This is Gavin Newsom – "And This Is Where MAGA Got Their Playbook"

With Congressman Jim Clyburn
iHeartPodcasts | February 19, 2026

Episode Overview

Governor Gavin Newsom sits down with Congressman Jim Clyburn for a wide-ranging conversation on American democracy, civil rights history, Black political power, and the current threats to voting rights. Recorded the day of Reverend Jesse Jackson’s death, the episode weaves together personal stories, reflections on iconic civil rights figures, and a clear-eyed discussion about the resurgence of anti-democratic forces. Clyburn highlights the urgent need to focus not just on preserving democracy, but also on ensuring dignity and accessibility for all Americans.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Remembering Jesse Jackson and the Civil Rights Generation

[03:21-07:10]

• Clyburn shares personal memories of Jesse Jackson, tracing their rivalry back to high school football and acknowledging Jackson’s exceptional athleticism and activism.
• Clyburn reflects on the recent loss of both Jesse Jackson and his wife Emily, drawing poignant parallels between struggles with illness in both families.
• The origins of Clyburn’s own activism: Meeting his wife during a sit-in jail protest in 1960 (“I married her 18 months later – all because of a half hamburger.” [05:41], James Clyburn).

2. Early Political Exposure and the Shifting Parties

[00:57-02:59]; [09:04-16:52]

• Growing up in a Republican household, Clyburn observed the shifting loyalties of Black voters and recounts how the Civil Rights Acts of the 1960s altered party demographics.
• Clyburn traces his leadership tendencies back to his youth — running the NAACP youth council at age 12, under the stern but nurturing guidance of his preacher father.
• He describes a formative experience meeting John Lewis and Martin Luther King Jr. at SNCC’s inception in 1960 and details generational debates over strategies for change.

“King was preaching nonviolence, and all of us were practicing nonviolence. But King was also preaching disobeying unjust laws and paying the price for it. And we thought he wasn’t demonstrating enough leadership in that category.” [12:26], James Clyburn

• The “infamous phone call”: Clyburn recounts how JFK’s decision to call Coretta Scott King during MLK’s 1960 imprisonment turned the tide of the election ([13:40-13:57]).

3. The Evolution of Black Political Power and Party Realignment

[14:12-16:52; 36:33-40:44]

• The podcast revisits the dramatic shift in Black voter allegiance from the Republican to the Democratic Party in the 1960s and emphasizes critical moments such as the passage of Civil Rights legislation.
• Clyburn highlights the importance of both democracy and dignity: “It’s one thing to talk about democracy, it’s something else to talk about dignity.” [15:29]
• Clyburn discusses meeting and learning from icons including John Lewis and Martin Luther King Jr. — and how these relationships shaped his worldview and congressional career.

4. Lessons from History: Reconstruction, Backlash & The Modern Threat

[36:33-42:48]

• In response to Newsom’s questions, Clyburn draws direct parallels between current events and the end of post-Civil War Reconstruction – emphasizing the fragility of political progress.
• Clyburn’s recent book was inspired by the erasure of Black Congressional predecessors after Reconstruction, and the ongoing “second Reconstruction” — warning that rights once gained can be lost again.

“The only way you can have a second Reconstruction is for the first one to come to an end. … The book is about saying to people, be careful of this.” [37:41], James Clyburn

• He describes how a single political deal in 1877—“the biggest double-cross in African American history”—ushered in nearly a century of Jim Crow.

5. The Fight Over Voting Rights and the Return of Jim Crow Tactics

[42:03-47:09]

• Newsom and Clyburn discuss contemporary voter suppression laws (e.g., voter ID requirements), making clear how these echo Jim Crow-era disenfranchisement.
• Clyburn critiques the selective nature of acceptable IDs (e.g., hunting licenses but not student IDs) as thinly veiled suppression.

“Why is it when they started talking about what forms of ID would be accepted—a hunting license would be accepted but your picture on a student activity card would not be accepted. Somebody explain that to me.” [43:31], James Clyburn

• Newsom highlights the logistical burdens for poor and elderly voters under new registration laws.

6. Economic and Political Empowerment: The Clyburn Doctrine

[29:46-35:49]

• Clyburn shares his long-time mantra: “Making America’s greatness accessible and affordable for all,” which has guided his legislative priorities—from broadband expansion to targeted poverty alleviation.
• His “10-20-30” strategy directs a minimum of 10% of certain federal funds to counties with 20%+ poverty for at least 30 years, emphasizing the broad, non-racial scope of his anti-poverty work.
• He notes, “2/3 of the counties that fall into this [persistent poverty] category are represented by Republicans, and they ain’t Black.” [33:23], James Clyburn

7. The Danger of Censored History & Assaults on Truth

[47:54-54:36]

• The conversation turns to the coordinated effort to censor Black history (e.g., Florida’s removal of Rosa Parks’ race from textbooks).
• Clyburn tells an anecdote about Thomas Edison and Lewis Latimer, emphasizing the importance of teaching full, honest history for both white and Black students.
• Newsom laments the palpable anger and frustration of watching these retrograde policies repeat themselves.

"We don’t have any problem putting things in the textbooks that make white students proud, but there’s a problem putting in things that make Black students proud.” [52:56], James Clyburn

8. The State of Black Voters & the Soul of the Democratic Party

[54:36-57:41]

• Newsom raises the surprising fact that Trump received significant Black voter support. Clyburn insists this is a Democratic failure—especially when “algorithms get more weight than lived experiences.”
• Clyburn offers this advice: focus on dignity, respect, affordability, and accessibility for all Americans.
• He expresses hope that with leaders like Hakeem Jeffries, the party will restore sensitivity and sensibility.

“We’ve got a job to preserve democracy, but I think we got to take it a little step further… making America’s greatness accessible and affordable for all.” [00:01, 57:41], James Clyburn

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On meeting his wife during a protest:
  “Emily walked toward me with this hamburger in her hands. I really didn’t know her at the time. I reached for the hamburger, she broke it in half, gave me a half hamburger. She ate the other half. I was so grateful for the half hamburger. I married her 18 months later.” [05:41], James Clyburn

• Civil Rights legacy and painful continuities:
  “History… anything that's happened before can happen again.” [37:41], James Clyburn

• On voter suppression tools:
  “A hunting license would be accepted, your picture on a student activity card will not be accepted. … I am against your telling me that the ID that I'm more apt to have in my possession will be no good.” [43:31], James Clyburn

• On why Democrats lost Black voters:
  “When the algorithms get more weight than lived experiences, you’re going to have a problem.” [55:00], James Clyburn

• On restoring democracy and dignity:
  “It’s one thing to argue for democracy, it’s something else again to argue for dignity.” [48:59], James Clyburn

Timestamps for Major Segments

• 00:00 – Opening statement on preserving democracy and dignity
• 03:21 – Personal history with Jesse Jackson; sit-ins and meeting his wife
• 09:04 – Clyburn’s upbringing, early NAACP leadership, and the “age of responsibility”
• 12:26 – MLK, SNCC, the “oldsters vs. youngsters,” and JFK’s pivotal 1960 phone call
• 16:52 – On John Lewis, lived nonviolence, and Congressional friendship
• 29:46 – Congressional run, “making America’s greatness accessible and affordable for all”
• 32:08 – Explanation and impact of the “10-20-30” poverty strategy
• 36:33 – Black Congressional history, Reconstruction, and January 6th as a symmetry-break
• 42:03 – The threat of a "second Jim Crow," voter ID laws, SAVE Act
• 47:07 – South Carolina’s role and disgrace of gerrymandering
• 52:56 – Removal of Black history from textbooks, importance of honest curriculum
• 54:36 – Declining Black support for Democrats, strategies for moving forward
• 57:41 – Closing thoughts: “dignity, affordability, accessibility”

Closing Thoughts

In a conversation marked by warmth, candor, and urgency, Congressman Clyburn threads his personal story through America’s battles for civil rights and democracy. He warns that progress is fragile and must be constantly defended—not just procedurally, but in the daily dignity accorded to every American. By reflecting on Reconstruction’s abrupt end and today’s voter suppression, Newsom and Clyburn articulate a vision of a more equitable nation, while sounding the alarm on familiar threats returning in modern guise.