point is still here and it's still clear. I. All I'm saying is I agree with everything."
• Felipe [44:27]: "Guess how much that I've gotten a quote to repair."
• Kenneth [46:10]: "Imagine how much more expensive they're going to be repair."
• Kenneth [48:08]: "And the thing that's interesting to me about it is that it remains tremendously valuable despite the fact that the M2 has come out."
• Kenneth [51:06]: "I love restomods. I think the concept of an old car on a new car."
• Kenneth [50:21]: "Special wins out over good."
• Doug [61:24]: "I would absolutely choose all Hoovies cars because they're."

Transcript

[Felipe]

Foreign.

[Kenneth]

Welcome to this car pod.

[Doug]

I'm Kenneth.

[Felipe]

I'm Felipe.

[Kenneth]

And there's a lot to talk about. Let's do the news, starting with. We are recording this today. Today's Wednesday. It was up on Friday. There's a massive fire rolling through the Los Angeles area and people don't care about disasters unless it's happening in their area. So a lot of people are gonna be like, yeah, whatever, they're gonna skip this. This is serious. This is a serious thing. It's a huge deal.

[Felipe]

Also very tragic for people.

[Kenneth]

Like a real thing. Now. I appreciate, by the way, all the text messages I've gotten from friends in the east coast saying, I hope I'm safe. I am safe. We don't live in Los Angeles here. I've tried to make that point, but.

[Doug]

It'S just everybody, LA and San Diego are really close together. They are not.

[Kenneth]

They are not. They are not. But anyway, it's a really, really big deal. Obviously, it's a tragedy. From human life perspective. There are several fires going right now. The one in Pacific Palisades is a huge, huge, huge deal. I have friends up there. I filmed a ton of my videos in that area.

[Felipe]

Even if you're not from la, Pacific Palisades and Malibu are where you hear about, like the rich people with insane car collections. That's where a lot of them are.

[Kenneth]

From a human life perspective, this is a, this is a, you know, dangerous and sad situation. Incredibly, taking it to a car perspective as this is a car podcast, you know, the big story was this bulldozer moving cars out of the way. That was like a big thing that came out of this because it's quite a scene. It's quite a scene. They got video of it. It was safe to shoot while they were doing it. But the real story that's going to come out of this is the loss of property, both homes. People aren't understanding like, no, there are going to be multi, multi million dollar, very valuable special cars lost in this.

[Felipe]

Fire as of this morning. So this was early on because the fire is still about 0% contained. It's actually true of the three biggest fires. They're all about 0% contained. When we're filming this early this morning, the report was that there were 20,000 dwellings fully destroyed.

[Kenneth]

I.

[Felipe]

And those are expensive.

[Kenneth]

People don't understand, like, this is the wealthiest of the wealthy, the highest end of the high end stuff. One day in Malibu five years ago, I was walking down the street and a guy backed his end, was backing his Enzo out of his garage.

[Doug]

Yeah, that might be gone.

[Kenneth]

When fires like this happen, they spread so quickly. It's hard to know that where it's coming and if it's coming for you. And people in this area generally kind of take cover. But a lot of these areas are, I mean neighborhoods, these are like neighborhoods that aren't even really in next to canyons or forests or whatever.

[Doug]

And some of these houses, particularly the really valuable ones, like are not necessarily people's primary house. They might be somewhere else or they might. Or if you're at work and all of a sudden there's a fire, you can't necessarily get home because of this situation.

[Kenneth]

Right. Cars were blocking areas with all the traffic. Yeah, totally.

[Doug]

I mean, LA is known for its.

[Kenneth]

Traffic and especially some of these areas, there was kind of one road in, one road out sort of things, or narrow roads to get in and out. And people, you know, there's a ton of traffic, people are blocking. It's not possible. And it's not the first thing in your mind. I mean, for me, to be honest, it wouldn't be for me if there was a fire near me. I'm just going to say this right now because I always see whenever, whenever there's a hurricane and the videos show all the cars be like, why didn't they get them out? And it's like, you don't get it. Like hurricanes turn at the last second. It happens all the time. Damn it. You're in an area that has never been damaged before in 100 years, you think you're safe and then there's one hurricane that comes and damages it. These people, Pacific Palisades, never would have thought, I mean, These houses are 30, 40, 50 years old. These areas are not areas that are.

[Felipe]

Typically under inflight mile an hour winds.

[Kenneth]

Things move quickly, incredibly quickly. I literally wouldn't even be on my mind to try to get.

[Felipe]

No, you get, you get yourself out of your kids, family.

[Kenneth]

The cars are.

[Felipe]

You don't care about your house, you don't care about your cars. Those are all replaceable.

[Kenneth]

Right?

[Felipe]

It feels weird on this podcast. Then also say the next sentence, which is there are some cars that aren't really replaceable.

[Kenneth]

And I wonder, and I wonder the story that's going to come out about some of those. I have a suspicion that we're going to hear that some really, really irreplaceable cars have been destroyed, which is a.

[Doug]

Ferrari factory is going to start making some, some more cars.

[Kenneth]

You wonder about that. That's the thing that they have done in the past. Yes. And you. It is. And they've announced it. I mean there were some Enzos that, that were completely destroyed that they.

[Doug]

As long as you have the vin, like it kind of.

[Kenneth]

Or even if you don't, as long as you have the title, hopefully that.

[Doug]

Thing go up in flames too. Yeah, it is, it is a. Yeah. It will take a long time to tabulate exactly what the impact of this has been like from a financial perspective on the world. Like it's just the property value and then what will that property be valuable in the future? And from the cars perspective, like you said, some of that is just gone. Especially some of the really old stuff that. Because when we go to Malibu, cars and coffee, I mean, we saw real heavy metal and all those people live.

[Kenneth]

Around there and, and evacuations are. I mean, this fire I first heard about at 4:00 and by 10:00 there, I mean, there were many, many, many places gone. And you're thinking about where do I take my kids? How do I get out of here with my kids, my family, my documents, whatever. And it's crazy.

[Felipe]

The good news is that so far there have not been a lot of reports of fatalities.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, not many. As we're, as we're filming this, I've only heard of two and none in this fire. I imagine that will change.

[Felipe]

Like, who cares about the property? Whatever. Something.

[Kenneth]

It is interesting though. I agree. Who cares about the property? But it is interesting. This will be the, this will be the costliest fire ever. I haven't heard anybody say that, but I have zeroed out in my mind.

[Felipe]

When the homes burning down row after row through row are all $20 million.

[Kenneth]

So then you wonder, you know, do insurers pay out? Do. Do. Some insurers are probably going to not be able to pay out. Does the state have to backstop some of this? Do they rebuild in this area?

[Felipe]

What does that mean for the underwriting for some auto insurance?

[Kenneth]

What does it mean for Los Angeles in general? Like, do the. Does, does this city, does this city abandon Malibu?

[Felipe]

I mean, but it's not just Malibu anymore. Like the, the fire is at northern part of Santa Monica, Brentwood, there are. And because of the winds and how dry it is, there's also small fires breaking out further east, which is insane.

[Kenneth]

I mean, this could happen anywhere essentially. Now Hollywood Hills, any of those places are scary. Yes. Embers could then be blown into neighborhoods and start smaller fires there. Those are a lot easier to contain. Agreed. But like, damn, it's crazy. The whole situation is Absolutely wild. And I'm very interested, saddened by the whole thing. It is unbelievable to watch. I have a personal friend who lost his house, a very special house, very special cars. And I'm, I'm sure it's just, it's a sad situation I think for a lot of people.

[Felipe]

But anyway take a long time to recover from it.

[Kenneth]

Long time. If, if they ever do. Palisades is a cool area. It really is. I'm not a big LA guy, but that area is really cool. And, and I, I. It probably will never be the same.

[Doug]

Absolutely not.

[Kenneth]

Anyway, next news story back to more automotive related Nissan Z which is a car that no one has ever seen. So true.

[Doug]

That is.

[Felipe]

I saw one yesterday and there was a real thought in my mind. Does Doug have a Nissan Z press card this week? That's how rare it is that I see.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, they're not around which is odd because they the Z purportedly outsold the Supra this year reportedly to be clear.

[Felipe]

It is based on the sales numbers released by Toyota and by Nissan. This is true. The the Nissan Z sold 3164 units in 2024 which is by the way is up 500 units from. It's up notably from the year prior. And Toyota sold 2600 Supras.

[Kenneth]

Just to put that into perspective, I just did the calculation that is the number of Camrys they sell in five days.

[Felipe]

Yeah, they're not selling cars.

[Kenneth]

It's pretty wild. We have to at some point admit even as car enthusiasts it's pretty w these automakers have gone to the trouble to develop these cars. Now to Toyota's credit, Toyota stopped doing developing sports cars but they have partnered with other companies and they continue to make sports cars. And that's probably the only way forward for sports cars in the future.

[Felipe]

I mean Nissan used their 370Z chassis and backup camera and a lot of other things from it.

[Kenneth]

That's right.

[Felipe]

And like that's how they made it work.

[Kenneth]

But I'm glad the only way to make a successful and by successful I mean number of cameras they sold in five days.

[Felipe]

You know, I have bad news for you. How many cars you choose, you think they sold compared to Camrys 1270.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, but the point is, you know, the Supra, you're right. This was a bunch of reused parts from the old Z. This car is going Austria. Like at the end of the day sports cars are just not what at the high end they still are.

[Felipe]

By the way, one related piece of news, majority of Supra sold were manuals.

[Doug]

Of course the way it should be.

[Kenneth]

I mean I think I learned last week that when you had that. That data point that the remaining 29 manual cars, whatever it is, the majority of them are enthusiast cars. You will buy them at this, at this stage. The only, the only. I mean the sports car, of course the majority of supers are sold with manuals. That's the type of person. That's it. That's all there is anymore.

[Felipe]

Can I ask you the question? Okay. The Nissan Z in 2023 sold 1700 units. So they were up 79% year over year. How.

[Kenneth]

Yeah. What incentives surprising.

[Felipe]

Are there incentives on these?

[Kenneth]

Initially I heard there were production constraints. So they've obviously got cars out. They've also released the new NISMO model. Right. I'm reading here that it says that Porsche sold in the US this is. This is January to September of 24. They sold 11,911. So the 911 is radically more popular. I mean combine these two cars and then this is just the US that's in North America.

[Felipe]

But tracks.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, it does track. You see a lot more 9 11s but it's crazy. The 911 is like add these two together and you're still at double. Yeah.

[Doug]

Wow. That's wild. Never would have thought when the Z came out because I remember when the Z came out, never would have thought.

[Kenneth]

That what the new one, the new.

[Felipe]

He said in general 370.

[Doug]

Yeah, I remember like thinking back then, it's like that the Porsche 911, the CZ felt very common to see a 911 filled Uncarman. It turns out things have. The tides have changed.

[Kenneth]

I'm very curious about this. In 2003, which was the year the 350Z came out, which to me was like the revitalize. Like the peak revitalization of that car. They sold 36,000 Z's in the US and last year they. Last year car is brand new. This is probably the first full year it's been on sale. They managed to move 3100.

[Doug]

Wow.

[Kenneth]

You got to start saying sports cars are especially not. Not expensive sports cars where they're still desirable because it's cool like these cars. It's just nobody has the money for an impractical car unless they have a ton of money for an impractical car.

[Doug]

And then they're not considering these.

[Kenneth]

Right. They're buying an I love.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Felipe]

There were how interesting crazy what sold in 2024. There were 8000 miatas 8, 000 miatas.

[Kenneth]

That's still relatively healthy. But I mean, you know, but that.

[Felipe]

That, that's so little compared to what warfare? 350 z's and 1991.

[Kenneth]

Mazda sold 31,000 Miatas in the United States so they're not incredibly far off.

[Felipe]

But the market's cooled on this.

[Kenneth]

No. 1 Interesting. Well now that car's 10 years old, so to Mazda's credit they do still. They came out in 15 the ND they do still.

[Felipe]

Yeah, I'm not wrong, came out of 14.

[Kenneth]

But yeah, Mazda does still make the car and that's really cool. But like the, another way to, to justify making a sports car in this market segment is to just milk the hell out of the days of a four year, of a four year product cycle. Like NA was 90 to 90, what, 6, 97 and then the NB was 98 to 04. Like 5, 6 years they would do product cycles. Those days are gone. Yeah, the only way to make this happen is if you just milk every.

[Felipe]

Penny out of 2005. 20 I think 20. Sorry, I meant 20.

[Kenneth]

20.

[Felipe]

Sorry.

[Kenneth]

19. 20.

[Doug]

I think it was 19.

[Kenneth]

I went to the press launch in the spring of 19 so probably came.

[Felipe]

Out for the 20 mile year.

[Kenneth]

And that press lunch by the way was in West Virginia.

[Doug]

I remember the video.

[Kenneth]

Oh, it rained. Getting cozy is one of the best parts of the winter season. So it's good to buy nice clothes to enjoy the winter season as best you can. Whether you're out in the cold or enjoying a cool day in the top down in your sports car. Personally, I'm willing to do or buy whatever I can to stay cozy. For the ultimate cold weather necessities made from premium materials, you've got to check out quints. With quints you can treat yourself to true quality at an affordable price. For instance, there's something everyone needs in their closet. Quince's iconic Mongolian cashmere sweaters, which start at $50. Their super soft fleece sweatpants are a major upgrade to whatever you're lounging in right now. And their wind resistant responsible down jackets are perfect for keeping warm no matter what you're looking for. All Quint's Items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. And by partnering directly with top factories and cutting out the cost of the middleman, Quince passes the savings on to you. Plus, Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical and respons manufacturing practices. And they use premium fabrics and finishes for that luxury feel in every piece. Ken's wearing some quints right now. Kenan, tell us about your experience.

[Doug]

It's been wonderful. They have a variety of styles to pick from. I happened to pick this and I love the fitment, the quality and the prices truly were astonishingly low.

[Kenneth]

That's excellent. Luxuriate in coziness without the luxury price tag. Go to quince.com doug for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order. That's Q U I N C E Quince.comquot to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com Doug okay, give us the next two stories. Ah, yes, the Mustang.

[Felipe]

Yep, the Mustang Mach E. Okay. There was a new Mustang for 2024.

[Kenneth]

Brand new Mustang. I was behind one yesterday. Rare.

[Doug]

I saw one recently.

[Felipe]

The Mustang Mach E you're familiar with. It's a small electric crossover.

[Kenneth]

Yes.

[Felipe]

Which one do you think sold more?

[Kenneth]

I bet it's the Mach E. Wow. How did you ever guess? What were the numbers? All right.

[Felipe]

There were about 52,000 Mach es sold in 2024, which is the best year ever. The Mustang on the other hand, had the worst year it's ever had. What ever is the headline that Motor one went with. I have not independently verified that it's ever. But it's notably.

[Kenneth]

How many did they sell?

[Felipe]

They sold 44,000.

[Kenneth]

44,000. Which compared to the super and the Z is actually still pretty healthy. But the days of crazy Mustang sales.

[Felipe]

Do you want to guess what the second worst year was? It's not a retro.

[Kenneth]

Last year.

[Felipe]

Yeah, 2023 had a little bump. The second worst was 7022 when they.

[Kenneth]

Sold 47,000 in 2005 when the. That was when the new Mustang came out. The new retro looking 105.

[Felipe]

New one. Yeah.

[Kenneth]

No, no. In 05 that was.

[Felipe]

That was not the new Edge.

[Kenneth]

Sorry. Right, right. The new edge entered in 04.05. The new one came out and they sold 161,000 that year. And in 06, probably its first full year, they sold 167,000 Mustangs. Would you say 44?

[Felipe]

Yeah.

[Kenneth]

But add in the Mach E. How.

[Felipe]

Much was it with the Mach E?

[Kenneth]

They're still doing great with Mustangs.

[Doug]

That's exactly.

[Felipe]

It's. I'm. I'm actually. It's the new Mustang, I think we can all agree is a little bit of a disappointment from a sales standpoint. They're not. You expect the new generation to have a sales boost that has not really happened.

[Kenneth]

I also find it to be a bit of a Disappointment.

[Doug]

Yeah, it looks too similar to the S500.

[Kenneth]

I love the new Mustang but I have also loved the new Mustang for the last couple gens and I don't see a great benefit. If I'm in the market, I'm. I would buy a three year old. I'd buy a GT350. Honestly.

[Doug]

Yeah, yeah.

[Felipe]

The Mach E is a legitimately competitive EV and so it makes sense to me that those continue that the Mach E V keeps going up a little bit and the Mustang has maybe lost the amount.

[Kenneth]

Crazy though it lends credence to my trick that I. Whenever I see someone and they tell me that they have a Mustang, I say to them, oh, a Mach E. And if they see. If you do this to Mustang owners, they get very angry. But you're. No, it's a real Mustang. But now I'm going to be like, well, I don't know the right. The electric one's more popular. I didn't know. I'm sorry.

[Felipe]

I assume percent more things are shifting soon.

[Doug]

You have to start saying what a GT350 to the. I know it's Mach E actually.

[Kenneth]

They should do a mach e GT350.

[Doug]

That would be interesting.

[Felipe]

They were gonna do the Maki rally. The GT and the rally.

[Kenneth]

Aren't they gonna do that crazy off roady one?

[Felipe]

The rally is, I think the crazy.

[Kenneth]

I thought there was gonna be like a, like a one.

[Felipe]

There was talk of the Mustang brand expanding to an off roader.

[Kenneth]

There was not just talk. Ford confirmed that.

[Felipe]

Yeah, but there's gonna be, there's gonna.

[Kenneth]

Be an off road Mustang like a rally.

[Felipe]

Tesla confirmed the Roadster in 2016. You know, any day now.

[Kenneth]

Any day now. By the way, you know what I got a lot of flack for? I said that thing about the Mazda 6.

[Felipe]

That's why. Oh no, sorry.

[Kenneth]

I thought about flags. The Mazda 6. I don't believe anything an automaker says because the Mazda 6. I went to the launch and they said they'd have a diesel and everybody replied they did make a diesel in Europe. Okay, listen, it was a US press launch and they never made a diesel.

[Felipe]

In the US Committed to it heavily too.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, heavily. Now I will say I went to the Jeep Wrangler JL press launch in Tucson in 2018. By the way, that's an old car. And. And they committed. They said they would have a diesel and you know what they did. So did they recruit.

[Felipe]

They did have a hybrid.

[Kenneth]

Very.

[Felipe]

Available for lease seals.

[Kenneth]

They have a plug in hybrid as well. There was A diesel for a while, but it's gone, I think. I assume.

[Felipe]

I don't think there was ever.

[Kenneth]

Are there? There was. There was a jail diesel.

[Felipe]

Was there?

[Kenneth]

Yeah. Kenneth and I were big fans of it.

[Doug]

Oh, huge fan.

[Kenneth]

There's a diesel JL.

[Felipe]

Was it made by that Italian company.

[Kenneth]

3 liter Eco Diesel? No, you're thinking of people. Here's something nobody knows. Do you remember the Jeep Liberty and the Grand Cherokee had a diesel.

[Felipe]

I thought that the Wrangler one.

[Kenneth]

There was a Wrangler Eco Diesel for a little while. I recall that.

[Felipe]

But I thought it was made by an Italian brand.

[Kenneth]

I can't help you out. This is the kind of thing Europeans do. Yeah. Americans at baseline. Just assume that American companies make everything. And so Europeans. Whenever. I remember when I worked at Porsche and there was a plane crash, an Air France plane from South America crashed into the ocean and they had to go find the wreckage. And one of my German colleagues at Portia was like, you know, a German company is the one that helped them find the wreckage. And it's like it really is solving that. Only you're gonna die, don't you? You know, a Belgian company was responsible for making those paper clips, actually designing them in the first place.

[Felipe]

But it's also something that my mother would say. So I. I feel bad that I.

[Kenneth]

You know, all Filippos become their mother. Okay, move on to the next news story. We've hashed this out. Oh, yes. Okay. This cannot be a real image.

[Felipe]

It looks.

[Kenneth]

It looks flat. It was not an attractive car. All right, Honda. What? I don't.

[Felipe]

Yeah, yeah, you're right.

[Kenneth]

Honda came out at the Consumer Electronics show, which happens every year in Las.

[Felipe]

Vegas, better known as ces.

[Kenneth]

Well, we call it the Consumer Electronics Show.

[Felipe]

No human ever has.

[Kenneth]

Anyway, Honda came out with a couple of concept cars. One of them was this. They're both called the Zero. There's the Zero SUV and the Zero Sedan. I was just reading the press release. Saloon. I'm sorry. I was just reading the press release, trying to find data. There's no data. It's just like tech. It's about how there's AI and how the technology is Asimo, which is the name of their robot. And now it's the name of the technology and the cars. But there's no. It's this long and it's going to be sold in these numbers and it's got a, you know, hybrid. There's none of that. It's. No, no, it's just. It's just they debuted design and they said this is a car.

[Felipe]

And it's a combination of a Honda e and a Polestar 3.

[Kenneth]

It looks to me like a regular car wearing a backpack does that, but.

[Felipe]

Not like the Defender 130, which is a Defender wearing a backpack. It's different.

[Kenneth]

It's not a handsome automobile, this vehicle. It looks like what you'd expect a.

[Felipe]

Car, an electronic show to look like. And it is.

[Doug]

This is very astonishing. Spot alike here. Yeah.

[Kenneth]

Oh, my God. That's exactly what looks like. I take it all back. I love it now. No, I actually think I'm into all concept cars. Of course, they never, they never come out looking like this. Remember, my thing about the concept cars is when they, when they debut the concept, it looks flashy and cool and exciting. And then when it comes out, it's the accurate.

[Felipe]

This has really ample room between the tire and the wheel well. So maybe it's realistic.

[Kenneth]

We're off roading.

[Felipe]

I will say it's interesting that these cars are getting, if it ever comes to fruition, are getting revealed to ces. CES is the auto show.

[Kenneth]

The auto shows are dead.

[Felipe]

Dead shows are dead.

[Kenneth]

I mean, you got to wonder if the auto shows make another couple rounds, you know, because it's an annual.

[Felipe]

Because their local dealer wants to promote the new.

[Kenneth]

Well, true.

[Doug]

Touched on something there. It's like, I think. Yeah, that would be.

[Kenneth]

That's what it's for.

[Doug]

That's what it's for. Like, the dealers can't afford to do the displays. They used to.

[Kenneth]

The manufacturers used to. Yeah, it used to be that the, that the. In the. In the major markets, the big auto shows which were New York, L.A. detroit, Chicago, they. The automakers would come and obviously, yeah, Tokyo, Geneva, Frankfurt, sometimes Paris. Paris. The automakers would come and they would debut new cars there.

[Felipe]

So such an exciting day when like you could, like when like the new. The. The auto show presses were happening and you knew that all of the automotive blogs had all of the photos, all.

[Kenneth]

The photos of all the cars. It was so cool because. Because that was like it. Like, like every car was coming out that day. And it was kind of a. It was kind of a race to see, like, who would win the day.

[Felipe]

Right.

[Kenneth]

Like, who would be the story coming out of the auto show. And those days have changed. But apparently at ces there's enough interest in that physical show that people are debuting cars there Also, by the way.

[Felipe]

One downside of there not being auto shows, you lose track of what cars are out. For example, There's a VinFast VF9. It is a vehicle that is for sale.

[Kenneth]

I know. I got to send them an email and like. Because it looks weird. It looks, yeah.

[Felipe]

But nobody knows because you don't. If you're a smaller manufacturer, you don't get the press coverage. Like, if Jeep releases a new Wrangler, they get press coverage regardless. But the auto show's kind of helped even out some of that.

[Kenneth]

That's an interesting point. You really don't find out, like, what's on the road. Generally speaking, the first time I know a car is for sale is when I see it on the road or when they send me a press car. Sure.

[Felipe]

But like, for a long time it was when it was at the auto show in production form.

[Kenneth]

Right. It was like, okay, that car is.

[Felipe]

The car and driver did a piece on it. Johnny Lieberman, our friend. And that's how you knew how long.

[Doug]

But do you wonder how long.

[Felipe]

That's close.

[Doug]

You wonder how long CES stays a thing also like it used to be, you know, I mean, I. There are a number of events every year I'd wait for Apple to release their products and they used to have events where Steve Jobs would go and talk to people.

[Kenneth]

They don't do that.

[Felipe]

They still do.

[Doug]

Well, now they do it. It's all pre recorded and it's all virtual and like they just have something and you go and see it's not the same.

[Kenneth]

I didn't know that.

[Doug]

It used to be. So I do wonder if, like, technical. See the value in like the benefit though of seeing having small things for press people.

[Kenneth]

Like if you want the technology, you want to hold it in your hands like you want to see the Palm Pilot.

[Doug]

The big brands like Apple holding the Palm Pilot.

[Felipe]

Apple and some others have moved away from being part of it. And Mobile World Congress in Madrid, Barcelona, which is a big deal, but it's still a big deal for the other brands.

[Kenneth]

It is nonetheless interesting that the automakers see fit to do this at ces. That tells you the direction they're going. This is more of a technology play than an automotive play.

[Felipe]

Never thought I'd be able to talk about the Mobile World Congress at.

[Kenneth]

Move on to the next story.

[Felipe]

Also, this was at CS last year, if memory serves.

[Kenneth]

Memory doesn't.

[Felipe]

Yeah, this is the Sony affiliate.

[Kenneth]

It's the Sony Affila. So it's the word feel and an A on the front and an A on the back.

[Doug]

I feel you.

[Kenneth]

Oh, that's nice. Sony, I feel you.

[Felipe]

It is made in partnership with Honda, so it is Actually made by Sony, Honda Mobility.

[Kenneth]

Okay.

[Felipe]

It will be available in the U.S. it is. They. They are pretending this is a car that's for sale in California.

[Kenneth]

Only Sony is making a car.

[Felipe]

Yeah, that's. But with, with Honda.

[Kenneth]

So is it going to be branded as a Honda or Sony?

[Felipe]

I think it's going to be branded as a fellow.

[Kenneth]

The brand on the front was a filo.

[Felipe]

It's a Fela one.

[Kenneth]

So this is like how TVs used to have like.

[Felipe]

Yeah.

[Kenneth]

Brands that weren't. Okay.

[Felipe]

Can I, can I tell you what is on their website as the main things.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Felipe]

The tagline is where mobility meets intelligence. They say that it starts from $90,000.

[Doug]

Which is dramatically over this 90,000American, by the way.

[Felipe]

It only has 300 miles of range and only has 400 something horsepower.

[Kenneth]

So this is like lucid air stuff.

[Felipe]

But way more expensive, worse ugly and.

[Kenneth]

Uglier and slower for those who can't see.

[Doug]

It has a bunch of sensors that are on the roof. That looks awful.

[Felipe]

I'm glad you noticed this.

[Kenneth]

That's the future.

[Felipe]

Because it says above the fold, they're starting from 89.9 ep, estimated range up to 300 miles. And then the one in between is sensors. 40 units.

[Kenneth]

40 sensors.

[Felipe]

I will say 40 units.

[Kenneth]

I will say. When I, When I was reviewing those Chinese cars, maybe I told you this on the pod, but when I was reviewing those Chinese cars and they gave me a spec list, like horsepower price was all on it. But then like the eighth thing on the list was like number of sensors, number of radars, number of. And it was like, this is a thing that we're gonna. How many sensors you got? I got, I got. You know how people brag about the number of speakers their car has or like the tire size? I mean, sensors.

[Doug]

This is not necessarily new. I remember Top Gear mentioning something that many years ago, they couldn't find the horsepower figure, but they could see like what Bluetooth features it had. I mean, people used to brag about the 7 series had more. The E38 had more computers on it than sent the man to the moon. So maybe the people, maybe people brag about this. I mean, otherwise, maybe it's because it's an exceptionally boring car. There's nothing else that's interesting about it.

[Felipe]

But there's nothing else interesting about it. It's dramatically overpriced for the market. What's interesting is why are they even selling it in the U.S. well, let me. California only, by the way, because they don't have dealers they have, they will have like just like lucid. Honestly has. Or let me have like center the malls.

[Kenneth]

I'm going to teach you something. Philippe. Yeah, please. I reviewed a Xiaomi SU7, I recall.

[Felipe]

I mean it was here in the office.

[Kenneth]

It was great. It was blue. It was. And greenish blue. And the thing about show me is that yesterday they were making phones. No cars. And today they're making cars and phones. Right. So why are they making this? Because it's time to branch out, dude.

[Felipe]

I don't know what they're making. It sound like Sony's been.

[Kenneth]

I'm going to make, I'm going to make a prediction here. I'm going to make a prediction. The automotive industry has been fenced in by regulation.

[Felipe]

True.

[Kenneth]

For an enormous amount of time. Two big regulations, especially in North America. Dealer networks. Yep. EPA engine compliance. Neither of those things are here, especially.

[Felipe]

If you're willing to sell just in some states.

[Kenneth]

So the dealer network thing is gone.

[Felipe]

And Sony apparently are.

[Kenneth]

The dealer network thing is gone because. Yes. A lot of states have allowed the automakers to just sell directly. Yep. The regulation thing is gone because EVs don't have to meet emissions. So your only requirement is, is safety. And that's not all that hard.

[Felipe]

And a lot of that is like very formulaic. Are your headlights big enough?

[Kenneth]

Me and Kenan can make a, we could meet safety requirements like we can with a couple of cold.

[Felipe]

It is a sheet metal and mentally. Yeah.

[Kenneth]

And so my prediction is that we're going to see an explosion of new automakers.

[Felipe]

Kind of cool.

[Kenneth]

And I'm making this prediction slightly late because Tesla is one of the new automakers and it's already been around for 15 years. So it's, you could say that I'm not really at the forefront of the times with this prediction, but I'm looking at the Chines market and I'm seeing all these new cars by companies that like didn't exist yesterday and now they make a 5,000 horsepower sedan that jumps. Which by the way should have been one of the new stories.

[Doug]

You see that we're going to get into it later.

[Kenneth]

Okay.

[Felipe]

I, I, it is also interesting, like I wonder if it's a way for somebody like Honda who has partnered with Sony on this to. They don't really have their own EV tech. There's a way for them to maybe experiment a little bit with a brand that it's not tied to Honda explicitly. It's not branded as a Honda. They can do some weirder things.

[Doug]

Things.

[Kenneth]

Right.

[Felipe]

Like a Odd looking car that's massively overpriced.

[Kenneth]

But this, maybe this is the future. Why, why don't the electronic companies come into this? They already making batteries, they're already making, they're already making screens. At this point it's not that much different. The only thing people care about now with cars, batteries and screens.

[Doug]

But here's the thing. It's like, okay, so let's say that there's this huge explosion of brands. Like there wasn't the 1920s. Like yeah, yes, they, well, yes, there were so many that existed and then they all disappeared eventually they. Because they were just. How then do you begin to differentiate between these cars of like is, do you, is it you're bragging about screens and sensors or is it like they all just become the same?

[Kenneth]

I'll tell you that the jumping thing was interesting because the way to differentiate is going to be this is fun.

[Doug]

This is interesting.

[Kenneth]

People have been asking me for a long time, are you worried when cars become electric that no, you know, no one's going to care about your videos anymore because they'll all be about the same. I totally think it's the opposite. I think in order to distinguish electric cars from themselves, automakers are going to have to come up with weird stuff. Electric cars are going to have to have gimmicks.

[Felipe]

Going viral is how you'll sell cars.

[Kenneth]

We can call it quirks and features if you will. But I mean that we had the MG Cyberster in the office with its, with its like butterfly doors and tail.

[Felipe]

Lights that are crazy.

[Kenneth]

I mean in order to differentiate an electric car, you have to do stuff like that. We already saw that Yangwang SUV that floats. And now released in the last couple of days is this video about this Yangwang sports car that can literally jump off. There's not a person in the world who thinks this is a real video, this car cannot jump. But the point of it is, is that electric cars, in order, they're all the same, they drive the same. They, in order to distinguish themselves, stuff like this is going to have to start happening. It's an interesting thing.

[Felipe]

The big question becomes about discovery. Like you choose to buy a, an Accord or a Camry because you know that's at the dealer, you know they have a good reputation. If all these upstart brands, you don't know how Sony's reliability is, you don't.

[Kenneth]

And I will say every time one fails like Fisker, I think it reflects poorly on all of them. It does. I think everybody who would have considered A Fisker is like, oh, maybe I won't get a Rivian now, maybe I won't get a lucid now because I'm anxious that that brand might also fail. But I think that this could be the future of, of brands. Why wouldn't it be?

[Felipe]

It's really interesting. It's like from a car market standpoint, you see, you're seeing consolidation, Nissan, Honda merging. And then you also are seeing like weird new upstart brands and innovation for companies that have money, like Sony is also creating or Yang Wing, which we don't know anything about is create. Like, it's interesting. You're seeing consolidation in traditional spaces.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Felipe]

A lot of new brands.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Felipe]

But discovery does really become the question, like, how do you choose to find out about Yang Wing?

[Kenneth]

Right. Because Ying Wing is a BYD brand. I didn't know that, but yes, but.

[Felipe]

Build your dreams, Doug. Build your dreams.

[Kenneth]

Build your dreams. But anyway, the point is. The point is these electric cars are coming. There's nothing. There's fewer barriers to entry they ever were. When I was a kid and when my dad was a kid, it was always said that the big three would be X. And given the regulatory environment at the time, that was true. Things have changed. And you're going to see the Sonys and if they come out with this Afila, which is heinous and overpriced, that's how it's going to be. But like cars, more cars are coming. The Faraday futures, the Rivians, the Fiskers. You mark my words, you're going to be driving around at a Bebo. I do want to flubelbah.

[Felipe]

I do wonder who will enter the space not at the 100k sedan spot because that's a weird spot to enter the market. Well, when will there be a 25k?

[Kenneth]

2525 is hard to imagine. Although those Chinese cars are affordable in.

[Felipe]

Europe, the cheap side of the market is a lot of those cars.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, I agree. And I was surprised in those Chinese cars, what they cost, how relatively affordable they are these days. EVs in America have been seen as largely a luxury purchase. But that will not stay the same forever. Not everybody has entered in this price point, though Rivian did come with an SUV in a truck. Let's be real, guys, wearing nice pants sucks. Everybody knows I'm a shorts guy, but sometimes pants are unavoidable. But who decided that stiff, uncomfortable fabric squeezing your legs was the key to looking sharp this year? Make the switch to public, where comfort rules. Public Rec's daymaker pants are here to make sure you stay comfortable. They feel like your favorite sweats, but they look like tailored pants. Yep. Super stretchy with an elastic waistband so you can rock them anywhere. Whether you're hanging out with friends or working on a car or driving something with a very tight sports seat or just walking the dog. These pants have you covered. Filippo is even wearing them now. How do they feel?

[Felipe]

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[Kenneth]

That's great. Make your New Year's resolution a comfortable one. No more pants that pinch, tug or annoy. For a limited time, you can get 20% off at public rec by using the code cars at checkout. Just head to public rec.com use the code CARS and you're all set. Oh, and when they ask how you found them, be sure to mention our show. It really helps us out. Find your perfect fit and never compromise on comfort again. Public rec where comfort rules. Okay, give us the next news story here. Do we still have news? Oh, Nissan Xterra. We gotta get through news very quickly. Nissan Xterra. Nissan is retradmarked. The Xterra name. I've been saying for 20 years that Nissan screwed this up getting rid of the Xterra. You're right and I was right. And finally someone at Nissan has decided to listen. They're way too late. This is how you know a recession is imminent when Nissan finally jumps back into the off road game. Oh, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna sit this one out and wait and see. They set out for 15 years.

[Felipe]

They are in the off road game. Have you heard of the Pathfinder Rock Creek?

[Kenneth]

Pathfinder, Rock Creek. And the Frontier Pro 4X? Nobody has anybody gives any credit to these cars.

[Doug]

An optimistic podcast. We start with a dystopian fire. Then we talk about how sports cars are dead. Then we how evil. But at least we got the Xterra.

[Kenneth]

The Xterra coming back would be great, but I don't have high hopes. It's hard for me to believe that Nissan. What are they going to do? Do the truck. I mean, I guess it could be good, but they're 10 years late. 4Runner's been eating their lunch forever. Deservedly so. And now Nissan's out of money. What a surprise. Nissan cancels its car two days before the off road genre takes off and then won't go back into it. It's just Nissan is bad decision after bad decision after bad decision. And me, a casual observer idiot, is sitting here thinking, I would have done this so much better. And everybody's like Carlos Ghosn is a genius. And I'm like, just because he fit into that tuba case?

[Doug]

Well, I will say it's pretty hard.

[Felipe]

The good news for Nissan is that their Nissan Z sales are up 79 year over year.

[Kenneth]

And they do this Z, they sit out the off road SUV market. How many foreigners 4 runners to try to sell last year, 4 billion. All of which went for the waiting for sale for literally 14 came out in 12. But coincidentally the year that Nissan canceled the Xterra and yeah it was. It's been going for on and on and on for years and years and years. They're still selling hundreds of millions of them. And Nissan's like, we see all these SUV sales, we see the off roader genre, we see the popularity. We're going to do a sports car just complete disaster company okay, there's a.

[Felipe]

Short for a producer.

[Doug]

Finally talking about something Italian cruise. So this is my story. No, this is not a Chevy Cruze. This is allegedly. You know, I'll tell you what it doesn't look like. It doesn't look like a Ferrari. However, this was spotted around Maranello. Driving around. This is supposedly Ferrari's test mule for what will be their upcoming EV. Now their, their CEO Benedict Ovinia said that EVs won't be silent and this car is heard around making noises of some kind. And again it's, it's a four door hatchback looking car.

[Kenneth]

I saw the video. This looks like a Prius come to life.

[Doug]

Looks like hopefully a Maserati and hopefully not a.

[Kenneth]

You know what? You should look up, you know what? It looks just like look up the Maserati kubang.

[Doug]

Oh, I remember that.

[Kenneth]

You remember that?

[Doug]

Yes. Which the Q bang. Is the sound that makes when the warranty runs out.

[Kenneth]

This was an SUV concept Maserati had like way before they came out with the Levante. Like K U B A N G.

[Doug]

K U B K U B.

[Felipe]

As you said, bang.

[Kenneth]

Google that. That this was a Maserati SUV concept. Honestly, the thing that, the Ferrari thing that was driving around Maranello kind of looks like that.

[Felipe]

Just the grecale or the, the normal one. The earlier concept is one we want. This is, that's what, this is it.

[Kenneth]

This is it. They're talking about the Levante. No, that just looks like the Levante Flippo.

[Doug]

Go back to bed.

[Kenneth]

I agree. It looks more like that than I thought. Maybe the Levante was bigger and wider in SUV or this.

[Doug]

Maybe they did use one of Those to hide all the technology.

[Kenneth]

But now Ferrari is not above using mules that have no bearing on pull up the 348 Enzo. You know about this? No, this is the all time coolest thing. Sean, you know about this?

[Doug]

Oh, this is great. So this is the all the coolest.

[Kenneth]

Thing that's ever happened. This was a. The Enzo test mule. They took the 348 and it was just.

[Doug]

And a 350 long kind of. And like they just slapped it together and they put there it is clearly the Enzo V12.

[Kenneth]

Did they sell this in the end? I thought one of those.

[Doug]

I think they made three and they did sell one, I believe.

[Kenneth]

So they drove this around Marinella, around Modena and they were like, oh yeah, we got a 348.

[Doug]

Just a 348.

[Kenneth]

But everybody knew they were working on a new supercar. But by putting it in a 348, you couldn't.

[Felipe]

Honestly, it doesn't look bad.

[Kenneth]

It's pretty cool. No, I know it doesn't look bad. It doesn't look bad.

[Doug]

Yeah, but this one, not as exciting as that one.

[Felipe]

Can you describe the sounds? Like Doug famously uses monkey sounds in his videos.

[Doug]

Yeah, it wasn't that. The sound was no. Yeah. Or did a long time ago. But yeah, it was. It wasn't that. It was kind of. I mean it was an EV engine sort of sound.

[Kenneth]

My only comment on this news story is we really should buy Ferraris now. I'm looking at Porsche, I'm looking at Ferrari. I'm seeing these companies. The future is bleak and we should buy used Ferraris now because I see what's going to happen in the market. Just like, just like the market for those 2000s cars blew up when that all ended. I know this is a, this is a Ford Fusion. I mean I'm not trying like it's just this isn't a Ferrari. And if Ferrari wants to get into the SUV game and the four door hatchback game, that's, that's fine. They probably make more money in some more cars. But like there is a market of people for whom Ferrari will always be gated. Na big engine, beautiful Pin and Farina designed, you know, Nicholas Cage era stuff.

[Doug]

Yes, there was the Enzo era, then.

[Kenneth]

There was Nicolas Cage there.

[Doug]

Yes. Some of us say the look of the Montezuma era. Yeah, okay, but you've got a great point. And that was the first thing I thought when I saw this is enough. I've read some reports that their EV may come by the end of 2025. For the 26 model year from Ferrari. I mean if they are. If, if it, if this is the point and this is what it's going to look like, it's terrifying. Again a fact that there's. I accepted one four door Ferrari with the Pure Song already.

[Kenneth]

I.

[Doug]

Let's be.

[Kenneth]

I like the Pure song for the public company. I mean they got it. They got it. They got to sell cars and make money.

[Felipe]

Do the.

[Doug]

But sure. But do the customers who buy their cars, who prop up the company want.

[Kenneth]

I would argue that Ferrari would make the same argument that BMW made 20 years ago which is we need to find new customers and we don't. Yeah, we've. We're going to lose the manual transmission, rear wheel drive people. But like BMW has eight SUVs right. Seven good ones and then the XM and, and at the end of the day like they needed to go and they needed to ditch the ultimate driving machine and go find.

[Doug]

But that's BMW a company that builds normal cars. This is Ferrari a company build sports cars.

[Kenneth]

I would argue when I was a kid BMW was known for building sporty cars.

[Doug]

Well, sport e these are sports cars.

[Kenneth]

But what. But they made the transition is my point. It's. I'm not saying they're making the same I I'm saying they were sporty cars and now they're primarily a crossover brand. Ferrari was sports cars and they. It's a public company. They want to increase. They want to increase sales. That that means taking the brand and bastardizing it. And I hate to say it but we have found out. We have found out with AMG and with BMW M and frankly with Maserati that you can mess with historic heritage brands and it have it not really hurt you all that much. AMG people made fun of me for the my Maybach take that. I think they should do a Maybach line of Mercedes cars. But. But they. And they're like well that would, that would water down the brand. Well no, I don't know. They did it with amg. It didn't water down anything.

[Doug]

It wasn't a historical. They were a brand that made cars for 70 years.

[Kenneth]

You're missing my point.

[Doug]

I'm getting your point.

[Kenneth]

But my point is you can mess with these brands sense and still be okay. And as long as Ferrari keeps coming out with the SP3s and the SP4 and 5 and whatever the future ones are, they probably have. They probably have cover to get away with dumb stuff like this portion the kind portion the kite if you're ready.

[Doug]

If you talk about a Ferrari that is going to depreciate like a stone.

[Felipe]

You think that I want to be clear.

[Kenneth]

They don't care.

[Felipe]

We don't know that. This might just be a mule for the sounds because they needed an EV to do it with, so they used an exit.

[Kenneth]

But the point, the point is still here and it's still clear. I. All I'm saying is I agree with everything. And then this is why I think we should all go buy old Ferraris. But like Porsche, the macan. Dude, I drive the courage. I get up next to a macan. Do you know how often they look over or give me a thumbs up? It has never occurred. I have never been next to a Macan. Two. Two years, 44 miles on that car. I have never been next to a.

[Felipe]

Lot of macans all the time.

[Kenneth]

I mean, at least one every time I drive the car. And they have never once given me a thumbs up or looked or taken a picture, anything like that. But I think it's gonna, it's a, it's gonna be a different.

[Doug]

But I could see Ferrari having, you know, offered another car in terms of like the pro song. I don't. They don't bother me at all. Like that True. Doesn't bother me. It's that they're going to offer this type of car with an EV and lose the engine, which is the whole point of a Ferrari. But they engine the way it looks. That's all a Ferrari has.

[Felipe]

I'm not done.

[Doug]

All Ferrari has to do is look good and sound good. And this car does. I'm not done. This car does neither.

[Kenneth]

I would argue that in today's world, all a Ferrari has to do is make money and make more money. And I, by the way, obviously I agree with you. I'm sitting here looking at 550 Marinellas thinking, but, but the new era of Ferrari is different than the era of Ferrari that we know and love. This. This is Ferrari. Now.

[Doug]

Maybe, maybe I think we. I, I still want to see how Parisian way sells. I mean the V12 one is very appealing pretty well. But I think people are buying the V12 one because it's the V12 one and they know.

[Kenneth]

I think people are buying it because it's a Ferrari suv. And I think at some point you're gonna have to admit to yourself that today's Ferrari customers, much like BMW's customers when they expanded their lineup to seven good SUVs.

[Felipe]

In the XL, they have nine.

[Kenneth]

They have nine SUVs.

[Felipe]

I forgot about the IX.

[Kenneth]

Oh, I love the ix greatly still that, that the buyer is changing. The person who's buying these cars is simply changing. It's going to be. It's people who want the brand. It's people who want to show off. And Ferrari is more than happy to make a lot of cars at high profit margins that cater to.

[Felipe]

Can't you imagine somebody who lives in London, you can only drive an EV in the center. They want, they have their other Ferraris, but they want to have one for driving around town. Maybe that's what's coming to mind.

[Kenneth]

But really though, I wouldn't be that defeatist about it. This is the future, my man. This is it. This is it. This is the, this is the end of. These brands are changing as. As we know them.

[Doug]

I'm just gonna stay in the past. More exciting there.

[Kenneth]

No, it is. And I think, honestly, I think that anybody who stays in the past will be richly rewarded financially. I think that, that as the new Ferrari comes out and the brand still remains hot and exciting and all the athletes have them and all the celebrities have them, people are going to look for the past and say, oh, the Countaches, The Miuras, the 550s, all these brands, right? It's true of all of them. Lamborghini, Ferrari, Porsche as well. Because now the GT3RS has a giant wing and nobody cares how it drives. But the historical people are now talking, okay, the rare stuff, the old stuff, the heritage, the history.

[Doug]

Yeah, I guess as a kid I never thought I would ever turn my back on my favorite brand, which is Ferrari. Everybody thinks it's BMW. It's not Ferrari.

[Kenneth]

You don't have to turn your back on.

[Doug]

I think I am. Well, I think I am going to. If they just build cars that are completely unappealing, which in my opinion, opinion it is. It's not appealing to me. It's appealing to the people and their shareholders.

[Kenneth]

I will say I think they're going to continue. They have. Their brand is very valuable to them and very important. I think they will continue making very special cars that you love, like the SP3 and like the, like the 812, things like that, or the 12 cylindry as I call it. I, I think that they will still keep making those cars, but the future of the Ferrari brand is clear year. And all these brands, they, they want to make money. Look what the earth did. Every have every, every other Lamborghini, now they sell it.

[Doug]

Now if I would, it used to be, I would say I would be more okay with this if it meant that the Reformul1 team could do better because they have more money to pump in it. But guess what? They don't. They joke and you know the formula, the F1 cost cap. They can't do it. I will say the last point on this. Italians really known for their expertise in electronics. I'm sure it'll be a very reliable car, especially from a very reliable brand like Ferrari.

[Kenneth]

Okay, we've gone way too far into the news. We have. Way too far. It threw everything very else very quickly. But starting with, let's talk about the slk. Is it live right now?

[Felipe]

The SLK is live.

[Kenneth]

Pull up. There's an SLK on the site right now that needs to be discussed.

[Felipe]

It really does.

[Kenneth]

You're thinking to yourself, whoa, because this one doesn't look like an slk. It has the body of a Volkswagen Carmen Ghia. Yep. Somebody. Where is it located? Some sort of cold state. Somebody somewhere. It's in Texas.

[Doug]

Texas.

[Kenneth]

Somebody in Texas was like, right now.

[Felipe]

It'S a cold state. You're good.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, yeah. The trees are. Leaves are off the trees. Somebody's like, hey, here's an idea. And so the idea was to put a karman gia body on an SLK and. And old wheels from an old SL.

[Felipe]

And it kind of Mercedes.

[Doug]

It has a hint of 190, like about like. Or the like the like 300 SL era 190.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Doug]

It has like some.

[Kenneth]

I hate to say it, it looks.

[Doug]

Pretty good now then. Then you get to the interior and as well.

[Felipe]

Isn't that what you want?

[Kenneth]

That is what you want. You want. This is the thing. Everybody's always wants a vintage car. Everybody thinks they want a vintage car.

[Felipe]

Car.

[Kenneth]

They don't want a vintage car. They want a modern car. They want the look of a vintage car. This is that. This is cool.

[Felipe]

And it really is quite cool.

[Doug]

It is.

[Felipe]

What a fascinating.

[Doug]

Bizarre.

[Kenneth]

Absolutely fascinating. It honestly looks pretty darn good. I. If I saw it on the street, I'd be like, huh, yeah, it looks. It has a bit of the 190, original 190sl look to it, but just a coupe version. And honestly with a little more flair.

[Doug]

It's a cool looking car.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Yeah, I'm into it.

[Kenneth]

I'm into it too.

[Doug]

This is absolutely a thing. I always hope that we get submitted on the site because it's just bizarre. It's just so cool.

[Kenneth]

I featured it. I love it.

[Doug]

It deserved to be.

[Kenneth]

Okay, Filippo, give us your update.

[Felipe]

Yeah.

[Kenneth]

All right.

[Felipe]

Unfortunately, we eventually alluded to this last Week. But somebody hit our station. Right. Somebody hit your car parked in front of our house. Because, you know, my wife was home and somebody in a plumbing truck hit it. They owned up to it, although they were not insured. So that's interesting. Guess how much that I've gotten a quote to repair.

[Kenneth]

Yeah.

[Felipe]

Guess how much it will cost.

[Kenneth]

$7,000. Okay.

[Felipe]

Well I told you this. Yeah.

[Kenneth]

Did the. Does the wheel part.

[Doug]

Yeah. Is the wheel part of it is clearly damaged?

[Felipe]

No, it's damaged.

[Kenneth]

But Filippo did that earlier module full out of. Yes.

[Felipe]

That module, which is the blind spot sensor fully fell out. That module alone with programming is 1500.

[Doug]

Oh God.

[Kenneth]

You're doing tail light, you're doing bumper. This panel need to be replaced, I assume.

[Felipe]

Thankfully it doesn't need to be replaced.

[Kenneth]

Because that would be impossible. Because replacing it is the one that goes all the way over. Yeah.

[Felipe]

But it doesn't be pulled out. It all needs to be repainted. Yeah. This car is worth the 15 to $20,000, man. 15. So we're.

[Kenneth]

We're at.

[Felipe]

No, no, that is the right number.

[Kenneth]

Not worth 15 to 20 after this.

[Felipe]

Oh, and a small accident where the. Their truck, which is like a contract like it's like a. A work truck has like some scuffs on the side that. That low speed impact. Seven grand.

[Kenneth]

Seven grand.

[Felipe]

So newer cars. This is a ten year old car. But newer cars are so expensive.

[Kenneth]

This car was in an accident what 18 months ago.

[Felipe]

A year, A year and a month prior.

[Kenneth]

So 13 months ago it was hit. Today it was hit or last week.

[Felipe]

And that one was like nine grand. Because the headlights are really expensive.

[Kenneth]

A lot of money has gone into this car.

[Felipe]

Well, I mean it was a tough.

[Doug]

2,000 USA has to say. So it was $7,000 to repair. It's like. And mostly due to the tail. The module.

[Felipe]

The tail light isn't that expensive, but everything. Yeah, the module and program.

[Kenneth]

Module. There's probably other electronics under there. Full model.

[Felipe]

I wouldn't be shocked. It goes up.

[Doug]

The point I want to make with that is like if. If it does. If the future is that all cars we brag about their sensors and stuff. Imagine how much more expensive they're going to be repair. This is a car from a long time ago. That is crazy.

[Kenneth]

Although they won't have engines. You know I was the other day, someday people are going to be like. And there were little explosions inside the under in the car. And that's how the car moved. People are going to be like, what are you. What are you Talking just like how we think about. There are horses. Like people have horses in 100 years, people would be like combustion. There was a combustion.

[Felipe]

And that power on fire.

[Kenneth]

Like there was fire in the car. Weren't cars catching on fire all the time? People are going to be astonished.

[Felipe]

Yes, but only until like the 90s then we saw.

[Doug]

I mean, I think we're multiple generations removed from having. But it will.

[Kenneth]

No, no, it's multiple. There's going to be.

[Felipe]

Not for the average.

[Doug]

Okay. People born today will experience gasoline power.

[Kenneth]

Okay, well that's 20 years.

[Felipe]

Fine, fine. You know what I'm saying?

[Doug]

You know how time works.

[Felipe]

One full generation. Full generation.

[Doug]

You're right.

[Felipe]

There was something I was going to say about this. Oh. One of our co workers who used to be an insurance adjuster told me a story about how when the Audi Q5 and Q7 started doing like blind spot monitoring, it was in the mirror. So if. And so when somebody like hit your mirror, which happens, you have to replace it and then you have to do a full alignment for that technology to work. So anytime somebody hit your mirror and you have to replace it was many thousands of dollars because of those sensors. They've gotten better. Right. Like that's like a simply replaceable part. Yikes. But it's yikes indeed.

[Kenneth]

Okay, we gotta go on to the market report, as always.

[Felipe]

If, by the way, you want to buy a heavily damaged Mercedes, I don't have to fix it, let me know.

[Kenneth]

The market report is, as always, brought to us by the Cars and Bids app, which is located on your smartphone phone. If you have an Apple device, if you have an Apple device and if you've downloaded the app, you have to have done both and you should. I only want to talk about one market report car, which is the BMW 1M. Then we'll move on to questions. We sold the 1M the other day for 50,500 and it had miles. What was the miles? It had 63,000 miles. And it had been used.

[Felipe]

Some mods.

[Kenneth]

And it had some mods. And one of the things that I'm interested in with this car is that it remains tremendously valuable.

[Felipe]

It does.

[Kenneth]

And the thing that's interesting to me about it is that it remains tremendously valuable despite the fact that the M2 has come out. And it's obviously better, it's more powerful, it's more fun, it's, you know, throw it around. And there's an M2Cs and there's an M2 competition. And those cars are excellent. They're Better in every way. But this is. This car is an interesting proof of special wins at the end of the day.

[Felipe]

Yep.

[Kenneth]

Special wins out over.

[Doug]

So I'm actually going. I'm flying to Arizona to review one tomorrow that has about 2,500 miles on a really, really special car. But one of the. Yes special wins. I mean there just aren't that many rare modern production BMW. And like from a collector perspective it's like this is a wonderful car to drive. It cemented its reputation as being lauded by journalists in its time. So much so they ended up producing way more than they thought they were going to and built 6,300 of these. Wow. And. And also available only available in three colors. It has lore around it that then gave birth to cars that sure are better but then they just produced lots of those because the demand was there.

[Kenneth]

Right.

[Doug]

But this was a special car and at the time it was revered as it's part of that analog era of the E9XM3 which was an awesome car to drive. The E60M5 which was an awesome car to drive. This falls in that era. And it's like it's the collectible one of them. All due to its production numbers.

[Kenneth]

Yeah. And it's production numbers and also like you said, the lore, the special etc. Because on paper an M2 or an M2 CS run two comps a better car. But this car and its continued value holding is proof that special is a bigger determinant than. Than good. And this annoys me every time someone's like don't you know the such and such car drives like crap. It's like dude, don't ever drive a 250GTO.

[Doug]

Right. And you love to make that example. And that is. That is. I mean yeah, 250 GTO is a. It's an old race car that there are a lot of cars that are faster than it. But there aren't two. They aren't 250 GTO.

[Kenneth]

They aren't more special. And this car is proving. Proving me wrong. You know I love this car. When it came out I tried to get one and I tried to get a used one for a long time. Then the M2 came out and I drove M2s and I was like, you know the M2 is better. I think I'll just pass on the one M&. And I don't know. I mean the markets can can still considers this. Meanwhile pull up what M2s are selling for which have more power. 30 right. They is that true? Can you get them in the 20s already?

[Felipe]

I don't know. Yes.

[Kenneth]

Look at that. They're already. They're already in the high 20s with tip. I mean, it's interesting. It's an interesting conversation. Like at the end of the day, special wins.

[Doug]

Special wins. I. I have often thought about getting a 1M. I love that car. Always thought it was cool.

[Kenneth]

I've often thought about getting a Mark IV.

[Felipe]

Have you considered a 135i for literally a quarter the price?

[Doug]

I like special.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, but that, that's exactly the problem.

[Felipe]

I know.

[Kenneth]

That's why you don't think in the.

[Felipe]

Way I'm not self aware. You think I'm not self aware.

[Kenneth]

No, I, I don't think you're self aware about this. I think about cost. I think you think about cost and enterprise price. And I think that special thinks about special and special opportunity cost. Okay, let's move on to the questions. Remember, you too can submit your questions to us. You go to carsandbids.com you click the community tab at the top of the page and there will be a post there and it says ask your questions. And then we'll answer the most highly upvoted questions.

[Felipe]

Yes, we will.

[Kenneth]

Every week.

[Felipe]

Yep.

[Kenneth]

First question from Never use blinkers. What are your thoughts on resto mod cars? Well, we just covered that slk.

[Doug]

So there are, there's. Yeah, I think generally they're, they're cool. I think a lot of the time you are. Sometimes you're ruining a classic to make a, to make a better car or a modern car. And I'm not necessarily into that car. Survived a long time. I'm more of a preservationist like restorations. But for the use case scenario, being able to drive something cool that you know will start every time, that will drive, admittedly probably better than the classic. Like it is really appealing.

[Kenneth]

I love them all. I don't care if they ruined classic. I love a resto mod. I've seen 300sls get ruined. I'm here for it. I love restomods. I think the concept of an old car on a new car. Frame, interior, chassis, powertrain, electric. I love it. I love it.

[Doug]

You hit the nail on the ones I'm most excited about. I love the EV restomods for cars that are like luxury cars with EV powertrains because luxury cars were never about the engine. It's not about that experience. It's about quiet.

[Kenneth]

Or the Volkswagen buses or cars like.

[Doug]

That, like where the engine is just season kind of there. It wasn't necessarily or the 356.

[Kenneth]

Let's be honest.

[Doug]

Yeah, I mean, let's sit here and.

[Kenneth]

Be honest with us.

[Doug]

I would be fine ruining a couple 356. You ruined the whole. They're all ruined in my mind.

[Felipe]

I mean, I have good news for you about what happened in the last day.

[Kenneth]

What? Oh, a lot of them caught on fire.

[Doug]

The fire killed off a lot of bathroom.

[Felipe]

Think about where a lot of three.

[Kenneth]

All right, next question. From in the can, what was the outcome of the eighteen thousand dollar car challenge giveaway in which car to the winner pick? We're going to have content on this in a little bit. We're gonna have an actual video about this. The giveaway. Who won? What happened? But the quick short answer is Michael in Colorado won. And he chose the C6, which astonished us all correctly. So we assumed any winner would take the M5. They didn't. And so now we are going to sell on cars and bids. The M5 and the Cayenne Turbo. And Kenan told me he's going to take the steering wheel from the M5 and swap it with his.

[Felipe]

No, no, no. We've talked about this. We were taking photos.

[Doug]

I think I'm going to take it. But. But nonetheless, I think I am. Yeah, I'm sad that he didn't pick the M5. But this, I mean, I understand if you already. If you want a sports car, that is the only sports car. As you said many times, it is the sports car. But I get to spend more time with that Ethereum 5 around. It's nice.

[Kenneth]

Next question from duges12. Doug, has there ever been any car that you filmed only to never release the video? If so, what cars and reasons about filming? No, not really. I. When I go shoot, I make sure that that content goes up. I don't lose a shooting day.

[Felipe]

There were cars that you intended to shoot but didn't get to, but they were generally more boring.

[Kenneth]

I have been sitting on a Saturn SL for like 16 months.

[Felipe]

So true.

[Kenneth]

I'm waiting for the right time.

[Felipe]

I'm excited for that video.

[Kenneth]

I'm waiting to slide.

[Felipe]

This is like purposely to like anger me because I want to see.

[Kenneth]

Okay, so. So these days I shoot two types of videos. I shoot brand new cars that have just come out that are like hot and excited lighting. And then I shoot cars for the site. Yeah, the Saturn SL I shot because a guy who was, you know, I shot that actually in the fall of 21. Now that I think about it, I shot it, but I shot it in the fall 20. Anyway, the guy who was, he was selling a 430 Scuderia on the site and he happened to have a mint Saturn SL also. And I was like, you know, I wouldn't mind shooting the Saturn too. And so I did. And I'm just waiting for the right time. I'm just waiting till like, you know.

[Felipe]

Every day is the right time for a Saturn SL video.

[Kenneth]

No. But the answer is no. I, I, when I shoot, it goes up. There are exceptions probably over the years, but like, very few. Very few. Next question from car Dreamer. Question from Doug. You recently did some renovations of your house, which included your garage. You've mentioned how you have more space for cars now. Can you do an updated tour? Yeah, I guess it's not that interesting. There's a, there's a garage, there's cars. A lot of these YouTuber garage tours. It's like, hey, you know, here's the sink. And it's like.

[Felipe]

Well, what Doug actually did was he bought Stride man's house.

[Doug]

There's the sink.

[Kenneth]

There's the sink. You know, I have that hose bib in my garage. Do you think I could drink out of that?

[Doug]

Well, you, you told me all the water in your house is filtered.

[Kenneth]

The water's filtered, but like it comes out of a metal hose. Is that a prop? Oh, all right.

[Doug]

Are you just, Is the, is the fitting made of lead? I don't think it'll be a problem.

[Kenneth]

Okay, well, listen, dude, you think I know. I don't know anything.

[Felipe]

Ken and I both don't think you do.

[Doug]

Be an adult and use the sink.

[Kenneth]

Cuz there's not a sink in the garage. Gosh.

[Felipe]

So far away.

[Kenneth]

I'm not like you. Set up stairs.

[Doug]

Get some steps in.

[Kenneth]

All right, next question. And this is a really good one for Kenan from Walsh. What's the story behind the seagull? Someone has gone on to. I guess it's your LinkedIn.

[Doug]

My LinkedIn? Yeah.

[Kenneth]

And there's a pic. We'll put it up. There's a picture of you. Your, your profile picture is you in front of exotic cars. Great. But then the, the headline picture is a seagull.

[Felipe]

Yeah.

[Doug]

Flying to the.

[Felipe]

Oh, that one.

[Doug]

It's flying to the. Yeah. So I, A couple reasons. One, I did take that picture myself. You took a picture of a seagull in Pacific Beach? Yeah, I was able to, I was like tracking it and I was able to get a picture like that perfect picture with my camera. And I took it at the time because my And I posted it on LinkedIn at the time because my ambition was to move to California and it was flying west and I took it here. And so that was the, like, the reason I posted the Seagull. And I thought it was a great picture. And everybody's like, I didn't want to put like more cars because I didn't know at the time if like cars necessarily the industry I was going to work in. But Seagulls, obviously it became the industry, hence the profile picture.

[Kenneth]

Right.

[Doug]

But that was, that's the story behind the seagull on my LinkedIn page, which I haven't updated in a long time.

[Kenneth]

That is interesting and that's useful, helpful. And it's interesting because the Seagull, like, you haven't updated in a long time because you did move to California, you did get a real job and you're doing and you're working and so you don't have time to update the Seagull. And so that's actually a good thing, I would argue.

[Doug]

I think the Seagull will stay probably forever.

[Kenneth]

Seagull proved itself.

[Felipe]

Wow.

[Doug]

It was a great picture.

[Kenneth]

Okay, next question from Alec Metz, 2011. Why haven't you reviewed a Suzuki X90 yet? Okay, here's the deal.

[Felipe]

That's a great question.

[Kenneth]

I only review cars now. Two types of reviews. I may have mentioned this five minutes ago. I don't know if we're going to breaks the pot. I do two types of reviews. New cars and cars that are on the site.

[Felipe]

Repeating. Okay.

[Kenneth]

And so as a result of that, I. The cars that I, that go up, that I, that are used cars that are older cars are on the site, they're for sale. Saturn sl, except for that one Saturn sl. And so, So I don't actually have a lot of choice. I have a list, I would say a list of 400 older cars that I'm looking to review at any given time. And from there it just becomes a question of what happens to pop up in Southern California on the site. And so the Lexus SC300, the Cadillac Catera, the Z3 coupe, there's a few of these that have either just gone up or about to go up. And so because they were here and they're on the site, the. An X90 hasn't popped up for whatever reason.

[Felipe]

If you have one in Southern California.

[Kenneth]

And you want, if you have an X90 in SoCal and you want to sell it and it's in good shape and ideally it's either purple or has the, the base wheel, I'LL take the alloy. But the base wheel.

[Felipe]

You're so right.

[Kenneth]

The base wheel on the X90 was objectionable. I mean it was objectionable. It's like they were making fun of the people who are buying the car and frankly the whole car was like that.

[Felipe]

And if you own one, don't be offended.

[Kenneth]

Just pull up the X90 base wheel, go to the site. I think we've sold a few. No, no, just type in X Men.

[Felipe]

Did we not sell one by our friend Myron Vernis?

[Kenneth]

Yeah, Myron Vernis sold that. But that's not the right wheel.

[Felipe]

No, it's not the right wheel.

[Kenneth]

Get out of this one. 1. These all have the alloy, alloy stuff. You go to. Go to the, go to the Google. Go to the google.com suzuki x90 base wheel.

[Felipe]

Quite something.

[Doug]

I, I had to look that up because it was a line I wanted to send to him. Like x90 base wheel.

[Kenneth]

No, you. I don't think this is going to happen. You got to type in Suzuki, my friend.

[Doug]

Well, I actually for once I have to type in the whole term.

[Kenneth]

I also think. No, no, don't. It's this, it's this.

[Felipe]

Go damages.

[Kenneth]

It's this wheel. This, this three spoke wheel comes. Terrible.

[Felipe]

Do any actually exist with those wheels still on it?

[Kenneth]

No. No. Okay, next question that is. But anyway, the answer is I will at some point. I'll review one. It's the same reason I haven't reviewed a Twin Turbo Z32 yet. Like ultimately just this hasn't come up on the site until Cal. But it will and I'll get there. And my long list of cars slowly gets whittled away. If I do every month I probably do eight, nine car reviews and five of them are new cars. So four every month are older cars, cars. And so 50 a year. It's just whittling.

[Felipe]

Add in a quick plug. Right now one of those older cars is a 987 Cayman that you reviewed that's going live yesterday.

[Kenneth]

Yes.

[Felipe]

And that's sold by one of our producers.

[Kenneth]

Yes, our producer has a Cayman on the site and I don't know if I've ever done a 987 video. But regardless, those cars become such deals. I felt like it had. They are.

[Felipe]

I love that I drove it for a video on cars and beds and it's such an excellent car, such a nice car.

[Kenneth]

It is so good. I drove that and the NA Miata back to back on separate days.

[Felipe]

What a day or two.

[Kenneth]

Both of them, both of them are so are exactly the same. The same. They're, they're, they're radically underpowered.

[Felipe]

And unbelievably amazing is not radically underpowered. I enjoy a card that I can literally floor through several.

[Kenneth]

The S was, was better. You can still floor the S, but it's just more powerful. Question for Ken. Next question. Question from Tom Tinker. Tom Tinker. Question for Kennen. Would you rather take ownership of Hoovy's entire garage including the Veyron, or let Filippo Choose 10 cars for you to buy? An owner. That's easy.

[Doug]

So easy. Hoobies. You don't get to choose anything from me. I would absolutely choose all of who's cars.

[Felipe]

I'm a nice person. I would choose cars.

[Doug]

Yeah, but you have bad taste. I would, I would choose all Hoovies cars because they're. I, I personally I. Tyler Hoover is the king of 04. Rich generally and I like his taste of cars generally. I like a lot of the cars that he has. It's always been a wonderful academic curiosity because I'm too afraid to own most of the cars he has, including the Veyron obviously. Obviously. But yes, maybe the spirit of the question is would you be afraid to take care of those kind of cars? But like I would way rather do that than drive the mundane, boring, pointless, just pedestrian stuff that you would pick for me.

[Felipe]

Can you add more peas into that?

[Doug]

I'm sure I can't.

[Kenneth]

Poor.

[Doug]

Just outright poor choices.

[Felipe]

Nice.

[Kenneth]

Next question from Cyrus S. Who is the best tennis player? Filippo, Ken and I play tennis together every morning.

[Felipe]

Morning.

[Kenneth]

Every single morning, including this morning.

[Doug]

Well, a group of us play together, but yeah, you and Doug is the best. Filippo is second best and I'm there.

[Kenneth]

Now for now I'm the best. I, I, we've all. We all sleep. When I started the same time basically three years ago and I have taken. I initially was just doing it for exercise and then like everything in my life, I started taking it very seriously.

[Doug]

And Doug, which he said, he said I won't do this because I'll ruin it. Well, you've ruined it.

[Felipe]

So meanwhile some of them just show up.

[Kenneth]

I still have a lot of fun.

[Felipe]

It is fun.

[Kenneth]

Next question.

[Felipe]

Slowly going down.

[Kenneth]

Next. Next question from Talon. Pat, whatever happened to the monkey noise that you used to play over silly quirks and features in your older videos? Will you ever bring it back? Yeah, if Nick is here. Nick, I gotta bring back the monkey noises. I used to do it when I edited my own videos and I think Nick doesn't want to take Weird liberties like that. But I didn't care all that much when I was doing it. But yeah. Okay, well, we'll do a couple more monkey noises. Okay, Last question.

[Felipe]

Question.

[Kenneth]

Yeah, last question. Two last questions. Actually, two last questions from BBB914, Doug. How often do you go back through the Doug score chart and update categories like styling, value, cool factor based on recent developments in the car market? I want to be very clear about this. When I launched the Doug score in 2017, I said I would be constantly changing the scores because a car that gets a 10 in features when it's 6 years old no longer deserves a 10 in features. I still do that all the time. So people are like, oh, my DOUG score was this. It's like, well, today it is. But like I changed the them literally every week. Every single week. I'm adjusting the Doug score so it happens all the time. So don't get a vanity plate with your Doug score.

[Felipe]

If you want a point in time, you can go to merch.car.com and buy a couple shirts that have the current Doug.

[Kenneth]

The current Doug score. G. Final question. Final question from Chris X. Do you believe there will ever come a time when the 997911 significantly rises in value like the 964 and 993 have, or did the 996 break the chain? The answer is no. There will never become that time. Anyway.

[Felipe]

Wait, wait, wait, wait. Already specific subsets of the 997 market have proven that they've retained value very differently.

[Kenneth]

I'll amend my response to Chris X. No. Except for the GT3RS 4.0. Anyway, good night, everybody.

[Felipe]

I'll accept that. That's fine.

[Doug]

No, the turbo, you feel is the.

[Felipe]

997 retained value in a way that the 996 Turbo has very much an option. Not.

[Kenneth]

No.

[Felipe]

And. And a lot of other ones have retained value like the. The 991 is about to depreciate past the 997 for specific subsets.

[Kenneth]

No, no, I agree, actually, certain versions, of course, but that's true of every car. But I think he's. The general question that he's asking is will it happen? Because Even the regular 964s and 993, anybody can predict the GT3s and the RSS and the special cars will go up. Obviously it's going to happen. Will the regular ones? No is a production number difference. The996 broke the chain only in the sense that Porsche, when they came out with the996 in 1997. 98 decided to become a real car company. Right. Previous to this Porsche was not a real company. They were, they were a hobbyist garage.

[Felipe]

Yep. 100% agreed.

[Kenneth]

I'm not entirely joking here. And so in 98 they were like, you know, we either have to remain a hobbyist garage and probably be bought by a company.

[Felipe]

Yeah.

[Kenneth]

Or we have to like start doing.

[Felipe]

The options were go bankrupt or sell cars.

[Kenneth]

Go bankrupt or sell cars.

[Felipe]

They chose to sell cars.

[Kenneth]

Really it was buy out or sell cars and, and, and give up to Mercedes or Volkswagen and they decided to, to sell cars. And so the, the reason the 997 will never go up is because the production number difference is just absolutely astronomy astronomical. In addition to the air cold water cooled thing, it's just incredibly different.

[Felipe]

I feel like regular 993s, 964s are down a little bit, but they were up compared to.

[Kenneth]

I mean when I, when I was looking in 10 you could buy one for 30. That's, that's no longer the case.

[Felipe]

993 cab and a 997S cab are the same price. Price.

[Kenneth]

Yeah. I mean is that something?

[Felipe]

Okay.

[Kenneth]

The 997 still dropping.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Kenneth]

And I don't think it's ever going to go up. Listen, there was a time when a regular 993 was like a 90 car. I think those prices have come down. But there will never be a time when a base model regular 997 maybe some late 0.2s with a stick in nice shape and nice color, blah blah blah. But a general car is just, it's just. There's too many of them but just great.

[Doug]

I think it's fine. It's. It's a wonderful car to buy and own and like I think it's fine.

[Kenneth]

That's a good point. It is great. It's nice that it remains accessible.

[Felipe]

I do think they have more potential than some later ones I can't like than a regular one has more potential to increase than a A2 997 than like a 991.1 dot twos will be.

[Kenneth]

The special if it ever happens.

[Doug]

It'll be 1s or less NA911s. So who knows that might have something.

[Kenneth]

That'S a GP KR. Okay, thank you everyone for watching another absolutely fantastic podcast. It was my best one ever. Philippe. No, I'm kidding. Best podcast of all time. Thank you for watching. Good night and good luck.

[Felipe]

Good day actually good look at a F6 exam.